* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.
           
          [00:00:02]
I CAN SEE. 
          WOW. 
          [1. CALL TO ORDER/PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE/MOMENT OF SILENCE]
LOOK AT THAT. 
          OKAY. 
          GOOD AFTERNOON EVERYONE. 
          WELCOME TO OUR COUNCIL MEETING. 
          UM, WE'LL NOW CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER. 
          PLEASE JOIN ME FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. 
          I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WITHSTAND ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVIDUAL WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE. 
          AND JOIN ME FOR A MOMENT OF SILENCE. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          [2. ROLL CALL]
MADAM CLERK, CAN YOU PLEASE READ THE ROLE? MAYOR JALO. 
          PRESENT VICE MAYOR PLU. 
          HERE. 
          COUNCILOR DUNN. 
          PRESENT. 
          COUNSELOR FOLTZ. 
          HERE. 
          COUNCILOR FURMAN? HERE. 
          COUNCILLOR KINSELLA. 
          PRESENT. 
          COUNCILLOR WILLIAMSON. 
          HERE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          ITEM 
          [3. CONSENT ITEMS]
THREE, CONSENT ITEMS. THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY WHERE THE STAFF, THE PUBLIC OR THE COUNCIL WOULD'VE AN OPPORTUNITY TO PULL THE ITEM LISTED FROM EIGHT TO G. 
          DO WE HAVE ANY, ANY ISSUES? ANY QUESTIONS? OKAY. 
          CAN I HAVE A MOTION PLEASE? I MOVE TO APPROVE CONSENT ITEMS THREE A THROUGH G. 
          OKAY, SECOND. 
          SECOND. 
          SECONDED BY COUNCILLOR FULTZ. 
          ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. 
          AYE. 
          AYE. 
          ANY OPPOSED? WE UNANIMOUS? OKAY. 
          ITEM FOUR IS APPOINTMENTS. 
          WE HAVE NONE. 
          [5. SUMMARY OF CURRENT EVENTS BY MAYOR/COUNCILORS/CITY MANAGER]
SUMMARY OF CURRENT EVENTS BY THE MAYOR, COUNSELOR, AND OR CITY MANAGER, VICE MAYOR. 
          I'D JUST LIKE TO SAY THAT I DON'T HAVE MY NORMAL PARKS AND REC REPORT BECAUSE WE'RE IN TRANSITION AND WE'RE MOVING FROM SUMMER TO FALL. 
          AND SO STAY TUNED FOR NEXT COUNCIL MEETING. 
          WE'LL HAVE AN UPDATED REPORT. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          ANY OTHER COUNSELORS? KAREN? ANYTHING? NOTHING. 
          OKAY. 
          [6. PUBLIC FORUM]
OKAY. 
          WE'RE GOING TO WRITE, UH, INTO PUBLIC FORUM. 
          I HAVE ONE CARD, TOM GILMAN. 
          YOU DON'T HAVE TO START WITH YOUR NAME. 
          CITY OF RESIDENT. 
          AND YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES. 
          THANK YOU. 
          WELCOME, TOM. 
          MY NAME IS TOM GILMAN. 
          I'M A RESIDENT OF DEL. 
          I'VE BEEN HERE FOR 38 YEARS. 
          YES. 
          SPEAK UP A LITTLE BIT. 
          EIGHT. 
          EXCUSE ME. 
          YEAH, I'M 80 YEARS OLD. 
          I'VE BEEN HERE FOR 38 YEARS. 
          I OWN BUSINESSES AND I HAVE 15 TENANTS. 
          I LIVE IN UPTOWN SEDONA. 
          UM, AND I'M CONCERNED, YOU KNOW, I HEAR ABOUT NUMBERS AND CONSULTANTS, ALL THE CONSULTANTS. 
          I DON'T KNOW WHY, HOW MUCH WE SPEND ON CONSULTANTS, BUT THEY TALK ABOUT THE IMPACT OF TRAFFIC AND THIS AND THAT, BUT THEY NEVER TALK ABOUT THE IMPACT TO THE SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS. 
          THEY NEVER TALK ABOUT THE IMPACT TO THE ECONOMY. 
          YOU KNOW, THESE SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS, WHICH ARE NOT TAKEN VERY SERIOUSLY, THEY GENERATE THROUGH THEIR EFFORTS A HUGE AMOUNT OF SALES TAX IN UPTOWN. 
          IT'S SOME OF THE HIGHEST SALES TAX IN THE UNITED STATES. 
          AND THEY'RE THERE. 
          THEY'RE WORKING EVERY DAY. 
          THEY'RE STRUGGLING RIGHT NOW. 
          IF YOU DON'T HAVE A CLUE, AUGUST IS GONNA BE A PRETTY BAD MONTH. 
          AND WHEN WE LOSE MONEY, WE LOSE MONEY. 
          THE SALES TAX STILL GETS PAID RIGHT OFF THE TOP. 
          SO IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER. 
          IF SOMEONE CAN HARDLY MAKE PAYROLL, THEY'RE GONNA PAY THEIR SALES TAX FIRST. 
          SO I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO SEE THE CITY COUNCIL LOOK AT WHEN YOU'RE DOING YOUR IMPACT STUDIES THAT YOU'RE DOING IMPACT EFFECT IT HAS ON THE BUSINESSES AND THE EFFECT THAT IT'S GONNA HAVE ON THE FUTURE RESIDENTS AND BUSINESSES, BECAUSE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT $20 MILLION FOR A CULTURAL PARK THAT NO ONE KNEW ABOUT BEFORE THE DAY IT WAS VOTED. 
          I'VE BEEN TOLD THAT'S THE CASE, BUT THAT NO ONE KNEW ABOUT. 
          UM, AND IT'S RIDICULOUS. 
          YOU'RE GONNA STILL SPEND MILLIONS OF DOLLARS FOR INFRASTRUCTURE MILLIONS, BUT THAT WAS OKAY TO DO WITHOUT HAVING SOME KIND OF MASS MAILING OR WHATEVER, MILLIONS OF DOLLARS. 
          AND 
          [00:05:01]
I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT, YOU KNOW, THIS MEDIAN WHICH IS BEING DESIGNED SO THAT PEOPLE CAN'T CROSS FROM THE LEFT LANE TO THE RIGHT LANE. 
          WELL, I LIVE THERE AND THAT HAPPENS RARELY, RARELY. 
          I THINK THE POLLS THAT WERE PUT UP REDUCES THAT, AND QUITE CAN, IF YOU PUT UP A FEW MORE POLLS BEFORE YOU DID ANYTHING ELSE, YOU MIGHT FIND THAT IT REDUCES IT SIGNIFICANTLY. 
          BUT IT'S MUCH EASIER TO GO OUT AND SPEND SEVEN, EIGHT, $9 MILLION AND TAKE UP FOUR OR FIVE MONTHS TO PUT THE MEDIAN IN. 
          I MEAN, IT'S RIDICULOUS. 
          NO ONE'S THINKING ABOUT MONEY. 
          WELL, YOU'RE NOT GONNA PAY IT AND I'M NOT GONNA PAY IT, BUT SOMEONE'S GONNA HAVE TO PAY THESE BILLS DOWN THE ROAD AND IT'S GONNA BE MY CHILDREN. 
          I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OF YOU HAVE CHILDREN LIVING HERE, BUT IT'S GONNA BE MY CHILDREN AND OTHER PEOPLE'S CHILDREN. 
          10, 15 YEARS, THEY'LL BE STILL PAYING OFF THE CULTURAL PARK, WHICH NO ONE KNOWS WHAT THE PLAN FOR THE CULTURAL PARK IS, BUT YOU CAN SPEND $20 MILLION ON IT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU, TOM. 
          IF ANYONE ELSE WISHES TO, UH, SPEAK DURING THE PUBLIC FORUM, THAT'S FOR ITEMS THAT ARE NOT CURRENTLY ON THE AGENDA, JUST RAISE YOUR HAND. 
          IF NOT, WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC FORUM. 
          OKAY. 
          PUBLIC FORUM IS CLOSED. 
          UH, 
          [7.a. Recognition of K9 Dalon Artwork by Robert Albrecht.]
WE, WE HAD SOMETHING ON HERE FOR PROCLAMATIONS, RECOGNITIONS OF REWARDS THAT WAS PULLED FOR UNTIL THE NEXT MEETING. 
          [8.a. AB 2985 Public hearing/presentation/discussion regarding the City of Sedona Development Impact Fee Audit Report for Fiscal Years 2020-21 and 2021-22.]
SO WE'LL GO INTO THE, TO REGULAR BUSINESS ITEM EIGHT A A B 29 85, A PUBLIC HEARING PRESENTATION DISCUSSION REGARDING THE CITY OF SEDONAS DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEE AUDIT REPORT FOR FISCAL YEARS, UH, 2020 TO 2021, AND 2021 TO 2022. 
          SHERRY, GOOD EVENING, MAYOR AND COUNCIL. 
          GOOD EVENING. 
          UM, I BELIEVE YOU HAVE MET OUR ACCOUNTING MANAGER, RENEE STANLEY. 
          WE HAVE, AND SHE WAS THE LIAISON FOR THIS AUDIT WITH THE AUDIT FIRM. 
          AND SO SHE'S GOING TO COVER THE DISCUSSION. 
          GOOD EVENING, MAYOR AND COUNCIL. 
          TODAY I'M PRESENTING THE RESULTS OF OUR LATEST DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEE AUDIT. 
          AS SOME OF YOU MAY BE AWARE, STATE STATUTES REQUIRE THAT WE HAVE A DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEE AUDIT BI-ANNUALLY. 
          WE JUST CONCLUDED OUR AUDIT FOR FISCAL YEARS 2021 AND 2022. 
          WE USED THE C P A FIRM, HEIN FIELD, AND MEECH, WHICH IS THE SAME FIRM THAT WE USED FOR THE F Y 19 AND F Y 20 AUDITS. 
          WE HAVE TWO FINDINGS FROM THIS MOST RECENT AUDIT TO REPORT TO YOU. 
          THE FIRST FINDING WAS RELATED TO OUR F Y 22 DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEE REPORT. 
          IN THIS REPORT, WE CATEGORIZED THE FOREST ROAD CONNECTION PROJECT AS DIFF, UM, FUNDED. 
          HOWEVER, IT WAS LATER DETERMINED THAT THIS PROJECT WOULD BE BOND FUNDED. 
          THE RESULTED, THIS RESULTED IN A VARIANCE OF APPROXIMATELY $181,000 FROM THE DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEE REPORT. 
          THIS IS NOT UNCOMMON TO HAVE THE MOVEMENT OF EXPENDITURES BECAUSE THE CITY'S AUDITED FINANCIAL STATEMENTS ARE, UM, ISSUED DECEMBER 31ST, WHEREAS THE DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEE REPORT IS ISSUED, UM, SEPTEMBER 30TH. 
          SO NO CORRECTIVE ACTION IS NEEDED IN THIS CASE BECAUSE THE IMPACT FEE REPORT IS, IS DUE SEPTEMBER 30TH, AND THE FINAL AUDITED FINANCIAL STATEMENT IS NOT ISSUED UNTIL DECEMBER 31ST. 
          SO A VARIANCE BETWEEN THE TWO REPORTS CAN ALWAYS EXIST. 
          WE ALSO HAD A FINDING RELATED TO CHARGING OF DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEES. 
          OF THE 40 PERMITS THAT WERE REVIEWED, THERE WERE TWO THAT WE DIDN'T CHARGE DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEES ON THIS RESULTED IN UNDERCHARGE OF APPROXIMATELY $4,800. 
          CORRECTIVE MEASURES HAVE ALREADY BEEN PUT INTO PLACE BECAUSE THIS WAS A PRIOR AUDIT FINDING. 
          HOWEVER, THE TWO PERMITS IN QUESTION WERE ISSUED IN CALENDAR YEAR 2020, AND THAT WAS RIGHT BEFORE STEVE AND THE CON DEV TEAM IMPLEMENTED THE MEASURES. 
          UM, THE CORRECTIVE MEASURES IN 2021. 
          NOW, WHEN A PERMIT TECH, WHEN A PERMIT APPLICATION FOR A NEW SINGLE FAMILY HOME COMES THROUGH A SECONDARY PERMIT, TECHNICIAN REVIEWS THE WORK OF THE FIRST PERMIT TECH AND THE, SORRY. 
          I CAN HELP YOU WITH THAT. 
          SURE, GO AHEAD, . 
          THANK YOU. 
           TAG TEAM. 
          GOOD EVENING. 
          MR. MAYOR, VICE MAYOR AND COUNSELORS. 
          UM, YES, AFTER, UH, THE INITIAL REPORT, WE DID INSTITUTE SOME NEW PROCEDURES. 
          UH, DID WRITE UP A PROCEDURE FOR APPLYING THE DIFF FEES. 
          UM, AS A PART OF THAT PROCEDURE, WE DID THREE DIFFERENT THINGS. 
          [00:10:01]
UM, ONE, WE HAVE NINE SUBDIVISIONS OUT THERE, WHICH HAVE ACTUAL DIFF FEE CREDITS. 
          AND, UM, TRYING TO REMEMBER THOSE AND APPLY THOSE WAS A, A, A PROBLEM. 
          SO WE HAVE NOW, UM, PUT A A, SOME INFORMATION ON OUR G I S SYSTEM. 
          WE CAN LOOK UP A PROPERTY AND SEE WHETHER OR NOT THEY HAVE A CREDIT IN THAT REGARD. 
          UM, WE ALSO HAVE A NEW SPREADSHEET THAT WILL TRACK THOSE DFI CREDITS. 
          UM, AND WE CREATED, UM, THIS PROGRAM, WHICH WE CALL THE DISCOUNT DOUBLE CHECK, WHERE THE PERMIT TECH THAT, UH, DEVISES THE FEES, THEN BRINGS THAT OVER TO THE PERMIT, A SEPARATE PERMIT TECH WHO WILL THEN CHECK ALL THOSE FEES TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY ARE CORRECT. 
          UNFORTUNATELY, WITH OUR ANTIQUATED SYSTEM, ALL OF THIS HAS TO BE DONE BY HAND. 
          UH, WE HAVE TRIED FOR, UH, OVER A YEAR GOING BACK AND FORTH WITH IT AND WORKING WITH FINANCE AND WITHIN OUR DEPARTMENT, UH, TO SEE IF SPRINGBROOK CAN, UH, CALCULATE THESE FEES, UH, SO THAT THERE'S NO HUMAN ERROR. 
          THE PROBLEM WITH SPRINGBROOK IS THAT THEY'RE ONLY CAL, THEY CAN ONLY CALCULATE ONE EQUATION. 
          AND SO IT'S EITHER THE DIFF FEES OR IT'S THE PERMIT FEES. 
          SO THE DIFF FEES GET CALCULATED BY HAND. 
          SO YES, THERE IS SOME HUMAN ERROR INVOLVED. 
          SO WE HAVE CREATED THESE, UH, THE PROCEDURES AND THESE PROGRAMS TO TRY TO HELP, UH, ELIMINATE THOSE IN THE FUTURE. 
          UM, AND YES, UH, THOSE, UH, THOSE TWO PERMITS, UH, WERE PERMITS THAT HE PULLED FROM PRIOR TO THE LAST AUDIT. 
          SO, UM, UH, WE HAD NOT IMPLEMENTED THESE AT THAT TIME. 
          I HAVE A QUESTION. 
          I'M SORRY, MAYOR. 
          OH, YES, PLEASE, KAREN. 
          UNDER THE NEW SYSTEM THAT WILL, OUR NEW SYSTEM THAT WILL REPLACE SPRING BOOK OR SHERRY WILL RECTIFY THAT PROBLEM. 
          CORRECT. 
          IT WILL BE ABLE TO PERFORM THIS BECAUSE HE WAS TALKING ABOUT AN ADEQUATED SYSTEM. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO IT WILL BE SOLVED TECHNOLOGICALLY ONCE THE NEW SYSTEM'S IN PLACE. 
          I, I WOULD IMAGINE THAT THE MODERN E R P SYSTEMS WILL BE ABLE TO ACCOMMODATE THAT. 
          SO WE ACTUALLY JUST HAD OUR, UH, UM, DISTRIBUTION OF THE PROPOSALS WE RECEIVED FOR THE CONSULTANT, UM, THIS MORNING. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, SO WE DID RECEIVE, UM, SIX PROPOSALS THAT WILL BE REVIEWED AND, AND WE HAVE SLATED FOR THE END OF OCTOBER TO BRING THAT TO COUNCIL FOR, FOR APPROVING A CONSULTANT TO SHERRY. 
          IS THAT SOMETHING YOU CAN GET BACK TO US LATER WHEN YOU DO GET THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION? IF IT'S TWO MONTHS FROM NOW, WHEREVER IT IS, JUST, YEAH. 
          WELL, IT'LL BE A WHILE BEFORE WE GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS WITH THE CONSULTANT AND THE DEMOS WITH THE VARIOUS E R P SYSTEMS AND SELECT A SYSTEM. 
          BUT IT WILL BE ON THE LIST OF THINGS TO HAVE THAT WE WANT IN A NEW SYSTEM. 
          THANK YOU. 
          I'LL REPEAT, UH, STEVE, I, I'D LIKE, OR RENEE OR SHERRY , UH, I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHETHER THE, THE FIX OUR SECOND PERMIT TECHNICIAN, DID WE INCREASE THE TIME? DID WE INCREASE THE COST BY OUR SOLUTION METHOD? TIME-WISE, YOU'RE LOOKING AT MAYBE AN ADDITIONAL FIVE MINUTES, THREE TO FIVE MINUTES PER PERMIT, DEPENDING ON HOW INTENSE, UH, IT IS. 
          IT'S REALLY, THEY'RE NOT ONLY DOUBLE CHECKING THE FEES, BUT THE DIFF FEES, BUT THE PERMIT FEES AS WELL. 
          UM, IT'S, IT'S NOT A LONG PROCESS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          YOU'RE WELCOME. 
          ANYMORE, OH, VICE MAYOR. 
          SO I WAS JUST CURIOUS, YOU REVIEWED TWO OF 40 PERMITS. 
          SO IS 40 THE TOTAL, THEY REVIEWED 40 PERMITS IN TOTAL AND OUT OF TWO, YEAH, OUT OUT OF 40. 
          THEY HAD TO, BUT HOW MANY TOTAL PERMITS DID WE ISSUE DURING THAT TIME PERIOD? WE GENERALLY ISSUE AROUND 650 TO 700 PERMITS A YEAR. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          STEVE, RENEE, WHOEVER, OR YOU DONE THAT WAS IT. 
          THAT WAS THE END OF OUR PRESENTATION. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          SO WITH THAT BEING SAID, IS THERE ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? ALRIGHT, VERY GOOD. 
          THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING, MAYOR. 
          WE NEED TO OPEN IT. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          OKAY. 
          ARE THERE ANY CARDS FOR THIS? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          SO WE WILL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING AND WE'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. 
          THANK YOU, JOANNE. 
          OKAY. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          THANK YOU. 
          [00:15:01]
THANK YOU. 
          OKAY, SHERRY, I, YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          [8.b. AB 2953 Presentation/discussion regarding the June 2023 Sales and Bed Tax Report.]
ITEM EIGHT B PRESENTATION REGARDING THE JUNE 23RD JUNE, 2023 SALES AND BED TAX REPORT. 
          SHE'S, SHE, UM, RENEE'S GOING TO BAIL ON YOU NOW. 
          I'M JUST GONNA BE RIGHT HERE RECORDING . 
          OKAY. 
          SO, UM, I DO WANT TO CLARIFY. 
          THIS IS PRELIMINARY, UM, JUNE INFORMATION. 
          SO, UM, THIS IS STILL VERY EARLY IN OUR PROCESS OF ALL THE YEAR END ACCRUALS AND ADJUSTMENTS THAT WE NEED TO DO. 
          UM, I DO NOT IMAGINE THAT THE YEAREND ACCRUALS THAT WOULD BE, UH, REFLECTED FOR SALES AND BID TAX REVENUES WOULD HAVE A VERY SIGNIFICANT IMPACT ON THESE RESULTS. 
          SO I, I FEEL PRETTY CONFIDENT THAT WE CAN HAVE GOOD INFORMATION TO DISCUSS. 
          UM, THE FISCAL YEAR, 22 YEAR END ADJUSTMENTS WERE APPROXIMATELY 65,000. 
          SO IT COULD BE IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD OR POSSIBLY EVEN LESS. 
          SO WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE IN THE NUMBERS. 
          SO A REMINDER, UM, FOR, UH, NOT ONLY COUNCIL, BUT FOR MEMBERS OF THE AUDIENCE AND, UM, PEOPLE THAT ARE LISTENING, UM, T P T, UM, WHICH IS TECHNICALLY WHAT WE HAVE, UM, WE CALL IT SALES TAX, BUT TECHNICALLY ARIZONA IS NOT A SALES TAX STATE. 
          ARIZONA IS A TRANSACTION PRIVILEGE TAX STATE, WHICH IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT IN HOW THINGS OPERATE. 
          UM, SO IT STATES WHERE IT'S JUST A SALES TAX, THEY ONLY TAX RETAIL ARIZONA TAXES, OTHER CATEGORIES BESIDES RETAIL. 
          UM, THERE ARE CONFIDENTIALITY RULES THAT WE MUST FOLLOW, UM, BECAUSE WE'RE NOT ALLOWED TO DISCLOSE, UM, PRIVATE BUSINESS INFORMATION, UM, THAT WOULD, UM, GIVE INFORMATION TO THEIR COMPETITORS AND THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          UM, SO DEFINITELY NOT REGARDING ANY INDIVIDUAL TAXPAYERS. 
          WE CAN'T EVEN TELL YOU. 
          YOU, IF YOU SAY, WELL, DOES SO-AND-SO PAY TAX OR NOT PAY TAX, CAN'T TELL YOU THAT EVEN, UM, WE ALSO, NOT JUST FROM AN INDIVIDUAL LEVEL, BUT IF IT'S A SMALL GROUP, WE CANNOT DISCLOSE INFORMATION BECAUSE WHEN THE GROUP IS SO SMALL, IT'S EASY FOR, UM, THE MEMBERS OF THAT GROUP TO KIND OF GET AN IDEA OF, OF WHERE THEY STAND WITHIN THE GROUP AND, AND INTERPOLATE SOME INFORMATION. 
          SO THE RULE IS, UM, THAT ANYTHING WHERE IT'S 10 OR FEWER, OR IF IT'S 10 OR FEWER REPRESENT A SIGNIFICANT PORTION OF A CATEGORY. 
          SO YOU CAN HAVE MORE THAN 10, BUT YOUR OTHER, UM, REMAINING TAXPAYERS WITHIN THAT CATEGORY HAVE SO MINIMAL IMPACT. 
          AND YOU'VE GOT 10 OR FEWER THAT REALLY MAKE UP THE BULK OF THAT CATEGORY. 
          IT'S STILL THE SAME RULE APPLIES. 
          UM, THE RULE BASICALLY SAYS THAT ONLY CITY EMPLOYEES WITH A NEED TO KNOW FOR TAX COLLECTION ARE ALLOWED TO HAVE, UM, ACCESS. 
          AND THEY SPECIFICALLY IDENTIFY EVEN THE CITY MANAGER ROLE THAT, UM, UNLESS YOU'RE A REALLY, REALLY SMALL, UM, CITY OR TOWN, THAT THE CITY MANAGER ALSO FUNCTIONS AS THE FINANCE DIRECTOR, WHICH THERE ARE MANY OF THOSE REALLY TINY ONES OUT THERE THAT OPERATE THAT WAY. 
          SO OTHER THAN THAT, UM, THEY BASICALLY SAY, UM, CITY MANAGER IS NOT ONE OF THOSE POSITIONS THAT IS IN A NEED TO KNOW FOR TAX COLLECTION PURPOSES. 
          UH, PETE, YOU WANT, HOW DO YOU WANT TO DO QUESTIONS? CHAIR TO FINISH? I, I'M OKAY IF WE TAKE THEM AS WE GO. 
          OKAY. 
          PETE, SHERRY, I'D BE INTERESTED IF YOU COULD SHARE WITH ME, IS THAT STATUTE THOSE CONFIDENTIALITY RULES OR IS THAT ADO R POLICY? UM, IT'S, IT'S PART OF ADO R'S RULINGS. 
          THERE'S SOME DISCUSSION IN STATUTE ABOUT THE CONFIDENTIALITY, BUT MORE OF THE PARTICULARS IS IN THE ADO R RULINGS. 
          AND THE RESULT, IF WE WERE TO VIOLATE THIS, IS THEY WOULD STOP GIVING US THE DETAILED INFORMATION AND WE JUST KNOW TOTALS. 
          AND THAT'S IT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          GOOD. 
          OKAY, SHERRY. 
          OKAY. 
          SO, UM, HERE I'M SHOWING A COMPARISON, UM, TO BOTH THE PRIOR YEAR AND THE, UM, BUDGET AMOUNTS. 
          SO IF YOU LOOK AT, IN TOTAL FISCAL YEAR 22, SALES TAX REVENUE WAS 32.7 MILLION. 
          AND IN FISCAL YEAR 23 IS 31.7 MILLION FOR A 3% DECREASE. 
          UM, WE HAD, AT THE TIME THAT WE PREPARED THE FISCAL YEAR 23 BUDGET, WE BUDGETED AN INCREASE BECAUSE AT, AT THAT TIME, WE WERE SHOWING VERY, VERY SIGNIFICANT, UM, MONTH OVER MONTH INCREASES IN FISCAL YEAR 22. 
          AND WE WERE ACTUALLY VERY CONSERVATIVE 'CAUSE WE WERE, UM, LIKE 25% AND 45% HIGHER EACH MONTH DURING FISCAL YEAR 
          [00:20:01]
22. 
          AND, UM, SO WE ONLY DID, UM, LIKE 15% INCREASE FOR THE REMAINDER OF THE YEAR AND, AND 7% FOR THE NEXT YEAR. 
          SO WE THOUGHT WE WERE DOING REALLY MODEST INCREASES. 
          UM, DURING THE BUDGET PROCESS. 
          WE, UM, DO, UM, SEEK, UH, INPUT FROM OTHERS INCLUDING, UM, THE CHAMBER. 
          SO AT, AT THAT POINT IN TIME, UM, IT WAS UM, UH, CANDACE STRAUSS THAT WAS THE, UM, DIRECTOR FOR THE CHAMBER AND KIND OF WAS GETTING A LITTLE PUSHBACK OF LIKE, I THINK YOU'RE BUDGETING TOO LOW, AND TURNS OUT WE BUDGETED TOO HIGH. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS OF, YOU KNOW, WE CAN ASK THE MAGIC EIGHT BALL BECAUSE NOBODY REALLY KNOWS WHAT, WHAT THE FUTURE HOLDS. 
          ON THE, UM, BED TAX SIDE, UH, FISCAL YEAR 22 ACTUALS WERE 8.9 MILLION. 
          FISCAL YEAR 23 WAS 8.5 FOR A 4% DECREASE. 
          AND FOR, COMPARED TO FISCAL YEAR 23, BUDGET OF 10 MILLION. 
          SO IN BOTH OF THE CASES, UM, BECAUSE OF THE HIGHER, UH, ANTICIPATION OF HIGHER BUDGETS WE WERE UNDER. 
          UM, SO THE, UM, THINGS I'VE LISTED HERE AS POSSIBLE REASONS FOR THE DECREASES. 
          SO YOU CAN SEE FOR THE MOST PART, EACH MONTH DURING THE YEAR DECREASES, UM, OCCURRED. 
          THERE WERE A FEW MONTHS WHERE THERE WAS SOME INCREASES. 
          UM, AND SO WHEN I SEND OUT, UM, THE REPORT TO COUNSEL, UM, SOMETIMES I PUT SOME INFORMATION IN THERE ABOUT THERE WERE SOME REALLY SIGNIFICANT DELINQUENCIES AND THAT'S WHY THE NUMBER INCREASED. 
          UM, OR THERE WAS SOME SIGNIFICANT DELINQUENCIES THAT WEREN'T PAID AND THAT'S WHY THE NUMBER WAS A DECREASE AS MUCH AS IT WAS. 
          SO IT CAN VARY SO, SO MUCH IN FROM A MONTH TO MONTH BASIS, THE PROCESS AND THE WAY THAT IT HAPPENED. 
          SO A BUSINESS, UM, SO RIGHT NOW WE'RE IN THE, THE MONTH OF AUGUST BUSINESSES DOING WHATEVER BUSINESS THAT THEY ARE DURING THE MONTH OF AUGUST. 
          THEY'RE, AFTER THE END OF AUGUST, THEY'RE CLOSING THEIR BOOKS AND IDENTIFYING HOW MUCH SALES TAX THAT THEY WOULD NEED TO PAY. 
          AND THEY HAVE UNTIL THE 20TH OF THE FOLLOWING MONTH. 
          SO UNTIL SEPTEMBER 20TH, YOU PAY THAT. 
          IF THEY DON'T PAY IT BY THE 20TH, A OR ARIZONA DEPARTMENT OF REVENUE IS CLOSING THEIR BOOKS. 
          'CAUSE THEY HAVE TO CLOSE AT SOME POINT. 
          AND WE'RE GOING TO, I'M GONNA SHOW YOU SOME STUFF ON THAT. 
          AND SO ANYONE WHO DIDN'T PAY, I'M TRYING TO GUESS ABOUT SOME OF THOSE DELINQUENCIES. 
          UM, SO, UM, FROM, UH, THE ACTUAL NUMBERS, THESE ARE ACTUALLY FAIRLY SMALL DECREASES FOR THE YEAR. 
          3% IN SALES TAX, 4% IN BED TAX. 
          AND I IDENTIFIED, UM, SOME OF THE THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN DISCUSSED AS POSSIBLE REASONS WHY THE NUMBERS HAVE COME DOWN. 
