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MEETING TO ORDER.LET'S DO THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE, PLEASE.
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS ON NATION BY GOD, INDIVIDUAL, THE LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.
UM, CAN I HAVE YOU DO THE ROLL CALL, PLEASE? DONNA? CHAIR UNER.
COMMISSIONER SAGNER HERE ALL PRESENTS.
SO, UM, DO WE HAVE ANY ANNOUNCEMENTS? UM, OR, UH, UH, WHO, WHO, WHO'S GOING TO MAKE ANNOUNCEMENTS TODAY? I, I HAVE ONE ANNOUNCEMENT.
UH, UM, RESERVATIONS AT THE HOTEL HAS BEEN MADE FOR THE INDIVIDUALS ATTENDING THE CONFERENCE AND A CITY VEHICLE HAS BEEN RESERVED, WHICH I WILL NEED TO KNOW IF ANYONE WISHES TO USE IT.
BUT I WILL BE SENDING OUT, UM, AN EMAIL WITH INFORMATION AND YOUR ACCOMMODATION AND REGISTRATION RECEIPTS.
SO IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, LET ME KNOW.
BUT, UH, YOU'LL NEED TO REVIEW THAT BECAUSE THERE ARE RESTRICTIONS ON PERSONAL USE IF YOU USE THE CITY VEHICLE CETERA.
SO YOU SHOULD BE GETTING THAT LATER THIS WEEK.
IF ANYTHING HAS CHANGED AMONG THOSE INDICATING THAT THEY'RE GOING TO ATTEND IN PERSON, PLEASE LET ME KNOW RIGHT AWAY, BECAUSE I'LL BE DOING YOUR REGISTRATIONS TOMORROW.
AND WE DON'T NECESSARILY GET A FULL REFUND ON THOSE IF YOU CHANGE YOUR MIND.
DOES ANYBODY ON THE COMMISSION HAVE, UH, AN ANNOUNCEMENTS ANNOUNCEMENT FOR ANYTHING? OKAY.
SO, UM, OH GOSH, HERE WE GO AGAIN.
DONNA, WHAT DO I SAY WHEN? I JUST WANT THE
I SHOULDN'T WRITE IT RIGHT DOWN IN HERE.
YOU ASK IF THERE ARE ANY CORRECTIONS TO THE MINUTES OF APRIL 10TH, 2023.
AND IF YOU HEAR NONE, THE MINUTES ARE APPROVED.
ARE THERE ANY, UM, UM, ADJUSTMENTS MADE NEED TO BE MADE FOR THE MINUTES OF APRIL 10TH, 2023.
I DUNNO WHY I, THAT'S SO SIMPLE.
I SHOULD REALLY, YOU KNOW, OUTTA ALL THE THINGS I HAVE TO REMEMBER.
THAT SHOULD BE ABSOLUTELY EASY.
AND IT ABSOLUTELY ISN'T FOR SOME ODD REASON.
UM, I DON'T SEE ANYONE HERE FOR THE PUBLIC FORUM.
SO WE WILL PASS RIGHT ON TO REGULAR BUSINESS AND AN UPDATE ON THE STATUS OF THE RANGER STATION BUILDING RENOVATIONS.
CAN I HAVE MADAM CHAIR? THAT WOULD BE ME.
I RECEIVED WORD FROM, UH, SANDY, OUR ASSISTANT, UH, PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR.
AND, UH, SHE HAS FINALLY CORRALLED THE ARCHITECT TO, UH, HAVE A MEETING SIT DOWN, START OFF MEETING WITH US, UM, TO DISCUSS THE PLANS FOR THE ALTERATIONS OF, UH, THE HOUSE, THE INTERIOR ALTERATIONS OF THE HOUSE AND THE BARN.
SO, UM, THAT IS TO TAKE, UH, IT'S JULY 13TH THIS WEEK.
SO, UM, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT SHE'S BEEN TRYING TO GET THE ARCHITECT OP CENTER FOR PROBABLY TWO MONTHS NOW.
AND HE'S HAD A LOT OF WORK AND, UH, AND SO NOW HE'S FINALLY BEEN ABLE TO CLEAR UP HIS SCHEDULE WHEN WE'RE NEXT.
NOW, WHO, WHO IS THE ARCHITECT AGAIN? UM, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE KNEW THAT.
SO SHE DID NOT INCLUDE THAT IN HER EMAIL TO ME.
SO HE'S GONNA, HE'S GONNA BRING IT TO YOU AND THEN YOU WILL, UH, UPDATE US ON WHAT HE, WHAT HE'S LOOKING AT DOING WITH THOSE INTERIORS.
IS THAT HOW IT'S GONNA WORK? YES.
THE, UM, THE FOCUS OF THE ALTERATIONS HAS NOT CHANGED.
IN THE SENSE THAT THE HOUSE IS STILL LOOKING TO BE ALTERED TO ALLOW FOR PUBLIC MEETINGS.
UM, AND THEY'RE LOOKING TO INSTALL TWO BATHROOMS, UH, ONE OF 'EM BEING ACCESSIBLE.
UM, SO, UH, IT'S ALL GONNA BE PRELIMINARY AT THE START.
UM, SO IT'LL BE WORKING WITH STAFF TO, UH, PROVIDE SOME PRELIMINARY PLANS AND HAVE THOSE ABLE TO BE, UM,
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PASSED AROUND FOR, UH, FOR, UH, UH, RESPONSES FROM, UH, THE COMMISSION AND, AND FROM STAFF THEMSELVES.AND THEN ULTIMATELY IT'LL GO THROUGH THE PERMIT PROCESS.
DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT? NATE? GO AHEAD.
UH, WHAT'S THE TIMELINE ON IT? SO THE TIMELINE, I DON'T KNOW.
UM, IT, THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT SANDY JUST SENT TO ME.
LET THE COMMISSION KNOW, UM, THAT WE FINALLY HAVE THE ARCHITECT ON BOARD.
UM, MY GUESS, JUST FROM UNDERSTANDING THE PROCESS OF CREATING THE PLANS AND, UH, YOU'RE PROBABLY LOOKING AT A COUPLE, COUPLE MONTHS DOWN THE ROAD, MONTH AND A HALF BEFORE YOU SEE, UH, A PRELIMINARY SET.
NOW IS THAT, IS THAT GONNA BE EMAILED TO US OR IS THAT GONNA BE JUST PRESENTED IN FRONT OF THE COMMISSION AT ONE OF OUR MEETINGS, DO YOU THINK? UM, IT'S SOMETHING I CAN ASK SANDY.
WE CAN CERTAINLY EMAIL, UM, YOU KNOW, THE PRELIMINARY PLANS, BUT, UH, IT WOULD BE SOMETHING I WOULD THINK THAT SHE WOULD WANNA PRESENT TO YOU AT A MEETING.
IS THERE GONNA BE ANY OPPORTUNITY TO OFFER ALTERNATIVE PLANS? BECAUSE I AM FIRMLY AGAINST HAVING THAT AS A MEETING PLACE.
I CAN SEE HAVING DOCENTS OR SOMEBODY FROM THE FOREST SERVICE LEADING WALKS OR TALKS IN THAT AREA.
AND, AND I'M A LITTLE, A LITTLE UPSET THAT I OFFERED THIS, AND IT JUST SEEMS THAT NOBODY PAYS ANY ATTENTION AT ALL.
AND SO I'M JUST KIND OF CONCERNED THAT I'M, IT'S GONNA BE CROSSED RIGHT OFF.
UM, WE'VE TALKED FOR EIGHT YEARS.
WE'VE TALKED FOR EIGHT YEARS AND THE PLANS HAVE CHANGED A LITTLE BIT, BUT I SENT THE CITY COUNCIL A LETTER, YOU'VE PROBABLY SEEN IT LAST WEEK, ASKING FOR A SIT DOWN TO WHAT IS THE PARK? IS IT GONNA BE A, I'M NOT SAYING CHANGE THE PARK, I'M JUST SAYING WHAT'S THE OVERALL THEME? AND THEN ONCE YOU HAVE A THEME, THEN YOU WORK BACKWARDS AND THEN THE HOUSE AND THE UNITS FALL INTO A THEME.
WE'RE JUST DOING AD HOC AND I REALLY THINK WE NEED TO SIT DOWN AND, AND HAVE A DISCUSSION.
IS IT GONNA BE A HISTORY PARK? IS IT GONNA BE A, A CHILDREN'S PARK? IS IT GOING TO BE AN ART PARK? UH, WE'RE NOT TALKING CHANGING ANYTHING YOU'RE DOING.
WE'RE JUST TALKING WHAT'S THE STORY? AND TO YOUR POINT, IF THE STORY IS, IF, IF IT'S A HISTORY PARK THAT'S A, A GOOD USE OF A HISTORY PARK.
UM, IF WE PUT PLAQUES AROUND THE EDGES, IF WE BRING IN ART, UH, THAT TIES INTO OUR HISTORY WALKS AND THAT TIES INTO OUR RIVER WALK.
SO WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS KIND OF OUT OF CONTEXT, AND I THINK WE NEED TO BRING IT BACK IN CONTEXT.
SO I, I, I'VE JUST, I'M A LITTLE FRUSTRATED, FRANKLY CUZ I'VE BEEN INVOLVED WITH THIS FOR 10 YEARS MM-HMM.
I, NOT ONE COMPLAINT, IT JUST DOESN'T HAVE A STORY.
YOU BUILD FROM A STORY YOU DON'T BUILD, THEN THROW A STORY ON TOP OF IT.
UH, FROM WHERE I, I SIT TO, I, I WOULD AGREE WITH THE IMPORTANCE OF STORYTELLING.
UM, I HAVEN'T BEEN A PART OF THE PROCESS, YOU KNOW, SO I, I CAN'T SPEAK TO THAT.
UH, YOU KNOW, IT DOES SEEM LIKE A VERY ACCELERATE, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE I'M JUST USED TO, TO DIFFERENT CITIES.
UH, AND I, I JUST NEED TO GET USED TO THE SPEED OF SEDONA.
BUT THAT DOES SEEM LIKE AN EXTREMELY ACCELERATED TIMELINE TO ME TO SAY FROM WHERE WE SIT RIGHT NOW, WHERE WE HAVEN'T HAD ANY, UM, CONVERSATIONS WITH THE DESIGN TEAM TO, IN A MONTH AND A HALF TO TWO MONTHS, WE'LL HAVE DRAWINGS IS, UM, SEEMS REALLY RAPID.
UM, AND I DO JUST HOPE THAT, UH, THERE IS A CHANCE TO WEIGH IN AND, AND WE'RE JUST TALKING INTERIOR AT THE MOMENT MM-HMM.
RIGHT? WE ARE, SO WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE PARK AS A WHOLE OR OTHER OPPORTUNITIES FOR ART OR SCULPTURE OR, OR, UH, KIOSKS OR ANYTHING THROUGHOUT THE REST OF THE PARK.
THIS IS JUST THE, THE PHASE WE'RE TALKING RIGHT NOW IS STRICTLY INTERIOR OF THE TWO BUILDINGS.
THAT IS WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NOW, HOW, YOU KNOW, PUBLIC WORKS IS OUT THERE, UH, DOING SOME, UH, LAND WORK, SITE WORK.
UM, PERHAPS WHAT YOU MIGHT WANT TO DO IS, IS ASK FOR THEM TO, UH, BE ON THE NEXT AGENDA, UM,
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WITH SPECIFIC QUESTIONS THAT YOU WANT THEM TO ANSWER.SO REMOVED FROM MUCH OF THAT AND DEFINITELY REMOVED FROM THE HISTORY OF THAT MM-HMM.
SO I THINK, UM, THAT MIGHT BE WHAT YOU'D LIKE, WHAT YOU'D WANT TO DO.
AND THE, MY ONE AND A HALF TO TWO MONTH, UM, GUESSTIMATE, UH, IS JUST BASED UPON DRAWING PLANS MM-HMM.
THE INTENT IS PRELIMINARY SET PROVIDED FOR, UH, RESPONSE FROM THE COMMISSION, UM, AND, UH, BEFORE IT EVEN GOES TO THE PERMIT PROCESS MM-HMM.
UM, THAT'S WHY I THINK MAYBE THE BEST THING TO DO IS TO HAVE THEM ON THE AGENDA FOR THE NEXT MEETING.
WELL, I'M, I'M, I'M A BIT CONCERNED BECAUSE IF, IF ALREADY IT IS DECIDED THAT THAT IS GOING TO BE A SPACE THAT IS GONNA BE USED FOR MEETINGS, THAT'S GONNA CHANGE IT FROM WHAT IT WOULD BE, THAT'S GONNA, SO THAT'S GOING TO TELL THE ARCHITECT, UM, AND I HATE THE CITY TO SPEND MONEY ON DOING SOMETHING THAT THEN, THEN WE HAVE TO DRAW BACK BECAUSE WE DON'T FEEL THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE WE WANTED TO GO WITH THE INTERIORS.
YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE HAD BEEN CERTAINLY DISCUSSION AS HOW TO THAT, HOW WOULD THAT WOULD WORK FOR, UM, THOSE KIND OF SITUATIONS WHERE YOU WOULD HAVE MEETINGS THERE.
UM, I'M SUPPOSING THAT, THAT THERE MIGHT BE A WAY THAT YOU COULD ACTUALLY ALLOW FOR THE MEETINGS TO TAKE PLACE AND STILL HAVE IT HISTORIC.
BUT I THINK WHAT WORRIES ME IS THAT IF THE ARCHITECT ONLY HAS THE INTENTION OF MAKING IT A MEETING SPACE AND HE PUTS THE MONEY IN, I DON'T WANT, YOU KNOW, IF IF IT COMES BACK TO US IN ALL PROBABILITY, IF WE HAVE AN OBJECTION TO IT AT THAT POINT, WE'RE PROBABLY NOT.
WE'RE GONNA BE PROBABLY SHUT DOWN BECAUSE THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN TAKEN CARE OF.
THE MONEY HAS ALREADY BEEN SPENT FOR THE ARCHITECT.
CUZ I KNOW THAT'S NOT CHEAP, YOU KNOW, TO HAVE THE ARCHITECT DO THAT KIND OF WORK.
SO MY QUESTION IS, IS THERE, IS THERE ANY WAY THAT, THAT THERE CAN BE, THAT THE ARCHITECT CAN BE TOLD THAT THERE'S A POSSIBILITY OF A, OF, OF A VARIABLE THAT MIGHT BE WHAT, WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE, WHICH IS ACTUALLY TO MAKE IT A MORE HISTORIC SPACE.
UM, OR SH SHOW THE HISTORY OF THAT SPACE RATHER THAN JUST A, A MEETING SPACE.
BRYN, I DON'T KNOW, BRYNN, I TALKED TO KAREN MONTHS AGO ABOUT THIS SAME CONCERN, AND SHE SAID, WELL, YOU SHOULD BRING IT UP THROUGH THIS COMMITTEE.
AND WE HAVE, AND WE JUST GET PUSHED BACK SAYING, WELL, THIS IS HOW IT'S GOING AND THIS IS WHAT WE HAD THE PUBLIC MEETING.
AND I SAID, IT'S BEEN EIGHT YEARS TIME TO REVISIT IT.
UM, WE HAVE A PARK, IT'S NICE, IT'S GONNA HAVE BATHROOMS, IT'S GONNA HAVE ADA BATHROOMS. UM, I DON'T THINK YOU NEED TO SPEND THE MONEY ON ADA BATHROOMS ON A MEETING PLACE THAT WE PROBABLY DON'T NEED.
THAT I THINK DOESN'T FIT THE HISTORIC CONTEXT.
NOW WE DO HAVE A RIGHT IN THIS GROUP TO VOTE ON THE HISTORIC CONTEXT WHEN SOMETHING'S A BUILDING AND WHAT'S GOING TO BE NEXT TO THE BUILDING.
SO IN THEORY, WE HAVE OVERSIGHT OF, OF THAT BUILDING.
AND I DON'T THINK WE'RE, WE'RE HAVING A CHANCE TO HAVE OVERSIGHT.
I THINK WE'RE BEING TOLD, HERE'S WHAT WE'RE DOING.
AND I WOULD, I WOULD STRONGLY SAY THAT I'M AGAINST A, A BUILDING THAT'S GONNA BE USED BY THE PUBLIC EVERY SO OFTEN.
AND IT SHOULD TO BE TIED IN WITH AN OVERALL THEME.
AND I DON'T THINK THE CITY SHOULD SPEND A HUNDRED THOUSAND PLUS THAT IT'S GONNA COST TO PUT A BATHROOM IN THERE.
IT'S GONNA BE OUT OF CONTEXT WITH THE BUILDING.
UH, JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, IS THE COMMISSION UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT THIS IS GOING TO ALTER THE EXTERIOR? NO, AND THAT IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I THINK IS RATHER AWKWARD IN THIS SITUATION BECAUSE FOR THE MOST PART, OUR DICTATES ONLY, UH, STATE THAT WE HAVE THE, THE, THE POSSIBILITY OF ACTUALLY OBJECTING TO WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE BUILDING.
I THINK, I THINK I THINK WE'RE ALL WEIGHING IN SIMPLY BECAUSE THIS IS A, A PIECE OF PROPERTY AND A A, A SORT OF, UM, A, A A, A PARK THAT WE HAD HOPED WOULD BE, UM, SOMETHING THAT WOULD ACTUALLY SPEAK TO HISTORY RATHER THAN JUST, UH, UH, USE USED FOR SOMETHING ELSE.
NOW, UM, THE REALITY IS THE CITY MAY DECIDE THAT WE HAVE NO RIGHT IN SAYING WHAT WE WANT ON THE INTERIOR, BUT I THINK, I THINK I WOULD LIKE TO BELIEVE THAT THE CITY WOULD, UH, UH, UH, ACTUALLY THINK ABOUT OR
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CONSIDER, UM, OUR, OUR CONCERNS WITH WHAT IT WAS, WHAT IT'S GOING TO BE ONCE YOU MAKE A CHANGE, IT'S THERE FOREVER.AND WE'VE ALL SEEN BUILDINGS, THEY SAID, OH, BACK IN THE SEVENTIES THEY DID THIS, OR BACK IN THE EIGHTIES THEY DID THAT.