          UM, REOPENING OF EUROPE, SIGNIFICANT INFLATION IMPACTS THAT IMPACT, UM, PEOPLE'S ABILITY TO, UH, TRAVEL, UM, TALK OF A COMING RECESSION TENDS TO HAVE SOME IMPACT ON HOW MUCH PEOPLE ARE WILLING TO TRAVEL. 
          AND THEN OF COURSE WE HAD THE HOLD ON DESTINATION MARKETING. 
          SO THAT, UM, PROBABLY HAD A LITTLE IMPACT AS WELL. 
          AND UM, AS YOU KNOW, PART OF THAT WAS, UM, A CONSCIOUS DECISION BECAUSE THE LEVEL OF TOURISM WAS SO HIGH, UM, THAT COUNCIL SAID, WE NEED TO HELP GET THIS UNDER CONTROL A LITTLE BIT. 
          MAYOR, MAYOR PETE? YES. 
          UH, SHERRY, YOU AND I HAD THIS LITTLE CONVERSATION. 
          I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO POINT OUT, REMIND FOLKS WHEN THEY LOOK AT THESE CHARTS THAT THE BED TAX REVENUES ARE NOT A SUBSET OF THE SALES TAX REVENUES, THIS IS ADDITIONAL REVENUE. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO OFTENTIMES WHEN WE THINK ABOUT THE IMPACT OF TOURISM, TOURISM TENDS TO ACTUALLY PAY THE LION'S SHARE OF THESE TAXES THAT ARE COLLECTED. 
          THEY'RE ALSO PAYING THE LION'S SHARE OF THE BED TAX REVENUES. 
          BUT I, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT FOR EVERYONE TO REMIND THEMSELVES AND THINK THAT THESE ARE, THESE ARE NOT, THE 9 MILLION IS NOT A SUBSET OF THE 32 MILLION. 
          IT'S AN ADDITIONAL AMOUNT. 
          THAT'S CORRECT, SHERRY, CORRECT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          YES. 
          UM, AND THE COMBINATION OF THESE TWO, OUR ESTIMATE IS THAT 77% COMES FROM TOURISM. 
          OKAY. 
          HAS THAT NUMBER CHANGED? UM, WE HAVEN'T DONE A NEW ANALYSIS IN A LITTLE WHILE, UM, THAT IS ON MY LIST OF TO-DOS, BUT AS, AS YOU MAY REMEMBER FROM THE RETREAT, THE E R P SYSTEM WAS MADE THE NUMBER ONE PRIORITY. 
          SO IT MIGHT BE A LITTLE, BEFORE I GET TO THAT, I JUST THOUGHT I REMEMBERED SOMEWHERE AROUND 75% IN THE PAST. 
          70% IN THE PAST. 
          YEAH. 
          AND IT INCREASED AND, AND WE DID THAT ANALYSIS PRE C O D. 
          SO WHAT THE CHANGES ARE SINCE C O, UM, TO THAT IMPACT, WE, WE HAVEN'T DONE THAT ANALYSIS AT THIS POINT IN TIME. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          AND THE CURRENT NUMBER OF YOUR ESTIMATE IS AGAIN? 70 77 77? YES. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, SO WE'VE BEEN DOING SOME COMPARISON TO PRE COVID BECAUSE WE HAD SUCH A HUGE SPIKE, UM, 
          [00:25:01]
COMING OUT OF THE, THE COVID CLOSURES. 
          AND SO LOOKING AT COMPARISON ON THOSE AMOUNTS, SO, UM, THE SALES TAX, UM, AMOUNTS, UM, FOR THE MONTH OF JUNE WERE, UM, 44% HIGHER BED TAX, 88% HIGHER THAN JUNE OF 2019 FOR THE FISCAL YEAR. 
          UM, FISCAL YEAR 23 SALES TAX WAS 49% HIGHER THAN FISCAL YEAR 2019 AND 79% HIGHER IN THE BED TAX. 
          THE, UM, LOOKING AT A, AT A RELATIVE, SOME RELATIVE COMPARISON OF THE WESTERN REGION C P I, THE INCREASE WAS FROM JUNE, 2019 TO JUNE, 2023 WAS 20%. 
          SO THESE PERCENTAGES OBVIOUSLY ARE A LOT HIGHER THAN THAT. 
          BUT ONE THING TO KEEP IN MIND, THE C P I IS LOOKING AT, UM, A BROAD AREA. 
          IT'S NOT SEDONA SPECIFIC. 
          UM, THERE IS, UM, NOT A MONTHLY MEASURE, BUT AN EVERY OTHER MONTH MEASURE FOR THE, THE PHOENIX METROPOLITAN AREA FOR THEIR C P I. 
          BUT TO ME THAT'S NOT NECESSARILY A GOOD MEASURE BECAUSE RURAL COMPARED TO METROPOLITAN ISN'T NECESSARILY COMPARABLE. 
          WHEREAS THE WESTERN REGION IS A BLENDING OF ALL OF THOSE. 
          SO THAT I'M SAYING THAT'S PROBABLY THE BEST THAT WE CAN DO, UM, FOR A COMPARISON. 
          YES. 
          UH, MAYOR, YES, JESSICA, JUST WANNA CLARIFY FOR PEOPLE WATCHING, I THINK I'M GONNA CLARIFY. 
          THE BED TAX INCLUDES SHORT TERM RENTAL BED TAX AS WELL AS TRADITIONAL. 
          SO THAT THAT INCREASE, UM, BETWEEN 19 AND 2023 TAKES INTO ACCOUNT THE PROLIFERATION EXPLOSION OF SHORT-TERM RENTALS DURING THAT TIME THAT ISN'T JUST ATTRIBUTABLE TO TRADITIONAL HOTELS. 
          UM, AND I, IF I'M REMEMBERING CORRECTLY, I THINK IT WAS JANUARY 1ST, 2017, THAT WAS WHEN, UM, THE, THE RIGHT TO PROHIBIT SHORT-TERM RENTAL RENTALS WAS TAKEN AWAY. 
          YES. 
          BUT THE PROLIFERATION TOOK A COUPLE OF YEARS TO REALLY GET GOING. 
          SO IT WAS HITTING DURING THIS COMPARISON PERIOD WOULD BE MY THEORY . 
          UM, SO, UM, WITH THE COMPARISON TO THE WESTERN REGION, C P I, THE WESTERN REGION C P I IS, UM, LOOKING AT INFLATION ON, ON COST ON THIS BIG REGION. 
          AS I SAID, NOT SEDONA SPECIFIC. 
          UM, IT DOES NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT, UM, WHAT THE REVENUE SIDE OF THE EQUATION NECESSARILY IS. 
          SO AS BUSINESSES INCREASE THEIR, THEIR REVENUES, THE SALES TAX IS BASED OFF OF THE, OFF OF THE REVENUE, BUT IS THE TRANSLATION, AND WE DON'T HAVE ANY INFORMATION, IS THE TRANSLATION OF THE INCREASE IN REVENUE COMPARED TO WHATEVER THE SEDONA AND EACH BUSINESS SPECIFIC INCREASE IN EXPENDITURES IS? WHAT IS THEIR NET PROFIT? HOW HAS THAT IMPACTED THEIR NET PROFIT? WE, WE DON'T HAVE INFORMATION ON THAT AND IT'S, YOU KNOW, PROPRIETARY BUSINESS INFORMATION THAT WE REALLY WOULDN'T HAVE AN AVENUE FOR BEING ABLE TO GET THAT. 
          UM, I ADDED, UM, A NEW TABLE TO COMPARE TO CONSTANT DOLLARS. 
          SO ESSENTIALLY BACKING OUT THE IMPACTS OF INFLATION SO THAT IT'S USING, UM, A BASELINE. 
          SO THE, THE CHART STARTS WITH 2014, SO I'M USING A BASELINE OF 20 $14. 
          AND SO ON THE CHARTS, SO THE, UM, KIND OF BLUE NAVY BAR THERE, UM, THAT IS THE ACTUAL DOLLARS, WHEREAS THIS KIND OF, UH, REDDISH LINE IS WHERE IT WOULD'VE BEEN IN 20 $14, EXCLUDING THE INFLATION. 
          UM, THE, THERE'S ALSO A COUPLE TREND LINES. 
          SO THE BLUE TREND LINE IS THE TREND LINE FOR, UM, THE ACTUAL DOLLARS. 
          AND THEN THE RED TREND LINE IS THE TREND LINE FOR THE, UM, CONSTANT DOLLARS. 
          SO, UH, YOU CAN SEE THAT, UM, ON THE RED LINE THAT IT WAS SOMEWHAT CONSISTENT IN THE FIRST FEW YEARS THAT I HAVE HERE ON THE CHART, UM, COMPARED TO THE ACTUAL. 
          AND THEN YOU START SEEING SOME, SOME GAPS IN THE REAL NUMBERS COMPARED TO INFLATION. 
          UM, LITTLE BIT IN 17, MORE IN 18, MORE IN 19, UM, THE DROP IN 2020. 
          UM, SO YOU CAN SEE THAT THAT WAS STILL ABOVE WHERE THE ELIMINATING IMPACTS OF INFLATION WAS AND THEN GREATER IN 21 AND EVEN GREATER IN 22 AND STILL EVEN GREATER, UM, USING THE 20 $14 4 23. 
          BUT 
          [00:30:01]
YOU CAN ALSO LOOK AT, UM, AS A A POINT OF COMPARISON THAT EXCLUDING INFLATION AND WE'RE USING THE WESTERN REGION, C P I AS THAT NUMBER TO TRY AND IDENTIFY INFLATION. 
          SO YOU SEE THAT THE AMOUNTS KEEP GOING UP UNTIL WE HIT 2020 DURING THE CLOSURES, THEN IT WAS A MORE SIGNIFICANT GOING UP AND ABOVE THE TREND LINE, UM, IN THE CONSTANT DOLLARS FOR 21 AND 22 AND THEN COMING DOWN IN 23. 
          AND IN THE TABLE AT THE BOTTOM, I HAVE INFORMATION THERE FOR YOU ON WHAT THESE, UM, CHANGES WERE. 
          SO FROM 24 TO 25 SALES TAX ACTUAL CHANGE WAS AN INCREASE OF 8%. 
          BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT FROM CONSTANT DOLLAR AMOUNTS, IT'S 7%, UM, BED TAX, 27% BASED OFF OF ACTUAL DOLLARS. 
          AND THEN, OH, SORRY MY LABEL'S WRONG SAYS SALES TAX, BUT IT SHOULD BE BED TAX. 
          CONSTANT DOLLAR CHANGE WAS 25%. 
          SO LOOKING GOING ALL THE WAY OVER TO THE RIGHT FOR THE FISCAL YEAR 23 NUMBERS. 
          SO SALES TAX WAS DOWN 3%. 
          BUT WHEN I'M LOOKING AT IT FROM A CONSTANT DOLLAR PERSPECTIVE, IT WENT DOWN 6% AND THE BED TAX WENT DOWN 4% FROM, BUT FROM A CONSTANT DOLLAR CHANGE IT WENT DOWN 7%. 
          SO, UM, HOW THAT REALLY TRANSLATES INTO WHAT THE EXPERIENCES OF THE BUSINESS IS, AND IT GIVES US SOME INDICATION, BUT IT'S, AGAIN, IT'S REALLY HARD TO TELL BECAUSE THIS IS WESTERN REGION, C P I, THIS IS NOT SEDONA SPECIFIC. 
          AND EVERY BUSINESS HAS THEIR OWN INDIVIDUAL EXPERIENCES. 
          THEY HANDLE THEIR BUSINESSES DIFFERENTLY AND EACH ONE CAN HAVE A DIFFERENT, UM, LEVEL OF RESULTS. 
          MAYOR PETE, I'M SORRY I KEEP HAVING MY BACK TO YOU. 
          NO, THAT'S ALL RIGHT. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          UH, SHERRY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THE ADDITION OF THESE CHARTS AND SOME OF THIS EXTRA WORK THAT YOU'VE BEEN GOING TO. 
          I, I FIND THIS ACTUALLY TREMENDOUSLY FASCINATING. 
          ONE QUESTION, VERY TECHNICAL QUESTION, I DIDN'T GET A CHANCE TO ASK YOU BEFOREHAND. 
          THE BLUE LINEAR LINE, I DON'T QUITE UNDERSTAND WHY IT STARTS BELOW THE BAR ON THE FIRST 2014, THE FIRST BAR. 
          SO WHAT'S THE BASELINE FOR THAT NUMBER? I GUESS PERHAPS, I DON'T UNDERSTAND EXACT. 
          THE RED LINE LOOKS LIKE IT CONNECTS THE FIRST DATA POINT, THE LAST DATA POINT. 
          IT'S, IT'S ACTUALLY A LITTLE BELOW ON THE RED LINE AS WELL AND A LITTLE ABOVE AT THE ENDING POINT AS WELL. 
          SO COULD YOU, COULD YOU GIVE, TAKE ANOTHER SHOT EXPLAINING THOSE MORE? YEAH. 
          AND SO THIS IS NOT A FORMULA THAT, THAT I DID. 
          I'M USING THE FUNCTION WITHIN EXCEL, AH, TO DO THIS. 
          SO IT'S AN AUTOMATED FUNCTION AND IT'S A, IT'S JUST A STRAIGHT LINEAR LINE WHERE IT'S TRYING TO IDENTIFY WHAT'S THE CLOSEST POINTS BEST BIT, UM, TO SHOW A LINEAR TREND OVER THAT TIME PERIOD. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU FOR THAT. 
          SURE. 
          AND THEN ON THE BED TAX REVENUE CHART, IT QUESTIONS THAT I HAVE ALMOST GOES BACK TO WHAT COUNSELOR WILLIAMSON WAS JUST ASKING ABOUT. 
          YOU KNOW, I KEEP TRYING TO LOOK AT THIS DATA TO UNDERSTAND THE IMPACT OF SHORT-TERM RENTALS ON OUR COMMUNITY. 
          AND UH, OF THE FIRST THING I'D LIKE TO ASK IS TO GO BACK AGAIN ABOUT WHY CAN'T WE GET THIS SPLIT OUT BETWEEN SHORT-TERM RENTALS AND, AND TRADITIONAL HOTELS AND, AND OTHER LODGING BECAUSE OF THE CONFIDENTIALITY RULES. 
          AND SO IT WOULD BE VIOLATING THOSE RULES IN ORDER TO PROVIDE THAT DATA. 
          AND I, FORGIVE ME FOR PUSHING THIS A LITTLE BIT MORE, BUT WHY DOES SCOTTSDALE DISCLOSE THAT NUMBER? UM, I CAN'T ANSWER FOR SCOTTSDALE. 
          DID YOU EVER TRY AND GET AN OPINION FROM ADO R AS TO WHETHER YOU COULD ACTUALLY DO THIS AND NOT VIOLATE THE RULES AS YOU SEE 'EM? IT'S NOT ALWAYS EASY TO GET TO PEOPLE IN ADO THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL. 
          WHO I TALK TO ARE THE SALES, UM, TAX EXPERTS FROM THE LEAGUE. 
          SO LEE STROM IS VERY, VERY INVOLVED AND VERY, VERY INVOLVED WITH ADO AND ALL THE TRANSITION THAT WAS DONE. 
          AND I'VE HAD MANY CONVERSATIONS WITH HIM ABOUT, UM, HOW WE'RE HANDLING THIS AND, AND HE AGREED WITH, WITH MY INTERPRETATION, GIVEN THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THIS ISSUE TO OUR COMMUNITY. 
          I, YOU KNOW, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE US PUSH A LITTLE BIT MORE. 
          'CAUSE WHEN I LOOK AT THIS CHART, AND I THINK OF WHEN SHORT TERM RENTALS CAME INTO OUR COMMUNITY FROM THE BED TAX REVENUE, I, I DON'T SEE IT HERE NOW. 
          THIS CHART IS A COMBINATION OF OCCUPANCY RATE AND THEN THE, THE NUMBER OF HOTEL ROOMS AND THE NUMBER OF SHORT-TERM RENTAL ROOMS AND 14 AND 15 GOES BACK BEFORE WHAT WE THINK IS THE RISE OF SHORT-TERM RENTALS. 
          MM-HMM. 
           ON MY EYE IS JUST TRYING TO LOOK AT THAT CHART. 
          OF COURSE YOU SEE IT, YOU KNOW, JUMPING 2021, WHICH MIGHT BE PART OF THAT ANSWER THAT ALSO MIGHT BE JUST COVID. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHY I WOULD LOVE 
          [00:35:01]
TO DIG IN, GET, BE ABLE TO GET THIS DIFFERENCE BETWEEN TRADITIONAL ROOMS AND SHORT, SHORT-TERM RENTAL ROOMS. I THINK THAT WOULD SHED A LOT OF LIGHT INTO THESE CHARTS. 
          AND SO I, I KIND OF, YOU KNOW, EXPRESSED MY INTEREST IN US PERHAPS PUSHING A LITTLE HARDER AND SEEING IF THAT ISN'T SOMETHING THAT ADO R PERHAPS COULD SEE SOME FLEXIBILITY ON BECAUSE IT ISN'T THE BOOKING COMPANIES THAT ARE PAYING THIS TAX. 
          IT'S, IT'S THE CUSTOMER HERE IS THE PERSON STAYING IN THE ROOM AND THERE'S THOUSANDS OF THOSE PEOPLE. 
          SO WE'RE NOT ACTUALLY EXPOSING THE DATA FOR AN INDIVIDUAL. 
          BUT I UNDERSTAND, I MEAN, I CAN I HEAR YOUR YOUR POINT AS WELL. 
          I WOULD JUST, IT WOULD BE SUPER BENEFICIAL I THINK IN OUR COMMUNITY TO DIG INTO THIS AT A DEEPER LEVEL. 
          JUST ONE SECOND. 
          UM, BRIAN'S FIRST, SO YOU GO, I THINK I'M SAFE IN SAYING THIS BECAUSE IT'S PART OF LIKE THE TAX CODE RULES OF LIKE HOW THEY FOLLOW, UM, SO THERE WAS, THERE WAS, AFTER 1350, THEN THERE WAS ANOTHER, UM, BILL THAT WAS PASSED ABOUT THE ONLINE PLATFORMS PAYING, UM, ON BEHALF OF THE PROPERTY OWNERS, THE TAX THAT WAS OWED. 
          UM, BUT THE, IT'S THE FULL COST OF WHAT THE RENTER IS PAYING IS HOW THEY CALCULATE THE TAX. 
          AND THESE ONLINE PLATFORMS AREN'T DOING THIS OUT OF THEIR OWN GOODNESS OF THEIR HEART . 
          SO THEY'RE, THERE'S A FEE THAT THEY CHARGE THAT IS ALL PART OF, IF YOU, IF YOU RENT A ROOM, IT'S BUILT INTO THAT RATE. 
          A AND, AND AGAIN, I'LL JUST, YOU KNOW, LEAD EVERYONE TO LOOK AT THE CITY OF SCOTTSDALE'S VERY PUBLIC WEBSITE AND REALLY BEAUTIFUL CHARTS OF, OF HOW MUCH REVENUE THEY'RE COLLECTING, YOU KNOW, FOR SHORT-TERM RENTALS. 
          EXACTLY. 
          SO THERE'S A QUESTION HERE OF LAW I THINK THAT, THAT A D O R NEEDS TO HELP US WITH, AND EITHER OF THIS STUFF SHOULD BE DISCLOSED, IT CAN BE DISCLOSED OR IT COULDN'T. 
          AND I'D LIKE TO GET TO THE BOTTOM OF THAT KIND OF ANSWER. 
          YOU DONE, PETE? YEAH. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR BRIAN. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          UM, I GUESS BEATING A DEAD HORSE A LITTLE BIT, SHERRY, SORRY. 
          UM, IF THERE'S OVER A THOUSAND SHORT TERM RENTAL PROPERTIES IN THE CITY, THEN IF WE'RE GETTING AN AGGREGATE VALUE OF BED TAX FROM THEM, HOW DOES THAT VIOLATE CONFIDENTIALITY? IT IS MORE THAN 10 AND WE'RE NOT LOOKING TO UNDERSTAND THEM AT A INDIVIDUAL SS T R LEVEL. 
          SO I'M STRUGGLING WITH WHERE'S, WHERE'S THE, WHERE'S THE POTENTIAL VIOLATION OF CONFIDENTIALITY IN THIS CASE? SO IT'S NOT JUST 10 IN THE CATEGORY, IT'S IF 10 OR IF FEWER MAKE UP THE MAJORITY OF WHAT'S HAPPENING IN THAT CATEGORY. 
          OKAY. 
          SO DO WE EVEN KNOW IF THERE IS, SO THEN YOU'RE, THAT IT WOULD IMPLY THAT THERE ARE FEWER THAN 10 OWNERS OF THE THOUSAND, OR THAT THAT 10 OWNERS OF THE MORE THAN THOUSAND STR SOMEHOW HAVE HIGH CONCENTRATION AND THEREFORE WE CAN'T EXPOSE THAT THEY WOULD BE EXPOSED BY US KNOWING WHAT THE AGGREGATE AMOUNT OF BED TAX IS. 
          I'M, I'M STILL STRUGGLING HERE. 
          I I CANNOT ANSWER THAT QUESTION IN A WAY THAT WOULD SATISFY YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          WITHOUT VIOLATING CONFIDENTIALITY RULES. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, I'M, I'M JUST GONNA JUST, UH, CHIME IN THEN WITH COUNSELOR FURMAN THAT SOME WAY SOMEHOW WE, WE NEED TO PUSH MAYOR, COUNSEL MAYOR ON THIS AND GET RESOLUTION ONE, ONE. 
          I THINK YOU COULD, YOU COULD JUST SAY THAT IT'S, IT'S NOT BASED ON THE OWNERS, IT'S ON WHO'S PAYING THE TAXES, BUT WE ONLY CARE ABOUT THE AGGREGATE. 
          WE DON'T CARE ABOUT WHO, BUT IF THERE'S LESS THAN 10 MAJOR PLAYERS WHO ARE PAYING THE TAXES, SO THAT'S WHAT IT'S BASED ON. 
          THAT'S GOOFY. 
          OKAY. 
          KAREN HAS TO WEIGH IN? NO, I JUST HAVE, OKAY. 
          ONE OF THE THINGS WE HAD TALKED ABOUT IS, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE FOR A LONG TIME REPORTED ON TRADITIONAL HOTEL TAX COLLECTIONS. 
          THERE ARE MANY, MANY MORE THAN 10, UM, PAYERS OF THAT TAX. 
          AND IF WE REPORTED ON HOW MUCH OF THE TOTAL IS REPRESENTED BY TRADITIONAL HOTELS MM-HMM. 
          , THAT WOULD BE A DATA POINT THAT WOULD HELP US IN DECISION MAKING AROUND LODGING. 
          [00:40:03]
AND MAYBE THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING WE COULD ASK OF THE LEAGUE EXPERTS OR A D O R TO ENSURE THAT THAT IS STILL A SAFE NUMBER TO DISCLOSE THAT DOESN'T VIOLATE THE RULES. 
          I, I'VE HAD THOSE CONVERSATIONS WITH THE LEAGUE, SO IT ESSENTIALLY, IF I GIVE YOU THAT INFORMATION, THEN YOU CAN JUST TAKE THAT NUMBER MINUS THE OTHER NUMBER THAT YOU SEE THERE AND YOU HAVE THE, THE DIFFERENCE. 
          SO, BUT WE STILL DON'T KNOW. 
          IT STILL VIOLATES WE, BUT WE DON'T KNOW THE WHO BEHIND THAT SUBTRACTION CALCULATION. 
          SO HOW IS THERE A VIOLATION THERE? WE HAVE NO IDEA WHO THE EIGHT PAYERS ARE OR WHATEVER THAT NUMBER IS. 
          WE JUST KNOW THAT IT'S $1 MILLION, LET'S JUST SAY. 
          SO HOW IS THAT A VIOLATION? IT JUST IS BECAUSE IT'S, THE RULE IS IF IT'S 10 OR FEWER THAT MAKE UP THE MAJORITY, WE CANNOT DISCLOSE THAT. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT WOULD BE, UH, COUNCILOR KINSELLA NEXT? NO, I WAS, SO NO, SHE WAS NEXT. 
          AND THEN YOU NEXT. 
          SO I I I, I THINK THAT COUNCILOR FERMAN AND COUNCILLOR FOLTZ MADE THE SAME POINT THAT I WANTED TO MAKE AS WELL. 
          UM, AGAIN, STICKING ON THE WORD AGGREGATE, IT'S AN AGGREGATE NUMBER, SO THERE'S NOT A DISCLOSURE OF, OF SPECIFIC INFORMATION. 
          THIS IS IMPORTANT FOR OUR, OUR COMMUNITY BECAUSE WE ARE SO IMPACTED BY SHORT-TERM RENTALS AND WE DON'T KNOW HOW OUR OTHER BUSINESSES ARE IMPACTED BY THEN. 
          SO I, AGAIN, WHO CAN WE TURN TO FOR MORE CLARITY ON THIS, BECAUSE I WANT THAT NUMBER AS WELL. 
          SO THERE ARE OTHER POTENTIAL AVENUES THAT I KNOW ARE DIFFICULT AND NOT EASY TO GET THE INFORMATION OTHER THAN THE, UM, SALES TAX DATA. 
          SO, UM, I KNOW THAT THERESA HAD TALKED ABOUT, UM, AND WE, WE DISCUSSED IN THE, THE WORK SESSIONS, SHE WANTS TO, TO CHANGE FROM GOBOS FOR THE SHORT TERM RENTAL, UH, MONITORING AND STUFF TO SOME OTHER PLATFORM. 
          AND MAYBE ANOTHER PLATFORM WILL HELP HER WITH BETTER DATA. 
          UH, BUT THAT'S NOT SOMETHING WHERE THERE'S, UM, CONFIDENTIALITY RULES AROUND. 
          SO THERE COULD BE THINGS FROM THAT DATA THAT YOU COULD GET INFORMATION THAT YOU, YOU ARE SEEKING. 
          AND ARE WE PURSUING THOSE PLATFORMS? I, I DON'T THINK THAT THAT WOULD BE RELIABLE IN, WE HAD A LOT OF DIFFICULTY, I FORGET WHO IT WAS BEFORE GO OSS, THAT THEY WERE TRYING TO SCRUB THE DATA TO MAKE SURE THAT DUPLICATE, UM, POSTINGS FOR, UM, SHORT TERM RENTALS WEREN'T BEING COUNTED TWICE AND ALL OF THAT. 
          AND IT'S REALLY, IT'S, AS I SAID, IT'S EXTREMELY DIFFICULT TO DO AND, AND TO GET REALLY GOOD DATA ON ALL OF THAT. 
          AND WHAT WILL WE GET WITH A NEW COMPANY? I, I DON'T KNOW, BUT I KNOW THAT THERESA'S LOOKING AT, UH, DOING AN R F E, IT, IT, IT JUST SEEMS LIKE IT'S SUCH AN IMPORTANT PIECE AND WE'RE AT A STUMBLING BLOCK. 
          I APPRECIATE YOUR POSITION ON THAT, BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW WE CAN BRAINSTORM AROUND GETTING AROUND THAT BECAUSE IT IS A PIECE OF INFORMATION THAT I THINK IS REALLY VITAL TO THE CONVERSATION. 
          ALRIGHT, THANK YOU VICE MAYOR. 
          AND THEN, UH, JESSICA KIRK, CAN YOU REACH OUT TO SCOTTSDALE AND FIND OUT WHAT, WHAT I WAS GONNA ASK HOW THEY DO IT? ARE WE GETTING AROUND THIS? SURE, I CAN DO THAT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          YOU DO SOLVE MY QUESTION, JESSICA. 
          THAT WAS MY QUESTION WAS CAN'T WE JUST FIND OUT? CAN'T WE JUST ASK? UM, I'VE, I'VE REACHED OUT TO THEM AND I'VE HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH LEE GRAFTS. 
          WHAT I FIGURED YOU PROBABLY HAD WHAT SCOTTSDALE'S DOING WITH SCOTTSDALE? UM, THEY DIDN'T RESPOND. 
          OH, I, UM, WHEN I REACHED OUT TO THEM, BUT I HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH LEE STROM AND HE AND I HAD A CONVERSATION OKAY. 
          ABOUT THAT. 
          THAT DOES HE TELL YOU HOW, WHY THEY'RE DOING IT, HOW THEY'RE DOING IT? NO, UM, I DON'T THINK THIS IS THE RIGHT FORM TO OKAY, THANK YOU. 
          SHARE WHAT HE SAID. 
          UH, I'LL JUST, I'LL JUST SAY KURT WILL PROCEED. 
          OKAY. 
          GOOD. 
          OKAY. 
          MARY, JUST ONE WRINKLE ON THAT. 
          YES, SHERRY AND I APPRECIATE YOUR PROFESSIONALISM AND YOUR TRYING TO STICK TO THE CODE AND YOUR ETHICS AND HONORS. 
          YOU READ IT. 
          AND SO THAT MEANS A LOT TO ME. 
          KURT, IS IT POSSIBLE FOR US TO GET A LEGAL OPINION FROM ADO? R NOT GOING THROUGH LEAGUE CITIES RUNS LOTS OF, THEY BALANCE LOTS OF THINGS AND SO THEY ANSWER QUESTIONS BALANCING LOTS OF THINGS. 
          WE CAN REQUEST, UH, MAKE A REQUEST THAT THERE, THERE'S NO LEGAL REQUIREMENT THAT THEY PROVIDE ANY, UH, OPINION ON, ON THIS TOPIC OR ANY TOPIC, ANY TAX TOPIC TO THE CITY. 
          AND ALSO TO CLARIFY, WHEN THEY PROVIDE US THE DATA, THEY DON'T PROVIDE US THE DATA IN A WAY WHERE IT'S SEPARATED. 
          WE WOULD MANUALLY HAVE TO GO THROUGH AND SEPARATE THE INFORMATION. 
          [00:45:04]
THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          OKAY. 
          CONTINUE ON THEN, SHERRY. 
          OKAY. 
          SORRY. 
          I PUT THE WHOLE THING, THE SLIDE IN THERE ABOUT CONFIDENTIALITY ON PURPOSE. 
          SO , SO I FIGURED IT WOULD COME UP. 
          YEP. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, ANY QUESTIONS ON THE COMPARISON TO CONSTANT DOLLARS? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          SO, UM, HERE IS ALSO A WAY TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AT, FROM THE DATA THAT WE GET FROM THE CHAMBER ON THE TRADITIONAL HOTEL OCCUPANCY AND A D R, THIS IS THE INFORMATION FOR THE TRADITIONAL HOTELS ONLY. 
          THIS IS NOT INCLUDE ANY OF THE OTHER OCCUPANCY TYPES, SHORT TERM RENTAL OR ANY OF THE REST OF THAT. 
          SO LOOKING AT THIS INFORMATION COMPARED TO HOW THE REVENUES ARE COMING IN, THE SALES AND BED TAX REVENUES ARE COMING IN IS SOMETHING WHERE YOU COULD SAY, HMM, I DON'T KNOW, I, MAYBE I COULD MAKE SOME ASSUMPTIONS HERE OR THERE. 
          UM, WILL I BE ABLE TO LET YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT YOUR ASSUMPTIONS ARE CORRECT? NO . 
          SO, UM, BUT IT'S SOMETHING TO LOOK AT. 
          SO ON THE UM, UM, FIRST CHART HERE, SO THIS IS THE OCCUPANCY BY MONTH AND YEAR. 
          UM, AND THIS, UM, KIND OF RED LINE THAT REALLY BIG DIP THERE, THAT IS DURING THE COVID CLOSURES. 
          UM, AND THEN IT CAME BACK UP. 
          AND SO OCCUPANCY, UM, HAS BEEN RELATIVELY WITHIN SIMILAR RANGES AND DEPENDING UPON THE MONTH, HOW CLOSE THEY ARE. 
          BUT SOME MONTHS, SO LIKE MARCH, AS YOU CAN SEE, UM, COVID CLOSURES OF COURSE WAS REALLY LOW, BUT THIS, UM, KIND OF TEAL LINE HERE, UM, FOR 2023, UM, THAT IS LOWER THAN THE OTHER PREVIOUS YEARS FOR, UM, 2022 WAS THE NEXT LOWEST THAN 2021 AND ACTUALLY 2019 WAS THE HIGHEST. 
          SO IN OUR COMPARISON TO PRE COVID NUMBERS, LOOKING AT OCCUPANCY LEVELS, THAT PRE COVID WAS THE HIGHEST OCCUPANCY IN MARCH OF, FOR MARCH OF 2019. 
          UM, YOU ALSO COMBINE THAT WITH THEN A D R AVERAGE DAILY ROOM RATE. 
          UM, SO THAT ALSO HAS A VERY BIG IMPACT ON WHAT THE REVENUES ARE. 
          SO THEY COULD HAVE A LOWER OCCUPANCY BUT BE CHARGING A HIGHER ROOM RATE. 
          AND I AM NOT A HOTELIER, I DON'T KNOW, SOME MAGIC FORMULA OF HOW DO YOU GET THE RIGHT BALANCE BETWEEN OCCUPANCY AND AVERAGE DAILY ROOM RATE. 
          UM, I HOPE THAT THEY HAVE A BETTER IDEA OF IT. 
          'CAUSE I, THAT'S NOT MY INDUSTRY AT ALL. 
          SHERRY, HOLD ON FOR A SECOND. 
          BRIAN HAS A QUESTION. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          UM, FIRST OFF, JUST ECHOING COUNSELOR FURMAN, DESPITE BEATING A DEAD HORSE, THANK YOU FOR YOUR INTEGRITY AND JUST KNOW THAT THAT'S FULLY RESPECTED. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, ON THE DATA HERE, CAN WE GET REVPAR INCLUDED IN THE, UH, THE, THE, THE PRESENTATION IN THE FUTURE? 'CAUSE THAT THAT IS WHERE A D R AND, AND OCCUPANCY MEET EACH OTHER AND REALLY TELLS THE STORY OF WHAT'S HAPPENING. 
          SO COULD WE GET THAT INCLUDED PLEASE? SURE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, I DO HAVE AT THE BOTTOM HERE, UM, SOME OF THE DEFINITION OF WHAT'S INCLUDED. 
          UM, BECAUSE THERE HAVE BEEN TIMES WHEN PEOPLE HAVE TALKED ABOUT IT AND I JUST, FROM THE THINGS THAT THEY HAVE SAID, I'M LIKE, I DON'T THINK THEY REALLY KNOW WHAT ALL'S IN INCLUDED. 
          SO IN THIS CATEGORY, THEY USE THE TERM HOTEL, BUT THEN THEY DESCRIBE AS THE DEFINITION OF HOTEL RATHER BROADLY. 
          UM, PUBLIC OR PRIVATE HOTEL IN HOLSTER STREET, TOURIST HOME, UM, HOUSE, MOTEL, ROOMING HOUSE, APARTMENT, HOUSE TRAILER OR OTHER LODGING PLACE, UM, WITHIN THE CITY AND LODGING OR LODGING SPACE IS ANY ROOM OR APARTMENT IN A HOTEL OR OTHER PROVIDER OF ROOMS, TRAILER SPACES OR OTHER RESIDENTIAL DWELLING SPACES. 
          SO IT INCLUDES QUITE A LOT. 
          UM, AND THIS, UM, HOTEL AND AND LODGING. 
          UM, WE ALSO REFER TO IT AS TRANSIENT OCCUPANCY. 
          THE TRANSIENT OCCUPANCY MEANS THAT IT'S, UM, LESS THAN 30 DAYS STAY. 
          UM, SO ANYTHING LONGER THAN THAT IS CONSIDERED A LONG-TERM RENTAL. 
          UM, I ALSO DID THIS COMPARISON BASED OFF OF AVERAGE ANNUAL, UM, HOTEL OCCUPANCY. 
          SO THIS IS TAKING THE 12 MONTHS AND LOOKING AT WHAT THE AVERAGE IS ACROSS THE, THE 12 MONTHS FOR EACH FISCAL YEAR AND COMPARISON OF THE HOTEL OCCUPANCY AND THE, UM, HOTEL ROOM RATE. 
          SO, UM, WE WERE IN THE GREAT RECESSION BACK IN, IN FISCAL YEAR 10. 
          UM, OCCUPANCIES WERE REALLY LOW THERE CAME UP, UM, FISCAL YEAR 14 WAS WHEN THE NEW CONTRACT WAS PUT IN PLACE WITH THE CHAMBER WHERE, UM, THE DESTINATION MARKETING PROGRAM 
          [00:50:01]
AND ALL OF THAT WAS PUT INTO PLACE. 
          UM, THAT EVOLVED OVER TIME. 
          THE BIG DROP IN FISCAL YEAR 20 WAS BECAUSE OF THE, THE COVID CLOSURES. 
          AND THEN YOU CAN SEE THAT, UM, OCCUPANCY RATES DID NOT ACTUALLY COME BACK ON AN AVERAGE FOR THE YEAR AS A WHOLE TO PRE COVID LEVELS. 
          UM, THEY WERE, YOU KNOW, UP PRETTY WELL, BUT STILL NOT AT THAT LEVEL THAT WHEN YOU LOOK AT HOTEL ROOM RATES, UM, THERE WAS THAT, UM, BIT OF A DROP FOR THE ENTIRE FISCAL YEAR, 2020, UM, WHICH THERE WAS TWO MONTHS ESSENTIALLY THAT WAS CLOSED. 
          AND SO THE HOTEL ROOM RATE CAME DOWN SOME IN 2020, BUT THEN YOU CAN SEE IT KIND OF SKYROCKETED IN 21 AND 22 AND THEN HAS COME BACK DOWN SOME. 
          BUT THE FISCAL YEAR 23 IS STILL THE SECOND HIGHEST, UM, IN THIS DATA GOING ALL THE WAY BACK TO FISCAL YEAR 2007. 
          UM, I DID ADD, UM, AND I PUT COPIES ON YOUR, UH, UH, YOUR SEATS FOR YOU. 
          I DID, UM, ADD A LITTLE BIT OF INFORMATION THAT WASN'T IN THE ORIGINAL SLIDE ABOUT THE RESULTS OF THE NATIONAL CITIZEN SURVEY. 
          SO THE NA THE LAST THREE SURVEYS, UM, IN 20 17, 20 20 AND 2022, THERE WERE QUESTIONS ABOUT TOURISM. 
          AND IN 2017 IT WAS ASKED A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY. 
          SO THERE WAS A VARIETY OF, OF BUSINESSES AND INDUSTRIES ON THE LIST. 
          AND IT SAID, TO WHAT EXTENT WOULD YOU SUPPORT OR OPPOSE THE CITY OF SEDONA ENCOURAGING GROWTH IN THE FOLLOWING TYPES OF BUSINESSES AND INDUSTRIES. 
          AND THEN THE RESPONSE REGARDING THE TOURISM INDUSTRY, THERE WAS 43% SUPPORT. 
          57% OPPOSE. 
          THE QUESTION WAS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THE NEXT TWO YEARS, 2020, IT SAID, IN THE FUTURE, HOW MUCH OF A ROLE WOULD YOU LIKE TO SEE TOURISM HAVE IN SEDONAS ECONOMY? AND SO AT THAT POINT IN TIME, IN 2020 6% SAID MORE OF A ROLE. 
          38% SAID ABOUT THE SAME ROLE, 57% SAID LESS OF A ROLE. 
          SO THE LESS OF A ROLE IS THE SAME NUMBER AS THE OPPOSE IN THE PREVIOUS QUESTION. 
          SO SOMEWHAT EQUIVALENT, UM, IN THE 2022. 
          UM, SO SAME, SAME WAY AS THE QUESTION WAS ASKED. 
          IN 2020 3% SAID MORE OF A ROLE, SO FEWER, UM, 35% SAID ABOUT THE SAME ROLE. 
          SO FEWER AND 62% SAID LESS OF A ROLE. 
          SO AN INCREASE THERE OF PEOPLE THAT WERE WANTING TO SEE LESS OF A ROLE. 
          SO THIS INFORMATION, I BELIEVE WAS PART OF WHY COUNCIL SAID AND OTHER, OTHER INFORMATION THAT WAS RECEIVED ABOUT, UM, PUTTING A, A HOLD ON THE DESTINATION MARKETING, UH, BECAUSE OF THE EXTENT OF THE TOURISM. 
          THANKS, MAYOR. 
          SO SHERRY, GOING BACK TO OUR CONVERSATION A FEW MINUTES AGO, THIS, THESE SLIDES ARE, DON'T TELL THE WHOLE STORY. 
          AND WITHOUT HAVING SHORT TERM RENTALS IN HERE, WE CANNOT TRULY UNDERSTAND OUR VISITATION. 
          YOU KNOW, AND SO IT MAY APPEAR AS IF, OR IT DOES APPEAR AS IF TRADITIONAL LODGING HAS DECREASED, BUT WITHOUT SHORT-TERM RENTALS, WE DON'T KNOW IF VISITATION HAS DECREASED. 
          CORRECT. 
          AND SO WE OPERATE WITH, WITHOUT A FULL PICTURE, WITHOUT UNDERSTANDING EVERYTHING ABOUT OUR VISITATION IN THE CITY. 
          AND, UH, THE ARIZONA TOURISM LODGING INDUSTRY HAD A, A, UH, A MEETING LAST WEEK HERE AND THEY GAVE US, YOU KNOW, THIS INFORMATION AND WE TALKED TO THEM, BRIAN TALKED TO THEM, I TALK TO THEM ABOUT HOW WE CAN, WE CAN REALLY GATHER INFORMATION THAT PROVIDES FOR US SOMETHING WE CAN USE TO, TO DETERMINE HOW WE SHOULD PROCEED, WHETHER OR NOT WE NEED TO INCREASE OUR MARKETING AND, UH, EFFORTS. 
          AND WHAT, WHAT, AGAIN, WHAT THE TRUE PICTURE IS, AND THEY ACKNOWLEDGED THAT THE DATA IS, IS IN, UH, SEPARATE PLACES. 
          AND, AND THEY DON'T, THEY DON'T COMBINE IT. 
          SO THEY, THEY JUST DO TRADITIONAL LODGING. 
          THEY DON'T CONSIDER STRS LODGING FROM THEIR PERSPECTIVE. 
          AND SO THE INFORMATION THEY PROVIDE AND WHY SOMETIMES WE GET, UH, WE GET HOTELIERS GIVING US THE DOOM AND GLOOM STORY, UH, IS BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH OF THEIR, HOW MUCH IS BEING PICKED UP BY THE SHORT TERM RENTALS. 
          SO WE COULD ACTUALLY BE SEEING AN INCREASE IN VISITATION AND WE WOULDN'T KNOW IT. 
          SO IT'S REALLY CRITICAL THAT WE FIND A WAY IN WHICH TO, YOU KNOW, INCORPORATE THIS INFORMATION AND DOESN'T HAVE TO BE FROM, FROM REVENUE. 
          IF WE CAN'T DO THAT, I WOULD 
          [00:55:01]
LIKE US TO PURSUE THAT LIKE WE JUST TALKED ABOUT. 
          BUT, UH, THERE ARE DIFFERENT, AND KAREN KNOWS THIS, THERE'S DIFFERENT METRICS, THERE'S DIFFERENT PLATFORMS AVAILABLE. 
          I TALKED TO THE S T R, WHICH IS UNFORTUNATELY THE NAME OF A PLATFORM, ALTHOUGH IT'S ABOUT TRADITIONAL LODGING, NOT ABOUT SHORT TERM RENTALS. 
          UH, AND SHE SAID THAT SHE UNDERSTOOD THE NEED FOR THEM TO REACH OUT TO THE SHORT TERM RENTAL COMMUNITY AND TRY TO GET THEIR DATA. 
          AND SOME OF IT IS JUST SCRAPING THE ADVERTISING FOR SHORT-TERM RENTALS. 
          SO NONE OF IT'S PERFECT, BUT IT WOULD GIVE US A MUCH BIGGER, YOU KNOW, BROADER VIEW AS TO WHAT IS HAPPENING IN OUR COMMUNITY. 
          BUT I, I REALLY CAUTION PEOPLE TO NOT LOOK AT THIS AND, AND EITHER, YOU KNOW, SAY THE SKY IS FALLING OR REACT TO IT WITHOUT UNDERSTANDING IT'S MISSING PERHAPS HALF THE DATA. 
          I MEAN, WE JUST DON'T REALLY KNOW. 
          UM, SO DURING THE BUDGET PROCESS IN THE WORK SESSIONS, ONE OF THE DECISION PACKAGES THAT WAS PRESENTED MM-HMM  WAS FOR COLLECTION OF DATA RELATED TO TOURISM. 
          AND SO I KNOW, UM, KAREN HAS BEEN, UM, WORKING ON GETTING SOMETHING IN PLACE FOR THAT. 
          UH, SHE COULD PROBABLY TELL YOU MORE ABOUT WHERE THAT STANDS AND HOW SOON THAT WILL BE HAPPENING. 
          GO AHEAD, . 
          WELL, SO WE'LL HAVE, UM, THE WHOLE UPDATE ON THE TOURISM PROGRAM, INCLUDING WHERE WE ARE WITH THE DATA EVALUATION. 
          WE'VE GOT A COUPLE DIFFERENT THINGS IN THE WORKS RIGHT NOW, UM, WILL HAPPEN AT YOUR MEETING ON SEPTEMBER 26TH. 
          SO WE'LL GIVE YOU THE FULL EVERYTHING THAT'S HAPPENING IN THAT REALM, INCLUDING THE DATA ANALYSIS. 
          BUT THERE ARE UNFORTUNATELY SMITH TRAVEL, WHICH IS THE TRADITIONAL HOTEL AND GIVES US OCCUPANCY AND RATE. 
          UM, AND REVPAR IS A SEPARATE COMPANY AND EFFORT FOR SOME REASON THAN KEY DATA, WHICH IS THE FIRM THAT DOES THE TRACKING OF THOSE SAME METRICS FOR SHORT-TERM RENTALS. 
          SO WE ARE IN THE PROCESS OF IMPLEMENTING BOTH OF THOSE TOOLS, UM, AND WE WILL HAVE THAT DATA, CAN WE CORRELATE IT TO, TO WHAT IT MEANS FOR OUR SALES TAX IF, FOR EXAMPLE, TRADITIONAL HO HOTEL OCCUPANCY FOR A PERIOD OF TIME IS AT 60%. 
          UM, AND WE SEE THAT IT WENT FROM 65 TO 60, BUT WE SEE THAT THE OCCUPANCY RATE FOR STR WENT FROM 60 TO 55. 
          YOU KNOW, SO WE WILL HAVE THAT KIND OF INFORMATION. 
          HOW IT SPECIFICALLY TRANSLATES BASED ON RATE AND OCCUPANCY TO SALES TAX DATA IS GONNA BE SOMETHING THAT WE WILL PROBABLY NEED TO DRILL DOWN ON AND TRY TO MAKE SOME ASSUMPTIONS ABOUT FOR DECISION MAKING PURPOSES, BUT WE WON'T HAVE THE ACCURATE INFORMATION. 
          I THINK RIGHT NOW WE'RE OPERATING WITHOUT, WE'RE ALL DATA DRIVEN HERE, YOU KNOW, WITH WITH ANECDOTAL INFORMATION, OH, PEOPLE ARE SUFFERING. 
          THE SHORT TERM RENTALS ARE DOWN HOTEL OCCUPANCY THAT WE, HOTEL OCCUPANCY, WE DO HAVE GOOD NUMBERS, BUT WE DON'T KNOW HOW THEY MESH TOGETHER AND WHAT THE TRUE, AS I SAID BEFORE, THE TRUE PICTURE IS. 
          SO YEAH, AND I THINK ONE OF THE OTHER PIECES THAT WILL BE MISSING IS THE COST OF DOING BUSINESS, RIGHT? WE CAN APPLY SOME INFLATIONARY FACTORS AND MAKE SOME OTHER ASSUMPTIONS, BUT THAT'S JUST THE OTHER PIECE THAT WE'LL HAVE TO PLUG IN AS WE'RE REALLY TRYING TO FULLY UNDERSTAND THE PICTURE OF WHAT'S HAPPENING OUT THERE. 
          YEAH. 
          THANKS. 
          OKAY, BRIAN, YOU GO NEXT. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          SO JUST ADDING ON TO WHAT, UH, THE VICE MAYOR WAS TALKING ABOUT FROM LAST WEEK AND THE PRESENTATION THAT WE SAW FROM SMITH TRAVEL. 
          UM, ACTUALLY JUST ADDING ON TO TODAY, THE WEEKLY CHAMBER NEWSLETTER REPORTS KEY DATA AND SAYS THAT FOR, UH, FISCAL 23, UH, SHORT-TERM RENTALS IN SEDONA AVERAGED 50% OCCUPANCY, WHICH SOUNDS TERRIBLE ON THE ONE HAND, BUT IT REPRESENTS, UH, OVER 2000 ROOMS WHEN YOU CONVERT, UH, THE UNITS TO THE ACTUAL NUMBER OF ROOMS THEY HAVE. 
          SO YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ON AVERAGE A THOUSAND ROOMS BEING OCCUPIED OVER THE COURSE OF THE YEAR, AND THAT'S EQUIVALENT TO ABOUT 50% OF THE SUPPLY OF TRADITIONAL LODGING IN TOWN. 
          SO YOU CAN MAKE, UH, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN ASSEMBLE A STORY HERE AND, AND IT IS ONE IN WHICH THE SKY'S 
          [01:00:01]
NOT FALLING. 
          AND, UH, THE DATA THAT WE SAW FROM SMITH TRAVEL RESEARCH LAST WEEK STRONGLY, UH, INDICATED THAT THE SKY IS NOT FALLING. 
          THAT IN FACT OUR LEVEL OF, UH, OCCUPANCY IS IN LINE WITH OTHER HIGH-END RESORT COMMUNITIES THAT WE FRANKLY SHOULDN'T BE SURPRISED THAT OF THE REASONS THAT SHERRY, THAT YOU SHARED ON THE, UH, ONE OF THE EARLIER SLIDES ABOUT WHY OCCUPANCY MIGHT BE DOWN, THAT CLEARLY AMERICA WENT TO EUROPE THIS SUMMER, LIKE BIGGER AND BATTER THAN EVER BEFORE. 
          UM, DOES IT MEAN THAT WE'RE INSENSITIVE TO THE PLIGHT OF LOCAL BUSINESS? OF COURSE NOT. 
          AND WE'RE INVESTING SIGNIFICANTLY AS KAREN HAS TALKED ABOUT, SO THAT WE DO HAVE BETTER DATA ON THIS. 
          BUT, YOU KNOW, I WOULD JUST SAY TO THE PUBLIC AND IN PARTICULAR OUR BUSINESS COMMUNITY, WE ARE PAYING ATTENTION. 
          IN FACT, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A BETTER STORY, A BETTER AND ACCURATE STORY THAN WHAT'S EXISTED PREVIOUSLY BECAUSE OF THE WORK THAT'S UNDERWAY. 
          SO, THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU, MELISSA. 
          SO THIS IS JUST SORT OF A, A GENERAL COMMENT ON THE TOPIC. 
          SO WHEN WE LOOK AT AN AVERAGE, WHEN WE LOOK AT TRADITIONAL HOTELS, WE KNOW ROOMS. WE KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE FIT IN THE ROOMS, WE KNOW A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT HOW MANY VISITORS THERE ARE. 
          WHEN WE KNOW ABOUT OCCUPANCY INSIDE OF A HOTEL, THIS IS NOT WHAT WE KNOW. 
          AND WE, EVEN IF WE WERE TO KNOW HOW MANY ST WE'RE CURRENTLY, UM, ENGAGED IN BUSINESS, WE WOULDN'T KNOW NECESSARILY HOW MANY INDIVIDUALS THAT REPRESENTS. 
          SO WHEN YOU'RE TRYING TO TIE SLEEPING ARRANGEMENTS, WE'LL, WE'LL BROADEN IT THAT WAY TO, UM, NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO ARE IN TOWN WHO ARE VISITORS. 
          WE'RE ALWAYS GOING TO HAVE A GAP BETWEEN KNOWING HOW MANY PEOPLE THERE ARE VERSUS HOW MANY SPACES ARE CURRENTLY BEING USED. 
          ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU START TO REMEMBER THAT STRS ALSO INCLUDE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE RENTING A ROOM IN THEIR HOME TO VISITATION, NOT JUST WHAT WE HAVE COME TO THINK OF AS STRS, WHICH ARE THE WHOLE HOUSE. 
          SO THIS IS, THIS IS VERY FINESSED AND UM, WE'RE, WE'RE, WE'RE ALL GONNA TRY AND DO BETTER ABOUT TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHERE PEOPLE ARE AND WHERE THEY'RE SPENDING THEIR NIGHTS AND THEIR DAYS, AND HOW MANY OF THEM WE THINK THERE ARE. 
          BUT THERE WILL ALWAYS BE A GAP. 
          UM, AND WE, WE JUST ALL HAVE TO ACCEPT THAT. 
          THANK YOU, MELISSA, YOU ANYTHING I SAID? OKAY, GO AHEAD. 
          OKAY. 
          SO, UM, THIS LIKE, UM, KIND OF SHOWS YOU WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT BEFORE ABOUT THE DELINQUENCIES. 
          UM, AND SO I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE INTERESTING TO YOU TO BE ABLE TO SEE FOR THE JUNE REVENUES THAT WE RECEIVE THAT ARE, THAT ARE ASSIGNED AS JUNE. 
          UM, THERE'S ADJUSTMENTS AND THINGS GOING ALL THE WAY BACK TO 2003. 
          AND YOU CAN SEE LIKE THERE WAS, UM, SOME LIKELY COLLECTION OF DELINQUENCIES THAT WERE FOR MAY OF A HUNDRED THOUSAND. 
          UM, SO THE DATA THAT WE GET, IT'S REALLY HARD FROM A MONTH TO MONTH. 
          IT'S A LITTLE BIT BETTER WHEN YOU LOOK AT A, A WHOLE YEAR AT ONCE, BUT WHEN YOU LOOK FROM MONTH TO MONTH, IT CAN REALLY BE TRICKY IN THOSE COMPARISONS, UM, BECAUSE OF WHETHER OR NOT PEOPLE ARE PAYING TIMELY AND EVEN WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE, UM, FILING APPROPRIATELY. 
          SO, UM, WHATEVER THEY ENTER IN. 
          AND, UM, THE, I THINK ADO R IS NOW LIKE NOT REALLY ACCEPTING ANY PAPER FORMS ANYMORE. 
          I THINK THEY WENT TO ALL A HUNDRED PERCENT ELECTRONIC FORMS, BUT STILL JUST IN LOOKING AT RAW DATA, THERE ARE, THERE ARE THINGS THAT I SEE THAT I'M LIKE, YEAH, I DON'T THINK THIS TAXPAYER LIKE REPORTED SOMETHING QUITE RIGHT. 
          UM, IT'S WHETHER IT'S TYPOS, WHETHER IT'S WHATEVER. 
          SO IT'S ONLY AS GOOD AS WHATEVER THE TAXPAYER ENTERED IN. 
          AND, UM, ADO R DOES A CURSORY REVIEW MAKING SURE THAT WHAT THEY PAID MATCHES WITH THE FORM AND THAT KIND OF THING BEFORE THEY DISTRIBUTE MONEY. 
          UM, BUT AS FAR AS LIKE AUDITS ADO R DOES SOME AUDITS, UM, AND THEN THEY ALLOW, UM, CITIES AND TOWNS TO, UM, HAVE ADDITIONAL AUDITS. 
          THE SMALLER ONES LIKE US, WE HAVE A CONTRACTED SALES TAX AUDITOR, UM, THAT WILL GO AND DO DO SOME OF THE AUDITING FOR US. 
          A FEW OF THE BIGGER ONES ACTUALLY HAVE IN-HOUSE ON STAFF, UM, SALES TAX AUDITORS TO GO, GO OUT AND CHECK. 
          BUT, UM, WITH THE NUMBER OF TAX PAYERS IN THE STATE, UM, LIKE TO MAKE SURE LIKE IT'S ALL VERY ACCURATE DATA, THAT'S REALLY, REALLY TOUGH, UM, TO DO. 
          SO IT'S ONE TAXPAYER AT A TIME, ONE AUDIT AT A TIME. 
          UM, I 
          [01:05:01]
DID PUT SOME INFORMATION IN HERE ABOUT THE CATEGORIES AND WHAT IS INCLUDED. 
          SO, UH, RETAIL IS, UM, RETAIL SALES, BUT WE DON'T ACTUALLY, UM, UM, HAVE A TAX ON FOOD FOR HOME CONSUMPTION. 
          UM, BASICALLY THE GROCERIES. 
          SO WHEN YOU GO BUY YOUR GROCERIES IN SEDONA, YOU'RE NOT PAYING SALES TAX ON THOSE GROCERIES. 
          CAN'T SAY THAT ABOUT SOME OF THE OTHER CITIES. 
          YOU MAY OR MAY NOT BE AWARE OF SOME OF THE ONES IN VERDE VALLEY THAT CHARGE ON ON FOOD. 
          SO, UM, SO THAT'S PART OF WHAT'S IN RETAIL. 
          UM, AND THEN ALSO THESE OTHER CATEGORIES, BOTH MEDICAL AND ADULT USE MARIJUANA IN HERE, ONLINE MARKETS MARKETPLACE. 
          SO, UM, THE WAYFAIR DECISION, UM, THAT WAS, UM, DONE IN THE COURT SAID YOU STILL NEED TO, TO PAY SALES TAX, UM, TO THOSE DIFFERENT JURISDICTIONS. 
          SO THOSE ONLINE MARKETPLACES AND THEN USE TAXES ALSO, UM, ARE FALLING INTO THIS RETAIL CATEGORY. 
          UM, RESTAURANT, RESTAURANT BAR IS PRETTY SELF-EXPLANATORY. 
          HOTEL MOTEL, UM, WE TALKED ABOUT WHAT IS INCLUDED IN THE, UM, DEFINITIONS THERE OF THE HOTEL MOTEL, UM, CONSTRUCTION INCLUDES PRIME CONTRACTING, SPECULATIVE BUILDERS, OWNER SLASH BUILDER CONTRACTING. 
          AND WE'RE ALSO INCLUDING IN HERE, UM, THE SEPARATE CATEGORY THAT THEY HAD CREATED A LITTLE WHILE BACK THAT WE REFER TO AS MURA, WHICH IS MAINTENANCE, REPAIR, REPLACEMENT AND ALTERATION, UM, FOR CONSTRUCTION ACTIVITIES. 
          LEASING IS, UM, COMMERCIAL LEASING OF REAL PROPERTY OR RENTAL, LEASING OF TANGIBLE PERSONAL PROPERTY COMMUNICATION. 
          UTILITIES IS JUST THAT AND AMUSEMENTS AND OTHER IS NOT JUST AMUSEMENTS, IT'S TRULY AND OTHER. 
          AND SO THERE'S ALL THESE OTHER THINGS, TRANSPORTING, PUBLICATION, JOB PRINTING, AND THE SMALL CATEGORY WHERE THEY JUST GO, WE'RE JUST NOT GONNA TRY AND FIGURE OUT WHERE IT GOES THAT IT'S JUST PRIOR, DUE PRIOR TO 2015 IS IN ADDITION TO LICENSE FEES. 
          SO WE GET, UM, WHEN, WHEN ADO R CHARGES THE LICENSE FEE TO GET A T P T LICENSE, $2 OF THAT COMES TO SEDONA. 
          SO THAT'S INCLUDED IN THERE. 
          UM, OKAY. 
          SURE. 
          YOU ALSO, JUST TO LET YOU KNOW, WE DON'T HAVE A FOOD TAX. 