AND I JUST DON'T THINK WE SHOULD GO DOWN THAT ROAD.
UM, I THINK THAT ARCHITECTURALLY INTERIOR AND EXTERIOR SHOULD BE KEPT AS CLOSE TO PRISTINE AND BROUGHT UP TO PRISTINE AS POSSIBLE.
AND THEN WE CAN USE IT, DECIDE DOWN THE LAKE.
I LIKE THE IDEA OF, OF BEING PART OF THE PARK.
YOU CAN MAYBE LOOK THROUGH THE WINDOWS AND YOU KNOW HOW YOU CAN GO IN AND YOU GO TO A ROOM WITH GLASS AND YOU CAN KIND OF LOOK IN AND SEE, AND WE ACTUALLY SET IT UP, UM, IT BECOMES A DISPLAY FOR THE PARK.
SO I THINK WE'RE ALL ON THE SAME BOARD.
I I THINK THIS IS JUST MOVING DOWN THE WRONG ROAD.
AND FOR THE RECORD, UH, THE STATE OFFICE HAS INDICATED OVER AND OVER AGAIN THAT THEY'RE ENCOURAGING THE, UM, THE, UH, ADAPTIVE VIEWS, GOVERNMENTS TO CONSIDER STORYTELLING.
IT COMES UP OVER AND OVER AGAIN.
AND, UM, AND THIS GIVES US A VENUE FOR THAT.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I DON'T THINK THE CITY REALIZES, AND THAT IS THAT PARTICULAR BUILDING WAS THE VERY FIRST ONE THAT WAS EVER BUILT.
AND IT WAS BUILT BY A RANGER DURING WORLD WAR I AND USING THE PLANS, THE, THE, THE, UH, DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE DIDN'T HAVE ANY PLANS FOR THE FOREST SERVICE.
RANGERS WENT OUT AND BILL THEIR OWN RANGER STATION, AND THIS WAS THE FIRST ONE WHEN THEY SENT OUT PLANS, THEY'RE CALLED THE ONE D PLAN.
AND THIS RANGER IN ONE YEAR BUILT THAT WHOLE THING.
AND SO IT'S ONE OF A KIND, THEY DIDN'T BUILD ANYMORE FOR A WHILE.
AND SO THE, TO ME, THE EXTERIOR AND THE INTERIOR ARE BOTH VERY IMPORTANT.
AND YOU KNOW, I, IT'S JUST FRUSTRATING THAT WE HAVE THE VERY FIRST OF ITS KIND OF A TYPE OF ARCHITECTURE WHICH WOULD BECOME A IDENTIFIED WITH THE FOREST SERVICE, THE WHITE CLAPBOARD WITH THE GREEN, UM, SILLS ON IT.
AND TODAY WHEN WE DRIVE THROUGH A NATIONAL FOREST, YOU SEE THOSE BUILDINGS AND YOU KNOW, IT'S A FOREST SERVICE BUILDING.
AND YET SEDONA HAS THE ONLY FIRST ONE EVER BUILT.
AND ALSO IT'S, IT'S ONE OF THE FEW THAT ACTUALLY FOLLOWED THAT PATTERN AND ACTUALLY DID WHAT THEY DID THAT'S LEFT IN THE COUNTRY.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, FOR US TO SORT OF DISREGARD THAT I THINK IS A LITTLE BIT DIS DISHEARTENING ALSO.
THINK ABOUT THE ART BARN, WHAT A LOSS THAT IS BECAUSE IT'S BEEN MODIFIED SO MUCH THAT IT'S, IT'S LOST ITS HISTORIC TEXTURE.
AND I JUST DON'T THINK WE SH WE SHOULD LOSE THE HISTORIC TEXTURE.
I THINK, I THINK THIS GROUP, IF WE CAN MAKE A COMMENT TO CITY COUNCIL OR TO THE POWERS IT BE THAT WE WANT TO HAVE A MEETING ON THIS, WE WANT TO UNDERSTAND BETTER ITS USE AND ITS STORYTELLING.
UH, HISTORICALLY WE JUST THINK THAT, I JUST THINK THAT WE'RE MOVING TOO FAST AND I DON'T KNOW HOW, HOW, HOW WE STOP THE BALL ROLLING IF YOU'VE ALREADY GOT THE ARCHITECT AND LINED UP TO COME IN AND, AND IT'S, IF HE'S ALREADY BEEN TOLD WHAT HE NEEDS TO DO, I MEAN, BUT I THINK ALL OF US ON THIS COMMISSION WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT THOUGHT ABOUT A LITTLE BIT MORE BEFORE IT'S, IT'S, IT'S GOES INTO THIS NEXT PHASE.
AND I CAN RELAY THAT TO PUBLIC WORKS.
UM, AGAIN, THE MEETING IS THE 13TH, UM, SO, SO JUST A FEW DAYS AWAY.
UM, AND I DON'T KNOW, CERTAINLY WE DON'T HAVE ANOTHER MEETING.
WE EVEN THOUGHT ABOUT SCHEDULING FOR ANOTHER MONTH.
SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, THAT'S PUTTING US WELL OUT THERE, YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF US ACTUALLY, UM, INTERCEDING OR SPEAKING TO THIS.
SO I, I THINK IT COMES BACK TO A, A BIGGER QUESTION.
AND THIS QUESTION I ASK THE CITY IS, WHAT IS THE OVERALL THEME OF THIS PARK? IS IT A COMMUNITY LOCAL PARK? IS IT GOING TO BE PART OF A HISTORIC PARK OVERSEEN IN BY POINT FROM THE HISTORIC VIEW? IS IT GONNA BE AN ART PARK? WE TALKED ABOUT A LOT.
I EVEN TALKED TO THE CITY'S PERSON IN CHARGE OF ART.
SHE LOVED THE IDEA IF WE COULD GET PEOPLE TO DONATE BRONZES AND DIFFERENT THINGS ACROSS THE STREET.
WE HAD ONE OF THE MOST FAMOUS ARTISTS IN THE WORLD LIVING JUST A HUNDRED YARDS AWAY, MAXED ERNST.
UH, THESE ARE ALL WONDERFUL STORIES THAT WE'D LIKE TO TELL AT THIS LOCATION, BUT IT'S,
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AND UNDER, I UNDERSTAND ENGINEERING AND I UNDERSTAND HOW THE CITY WORKS AND IT'S ABOUT CHECKING BOXES AND MOVING FORWARD, BUT STORYTELLING IS WHAT WE DO AND WE'RE TRYING TO SAVE A STORY HERE.AND THEN WE'RE TRYING TO REDEFINE A STORY FOR THE NEXT 20 OR 30 YEARS.
SO THIS IS REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT AND I JUST CAN'T SEEM TO GET ANYBODY OUT OF THE GROOVE OF LET'S GET IT DONE.
YOU CAN STILL BUILD THE PARK, YOU CAN PUT ALL THAT LANDSCAPE IN, BUT WOULDN'T IT BE NICE IF WE SIT DOWN WITH THE PARKS DEPARTMENT AND THE HISTORY DEPARTMENT AND MAYBE THE MUSEUM AND COME TO SOME KIND OF UNDERSTANDING? UH, I SPENT LAST WEEK WITH DESIGN GROUP GOING OVER PLANS GOING BACK 20 YEARS ON THE HISTORY WALK AND THE WALK ALONG THE RIVER WALK AND, UH, THE HISTORY PLAQUE.
AND IT'S SUPPOSED TO ALL KIND OF TIE TOGETHER, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE FROM THIS PARK SHOULD BE ABLE TO WALK THROUGH LACAK, PICK UP INFORMATION, MOVE UP THROUGH THE NEW HISTORY WALK, THEY'RE BUILDING ON 89 A OVERLOOKING THE RIVER.
IT SHOULD ALL BE A THEME THAT WORKS TOGETHER.
AND I KIND OF FEEL LIKE WE'RE A STARFISH AND EACH EACH INDIVIDUAL HAND'S JUST DOING ITS THING, BUT WE AREN'T MOVING FORWARD.
SO I'D REALLY LIKE TO SAY HAVE, LIKE I SAID, I, I ASKED THE CITY COUNCIL, I THINK IT'S TIME FOR A MEETING, AND I THINK YOU CAN JUST SAY THAT WE'RE, WE'RE NOT PARTICULARLY HAPPY WITH THE DIRECTION IT'S GOING.
AND, AND MAYBE THIS IS GOING A LITTLE BIT TOO FAR, BUT MY FEELING IS THAT, UM, WE HAVEN'T HAD A MEETING WITH THE CITY COUNCIL FOR A GOOD NUMBER OF YEARS, AND I DON'T THINK A LOT OF THE CITY COUNCIL ACTUALLY UNDERSTOOD STANDS WHO WE ARE.
I HAVE TO BE HONEST ABOUT THAT.
AND I, I, I DON'T KNOW THAT IT WOULDN'T BE APPROPRIATE FOR ONE OF OUR MEETINGS FOR THE, THE CITY COUNCIL TO BE, UH, FOR US TO GET TOGETHER WITH THE CITY COUNCIL TO ACTUALLY SPEAK ABOUT THESE THINGS BECAUSE IT'S REALLY HARD WHEN, WHEN WE'RE IN SUCH SE SEPARATE BOXES FOR US TO ACTUALLY HAVE COMMUNICATION THAT ACTUALLY WORKS, UM, TOWARD A GO GOAL.
SO I I I, I WOULD THROW THAT IN JUST AS A THOUGHT, UM, YOU KNOW, GOING FORWARD.
SO, UM, TIMELINE IN YOUR THOUGHTS.
I, WELL, I THINK ANY OF US WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO DO A, A MEETING AS SOON AS, AS SOON AS WE COULD.
I MEAN, I THINK, I THINK, UM, ALL OF US WOULD REALLY BE OPEN TO THAT.
EVEN IF IT'S NOT ONE THAT IS ACTUALLY ON OUR SCHEDULE RIGHT NOW.
I THINK WE WOULD BE HAPPY TO DO THAT.
THAT BUILDING COULD SIT THE WAY IT IS RIGHT NOW FOR A YEAR OR TWO YEARS AND IT WOULDN'T INTERFERE WITH ANYTHING.
AND IT WOULD SAVE THE CITY MONEY AND WE COULD ALL HAVE A CHANCE TO TAKE A DEEP BREATH AND COME UP WITH THE BIG AUDACIOUS PLAN.
AND, AND MY FRUSTRATION IS THE CITY DOES WONDERFUL WORK.
THEY HAVE GOOD PEOPLE, BUT THEY DON'T ADD 10% AND 10 ADDING 10% IS TALKING TO PEOPLE, GETTING IDEAS.
HOW DO WE DO IT A LITTLE DIFFERENT? HOW CAN WE MAKE THIS SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE COME AND YOU HAVE TO GO TO THE PARK? NOT THAT IT'S A PARK, YOU KNOW, SO THAT TAKES, THAT TAKES COMMITTEE MEETINGS AND MEETINGS.
AND WE DON'T DO THAT IN THIS TOWN ANYMORE, UNFORTUNATELY.
BUT I THINK WE NEED TO GET BACK TO GETTING, SITTING DOWN AND TALKING.
I'VE MENTIONED ABOUT AN ART PARK TO EVERYBODY, AND THEY ALL GO, GREAT, GREAT, GREAT, GREAT, GREAT.
WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS FOR THE LAST SEVEN YEARS AND WE JUST KEEP RUNNING INTO THIS WALL.
WELL THEN LET'S STOP AND REDO THE PLAN.
WELL, AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE WAS SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING TO BE SAID FOR THE FACT THAT THE CITY WANTED TO MOVE ON THOSE, ON THOSE PROPERTIES TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY, NOTHING HAPPENED TO THEM.
AND I AM, I THINK ALL OF US ARE INCREDIBLY IMPRESSED WITH WHAT HAS BEEN DONE TO SAVE THOSE BUILDINGS.
I MEAN, I THINK ALL OF US HAVE TO SAY THAT THAT IS AN, AN INCREDIBLE, UM, AMOUNT OF WORK THAT WAS DONE.
AND WE ALL APPRECIATE THAT IMMENSELY BECAUSE THAT IF IT HAD THAT NOT BEEN DONE, THERE'S A BIG POSSIBILITY THAT WE WOULDN'T BE TALKING ABOUT THIS PART OF IT AT ALL.
BUT I THINK WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR IS MAYBE A LITTLE TIME AND MAYBE A MEETING TO, TO DISCUSS IT A LITTLE BIT BEFORE WE MOVE QUICKLY INTO THE NEXT PHASE OF IT.
AND I KNOW THAT THE CITY IS THINKING THAT WE, WE SEE IT AS SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE TOO, AS WE DO MM-HMM.
BUT I THINK, AND THAT THE PART THAT WE REALLY WANTED DONE WAS TO MAKE SURE THAT WE SAVE THOSE BUILDINGS IN A WAY THAT WE WOULDN'T HAVE TO BE WORRYING ABOUT THEM FOR THE NEXT 10 YEARS, BUT, UM, OR 20 YEARS.
I MEAN, THE, THE AMOUNT OF WORK THEY'VE DONE IS ABSOLUTELY AMAZING.
AND I THINK WE ALL HAVE TO HAVE TO CONGRATULATE THE CITY FOR HAVING DONE THAT.
I THINK WHAT WE'RE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS NOW THE, THE MOTION FORWARD DOESN'T HAVE TO BE AS, AS RAPID.
MAYBE, MAYBE, MAYBE THE EXTERIOR COULD BE MORE RAPID, BUT MAYBE WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT WHAT WE'RE DOING ON THE INTERIOR JUST SO THAT WE HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING AND WE FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE ABOUT THAT, THAT MOVING THAT PART FORWARD.
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THE, THE IDEA IS, WHEN WE STARTED THIS, WE WERE GONNA HAVE MAYBE SOME APPLE ORCHARDS OR APPLE TREES WE'D TALK ABOUT.AND WE WOULD TALK ABOUT THE INDUSTRY, THE APPLE INDUSTRY, OBY DITCHES VERY CLOSE TO THERE.
WE CAN PULL WATER FROM OBY DITCH.
I THINK WE COULD PROBABLY GET THAT WORKED OUT.
BUT THE IDEA OF MAYBE HAVING CIRCULAR PLAQUES AROUND IT IN A LITTLE WALKWAY SO THAT A SCHOOL COULD COME, YOU COULD START THEM AND WALK 'EM THROUGH THE HISTORY AROUND THIS IN A SERPENTINE WAY AND TALK ABOUT THIS IS WHY IT WAS BUILT.
THIS IS THE BUILDING IN CONTEXT.
ANYBODY COULD WALK THROUGH THIS AND LIKE GO, WOW.
YOU KNOW, THE IDEA OF THE NEW HISTORY WALK ROOM UP 89 A WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IS WE DON'T WANT IT TO BE A HISTORY WALK.
IT HAPPENS TO BE ON THE HIGHWAY.
AND THAT MEANS EXPERIENCE, EXPERIENCE.
THAT MEANS, THAT MEANS SITTING DOWN WITH PEOPLE AND HAVING DISCUSSIONS.
BECAUSE THE CITY PEOPLE HAVE GREAT IDEAS TOO.
AND IT'S GREAT TO HEAR THE WHAT IFS MM-HMM.
AND SO THERE'S SO MANY, THERE'S SO MANY GREAT THINGS WE CAN DO.
WE JUST NEED TO SIT DOWN AND REVISIT THIS.
I MEAN, AND I THINK, I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE ANY MORE DISCUSSION ON THIS END OF IT.
IF, IF THAT'S SOMETHING YOU UNDERSTAND AND CAN BRING TO THE CITY COUNCIL AND, AND, AND PLANNING AND ZONING IN TERMS OF WHERE WE'RE COMING FROM AND, AND HOW THIS NEEDS TO BE.
UM, AND I THINK, LIKE I SAID, I THINK ALL OF US WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO HAVE A MEETING WHENEVER, UM, POSSIBLE.
UM, YOU KNOW, WHENEVER IT'S, IT'S FEASIBLE FOR THE CITY COUNCIL AND THE, AND PROBABLY PLANNING AND ZONING TOO, BECAUSE THEY'RE GONNA BE INVOLVED IN, CERTAINLY IN THIS.
UM, I, I THINK TOO, I JUST WANNA BE CLEAR.
LIKE, I, I THINK WE ALL UNDERSTAND, UM, JACK, UH, I THINK UNDER HIS BREATH JUST A FEW MINUTES AGO SAID ADAPTIVE REUSE.
I THINK WE ALL UNDERSTAND THAT.
AND I THINK WE'RE ALL CLEAR THAT REGARDLESS OF WHAT GOES IN THE INTERIOR, THERE'S GOING TO NEED TO BE CHANGES.
AND I THINK WE ALL UNDERSTAND THAT.
SO EVEN IF IT, IT WAS TO BECOME A, A MUSEUM OR EXHIBIT SPACE OR, OR WHATEVER, UM, THERE WOULD STILL NEED TO BE, UM, UH, CHANGES TO THAT INTERIOR TO MAKE IT.
AND SO I, I THINK WE UNDERSTAND THAT.
I DON'T THINK THAT WE'RE SAYING WE DON'T WANT SEE ANYTHING, ANYTHING.
WE JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT IT'S, IT'S INAPPROPRIATE REUSE.
AND, AND, YOU KNOW, ADAPTIVE USE IS GREAT.
YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE AN OLD BANK BUILDING AND IT'S NOT USABLE ANYMORE, INSTEAD OF TEARING IT DOWN, YOU BUILD A LIBRARY IN IT OR SOMETHING.
BUT YOU KNOW, THIS, THIS, THIS ISN'T THE BUILDING TO DO THAT TO.
I, I WOULD RATHER, WELL, I'VE LOST THE WORD I WAS TRYING TO THINK OF.
UH, BUT ANYWAY, THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK SOMETIMES A HISTORIC BUILDING IS A HISTORIC BUILDING AND YOU HAVE TO RESPECT THE INSIDE AS WELL AS THE OUTSIDE.
I THINK ONE OF THE CRITICAL ELEMENTS THAT'S OVERLOOKED IN HISTORIC PRESERVATION IS A SENSE OF PLACE.