          WE ALSO DON'T HAVE A TAX ON LONG-TERM RENTALS IN SOME OTHER CITIES RIGHT. 
          NEARBY DO. 
          BUT THEY, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THEIR PREROGATIVE. 
          BUT, AND THE, THE GOVERNOR DID SIGN THE BILL TO TAKE AWAY THE ABILITY TO TAX ON LONG TERM RIGHT. 
          RESIDENTIAL RENTAL. 
          IT WON'T BE AFFECTING US. 
          CORRECT. 
          UM, SO HERE'S A LOOK AT, UM, COMPARISON TO, TO THE PREVIOUS YEAR, MONTH BY MONTH, O OF THOSE VARIOUS CATEGORIES. 
          SO, UM, I DID PUT A NOTE DOWN HERE IN JUNE, 2022 FOR THE CONSTRUCTION CATEGORY. 
          THERE WAS SOME SIGNIFICANT DELINQUENCIES. 
          SO WE ARE SHOWING THAT FOR THE MONTH OF JUNE, THAT IT'S 21% LESS THAN THE PRIOR JUNE. 
          BUT IF, IF JUNE, 2022 DIDN'T HAVE THOSE DELINQUENCIES, IF I TAKE THOSE OUT, IT WOULD BE A, AT 13% LESS. 
          SO STILL LOWER. 
          UM, CONSTRUCTION DOES NOT FOLLOW THE TOURISM PATTERNS. 
          IT'S KIND OF REALLY UNRELATED TO THAT. 
          UM, BUT, UM, MANY OF THE OTHER CATEGORIES DO TEND TO FOLLOW SOME OF THOSE PATTERNS FOR, UM, THE YEAR AS A WHOLE. 
          UM, LOOKING AT THE PERCENTAGES, SO SINGLE DIGITS, UM, KIND OF ON THE LOW END, RETAIL WAS AT 3%. 
          RESTAURANT BAR WAS 1% DOWN. 
          HOTEL MOTEL, 14 OR 4% DOWN. 
          UM, COMMUNICATIONS AND UTILITIES WAS ACTUALLY A LITTLE BIT UP AT 6%. 
          AND THEN THE AMUSEMENTS IN OTHER CATEGORIES, I SAID, AS IN A COMBINATION OF A LOT OF THINGS IN TOTAL WAS FOR THE YEAR WAS DOWN 12%. 
          UM, I ALSO HAVE HERE FOR YOU A COMPARISON TO PRE COVID NUMBERS. 
          SO FOR THE MONTH OF JUNE, WHAT THOSE, UM, CHANGES WERE FROM JUNE, 2019 TO JUNE, 2023, AND FOR THE FISCAL YEAR 2019 TO FISCAL YEAR 23. 
          AGAIN, THE WESTERN REGION, C P I OVER THAT TIME PERIOD WAS 20%. 
          SO, UM, THE, UM, FIRST FEW CATEGORIES, UM, ARE ABOVE THAT. 
          SOME WELL ABOVE, LIKE HOTEL MOTEL IS 82% ABOVE. 
          UM, SO AT THE 20%, THAT'S QUITE A BIT MORE THAN WHAT THE, THE C P I ADJUSTMENT WAS. 
          RETAIL WAS 52% HIGHER. 
          UM, LEASING WAS REALLY CLOSE AT 22%. 
          THE COMMUNICATIONS AND UTILITIES AND THE AMUSEMENTS AND OTHERS WERE ACTUALLY LOWER THAN WHAT THAT, UM, C P I INFLATIONARY FACTOR WAS OVER THAT TIME PERIOD. 
          SO THEY WERE AT 13% COMPARED TO THE 20%, UM, IN THE, UH, INCREASE IN ESTIMATED TAXABLE SALES. 
          UM, SO I SAY ESTIMATED BECAUSE 
          [01:10:01]
THE WAY WE GET THE DATA FROM ADO R IT IS EXTREMELY DIFFICULT IN A VERY MANUAL PROCESS TO TRY AND FIGURE OUT, OKAY, WHAT TRULY WAS TAXABLE SALES? WHAT WE ARE, UM, LOOKING AT IS HOW MUCH WAS PAID AND THEN SAYING, OKAY, WHAT WAS THE TAX RATE? WHAT DO WE THINK THAT TRANSLATES INTO OF TAXABLE SALES? BUT AS I SHOWED YOU IN ALL THAT, LIKE ADJUSTMENTS GOING BACK TO 2003, LIKE THE IMPACT OF WHATEVER ADJUSTMENTS AND DELINQUENCIES AND VARIOUS ITEMS. UM, SO THESE WOULDN'T BE EXACT NUMBERS, UM, BY ANY MEANS. 
          UM, BUT COMPARING TO FISCAL YEAR 19 TO FISCAL YEAR 23 WITH THESE ESTIMATIONS, SO WE'RE LOOKING AT, UM, ESTIMATED TAXABLE SALES. 
          AND AGAIN, THIS IS ONLY WHAT'S TAXABLE. 
          I'M NOT INCLUDING, THERE'S THINGS THAT, THAT ARE EXEMPT FROM TAX. 
          UM, AND SO WHATEVER THOSE AMOUNTS ARE, I'M NOT, I DON'T HAVE INFORMATION HERE FOR YOU REGARDING THOSE. 
          SO RETAIL ON THE TAXABLE SIDE, WE'RE LOOKING AT OVER THAT TIME PERIOD, IT LOOKS LIKE THAT 105 MILLION INCREASE IN HOW MUCH TAXABLE SALES WERE, UH, RESTAURANT BAR, 47%. 
          UM, HOTEL MOTEL A HUNDRED AND 147 MILLION FOR RESTAURANT BAR, 113 MILLION FOR HOTEL MOTEL. 
          AND, UM, THE OTHER CATEGORIES, A A BIT LESS MAYOR, IF I MAY, PETE, SHERRY ON THE, ON THE CHART PREVIOUS. 
          YES. 
          THIS IS WHY I ALSO, I'M JUST SO GRATEFUL THAT WE, WE GET THIS DATA AND WE TAKE A LOOK AT IT, AND THIS IS FASCINATING TO ME TO THINK ABOUT HOTEL MOTEL UP 82%, RETAIL 50%, BUT THEN I LOOK AT RESTAURANTS ARE ONLY 38 AND AMUSEMENTS DOWN AT 13. 
          SO I'M WONDERING IF THIS IS INDICATIVE OF A CHANGING PATTERN OF BEHAVIOR FROM OUR VISITORS IN, IN SOME SENSE THAT THEY'RE STILL COMING, BUT THEY'RE NOT DOING SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WE EXPECTED TO THEM IN THE PAST. 
          AND I, AND I, I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE'S A QUESTION EMBEDDED IN HERE, SHERRY, UNLESS YOU HAVE SOME ALSO SPECULATIONS OR THOUGHTS ABOUT THAT IN THE PAST. 
          BUT I, YOU KNOW, THIS IS, I THINK, REALLY IMPORTANT FOR US TO CONTINUE TO LOOK AT AND KEEP ON TOP OF MIND AND THINK ABOUT AS WE, YOU KNOW, MANAGE THIS, OUR, OUR ECONOMY AND OUR, AND OUR TOWN. 
          SO THANK YOU FOR, AGAIN, THANK YOU FOR PRODUCING THIS KIND OF DATA AND MORE DATA IS GOOD. 
          , SHERRY, THE MINDSET THAT, ALONG, ALONG WITH COUNCILOR, UH, FURMAN BECAUSE OF THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS AND THEY ALL HAVE KITCHENS THAT THE PEOPLE MIGHT BE STAYING HOME IN THEIR, UH, SHORT-TERM RENTAL AND HAVING A FAMILY DINNER, WHICH THEY WOULD NORMALLY DO AT HOME AS OPPOSED TO EATING THE FINE FOOD IN SEDONA. 
          UM, THAT, THAT IS A POSSIBILITY. 
          I, I, I CAN'T SAY HOW MUCH THAT HAPPENS, BUT I WOULD SAY THAT IT, THAT IT'S VERY LIKELY THAT SOME OF THAT IS HAPPENING AND THEY DON'T PAY TAX ON GROCERIES. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND IF YOU GO INTO SAFEWAY IN PARTICULAR, IN THE MIDDLE OF THE DAY, THE PLACE IS JAM PACKED MM-HMM. 
          , SO MM-HMM. 
          , YOU KNOW, UM, OKAY. 
          JUST WANT TO KNOW IF THAT WAS PART OF YOUR THOUGHTS. 
          SO YEAH, I WOULD SAY THAT THAT HAS AN IMPACT. 
          AND ALSO THERE'S BEEN PRIOR TALK ABOUT HOW, UM, THE THOUGHT IS THAT THAT GENERALLY GEN GENERATIONALLY MM-HMM. 
          , UM, PEOPLE TRAVEL IN DIFFERENT WAYS AND HAVE DIFFERENT WAYS THAT THEY, THEY WANT TO EXPERIENCE THINGS AND THE YOUNGER GENERATIONS, UM, CHOOSE TO SPEND MORE OF THEIR MONEY ON EXPERIENCES AND LESS MONEY ON, UM, STUFF. 
          SO, UM, SOME OF THE PRIOR GENERATIONS WOULD SPEND A LOT OF MONEY ON ALL VARIOUS SOUVENIRS AND STUFF, AND WHEN I TRAVEL, BUT FOOD IS LIKE, THEY HAVE A SOUVENIR FROM WHERE I WENT TO. 
          BUT, UH, BUT THEY SAY THAT THAT'S, THAT'S LESS AND LESS COMMON, UM, THAT PEOPLE AREN'T DOING AS MUCH OF THAT NOW. 
          THEY'RE SPENDING MORE OF THEIR MONEY ON EXPERIENCES AND, AND DON'T CARE ABOUT THE SOUVENIRS. 
          SO, OKAY. 
          ICE MAYOR TO THAT POINT, OR TO YOUR POINT, I, I WAS AT WHOLE FOODS THE OTHER DAY AND A, A LOT OF PEOPLE WERE TAKING FOOD OUT AND EATING IT IN THE PARKING LOT. 
          OH, WELL, IN BETWEEN, SEE, IT WAS LUNCHTIME. 
          LUNCHTIME. 
          AND SO WE'RE NOT SEEING THE SALES TAX ON THE GROCERIES AND THE, AND THE RESTAURANTS ARE NOT GETTING THE BENEFIT OF THE PREPARED FOOD. 
          IT'S PREPARED FOOD IS TAXED, I BELIEVE. 
          IS THAT CORRECT? I THINK, YES. 
          SO THE SANDWICH IS TAXED. 
          YEAH. 
          IF IT'S PREPARED FOOD, IF IT'S WHAT THEY CALL FOOD FOR HOME CONSUMPTION, WHICH IS BASICALLY BUYING GROCERIES TO GO MM-HMM. 
           PREPARE SOMETHING AT HOME. 
          IF IT'S ALREADY PREPARED, THEN IT'S CONSIDERED, UM, TAXABLE. 
          SO IF YOU BUY TURKEY THAT'S COOKED, YOU'RE GONNA PAY TAX ON IT. 
          DELI COUNTER IS TAXED, BUT THE, BUT BUYING A FROZEN TURKEY IS NOT, I GET THAT. 
          OKAY. 
          IF YOU HAVE TO PREPARE IT. 
          OKAY. 
          NEW INFORMATION. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU SHERRY. 
          [01:15:05]
OKAY. 
          UM, SO LOOKING AT A COMPARISON OF, UM, TO THE PRIOR YEAR AND TO THE BUDGET, SO COMPARED TO THE PRIOR YEAR, UM, WE ENDED UP WITH, UM, TOTAL OF SALES AND BED TAX REVENUE AT 1.3 MILLION LESS IN FISCAL YEAR 23 COMPARED TO FISCAL YEAR 22. 
          SO, UM, AS FAR AS FROM OUR OPERATIONAL BUDGET STATUS, THAT'S, THAT'S NOT, UM, THAT MUCH OF A A, A BIG HURT IN, IN TRYING TO, WHEN WE'RE GENERATING SURPLUSES, IT'S NOT THAT SIGNIFICANT WHEN YOU LOOK AT, FROM A BUDGET PERSPECTIVE, 'CAUSE WE THOUGHT WE WERE BEING CONSERVATIVE ON THE BUDGET AND ACTUALLY CAME DOWN. 
          SO FROM A BUDGET PERSPECTIVE, IT WAS, UM, ABOUT 6.5 MILLION, UM, UNDER THE BUDGET AMOUNT IN THE FISCAL YEAR 24 BUDGET PROCESS, WE HAD THE WORK SESSIONS AND EVERYTHING. 
          UM, THE ESTIMATION THAT WE HAD INCLUDED IN THAT FOR FISCAL YEAR 23 WAS AT 7.2 MILLION UNDER THE BUDGET AND STILL GENERATING A GENERAL FUND SURPLUS OF 11.5 MILLION. 
          SO IT'S NOT, IT'S BETTER THAN WHAT THE ESTIMATIONS WERE DURING THE BUDGET PROCESS. 
          AND WE'LL, WE'RE, WE WON'T HAVE FINAL NUMBERS FOR YOU FOR A LITTLE WHILE AS WE WORK THROUGH ALL THE YEAR END ADJUSTMENTS AND FIND OUT WHAT EXACTLY ARE THE FINAL YEAR END EXPENDITURE SIDE, BECAUSE WE NEVER SPEND THE ENTIRE AMOUNT OF THE BUDGET. 
          WE'RE ALWAYS UNDER BUDGET BY SOME AMOUNT. 
          AND SO HOW SIGNIFICANT THAT IS COMPARED TO WHAT THE ESTIMATES ARE, UM, TYPICALLY, UM, IN PAST YEARS, UM, WHAT WAS ESTIMATED IN THE BUDGET OF HOW MUCH WILL BE SPENT COMPARED TO WHAT THE FINAL ACTUAL NUMBER IS, IT'S EVEN LESS THAN WHAT WAS ESTIMATED DURING THAT PROCESS. 
          SO MY GUESS IS THAT THE SURPLUS WILL BE MORE THAN THE 11.5 MILLION, BUT I CAN'T GIVE YOU AN EXACT ANSWER OF IF THAT'S TRUE OR NOT UNTIL WE DO THOSE YEAR END ADJUSTMENTS. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT'S WHAT I HAVE FOR YOU. 
          I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION FOR YOU. 
          SO BEING, WE HAVE QUITE A FEW PEOPLE HERE IN THE AUDIENCE, IN THE, UH, SHORT AT THE O H V INDUSTRY, DO YOU, WHERE DOES THEIR TAX, UH, SALES TAX COME IN UNDER, IS THAT, WOULD THAT BE AMUSEMENT OR, UM, I KNOW IT, IT WOULDN'T BE BROKEN OUT BECAUSE OF ALL THE RULES THAT IN PLACE, BUT I'M JUST CURIOUS WHERE IT WOULD SHOW UP. 
          CAN YOU ANSWER? UM, SO IT, IT DEPENDS. 
          , IT'S VERY SIMPLE AND, AND THE, AND THE, THE TAX CODE IS COMPLICATED, JUST LIKE INCOME TAXES WITH I R S IS COMPLICATED . 
          SO, UM, SO AGAIN, UM, JUST TO POINT OUT, SO THERE'S THE LEASING CATEGORY WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT RENTAL LEASING, A TANGIBLE PERSONAL PROPERTY. 
          UM, SO THAT'S A POTENTIAL AREA. 
          AND AMUSEMENTS AND OTHER WOULD BE ANOTHER POTENTIAL AREA THAT I WOULD SAY THAT THEY MIGHT BE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          ANY FROM THE DAYS, PETE, YOU HAVE LOOK A, A COMMENT. 
          I'M CURIOUS WHETHER THERE'S ANY PUBLIC COMMENT. 
          NO, I, I, YEAH, I JUST WANNA SEE IF THERE'S ANY OTHER QUESTIONS WHILE I WAS GOING HERE. 
          COMMENT. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, JOE, DO YOU HAVE ANY COURTS? NO. 
          SO WE WILL OPEN THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD AND WE WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD, AND WE'LL TAKE COMMENTS FROM THE, UH, DEAS AND THEN WE'LL MOVE ON. 
          ANY, ANY COMMENTS, PETE? SO, THANK YOU MAYOR AND, AND THANK YOU COUNSEL FOR AGREEING TO HEAR THIS ITEM, UH, AS WE MOVE FORWARD. 
          AND I APPRECIATE THE CONVERSATIONS WE HAD WITH CITY MANAGER ABOUT, YOU KNOW, HOW OFTEN TO DO THIS KIND OF THING. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE WE DO TALK ABOUT THIS AND SHOW THESE KIND OF NUMBERS IN OUR JANUARY AND WE ALSO, UH, UH, RETREAT AND WE ALSO TALK ABOUT 'EM DURING THE BUDGET PROCESS. 
          AND I THINK THAT, AND THAT'S, THAT'S GOOD AND, AND CORRECT THOSE SESSIONS. 
          WE TEND TO FOCUS ON THE NUMBERS BECAUSE WE'RE THINKING ABOUT HOW THE NUMBERS FIT WITH THE REST OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO. 
          AND SO I THINK TODAY'S SESSION AND FUTURE SESSIONS, AGAIN, MAYBE NOW TWICE A YEAR, ONCE IN THE SPRING, ONCE IN THE FALL. 
          SO WE THINK ABOUT THIS GENERALLY FOUR TIMES A YEAR. 
          BUT TODAY'S SESSION AND, AND UH, SESSIONS TIME LIKE TODAY ARE NOT SO MUCH ABOUT THE NUMBERS, BUT THEY'RE ABOUT WHAT THEY MEAN AND WHAT THE IMPACT IS TO OUR COMMUNITY AND SORT OF A BROADER SENSE. 
          AND, AND I THINK THAT WE, YOU KNOW, WE HAD SOME INTERESTING INSIGHTS TODAY AND THEY'RE ALL THINGS FOR US TO THINK ABOUT MOVING FORWARD. 
          AND, AND I'M SUPER GRATEFUL THAT WE HAD THIS CONVERSATION TODAY AND LIKE TO SEE US CONTINUE TO HAVE THIS KIND OF CONVERSATION MOVING FORWARD. 
          SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR PREPARING THE, OKAY. 
          ANY OTHER MAYOR IF I COULD ASK A QUESTION? YEAH. 
          . 
          YES. 
          SO MY 
          [01:20:01]
THOUGHT, AND I JUST WANTED TO TO VERIFY WITH YOU, UM, SO I WENT INTO A LOT OF DIFFERENT INFORMATION TODAY TO KIND OF SET SOME CONTEXT WHAT I WAS THINKING FOR, UM, FUTURE. 
          'CAUSE WE TALKED ABOUT DOING THIS QUARTERLY, UM, THAT FOR FUTURE ONES, SOME OF THIS INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT'S INCLUDED IN THE CATEGORIES AND SOME OF THOSE THINGS LIKE I JUST PUT IN THE AGENDA BILL, BUT I'M NOT PLANNING ON COVERING COVERING THEM IN THE PRESENTATION 'CAUSE WE DID THAT THIS TIME. 
          SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT YOU GUYS WERE OKAY WITH THAT. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT, SHERRY, THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, I THINK IT'S TOO EARLY FOR A BREAK, RIGHT? OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          [8.c. AB 2950 Discussion/direction regarding an Ordinance amending the Sedona City Code Title 10 (Vehicles and Traffic) by adding Chapter 10.30 (Improper Motor Vehicle Equipment) and a voluntary agreement with local OHV rental companies.]
ITEM HC AB 29 50 DISCUSSION DIRECTION REGARDING AN ORDINANCE AMENDING THE SEDONA CITY CODE TITLE 10 VEHICLES AND TRAFFIC BY ADDING CHAPTER 10.3 AND PROPER MOTOR VEHICLE EQUIPMENT AND A VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT WITH LOCAL O H V RENTAL COMPANIES. 
          KURT, THAT'S GONNA BE YOU AND I'LL WEIGH IN AS WE GO. 
          THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR AND MADAM VICE MAYOR AND COUNSELORS. 
          UH, THIS AGENDA BILL IS, AS IT WAS LISTED, IS A CONTINUATION OF THE DISCUSSION ON THE IMPROPER MOTOR VEHICLE ORDINANCE. 
          UM, THAT IS IN THE PACKETS IN SUBSTANTIALLY FINAL FORM. 
          UM, IT'S CHANGED, UH, SOMEWHAT FROM WHAT WAS PRESENTED TO COUNCIL, UH, ABOUT TWO MONTHS AGO, THE LAST TIME WE HAD A MEETING ON THIS. 
          UM, DURING THAT INTERIM, UM, THERE HAVE BEEN MEETINGS WITH THE LOCAL O H V RENTAL COMPANIES. 
          THE LOCAL O H V RENTAL COMPANIES HAVE PROPOSED, UM, THE COMMITMENTS THAT ARE SHOWN HERE ON THE SCREEN. 
          UM, AND WITH THOSE COMMITMENTS OF REQUESTS THAT THE CITY COUNCIL TABLE, UM, OR DEFER CONSIDERATION ON THE IMPROPER MOTOR VEHICLE ORDINANCE. 
          UM, AND SO THAT'S WHAT WE'RE, WHAT STAFF IS HERE TO DO THIS EVENING, IS GET DIRECTION FROM COUNCIL ON WHETHER THEY'D LIKE TO PROCEED WITH THE ORDINANCE OR, UM, WORK ON THESE COMMITMENTS, UH, PROCEED WITH THESE COMMITMENTS. 
          UM, I BELIEVE THERE'LL PROBABLY BE SOME CHANGES TO THESE COMMITMENTS. 
          UH, THIS IS WHAT WAS PROVIDED LAST WEEK. 
          UM, BUT THE O H P RENTAL COMPANY, SOME OF THE REPRESENTATIVES ARE HERE AND CAN SPEAK TO THOSE CHANGES. 
          IF COUNSEL HAS ANY QUESTIONS, I WILL GO THROUGH THE COMMITMENTS. 
          JUST BRIEFLY. 
          UH, THE FIRST COMMITMENT WOULD BE TO INSTALL TURN SIGNALS ON THE FLEET. 
          UH, MOST OF THE FLEET WITHIN 90 DAYS, AND A HUNDRED PERCENT WITHIN 180 DAYS. 
          SO SIX MONTHS. 
          THE SECOND ONE WOULD CONTINUE THE EDUCATION. 
          UH, MANY OF THE O H P RENTAL COMPANIES ALREADY DO EDUCATION ON OFF-ROAD TRAIL ETIQUETTE AND, AND SAFETY, UH, AND DRIVING OFF ROAD. 
          THIS WOULD INCLUDE ON PAVED AND PUBLIC ROAD, UH, EDUCATION FOR THE RENTAL CUSTOMERS. 
          UH, AND THEN IN ADDITION TO, TO THAT TYPE OF EDUCATION, THEY ALSO ARE COMMITTING TO WORK WITH THE G S R C ROCK AND US FOREST SERVICE FOR TRAIL MAINTENANCE AND SIGNAGE. 
          UH, NUMBER THREE WOULD BE THE O H P RENTAL COMPANIES ARE AGREEING TO GOVERN THE SPEED OF THE O H P RENTALS TO 35 MILES PER HOUR. 
          IT IS WITH AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE BASED ON THE TYPE AND AGE OF THE VEHICLE. 
          AND THAT'S BROKEN DOWN, UM, BY THE INDIVIDUAL COMPANIES. 
          UH, THERE BELOW NUMBER THREE. 
          NUMBER FOUR IS WOULD THE O H VEHICLE COMPANIES ARE COMMITTING TO INSTALL QUIETER MUFFLERS, UM, AND AS, AS, AGAIN, AS AVAILABLE BY THE MANUFACTURER. 
          AND AGAIN, THAT'S BROKEN DOWN BY THE DIFFERENT O H V RENTAL COMPANIES. 
          UH, NUMBER FIVE IS TO, UH, CONTINUE TO LIMIT USE ON MORGAN ROAD, WHICH MORGAN DRIVE, WHICH GOES TO, UH, BROKEN ARROW, THAT TRAILHEAD. 
          UH, AND THEN IN ADDITION TO THAT, THE O H V RENTAL COMPANIES WOULD SUPPORT COLLABORATING WITH THE CITY, UM, THE UNITED STATES FOREST SERVICE ON A PERMITTING SYSTEM AND DAILY LIMITS AT ALL, ALL OF THE O H V TRAIL HEADS. 
          UM, AND WORKING WITH THE G S R C ON THAT. 
          UH, SIX IS SOMETHING THEY DO CURRENTLY. 
          UM, DISTINCTIVE FLAGS FOR EACH OF THE FOUR O H P RENTAL COMPANIES WITHIN THE CITY. 
          UH, COLOR CODED. 
          AND THEN SEVEN, UM, IS, AGAIN, A, AN ADDITIONAL, AND THIS IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT FROM WHAT'S IN WHAT'S IN FIVE, BUT AN ADDITIONAL COMMITMENT TO WORK WITH THE G SS R C UNITED STATES FOREST SERVICE ROCK ON COLLABORATING, UM, ON DIFFERENT OPTIONS TO, TO MANAGE THE O H P RENTAL TRAFFIC WITHIN THE CITY. 
          SO THAT IS THEIR COMMITMENT TO THE CITY, UH, TO CITY COUNCIL, UM, AND TO THE COMMUNITY. 
          UM, AND LIKE I SAID, IN EXCHANGE FOR THAT, THEY WOULD BE LOOKING THE COUNCIL 
          [01:25:01]
NOT PASS THE O H V, THE IMPROPER MOTOR VEHICLE EQUIPMENT ORDINANCE, WHICH PRIMARILY AFFECTS THEIR BUSINESSES. 
          SO I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. 
          COUNSEL HAS, LIKE I SAID, THE THE REPRESENTATIVES ARE ALSO HERE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS AND STAFF'S LOOKING, UH, TO KNOW WHAT TO BRING BACK TO COUNCIL IN A COUPLE OF WEEKS. 
          THIS ITEM IS AGENDAS JUST FOR DISCUSSION TODAY. 
          UH, THIS IS THE FIRST TIME THE COMMITMENTS HAVE REALLY BEEN MADE, UH, PUBLIC. 
          SO THAT ALLOW COUNTS, ALLOW THE COMMUNITY TIME TO WEIGH IN ON THIS AS WELL AS WHETHER IT'S SOMETHING THEY WERE, THEY FELT WAS APPROPRIATE OR NOT. 
          SO, KURT, IF I DON'T, IF YOU DON'T MIND, I'D LIKE TO JUST WEIGH IN HERE AND, UM, THANK THE FOUR LOCAL COMPANIES HERE. 
          UH, AS EVERYONE KNOWS, IT STARTED OUT AS A VERY, UH, CONTENTIOUS ISSUE, UH, FOR THE SAFETY OF OUR RESIDENTS AND THE LOCAL O H V UH, RENTAL COMPANIES HAVE STEPPED UP AND WORKED WITH US AND THE COMMITTEE, UH, TO THE BEST I THINK OF THEIR ABILITY. 
          UH, AND IT WAS QUITE REFRESHING. 
          SO I WANNA THANK THEM ALL. 
          THEY'RE ALL HERE AND I APPRECIATE THAT. 
          UH, I DID TALK WITH, UH, DAN CANDLER FROM, UH, OUTBACK ABOUT, UH, THE MUFFLERS AND WHAT IT MEANS TO QUIET THE MUFFLERS DOWN. 
          I I THOUGHT THAT THAT WHERE IT SAYS INSTALLING QUIETER MUFFLERS, BUT IT'S NOT QUANTIFIED ANYWHERE. 
          AND HE'D AGREED TO COME BACK WITH SOME INFORMATION, UH, AND HOPEFULLY THE OTHERS WILL AS WELL, TO SHOW WHAT THAT MEANS, WHAT THAT NUMBER IS. 
          I BELIEVE, UH, POLARIS AT, UH, CORPORATE HAD SAID SOMETHING ABOUT 6%, UH, OR DROPPING SIX POINTS. 
          IS IT, UH, FOR DBS? YEAH. 
          SIX DECIMALS. 
          SIX DECIMAL POINTS. 
          SO, UH, BUT THAT SHOULD BE IN THE, UH, UH, THE LETTER FROM THEM ALSO. 
          YOU MENTIONED SOMETHING ABOUT, UM, NOT PASSING THE ORDINANCE, BUT WE'RE GONNA TABLE THE ORDINANCE. 
          IS THAT DIFFERENT? NO, I MEAN, THAT'D BE THE SAME THING. 
          SO, UM, AS WE, AS WAS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED WITH O S U RENTAL COMPANIES, COUNSEL CANNOT, UH, UH, PROMISE NOT TO TAKE FUTURE LEGISLATIVE ACTION, UH, AS A LEGISLATIVE BODY. 
          THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO, TO REVIEW LAWS AND, AND PASS LAWS WHENEVER, UH, THEY DEEM IT'S IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE COMMUNITY TO DO SO. 
          UH, BUT COUNCIL COULD TAKE A VOTE TO, UH, IN THE RULES OF PROCEDURES, DEFER CONSIDERATION. 
          UH, AND SO WHEN THIS CAME BACK TO COUNCIL IN A COUPLE OF WEEKS IN A, IN A, IN A MORE FINAL FORM, IF THAT'S THE DIRECTION COUNCIL GIVES TONIGHT, UH, THEN COUNCIL COULD VOTE TO, UH, DEFER CONSIDERATION INDEFINITELY, WHICH MEANS THERE WOULD BE NO SET TIME, IT WON'T BE BROUGHT BACK. 
          UM, AND LESS THAN UNTIL COUNSEL DECIDED TO BRING IT BACK. 
          AND THEN I, LEMME JUST, OKAY. 
          AND THEN I WOULD LIKE TO ASK YOU, WHICH HADN'T BEEN DISCUSSED. 
          UH, THEY AGREED TO, UH, MORGAN ROAD, BUT THIS WHOLE CON, THIS WHOLE PROCESS IS CONTINGENT UPON, UH, WHICH THE, THE GROUP AGREED TO, UM, SUPPORT A PERMANENT SYSTEM IN THE FOREST TO THE G SS R C, WHO IN TURN WOULD WORK, BE WORKING WITH THE FOREST SERVICE. 
          AND I UNDERSTAND THAT THEY HAVE BEEN WORKING REALLY NICELY. 
          THERE WAS A MEETING THIS PAST FRIDAY WHERE THE G S R C HAD BEEN WORKING TO GET INFORMATION PRIOR TO OUR MEETING. 
          'CAUSE THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT WE ARE GONNA GIVE THEM, UH, FOR A PERMANENT SYSTEM. 
          BUT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT MORGAN ROAD, AND IT MAY TAKE A YEAR FOR A CHANGE TO COME FROM THE FOREST SERVICE. 
          EVEN IF THEY AGREED TO SOMETHING IN SIX, EIGHT MONTHS, IT COULD STILL TAKE A PERIOD OF TIME, UH, FOR A PERMANENT SYSTEM TO BE IN PLACE. 
          I WAS WONDERING IF WE COULD DISCUSS, UH, AND SEE HOW THE COUNCIL FEELS ABOUT, UH, THIS ORDINANCE GOING INTO EFFECT A, UH, BANNING OF OHVS ON MORGAN ROAD ONLY UNTIL SUCH TIME AS THERE, THERE WAS A PERMIT SYSTEM IN PLACE AND, AND OR A GATE, WHATEVER IS DECIDED ON BY THE G S R C. 
          BUT THAT WOULD HELP, UH, REMEDY SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT THE PEOPLE ON MORGAN ROAD ARE GOING THROUGH UNTIL THE NEXT STEP WERE TO TAKE PLACE. 
          IS THAT SOMETHING THAT WE COULD LOOK AT? CERTAINLY. 
          SO, UM, THIS IS A VOLUNTARY COMMITMENT FROM THE O H P RENTAL COMPANIES. 
          IT DOES ONLY APPLY TO THE, THE, THE RENTAL COMPANIES. 
          IT DOESN'T APPLY TO PRIVATE OPERATORS OR RENTAL COMPANIES WITH OUTSIDE, UH, THE CITY OF SEDONA. 
          UH, AND THEN FROM THE CITY'S, FROM COUNCIL STANDPOINT, IT'S ALSO, THIS IS A, AN ACTION THEY'RE GONNA VOTE ON TO DEFER CONSIDERATION IF THAT'S WHAT THEY, WHAT THEY CHOSE. 
          UH, SO ON THE, ON THE FLIP SIDE IS AS LONG AS, YOU KNOW, THE O H V RENTAL COMPANIES WERE OKAY WITH THAT AND COUNCIL, ALL OF COUNCIL WAS OKAY WITH THAT, 
          [01:30:01]
MR. MAYOR THEN? UH, YES, IT'S WITHIN COUNCIL'S AUTHORITY TO DESIGNATE O H V ROUTES AND TO CLOSE O H ROUTES TO O H V. 
          AND THAT COULD INCLUDE, UH, MORGAN ROAD, RIGHT? AND ONLY FOR JUST THE ONE, UH, ROAD UNTIL SUCH TIME AS SOMETHING MORE PERMANENT COMES INTO PLAY. 
          UM, I THINK THAT'S ALL I HAVE. 
          UH, I'D LIKE TO BRING IT BACK TO, UH, TO COUNCIL FOR ANY QUESTIONS OF EITHER KURT OR MYSELF. 
          MELISSA. 
          I, OH, JESSE, YOU DID ASK YEAH, I HAD A QUESTION ON THE PROCESS THAT, OKAY. 
          YOU HAD ASKED ABOUT, SO TABLING THE ORDINANCE IS THE LANGUAGE BEING USED AND IT, IF IT'S TABLED IT TAKE, IT CAN COME BACK PROACTIVELY. 
          IT HAS TO BE PROACTIVE ACTION TO PUT IT BACK ON. 
          BUT WHAT DOES THAT MEAN IN TERMS OF OUR PROCEDURES? DOES THAT MEAN THAT SOMEBODY RAISES IT AND WE GO THROUGH THAT? YOU KNOW, IF IT'S TABLED, IS THAT DIFFERENT THAN SOMEBODY BRINGING SOMETHING UP NEW THAT REQUIRES MULTIPLE COUNSEL SUPPORT OR THEN YOU HAVE TO MAKE THE CASE AGAIN TO CONVINCE OTHERS TO BRING IT FORTH? I JUST WANNA UNDERSTAND, IF THIS IS TABLED AND WE WANT TO REVISIT THIS, WHAT ARE THE LIMITATIONS ON THE TIMEFRAME OF VISITING IT AND WHAT EXACTLY HAS TO HAPPEN IN ORDER FOR IT TO COME BACK ON, ON IN FRONT OF US? SO, SO THERE'S, THERE'S NOT, IT'S, IT'S FAIRLY OPEN. 
          COUNCILOR KINSELLA, UM, IT WOULD BE A, A MOTION TO DEFER CONSIDERATION. 
          THE MOTION TO DEFER CONSIDERATION ALLOWS, UH, COUNCIL TO DEFER CONSIDERATION TO A SPECIFIC TIME. 
          SO IF THERE WAS, AND THIS COULD BE USED ANY TIME ON ANY ITEM, SO ANY ITEM ON THE AGENDA, IF COUNCIL WANTED TO DEFER CONSIDERATION TO THE SUBSEQUENT MEETING, OR IN A MONTH OR TWO MONTHS, THEY COULD GIVE IT A SET DATE. 
          THE OTHER OPTION IN THIS COUNCIL RULES A PROCEDURE IS JUST A MOTION TO DEFER CONSIDERATION INDEFINITELY. 
          UM, WHICH MEANS IT'S NOT GONNA GET BROUGHT BACK UNTIL, UM, A COUNSELOR, UM, REQUESTS THAT IT, IT COMES BACK. 
          AND ANY COUNSELOR OR TWO COUNSELORS OR, OR HOW, THAT'S MY QUESTION IS HOW TO SAY. 
          SO IT'S NOT SPECIFIC. 
          IT, I GUESS IF, IF COUNCIL MOVE, IF VOTES TO DEFER CONSIDERATION, UM, THEN IF IT'S A, IF IT'S A MOTION TO RECONSIDERATION, ANY COUNSELOR THAT VOTES IN THE MAJORITY COULD ASK WITHIN 60 DAYS, UH, TO BRING IT BACK OUTSIDE OF THAT 60 DAY TIME PERIOD. 
          UH, VOTES NOT IN THE MAJORITY WITH THE PREVAILING SIDE COULD BRING IT BACK WITHIN 60 DAYS OUTSIDE OF THE 60 DAYS, THEN IT WOULD REQUIRE THE, THE TWO COUNSELORS, THE, TO SUPPORT IT, BRINGING IT BACK. 
          THANK YOU. 
          I JUST WANTED TO BE CLEAR WHAT, WHAT WE WERE, WHAT IT WOULD BE ENTAILED. 
          THANK YOU FOR THAT. 
          SO, UH, PETE, JESSICA, QUESTIONS IF YOU WANNA QUESTIONS, START THE PROCESS. 
          YES. 
          QUESTIONS. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          SO I HAVE A LIST OF QUESTIONS HERE THAT I'VE THOUGHT OF. 
          THE FIRST ONE, KURT, IS PROBABLY NOT TO BE AN, NOT AN ANSWER YOU'LL HAVE, BUT I'M CURIOUS AS TO HOW MANY PRIVATE VEHICLES ARE OWNED BY SEDONA RESIDENTS. 
          IF WE, IF ANYONE IN THIS PROCESS, IF WE'VE EVER GOTTEN A, A, A HANDLE ON WHAT THIS NUMBER MIGHT BE. 
          IS IT 10, IS IT A HUNDRED? IS IT MORE THAN A HUNDRED? DO WE HAVE ANY IDEA? I KNOW I TRIED TO ASK POLARIS THIS QUESTION AT, AT ONE POINT AND THEY WERE GONNA TRY AND FIND NUMBERS OF THEIR USER, PEOPLE WHO ARE ACTIVELY REGISTERED AS IN THEIR USER GROUPS OR WHATEVER. 
          BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT I'VE HEARD A NUMBER. 
          I'M CURIOUS WHETHER ANYONE HAS NO, NO. 
          COUNCILOR FURMAN, WE, WE KNOW ANECDOTALLY THAT THERE ARE A FEW RESIDENTS THAT OWN OHVS. 
          UM, THEY, UM, THEY'VE BEEN SEEN DRIVING AROUND IN THEIR OHVS AND IN THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS FROM THEIR HOUSES, NOT JUST THERE FOR SHORT-TERM RENTALS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          BUT WE DON'T KNOW THE NUMBER OF HOW RESIDENTS WHO OWN OHVS. 
          WELL, AS WE CONTINUE TO WORK OUR WAY THROUGH THIS, AND IF WE EVER TALK ABOUT IT AGAIN, I'D APPRECIATE PEOPLE THAT PERHAPS AT, AT, YOU KNOW, WHETHER PLAYERS WOULD ONLY KNOW HOW MANY POLAR PEOPLE ARE HERE. 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT THAT WOULD BE A GOOD NUMBER. 
          AND I THOUGHT I HEARD A PRELIMINARY NUMBER FROM THEM THAT IT WAS OVER 70. 
          SO I'M JUST TRYING TO GET A HANDLE ON 7 0 7 0. 
          YEAH, I LIKE TO, I'D LIKE TO US TO UNDERSTAND HOW MANY OF OUR RE PRIVATELY OWNED RESIDENTS ARE IMPACTED POTENTIALLY. 
          I COULD CHECK, I COULD CHECK WITH ADOT AND SEE THEY WERE ABLE TO DIAL IN FOR ACCIDENTS IN THE STATE AND FOR EVEN SEDONA, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF IT REGISTRATIONS IF WE WILL DEAL WITH REGISTRATION, BUT I CAN WORK ON THAT. 
          GREAT. 
          BUT IT'S NOT, YOU KNOW, THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF THIS AGREEMENT IS THIS WOULD NOT NEGATIVELY IMPACT, UH, INDIVIDUAL RESIDENTS. 
          YEAH, YEAH, YEAH. 
          UM, THAT, THAT QUESTION WOULD BE MORE APPLICABLE TO IF THE VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT FALLS APART AND SOMETHING HAPPENS AND WE START TO MOVE THE ORDINANCE TOGETHER. 
          I'M HOPING IT DOESN'T HAPPEN. 
          SO WE ALL, WE ALL DO A QUESTION ABOUT THE VOLUNTEER AGREEMENT. 
          KURT, IT WAS REALLY, AND YOU PACKET PAGE 62, BUT IT'S THE COMMITMENT THREE. 
          IT'S ABOUT SPEED. 
          AND SO 35 MILES CAME UP AND I'M INTERESTED TO 
          [01:35:01]
KNOW HOW THAT NUMBER CAME TOGETHER. 
          UH, AND THEN NOT TO PUT , SEDONA, UH, A T V SPECIFICALLY ON THE SPOT, I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE ANYONE HERE, JIMMY'S HERE, BUT I KNOW THAT IN THEIR DOCUMENT THAT THEY HAVE PEOPLE SIGN, THEY TALK ABOUT A LIMIT OF 15 ON THE TRAILS. 
          AND NOW THIS IS 35 ON OTHERS. 
          AND I'D LIKE TO KNOW THE STATUS OF HOW WE'RE THINKING ABOUT SPEED OF ATVS IN THE COMMUNITY. 
          SO THE, UH, THIS NUMBER'S PROPOSED BY THE O H V RENTAL COMPANIES, UH, ALL, ALL OF THE SPEED LIMITS WITHIN THE CITY ARE LESS THAN, OR 35 ARE LESS EXCEPT FOR COOKS HILL. 
          RIGHT. 
          UM, AND THAT IS LIKELY TO CHANGE WITH THE NEW ROUNDABOUT AT FOREST ROAD. 
          IT'S GOING TO MOVING FURTHER WEST, IT'S GONNA SHORTEN THAT DISTANCE BETWEEN AIRPORT ROAD AND, AND THE NEW ROUNDABOUT. 
          AND SO THERE'S A LIKELIHOOD THAT THAT'S GONNA BECOME 35 THERE ANYWAY INSTEAD OF THE 40 THAT IT IS. 
          UH, SO THAT WAS PART OF THE DISCUSSION AS WELL. 
          UH, THAT'LL BE AN ADOT DETERMINATION EVENTUALLY ONCE THOSE THAT PROJECT'S FINALIZED. 
          UM, BUT THEN THE THOUGHT WAS ALSO, UM, THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION ON WHETHER OR NOT WE WANTED TO BE FALLING BEHIND O H P'S GOING SLOWER AT 30 OR 35 OR 25 WHEN THE SPEED LIMIT'S 30 OR 35. 
          YEP. 
          SO HAS THERE BEEN ANY TALK IN THE, A VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT ABOUT, OKAY, THAT KIND OF MAKES SENSE, THAT 35 MILE AN HOUR ON ROADS, BUT IS THERE A VOLUNTEER AGREEMENT ABOUT WHAT THEY'RE GONNA ASK THEIR CUSTOMERS ON TRAILS? THAT HAS NOT BEEN DISCUSSED? UM, AND IT'S NOT IN THE COMMITMENT THAT I'M AWARE OF. 
          AND WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS, ALL EXCEPT FOR A FEW, UM, PRIVATE ROADS THAT ARE DIRT, UH, DRIVEWAYS MOSTLY. 
          UM, OR, OR MAYBE A COUPLE HOUSES ARE ON IT EXCEPT FOR THE LAST MAYBE QUARTER MILE OR HALF MILE OF SNUBBY HILL ROAD. 
          ALL THE ROADS WITHIN THE CITY ARE PAVED. 
          SO, WHICH BRINGS UP AN INTERESTING POINT, KURT, THAT THIS VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT, DOES IT STRICTLY HAVE TO ALSO CONTAIN ITSELF TO THE CITY LIMITS OR, BECAUSE NOW THIS IS AN AGREEMENT, THE AGREEMENT COULD COMPRISE ELEMENTS THAT EXTEND BEYOND THE CITY LIMITS. 
          IS THAT CORRECT? CORRECT. 
          SO, AND IN FACT, A LOT OF THESE DO SELECT THE SPEED LIMITS 35 MILES AN HOUR, NOT JUST WITHIN THE CITY. 
          IT'S OUTSIDE THE CITY TOO. 
          UM, OBVIOUSLY THERE CAN BE A DISCUSSION ABOUT WHETHER IT SHOULD BE LOWER OUTSIDE THE CITY ON ON UN PAVED ROADS. 
          UM, BUT IT, OTHER THINGS ARE LIKE THE G P SS MONITORING SYSTEMS THAT'S GONNA WORK, UM, OUTSIDE THE CITY AS WELL. 
          AND THEN COUPLED WITH THE SPEED QUESTIONS IS IN THE PARAGRAPH IN THE AGREEMENT, THERE'S TALK ABOUT THE VEHICLES MONITORED BY G P S. 
          I'M CURIOUS WHETHER THIS, WHAT'S THE STATUS OF THE DISCUSSIONS, UH, IN THE AGREEMENT HERE WITH OUR RENTAL COMPANIES ABOUT WHETHER THEY ARE WILLING TO STEP UP AND DO PRIVATE ENFORCEMENT OF THEIR CONTRACTUAL AGREEMENTS WITH CUSTOMERS FOR SPEED LIMITS? HA HAS NOT BEEN DISCUSSED YET. 
          COUNCILLOR VERMAN AND THEY ARE HERE AND WE COULD DISCUSS THAT WITH THEM TODAY. 
          SURE. 
          SO, YEAH. 
          YEP. 
          I'D LIKE TO HEAR SOME THAT, AN ADDITIONAL THOUGHT ON THAT IS WHETHER THEY'D BE WILLING TO SHARE ANY OF THE, THE DATA THAT THEY COLLECT FROM THE G P S SYSTEMS AS WELL. 
          I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S SOMETHING THEY COLLECT OR CAN JUST, UH, REVIEW INDIVIDUALLY. 
          AND THEN I HAD A QUESTION, SO I'M GONNA TRY TO REAL TIME EDIT HERE AND EVEN THINK ABOUT TO ASK IT OR NOT. 
          THERE WAS SOME WELL SUPPORT, I THINK THIS REALLY COMES FROM YOUR REPORT HERE. 
          SO THIS IS PACKET PAGE 62, KURT. 
          THE STAFF REPORT THAT THE RENTAL COMPANIES WILL SUPPORT LIMITS GUIDED TOURISM PERMITTING ON LOCAL OFF-ROAD SHOWS. 
          WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? WHAT, WHAT SUPPORT ENTAIL , UH, SUPPORT BOTH IN THE G S R C AND TO THE UNITED STATES FOREST SERVICE, WHAT THOSE LIMITS OR PERMIT SYSTEMS ARE, UH, HAS NOT BEEN TO DETERMINE, BECAUSE THAT'S GONNA BE A, A FOREST SERVICE PROCESS AND ULTIMATELY THE FOREST SERVICE DECISION. 
          UH, AND THEY'RE LOOKING FOR RECOMMENDATION FROM THE G S R C AND, AND SO THAT NONE OF THAT'S BEEN, BEEN DETERMINED AT THIS POINT. 
          SO DOES WELL SUPPORT THEN INDICATE TO ME THAT THEY'RE GONNA ADVOCATE FOR SOME LIMITS ON THESE TOPICS? YES. 
          THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE AGREEABLE TO DO THIS. 
          YES. 
          YES. 
          I ALSO WANT TO ADD, EXCUSE ME, UH, PETE, IT WAS DISCUSSED ABOUT, UM, I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE WAS DISCUSSION, I SHOULD SAY THAT THE G S R C AND THE FOREST SERVICE ALL LOOKING FOR SPEED, UH, LIMITS WITH SIGNAGE, IT'S BEING DISCUSSED. 
          I DON'T KNOW WHERE IT'S GONNA GO. 
          UH, BUT IT IS BEING DISCUSSED. 
          YEAH, THAT'S THAT'S GOOD. 
          AND YOU KNOW, AND I DO APPRECIATE THE FACT THAT SEDONA, A T V FOR ONE IS TRYING TO GET THEIR 
          [01:40:01]
CUSTOMERS TO STAY AT 15 MILES AN HOUR ON THE TRAILS, WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, A VERY INTERESTING NUMBER. 
          'CAUSE FOR ME, THE PROBLEMS THAT WE ALL HAVE ABOUT ARE, ARE ALL RELATE TO SPEED. 
          NOISE IS RELATED TO SPEED, SAFETY IS RELATED TO SPEED. 
          THE DUST ISSUES ARE RELATED TO SPEED. 
          SPEED IS LIKE THE DRIVING FACTOR HERE. 
          AND THAT'S THE A THING TO TRY AND MOVE. 
          THEN KURT, I'VE GOT SOME QUESTIONS HERE REALLY FOR  FOR YOU IN RE REFERENCE TO THE ORDINANCE IN CASE IT EVER COMES BACK UP. 
          THE FIRST QUESTION I HAD IS ON PACKET OF PAGE 65, WHERE THERE'S A, WHEREAS HERE ABOUT THE THIRD LEADING CAUSE OF CHILD INJURY, WHICH I UNDERSTAND. 
          AND I ACTUALLY WATCHED THAT HEARING AND I HEARD THAT STATEMENT MADE AT THE HEARING. 
          THERE WAS AN ERROR. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THAT, THAT THAT'S WHERE, WHERE I WAS GONNA GO. 
          AND YEAH, WHETHER WE'VE DONE ANY WORK TO THIS IS, THAT'S A, THIS IS A VERY EMOTIONALLY POWERFUL STATEMENT IN OUR WAREHOUSES. 
          AND, AND IF IT'S TRUE, I DON'T MIND IT BEING IN THE WAREHOUSES, BUT BECAUSE IT'S SO POWERFUL, I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW THAT WE'VE DONE OUR DUE DILIGENCE TO UNDERSTAND WHETHER THAT'S A CORRECT STATEMENT OR NOT. 
          SO ORIGINALLY IN THE, IN THE, IN THE PACKET THAT WAS FIRST PUBLISHED IN THE BEGINNING OF AUGUST, IT WAS THIRD LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH. 
          UM, AND THAT'S BEEN CORRECTED, A THIRD LEADING CAUSE OF INJURY INJURY. 
          AND THAT'S IS CORRECT. 
          AND THAT'S STATEWIDE. 
          AND, AND SO, OKAY. 
          SO YES, RECOGNIZE, I DO RECOGNIZE NOW THAT THAT'S A WORD CHANGE AND WE FEEL COMFORTABLE THAT THAT'S AN ACCURATE STATEMENT AT THIS POINT, ACCORDING TO THE TRAUMA CENTERS DIRECTLY FROM THEM. 
          YES. 
          GREAT. 
          GOOD. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU FOR, FOR DOING THAT. 
          ON PAGE 66 OF YOUR ORDINANCE, KURT, THIS IS A TOPIC YOU AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT ONCE BEFORE IN 10 30, 20, WHERE YOU HAVE ITEM ONE AND ITEM TWO AND ITEM THREE, WHERE ITEM ONE AND ITEM TWO ARE VERY SIMILAR TO EACH OTHER. 
          AND I UNDERSTAND THAT PERHAPS THE INTENT HERE IS THAT ITEM ONE IS ABOUT DRIVING OR OPERATING, AND ITEM TWO IS ABOUT, UH, LEASING, ALLOWING OTHERS TO DO IT. 
          THAT'S CORRECT. 
          BUT YOU ALSO STILL HAVE THE DRIVER OPERATE LANGUAGE IN TWO. 
          AND SO I'M  IF IT'S REALLY ABOUT THOSE TWO, SHOULD THAT WORDS, AND, AND, AND TWO BE THERE IS IS ONE ALWAYS ABOUT DRIVING OPERATE AND TWO IS ABOUT LETTING OTHERS DO THAT. 
          SO IT'S, IT'S ONE'S THE ALSO GEARED TOWARDS A DRIVER VERSUS THE OWNER AND TWO'S GEARED TOWARDS THE OWNER. 
          THE OWNER THEMSELVES SHOULD NOT BE OPERATING IT. 
          OKAY. 
          SO AN OWNER DRIVING THEMSELVES COULDN'T BE CITED UNDER ONE. 
          IT'S A PERSON YES, THEY COULD. 
          OKAY. 
          SO THERE'S JUST PERHAPS THERE'S STILL A LITTLE BIT OF CLARITY THERE THAT YOU CAN THINK THROUGH AND, AND YEAH, I THINK WE'VE HAD THIS DISCUSSION, THE, I HAVE THOSE AS TWO SEPARATE CATEGORIES, UH, BECAUSE IT'S ALREADY A, A REALLY WORDY, UH, SENTENCE. 
          UM, AND SO COMBINING ALL OF THAT WOULD ADD IN, WELL, I APPRECIATE THE NUMBER. 
          AND SO YEAH, I THINK THERE'S A COUPLE MORE WORDS. 
          IF YOU GOT RID OF SHALL NOT, SHALL NOT DRIVE OR OPERATE, THAT'S COVERED UNDER ONE. 
          SO TWO IS ABOUT THE OWNER SHALL NOT RENT OR ALLOW A PERSON TWO. 
          SO JUST A THOUGHT AMONG THAT IS A POSSIBILITY AND I WILL CONSIDER IT. 
          GREAT. 
          AND THEN, UM, I WANNA JUST BE CLEAR IN MY OWN MIND THAT THE, THE SECTION TWO, THE OWNERS, DOES THAT COVER ALL THE RENTAL COMPANIES? SOME OF THE RENTAL COMPANIES OWN VEHICLES? SOME OF THE RENTAL COMPANIES DON'T OWN THEM. 
          WHO WOULD BE LIABLE IN THE CASE OF THAT THEY WERE LEASING THEM? UM, I MEAN, SO THE OWNER WOULD BE LIABLE. 
          AND SO IF THEY, THEY LEASE AND, AND ARE YOU THE OWNER IF YOU'RE LEASING A I I BELIEVE SO. 
          IF, IF A IF YOU'VE GOT A COMMERCIAL LEASE OF MULTIPLE VEHICLES, YOU ARE STILL THE OWNER OF THAT VEHICLE. 
          YES. 
          AND IN SOME SCENARIOS THOUGH, I, UH, WE COULD, WE COULD CHECK TO SEE WHO THE RE IT'D BE WHOEVER'S ON THE, THE REGISTRATION. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND SO WHEN YOU'RE LEASING A VEHICLE, USUALLY YOU'RE STILL ON THE, THE REGISTRATION. 
          I IMAGINE IT'S THE SAME IN THIS SCENARIO. 
          UM, IF IT'S NOT, THEN THE, THE PERSON WHO'S ON THE REGISTRATION COULD, COULD BE LIABLE. 
          GREAT. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OR, OR COMPANY. 
          THEN MY LAST QUESTION IN THIS SECTION HERE IS, IS IN, IN ITEM THREE WHERE WE STILL TALK ABOUT TIRES, BUT THE VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT, I DON'T SEE MUCH TALKED ABOUT TIRES. 
          SO I'M KIND OF CURIOUS ON WHERE WE STAND HERE WITH TIRES IN THE VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT. 
          UH, IT'S, IT'S BEEN EXPRESSED BY THE MANU, ONE OF THE MANUFACTURERS, POLARIS AND THE O H P RENTAL COMPANIES THAT PUTTING D O T TIRES ON THE O FEESS WOULD ACTUALLY MAKE THEM LESS SAFE. 
          UM, UH, SO I DON'T KNOW. 
          I DON'T HAVE DATA ONE WAY OR THE OTHER IN THAT. 
          AND SO IT'S SOMETHING FOR COUNCIL TO CONSIDER, BUT THAT'S WHY IT'S HAS NOT BEEN INCLUDED IN 
          [01:45:01]
THIS VOLUNTARY COMMITMENT. 
          'CAUSE ALONG WITH SAFETY, THERE'S A NOISE ISSUE. 
          AND, AND, AND SO WE TALKED ABOUT MUFFLER NOISE AND I HEARD GOT THE OPPORTUNITY, UNVEILED MYSELF WITH THE OPPORTUNITY TO GO LISTEN TO THE TWO MUFFLER SOLUTIONS, THE NEW MUFFLER SOLUTION VERSUS THE OLD, AND THE CAR WASN'T, THE VEHICLE WASN'T MOVING, BUT THEY DID REV IT UP TO 4,000 R P M FOR ME. 
          AND IT, IT'S CHARACTERISTICALLY DIFFERENT. 
          AND JUST TO MAKE SURE IF IN CASE YOU HAVEN'T HAD THAT SCIENTIFIC BACKGROUND OR UNDERSTANDING, UM, THE D B A SCALE IS LOGARITHMIC. 
          AND SO ALTHOUGH SIX OR EIGHT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE A BIG NUMBER, IT'S ACTUALLY A BIG NUMBER. 
          AND I, YOU COULD HEAR IT, NOT ONLY IS IT QUIETER, BUT THE TONAL , THERE'S LESS OF THE LOW RUMBLING NOISES AND MORE MID-RANGE NOISES, WHICH I THINK GENERALLY MAKES IT A MORE, LESS, UH, LESS DISTURBING SOUND. 
          I WAS GONNA SAY MORE PLEASING, BUT I THINK IT'S LESS DISTURBING. 
          BUT IN ADDITION TO THAT, WHEN THE VEHICLES ARE RUNNING DOWN THE ROAD, WHICH I'D LIKE TO HEAR IT ACTUALLY OPERATING, RUNNING DOWN THE ROAD TO UNDERSTAND IN OPERATION THE DIFFERENCE. 
          BUT YOU HEAR TIRE, TIRE NOISE IS A BIG ISSUE TOO, POTENTIALLY AS MUCH AS THE MUFFLER NOISE. 
          AND SO, YOU KNOW, A LIGHT TRUCK COMPATIBLE TIRE RUNNING DOWN THE ROAD ON ONE OF THE O HBS WOULD I, I THINK BE SIGNIFICANTLY LESS NOISY THAN THE NAVI OFF-ROAD SAND HOLLOW PERFORMANCE TIRES. 
          AND IF, YOU KNOW, I THINK EVERYONE KIND OF AGREES THAT WE'RE NOT TRYING TO, NO ONE'S VERY INTERESTED IN HIGH PERFORMANCE ATVS IN OUR STREETS, IN OUR BACK COUNTRIES AND AROUND OUR TOWN. 
          THIS IS MORE ABOUT VISITING AND SEEING THE BEAUTIFUL SITES THAT ARE SEDONA. 
          AND SO NOT HAVING THE KNOBBY TIRES MIGHT DEGRADE PERFORMANCE ON A HIGH PERFORMANCE END OF THE SPECTRUM. 
          BUT, YOU KNOW, LIGHT TRUCK TIRES ON THE JEEPS DO ALL THE ROCK CRAWLING IN, IN AND AROUND OUR COMMUNITY, AND THEY WOULD HAVE THAT SAME KIND OF BENEFIT TO ATVS, BUT THEN THE ALSO THE BENEFIT OF LESS ON STREET NOISE. 
          SO I THINK THAT'S PUT THAT BACK OUT THERE TO THE COMMUNITY THAT TALKING ABOUT THIS AGREEMENT AND MAKING, HAVING SOME CONVERSATION ABOUT THE BENEFITS OF, OF, UH, A LIGHT TRUCK TIRE. 
          I'D LIKE TO ADDRESS THAT IF YOU DON'T MIND, KURT. 
          IS THAT OKAY? YEP. 
          THEN THAT WAS MY LAST QUESTION. 
          MAY OR SOMETHING. 
          OKAY. 