AND TO GET A SENSE OF PLACE YOU NEED, BASICALLY WHAT, UH, COMMISSIONER HUGGINS IS SUGGESTING MM-HMM.
AND THAT IT'S A WORKING RANGER STATION.
AND, UH, AND THAT'S AN ELEMENT THAT IS OFTEN LOST, JUST SO THE CITY UNDERSTANDS OUR POSITION.
OUR POSITION IS TO PROTECT HISTORIC BUILDINGS AND AREAS IN SEDONA.
WE SPEAK FOR THOSE BUILDINGS CUZ THEY CAN'T SPEAK FOR THEMSELF.
SO WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT BEING PER PERSONALITY WISE, ARE THE COMMISSIONS DOING THIS.
OUR JOB IS TO SPEAK FOR THAT BUILDING A HUNDRED YEARS FROM NOW.
AND SO WE'RE SAYING THAT RIGHT NOW WE'RE UNCOMFORTABLE WITH IT'S WHERE IT'S GOING.
SO WE'RE NOT, I DON'T WANT TO TAKE IT PERSONAL OR THINK THAT WE'RE TRYING TO KILL IT MIDWAY.
WE AREN'T, WE'RE SPEAKING FOR THE BUILDING.
WHY WOULD WE HAVE A COMMISSION OTHERWISE? UNDERSTOOD.
SO, SO I THINK WE CAN SORT OF LEAVE IT AT THERE AT THAT POINT.
UM, AND, AND HOPE THAT YOU KNOW, THAT WE WILL BE ABLE TO HAVE A TIME, UH, FAIRLY SOON WHERE WE CAN HAVE THAT DISCUSSION.
AND CERTAINLY IF YOU BRING IT UP WITH A MEETING WITH THE ARCHITECT ON THE 13TH, UM, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'RE GONNA BE THERE, BUT
WELL I'M HOPING THAT YOU CAN, YOU CAN PROJECT THAT TO WHOEVER HAS BEEN INVITED.
BECAUSE, UH, IF YOU'RE NOT GONNA, IF YOU'RE NOT HAVING BEEN INVITED, WE HAVEN'T BEEN INVITED.
SO IF YOU COULD DO THAT, THAT WOULD BE MOST APPRECIATED.
NO, I'LL BE CREATING AN EMAIL AS SOON AS WE'RE DONE HERE, SO.
CAN I JUST, ONE, ONE POINT OF CLARIFICATION, JUST ONE QUICK THING BECAUSE I WANT STAFF TO, TO UNDERSTAND,
[00:30:01]
UH, I'VE SAT IN YOUR SEATS BEFORE.UM, SO I WANT YOU GUYS TO HAVE A CLEAR, UH, DIRECTION THAT WE'RE GIVING YOU CUZ WE'VE, WE'VE GIVEN 'EM A COUPLE THINGS NOW.
WE'VE ALSO ASKED FOR, UH, PUBLIC WORKS TO ATTEND, UH, UH, OUR NEXT MEETING AND TALK ABOUT THE, THE WORK IN THE EXTERIOR OF THE PARK.
I JUST WANNA BE CLEAR THAT'S SO THAT STAFF KNOWS WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR.
UH, IS THAT WHAT WE'RE ASKING STAFF TO, TO MOVE FORWARD WITH? I ALSO THINK SOMEBODY FROM THE PARKS DEPARTMENT SHOULD BE THERE TOO.
WE'VE GOT A LOT OF FINGERS IN THIS POT AND WE'VE ALL GOT A TALK.
WELL, IT, IT, IT JUST SEEMS TO ME THAT WHENEVER YOU DO THAT, IT, IT, IT, YOU COME TO A BETTER CONCLUSION.
YOU HAVE, YOU HAVE ALL THE INPUTS IN THE SAME ROOM, AND WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT BANTERING OR TALKING AT WALLS AND NOT GETTING ANYTHING, YOU KNOW, UH, UH, ACCOMPLISHED WITH THAT.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT WE'RE WORRIED ABOUT THAT THAT HASN'T HAPPENED AT THIS POINT YET.
I THANK YOU EV EVERYBODY ON THE COMMISSION FOR, FOR YOUR INPUT AND YEAH, THANKS FOR BRINGING IT UP,
UM, NOW DISCUSSION OF PRO, UM, PROCEDURAL REQUIREMENTS FOR L D C SERIES 8.7.
UM, I DON'T KNOW WHO, WHO HAD, IF ONE OF YOU HAD PLANNED ON SORT OF MAKING THAT.
IT'S THE, THE FLOOR IS YOURS,
LET'S SEE IF THIS WORKS OR NOT.
SO, UM, WHILE THIS HOPEFULLY WARMS UP, UM, FINGERS CROSSED, IF NOT, I'LL JUST TALK MY WAY THROUGH IT.
UM, UH, HI, MY NAME IS CARRIE MEYER.
I AM THE PLANNING MANAGER FOR THE CITY OF SEDONA.
I'VE BEEN WITH THE CITY FOR ABOUT 11 YEARS AND, UM, PART OF MY RESPONSIBILITIES IS TO OVERSEE THE IMPLEMENTATION OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND MAKE SURE WE'RE ALL LEGAL AND ALL OF THAT.
SO I WAS ASKED LAST WEEK TO COME AND JUST TO GIVE YOU GUYS KIND OF A BRIEF OVERVIEW OF WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE CODE-WISE, WHAT KIND OF STEPS YOU NEED TO, TO GO THROUGH TO MAKE SURE THE DECISIONS YOU'RE POTENTIALLY MAKING ON POTENTIAL LANDMARKS AND ALL OF THAT ARE DONE IN THE, THE CORRECT WAY.
UM, I HAVE A REALLY COOL PRESENTATION IF THIS TURNS ON AND IF NOT, THEN UM, I'LL JUST SEND IT TO YOU LATER.
IT'S NOT ACTUALLY THAT EXCITING, IT'S JUST A WAY FOR ME TO ORGANIZE MY THOUGHTS.
REALLY? COME ON THAT SCREEN BY CHANCE.
YEAH, MAYBE IT WOULD BE, IT WOULD CERTAINLY BE EASIER FOR US TO SEE IF IT GOES UP THERE.
WELL THAT DOESN'T HAVE A SIGNAL RIGHT NOW.
THIS IS LIKE, DON'T WE ALL LOVE TECHNOLOGY? NO, I PUT PRETTY PICTURES IN IT AND EVERYTHING.
SOMEONE HAD A MEETING IN HERE AND UNPLUGGED SOMETHING.
WELL THERE'S SOMETHING HAPPENING.
SO, UM, AGAIN, LIKE I SAID, THIS PRESENTATION WAS TO HELP ME MAKE SURE I HIT EVERYTHING I WANTED TO HIT, BUT IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, UM, FEEL FREE TO INTERRUPT ME AND JUST SAY, HEY, I DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT.
UM, CAN YOU ELABORATE MORE? GO BACK.
THIS CODE IS SO MUCH FUN, I JUST WANNA SPEND MORE TIME TALKING ABOUT IT.
UM, SO BEFORE I GET STARTED, IN THE THINGS THAT ARE SPECIFIC TO HISTORIC PRESERVATION, I DID WANNA ADJUST AN OVERARCHING PURPOSE.
ARTICLE EIGHT IN OUR LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE IS ALL THESE PROCEDURES AND THEY ARE PUT IN PLACE, UM, TO MAKE SURE THAT THE APPLICATIONS THAT WE REVIEW AND GO THROUGH THESE PUBLIC PROCESSES, UM, ARE REVIEWED CONSISTENTLY AND EQUITABLY.
THAT THEY ALL GO THROUGH THE SAME REVIEW PROCESS AND THAT THE PUBLIC AND REVIEW AGENCIES ARE GIVEN SUFFICIENT NOTICE AND ABILITY TO COMMENT ON SOMETHING SO THAT AS DECISION MAKERS SUCH AS YOURSELF
[00:35:01]
ARE MAKING THESE DECISIONS, YOU HAVE ALL THE INFORMATION YOU NEED THAT YOU'RE NOT BEING SURPRISED AT THE LAST MINUTE BY, OH, I DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT THAT.OR, OH, THAT WOULD'VE BEEN NICE TO KNOW A MONTH AGO.
WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE GETTING ALL OF THIS INFORMATION UP FRONT.
SO THAT'S KIND OF THE GOAL OF THESE PROCESSES.
UM, AND WE USE THESE SAME PROCESSES FOR A LOT OF DIFFERENT DEVELOPMENT APPLICATIONS.
SO DEVELOPMENT REVIEWS, WHICH IS DESIGNS OF BUILDINGS, CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS FOR MAYBE HOW PROPERTIES ARE USED, SUBDIVISIONS, HOW PROPERTIES ARE SPLIT UP AND DIVIDED, HISTORIC PRESERVATION ZONE CHANGES, VARIANCES.
THEY ALL, UM, KIND OF USE THE SAME BASIC TEMPLATE OF THESE PROCESSES.
AND THEN THEY'RE TAILORED A LITTLE BIT TO EACH TYPE OF DE EACH TYPE OF APPLICATION.
BUT THE GENERAL FOUNDATION ARE THE SAME FOR ALL OF THESE.
UM, SO THE CODE SECTIONS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, I KNOW 8.7 IS THE ONE THAT IS SPECIFICALLY GUARDING HISTORIC PRESERVATION, BUT THERE'S, UM, OTHER SECTIONS, SECTION 8.2, 8.3, AND 8.9 THAT HAVE A LITTLE BIT IN THERE THAT WE WOULD BE REFERRING AND CROSS-REFERENCING.
AS WE LOOK AT A HISTORIC PRESERVATION APPLICATION, KIND OF THE TWO MOST BORING SECTIONS ARE 8.9, WHICH BASICALLY SAYS THAT YOU GUYS ARE ALLOWED TO EXIST.
THAT, UM, CITY COMMISSIONS, WE DON'T GET TO MAKE THEM UP.
THEY ARE ACTUALLY IN THE CODE OF THE ONES THAT EXIST AND THE ONES, YOU KNOW, THE ONES THAT DON'T, AREN'T IN THE CODE.
UM, SO 8.9 JUST SAYS THAT THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION IS ESTABLISHED BY THE CITY COUNCIL.
IT SAYS YOU HAVE OPERATING RULES AND REGULATIONS THAT YOU HAVE TO STICK TO AND THAT YOU CAN, THAT YOU NEED TO DO THINGS THAT THE CITY COUNCIL HAS TOLD YOU YOU'RE ALLOWED TO DO.
UM, AND THEN SECTION 8.2 HAS THIS FUND TABLE, WHICH THOUGHT IT WAS GONNA BE A LITTLE BIGGER, SORRY,
SO, UM, HIGHLIGHTED YOUR COLUMN HERE.
BASICALLY THIS SAYS THAT YOU ARE A RECOMMENDING BODY FOR DEVELOPMENT APPLICATIONS WHEN THAT APPLICATION INVOLVES A HISTORICALLY LANDMARKED PROPERTY.
SO THAT SAYS THIS R HERE, YOU CAN SEE THAT.
UM, AND THEN THIS HISTORIC PRESERVATION PROCEDURES DOWN HERE IS KIND OF YOUR BREAD AND BUTTER, I GUESS, UM, WHERE YOU HAVE DECISION MAKING AUTHORITY FOR LANDMARKING PROPERTIES AND ISSUING CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS.
AND THEN YOU HAVE A RECOMMENDING AUTHORITY IF WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT DESIGNATED AN ENTIRE DISTRICT, A HISTORIC DISTRICT.
SO A DISTRICT NEEDS TO BE DESIGNATED BY CITY COUNCIL.
YOU AS A COMMISSION DO HAVE DECISION MAKING FINAL AUTHORITY ON INDIVIDUAL LANDMARKS.
OBVIOUSLY YOU CAN, ALL OF THIS IS ONLINE IF YOU REALLY WANNA GO LOOK AT IT.
IT'S VERY EXCITING SECTION OF THE CODE.
BUT THERE'S ALWAYS APPEALS AS A COMMISSION.
ANY OF YOUR DECISIONS ARE APPEALABLE TO CITY COUNCIL OR THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT.
AND SO EVEN ON APPLICATIONS WHERE YOU HAVE THAT FINAL DECISION MAKING AUTHORITY, THERE IS A CHECKS AND BALANCE SYSTEM.
IF SOMEBODY DOESN'T LIKE WHAT YOU DECIDE, A, A QUESTION, WHAT WE SPOKE ABOUT EARLIER, UHHUH ON THAT CATEGORY MM-HMM.
WHAT WOULD BE THE PROCESS THAT WE WOULD BE INVOLVED WITH IN REMODELING OR WORKING ON THAT BUILDING IF THERE ARE STEPS THAT WE'RE GONNA BE ASKED TO DO THINGS OR DO WE HAVE ANY AUTHORITY WHATSOEVER? SO THAT ISN'T, I WAS ACTUALLY THINKING ABOUT THAT AS YOU WERE TALKING, KNOWING WHAT I WAS GONNA TALK ABOUT.
LIKE WHERE WOULD THIS FIT IN? AND SO, UM, AND THAT'S, I DON'T KNOW, I GUESS WOULD BE THE ANSWER BECAUSE WHERE YOU HAVE A RECOMMENDING AUTHORITY UP HERE IS FOR DEVELOPMENT REVIEW APPLICATIONS.
BUT AGAIN, THAT IS LOOKING MORE AT THE OUTSIDE OF A BUILDING.
OUR DEVELOPMENT REVIEW PROCESS DOESN'T NECESSARILY LOOK AT THE INTERIOR OF A BUILDING.
YOU AS A COMMISSION WERE INVOLVED IN THE RANGER STATION PARK MASTER PLAN PROCESS.
UM, AND THAT'S NOT NECESSARILY ON HERE, BUT IT WAS SOMETHING THAT AS, AS A HISTORIC LANDMARKED PROPERTY, YOU WERE, YOU KNOW, IT KIND OF FITS UNDER THAT BECAUSE YOU DO HAVE REVIEW AND RECOMMENDING ABILITIES FOR PROPERTIES THAT HAVE BEEN DE HAVE A HISTORIC LANDMARK DESIGNATION.
AND IT'S PROBABLY ALSO SOMETHING THAT I DON'T KNOW, I WASN'T INVOLVED IN THAT PROCESS, BUT IF WE HAD ASKED CITY COUNCIL AT THE TIME, THEY PROBABLY WOULD'VE SAID YES, WE WANT THE HISTORIC PRESERVATIONS COMMISSION INPUT ON THAT.
AND SO NOW AS WE'RE GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS, WHAT WE'RE DOING AS STAFF, UM, IS CAN TAKING THAT PLAN THAT WAS APPROVED THROUGH THAT PROCESS AND SAYING, DO THESE PLANS THAT THEY'RE SUBMITTING FOR BUILDING PERMITS COMPLY WITH WHAT HAS GONE THROUGH THE PROCESS? IF THERE'S SOMETHING THAT DOESN'T APPLY, WE'RE GONNA SEND THAT PLAN.
YOU KNOW, IF IT'S A CONSIDERED A SUBSTANTIAL CHANGE, WE WOULD SEND THAT PLAN BACK THROUGH THE SAME PROCESS.
SO I THINK YOU'VE SEEN A COUPLE THINGS
[00:40:01]
THAT HAVE COME UP.UM, I THINK SANDY HAS BEEN HERE BEFORE AND THAT HAS, UM, COME ABOUT BECAUSE MAYBE WHAT THEY'RE THINKING ISN'T NECESSARILY RIGHT IN LINE WITH, UM, WHAT THE, THE MASTER PLAN FOR THE PARK SAID.
AND SO THERE'S KIND OF THAT PROCESS, IF WE'RE DOING SUBSTANTIAL CHANGE, WE CAN GO BACK THROUGH THE SAME PROCESS THAT IT TOOK TO GET THAT, UM, THAT PLAN APPROVED IN THE FIRST PLACE.
UM, AND THEN IF STEVE, THE ESTEEM DIRECTOR THAT WE HAVE HERE YES.
YOU KNOW, COMMUNICATES WHAT YOU HAVE SAID TO THE POWERS THAT BE IN, THEY SAY, YES, WE WANT THAT.
SO I, MY EXPERIENCE IS MOSTLY WITH THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION AND JUST LIKE FOR A JOINT MEETING WITH THEM, GENERALLY WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IS THAT IF THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION WANTS IT, THAT WOULD BE COMMUNICATED TO THE CITY COUNCIL AND THE CITY COUNCIL WOULD DECIDE WHETHER THEY WANT IT OR NOT.
AND THEN IF THEY SAY YES, THEN WE SCHEDULE IT.
AND IT'S ALL THAT POINT OF CLARIFICATION ON THAT.
UHHUH
I AM STRUCK THAT YOU CANNOT READ THAT.
UM, SO THERE IS A DECISION MAKING PROCESS.
AND SO IF THERE WAS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, THAT'S WHERE A LANDMARK PROPERTY WANTS TO MAKE A CHANGE.
UM, IF IT'S DETERMINED THAT IT NEEDS TO GO THROUGH THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATE AND NOT THE CERTIFICATE OF NO EFFECT, WHICH IS DONE BETWEEN THE CHAIR AND STAFF.
UM, BUT YEAH, THAT WOULD BE A DECISION MAKING PROCESS.
UM, AND SO IF, UM, BASICALLY WHAT THAT MEANS IS IF EITHER IF, IF YOU AS A COMMISSION APPROVE A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS AND MAYBE SOMEONE FROM THE PUBLIC SAYS, I DON'T THINK THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN APPROVED, OR YOU DENY IT AND THE APPLICANT AND PROPERTY OWNER SAYS, I REALLY THINK IT SHOULD BE, THEY CAN APPEAL THAT.
AND THAT'S WHERE THIS NEXT COLUMN, THERE'S AN A APPEAL HERE TO CITY COUNCIL.
UM, SO THERE IS, YEAH, THAT'S THAT CHECKS AND BALANCES.
SORRY THAT WASN'T A LARGER TABLE.
SO KIND OF THE, UM, MORE OF THE MEAT OF WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT WOULD BE 8.3 AND 8.7, SPECIFICALLY 8.7.