          FROM WHAT, UH, I MEAN I THINK THE, THE, THE COMMITTEE AND, UH, KURT LEARNED A LOT FROM THESE DISCUSSIONS THAT WE HAD WITH THE RENTAL COMPANIES. 
          AND IT'S EVIDENT THAT IT WOULD DEGRADE THEIR EXPERIENCE TRUE, UH, IN THE FOREST, BUT IT WOULD, IF THEY WOULD CHANGE THE TIRES, THEY WOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED SAFE BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. 
          THE TIRES HAVE TO BE, AND THEY REALLY SHOULDN'T BE ON PAVED ROADS. 
          WE UNDERSTOOD THAT THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE NOISE, BUT THE IDEA IS THERE'S REALLY NOTHING ELSE THAT THEY COULD LEGALLY PUT ON AN O H V. 
          SO IT'S UNFORTUNATE. 
          IT'S A CONCERN. 
          IT'S ABSOLUTELY A CONCERN. 
          IT'S REALLY WOULD ALSO BE A DIFFICULT CHALLENGE TO REALLY, FOR US TO ENFORCE THAT AS WELL. 
          BUT IN ADDITION TO THE NOISE, AND I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT FROM THE KNOBBY TIRES, BUT THERE'S ALSO THE ISSUE OF THE TRANSMISSIONS. 
          ALL OF THESE O HVS HAVE C V T TRANSMISSIONS. 
          THEY DON'T HAVE GEARS, THEY HAVE BELTS. 
          THOSE ALSO ADD TO THE NOISE. 
          MM-HMM. 
          , THEY'RE NOT CHANGING THEIR TRANSMISSIONS UNTIL I'M TOLD THEY GO TO ELECTRIC. 
          IF THEY EVER GO TO ELECTRIC, THEN THAT WHOLE, UH, EVERYTHING WOULD CHANGE WITH ELECTRIC, WHETHER GOOD OR BAD. 
          I'M NOT GONNA GET INTO THAT NOW, BUT THAT NOISE, I'M TOLD THEY WOULD, IT WOULD BE REDUCED SUBSTANTIALLY BECAUSE THEY WOULDN'T HAVE A C V T TRANSMISSION. 
          THEY'RE NOT GONNA CHANGE A TRANSMISSION AND I DON'T KNOW, THEY CAN'T REALLY CHANGE THE TIRES. 
          SO THIS IS ONE OF THE COMPROMISES THAT I FEEL THAT I, I DON'T LIKE TO MAKE, BUT IT'S PART OF COMPROMISE. 
          IF I MAY ADD, PLEASE BACK, MAYOR, IT WAS MY OBSERVATION WHEN I VISITED SEDONA AT T V HERE RECENTLY, THAT SOME OF THE UNITS IN THEIR LOT HAD BIG KNOBBY TIRES AND SOME DIDN'T. 
          SO I'M KIND OF CURIOUS, AND I KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, THE JEEPS ALL RUN TIRES AND WE'RE PERFECTLY FINE FOR SLICK ROCK TRACTION AND DRIVING DOWN THE ROAD AND, AND I'VE NEVER QUITE UNDERSTOOD, ARE THERE JEEP RATED TIRES? YEAH. 
          THAT ARE D O T THAT FIT ON ATVS? FROM WHAT I WAS TOLD, FROM THE RESEARCH I'VE DONE, THEY WERE NEVER TESTED ON THAT VEHICLE. 
          ON ROADS. 
          [01:50:02]
OKAY. 
          ON PAVED PUBLIC ROADS. 
          THAT'S WHERE THE DIFFERENCE IS. 
          UH, IF YOU TAKE A JEEP TIRE AND PUT IT ON A NON-NO, I WOULD GUESS. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, I'M OPEN TO ANY YEAH. 
          INPUT FROM YOU GUYS. 
          I THINK I HAVE IT RIGHT, , RIGHT. 
          IT, IT WOULDN'T BE SAFE ON OUR ROADS. 
          BUT THE, THE NOBBY TIRES AREN'T TESTED ON THE ROADS FOR SAFETY EITHER, ARE THEY? I, I DON'T KNOW, I WOULD THINK. 
          BUT IF THEY'RE ON A JEEP AND IT SAYS D O T APPROVED, THEN IT WOULD BE. 
          AND SO THAT'S MY QUESTION REALLY. 
          AREN'T THERE SIZES AVAILABLE OF THOSE TIRES THAT FIT ACCORDING TO THE CONSUMER PRODUCT? I'D LOVE TO HEAR SOME AND WE'LL HAVE THEM UP. 
          LET, LET'S HAVE OUR QUESTIONS. 
          AND I WOULD LIKE, YOU KNOW, ONE OR TWO OF THE REPRESENTATIVES TO COME UP AND THEY, I MEAN, THEY'VE BEEN REALLY HELPFUL TO US AND THEY SHOULD BE HELPFUL TO YOU AS WELL. 
          YEP. 
          SO IF YOU'RE DONE, YOU, WHILE I'M LOOKING THIS WAY, YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? NO, JESSICA, DO DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING? I JUST HAVE A A QUICK QUESTION. 
          HOW ARE WE GOING TO MONITOR COMPLIANCE WITH THE, UH, THE AGREEMENT? THAT'LL BE UP TO KURT. 
          I AM, I'M LOOKING STRAIGHT AT HIM. 
          OKAY. 
          THE, THE O H P RENTAL COMPANIES ARE PROPOSING, UH, QUARTERLY MEETINGS WITH THE CITY, UH, WHERE THEY WILL REPORT ON COMPLIANCE AND THE AGREEMENT WOULD HAVE, WILL HAVE DATES ON IT OF WHAT, WHERE THE INVENTORY WILL, WILL BE. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO, AND THEN WE WOULD ULTIMATELY, WHEN THE, THE LAST I WOULD GUESS OF THE DATES PASSES, THEN WE WOULD DO AN INSPECTION. 
          SO YOU'RE, IT'S A COMBINATION OF ATTESTATION AND, UM, AN INSPECTION TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S BEEN IN COMPLIANCE. 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT WE ALSO TRYING TO BE FAIR TO THEM, IF THEY HAVE A FAIRLY NEW VEHICLE THAT THEY KNOW IS GOING TO BE, UH, ESPECIALLY ON THE LEASES, I THINK, UH, SEDONA, UH, A T V, THEY, UH, LEASE A LOT OF THEIR VEHICLES AND THEY ROTATE THEM EVERY, I, I DUNNO, FOUR TO SIX MONTHS, WHATEVER. 
          IF THEY KNOW THEY'RE GOING TO BE, YOU HAVE ONE COMING UP IN TWO MONTHS, THEY'RE NOT GONNA PUT A MUFFLER ON THAT. 
          THEY'RE GONNA WAIT FOR THE ROTATION TO GET THE NEWER ONES. 
          I WILL HAVE THE MUFFLER ON IT. 
          SO AT SOME POINT, ARE THEY ALL GOING TO HAVE MUFFLERS? IS THE NEW ONE COMES? YES. 
          SO THAT THE PERIOD WHERE YOU HAVE SOME THAT DON'T HAVE MUFFLERS WILL GO AWAY? YES. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UM, OKAY. 
          YEAH, THIS IS A FOLLOW UP TO COUNCILLOR WILLIAMSON'S QUESTION, WHICH INSPECTION BY WHOM? WE, YOU SAID THERE'D BE AN INSPECTION INSPECTION DONE BY THE CITY. 
          WHO IN THE CITY, THE CITY WE'RE, WHAT STAFF DO WE HAVE THAT'S CAPABLE OF DOING WELL, NOT THEY'RE, I'M SURE THEY'RE ALL CAPABLE, BUT WHO IS CERTIFIED AND AUTHORIZED? I MEAN, I JUST, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? INSPECTION? I DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT. 
          UH, CARE, WE TALKED ABOUT THAT YESTERDAY. 
          WE DON'T HAVE ANY RESOURCES FOR THAT. 
          THEY DON'T HAVE ANY, IS THIS AN UN, IS THIS PERHAPS AN UNCOMPLETED PIECE OF THE DIALOGUE OR IS THIS SOMETHING THAT IT'S JUST, WE KNOW IT'S UNCOMPLETED, BUT WE'RE LETTING IT OUT THERE. 
          HANG FOR THE MOMENT UNTIL THIS POSSIBLY COMES UP FOR REVISIONS. 
          IF IT DOES, IS I, I, I JUST DON'T KNOW WHERE WE ARE WITH THAT. 
          I, BECAUSE I, I, I, I GOT IT. 
          I JUST WANNA, I THINK THAT'S A VERY GOOD POINT. 
          ESPECIALLY KAREN SAID SHE DOESN'T HAVE ANY WAY OF DOING THAT. 
          I THINK I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FROM THE COMPANIES HOW THEY WOULD PROPOSE, UM, THE INSPECTION PORTION OF IT. 
          OKAY. 
          AND LET, LET'S CONTINUE WITH QUESTIONS AND THEN WE'LL BRING THEM UP. 
          VICE MAYOR, YOU DID HAVE A QUESTION, I APOLOGIZE. 
          WELL, IT WAS, IT WAS, UH, TO A POINT THAT PETE HAD RAISED EARLIER. 
          I WANTED TO GET CLARIFICATION ABOUT THE G P S AND MAYBE DAN, WHEN HE COMES UP TO SPEAK, I'M ASSUMING YOU'RE GONNA SPEAK, COULD TALK ABOUT HIS SELF-MONITORING, HOW THEIR COMPANY, UH, AND IT WAS VERY INTERESTING AND I THINK YOU WOULD, YOU, YOU WOULD, UH, FIND IT TO BE SO, UH, OF HOW THEY, THEY DEAL WITH IT IN THEIR OWN COMPANY AND, AND THEY ACTUALLY, AND HE CAN TALK MORE ABOUT THIS OBVIOUSLY, BUT THEY ACTUALLY, THEY SEE SOMEBODY VIOLATING ANY, UH, PART OF THEIR LEASE, YOU KNOW, AGREEMENT. 
          THEY CALL THEM BACK AND TELL 'EM THEY HAVE TO COME BACK AND DON'T LET 'EM CONTINUE WITH THE, WITH THE RENTAL. 
          SO THEY DO DO TWO VARYING DEGREES COMPANY BY COMPANY. 
          AND HOPEFULLY WHEN THEY ALL HAVE G P S, THEY'LL BE ABLE TO DO THAT THEN AND EXPAND THAT. 
          MELISSA, I KNOW YOU HAVE SOME QUESTIONS. 
          I, I DO. 
          I HAD THEM WHEN YOU ACKNOWLEDGED ME 45 MINUTES AGO. 
          SO, UM, SO, SO FIRST THIS IS DIRECTED TO 
          [01:55:01]
THE CITY ATTORNEY. 
          UM, THE ORDINANCE, AS I UNDERSTOOD IT, WAS ABOUT IMPROPER EQUIPMENT FOR SAFETY WITHIN THE JURISDICTION OF SEDONA, WHICH IS THE ONLY JURISDICTION THIS BODY HAS JURISDICTION OVER, AS I UNDERSTAND IT. 
          ARE THOSE ALL CORRECT ASSUMPTIONS? YES, THAT'S CORRECT. 
          COUNSELOR DUNN. 
          SO WHEN I, WHEN I LOOK AT THE VOLUNTEER LIST, I SEE VERY FEW ITEMS THAT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH SAFETY. 
          THERE'S NOTHING IN OUR ORDINANCE, AS I RECALL, THAT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH NOISE. 
          AM I INCORRECT? UH, I MEAN THE, A LOT OF THESE DO HAVE TO DO WITH SAFETY, THE VEHICLE AND THE TURN SIGNALS, THE EDUCATION, THE SPEED LIMIT, THE G P S, UM, ALL OUR SAFETY ISSUES, UH, I FEEL LIKE, SO SPEED LIMIT. 
          DO WE HAVE A LOT, A BIG PROBLEM HERE IN SEDONA THAT YOU'RE AWARE OF WITH, UM, O HVS GOING BEYOND 35 MILES AN HOUR NOW? NO. 
          THAT THIS IS A PROBLEM? NO, NOT GENERALLY. 
          THERE'S, THERE'S EVIDENCE AND EVERYONE'S SEEN O H V SPEEDING HERE AND THERE, BUT NO, NOT A, THERE'S NOT A LARGE, UH, LIST OF CITATIONS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT I CAN POINT TO. 
          AND, UM, I WASN'T QUITE SURE HOW THE G P S IS ACTUALLY, UM, A SAFETY THING INSIDE THE JURISDICTION OF SEDONA, NOT THE FOREST, BUT INSIDE OUR OWN NON SQUARE 18 MILES. 
          UH, NO. 
          SO PRIMARILY THE, THE, THE, BECAUSE THEY ARE LIMITED TO WHERE THEY CAN DRIVE WITHIN THE CITY, IT'S HARD TO DRIVE OFF THE ROAD IN THE CITY. 
          THERE'S USUALLY BUSINESSES AND OTHER CARS IN THE WAY. 
          UM, IT WAS THAT SAFETY IS PRIMARILY FOR OUTSIDE THE CITY, SO THEY CAN'T DO DONUTS DRIVE OFF, UM, DESIGNATED O H V TRAILS. 
          OKAY. 
          AND WE, YOU KNOW, I'VE HEARD THE MAYOR JUST ASK WHETHER OR NOT WE WOULD JUST CLOSE MORGAN UNTIL SUCH TIME AS WHATEVER FROM, UM, BY THE WAY, FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO KNOW, I'M IN THE G S R C, THAT HAT IS NOT CURRENTLY ON, IN CASE YOU ARE WONDERING. 
          'CAUSE I, I SEE MANY GUYS OUT THERE I HAVE SPOKEN WITH. 
          SO THIS IS, THIS IS COUNSELOR DUNTON CURRENTLY SPEAKING. 
          SO WHEN I LOOK AT, UM, US DOING THAT, WHY MORGAN ROAD, I MEAN, I HEAR LOTS OF RESIDENTS COMPLAIN ABOUT NELLY. 
          UM, WHY, WHY WOULD WE CHOOSE JUST THE ONE? AND IF WE CHOOSE JUST THE ONE, ARE WE IN ESSENCE OPENING OURSELVES TO, UM, MORE ANNOYANCE FROM, YOU KNOW, UH, RESIDENTS WHO SAY, WELL, WELL WHAT ABOUT MY ROAD? SO WE WOULD, SHOULD WE BE CONSIDERING IF WE WERE TO CLOSE THIS, TO CLOSE IT TO MULTIPLE ROADS WHERE WE KNOW THAT RESIDENTS TODAY HAVE ISSUES WITH THE VOLUME OF TRAFFIC. 
          SO THAT PROPOSAL IS THE MAYORS AND, UM, YOU'LL HAVE TO ASK HIM, I BELIEVE ON THAT. 
          BUT WE, UH, WE KNOW THE ROADS, IT'S, IT'S MORGAN, UM, SLY, DRY CREEK SOLDIERS PASS. 
          UH, THOSE ARE THE, THE ROADS THAT THEY DRIVE ON. 
          SO, UM, YEAH, I MEAN, IT'S A FAIR QUESTION. 
          IF YOU'RE ENCLOSED ONE, THEN WHY NOT THE OTHERS? AND THAT'S, UM, UP TO COUNCIL. 
          OKAY. 
          AND SO JUST, JUST ONE LAST SORT OF GENERAL QUESTION. 
          UM, I KNOW THIS GOES BACK TO YOU, MR. MAYOR, I MEAN, YOU AND, AND COUNSELOR FURMAN JUST HAD A, AN INTERESTING CONVERSATION ON TIRES. 
          MY UNDERSTANDING FROM THE INFORMATION THAT WAS PRESENTED, UM, AS UH, SUPPORTIVE OF THE ORDINANCE INSIDE OF THE PACKET INDICATES THAT THE TIRES THAT ARE CURRENTLY THERE ARE NOT AT ALL TESTED ON PAVED ROADS. 
          AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN THE R OF DOCUMENTATION, SO FORTH AND SO ON. 
          SO, UM, TO SAY THAT THOSE TIRES ARE SAFER ON PAVED ROADS THAN PUTTING LIKE TRUCK TIRES ON THERE, SEEMS LIKE IT'S NOT QUITE A RIGHT STATEMENT BECAUSE THESE TIRES THEMSELVES ARE ALSO NOT, AM I, AM I CORRECT IN UNDERSTANDING WHAT I'M READING? OH, YOU ARE CORRECT. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, SO THOSE ARE MY QUESTIONS AND I DEFER EVERYTHING ELSE TO COMMENTS. 
          THANK YOU, BRIAN. 
          I HAVE NO QUESTIONS, MAYOR, JUST COMMENTS. 
          OKAY. 
          SO IF WE CAN HAVE ONE OR TWO OR ALL FOUR OF THE REPRESENTATIVES COME UP AT THE, AT THE PODIUM, AND, UH, ACTUALLY, MR. MAYOR, I ASK ONE MORE QUESTION. 
          YEAH, WELL, YES. 
          AS THEY'RE, AS THEY'RE COMING FORWARD. 
          YEAH, SURE. 
          UM, IF THIS IS A VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT AND THEY'VE, UH, TALKED ABOUT INSPECTIONS AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS, IS THERE, IT SEEMS LIKE THERE'S NO PENALTY FOR NOT MEETING DATES AND FOR NOT MEETING THE INSPECTIONS. 
          IS THAT, IS THAT ACCURATE? CORRECT. 
          UH, THE, THE PENALTY COULD BE THAT THE COUNCIL, UH, ONE OR MORE COUNSELORS DECIDE TO BRING BACK UP THE IMPROPER MOTOR VEHICLE ORDINANCE IF THE 
          [02:00:01]
O FEES ARE CONTINUING TO BE, UH, UNSAFE FOR NOT MEETING THESE COMMITMENTS. 
          AND THIS ONLY APPLIES TO THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE SIGNED THIS VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT. 
          SO IF DAN DECIDES HE DOESN'T WANT HIS BUSINESS ANYMORE AND HE SELLS IT TO, YOU KNOW, CRAIG, UM, DOES CRAIG HAVE TO ABIDE BY THIS VOLUNTARY BECAUSE HE DIDN'T SIGN IT? CORRECT. 
          IT ONLY APPLIES TO THE CURRENT OWNERS AND THOSE WHO HAVE SENT THIS LETTER, AND IT ONLY APPLIES TO RENTAL VEHICLES FROM THESE, AS I UNDERSTOOD WHAT YOU SAID, NOT TO ANYONE OUTSIDE, NOR TO ANY PRIVATE PEOPLE WHO BRING THEIR VEHICLES INTO THE CITY. 
          CORRECT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THAT'S CORRECT. 
          SO, UH, DAN AND JIMMY, THANKS FOR COMING. 
          UH, YOU HEARD SOME OF THE COMMENTS, UH, AND QUESTIONS FROM THE COUNCIL SO FAR. 
          UH, AND THEN WE DO HAVE TO, I WANT TO GO TO THE, UH, PUBLIC AS WELL, BUT I WANTED TO GET THESE QUESTIONS ANSWERED AND YOU CAN ALWAYS COME BACK UP, UH, SHOULD THERE BE A QUESTION THAT YOU CAN ADDRESS, BUT THERE WERE QUESTIONS ABOUT, UH, THE MUFFLERS AND HOW WE WILL KNOW THAT THEY'RE CHANGED AND HOW, UH, WE, WE WILL KNOW, UH, THAT, YOU KNOW, EVERYTHING'S BEEN CYCLED THROUGH. 
          AND THEN I THINK COUNCILOR WILLIAMSON HAD A COUPLE QUESTIONS AS WELL, AND, AND, AND FURMAN, SO DO MUFFLERS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          SO, UH, AS FAR AS THE MUFFLERS ARE CONCERNED, IT SOUNDS LIKE THE QUESTION IS MAYBE MORE, UM, OF, OF COMPLIANCE. 
          IS THAT, IS THAT CORRECT? IS THAT, UM, OF HOW WE'LL MONITOR THAT? UM, AND SO I THINK AS WE AGREED OR, OR, YOU KNOW, UM, WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT, UH, POTENTIALLY QUARTERLY MEETINGS, UH, WITH THE CITY, WHICH WE'D LIKE TO FOLLOW UP ANYWAY IN, IN ADDITION TO, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE AS FAR AS, UM, YOU KNOW, OUR COMMITMENTS TO THE CITY AND, AND, AND TRYING TO APPEASE EVERYONE, YOU KNOW, AS BEST AS POSSIBLE, UM, IS, IS JUST TRYING TO COME UP WITH MORE IDEAS QUARTERLY IN ADDITION TO WHAT WE'RE DOING. 
          BUT TO SPEAK DIRECTLY TO THE QUESTION, UM, YEAH, I MEAN, WOULD WE BE OPEN FOR, YOU KNOW, SOMEBODY FROM THE CITY TO COME, YOU KNOW, CHECK ON THOSE MUFFLERS, I SUPPOSE IF, IF THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT THEY WANTED TO DO? I THINK, UH, TO BE QUITE HONEST WITH YOU, IT, IT WOULD BE A TRUST FACTOR, UM, BETWEEN EACH ONE OF OUR COMPANIES AND, AND, YOU KNOW, IN THE CITY AND, AND WHO WE'VE BEEN DEALING WITH, UH, WITH, WITH THE COUNCIL PEOPLE. 
          UM, JUST AS IT IS, UH, A TRUST ON, ON, ON OUR PART FROM THE CITY TO, YOU KNOW, TABLE THE ORDINANCE. 
          UM, SO I, I THINK THAT'S KIND OF AN AGREEMENT THAT WE'VE HAD IN, IN DISCUSSIONS AND MEETINGS THAT WE'VE BEEN INTO. 
          UM, SO YEAH, IT IS, IT IS A LOT OF TRUST, I BELIEVE. 
          UM, BUT WE WANT TO MAKE THOSE COMMITMENTS REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THIS ORDINANCE IS ON THE TABLE OR NOT. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, THIS IS SOMETHING THE FUTURE CITY OF SEDONA, UM, DESERVES, YOU KNOW, WITH US, WITH OUR COMPANIES, WITH OUR BUSINESSES, UH, TO CONTINUE TO IMPROVE, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE CAN DO TO, YOU KNOW, TO HELP, UM, YOU KNOW, ANY COMPLAINTS OR WHATNOT. 
          JESSICA, MY QUESTION, TRUST. 
          TRUST, OKAY, TRUST. 
          BUT FOR ALL OF OUR AGREEMENTS WE HAVE WITH PEOPLE, WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO VERIFY THAT THEY ARE IN FACT BEING, BEING, BEING COMPLIED WITH. 
          UM, AND WE WERE TALKING ABOUT INSPECTIONS NOT EVERY DAY, BUT, UH, THE CITY MANAGERS AGREED OR SAID THAT THE CITY DOES NOT HAVE A WAY TO, TO INSPECT THOSE. 
          WE DON'T HAVE PEOPLE WHO ARE QUALIFIED TO DO THAT. 
          UM, FROM WHAT I HEARD, YOU'RE SAYING WE SHOULD JUST TRUST YOU, WHICH IS NICE, BUT ASSUMING THAT WE WANTED TO DO MORE THAN THAT, THAT WE WANTED INSPECTIONS AT SOME INTERVAL OR SORT, HOW WOULD YOU RECOMMEND, WHO WOULD YOU RECOMMEND? WHAT ENTITY COULD WE RELY UPON TO, TO DO THAT INSPECTION FOR US? FOR COMPLIANCE WITH OUR AGREEMENT? YEAH. 
          DEAL, YOU KNOW, SECOND RECEIPT. 
          YEAH. 
          WE COULD RE YOU KNOW, WE COULD RELY ON THE MANUFACTURER TO SHOW, UM, WHAT MUELLERS WE HAD PURCHASED, YOU KNOW, TO SHOW, UH, AS A PERCENTAGE OF OUR VEHICLES. 
          UM, I MEAN IT'S, IT'S TO BE, TO BE HONEST, IT'S QUITE EASY TO TELL THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE, THE TWO MODELS, MODELS OF THE EXHAUST, UM, TO BE FAIR. 
          UM, BUT YEAH, WE WOULD BE OPEN, BUT THAT WOULD REQUIRE A PERSON THAT WOULD REQUIRE SOMEONE TO DO THAT. 
          AND SO I'M ASKING WHAT THE MOST EFFICIENT WAY OR A RELIABLE WAY FOR US TO, TO MUCH AS WE TOTALLY TRUST YOU TO VERIFY. 
          UM, I MEAN DAN HAS A GOOD IDEA, PROOF OF, YOU KNOW, PHOTOS POTENTIALLY. 
          UM, 
          [02:05:02]
YEAH, I MEAN THIS IS AN UNRESOLVED RN. 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          THIS HAS I GUESS TO BE SOMETHING THAT, I'D HAVE TO LOOK TO KAREN. 
          IT, MAYBE ANDY AND KURT, IF THEY COULD COME UP WITH ANY IDEAS ABOUT HOW THAT MIGHT BE DONE. 
          SINCE YOU REALLY DON'T HAVE YOU, THERE'S NOT AN EASY FIX FOR THIS. 
          YEAH. 
          IF YOU'RE ASKING FOR SELF-REGULATION, I THINK IT WOULD JUST BE A MATTER OF, YOU KNOW, HOW MANY EXHAUSTS WE'VE PURCHASED, HOW MANY VEHICLES WE CURRENTLY OWN, RIGHT? UM, YOU KNOW, THINGS OF THAT NATURE AND NO, I UNDERSTAND. 
          SO I THINK WE HAVE TO, I THINK KATHY'S RIGHT. 
          WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT, GIVEN YOUR ANSWER, WHAT WE WOULD WANT TO DO FOR COMPLIANCE AND THEN GET YOU TO AGREE TO IT. 
          OKAY. 
          PETE, QUESTIONS? YEAH, THAT. 
          THANK YOU, JIMMY. 
          LET'S, DAN, THANK YOU. 
          'CAUSE UH, YOU, YOU AND I ALSO SPENT SOME TIME TOGETHER TALKING AND I APPRECIATE THAT, UH, VICE MAYOR BROUGHT UP THE G P S. 
          SO LET'S START THERE THAT THE G P S AND, AND DAN, I SAW THAT G P S FROM YOUR DESK AND IT WAS AMAZING THAT WHAT YOU WERE ABLE TO SEE, AND I'M, I'LL GIVE YOU THE FLOOR FIRST ABOUT WHAT YOU ENVISION OF DOING MORE, PERHAPS, WHAT IS THIS? A VOLUNTEER AGREEMENT, UH, IMPLY WELL I'M SORRY, I GET IN THERE. 
          SO AS FAR AS THE G P S SYSTEMS THAT WE HAVE, UM, THEY'RE PRIMARILY FOR TRACKING THE VEHICLE, BUT WE'VE ACTUALLY TAKEN THE NEXT STEP APPROACH THAT IF THERE'S A RAPID BRAKING OR THERE'S A RAPID ACCELERATION, IT ACTUALLY SENDS US A COMPANY EMAIL INSTANTLY. 
          SO IF, FOR INSTANCE, SOMEBODY'S AT THE FRONT DESK, THEY WOULD SEE THAT THIS VEHICLE IS NOW ACTING ERRATICALLY, UH, THAT WAY THEY WOULD TAKE A CLOSER LOOK AND THEY CAN REPLAY THE WHOLE ROUTE IN REAL TIME OF THE VEHICLE. 
          AND THEN WE CAN, LIKE WE WERE, THE MAYOR TALKED ABOUT, WE CAN REACH OUT TO THE CUSTOMER RIGHT THEN AND THERE AND FIND OUT IF, YOU KNOW SOMETHING'S WRONG WITH THE CAR. 
          IF THEY'RE BEHAVING BADLY, THEN WE CAN TAKE CARE OF IT RIGHT AWAY. 
          UM, THE OTHER PROBLEM IS, IS IT'S NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT. 
          I MEAN, SOMEBODY WOULD HAVE TO BE THERE AND CHECK THAT EMAIL OR THAT NOTIFICATION AND THEN, YOU KNOW, TAKE THE STEPS NECESSARY. 
          UM, THAT'S THE PROCESS THAT WE'RE WORKING ON CURRENTLY. 
          AND DO YOU GET THOSE NOTIFICATIONS CURRENTLY WHEN THERE'S A  SPEED? DO YOU HAVE A SPEED LIMIT SET IN THERE? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE CONTEMPLATING IN THE FUTURE? IF WE ALL AGREE THAT 35 IS THE RIGHT NUMBER, THAT THAT'S WHAT YOU'LL PROGRAM IN YOUR SYSTEM AND YOU'LL GET SOME NUMBER BACK? UH, YEAH. 
          I CAN PROGRAM ANY OF THE NOTIFICATIONS FOR ANYTHING I WANT. 
          THERE'S, THERE'S LITERALLY PROBABLY 50 OR A HUNDRED DIFFERENT WAYS TO NOTIFICATIONS. 
          UM, I'M NOT SURE IF THERE'S A WAY TO SET THE ACTUAL SPEED. 
          THERE'S CATEGORIES OF THE SPEED. 
          MM-HMM. 
          UM, BUT JUST TO GO BACK TO THAT OTHER QUESTION, YOU HAD THE SPEED LIMIT THAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT IN OUR COMMITMENT LETTER IS ACTUALLY A GOVERNOR SYSTEM. 
          SO IT DOESN'T MATTER IF YOU ARE IN THE CITY LIMITS IN THE FOREST, THERE'S, THERE'S, IT'S A SPEED LIMITATION OF THE VEHICLE, NOT WHERE IT'S AT. 
          SO, SO THAT THEN BROACHES THIS QUESTION THAT I ASKED KURT ABOUT WHETHER YOU GUYS ARE CONTEMPLATING DOING ANY PRIVATE SPEED ENFORCEMENT THROUGH YOUR CONTRACT WITH YOUR CUSTOMERS. 