SO 8.3 IS JUST THE STANDARD FOR ALL THE DIFFERENT APPLICATIONS.
AND THEN 8.7 TELLS US WHICH OF THOSE PROCESSES APPLY TO HISTORIC PRESERVATION APPLICATIONS.
AND THERE'S THESE REALLY FUN TABLES.
UM, AND SO AS YOU CAN SEE, THERE'S THAT, THERE'S SEVEN DIFFERENT STEPS.
WE CAN GO THROUGH WHAT EACH ONE OF THOSE LOOKS LIKE.
UM, FOR A HISTORIC LANDMARK DESIGNATION, IT WOULD NEED TO GO THROUGH ALL SEVEN STEPS.
AS YOU CAN SEE IN THE LOWER TABLE HERE.
UM, THE CERTIFICATE, THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, UM, ELIMINATES THE CITIZEN REVIEW PROCESS THAT WOULD BE REQUIRED FOR HISTORIC LANDMARK DESIGNATION.
UM, SO KIND OF GOING THROUGH THESE ONE BY ONE PRE-APPLICATION MEETING, THE APPLICANT COMES IN, THEY MEET WITH CITY STAFF, UM, IDEALLY THE PERSON WHO IS IN CHARGE OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION PROCESS, UM, WE TALK ABOUT WHAT, WHAT THEY'LL NEED, YOU KNOW, IF THEY'RE DOING A LANDMARK OR AN A CERTIFICATE, WHAT THEY, WHAT WE WILL NEED TO SEE FROM THEM IN ORDER TO DO OUR REVIEW, WHAT THE TIMEFRAMES ARE, WHAT THE PROCESS IS, WHAT KIND OF HEARINGS THEY CAN EXPECT, UM, THAT SORT OF THING, KIND OF GO OVER THE PROCESS.
THE CITY HAS, UM, A STAT ON THE FEE SCHEDULED.
THERE ARE NO FEES FOR ANY OF THE HISTORIC APPLICATIONS, BUT THAT WOULD TYPICALLY HAPPEN DURING THAT PROCESS.
NO, UM, I KNOW IN THE LOT, IN THE TWO THAT WE'RE ACTUALLY SPEAKING TO RIGHT NOW, THE CITY STAFF DID NOT, WAS NOT INVOLVED IN US GOING, WE WENT OUT ON OUR OWN AND ACTUALLY SPOKE TO THE TWO.
IS IT NECESSARY FOR THE CITY STAFF TO BE THERE? IS IT POSSIBLE FOR US JUST TO GO AND PRESENT ALL OF THE INFORMATION TO THE HOMEOWNER OR THE BUSINESS OWNER WITHOUT THE CITY STAFF THERE? UM, SO I DON'T, I DON'T, I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANYTHING PREVENTING YOU AS, AS MAYBE INDIVIDUAL COMMISSIONERS.
OBVIOUSLY IF YOU GO AS A GROUP, YOU HAVE TO THAT DON'T DO THAT.
AND WE, AND WE DID ACTUALLY GO AS A GROUP AND, AND IT WAS APPROVED BY THE CITY FOR US TO GO AS A GROUP.
SO IF YOU'RE GOING AS A GROUP, THERE'S NOTICING REQUIREMENTS.
I THINK WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS, YOU KNOW, CAUSE WE'VE, THIS HAS BEEN ONE OF MY GOALS ALL ALONG, IS MAKE SURE THAT THINGS THAT CAN BE DONE WITHOUT THE CITY STAFF, WITHOUT THE NECESSITY OF THE CITY STAFF THAT WE CAN ACTUALLY TAKE CARE OF.
[00:45:01]
SO YEAH.SO CONTACTING A PROPERTY OWNER AS AN INDIVIDUAL COMMISSIONER, TALKING TO THEM ABOUT THE PROCESS, TALKING TO THEM, THAT'S ALL FINE.
ONCE THEY DECIDE THAT, YES, I'M ON BOARD, THEN THIS IS WHERE THAT PROCESS WOULD KICK IN.
SO IF WE WANT, IF YOU ACTUALLY WANNA GO THROUGH AND LANDMARK THE PR A PROPERTY, UM, ONCE THEY DECIDE THAT THEY'RE ON BOARD AND THEY WANNA DO IT, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE WE'RE FOLLOWING ALL THESE STEPS.
SO ALL THE RIGHT NOTICE OCCURS, ALL THE RIGHT OUTREACH OCCURS, THAT SO WE DON'T GET TO A POINT WHERE YOU ARE WANTING TO VOTE ON THE PROJECT, UM, OR ON THE PROPOSAL.
AND NO ONE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD KNOWS NONE OF THE OTHER AGENCIES THAT TYPICALLY LOOK AT THESE PROJECTS.
UM, NO, BECAUSE AGAIN, THAT GOES BACK TO THE WHOLE PURPOSE BEHIND THESE PROCEDURES, RIGHT? IS THAT YOU HAVE, AS YOU'RE MAKING A DECISION, YOU DO NOT HAVE JUST THE HISTORIC SIDE OF IT.
YOU HAVE THE PUBLIC INPUT, YOU KNOW, AND POTENTIALLY YOU MIGHT GET, IF YOU'RE NOTICING PROPERTY OWNERS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD, YOU MIGHT GET MORE SUPPORT FOR WHY A CERTAIN PROJECT DESERVES THAT RECOGNITION.
BECAUSE THEY MIGHT BE LIKE, YEAH, I'VE LIVED HERE FOR 30 YEARS AND HERE'S SOME MORE INFORMATION.
UM, OR THEY MIGHT SAY, I LIVED HERE FOR 30 YEARS AND THEY'RE LYING ON THEIR APPLICATION.
CUZ ACTUALLY WE RIGHT NOW HAVE TWO APPLICATIONS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN FILLED OUT.
SO I DON'T KNOW, HAVE WE, HAVE WE MADE A MISTAKE IN DOING NOT DOING THE PRE-APPLICATION MEETING BECAUSE WE'VE ACTUALLY BROUGHT THEM ALL THE INFORMATION AND, AND WE'VE, WE'VE MADE THEM AWARE OF THAT.
SO THE PRE-APPLICATION MEETING, WE CONSIDER A LOT OF THINGS A PRE-APPLICATION MEETING.
IT DOES NOT NECESSARILY MEAN YOU HAVE TO, I MEAN, WE DO THE FORMAL ONE WHERE YOU SIT DOWN, YOU TALK AND YOU KNOW, WE SCHEDULE AN HOUR AND WE TALK AND HERE'S THE APPLICATION AND WE GIVE YOU PAPER AND RIGHT.
UM, WE HAVE ALSO ACCEPTED AS A PRE-APPLICATION MEETING DISCUSSIONS WITH APPLICANTS THAT CONVEY THE SAME INFORMATION.
SO IF THEY ARE, IF THEY ARE AWARE OF THE PROCESS, WHAT, UM, OBVIOUSLY IN AN APPLICATION LIKE THIS WHERE WE HAVE A COMMISSION INVOLVED AND IT'S, UM, IT'S NOT QUITE, WHAT WE WANT TO AVOID IS SOMEONE SHOWING UP AT OUR DOOR AND SAID, HEY, I'M READY TO SUBMIT AN APPLICATION FOR A NEW HOTEL, AND WE HAVE NO CLUE WHAT'S COMING AND WE HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THEY'RE GIVING US AND ALL THAT SORT OF THING.
SO AGAIN, LOOKING BACK, THESE ARE THE SAME STEPS THAT APPLY TO MOST OF THE PROJECTS IN THE CITY.
SO WE KIND OF TAILOR WHAT WE COUNT FOR EACH ONE OF THOSE STEPS A LITTLE DIFFERENTLY.
BUT IN GENERAL, THE PROCESSES, THE OWNERS OF THESE TWO PROPERTIES THAT CHAIR UNGER IS TALKING ABOUT ARE EXTREMELY WELL INFORMED OWNERS.
AND SO, I, I THINK WE CAN FEEL SAFE HERE ABOUT, YOU KNOW, SAYING THAT THE BASES ARE COVERED.
AND AGAIN, NOT TO SAY THAT YOU CAN, YOU KNOW, AND I THINK PART OF YOUR JOB AS COMMISSIONERS IS TO INCREASE THE AWARENESS OF THE COMMUNITY FOR WHAT IS AVAILABLE, HOW WE CAN RECOGNIZE HISTORIC PROPERTIES.
AND SO GOING OUT AND TALKING, THAT'S ALL, THAT'S ALL GREAT.
UM, BUT WE JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT ONCE YOU'RE READY TO GO FORWARD WITH A SPECIFIC PROPERTY, WE WANNA MAKE SURE ALL OF THESE LEGAL STEPS ARE, ARE FOLLOWED.
AND, AND I KNOW THAT I, I'M PROBABLY MORE FAMILIAR WITH THE, WITH THIS THAN ANYBODY ELSE.
SO THAT'S WHY I GET TO BE HERE.
YOU GET TO TALK TO US ABOUT IT.
UM, SO YEAH, SO IF, AND AGAIN, I THINK ONE OF THE, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF THE STUFF IS MAKING SURE THAT WE TALK ABOUT IN PRE-APPLICATION MEETINGS IS WHAT DO YOU ACTUALLY NEED TO GIVE US IN ORDER FOR FOR US TO GO THROUGH THE REVIEW PROCESS? WHAT ARE YOUR FEES GONNA BE? HOW LONG IS THIS PROCESS GOING TO TAKE? SO, UM, YOU KNOW, IF THAT INFORMATION IS COMMUNICATED IN A DIFFERENT WAY AND IT'S OKAY, IT'S OKAY.
JUST AS LONG AS THEY ALSO KNOW WHO TO GET IN TOUCH WITH IF THEY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS TOO MM-HMM.
AND SO THEN THE NEXT STEP IS WHERE WE ACTUALLY TAKE IN THE APPLICATION AND, UM, FROM AN APPLICANT.
SO THAT'S WHERE WE GO THROUGH ALL THE APPLICATION MATERIALS.
WE MAKE SURE THAT EVERYTHING IS THERE.
WE TAKE THEIR FEES, NO FEES FOR HISTORIC PROJECTS.
UM, AND THEN KIND OF OUR PROCESS IS THAT WE DO HAVE A WEBSITE WHERE WE PUT ALL OF OUR DOCUMENTS ONLINE AND WE HAVE SOME PEOPLE WE SEND 'EM OUT TO.
AGAIN, THIS IS THE, THE STEPS IN THE PROCESS ARE THE SAME.
THE TIMEFRAMES ARE GONNA BE DIFFERENT FOR EACH PROJECT.
SO FOR SOMETHING LIKE A HISTORIC PRESERVATION APPLI, UH, HISTORIC LANDMARK APPLICATION, WE MIGHT STICK IT UP ON OUR WEBSITE, SEND OUT OUR EMAIL AND SAY, HEY, LIKE, LET US KNOW IN THE NEXT WEEK IF YOU HAVE WEEK OR TWO, IF YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS VERSUS A NEW HOTEL WHERE WE'RE SAYING, OKAY, IN TWO WEEKS WE'RE GONNA HAVE A MEETING AND WE NEED COMMENTS IN FOUR WEEKS BECAUSE WE JUST KNOW IT'S A LARGER PROJECT THAT'S GOING TO TAKE MORE TIME.
[00:50:01]
WE NEED TO DO TO MAKE SURE THAT WE GET THE FEEDBACK FROM THE PEOPLE WE NEED FEEDBACK FROM.BUT IF WE HAVE A PROJECT LIKE A HISTORIC LANDMARK WHERE WE DON'T REALLY THINK ANYONE'S GOING TO HAVE AN OBJECTION, WE'RE GONNA GIVE THEM A MUCH SHORTER TIMEFRAME TO RESPOND TO OUR, TO OUR EMAIL.
UM, AND THEN WHILE STAFF IS GOING THROUGH THAT PROCESS, THE APPLICANT, UM, DOES A CITIZEN REVIEW PROCESS.
AND THAT IS WHERE THE NEIGHBOR, THE NEIGHBORING PROPERTY OWNERS, WE GO, A 300 FOOT RADIUS FROM THAT PROPERTY ARE NOTIFIED OF THE APPLICATION.
AND THAT IS CONDUCTED BY THE APPLICANT.
UM, WHERE, AND AGAIN, THE SCALE OF THE PROJECT MIGHT DICTATE WHAT THAT PROCESS LOOKS LIKE, BUT THE GENERAL IDEA IS THAT WE LET THOSE NEIGHBORING PROPERTY OWNERS KNOW THAT THERE IS AN APPLICATION, UM, BEING CONSIDERED FOR SOMETHING NEAR THEM AND GIVING THEM AN OPPORTUNITY.
BECAUSE IF YOU THINK OF IT WITHOUT THIS PRO, OOPS, SORRY.
UM, WITHOUT THIS PROCESS, THE FIRST TIME SOMEONE MIGHT KNOW THAT THERE'S AN APPLICATION NEXT DOOR TO THEM IS WHEN THEY'RE GETTING AN A NOTICE IN THE MAIL FOR A PUBLIC HEARING IN TWO WEEKS.
AND AGAIN, GOING BACK TO THAT PURPOSE OF THIS PROCESS IS THAT WE DON'T WANT TO GO THROUGH THIS WHOLE PROCESS WHERE WE'RE DOING OUR, ALL OF OUR EVALUATION WITHOUT THAT PUBLIC INPUT COMPONENT.
UM, AND AGAIN, FOR A LARGER PROJECT, YOU MIGHT HAVE SOMETHING WHERE THE APPLICANT'S HAVING AN OPEN HOUSE AND THEY'RE SHOWING DRAWINGS, AND FOR SOMETHING SMALLER, MAYBE LIKE A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATE, WELL I GUESS YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO THROUGH IT.
NO, WE DON'T FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, WE, NO, YOU DO HAVE TO GO THROUGH IT FOR A HISTORIC LANDMARK DESIGNATION, BUT IT MIGHT JUST BE THAT YOU SEND OUT A LETTER RIGHT.
EXPLAINING WHAT YOU'RE DOING, SAYING, HEY, IF YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS, LET US KNOW WHEN WE'D DEPRECIATE YOUR COMMENTS IN THE NEXT TWO WEEKS.
AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO NECESSARILY DO THE OPEN HOUSE THAT THE LARGE DEVELOPMENT PROJECT'S GONNA DO, BUT YOU NEED TO AT LEAST SOMEHOW LET, AGAIN, THOSE PROPERTY OWNERS IN THE GENERAL VICINITY OF THE PROJECT, NO, THERE'S SOMETHING GOING ON.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S YOUR RESPONSIBILITY, RIGHT? THAT'S THE NO, THAT IS THE APPLICANT'S RESPONSIBILITY.
AND SO THAT'S WHERE WE WOULD HAVE TO FOR SOMETHING LIKE THIS.
WE HAVEN'T DONE ONE IN A WHILE.
IF THE CITY IS THE APPLICANT, IF THE COMMISSIONER, IF THE PROPERTY OWNERS THE APPLICANT, WE HAVE TO LIKE FIGURE OUT WHO THE APPLICANT IS AND WE WOULD WORK, WE PROVIDE THE MAILING LABEL.
SO LIKE AN APPLICANT DOESN'T HAVE TO GO AND TRY TO FIGURE OUT WHO, WHO YEAH.
CAUSE THAT'S GONNA BE RATHER AWKWARD.
WE HAVEN'T, I DON'T REMEMBER HAVING DONE THIS BEFORE.
DONNA, IS THIS SOMETHING NEW TO, UM, OUR, THIS PROCESS? BECAUSE I DON'T REMEMBER US EVER DOING THIS PART OF IT.
I REMEMBER PRETTY MUCH OF WHAT'S ON HERE, BUT I DON'T REMEMBER THAT PART OF IT.
IS THAT SOMETHING THAT HAS BEEN IN HERE? MODIFIED.
THERE WAS UPDATE DONE TO THE LDC AND AT THAT POINT TIME, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE PROCEDURES WERE, BUT THIS IS, CAUSE I DON'T REMEMBER THAT BEING PART OF THE PROCEDURE PREVIOUSLY, BUT MAYBE HAVE TO GO MAYBE JUST TO MAKE THEM ALL SORT OF FOLLOW THE SAME THING.
WE DID AN UPDATE TO THE TOTAL HALL, ALTHOUGH WE HAVEN'T DONE THE LANDMARK FOR A WHILE.
BUT AGAIN AND AGAIN, SO THAT'S KIND OF LEADS INTO THE NEXT STEP, WHICH IS THE STAFF REVIEW IN ACTION.
AND SO WHAT THEN THE STAFF WOULD DO IS WE WOULD TAKE ALL OF THOSE PUBLIC COMMENTS.
WE GET, WE TAKE THE, ANY COMMENTS WE GET FROM A REVIEW AGENCY, WE TAKE ALL OF THAT AND KIND OF COMBINE IT.
AND THEN WE LOOK AT IT AND THERE ARE FINDINGS IN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE THAT, UM, THAT WE HAVE TO GO THROUGH AND LOOK AT, DOES THIS MEET THE REASONS WHY WE DO HISTORIC LANDMARK DESIGNATIONS? AND IF WE DON'T HAVE THAT PUBLIC INPUT PROCESS, WE'RE MISSING A BIG COMPONENT OF HOW WE'RE GONNA BE ABLE TO MAKE THOSE FINDINGS.
AND SO WHAT STAFF WOULD DO, UM, DURING THIS STEP FOUR IS THAT WE WOULD COMPILE ALL OF THAT, LOOK AT IT FOR HOW IT COMPLIES OR DOESN'T COMPLY.
UM, AND THIS IS WHERE, YOU KNOW, WE MIGHT WORK WITH AN APPLICANT OR SOMETHING AND SAY, HEY, WE NEED MORE INFORMATION IN THIS AREA.
THIS QUESTION CAME UP, WHAT ABOUT THIS? AND WE WORK THROUGH THAT AND WE PREPARE A STAFF REPORT, UM, AND SAY, HERE'S THE REASONS WHY WE'RE EITHER RECOMMENDING APPROVAL OR DENIAL BASED ON ALL OF THIS GATHERING OF INFORMATION.
AND THEN THAT, UM, AND THEN ONCE WE GET THERE, YOU MOVE ON TO STEP FIVE WHERE AGAIN, WE'RE NOTICING THE PUBLIC HEARING AND WE'RE TELLING THOSE NEIGHBORING PROPERTY OWNERS AND THE GENERAL COMMUNITY THAT THERE IS A DECISION THAT'S POTENTIALLY GOING TO BE MADE AT A MEETING.
AND IF YOU'RE INTERESTED IN IT, YOU SHOULD SHOW UP.
AND SO WE DO THAT MAILING AGAIN TO THOSE PROPERTY OWNERS.
WE PUBLISH A NOTICE IN THE RED ROCK NEWS AND WE PUT A FUN LITTLE YELLOW SIGN ON THE PROPERTY SO PEOPLE DRIVING THROUGH THE NEIGHBORHOOD CAN RECOGNIZE IT.
THEY'RE AWARE THAT THERE'S A HEARING HAPPENING WHERE A DECISION COULD POTENTIALLY BE MADE AND THEY CAN COME AND THEY CAN, OH, AND THEN, BUT, AND AGAIN, HOPEFULLY
[00:55:01]
THIS IS NOT ESPECIALLY FOR THE NEIGHBORS WITHIN THAT IMMEDIATE VICINITY, HOPEFULLY THIS IS NOT THE FIRST TIME THEY'RE FINDING OUT ABOUT IT BECAUSE THEY'VE GOTTEN THAT NOTICE.THEY HAS DONE THAT NOTICE PRIOR.
AND THEN, UM, THE COMMISSION TAKES ALL OF THAT INFORMATION.
THEY TAKE ANY OF THE COMMENTS THAT MIGHT, UM, COME UP DURING A PUBLIC HEARING AND YOU MAKE A DECISION.
YOU SAY YES OR NO, MAKE A RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL OR DENIAL, KIND OF, AGAIN, GOING BACK TO THAT INITIAL CHART OF WHAT YOUR REVIEW AUTHORITY IS ON THAT SPECIFIC TYPE OF APPLICATION.
UM, AND THEN, UM, FROM THERE, IT AGAIN, THE POST-DECISION ACTIONS ARE JUST KIND OF DEPENDENT AGAIN ON WHAT THOSE, UM, THE DECISION IS WHAT THE DECISION IS.
SO IF YOU APPROVE SOMETHING THAT CAN BE APPEALED, IF YOU ARE A RECOMMENDING BODY ON THAT, IT JUST MOVES ON TO THE NEXT STEP IN THE PROCESS.
SO IF THERE IS A, AN APPLICATION FOR A DEVELOPMENT REVIEW FOR A PROPERTY THAT HAS BEEN HISTORICALLY LANDMARKED, IT WOULD COME TO YOU FIRST, YOU WOULD MAKE A RECOMMENDATION BASED ON THE HISTORIC NATURE OF THE PROJECT.
IT WOULD MOVE ON TO PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION WHERE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION HAS FINAL DECISION MAKING AUTHORITY ON A DEVELOPMENT REVIEW.
BUT THEN FROM THERE, SOMEONE COULD APPEAL THAT TO CITY COUNCIL.
WHEREAS IF IT'S A ZONE CHANGE PLANNING ZONING COMMISSION IS ALSO A RECOMMENDING BODY.
SO HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION MAKES A RECOMMENDATION, PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MAKES A RECOMMENDATION, AND THEN CITY COUNCIL MAKES THE FINAL DECISION.
SO THEN, UM, SO FOR ANYWHERE WHERE HPC IS A RECOMMENDING BODY, IT'S GENERALLY THE FIRST RECOMMENDING BODY.
AND THEN WE GO KIND OF BEYOND THAT UP FROM THERE.
AND I THINK THAT'S ABOUT ALL I HAVE.
LET ME ASK YOU SOMETHING THOUGH.
UM, WITH, YOU KNOW, YOU WERE SAYING THAT WE NEED THE SAME PROCESS IF SOMEBODY COMES TO US AND WE NEED A, A, A A, A CERTIFICATION OF APPROPRIATENESS THAT WE'VE NEVER DONE THAT, WE'VE NEVER ACTUALLY HAD TO, UM, GO THROUGH SCHEDULING, UH, UH, UH, A NOTE PUBLIC NOTICE.
WE'VE NEVER DONE THAT WHEN WE'VE, WHEN WE'VE BEEN INVOLVED.
AND I DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND THAT.
IS THAT SOMETHING YOU SAW IN, IN, IN THE REST OF IT, THAT WE WERE GONNA HAVE TO GO THROUGH THIS PRO PROCESS TOO WITH A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS? WELL, I MEAN, I THINK, I DON'T KNOW.
PART PART OF THE PROBLEM IS, IS THAT I THINK THEY REFER TO THIS AS THE COMMON PROCEDURE.
AND AND I UNDERSTAND WHY YOU DO THAT.
THE BIGGEST PROBLEM THAT WE HAVE IS WE'RE NOT COMMON.
AND, UM, GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE, THIS IS FROM 2017.
THIS IS A 2016 RECOMMENDATION.
I THINK IT WAS MIKE RABER, I THINK IS OH YEAH, YEAH.
MIKE RABER AND OUR ASSISTANT, UH, UH, DIRECTOR WARREN CAMPBELL UH, THESE ARE JUST AMENDMENTS TO WHAT HAPPENED TO BE IN THE, UH, LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AT THAT TIME.
THAT BECAME THIS, WHICH IS A SOMEWHAT WEIGHTY DOCUMENT THAT THE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR PUT TOGETHER FOR US IN 2018.
AND THE THING THAT'S INTERESTING ABOUT THIS THAT ISN'T IN THE NEW LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE IS THAT ALL OF THE DEFINITIONS THAT YOU FIND IN ARTICLE NINE, SECTION FIVE IN THE NEW LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, ARE WITHIN ARTICLE 15, SECTION 3 0 3 IN THE OLD CODE.
SO THE DEFINITIONS ARE WHERE THEY BELONG IN, IN, IN THE OLD DOCUMENT.
THEY ARE NOT WHERE THEY BELONG IN THE NEW DOCUMENT.
AND ONE OTHER THING THAT I NEED TO POINT OUT IS THAT BECAUSE WE WEREN'T EXPOSED TO THIS AS A GROUP, UH, THERE WERE SOME THINGS THAT WERE LOST.
ONE OF THEM IS THE, UM, THERE IS NO MENTION IN THE NEW LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE ABOUT THE HISTORIC RESOURCE RECOGNITION AWARD PROGRAM.
UM, THIS PROGRAM STARTED IN, UH, 2015 AND 2016 WITH WHEN ANN JARMUS WAS ON THIS BOARD, UH, ON THIS COMMISSION.
AND, UH, WHEN SHE WAS LEAVING THE COMMISSION, SHE HANDED IT OFF TO ME.
SINCE THAT TIME, BOB HUGGINS HAS BEEN VERY INVOLVED WITH THIS.
WE'VE GOTTEN IT OFF THE GROUND.
UH, THIS NEEDS TO BE SOMEWHERE IN THAT CODE.
BUT AGAIN, BECAUSE WE WEREN'T ASKED ABOUT THE CHANGES THAT WERE MADE, NOBODY CAME TO US.
WE COULDN'T SAY, HEY, WAIT, WHAT ABOUT IT? AND IT'S MISSING.
[01:00:01]
THAT AT THIS POINT, BUT, UM, YEAH, I WAS NOT, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT DECISION WAS MADE TO TAKE IT OUT.I KNOW THERE WAS A LOT OF THINGS THAT AS WE WERE GOING THROUGH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, THERE WERE THINGS THAT ARE NOT APPROPRIATE TO BE IN A CODE.
AND THAT WAS PROBABLY ONE OF THEM.
JUST, YOU KNOW, IF THE COMMISSION HAS BEEN GIVEN, IF THAT IS SOMETHING THE COMMISSION IS DOING, THAT PROBABLY MORE NEEDS TO BE IN YOUR OPERATING RULES AND PROCEDURES RATHER THAN THE CODE.
BECAUSE THE CODE SAYS THE COMMISSION HAS AUTHORITY IN, YOU KNOW, BASED ON THE RULES AND PROCEDURES AND THINGS THAT THE CITY COUNCIL HAS SPECIFICALLY AUTHORIZED YOU TO DO.
SO A, A PROGRAM THAT THE COMMISSION DOES IS PROBABLY ACTUALLY NOT APPROPRIATE TO BE IN THE CODE.
IT'S MORE WE WOULD WANNA LOOK AT THE, UM, OPERATING RULES AND PROCEDURES OF THE COMMISSION.
WELL, Y HERE'S, HERE'S THE, THE DIFFERENCE.
THE DIFFERENCE IS THAT WHAT ABOUT HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT PROPERTIES THAT DO NOT MEET THE CRITERIA FOR A LANDMARK? AND, AND THERE ARE SEVERAL OUT THERE.
I KNOW BOB HAS BEEN WORKING ON SEVERAL OF THESE.
AND, AND SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT THAT WAY, IT'S JUST A STEP DOWN, ONE STEP DOWN FROM A LANDMARK PROPERTY.
IF THE LANDMARK PROPERTY CRITERIA AND SO FORTH ARE GOING TO BE IN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, CERTAINLY THIS BELONGS THERE AS WELL.
I DON'T, AND, AND I DON'T KNOW.
AND, AND I HAVE TO SAY THE, THE, THE FACT OF THE MATTER THAT YOU'RE ASKING NOW FOR US TO LOOK AT, UM, ANY, ANY ALTERATIONS AS THAT WERE MADE FOR THE OUTSIDE, THAT WE'RE GONNA ACTUALLY HAVE TO HAVE A PUBLIC MEETING OVER THAT I CAN BET YOU DIMES TO DONUTS, WE'RE GONNA LOSE A LOT OF OUR LANDMARKS BECAUSE I, I CAN'T UNDERSTAND WHY WE WOULD NEED, WHY THE, THE COMMISSION WOULD NEED THE PUBLIC.
I CAN UNDERSTAND WHY THEY, THE PUBLIC NEEDS TO BE KNOWN, KNOW WHY WE'RE, THAT WE'RE LAND MAKE MARKING SOMETHING.
BUT IF WE'RE ALLOWING A A, AN ALTERATION TO BE MADE OF THAT LANDMARK, IT'S GONNA BE DONE WITH OUR EDUCATIONAL BACKGROUND IN, IN THE, IN THE SERVICE OF THIS.
SO FOR US TO GO THROUGH THAT, I CAN TELL YOU RIGHT NOW, THAT IS GONNA BE A REAL PROBLEM.
WE DID NOT, WE WERE NOT ASKED AT ALL WHAT WOULD THIS WAS GONNA HAPPEN.
IT WAS DURING COVID THAT YOU GUYS WENT THROUGH THIS AND CHANGED EVERYTHING AND BROUGHT THIS TO US.
WE, I, I AM REALLY CONCERNED WITH ACTUALLY ASKING ANYBODY TO LANDMARK ANYMORE.
CUZ IF, IF THEY HAVE, IF THEY WANNA DO AN ALTERATION OF THE OUTSIDE OF THEIR BUILDING AND THEY NOT ONLY HAVE TO COME TO US, BUT THEY HAVE TO GO TO THE PUBLIC TOO, THAT'S GONNA BE A REAL, A REAL SETBACK FOR US.
CUZ THAT WAS NEVER, WE HAVE NEVER DONE THAT IN THE NOW OH GOD, ALMOST 20 YEARS THAT I'VE BEEN ON THIS COMMISSION.
AND SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT GONNA ARGUE WITH YOU.
AND CERTAINLY WE'RE NOT TRYING TO ARGUE WITH YOU.
WE, WE UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS PROBABLY, YOU'RE JUST PRESENTING THIS.
I MEAN, I, I DON'T KNOW HOW WE NOW HOW WE MAKE IT, YOU KNOW, WE MAKE THE COMMENTS ON THIS BECAUSE THIS IS GONNA BE A REALLY, YOU KNOW, GOING THROUGH ALL THIS PROCESS IF THEY WANT.
AND I DON'T THINK THERE'S A CITY IN ARIZONA THAT DOES THIS WITH HISTORIC PRESERVATION.
THIS IS, WE'RE GONNA BE ONE OF THE FEW THAT ACTUALLY ASKS FOR THIS KIND OF EXTENSIVE, UM, UH, REVIEW OF SOMETHING.
IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO PAINT A DIFFERENT COLOR ON THEIR PLACE, NOW THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO GO TO THE PUBLIC, AND THE PUBLIC IS GONNA HAVE A SAY IN WHETHER THEY CAN DO THAT.
THAT IS NOT THE WAY THIS WORKS.
SO IF, BUT, BUT, BUT YOU'RE SAYING IS, UH, UH, IF WE HAVE TO MAKE A A A A CERTIFICATE OF OF OF APPROPRIATENESS MM-HMM.
I MEAN, HALF THE TIME WE'RE, WE'RE, WE'RE MAKING, THOSE ARE THINGS THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT AND SAYING, OKAY, THAT'S OKAY FOR YOU TO DO.
SO I WOULD FIRST POINT OUT THAT YOU ARE A PUBLIC BODY AND THE THINGS YOU DO ARE PUBLICLY NOTICED.
UM, IF PEOPLE WANT TO BE INVOLVED IN HISTORIC PRESERVATION, THEY'RE WELCOME TO COME.
AND SO IF SOMEONE, IF, IF PAINTING A HOUSE WAS NOT A CERTIFICATE WOULD HAD TO GO THROUGH A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATE APPROPRIATENESS, NOT A CERTIFICATE OF NO EFFECT, BECAUSE WE DO HAVE THOSE TWO DIFFERENT PROCESSES.
WE PUT THOSE, THE CERTIFICATE OF NO EFFECT IS BETWEEN STAFF AND THE CHAIR.
IF SO, IF YOU DETERMINE THAT THAT NEEDED A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, CAN I EXPLAIN WHAT THE PROCESS WOULD BE? OH, YEAH.
CUZ WELL, I ACTUALLY KNOW CAUSE I WROTE MOST OF THAT STUFF.
SO THE, THE, THE, THE PROCESS OF NO EFFECT.
SO I'M, WHAT I'M SAYING IS THAT IF SOMEONE NEEDED A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS BASED ON THE REQUIREMENTS AND THE CODE, RIGHT? THEY WOULD COME IN,
[01:05:01]
THEY WOULD SAY, I WANNA PAINT MY HOUSE.THEY WOULD GIVE US SOME PICTURES OF THE HOUSE.
THE PAINT COLOR SAID, I'M GONNA PAINT IT THIS COLOR.
WE'D SCHEDULE A PUBLIC HEARING.
YOU KNOW, IF I DON'T KNOW THAT WE WOULD BE, THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING, AGAIN, WE CAN USE OUR DISCRETION IN HOW EXTENSIVE THAT REVIEW IS.
THAT'S WHAT I WAS SAYING, THAT THERE ARE SOME PROJECTS THAT REQUIRE TWO DAYS OF REVIEW.
THERE'S SOME PROJECTS THAT REQUIRE TWO MONTHS OF REVIEW.
AND I DOUBT THAT A PAINT COLOR WOULD REQUIRE TWO MONTHS OF REVIEW.
AND SO THEY WOULD SUBMIT THAT.
WE WOULD SAY, AWESOME, THANKS FOR YOUR APPLICATION.
AGAIN, THERE'S NO FEES FOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION, UM, APPLICATIONS.
WE NEED THREE WEEKS TO DO THE PUBLIC NOTICING.
AND SO WE WOULD PUT IT ON YOUR NEXT AGENDA, SEND OUT A NOTICE TO PROPERTY OWNERS WITHIN 300 FEET, PUT IT ON YOUR NEXT AGENDA, AND YOU WOULD CONSIDER IT.
AND IT WOULD EITHER GET APPROVED OR NOT DURING THAT HEARING THAT, THAT'S RIGHT.
I I WAS, I WAS GONNA SAY BRENDAN JUST MM-HMM.
SO AND SO OUR REVIEW OF IT IN OUR MEETING, PUBLIC MEETING AND WOULD SIMPLY BE THE PUBLIC MEETING, PUBLIC MEETING.
AND WE WOULD JUST NOTICE IT TO THOSE 300 FOOT.
SO AS YOU SEE PROPERTY OWNERS, CORRECT.
THAT'S THE GRAYED OUT CITIZEN REVIEW PROCESS HERE.
THAT MEANS THAT THERE'S NOT A SEPARATE CITIZEN REVIEW PROCESS FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS.
IT'S JUST THE ONE NOTICE FOR THE ONE MEETING.
WELL, AND AND I, IT'S SIMPLY OUR REVIEW ON, AND I GUESS, I GUESS WHAT, UH, WHAT I, WE HAVEN'T DONE BEFORE IS WE'VE NEVER HAD TO NOTICE THE PROPERTY OWNERS NEARBY EVER MM-HMM.
SO THIS IS A NEW, THIS IS A TOTALLY NEW THING THAT, THAT HAS BEEN PUT IN THERE.
WE HAD THAT MEETING AND WE'D HAVE A MEETING AND IT WOULD, YOU KNOW, IT WOULD INDICATE THIS, BUT IT WASN'T, THERE WASN'T AN NECESSITY IN TELLING EVERYBODY IN THE CIR YOU KNOW, IN THE AREA AROUND THERE THAT THEY WERE GONNA CHANGE.
YOU KNOW, THERE WAS SOMETHING HAPPENING WITH THAT PROPERTY.
UM, SO I GUESS THAT'S A NEW, THAT'S A NEW, A NEW STEP THAT THEY PUT IN HERE FOR THE LANDMARKING.
WELL, AND FOR, YEAH, FOR LANDMARKING.
CAUSE I KNOW YOU HAD HAD IT FOREVER THINGS.
SO I THINK WHAT YOU'RE DOING IS YOU'RE SIMPLIFYING 'EM ALL AND YOU'RE POPPING THIS IN THERE.
IT JUST SEEMS A LITTLE BIT AWKWARD TO BE DOING THAT FOR SOMETHING LIKE THIS.