          'CAUSE I, I'VE SEEN JIMMY, AND IT'S IN YOUR AGREEMENT THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE ASKING YOUR CUSTOMERS TO STAY AT 15 ON TRAILS AND, AND WHETHER THAT'S WHAT PERHAPS YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT GETTING TO AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE, THAT YOU CAN NOW DO THIS MORE SPEED ENFORCEMENT VIA YOUR CONTRACT VIA THE G P SS SYSTEM. 
          YOU KNOW, YOU TALK ABOUT GETTING THOSE EMAILS, BUT DAN, CLEARLY, WHEN YOUR CUSTOMER CHECKS OUT, THAT'S AN OPPORTUNITY FOR YOU TO GO, HEY, OKAY, THANKS FOR COMING BACK. 
          YOU'RE ON TIME. 
          LET ME JUST CHECK THE EMAIL BOX AND SEE IF YOU'VE HAD ANY VIOLATIONS OVER TIME. 
          AND IS THAT THE KIND OF THINGS THAT YOU'RE EITHER ARE DOING NOW OR YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT DOING? OR ARE YOU JUST REALLY GONNA RELY ON THE GOVERNOR ONLY? WELL, UH, WITH THE GOVERNOR, IT WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO GO OVER 35. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO IF IT WAS 35 IN A 25 ZONE, THEN I COULD CHECK THAT VIA THE G P S. 
          TRUE. 
          UM, NOW THERE ARE LIMITATIONS TO THE PENALTIES AND WE'RE, WE'RE DEFINITELY CHECKING ON THOSE WITH OUR ATTORNEY AS WELL, UM, AS TO WHAT KIND OF PENALTIES AND HOW THEY'RE ENFORCED. 
          UM, WE DO HAVE CERTAIN, CERTAIN PENALTIES FOR CERTAIN DIFFERENT THINGS YOU DO. 
          AND ONE OF 'EM IS FOR CERTAIN LOCATIONS THAT WE DON'T ALLOW THE VEHICLES TO GO TO. 
          AND IF THEY GO THERE, THEN IT'S CLEARLY STATED IN THE CONTRACT, YOU WILL BE PENALIZED FINANCIALLY FOR THAT. 
          YEP. 
          AND HOW OFTEN WOULD YOU SAY CURRENTLY THAT'S AN ISSUE THAT COMES UP AND YOU ASSESS THOSE PENALTIES? UM, IT'S VERY INFREQUENT AND MAINLY BECAUSE OF THE EDUCATION PROCESS. 
          WHEN A CLIENT IS CHECKING THE VEHICLE OUT, IT'S CLEARLY STATED, THEY, THEY ACKNOWLEDGE IT WITH 
          [02:10:01]
A SIGNATURE OR INITIAL ABOUT THOSE TYPE OF PENALTIES. 
          AND THEN DAN, YOU KNOW, YOUR AGREEMENT IS, CALLS OUT THAT 15 NUMBER THAT I BROUGHT UP. 
          AND SO WE'VE TALKED ABOUT 35, WHICH MAY BE APPROPRIATE ON ROADS, BUT YOU HAVE STATED IN THE PAST THAT 15 ON SOME OF THE TRAILS MIGHT BE MORE APPROPRIATE. 
          WHAT, WHAT KIND OF ENFORCEMENT ACTION ARE YOU GUYS THINKING ABOUT MOVING TO? WELL, A LOT OF TIMES, I'M SORRY, I MEANT JIMMY, JIMMY, I SAID DAN, HOW DO YOU GET HIM CONFUSED LOOKING? SO CURRENTLY WITH THE, WITH THE 35 MILE PER HOUR, UM, SPEED LIMITING THAT'S, THAT'S SET UP, UM, THROUGH THE MANUFACTURER, IT'S, IT'S NOT AS SIMPLE AS SETTING A SPEED, 38 MILES AN HOUR, 40 MILES AN HOUR, 25 MILES AN HOUR. 
          IT'S, IT'S NOT JUST A MATTER OF, OF OF THE SPEEDOMETER ITSELF. 
          IT, IT'S, IT'S AN ENTIRETY OF THE UNIT, UH, TO STILL MAKE IT SAFE AND, AND OPERATE CORRECTLY. 
          SO, UM, YEAH, AS FAR AS, AS FAR AS DIFFERENT SPEEDS ON, ON TRAILS, I MEAN THAT'S SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, WE OBVIOUSLY WE HAVE TO MONITOR IN THE FUTURE. 
          UM, AS WITH DAN, WITH THESE G P S SYSTEMS CONTINUE TO GET, YOU KNOW, MORE TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED. 
          YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT GEOFENCING, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A MULTITUDE OF OPPORTUNITIES, UM, ESPECIALLY COMING ALONG WITH, UH, THE ELECTRIC VEHICLES THAT WOULD ALLOW US TO POTENTIALLY HAVE DIFFERENT SPEED LIMITS IN DIFFERENT ZONES. 
          YOU KNOW, WHETHER IT BE THE CITY OR THE FOREST, UM, YOU KNOW, OR CERTAIN AREAS OF THE CITY, UM, WHICH WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY AMAZING. 
          SO. 
          YEP. 
          SO THAT'S AN AREA WHERE YOU GUYS, AS TECHNOLOGY DEVELOPS, YOU'RE WILLING TO CONSIDER WAYS TO IMPLEMENT SPEED, OTHER SPEED LIMITS WITH YOUR CUSTOMER BASE AND ABSOLUTELY. 
          AND THEN PERHAPS DO SOME PRIVATE ENFORCEMENT THROUGH YOUR CONTRACT. 
          CORRECT. 
          YEP. 
          AND LET'S TURN TO THE TIRES. 
          JIMMY, IN YOUR LOT I'VE SEEN THE VEHICLES AND THEY, THERE'S A RADICALLY DIFFERENT MIX OF, OF TIRES THAT I SEE ON, ON YOUR VEHICLE. 
          SO TELL US, TELL US WHAT YOU'RE CURRENTLY THINKING ABOUT TIRES. 
          SO WE WE'RE, WE'RE CONSTANTLY TRYING, YOU KNOW, DIFFERENT TIRES TO SEE WHICH ONES HOLD UP WELL. 
          UM, THERE'S NEVER REALLY BEEN AN ISSUE OF SAFETY. 
          WE DON'T HAVE BLOWOUTS. 
          IT'S, IT'S, IT'S NOT AN ISSUE THERE. 
          I KNOW EVERYONE GETS CONFUSED WHEN THEY TALK ABOUT D O T TIRES AND, AND WHATNOT. 
          THE ISSUE WITH THE D O T TIRES IS THAT THE WAY THAT THESE VEHICLES ARE REGISTERED, UM, THE STATE AND THE REGISTRATION DOES NOT ALLOW THEM TO HAVE D O T TIRES ON THEM BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT REGISTERED AS A VEHICLE, AS A, AS A VEHICLE, AS A CAR OR TRUCK. 
          AND SO, UM, IN ORDER FOR THE, THE O HBS TO HAVE THAT, BY DEFINITION, THEY HAVE TO BE EQUIPPED WITH NON-HIGH TIRES. 
          MM-HMM. 
          UM, SO THAT'S WHERE THAT COMES FROM. 
          IT'S, IT'S NOT THAT WE'VE EVER SPECIFICALLY SAID THAT D O TIRES ARE NOT SAFE, UM, YOU KNOW, OR, OR THAT THE OFF HIGHWAY TIRES ARE NOT SAFE. 
          IT'S, IT'S NEVER, EVER BEEN A SAFETY ISSUE. 
          AND, AND I KNOW, UM, THAT, THAT THE ISSUE MORE WHERE IT'S COMING FROM IS, IS NOISE. 
          AND SO, UM, CERTAINLY WE CAN LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, WHICH TIRES, YOU KNOW, STILL, STILL OFFER A LEVEL OF, OF OFF-ROAD SAFETY BECAUSE THAT'S, THE MAJORITY OF OUR VEHICLES ARE TRAVELING OFF-ROAD. 
          AND SO THAT'S WHERE WE WANT, YOU KNOW, OUR CUSTOMERS TO BE SAFE. 
          YEAH. 
          UM, AND THERE ARE TIRES THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, SAFER ON, YOU KNOW, LOOSE GRAVELLY SURFACES, YOU KNOW, AS COMPARED TO, YOU KNOW, PAVEMENT. 
          AND, UM, YOU KNOW, ALTHOUGH THE MANUFACTURER DOESN'T SPECIFICALLY RECOMMEND THEM, OBVIOUSLY BEING ON THE ROAD, UM, IT DOES ALLOW PROVISIONS TO BE, TO BE DRIVEN ON ROAD AND, AND IT EXPLAINS IN THE, IN THE OWNER'S MANUAL AND HOW TO DO THAT. 
          AND SO THAT'S, YOU KNOW, IN OUR, IN OUR OFFERING OF, YOU KNOW, COMMITMENTS OF WHAT WE WANNA DO, UH, EXPLAINING TO THE CUSTOMER AND, AND GIVING A HIGHER LEVEL OF EDUCATION AS FAR AS HOW TO DO THAT. 
          BUT, BUT YEAH, AS FAR AS THE ACTUAL D O T CERTIFICATION, THAT'S SPECIFICALLY WHY THEY DON'T COME WITH THEM BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT TESTED AS SUCH, SO THEY DON'T COME WITH 'EM. 
          BUT IT IS SOMETHING THAT COULD BE, IS IT SOMETHING THAT COULD BE SWAPPED OUT? SO LET ME ASK A A A DIFFERENT WAY. 
          IN MY OBSERVATION, IN YOUR LOT, CERTAINLY THERE'S TIRES THERE THAT LOOK LIKE SAND HOLLOW SUPER KNOBBY GO RIP UP THE DESERT TIRES AND YOU KNOW, I GET THAT. 
          I DON'T THINK THAT'S REALLY WHAT EVEN YOU WANT YOUR CUSTOMERS TO BE DOING. 
          CORRECT. 
          AND A LOT OF THE, A LOT OF THE BRAND NEW VEHICLES THAT COME THAT, THAT SHIP FROM POLARIS HAVE THOSE, YOU KNOW YEAH. 
          MORE, MORE NOBBY MORE AGGRESSIVE TIRES THAN YOU. 
          AND SO THE OTHER TIRES THAT I SAW IN THE VEHICLES REPLACED THAT TO AT SOME POINT. 
          CORRECT. 
          AND ARE THOSE NON D O T OFF? CORRECT. 
          YEAH. 
          THEY USED, THEY USED TO MAKE AN OFFERING. 
          THEY LOOK JUST LIKE THE SAME TIRES I PUT ON MY JEEP IN THE PAST. 
          YEAH, YEAH. 
          AND THO AND THOSE WOULD'VE BEEN D O T TIRES, BUT RIGHT. 
          YOUR, THOSE TIRES THAT I SAW IN YOUR LOTS WEREN'T D O T TIRES. 
          THE D O T LABELING IS INHERENTLY A, A TESTING RIGHT. 
          THAT THE, THE MANUFACTURER DOES ON VEHICLES THAT ARE D O T APPROVED. 
          AND SO THAT'S WHY THEY DON'T NECESSARILY, YOU KNOW, THE, THE O H G COMPANIES DON'T, DON'T MAKE THEM FOR THAT, BUT, BUT I, I THINK WHAT YOU'RE GETTING AT IS COULD WE PUT TIRES THAT ARE LESS AGGRESSIVE ON OUR VEHICLES THAT POTENTIALLY WOULD BE LESS NOISY? UM, AND AS LONG AS THEY, YOU KNOW, 
          [02:15:01]
STILL PROVIDE US WITH A LEVEL OF SAFETY FOR OUR CUSTOMERS OFFROAD AND ON ROAD, OBVIOUSLY. 
          RIGHT. 
          UM, THEN YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. 
          THAT'S NOTHING WOULD PREVENT THAT IN THE LAW OR THE REGISTRATION. 
          CORRECT. 
          CORRECT. 
          NOT AT ALL. 
          AS, AS YOU SEE IT. 
          DAN, HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT AS WELL, USING A DIF DIFFERENT TIRE THAT WOULDN'T NECESSARILY GIVE THAT HIGH SAND HOLLOW HIGH END  PERFORMANCE, BUT YOU KNOW, WOULD BE LESS QUIET OR MORE QUIET ON THE ROADS AND STILL GIVE YOU THE CUSTOMERS THE ADEQUATE JEEP SLICK ROCK TRACTION? AS A MATTER OF FACT, I THINK THEY'RE BETTER FOR THE SLICK ROCK TRACTION THAN THE NAVI ONES. 
          RIGHT. 
          YOU KNOW, I'M NOT AGAINST ANYTHING, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF FACTORS, UM, A LOT OF TIMES THAT, UH, A MORE TREAD DENSE PATTERNS CAN BE A HEAVIER TIRE. 
          UH, THEREFORE DEPEND, THESE, THESE VEHICLES ARE NOT THAT HEAVY. 
          SO WHEN YOU CHANGE JUST A LITTLE BIT OF WEIGHT, IT HAS TO BE TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION. 
          UM, SO THERE'S A LOT OF FACTORS AND THAT'S JUST, I'M JUST KIND OF GIVING THAT ONE EXAMPLE, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT WAYS AND WE'VE, WE'VE TRIED DIFFERENT TIRES AND SO THERE ARE LESS AGGRESSIVE TIRES THAT SEEM TO WORK WELL. 
          NOW, IS IT JUST YOUR STANDARD TIRE THAT YOU CAN GO TO DISCOUNT AND GET AND PUT ON YOUR TOYOTA TACOMA? WELL, MAYBE THAT'S NOT THE PERFECT TIRE, BUT I BET THERE'S ONE IN BETWEEN THAT WILL WORK AND, AND WE'VE BEEN EXPERIMENTING WITH. 
          AND IS IT TRUE THAT THESE LESS AGGRESSIVE TIRES WOULD BE QUIETER ON ROAD THAN THE AGGRESSIVE TIRES? DO YOU THAT IT ALL DEPENDS ON THE TIRE. 
          I MEAN, TRUTHFULLY, THE DIFFERENT TIRE MANUFACTURERS DO, I BELIEVE, USE DIFFERENT TYPES OF RUBBER. 
          AND, AND A LOT OF TIMES THE, THE SOFTNESS OR THE HARDNESS OF THE RUBBER, THAT'S WHERE YOU GET MORE OF THE SOUND, NOT NECESSARILY THE TREAD PATTERN. 
          SO YOU'RE SAYING THESE ENGINEERS ARE WILEY, THEY'RE CRAZY . 
          THAT'S ALL. 
          MARY, THANK YOU MUCH. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU FOR THAT. 
          NO QUESTIONS AT ALL. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT THEN WHY DON'T YOU HAVE A SEAT. 
          WE'LL BRING YOU BACK UP IF THERE'S ANY, ANY QUESTIONS FROM THE PUBLIC, AND WE'LL OPEN THE PUBLIC FORUM. 
          AND, UH, THE FIRST CARD IS FROM, UH, CARL JACKSON, FOLLOWED UP BY GUY LAUNION. 
          HELLO, MY NAME'S CARL JACKSON. 
          I LIVE IN, UH, BROKEN ARROW, SEDONA. 
          FIRST I WANT TO THANK THE MAYOR, VICE MAYOR COUNCILOR DUNN. 
          I KNOW YOU'RE HEAVILY INVOLVED IN THIS ISSUE AS WELL, UH, FOR TRYING TO DO YOUR BEST TO UPHOLD YOUR OATH TO MAINTAIN SAFETY FOR EVERYONE IN SEDONA. 
          AND I KNOW THIS O H V SAFETY ISSUE IS VERY COMPLICATED. 
          I KNOW THE CITY COUNCIL HAS BEEN WORKING VERY HARD TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM, BUT THERE ARE IMPACTS THAT MIGHT ARISE. 
          I DO SUPPORT THE ORDINANCE. 
          I THINK THAT'S THE PERFECT WAY TO GET THE SAFETY YOU'RE TRYING TO ACHIEVE. 
          BUT I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'S A NEED TO CONSIDER ALTERNATIVES. 
          AND SO I DO WANT TO APPLAUD YOU AND THE O H B RENTAL COMPANIES FOR THEIR VOLUNTARY, UH, SAFETY MEASURES, THE SPEED GOVERNORS, THE MUFFLERS, THE DIRECTIONAL SIGNALS, INCREASED CONSUMER SAFETY EDUCATION, ALL THOSE ARE IMPORTANT, BUT NONE OF THOSE ARE A DIRECT SUBSTITUTE FOR THE ORDINANCE, OBVIOUSLY. 
          SO THE QUESTION BECOMES, IS THERE A PACKAGE OF ALTERNATIVE SOLUTIONS THAT AS A PACKAGE WHILE NOT PERFECT, COULD BE SOMEWHAT COMPARABLE TO THE O H V SAFETY ORDINANCE? IN MY OPINION, ONE OF THE KEY FEATURES THAT NEEDS TO BE IN ANY ALTERNATIVE PACKAGE HAS TO BE A REQUIREMENT, A SAFETY REQUIREMENT TO REDUCE AND CONTROL O H V VOLUME ON SEDONA PUBLIC ROADS. 
          UNLESS WE GET THE VOLUME UNDER CONTROL, WE'RE NEVER GOING TO FULLY CONTROL O H V SAFETY. 
          A PROPOSED ORDINANCE GETS YOU EXACTLY THAT CONTROL. 
          IT WOULD BE ZERO EXCEPT FOR TRAILING. 
          THE ONLY OTHER WAY I CAN THINK OF TO REDUCE MATERIALLY REDUCE VOLUME TO GET IT UNDER CONTROL, WOULD BE A SEDONA WIDE PERMITTING SYSTEM. 
          AND I THINK THERE'S SOME WILLINGNESS, OBVIOUSLY, BY THE RENTAL COMPANIES TO SUPPORT SUCH A PERMIT SYSTEM. 
          WHAT THOSE LEVELS LOOK LIKE HASN'T BEEN DECIDED. 
          BUT THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM IS, IT REQUIRES THE FOREST SERVICE AND WHATEVER GETS IMP UH, IMPLEMENTED COULD TAKE TWO YEARS. 
          AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THOSE, UH, LIMITS MIGHT BE. 
          SO I SUPPORT, UH, AS A RESIDENT CONTINUING THE DIALOGUE, BUT I DO THINK A PERMITTING SYSTEM WITH SIGNIFICANT REDUCTIONS TO MANAGE VOLUME IS THE END. 
          HAVING THE FOREST SERVICE PROVIDE MILESTONES AND STRONG COMMITMENTS TO SUPPORT A PERMIT SYSTEM HAVE TO BE IN PLACE. 
          OTHERWISE, I, I THINK THE CITY SHOULD, SHOULD SUPPORT AND, AND VOTE ON THE ORDINANCE. 
          SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          APPRECIATE IT. 
          CARL, BEFORE YOU GET SIT DOWN, WE CAN'T ASK QUESTIONS OF YOU BECAUSE OF, THIS IS A TOPIC WE'RE DISCUSSING, BUT YOU ARE, YOU SIT ON THE, UH, THE GSRC YES. 
          AND YOU ARE LOOKING AT PERMITTING SYSTEMS. YES. 
          AND THIS VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT FROM THE O H E COMPANIES, THEY ARE SUPPORTING, UH, A PERMITTING 
          [02:20:01]
SYSTEM. 
          CAN YOU JUST, IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE SURE. 
          I, NOT A REPRESENTATIVE, I'M, I'M JUST A MEMBER OF THE S JUST A MEMBER C I'M NOT TALKING ON THEIR BEHALF. 
          BUT YES, WE HAD AN ALL DAY SESSION ON FRIDAY, AND WHERE WE REALLY DID FOR THE FIRST TIME, IN MY OPINION, GET DOWN TO SPECIFIC STRATEGIES, LIKE WHAT STRATEGIES COULD WE REALLY IMPLEMENT TO ACTUALLY ACHIEVE AND SOLVE O O H V ISSUES. 
          UM, THE STRATEGIES THAT CAME TO THE TOP WERE A PERMITTING SYSTEM WAS ONE OF THE STRATEGIES THAT CAME TO THE TOP. 
          UM, HOW THAT PERMITTING SYSTEM WORKS, HOW IT'S IMPLEMENTED IN DIFFERENT AREAS, THE TIMING FOR THAT IMPLEMENTATION, AND, YOU KNOW, FULL CONSENSUS AND, BUT THOSE PERMIT LEVELS WOULD BE STILL ON THE TABLE, BUT IT WAS DEFINITELY FLOATED TO THE TOP. 
          AND IT WAS DEFINITELY SOMETHING THAT WAS DISCUSSED AS WAS TRYING TO MANAGE VOLUMES AND MAYBE CONNECT ROUTES, MAYBE HAVE SOME EXTRA O H V ROUTES, UM, AS WELL AS, UM, SPEED LIMITS THOSE WERE TALKED ABOUT. 
          SO THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME I REALLY FELT ENCOURAGED THAT THE G S R C WAS TRYING TO COME TO SOME STRATEGIES TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM. 
          AND I, AND, AND PERMITTING WAS ONE OF THE TOP STRATEGIES. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH, CARL. 
          SURE. 
          OKAY. 
          GUY LAUNION IS FOLLOWED BY CRAIG SWANSON. 
          THANK YOU MR. MAYOR, CITY COUNCIL STAFF AND MR. CITY ATTORNEY WHO'S DONE A GOOD JOB. 
          UH, SO I'VE BEEN A, AN ADVOCATE OF VOLUNTARY AGREEMENTS BEFORE THE ORDINANCE, UH, EVEN CAME. 
          AND, UH, I, I SUPPORT, YOU KNOW, AN ATTEMPT, UH, TO NEGOTIATE. 
          SO, SO THAT'S GOOD. 
          I DID, I DO FIND THERE, THERE ARE A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT ARE, THAT ARE LEFT OUT THAT'S OUR RESIDENCE, YOU KNOW, IS THAT, WHAT'S THE FAIRNESS PRINCIPLE? AND PEOPLE THAT TRAILER IN VEHICLES ALSO. 
          SO THOSE ARE TWO OTHER SOURCES THAT PROBABLY NEED TO CON, UH, CONSIDER. 
          I, I FIND A LOT OF WIGGLE ROOM IN FOUR. 
          WE COMMIT TO INSTALLING QUIET MUFFLERS ON ALL HVS IN OUR FLEAS AS SOON AS THEY BECOME AVAILABLE BY THE MANUFACTURER. 
          THIRD PARTY, UM, UH, MUFFLERS HAVE BEEN AVAILABLE THE WHOLE TIME WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THIS AND AT A REASONABLE PLACE. 
          I CITED THOSE BEFORE HERE AND I WOULD DIG IT UP AGAIN. 
          UH, AND, UH, THEN WE, WE REALLY DON'T HAVE, AND MR. MAYOR, I AGREE THERE, THERE, THERE ISN'T A CRITERIA. 
          QUIETER, WHAT'S THE DEFINITION OF QUIETER? ACTUALLY, I, I LOOKED IT UP. 
          UH, THREE DECIBEL REDUCTION IS A 50% REDUCTION IN NOISE. 
          SO IF POLARIS CAN BRING IT DOWN TO 89, THAT'S ALMOST TO THE MOTORCYCLE STANDARD 88. 
          UH, BY THE WAY, WHILE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT MOTORCYCLES, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, OHVS ARE REGULATED AS MOTORCYCLES, AND MY MOTORCYCLE CERTAINLY GOT D O T APPROVED TIRES ON IT. 
          SO, UM, UH, I AM, I'M SUPPORTING AND THANKING YOU ALL FOR ALL THE EFFORT AND, UH, I'D LIKE TO, UH, END BY QUOTING RONALD REAGAN TRUST, BUT VERIFY  THANK YOU GUY. 
          UH, CRAIG SWANSON, UM, WILL BE FOLLOWED BY MICHAEL WRIGHT. 
          MY NAME IS CRAIG SWANSON. 
          I'M A RESIDENT OF SEDONA. 
          I'M THE PRESIDENT OF KEEP SEDONA BEAUTIFUL. 
          I'M ALSO ON G S R C, BUT LIKE CARL, I'M NOT SPEAKING FOR THE ORGANIZATION. 
          UH, WHAT THE CITY OF SEDONA IS DOING IS COMPLIMENTARY TO WHAT G S R C IS DOING, THEIR DIFFERENT SPHERES OF INFLUENCE. 
          G S R C IS FOCUSED ON THE PUBLIC LAND, YOU'RE FOCUSED ON THE PRIVATE PART OF IT, BUT BOTH EFFORTS JOIN TOGETHER TO A, TO BE A SIGNIFICANT RESPONSE TO THE CRISIS WE HAVE. 
          I THINK TABLING THE ORDINANCE IS ABSOLUTELY APPROPRIATE AT THIS POINT. 
          I FULLY SUPPORT THAT. 
          UH, NOTE THAT G S R C IS ADVISORY ONLY, WE'RE GONNA COME UP WITH A SET OF RECOMMENDATIONS THAT IN A DELIVERABLE THAT WE GIVE TO THE FOREST SERVICE IN FOREST SERVICE LANGUAGE, THAT WE BELIEVE THE FOREST SERVICE CAN TAKE TO THEIR MANAGEMENT AND SAY, THE PUBLIC IS REQUESTING THIS, WE'RE GOING TO GO AHEAD AND DO IT. 
          I'M HIGHLY OPTIMISTIC THAT THE G S R C PROCESS IS GONNA ADDRESS BOTH SPEED AND PERMITTING. 
          UH, PERMITTING SYSTEM IS GONNA TAKE A FAIR AMOUNT OF TIME TO IMPLEMENT. 
          EVERYBODY HAS TO UNDERSTAND, BE PATIENT WITH THAT. 
          UH, IT'S A COMPLICATED PROCESS WITHIN THE FOREST SERVICE. 
          IF THEY AGREE WHEN THEY AGREE IN PRINCIPLE TO PERMITTING. 
          AND WITH THE 
          [02:25:01]
BACKING OF THE RENTAL COMPANIES AND G SRCS RECOMMENDATION, I'M CONFIDENT THAT THAT'S GONNA HAPPEN TO THE FACT THAT PRIVATE OHC ARE NOT INCLUDED IN THIS. 
          WELL, THE PERMITTING AND THE SPEED LIMIT IMPLEMENTED OUT ON THE FOREST SERVICE IMPACTS EVERYBODY. 
          SO, UH, THEY'RE COVERED IN THAT. 
          FOR INSPECTIONS, I WOULD PUT FORTH THREAT LIGHTLY AS AN ORGANIZATION THAT MIGHT WELL BE WILLING TO TAKE ON SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          THEY'RE A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION, THEY HAVE RESOURCES, AND I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT THEY MIGHT BE WILLING TO DO. 
          AND I KNOW THEY HAVE AN EXCELLENT RELATIONSHIP WITH ROCK AND THE RENTAL AGENCIES, SO I WOULD PUT FORTH THAT. 
          AND FINALLY, ON THE VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT, THE FRY FLY FRIENDLY AGREEMENT IS VOLUNTARY. 
          IT HELPS REDUCE HELICOPTER NOISE, AND IT'S SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED THE INTRUSION OF HELICOPTERS FOR RESIDENTS OF SEDONA. 
          AND I THINK IT'S AN EXAMPLE THAT WE CAN POINT TO WITH AN AGREEMENT LIKE THIS, SOMETHING THAT WILL WORK AND IS APPROPRIATE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU, CRAIG. 
          OKAY. 
          MICHAEL WRIGHT WILL BE FOLLOWED BY SARAH WATTS. 
          NAME, NAME, START WITH THE NAME. 
          MICHAEL MICHAEL WRIGHT. 
          UH, THANK YOU FOR GIVING ME AN OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK TO THE COUNCIL AND CITY OF SEDONA. 
          UH, I, YES, I'M FROM SEDONA, UH, LIVE IN WEST SEDONA FOR ABOUT 3, 3, 4 YEARS NOW. 
          I'LL START WITH MY PERSONAL PREFERENCE, WHICH IS IF IT WAS JUST UP TO ME, THERE WOULD NOT BE ANY OHVS IN THE CITY OR ON THE PUBLIC LAND, WHICH IS SO MUCH OF WHICH IS BEING DESTROYED. 
          THAT ISN'T AN OPTION AND IT ISN'T AN OPTION FOR ME, AND IT ISN'T AN OPTION FOR YOU. 
          SO I, BUT I APPRECIATE THE FACT THAT THE CITY HAS TAKEN THIS ON AND IT, IT'S A PROBLEM THAT PEOPLE ARE EXISTING ALL OVER THE PLACE AND THAT, THAT THEY'RE TAKING IT ON AND CAME UP WITH A SOLUTION TO DEAL WITH A SAFETY ISSUE IN THE CITY. 
          AND IT APPEARS THAT THAT HAS OPENED UP A DISCUSSION WHICH GETS MORE, MUCH BEYOND WHAT ARE THE LEGAL LIMITS OF RULES THAT CAN BE APPLIED. 
          AND WE'RE REALLY IN AN AREA THAT, THAT TO ME, IS THE BEST OF WHAT GOVERNMENT IS DOING. 
          IT'S NOT FORCING, IT'S, IT MAY HAVE TO FORCE SOMETHING TO START A DISCUSSION, BUT THIS HAS BEEN A REALLY ENLIGHTENING MEETING OF PEOPLE SEARCHING TO TRY TO FIND ANSWERS TO REALLY DIFFICULT PROBLEMS. IT'S NOT GONNA GET TO THE PLACE I WANT TO BE, BUT IT'S GONNA GET TO A BETTER PLACE THAT IT'S BEEN SINCE I MOVED HERE. 
          THE REAL QUESTION I THINK WE ALL RECOGNIZE IS IT'S COMPLICATED AND ENFORCEMENT IS REALLY, REALLY DIFFICULT. 
          YOU KNOW, GOVERNORS WILL HELP. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S PROBABLY AS SPECIFIC AS WE CAN GET. 
          THE ISSUE OF NOISE IS VERY FUZZY. 
          I MEAN, TO ME, QUIETER CAN BE ANYTHING. 