BUT, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, IT'S, IT'S THREE WEEKS IN ADVANCE OF THE HEARING.
WE, YOU JUST LET EVERYBODY KNOW HAVE A LETTER YOU, AND THAT IS NOT THE PROPERTY OWNERS, BUT BECAUSE THAT WOULD ONLY BE IN NUMBER THREE, THAT THAT WOULD BE THEIR RESPONSIBILITY.
SO UNDER NUMBER FIVE, THAT'S, WE WOULD NOTICE PROPERTY OWNERS THERE TOO.
BUT IT WOULD BE PART, IT WOULD BE THREE WEEKS MAXIMUM IN ADVANCE OF A HEARING.
AND SO SINCE YOU GUYS MEET ONCE A MONTH, YOU KNOW, WE JUST DO IT A FEW WEEKS BEFORE AND THEN JUST LET THEM KNOW THE HEARING AND THEN LET THEM KNOW THAT YOU GUYS ARE HAVING A MEETING AND YOU WOULD HAVE THIS MEETING AND THIS WOULD BE THEIR TIME FOR PUBLIC COMMENT AS WELL.
AND TO CLARIFY, THAT WORK FALLS ON STAFF, RIGHT? YEAH.
SO THAT'S NOT ANYTHING, THAT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO DO.
THAT'S NOT ANYTHING THAT THEY HAVE DIFFERENT FOR US.
WE'RE STILL JUST HOLDING OUR MEETING AND REVIEWING AND CORRECT.
AND NOT, NOT FOR THE APPLICANT THEMSELVES.
THE ONLY THING THAT I COULD SEE IS THAT SOME OF THE APPLICANTS WOULD FEEL, YOU KNOW, TO ACTUALLY MAKE IT THAT MUCH MORE OF A POINT OF WHAT THEY'RE DOING.
IT'S, IT'S A LITTLE UNCOMFORTABLE.
BUT, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT I GUESS WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO LIVE WITH IF THAT, IF THE CITY HAS DECIDED THAT.
SO I WONDER, COMMISSIONER FEENEY, DID YOU HAVE A COPY OF THE 2017 CODE TO WHERE WE COULD COMPARE WHAT ADDITIONAL STEPS HAVE BEEN ADDED? UM, THE ONE THOUGHT I HAVE IS THAT THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN DEVELOPMENT REVIEWS AND LANDMARKING IN THAT IN RECENT CASES, GOING BACK 10 YEARS, UM, HPC HAS BEEN THE MOVING PARTY TO GO TO PROPERTY OWNERS AND TRY TO CONVINCE THEM TO LANDMARK.
WHEREAS IN DEVELOPMENT REVIEW, THE DEVELOPERS ARE BRINGING THAT TO THE CITY.
AND IT IS POSSIBLE THAT THE APPLICANTS ARE GONNA BE UNCOMFORTABLE SENDING OUT THAT LETTER TO THE NEIGHBORS AFTER THEY'VE BEEN CONVINCED TO DO IT BY THE COMMISSION OR REPRESENTATIVES OF STAFF.
THAT IS, THAT IS ANOTHER, THAT IS AN ACTUALLY VALID POINT TOO.
IT GOES TO, THIS SEEMS TO BE A PUBLIC PROCESS.
IF THE CITY IS GONNA BE LANDMARKING A PROPERTY, THE, THE NOTIFICATION, THE PUBLIC PROCESS, THE TRANSPARENCY ALL NEEDS TO BE THERE SO THAT WE CAN MAKE SURE THAT WHEN WE'RE MAKING THE DECISION, WE MAKE IT WITH THE BEST AVAILABLE INFORMATION.
AND THAT COMES THROUGH GOING THROUGH THE PUBLIC PROCESS.
WELL, AND, AND I THINK, I THINK THAT ABSOLUTELY IS, IS, IS, YOU KNOW, AND I, I I, WE, I THINK WE ALL AGREE WITH THAT.
AND THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS IN FIVE.
I THINK WHAT SHE'S SAYING IS IT'S A LITTLE, SOME PEOPLE DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND IT.
SO IT MAY BE THAT WHATEVER WE'RE GOING TO SEND OUT AND WHATEVER IS GOING TO BE HANDED TO THEM TO SEND OUT, THEY NEED IT.
[01:10:01]
NEEDS TO BE MORE THAN JUST A NOTE NOTIFICATION.IT'S GONNA HAVE TO ACTUALLY, AND WE PROBABLY SHOULD CRAFT SOMETHING THAT TALKS TO WHAT THAT MEANS TO THE NEIGHBORS.
THAT IT'S NOT GONNA MEAN THAT THEY'RE GONNA BE AFFECTED BY IT.
YOU KNOW, MAYBE, MAYBE BECAUSE YOU GUYS HAVE NOT BEEN HERE THAT LONG, YOU DON'T REALIZE HOW DIFFICULT IT IS FOR PEOPLE TO MAKE THIS DECISION THINKING THAT THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE, HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THEIR NEIGHBORS OR HAVE A PROBLEM WITH, YOU KNOW, UH, SOMETHING ELSE.
SO I, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER, WHATEVER HAS TO GO OUT, MAYBE IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE, AND I'M JUST SUGGESTING THIS, MAYBE IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE FOR ONE OF THE MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION TO HELP PUT TOGETHER WHATEVER IS GOING TO BE SENT OUT.
BECAUSE THAT WE HAVEN'T DONE THIS YET.
THAT THAT HASN'T BEEN HAP HAPPENING YET.
YOU, WE HA WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS MAYBE PUT SOMETHING TOGETHER THAT THE HOMEOWNER FEELS COMFORTABLE ENOUGH WITH TO SEND TO THEIR NEIGHBORS.
AND BECAUSE PEOPLE HAVE REALLY, THEY HAVE MISUNDERSTANDINGS ABOUT A LOT OF THINGS.
AND WHEN YOU SAY YOU'RE GOING TO ACTUALLY LANDMARK A PIECE OF PROPERTY, SOMETIMES THE PEOPLE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THINK, WELL, OKAY, EVERYBODY'S GONNA DRIVE UP TO THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY NOW.
I DON'T WANT THIS, AND I'M GOING TO GO IN AND PROTEST IT.
AND THAT'S, AND SO THEN THAT HURTS THE HOMEOWNERS, THE HOMEOWNER SENDS THIS TO THEIR NEIGHBOR AND THEIR NEIGHBOR SHOWS UP IN THEIR FRONT DOOR, YOU DON'T DARE DO THIS.
YOU KNOW, SO THERE HAS TO BE WHATEVER, WHATEVER IS GOING TO BE SENT OUT TO THE, TO THE PROPERTY OWNER TO SEND OUT.
AND THAT NUMBER THREE, UM, I THINK NEEDS SOME KIND OF, UM, AND AS YOU'RE SOME KIND OF SOMETHING TO, TO ACTUALLY, AND I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS ARE THE ONES WE SHOULD BE TALKING TO ABOUT THIS.
MAYBE WE SHOULD BE TALKING TO OTHER STAFF MEMBERS, IF I MAY.
UH, CHAIR, UM, IN MY EXPERIENCE, UH, THOSE NOTICES ARE LEGAL NOTICES THAT ARE GENERALLY FORMULATED BY THE LEGAL DEPARTMENT.
UM, RATHER THAN ANYTHING ELSE.
AND SO, I, I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE FOR, FOR US TO WEIGH IN ON THAT.
BUT, UM, THE OTHER THING I WOULD SAY ABOUT THAT IS, THAT'S THE POINT OF, OF THREE AND INVITING PEOPLE IN IS TO THEN SAY, HERE, OR IS THE IMPACT OF THIS.
I DON'T THINK IT NECESSARILY NEEDS TO GO IN THAT NOTICE THAT, AS I SAID, IS GENERALLY IN MY EXPERIENCE, A LEGAL NOTICE ANYWAY.
BUT SEE, WHAT, WHAT, WHAT, AND THEN THREE, YOU'RE INVITING THEM IN TO EXPLAIN WHAT THOSE
AND THREE, YOU'RE NOT INVITING THEM IN UNTIL FIVE.
SO THREE'S GOING TO BE ACTUALLY, UM, AFFECTING WHAT THE STAFF REVIEWS.
IT'S NOT GONNA, IT'S NOT GONNA COME TO US.
NO, THAT WOULD BE PART OF WHAT YOU REVIEW.
SO WHAT STAFF DOES IS WE TAKE ALL OF THAT, WE MAKE A RECOMMENDATION, BUT WE PROVIDE YOU WITH ALL OF THAT INFORMATION AS PART OF YOUR DECISION MAKING.
BECAUSE WE DO NOT MAKE THE ULTIMATE DECISION.
SO FOR A LANDMARK, WE WOULD SAY, YES, THIS MEETS THE CRITERIA.
NO, IT DOESN'T, BUT HERE IS ALL THE INFORMATION THAT WE USE TO MAKE THAT DECISION.
WELL, AND MAYBE, MAYBE, MAYBE THE STEP THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS STEP ONE IN THE IN OR STEP TWO WITH THE APPLICATION.
MAYBE IN THE APPLICATION, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THE HOMEOWNER KNOWS HOW TO APPROACH IF THEY'RE NEIGHBORS ACTUALLY COME TO TALK TO THEM, HOW THEY, HOW THEY NEED TO TALK TO IT.
I'M, I'M JUST TRYING TO PREVENT SOMETHING FROM HAPPENING THAT I WORRY ABOUT HAPPENING.
AND I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE I'M WRONG WITH THAT, BUT I THINK LET'S BE PRAGMATIC ABOUT THIS ONE.
WE'RE NOT GONNA GET IT CHANGED.
WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO LIVE WITH IT.
AND THREE, IT'S PROBABLY GONNA HAVE NO EFFECT.
SO, UH, I THINK WE JUST, ONE OF THOSE THINGS, WE ROLL OUR EYES AND WE MOVE ON.
I JUST, I I'M, I, I JUST HAVE A CONCERN WITH IT.
MAYBE, MAYBE WE AS A BODY NEED TO UNDERSTAND HOW WE ACTUALLY APPROACH THE HOMEOWNERS AT THE, FROM, FROM THE VERY BEGINNING.
BECAUSE I DO WORRY ABOUT HOW PEOPLE REACT TO THIS.
UM, YOU KNOW, I, YOU KNOW, I DON'T WANT THOSE GUYS.
EVERYBODY'S GONNA BE DRIVING IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD.
NO, WE'RE NOT GONNA, I MEAN, FOR EVERY PROJECT THAT WE GET IN, NO MATTER, YOU KNOW, WE HAVEN'T REALLY HAD ANY HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMENTS.
BUT FOR PROJECTS, BUT FOR THE DEVELOPMENT REVIEW AND FOR CONDITION, WE GET COMMENTS, YOU KNOW, HOW IS THIS GONNA IMPACT ME? WHAT IS THIS GONNA MEAN FOR MY VIEWS? WHAT IS THIS GONNA MEAN FOR TRAFFIC IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD? AND WE ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS AND WE JUST, YOU KNOW.
WELL, ANOTHER, ANOTHER ISSUE IS THE FACT, AND AGAIN, WHAT MAKES US UNCOMMON IN THE PROCEDURE PROCESS IS THAT WE ALSO HAVE THE STATE ENTITY TO DEAL WITH.
AND FOR EXAMPLE, FOR THE AK PROJECT THAT WE'LL TALK ABOUT IN A FEW MINUTES, UH, WE HAD TO CONSULT WITH THEM ABOUT OUR ABILITY EVEN TO LANDMARK A PORTION OF A PROPERTY.
AND SO THAT IS YET ANOTHER ELEMENT THAT MAKES US DIFFERENT.
IT'S, IT'S, WELL, AND, AND, AND
[01:15:01]
CERTAINLY I'M NOT TRYING TO, I I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND THAT WE NEED TO, UM, MAKE EVERYBODY AWARE OF WHAT'S GOING ON.THAT I HAVE NO DISCOMFORT WITH THAT AT ALL.
I JUST, I JUST WORRY ABOUT HOW, HOW WE PRESENT OURSELVES IN, IN, IN THIS ISSUE.
BUT, UM, OBVIOUSLY STEVE IS RIGHT.
WE PROBABLY HAVE NOTHING TO SAY HERE.
SO MAYBE WE SHOULD JUST SHUT UP WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU, I GUESS I WOULD SAY BY THE HOUR AND SPEED THEM UP.
I GUESS I WOULD SAY TO ME, NOT TO SAY THAT YOU CAN NEVER CHANGE THINGS, UM, BUT THESE ARE, THESE ARE SET IN STONE
I WOULDN'T, I MEAN, THERE'S ALWAYS A WAY TO CHANGE SOMETHING, BUT KEEPING IN IN MIND THAT IN MY EXPERIENCE, UM, WITH OTHER PROJECTS THAT HAVE GONE THROUGH THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION AND CITY COUNCIL PROCESSES, UM, CITY COUNCIL WOULD ULTIMATELY BE THE ONE THAT WOULD NEED TO APPROVE ANY CHANGES.
AND THEIR, UM, DIRECTION RECENTLY HAS BEEN FOR MORE PUBLIC OUTREACH AND MORE TRANSPARENCY AND THE KIND OF CHANGES THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
WE'RE KIND OF GOING THE, IN THE OTHER DIRECTION FROM THE DIRECTION THAT WE'VE GOTTEN FOR OTHER PROJECTS.
WELL, I, I, I GUESS, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S ONE OF THOSE LEGAL THINGS AND WE'LL SEE HOW MANY PEOPLE SHOW UP.
I KNOW THE ONLY TIME THAT WE REALLY HAD A BUNCH OF PEOPLE COME IN, UM, OBJECTING TO A, UH, LANDMARK WAS WITH THE, UM, CHAPEL OF THE HOLY CROSS.
AND WE HAD A WHOLE BUNCH OF PEOPLE THAT CAME IN SAID, NO, YOU'RE NOT DOING THIS.
IT'S GOTTA, WELL, THAT, THAT'S, IN MY EXPERIENCE, I DON'T KNOW WHAT SEDONAS EXPERIENCE IS.
AND IF, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THE, THE LEGAL DEPARTMENT WOULD BE OKAY WITH THAT.
SO AGAIN, ON THESE FUND CHARTS HERE, UM, THREE AND FIVE ARE WHERE THE PUBLIC IS NOTIFIED.
SO OBVIOUSLY FOR THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, YOU'RE ONLY NOTIFYING ON FIVE DURING, FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING.
THOSE ARE LEGAL NOTICES THEY HAVE TO REQUIRE AND THEY HAVE TO CONTAIN CERTAIN INFORMATION.
NUMBER THREE, THE CITIZEN REVIEW PROCESS.
THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT THEY HAVE TO RE HAVE TO HAVE, BUT IT'S A LITTLE LOOSER.
AND WE DO WORK, WORK WITH APPLICANTS ON THAT ONE TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE CONVEYING THE RIGHT INFORMATION FOR ANY PROJECT.
I THINK I, AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT DONNA WAS SAYING, AND I WAS ACTUALLY SAYING THAT TOO.
I THINK IF WE COULD DO SOMETHING THAT WOULD JUST SORT OF BUFFER A LITTLE BIT AND LET THEM KNOW THAT JUST BY LANDMARKING FOR EXAMPLE, IT'S NOT GONNA MEAN THAT EVERYBODY'S GONNA BE COMING TO THE HOME TO, TO SEE THAT IT, YOU KNOW, TO SEE THE HOME THAT'S LANDMARKED.
WELL, WHAT, AND MAYBE WE CAN, YEAH, OKAY.
IF THAT, IF WE CAN, YOU KNOW, IF, IF IT, BECAUSE WE ARE COMING UP AGAINST TWO RIGHT NOW THAT WE'RE GONNA BE DOING, MAYBE IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE WHEN, WHEN IT COMES TO THE POINT WHERE WE HAVE TO DO THREE, WHICH WILL BE FAIRLY SOON, I THINK MAYBE THERE'S SOMETHING WE COULD DISCUSS.
UM, ONE OF THE MEMBERS HERE COULD DISCUSS WITH WHOEVER'S SENDING THAT LETTER TO THE HOMEOWNER THAT, WELL, AND AGAIN, THAT LETTER TYPICALLY COMES FROM THE APPLICANT ON THE PROJECT DOESN'T NECESSARILY COME FROM CITY STAFF, BUT WE WILL WORK WITH THE APPLICANT TO MAKE SURE IT HAS THE CORRECT INFORMATION.
WE COULD, AND THEN IF THERE IS ANYTHING THAT THE COMMISSION IS GIVING OUT TO THE APPLICANTS AS PART OF WHY THEY SHOULD LANDMARK, WHATEVER YOU'VE USED TO CONVINCE THEM THAT THEY SHOULD GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS, IT COULD BE IN THERE, CAN BE IN THAT LETTER AS WELL.
AND IF YOU, IF YOU PROVIDE THEM WITH A BASIC TEMPLATE FOR THE, THEIR LETTER RIGHT.
AND THE LABELS, THEN IT SHOULDN'T BE THAT MUCH OF AN ONEROUS TASK FOR THEM TO, TO DO THAT.
ADD THE PERSONAL INFORMATION THEY WANT.
WELL MAYBE ONE WE CAN HAVE, MAYBE A COUPLE OF US WORK ON THAT.
I DIDN'T MEAN TO, I'M SORRY WE SLOWED YOU DOWN
SO THAT WAS, I WAS JUST GONNA GO THROUGH THE STEPS AND SEE WHAT KIND OF QUESTIONS YOU GUYS HAD.
SO WE WANTED THE FEEDBACK TOO.
WELL, AND, AND, AND THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING US TO HAVE THAT FEED FEEDBACK.
UM, BUT YEAH, SO AGAIN, WE JUST NEED TO MAKE SURE, YOU KNOW, THAT WE'RE CHECKING ALL THE BOXES SO THAT WE DON'T GET TO THE END AND SOMEONE SAYS, WELL, THEY SKIPPED STEPS TWO AND THREE AND SO THIS, YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T WANNA GET TO A POINT WHERE THERE'S A LEGAL CHALLENGE BECAUSE OF A PROCEDURAL ISSUE.
UH, BECAUSE, UH, I, I WAS JUST SPEAKING WITH KAREN STUPAK EARLIER TODAY WHO
[01:20:01]
WAS ONE OF THE FOUNDERS OF THIS, UM, COMMISSION BACK, BACK IN THE DAY AND SHE SAID, UM, SHE HAD NO IDEA WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THIS TODAY, BUT SHE GOES, I'M JUST SO GLAD THAT THERE'S PROCESSES AND PROCEDURES IN PLACE BECAUSE WE USED TO GET OUR HAND SLAPPED ALL THE TIME CUZ WE WOULD JUST GO OUT AND DO THINGS.SO, UM, YEAH, I DO APPLAUD THE, THE CITY FOR TRYING TO GET OUT AHEAD OF THAT.
WELL, YEAH, AND I THINK WE ALL APPRECIATE ACTUALLY THE, THE INSIGHT AND BEING ABLE TO THEN TALK TO YOU AND GET FEEDBACK FROM YOU TOO AS TO, YOU KNOW, WHY THINGS ARE THE WAY THEY ARE.
CUZ IT, YOU KNOW, JUST TO HAVE IT SITTING IN FRONT OF YOU DOESN'T ALWAYS MAKE EVERYTHING CLEAR.
SO, AND AGAIN, UM, YOU KNOW, HISTORIC PROJECTS ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN.
HOPEFULLY THERE'LL BE MORE OF THEM, BUT WE GO AT LEAST MYSELF AND CHRIS WHO'S OVER THERE LEARNING AND STUFF AS WELL.
WE GO THROUGH THESE PROCESSES FOR ALL OF THEM.
WE HAVE LOTS OF IDEAS AND THOUGHTS AND, UM, WAYS THAT IF IT, AGAIN, UNDERSTANDING THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S SEVEN STEPS AND THEY'RE BOTH, THEY'RE ALL DETAILED.
AGAIN, THE CODE IS SUPER EXCITING TO READ.
WE UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S, UM, WHAT YOU ALL READ IF YOU NEED TO GO TO SLEEP AT NIGHT.
UM, BUT WE KNOW IT AND WE KIND OF KNOW KIND OF WHAT DOES IT BOIL DOWN TO, WHAT DOES THIS ACTUALLY MEAN FOR THE DIFFERENT PROJECTS.
AND SO WE'RE HAPPY TO, TO WORK WITH ANY PROJECT AND, UM, TAILOR THE, THE, EACH KIND OF STEP OF THE PROCESS, MAKING SURE THAT WE'RE MEETING ALL OF THOSE REQUIREMENTS, BUT DOING IT IN A WAY THAT'S APPROPRIATE FOR THE SIZE AND SCALE OF EACH PROJECT.
THAT'S WHERE THE FIRST STEP IS SO IMPORTANT TOO, THAT PRE-APPLICATION MEETING THAT, THAT THE PRE-APPLICATION.
AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS SAYING, MAYBE PERHAPS WHAT WE NEED TO DO IN THAT PRE-APPLICATION.
MAYBE WE SHOULD COME UP WITH SOMETHING THAT SPEAKS TO WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.
AND, YOU KNOW, I ACTUALLY HAND THIS OUT, BELIEVE IT OR NOT.
I HAND THIS OUT TO, I'VE SENT HANDED THIS, THIS, THIS WHOLE THING OUT.
SO WE CAN HELP AS FAR AS, YOU KNOW, BOILING IT DOWN TO SOMETHING THAT MAKES A LITTLE MORE SENSE TO THE COMMON PERSON AND SOMEONE WHO'S NOT DEALING WITH THIS EVERY DAY.
UM, AGAIN, MAKING SURE THAT WE'RE NOT PUTTING OURSELVES IN A LEGAL, UM, BIND BY SKIPPING SOMETHING BUT NOT GOING OVERKILL AND SAYING, WELL NOW YOU HAVE TO SPEND THE NEXT SIX MONTHS GOING DOOR TO DOOR AND LIKE, YOU KNOW, ASKING EVERYBODY
YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S OH, OH THAT PROPERTY OWNER LIVES IN NEW YORK, YOU NEED TO GO TO NEW YORK AND NOT LIKE, DON'T, LIKE, THERE'S, THERE'S THINGS, WAYS THAT WE CAN SCALE IT AS APPROPRIATE BASED ON THE PROJECT, BUT WE JUST NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT EACH OF THESE BOXES ARE GETTING CHECKED.
THANK, WOULD YOU VERY MUCH, WOULD IT BE HELPFUL IF CARRIE'S PRESENTATION WAS EMAILED TO YOU FOR FUTURE REFERENCE? UM, YEAH.
YOU, IF YOU DO THAT, IT'S, IT'S PROBABLY GOOD.
I'D LIKE TO HAVE IT IN MY RECORDS.
THAT WOULD BE NICE IF YOU CAN, CAN YOU DO THAT? YEAH.
I MEAN, I DON'T THINK IT'S THAT EXCITING, BUT YEAH, THE LOOK ON YOUR FACE,
BUT YEAH, FOR ANY PROJECT, LIKE I SAID, WE'RE, WE'RE HAPPY TO KIND OF WHAT DOES, WHAT DOES EACH ONE OF THESE STEPS MEAN IN THE CONTEXT OF AN INDIVIDUAL PROJECT.
AT LEAST KUDOS TO WHOEVER PUT THIS ONLINE BECAUSE THE LINK REALLY IS FAIRLY EASY TO USE.
AND SO, UH, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN, WE CAN PRETTY MUCH LOOK AT IT THERE TOO.
SO YOU THINK ABOUT OUR COLOR CHOICES.
WELL I THINK WE NEED TO GET ON WITH OUR NEXT, UM, UH, UM, ITEM ON THE AGENDA, WHICH IS DISCUSSION, DISCUSSION, REGULATING NEXT STEPS FOR TWO POTENTIAL LANDMARK APPLICATIONS.
SO, UM, I I'M GONNA, I'M GONNA TURN THIS OVER TO, TO JACK AND WHERE HE IS WITH THE, TO LOCKE CHAPEL AND TO CHAPEL AND, AND AND TOWER AND ALSO, UH, ALSO BOB CUZ BOTH OF YOU GUYS HAVE BEEN WORKING.
BOB DID THIS INCREDIBLE, I DON'T KNOW, HAS HE HANDED THIS? DID YOU GET ONE OF THESE? UM, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO GIVE ONE TO DONNA.
UM, WHAT, WHAT, AND, AND WHY DON'T YOU JUST START OUT WITH HOW YOU, WHAT, WHAT YOU PUT IN TO, TO CREATING THIS BOB.
UM, IF YOU WANT TO REAL QUICKLY DO THAT WOULD BE GOOD.
WELL, IT WAS JUST A REGULAR PROCESS OF TRYING TO DIG UP INFORMATION.
THERE WAS NO SINGLE SPACE PLACE WHERE I COULD, YOU KNOW, JUST WRITE IT OUT.
AND SO IT WENT THROUGH AND I, YOU KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, GOING THROUGH, UH, ARTICLES IN LAS VEGAS REVIEW JOURNAL AND WOW.
BUT IT WAS JUST, YOU KNOW, REGULAR HISTORIC RESEARCH.
WELL IT'S ACTUALLY, IT'S, IT'S PRETTY AMAZING.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN SEND IT TO US.
I CAN SCAN THIS IF YOU NEED ME TO UNLESS YOU CAN SEND IT TO US DIGITALLY.
CAN CAN YOU DO THAT? I CAN SEND HER IF YOU, YEAH, WHY DON'T YOU SEND IT TO, I'LL SEND IT, SEND IT TO DONNA TOO CUZ
[01:25:01]
THEN SHE CAN HAVE IT FOR HER RECORDS.UM, YEAH, I'LL SEND TO DONNA TO SEND OUT CAUSE I CAN'T SEND OH YEAH, HE'LL SEND IT TO DONNA AND DON WILL SEND IT OUT TO US.
UM, SO DO YOU WANNA GO, GO TAKE IT FROM THERE A LITTLE BIT? UM, YES.
JEFF
AND WHAT WE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE IS THE CHAPEL AT LACAK THAT HAS THE BELL TOWER THAT VERY OFTEN YOU WILL SEE IN THEIR CORRESPONDENCE AND ADVERTISING.
AND, UM, AND ACTUALLY, UM, SOMETIMES SIMPLICITY IS, UH, IS A GIFT IN AND OF ITSELF.
THE CHAPEL IS, IT, IT DEFINITELY MIMICS SOMETHING THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE SEEN A HUNDRED YEARS AGO.
UM, IT'S, UH, A SIMPLE NA AND UH, WHAT I MEAN BY THAT IS A WORSHIP PLACE THAT'S COVERED AND, UM, IT'S BASICALLY CONCRETE BLOCK THAT HAS BEEN GIVEN A WASH, STUCCO, UH, FINISH THE ROOF IS, UH, FAIRLY, UH, LOW GABLE, MAYBE 4, 4 12 PITCH.
AND, UM, AND SO IT'S VERY ATTRACTIVE IN, IN THE SENSE THAT IT REFLECTS SPANISH COLONIAL AND MEXICAN, UH, ARCHITECTURE AS WELL AS THE CULTURE.
UH, ONE OF THE THINGS WE TALK ABOUT, THE IMPORTANCE SOMETIMES OF THE INTERIORS.
UH, THIS HAS AN INCREDIBLE MURAL IN IT THAT WAS PAINTED BY EILEEN KHAN.
UH, BOB AND I WERE TALKING ABOUT THIS A LITTLE THIS MORNING OR EARLIER IN THIS, UH, IN THIS MEETING, UH, ABOUT THE FACT THAT IT TOOK HER EIGHT OR NINE MONTHS TO PAINT IT.
UH, IT'S IT'S JUST A WONDERFULLY SERENE, TRANQUIL FEELING WHEN YOU WALK IN.
AND, UH, AND SO IT DEFINITELY HAS A SENSE OF PLACE ABOUT IT.
UM, CHAIRMAN UNGER ASKED ME TO, UH, TO GO AHEAD AND FILL IN, UH, THE APPLICATION FOR WENDY LIPMAN, WHO IS THE GENERAL MANAGER.
AND, AND BASICALLY, UH, SHE'S BECOME THE HISTORICAL CUSTODIAN OF, OF THIS PROPERTY ALONG WITH THE OTHER PROPERTIES INT SO, UM, I'M GONNA HAND THIS OVER TO YOU.
WE NEED TO GET WENDY'S SIGNATURE ON THAT.
MADAM CHAIRMAN, I HAVE TO GET BACK TO WORK.
IS THERE SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE VOTED ON THAT I DON'T THINK ANY OF THESE THINGS NEED TO BE VOTED ON TODAY.
I MEAN, WE'RE JUST BASED, BASED ON DISCUSSING THIS PROCEDURES.
CAUSE IT WASN'T NOT, IT WASN'T NOTIFIED.
DIDN'T WANNA, DIDN'T WANT TO NOT HAVE A QUORUM.
CAUSE I, I HAVE TO LEAVE AT FIVE 30.
AND WE'VE, WE'VE GOT A QUORUM HERE.
EVEN IF YOU DO LEAVE, I DON'T HAVE A, HOWEVER, HOWEVER, UM, UH, YOU, YOU AND I NEED TO GO, UH, STEVE, CALL ME.
I'LL CALL YOU AND WE'LL GO TO HER AND TALK TO HER ABOUT THIS.
UM, I, SO THIS WE WILL, WE WILL BRING TO HER, SHE'S, WE'VE ALREADY MET WITH HER, STEVE AND I MET WITH HER AND IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S GONNA BE A GOOD, A GOOD, A GOOD, SHE'S VERY EXCITED ABOUT DOING THIS.
UM, IN FACT, SHE WANTS TO DO SOMETHING, WHICH IS REALLY INTERESTING.
SHE WANTS TO DO A BIG GET TOGETHER THERE AT TO LOCK P UM, SPEAKING TO THIS.
AND, UH, SO SHE'S, SHE'S WILLING TO PAY FOR EVERYTHING FOR THE CITY.
IT'LL BE A HISTORIC PRESERVATION EVENT THAT SHE'S GONNA, WE'RE GONNA WORK, WE'RE GONNA WORK TOGETHER.
NATE AND I AND, AND SHE, AND WE'RE GONNA, SHE'S THERE.
SHE'S GONNA GONNA PUT SOMETHING ON FOR THE CITY WHEN, WHEN, WHEN WE, WHEN WE'VE, WHEN WE'VE GOTTEN TO THE POINT WHERE THIS IS, THIS CAN BE, UM, UH, SIGNALED TO BE READY TO GO.
SO, SO I GUESS THE QUESTION WOULD BE, IS SHE LOOKING TO DO THAT AFTER SHE, AFTER YOU VOTE ON A LANDMARK DESIGNATION OR BEFORE? BECAUSE IF IT WAS BEFORE THAT, SHE COULD USE AN INVITATION TO THAT AS HER CITIZEN OUTREACH.
AND ACTUALLY SHE, IT, SHE VERY WELL MIGHT WANNA DO IT BEFORE BECAUSE SHE, SHE'S THERE, IT'S THEIR 50TH ANNIVERSARY.
THIS IS, AND THAT'S WHAT'S INTERESTING IN ABOUT THIS TOO.
THIS IS LANDING ON THEIR 50TH ANNIVERSARY.
SO SHE'S THINKING THAT SHE REALLY WOULD WANT TO DO SOMETHING AND IT WOULD PROBABLY BE BEFORE.
SO, SO THEN FOR THAT, YOU KNOW, WE CAN PROVIDE, YOU KNOW, SHE CAN INVITE OBVIOUSLY WHOEVER SHE WANTS, BUT SHE COULD USE THAT AS HER PUBLIC OUTREACH, MAKE SURE SHE NOTIFIES, YOU KNOW, LOOKING UP.
THERE'S NOT, THAT'S GOOD IDEA.
PROPERTIES WITHIN 300 FEET SAY, HEY, COME SEE THE CHAPEL.
[01:30:01]
LANDMARKING THIS, WE'D LOVE FOR YOU TO COME OUT AND TAKE A LOOK AT IT.YOU KNOW, SO THAT CAN BE COMBINED INTO SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
AND AS LONG AS AGAIN, WE'RE GETTING THE RIGHT PEOPLE ON THE NOTIFICATION LIST AND WE GET MAYBE A COUPLE, COUPLE CHANGES TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PEOPLE GETTING THAT INVITATION UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'S A POTENTIAL LANDMARK HAPPENING AS WELL THAT COULD COUNT FOR THE CITIZEN OUTREACH.
I I WILL, WILL MENTION THAT TO HER WHEN, WHEN I GO SEE HER.
AND, AND AS YOU CAN SEE, UM, AND, AND WE MAKE SURE THAT DONNA GETS YOU GUYS THIS TOO, BECAUSE THIS IS AMAZING.
UM, THIS SPEAKS TO MORE THAN JUST THE, THE SHORT TERM HISTORY OF THE LAST 50 YEARS.
SO, UM, YOU REALLY NEED TO, TO SEE THIS.
THIS IS, THAT'S THAT'S FANTASTIC.
UM, SO, UH, IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU NEEDED TO DISCUSS WITH THAT? ARE WE PRETTY MUCH ON THAT? NOT UNTIL, NO.
CAN I JUST, UH, SO I'M NOT TRYING TO TO TO, I WANNA BE CLEAR, I'M NOT TRYING TO PUT THE BRAKES ON BLOCK P OR ANYTHING, BUT JUST AS A POINT OF DISCUSSION, UM, ARE WE CONCERNED AT ALL WITH THE FACT THAT IT'S NOT, I MEAN IT'S A, IT'S THE WORD JACK USED MIMIC A MINUTE AGO IS MIMIC IT, IT MIMICS SOMETHING.
UM, ARE WE CONCERNED AT ALL ABOUT THAT? BECAUSE IT'S NOT, DOES THAT SPEAK TO A LEVEL OF INAUTHENTICITY? AND I DON'T HAVE A I DON'T HAVE A THOUGHT IN MY HEAD ON THAT.
MY ANSWER WOULD BE NO, EMPHATICALLY NO.
UH, BECAUSE THE INSPIRATION WAS, IS WAS FROM, TO THE VILLAGE OF TOPA IN MEXICO.
SO THIS HAS BEEN ADAPTED TO SEDONA MM-HMM.
SO, UH, I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY QUESTION.
I JUST WANTED TO BE CLEAR ON THAT.
I MEAN, NO, JUST FROM THE, UH, SHEER, UH, THE STORY OF, OF TAKAKI, UH, JUST FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE, I'M, I'M SOLD ON IT.
I JUST THOUGHT I SHOULD THROW THAT OUT THERE.
WELL, AND, AND IT, AND IT'S, IT'S CERTAINLY SOMETHING WORTH LOOKING AT WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT ANYTHING, WHETHER OR NOT IT'S JUST A, A MOCK OF SOMETHING ELSE.
AND I, I DON'T THINK AT THIS STAGE IT'S NO ANY LONGER A, A MOCK OF SOMETHING ELSE.
I THINK IT IS, IT'S GROWN OWN, IT HAS GROWN IT DOWN INTO ITSELF.
I THINK AT THIS POINT I CAN, AT LEAST THAT WOULD BE MY OPINION OF IT.
BUT I, I APPRECIATE YOUR, YOUR INPUT.
DO YOU WANNA GO AHEAD, UM, JACK AND TO UH, DO NUMBER, UH, 56 LENGTHS DRIVE, UH, ANYTHING YOU HAVE TO ADD? UM, ADD TO WHAT, WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THAT? UH, WELL AT THIS POINT I WAS HOPING CYNTHIA WOULD BE HERE,
SO, UM, UM, AT ANY RATE, I HAVE NOT HEARD ANYTHING, UH, IN TERMS OF THE PROGRESS OF THIS.
I, I KNOW THE LADIES WHO ARE INVOLVED IN THE OWNERSHIP ARE, ARE ANXIOUS TO GET THE, UM, UM, THIS THING TO MOVE ALONG BECAUSE THEY'RE SO EXCITED ABOUT THEIR PROPERTY AND, UH, AND THEY WENT TO A LOT OF, OF WORK, UH, AND INQUIRY TO, TO ANSWER A LOT OF THE QUESTIONS THAT ARE INVOLVED WITH IT.
IT'S AN EXTREMELY UNIQUE PROPERTY.
I HAVE NEVER BEEN IN A PROPERTY THAT UNIQUE THAT'S RESIDENTIAL.
UM, AND, UH, AND IT, IT, UM, IT SPEAKS TO, UH, A, A LITTLE INTERESTING, UH, ARCHITECTURE THAT INVOLVES EARLY USE OF PASSAGE, SOLAR, UH, UH, IN ADDITION TO, UM, UM, INCORPORATING THE NATIVE AMERICANS IN THE AREA AND THEIR CULTURE WHILE ALSO, UH, HAVING A, A LARGE GLASS WINDOW THAT LOOKS DIRECTLY AT THE CHAPEL OF THE HOLY CROSS.
AND THE, THE BUILDER AND ARCHITECT IN THE CHAP CHAP IN THE, UH, CHAPEL OF THE HOLY CROSS WAS INVOLVED IN BUILDING AND DESIGNING AND BUILDING THIS PROPERTY.
SO IT IT HAS A LOT OF HISTORY.
WAS HE HIS HISTORICAL SIGNIFICANCE? YEAH.
WELL, AND LET ME ASK YOU THIS BECAUSE YOU KNOW, WE'RE, WE'RE LOOKING AT THE STEPS THAT WE ARE TO GO THROUGH HERE AND SINCE THAT HAS BEEN HANDED OFF, HOW DO WE, HOW DO WE CHECK AND KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING IN TERMS OF THE CITIZEN REVIEW PRO PROCESS? CUZ THAT WOULD BE WHERE IT SHOULD BE NOW.
SO DO WE KEEP IN TOUCH WITH CYNTHIA ON THAT OR HOW DOES THAT WORK? I'LL BE THE ONE TALKING TO CYNTHIA ABOUT THAT.
WE WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO WORK BACKWARDS WITH THE APPLICANT, UH, FOR THAT CITIZEN OUTREACH AND, AND DISCUSS
[01:35:01]
HOW BEST TO DO THAT.BECAUSE YOU'RE, WE'RE AT THAT POINT NOW AND, AND THEN, AND THEN, THEN YOU GUYS HAVE TO REVIEW IT.
SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE AT YOU AND I I THINK IT'S JUST THAT I THINK WE WANNA STAY ON TOP OF IT TOO.
WE WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S MAKING THAT THE PROGRESS THAT IT NEEDS TO MAKE.
CUZ I, I KNOW WE GET CALLS FROM THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE ASKED US TO DO THIS
SO ONE OF THE THINGS THAT'S INTERESTING IS THAT BEFORE THEY WERE, BEFORE THEY APPROACHED THE CITY ABOUT LANDMARKING THIS PROPERTY IS THEY ACTUALLY WENT DOOR TO DOOR TO IN THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD TO SEE IF, YOU KNOW, HEY, IF WE LANDMARK OUR PROPERTY, DO YOU THINK THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT WOULD BE OKAY WITH YOU? OR YOU KNOW, AND SOME PEOPLE MENTIONED SOMETHING ABOUT PARKING AND ALL THAT AND THEY SAID, OH NO, NO, NO, NO, THIS PEOPLE AREN'T GONNA BE STOPPING AND WALKING TO OUR FRONT DOOR AND WANTING A TOUR.
YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY WERE VERY, UH, EXPLICIT ABOUT WHAT TO EXPECT AND, AND I, AND THEY TOOK IT UPON THEMSELVES THAT'S RIGHT.
SO, UH, I HOPE YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO MEET THEM.
THEY'RE INCREDIBLE
SO IT KIND OF PUT A HOLD ON THINGS BECAUSE OF THE PUBLIC OUTREACH REQUIREMENTS, ET CETERA, AND TO FIGURE OUT WHERE WE ACTUALLY WERE IN THE PROCESS AND WHERE WE NEED WOULD NEED TO BACK UP, ET CETERA.
WELL, HOPEFULLY SOME ANECDOTAL INFORMATION FROM THEM WILL HELP THE PROCESS ALONG.
THEY THEY CAN ADD THAT TO THEIR OUTREACH, BUT I, AND SO WE NEVER WANT TO TELL PEOPLE THEY CAN'T DO IT, BUT THAT'S ANOTHER REASON WHY IF WE MAKE SURE PEOPLE KNOW ABOUT THESE PROCESSES EARLY ON MM-HMM.
THEY CAN BE DOCUMENTING IT AS THEY DO IT.
WELL, WELL THAT, WELL THAT'S, THAT'S GREAT.
SO I THINK WE'RE REALLY, UM, WE'RE REALLY, UM, MOVING AHEAD WITH THESE TWO THINGS.
UM, I I DON'T THINK THAT I HAVE ANYTHING ELSE TO ADD EXCEPT THAT I'M, THE ONE THING I'M HAVING DIFFICULTY WITH IS MAKING SURE THAT WE DON'T CONTACT ONE ANOTHER
I MEAN, WHAT, WHAT IS SORT OF ODD, AND I, I WAS PROBABLY TALKING OUT OF TURN HERE AND I'M GONNA GET JUMPED ON BY DONNA FOR SURE, BUT, UM, BECAUSE THERE ARE ONLY FIVE OF US ANYMORE, ONLY TWO OF US CAN TALK
AND I WROTE A LETTER TO THE CITY ATTORNEY.
I HAVE NOT GOTTEN AN AN ANSWER BACK SAYING, HOW CAN WE, HOW CAN WE ACTUALLY DO SOMETHING WHERE IF SOMETHING HAS TO HAPPEN, I CAN, CAN I GET IN TOUCH WITH DONNA? CAN SHE GET IN TOUCH WITH SOMEBODY ELSE SO THAT WE, WE KNOW WHERE WE ARE AND I HAVEN'T, I HAVEN'T GOTTEN AN ANSWER BACK FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY.
SO I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE YOU GUYS CAN GIVE ME SOME INPUT, BUT I DON'T KNOW.
SO YOU CAN USE ME AS A STAFF LIAISON.
AND UH, ONE THING WE DO HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT IS THAT CHAIN OF COMMUNICATION.
EVEN THOUGH YOU MAY NOT ALL BE IN THE SAME ROOM OR ON THE SAME PHONE CALL.
IF YOU'RE CALLING NATE AND NATE'S CALLING JACK AND YOU KNOW, THEN YOU'RE ALSO VIOLATING THAT.
AND THAT'S WHAT I'M WORRIED ABOUT.
SO I BASICALLY WHAT, INSTEAD OF GETTING IN TOUCH WITH DONNA, I SHOULD PROBABLY GET IN TOUCH WITH YOU IF THERE'S SOMETHING.
CUZ I, YOU KNOW, THE THING IS WE'RE ALL, WE'RE ALL WORKING.
THIS IS, THIS IS ONE OF THE, WE HAVE, WE'VE BEEN SORT OF, SORT OF DORMANT IN A WHILE AND WORKING AS MUCH AS WE ARE NOW MM-HMM.
AND SO ONLY HAVING FIVE OF US WHEN THERE ARE SEVEN OF US, YOU KNOW, I COULD ACTUALLY WORK A LITTLE BIT WITH THREE, BUT WHEN THEY'RE ONLY TWO, I CAN ONLY CONTACT ONE OTHER PERSON.
IT STARTS MAKING IT MUCH MORE AWKWARD.
AND I'M SORRY, I'M OFF TOPIC
SO I THINK AT THAT POINT, UM, THE FUTURE MEETINGS WE HAVE, THE NEXT ONE WOULD BE MONDAY, AUGUST 14TH.
IS THERE ANYBODY THAT HA THAT, UH, DID, DO WE WANNA SEND OUT A, AN EMAIL OR DO YOU GUYS KNOW WHETHER OR NOT YOU'RE GONNA BE AVAILABLE? IS THIS SOMETHING THAT, AND, AND DO WE ALREADY HAVE? UM, BECAUSE I'M THINKING IF WE HAVE, IF WE HAVE THIS, UM, IF WE HAVE THIS APPLICATION READY, WE CAN BRING IT IN.
WE DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO HAVE A MEETING FOR IT, BUT, UM, WE COULD, WE, YOU KNOW, IF WE WANNA SEE WHERE THE PROGRESS IS WITH THINGS, IT, IT, IT, ANY, ANY SUGGESTIONS DONNA, IN TERMS I DIDN'T RECEIVE ANY NOTIFICATION OF SOMEONE THAT WOULD NOT BE AVAILABLE FOR AUGUST.
WHAT YOU MIGHT WANT TO CONSIDER IS YOUR, UM, CONFERENCE IS OCTOBER.
SO, AND HOW MUCH TIME IT WOULD TAKE TO REACT TO GETTING ANY PROGRESS ON THESE LANDMARKS? UM, I DON'T KNOW IF AUGUST IS TIMELY, IF YOU NEED THREE WEEKS LEAD TIME
[01:40:01]
AND YOU LOOK AT A MEETING EVERY MONTH.SO WE LIKELY WOULDN'T HAVE BE ABLE TO DO THE PUBLIC NOTICING BEFORE THE AUGUST MEETING, BUT UM RIGHT.
JUST KNOWING THAT THE PUBLIC OUTREACH STEP HASN'T TAKEN, HASN'T OCCURRED YET.
OR EVEN THE INFORMAL CAUSE THE INFORMAL, YEAH.
THE, THE ONLY THING IS WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO LANDMARK THAT THAT ONE BEFORE WE LANDMARK THE TOPA.
THE TOPA WE'RE SORT OF EARLIER IN THE STAGES OF IT RIGHT NOW.
SO MAYBE I'M JUST SAYING THAT THE NOTICE FOR A PUBLIC HEARING TO ACTUALLY HAVE THE VOTE AS, AS A LANDMARK WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO HAPPEN FOR AUGUST.
SO THAT, THAT WOULD BE, WE'D HAVE TO PUT THAT OFF UNTIL SEPTEMBER.
UM, WELL WHAT, WHAT IS ANYBODY ON THE COMMISSION'S THOUGHTS IN TERMS OF HAVING A, A MEETING WAITING UNTIL AUGUST, UH, SEPTEMBER TO HAVE OUR NEXT MEETING? WHAT DO YOU THINK? WELL YOU HAD MENTIONED EARLIER THAT YOU WANTED SOMETHING ABOUT THE RANGER STATION.
UM, WELL IF WE COULD, IF WE DID ASK FOR IF, IF WE COULD, IF WE COULD HAVE THAT MEETING.
I MEAN I, WHENEVER I'VE ASKED FOR THIS BEFORE, IT'S BEEN ABOUT THREE OR FOUR MONTHS OUT
BUT FOR COUNCIL MAYBE HARD YEAH.
BUT, BUT WE DID ASK IF, IF, UM, STAFF FROM FROM PUBLIC WORKS AND FROM PARKS COULD ATTEND OUR NEXT REGULAR MEETING AND THAT WOULD BE AUGUST.
UM, SO I, I WOULD SUGGEST THAT WE WOULD WANNA NOT DOUBLE UP AND NOT MOVE THAT TO SEPTEMBER.
I WOULD SUGGEST JUST GO AHEAD, WANNA HAVE OUR AUGUST MEETING AND HAVE THE AUGUST MEETING AND THEN, AND THEN WHATEVER, WHATEVER TIMING WE CAN FIND WITH THE CITY COUNCIL.
GENERALLY WHEN WE'VE DONE MEETINGS, HAVING DONE THIS FOR SO LONG, THE MEETINGS WITH THE CITY COUNCIL USUALLY IS THE, A GOOD TIMING IS USUALLY NOVEMBER, BUT I DON'T KNOW YOU, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO ASK THEM BECAUSE EVERYTHING IS DIFFERENT NOW THAN IT'S BEEN, YOU KNOW, WHEN IT, WHEN WE USED TO DO THIS, WE USED TO ACTUALLY HAVE A MEETING WITH THE CITY COUNCIL EVERY YEAR, UM, AND WE'RE, YOU KNOW, THAT'S NOT HAPPENING ANYMORE.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, MAYBE, MAYBE THAT'S THE TIMING.
BUT IF WE, IF WE DO THE, THIS ONE, YOU KNOW, JUST A FOR SHORTENED ONE WITH THE, WITH THAT, THAT PROBABLY IS A GOOD IDEA IF WE DO IT IN, IN IN AUGUST AND THE TIMING WOULD BE GOOD AS FAR AS, UM, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY AS A, AS A WARNING, I GUESS, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S THE RIGHT WORD, BUT WHEN, UM, THERE'S BEEN A COUPLE THINGS, I DON'T KNOW SPECIFICALLY WHERE PLANNING AND ZONING EXHIBITION HAS BEEN INTERESTED IN A JOINT MEETING AND THE CONCERN ON THE PART OF CITY COUNCIL IS THAT THEY ARE SEPARATE DECISION MAKING BODIES AND THEY KIND OF WANTED IN THOSE WERE REGARDING SPECIFIC PROJECTS.
CITY COUNCIL REALLY WANTED TO KEEP IN INDEPENDENT DECISION MAKING ABILITIES.
AND SO THERE, THE CITY COUNCIL HAS SAID NO WHEN PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION HAS REQUESTED THAT I, I FORGET EXACTLY WHEN THE LAST TIME WAS THAT WE DID ONE WITH P AND Z BUT STEVE WOULD BE, IT DOESN'T HURT TO ASK.
CAUSE THAT, AND WE'VE NEVER HAD A MEETING WITH P N Z EVER THAT I REMEMBER.
SO, YOU KNOW, AND MAYBE THAT'S WHY CUZ THEY LIKE TO KEEP THEM SEPARATE.
UM, BUT UM, IF YOU, IF THAT MIGHT BE, WELL I'LL CERTAINLY MAKE THE INQUIRY.
WHY DON'T YOU MAKE THE INQUIRY AND THEN LET US KNOW IF THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN DO.
THERE ARE SOME, WHEN, WHEN DO WE HAVE, WHEN DO WE HAVE, UH, TO GET OUR BUDGET INTO THE NEXT FISCAL YEAR? OH, THAT'S, THAT'S PROBABLY IN JANUARY.
SO WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO START LOOK WORKING AT THAT.
YEAH, WE START USUALLY IN OCTOBER.
IF THAT WE START WORKING ON THAT IN YEAH.
CAUSE WE GET, I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THAT TOO, BUT THERE IS SOME STATUTORY REQUIREMENT ABOUT KEEPING THE DECISION MAKING BODIES SEPARATE SO THAT, SO FOR EXAMPLE, YOUR LANDMARKING WHERE YOU ARE A DECISION MAKING BODY COUNSEL WOULD NOT WANT TO GET INTO PREEMPTING YOUR INDEPENDENCE IN MAKING THAT DECISION THROUGH A JOINT MEETING OR COMING TO YOUR MEETING AND TELLING YOU WHAT YOU SHOULD DECIDE.
I I BELIEVE WHAT YOU'RE DOING IS, IS YOU'RE OVERRIDING THE APPEALS PROCESS, CORRECT? YEAH.
SO IS THAT, IS THAT SOMETHING WE SHOULD BE DOING? DID YOU THINK? IS THAT WE SHOULD WE, WE SHOULD BE DOING, I THINK SHE'S SUGGESTING THAT'S A REASON THAT WOULDN'T HAPPEN.
YEAH, BUT I, BUT IS THIS THE REASON WE SHOULDN'T DO IT AT ALL?
IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT RECOMMENDING RESPONSIBILITIES, THAT'S ONE THING, BUT YOU WOULDN'T GO TO THEM TO DISCUSS YOUR LANDMARKING DECISION MAKING.
WELL NOW IN, IN THIS INSTANCE WHAT WE'RE TALKING, WE WE'RE PROBABLY GONNA BE TALKING WITH THEM ABOUT IS WELL, YEAH.
UM, THE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE PARK AND WHETHER OR NOT, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THAT.
SO WHETHER THAT IS ACTUALLY GOING TO REFLECT HOW WE'RE GOING TO THEN REACT, I'M NOT SURE.
UM, I THINK AS LONG AS YOU'RE NOT TRYING TO COME TO THE DECISION OR GET INTO
[01:45:01]
HOW YOU WOULD DECIDE THINGS, IF YOU'RE DOING IT FOR FACT FINDING AND SHARING OF CONCEPTS, THAT'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT.I THINK WHAT I WOULD ASK IS FOR MADAM CHAIR, IF YOU COULD SEND AN EMAIL WITH THE ACTUAL REASONINGS AND QUESTIONS THAT YOU MIGHT WANT TO POSE OKAY.
I CAN RUN THAT PAST LEGAL, MAKE SURE THAT THERE'S NO CONFLICT THERE, THERE'S NO CONFLICT BETWEEN THEM AND IT'S JUST BASICALLY OKAY.
AND, UM, WHAT I MAY HAVE TO DO, STEVE, IS I MAY HAVE TO, I MAYBE I'LL HAVE, UH, UM, YOU KNOW, I KNOW STEVE HAD SOME COMMENTS.
I KNOW BOB, YOU HAD SOME COMMENTS ON WHAT YOU THINK, UM, WE WANT TO DO.
MAYBE IF YOU COULD ACTUALLY FEED THAT IN TOO, BECAUSE, UM, THAT WAY WE, WE ALL HAVE, AND BECAUSE I CAN'T CONTACT YOU, YOU GUYS, UM, BOTH, UM, ALL OF US, UM, ANY OF YOU, US THAT HAVE SOMETHING, WHY DON'T WE, WE ACTUALLY PUT IT ON PAPER AND SEND IT TO STEVE MM-HMM.
DOES THAT MAKE WORK FOR YOU GUYS? AND I'LL LET STEVE KNOW THE OTHER STEVE KNOW
WELL I THINK UNLESS THERE, WE DON'T NEED AN EXECUTIVE SESSION.
SO I THINK WE CAN, WE CAN, UH, IF IF THERE'S NO, UM, NO OBJECTION, UH, WE CAN UH, UH, VOTE TO ADJOURN THIS MEETING AT WHAT QUARTER TO SIX? UH, 5 45.