          AND SO, BUT AGAIN, I'M NOT, I'M NOT REALLY SAYING ANYTHING THAT IS NEW FOR YOU. 
          I, I GUESS WHAT I WOULD WANNA SAY IS, AS A PERSON WHO IS ON THE MORE EXTREME SIDE OF NO OFF-ROAD VEHICLES, I TOTALLY SUPPORT THE IDEA OF EXPLORING AND REALLY TRYING TO MOVE FORWARD WITH A COLLABORATIVE AGREEMENT. 
          IT'S NOT MY PREFERRED OUTCOME, BUT THIS IS A GOOD FAITH EFFORT TO FIND THAT COMMON GROUND. 
          AND I HOPE PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES WILL SAY, NONE OF US ARE GONNA GET OUR PERFECT OUTCOME. 
          BUT I HOPE THEY'LL PARTICIPATE IN THE PROCESS AND I CERTAINLY WILL AS WELL. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          THANK YOU, MIKE. 
          AND JUST TO BE CLEAR, THEY, THE PAPER THAT YOU HAVE, UH, AND IT WAS ON THE, THE, UH, SCREEN WILL BE CHANGED. 
          THEY HAVE TO, THEY WILL BE GIVING US LIMITS OF HOW MUCH THE NOISE WILL BE REDUCED. 
          RIGHT. 
          I HEARD THAT. 
          I, I REALIZED I GOT A LOT MORE INFORMATION TONIGHT THAN FROM WHEN I WAS THINKING ABOUT THIS WHOLE ISSUE. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND OBVIOUSLY YOU GOTTA STAY ON TOP OF IT. 
          THIS IS A MOVING, IT'S A MOVING TARGET. 
          OKAY. 
          . 
          THANK YOU, MIKE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          SARAH WATTS AND SARAH, IT WILL BE OUR LAST SPEAKER. 
          ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD WISH TO SPEAK, UH, PLEASE GO AND FILL OUT A CARD NOW TO YOUR RIGHT. 
          UH, OTHERWISE SARAH WILL BE OUR LAST. 
          SARAH, UH, START WITH YOUR NAME. 
          YOU'VE DONE THIS BEFORE. 
          UH, YOUR NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE. 
          I'M SARAH WATTS. 
          I LIVE IN SEDONA, IN WEST SEDONA. 
          AND I JUST WANTED TO THERE, PETE, I JUST WANTED TO THANK THE COUNCIL FOR ALL YOUR WORK. 
          THANK THE MAYOR FOR THE CONTACTS HE'S MADE WITH THE CITIZENRY AND THE INFORMATION YOU GIVE OUT. 
          AND THE, WHAT CLEARLY IS A LOT OF HARD WORK BEHIND THE SCENES FOR THE COUNCIL, FOR THE STAFF AND EVERYBODY CONCERNED. 
          UM, 
          [02:30:01]
I'VE BEEN THINKING IN TERMS OF STAKEHOLDERS AND IN THE WIDEST POSSIBLE SENSE THAT I UNDERSTAND THE WORD. 
          WE HAVE NAMED QUITE A FEW STAKEHOLDERS HERE THIS EVENING FROM A GOVERNANCE, FROM A LEGAL, FROM A PRIVATE BUSINESS, FROM A FEDERAL WILD LANDS AND FROM BASIC HUMAN NEEDS. 
          AND I FEEL LIKE THAT BASIC HUMAN NEEDS HAVE NOT GOTTEN AS LARGE AS LARGE A FOOTPRINT IN TERMS OF BEING A STAKEHOLDER AS A CITIZEN, AS A PERSON WITH EARS, AS A PERSON WHO IS SENSITIVE TO, UM, VOLATILE ORGANIC COMPOUND POLLUTION TO THE KIND OF POLLUTION THAT TIRES PUT OUT ON STREETS AS THEY WEAR TO MANY OTHER KINDS OF, UM, EFFECTS ON A STAKEHOLDER AS A CITIZEN AND AS A PERSON WHO HEARS IN SEDONA AND WHO BREATHES IN SEDONA AND WHO DRINKS THE WATER IN SEDONA, AND WHO WOULD BE RAISING CHILDREN, UH, IN SEDONA LIKE MANY PEOPLE ARE. 
          SO I THINK THE NOTION THAT IT'S TWO SIDES OF THE, OF THE QUESTION OR THREE OR FOUR DOESN'T SEEM TO ME TO ENCOMPASS THE DEGREE OF WHAT THIS COUNCIL CALLS QUALITY OF LIFE. 
          THAT THE INCREASE FROM POINT A TO POINT B IN THE SHEER NUMBERS OF O H V BUSINESSES, OF O H V VEHICLE NUMBERS OF O H V MILES DRIVEN. 
          AND AS THE, UM, O H V STUDY COMMITTEE FOR THE STATE LEGISLATURE HEARING MENTIONED THE DEGREE TO WHICH ALCOHOL IS, UH, A FACTOR IN MANY OF THESE SAFETY, UM, ISSUES. 
          SO I WOULD LIKE THE COUNCIL, IF POSSIBLE, TO MAYBE RAISE OUR SIGHTS AS, AS YOU ALL ARE CITIZENS TOO, TO SAY, OKAY, WHAT IS THE OTHER ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM? WHAT IS THE LARGEST STAKEHOLDER HERE? WHICH ARE NOT THE ONES I JUST MENTIONED, BUT WHICH IS THE, UM, HEIR IN SEDONA, THE CITIZENRY IN SEDONA, THE VISITORS THAT COME SIT TO SEDONA, THE CHILDREN THAT ARE RAISED IN SEDONA, AND SAY, WHAT ARE OUR OBLIGATIONS? THANK YOU, SARAH. 
          OKAY. 
          I'M SEEING NO ADDITIONAL CARDS. 
          NOBODY INDICATED THEY HAD MORE TO SAY. 
          SO I'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC SESSION AND BRING IT BACK TO COUNCIL. 
          UH, I'D LIKE TO TOUCH ON SOMETHING THAT, UH, CRAIG SAID ABOUT, UH, TREAD LIGHTLY. 
          AND, UH, THAT'S A REALLY GOOD IDEA. 
          SOMETHING WE SHOULD VENTURE TO, UH, DISCUSS. 
          AND I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS DISCUSSION IN THE VERY BEGINNING FROM POLARIS OFFERING TO HELP IN SOME WAY THAT'S THE MANUFACTURER OKAY. 
          OF, OF THE OH FEES. 
          PERHAPS WE COULD TALK TO THEM TO FUND THAT KIND OF A PROCESS WHERE TREAD LIGHTLY, UH, WHO'S BEEN REALLY EFFECTIVE IN THE PAST TWO, THREE YEARS. 
          UH, PERHAPS WE CAN LOOK INTO DOING SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          AND THAT WOULD BE A WAY OF, UH, CHECKING ON THE MUFFLERS AND CHECKING ON ANYTHING THAT WOULD NEED TO BE CHECKED. 
          AND I THINK THAT WOULD BE A VOLUNTARY, UH, PROCESS. 
          BUT, UH, I THINK THAT IS A GOOD WAY TO START. 
          UH, ALSO WHAT, UH, I BELIEVE IT WAS, UH, DAN SAID ABOUT, UH, AND POSSIBLY CRAIG AS WELL, THE PERMITTING SYSTEM IS KEY. 
          MM-HMM. 
           THAT IS KEY TO A LOT OF THIS. 
          AND IF WE CAN REDUCE THE NUMBER, UH, OVERALL, WE WOULD HAVE LESS IN THE FOREST, LESS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD, LESS ON 89 A. 
          AND, UH, I THINK THAT THAT WOULD GO A, A LONG WAY AS WELL. 
          SO, UH, I'D LIKE TO OPEN UP THE COUNCIL FOR COMMENTS AND LET ME START ON THIS SIDE THIS TIME AND, UH, LET'S SEE WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY. 
          I WAS WAITING TO HEAR FURMAN. 
          NO, I DIDN'T. 
          WHILE YOU WERE LOOKING THIS WAY, I'M JUST LOOKING THIS WAY. 
          MM-HMM. 
          , I'M WAY PAST THAT. 
          . 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          COULDN'T RESIST. 
          THAT'S OKAY. 
          I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO SHARE WITH THE PUBLIC, UH, WHAT HAS TRANSPIRED OVER THE LAST FEW MONTHS AS, UM, WE, AS THE CITY HAS SPOKEN WITH THE OWNERS OF THE O H V RENTAL COMPANIES. 
          YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY THIS STARTED AS A SAFETY TOPIC AND IT HAS LARGELY REMAINED A SAFETY TOPIC, ALTHOUGH SOME OTHER ASPECTS HAVE BEEN BROUGHT INTO THE DISCUSSIONS. 
          WHEN WE STARTED, IT WAS QUITE A STANDOFF. 
          [02:35:01]
AND I WOULD NOT HAVE BET HIGHLY ON ARRIVING AT A POINT WHERE WE ARE TODAY WITH THE, UH, COMMITMENT LETTER THAT'S BEEN PROVIDED BY THE O H V OWNERS. 
          AND, AND AS WE STARTED TO MOVE PAST THREATS OF LITIGATING WITH ONE ANOTHER AND STARTING TO TRY TO FIND COMMON GROUND, UM, WE MORPHED THROUGH A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT POSSIBLE SCENARIOS. 
          ONE OF THE EARLY ONES WAS, WELL, IF YOU'RE GONNA FORCE US INTO TRAILERING, CAN YOU HELP US WITH SOMEWHERE TO STAGE? AND SO WE LOOKED AT THAT AND WE QUICKLY REALIZED, UH, MUTUALLY THAT THERE WERE, UH, LOGISTICAL CONSIDERATIONS THAT JUST MADE IT UNREALISTIC AND THAT WE NEEDED TO MOVE ON TO OTHER IDEAS. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, LOOKING AT, OKAY, WELL YOU CAN CLOSE OFF THE CITY ROADS, BUT LEAVE 89 A AND 1 79 OPEN. 
          UM, THAT CREATED ONE OF THE MOST SIGNIFICANT UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES THAT I THINK IS REALLY IMPORTANT FOR THE COMMUNITY TO UNDERSTAND, WHICH IS IF WE CLOSED OFF DRY CREEK ROAD AND HAD O HVS DRIVING OUT TO THE 5 2 5 ON 89 A, THEY WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, IN THEORY GOVERNED AT 35 MILES AN HOUR AND DRIVING IN A 65 MILE AN HOUR ZONE. 
          AND THAT WAS BROUGHT TO OUR ATTENTION AS SOMETHING THAT MIGHT NOT BE VERY SAFE. 
          AND I FOUND THAT ARGUMENT RATHER COMPELLING. 
          UM, SO WE'VE, YOU KNOW, CONTINUED TO EVOLVE WHAT CAN BE DONE, WHAT CAN BE DONE. 
          AND I BELIEVE THAT THE FOUR O H B, UH, RENTAL COMPANY OWNERS HAVE, UH, CERTAINLY COME TO THE TABLE IN GOOD FAITH AND HAVE MADE, UH, A NUMBER OF COMMITMENTS, AGAIN, AS DOCUMENTED AND AS WE'VE SEEN IN WHICH THERE WILL PROBABLY BE SOME ADJUSTMENTS TO AND SO FORTH. 
          SO I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, IT IS GOOD GOVERNANCE AND IT IS GOOD LEADERSHIP TO ARRIVE AT A NEGOTIATED PLACE RATHER THAN A LITIGATED PLACE, WHICH WAS, UH, PRETTY MUCH A SURE THING WHEN WE, YOU KNOW, FIRST STARTED OFF WITH THIS. 
          UM, I'M ENCOURAGED BY THE OPPORTUNITY THAT WE HAVE AS A CITY, UH, TO COLLABORATE WITH THE RENTAL COMPANIES, PARTICULARLY AS IT RELATES TO THE US FOREST SERVICE. 
          AND AS MR. JACKSON POINTED OUT, THAT IS A LINCHPIN TO MAKING REAL PROGRESS FOR THE LONG HAUL, IS GETTING THE US FOREST SERVICE TO ACT, WHICH THEY HAVE BEEN WOEFULLY SLOW AND UNWILLING TO DO SO. 
          UH, I WISH THEY WERE HERE RIGHT NOW, AND I WOULD NOT CHANGE MY COMMENTS IF THEY WERE. 
          UM, POLARIS ALSO HAS COME STRONGLY TO THE TABLE AND KIND OF GONE FROM ZERO TO 60, NO PUN INTENDED, ON A MUFFLER THAT HAS MADE A MEANINGFUL, UH, REDUCTION IN NOISE. 
          AND LIKE MY COLLEAGUES UP HERE, I'VE HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO HEAR WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE AT 4,000 RPMS COMPARED TO A STANDARD MUFFLER. 
          AND IT IS SIGNIFICANT. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, I'M APPRECIATIVE THAT POLARIS HAS MOVED QUICKLY ON THAT. 
          WE'D CERTAINLY LIKE TO SEE, UM, THE OTHER MANUFACTURERS, UH, TAKE ON, UH, A SIMILAR COMMITMENT TO NOISE REDUCTION. 
          AND FOR ANY, UH, AFTERMARKET MANUFACTURERS WHO MIGHT BE LISTENING NOW OR IN THE FUTURE, I WOULD STRONGLY RECOMMEND THAT YOU WORK ON CREATING MUFFLERS OR OTHER PARTS, UH, AFTERMARKET PARTS THAT ENHANCE SAFETY. 
          BECAUSE FOR THE LIFE OF ME, I CANNOT THINK OF ANY SOCIALLY REDEEMING VALUE FOR PUTTING ON AN AFTERMARKET MUFFLER THAT INCREASES NOISE. 
          UM, BECAUSE IT DOESN'T ADD ANYTHING. 
          AS MS. WATTS MENTIONED, IT DOESN'T ADD ANYTHING TO THE QUALITY OF LIFE TO HAVE MORE NOISE BEING GENERATED THAN WHAT WAS ACTUALLY DESIGNED BY THE MANUFACTURER IN THE FIRST PLACE. 
          AND IT'S NOT GOOD FOR THE WILDLIFE AND IT ON AND ON, RIGHT? SO, UM, THERE'S A FEW THINGS I'D LIKE TO SEE STILL GET INTO OUR COMMITMENT LETTER HERE. 
          UM, ONE OF WHICH I KNOW IS SOMETHING THAT I THINK WE ALL AGREE ON, WHICH IS THAT THE EYEBROW SECTION OF THE 1 52 C SHOULD GET REOPENED, UH, AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. 
          I THINK THAT THAT IS MEANINGFUL AND TANGIBLE AND THE FOREST SERVICE SHOULD BE OPEN TO, UH, TO DOING THAT. 
          UM, POLARIS, AS, UH, THE MAYOR HAS MENTIONED, HAS BEEN WILLING TO, UH, PONY UP SOME DOLLARS, UH, IN ADDITION TO WHAT THEY'VE DONE WITH THE MUFFLER. 
          AND I CERTAINLY WOULD LIKE TO SEE THEM PUT THEIR MONEY WHERE THEIR MOUTH IS AS IT RELATES TO ANY KIND OF BOOTS ON THE GROUND ENFORCEMENT, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IN OUR MEETINGS WITH THE RENTAL COMPANY OWNERS. 
          UM, SO OVERALL, IF YOU HADN'T FIGURED THIS OUT YET, I'M SUPPORTIVE OF, UH, GETTING TO A PLACE WHERE EVERYBODY FEELS GOOD WITH THIS COMMITMENT LETTER AND THAT I THINK IT IS THE BEST OUTCOME THAT WE CAN EXPECT FOR ALL THE STAKEHOLDERS AT THIS TIME. 
          AND I APPRECIATE THE COMMITMENT THAT THE RENTAL COMPANY OWNERS HAVE MADE TO GETTING TO THIS POINT THIS EVENING. 
          [02:40:01]
THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          THANK YOU, COUNCIL. 
          DONE. 
          I THINK MY BIGGEST ISSUE HERE IS THAT THE ORDINANCE IS ABOUT SAFETY INSIDE THE CITY LIMITS. 
          AND THIS AGREEMENT IS REALLY NOT ABOUT SAFETY WITH INSIDE THE CITY LIMITS. 
          THERE'S A LOT REFERENCING THE FOREST SERVICE OVER WHICH WE HAVE NO JURISDICTION. 
          AND, UM, FOR SURE PERMITTING WILL HELP, BUT WE HAVE NO CONTROL OVER PERMITTING. 
          WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, NO CONTROL OVER, UM, ANYTHING WITHIN THE FOREST SERVICE THAT'S UP TO THEM. 
          AND, UM, WHETHER OR NOT THEY CHOOSE TO LISTEN TO WHATEVER RECOMMENDATIONS THE G S R C PROVIDES, IN WHICH WE DO HAVE A MEMBER OF THE, UM, ROCK GROUP, WELL, MORE THAN ONE MEMBER OF THE ROCK GROUP PARTICIPATING. 
          SO I GUESS WHEN I LOOK AT THIS COMMITMENT, BESIDES THE FACTS THAT I'VE ALREADY BROUGHT UP, WHICH IS IT DOESN'T APPLY TO ANYONE WHO OWNS THEIR OWN, IT DOESN'T APPLY TO ANYONE WHO BRINGS IN THEIR OWN FROM OUTSIDE OF THE, THE STATE OR OUTSIDE OF OUR CITY. 
          UM, IT DOESN'T APPLY TO ANY NEW BUSINESSES THAT OPEN BECAUSE THEY HAVE NOT SIGNED THIS COMMITMENT IN ORDER, DOES IT APPLY TO ANYONE WHO BUYS A BUSINESS WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS? SO THERE'S A LOT OF, THIS IS A HIGHLY TECHNICAL TERM SQUISHYNESS, UM, THAT I SEE INSIDE OF THIS, UM, THIS COMMITMENT. 
          AND THERE IS A LOT OF FAITH THAT WE AS A CITY ARE HAVING TO PUT IN THE HANDS OF A FEW BUSINESSES. 
          NOW, I DON'T WANNA PUT ANY BUSINESSES OUT OF BUSINESS, BUT I HAVE CONCERNS HERE. 
          UM, THE INSTALLING THE, THE TURN SIGNALS, THAT'S GREAT. 
          THAT IS A SAFETY FEATURE. 
          AND WE ALL KNOW THAT IS AN ISSUE ON OUR ROADS WHERE PEOPLE ARE SUPPOSED TO USE THEIR HAND SIGNALS AND THEY MAYBE DON'T EVEN KNOW THEM. 
          UM, AND SO IT'S AN ISSUE. 
          I GET IT. 
          I APPRECIATE THAT A LOT. 
          BUT THEN WE TALK ABOUT CONTINUE TO IMPLEMENT EDUCATION. 
          OKAY, WELL, YOU'RE DOING IT ANYWAY. 
          AND, UM, I SUSPECT WITH A LITTLE PRODDING FROM FISH AND GAME AND FROM, UM, THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE, UH, YOU'LL CONTINUE. 
          I ALSO KNOW THAT THAT IS ONE OF THE AREAS IN WHICH THE, UM, WORK GROUP TO WHICH, UH, DEANNA IS, IS SITTING FOR THE LEGISLATURE. 
          THIS IS GOING TO BE A BIG DEAL WHETHER OR NOT WE CAN GET MANDATORY EDUCATION IN THE STATE OF ARIZONA, JUST LIKE OUR NEIGHBORING STATE OF UTAH. 
          SO, GREAT. 
          I'M GLAD YOU'RE KIND OF COMMITTING TO DOING SOMETHING YOU'RE ALREADY DOING. 
          UM, GOVERNING THE SPEED. 
          YOU ALREADY HEARD MY ANSWER ON SPEED. 
          UM, THERE'S NOT A LOT OF SPEEDING PROBLEMS WITH, OH, FEES PROBABLY WITHIN THE BORDERS OF SEDONA, AND THERE'S ONLY ONE AREA THAT'S VERY SMALL THAT MIGHT BE FASTER THAN 35 MILES AN HOUR. 
          SO AGAIN, WOW. 
          IT, IT SOUNDS GOOD, BUT KIND OF DOING IT ANYWAY. 
          UM, AND NUMBER FOUR IS THE QUIETER MUFFLERS. 
          AGAIN, EVERYONE'S POINTING THIS OUT. 
          I DON'T KNOW WHAT QUIETER MEANS. 
          UM, UH, I DIDN'T COME TO SEE YOU SPECIFICALLY. 
          AND THE REASON IS THAT I SPEND QUITE A BIT OF TIME AT THE BUSINESS THAT'S RIGHT NEXT DOOR TO YOU, . 
          SO I'M TALKING TO JIMMY, ANYONE WHO WANTS TO KNOW JIMMY, JIMMY, JIMMY KNOWS IT WELL, HIS MANAGER OF BRIAN. 
          SO BRIAN, YES, THEY KNOW, THEY KNOW, UM, WHAT I'M REFERRING TO. 
          SO I'VE HEARD IT, IT IS QUIETER. 
          BUT UNTIL SOMEBODY WERE TO RUN SOME TESTS, WHICH G S R C IS LOOKING TO DO, COMPARING THOSE MUFFLERS TO OTHER MUFFLERS IN THE SAME SITUATION WITH TIRE NOISE AND ALL THAT, FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF YOUR EARS, YOU DON'T DISCERN WHETHER OR NOT THAT'S COMING FROM THE MUFFLER OR IS COMING FROM THE TIRES, IS COMING FROM THE BOOMBOX BLASTING OUT THE WINDOW. 
          IT, IT, IT DOESN'T, YOUR EAR DOESN'T CARE. 
          SO, UM, I'M A LITTLE, I'M A LITTLE, UM, I'M A LITTLE CONCERNED ABOUT WORDS THAT ARE IN, IN HERE AROUND THE MUFFLERS. 
          UH, QUIETER ASIDE, UM, I'M NOT SURE EVERY MANUFACTURER HAS AGREED TO, TO ISSUE MUFFLERS THAT ARE QUIETER OR IF THIS IS JUST A POLARIS THING. 
          UM, AND I REALIZE MOST OF THE VEHICLES IN TOWN ARE POLARIS, SO I'M AWARE. 
          UM, I ALSO, I ALSO, THROUGHOUT HERE, THERE'S A LOT OF THIS SORT OF SOFT LANGUAGE. 
          WE'LL DO IT IF WE CAN KIND OF LANGUAGE, WE'LL DO IT. 
          IF THE VEHICLES ARE AVAILABLE LANGUAGE, WELL, WE HAVE NO CONTROL ON WHAT VEHICLES YOU DO AND DO NOT GET. 
          UM, YOU MIGHT, BUT WE DON'T. 
          AND SO THAT'S, THAT SEEMS LIKE UNCOMFORTABLE LANGUAGE TO ME FOR A, A STRONG VOLUNTARY COMMITMENT, UM, 
          [02:45:02]
UH, MORGAN DRIVE. 
          SO, UH, I AM, I AM AWARE THAT WHEN THERE IS BAD WEATHER OUT ON THE WESTERN CANYONS, UM, BARRIERS GO UP. 
          ALL KINDS OF THINGS GO UP TO TRY AND DISCOURAGE PEOPLE FROM BRINGING THEIR OHVS OVER INTO THE WESTERN CANYONS. 
          'CAUSE SO MUCH DAMAGE CAN HAPPEN WHEN THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF WATER OUT THERE. 
          AND THAT IS WHEN YOU SAY YOU'RE BASICALLY GOING TO SEND THEM TO MORGAN, AND I SUSPECT YOU SEND THEM TO MORGAN THEN KIND OF ONLY ANYWAY. 
          SO, UH, WE'RE, I'M AWARE FROM PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN MORGAN WHO, YOU KNOW, SPOKEN WITH ME, THERE'S A HIGH NUMBER OF PRIVATE VEHICLES THAT COME DOWN MORGAN, MORE THAN RENTAL VEHICLES THAT ARE COMING DOWN MORGAN. 
          AND THIS WILL NOT APPLY TO ANYONE WHO IS NOT IN A RENTAL VEHICLE. 
          SO I'M NOT SURE THAT REALLY HELPS THE MORGAN DRIVE PEOPLE. 
          UH, ULTIMATELY OR NOT. 
          I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. 
          UM, BUT I JUST FEEL WE SHOULD BE AWARE OF WHAT THAT STATEMENT REALLY MEANS. 
          UM, AS FAR AS THE NOISE IS CONCERNED, I HEAR PEOPLE WHO ARE RESIDENTS IN DRY CREEK COMPLAIN ABOUT THE NOISE ON DRY CREEK. 
          I'VE HEARD, AS I MENTIONED, SNUBBY, PEOPLE ON SNUBBY COMPLAINING ABOUT THE NOISE ON SNUBBY. 
          THIS ISN'T JUST A MORGAN DRIVE ISSUE. 
          UM, AND, AND WE, WE NEED TO SORT OF KEEP THAT IN MIND, SORT OF AS A GROUP THAT OUR RESIDENTS DON'T ALL LIVE ON MORGAN DRIVE. 
          UM, YOU ALREADY PUT THE FLAGS ON, SO THANKS FOR PUTTING THAT IN. 
          AND, UM, THEN THE NUMBER SEVEN IS FOREST SERVICE. 
          SO DO WE HAVE THE RIGHT ORDINANCE IN THE SENSE OF, THE ORDINANCE WAS FOCUSED ON SAFETY, WAS FOCUSED ON TIRES. 
          AND A LOT OF THE STUFF BESIDES THE INSTALL TURN INDICATORS DON'T REALLY ADD TO TO SAFETY. 
          THERE'S NO CRUSH CAGES BEING PUT ON. 
          YOU JUST HAVE YOUR ROLLOVER BARS. 
          YOU DON'T HAVE HIGH IMPACT BUMPERS. 
          YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T HAVE AIRBAGS, UM, TIRES ASIDE, YOU PUT ON, YOU HAVE SOMETHING HERE THAT WASN'T IN THE ORDINANCE. 
          BUT THERE'S OTHER THINGS THAT IF YOU'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT SAFETY EQUIPMENT JUST AREN'T ON THESE VEHICLES. 
          AND I'M NOT SAYING THEY SHOULD BE. 
          SO JUST, I'M JUST MAKING A POINT HERE AROUND THE, THE TURN INDICATORS AND OUR ORDINANCE. 
          AND SO I, WHEN I THINK ABOUT THE ORDINANCE, YOU KNOW, WHETHER OR NOT WE TABLE IT INDEFINITELY, IT'S ALMOST LIKE WHAT, YOU KNOW, TO, TO MS. WATT'S POINT, WHAT IS NOW THE POINT OF OUR ORDINANCE. 
          IF OUR ORDINANCE IS STILL ABOUT SAFETY, THEN DOES THIS VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT ACTUALLY LIVE UP TO WHAT WE SAID WE WERE CONCERNED ABOUT ACROSS THE CITY, NOT IN THE FOREST, JUST ACROSS THE CITY. 
          IF IT, IF THIS MEETS OUR DEMANDS, THEN THIS ORDINANCE SHOULD BE TABLED BECAUSE IT DOESN'T FOLLOW WHAT'S INSIDE OF THE VOLUNTARY COMMITMENT. 
          AND SO AT THIS POINT, WHAT I AM IS A LITTLE CONFUSED AS TO WHAT WE AS A COUNCIL WERE AND ARE AND WANT TO ACTUALLY DO, UM, FOR THE RESIDENTS IN OUR COMMUNITY WHEN IT COMES TO, UM, OHVS. 
          SO YOU ASK IF I'M SUPPOSED TO SAY TABLE IT OR NOT, TABLE IT. 
          WELL, I'M, I'M NOT SURE WHERE I STAND BECAUSE I DON'T SEE A GREAT MATCH BETWEEN THE VOLUNTARY COMMITMENT AND WHAT WE SAID WE WANTED TO DO IN THE ORDINANCE. 
          SO THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          I, I WILL, UM, WE, COUNCIL DUNYA MENTIONED ABOUT MORGAN ROAD AND YOU KNOW THAT IT'S PRIMARILY, UH, INDIVIDUAL, PRIVATELY OWNED. 
          AND THAT'S TRUE. 
          AND THAT'S WHY I ASKED FOR THE ADDITIONAL CLOSURE, UH, FROM THE CITY UNTIL THE, UH, THE G S R C AND THE FOREST SERVICE ACTUALLY PUT THE PERMIT SYSTEM IN. 
          AND THAT WILL HELP THE PEOPLE ON, UM, MORGAN ROAD. 
          NOW, I, I HEARD WHAT YOU SAID, LOUD AND CLEAR ABOUT THE REST OF THE CITY, BUT MORGAN ROAD HAD BEEN GETTING THE, THE HIGHEST IMPACT, UH, FROM, UH, OHVS, UH, OR A HIGHER IMPACT. 
          SO IT WAS THE INTENTION TO MITIGATE THAT UNTIL A PERMIT SYSTEM CAN BE PUT IN. 
          UM, LET ME SEE. 
          NOW, IF THE FOREST SERVICE DECIDES NOT TO IMPLEMENT A PERMIT SYSTEM, WE CAN COME BACK THEN WITH OUR ORDINANCE. 
          YES. 
          IT DOESN'T ALIGN PERFECTLY WITH THE AGREEMENT, BUT THAT'S WHAT COMPROMISE IS ABOUT. 
          [02:50:02]
I WOULD RATHER HAVE A COMPROMISE NOW HAVE WITHIN 18 MONTHS, HAVE ALL THE MUFFLERS AND THE GOVERNOR AND THE DIRECTIONAL SIGNALS. 
          I THINK THAT IS AN ISSUE NOW OR IT'S IMPLEMENTED VERSUS THE STATE LEGISLATURE COMING DOWN ON US, PRIVATE INDIVIDUALS SUING US AND THAT DRAGGING THINGS OUT AND HAVING NOTHING FOR YEARS. 
          SO WE CAN ALWAYS BRING BACK THE ORDINANCE, BUT SOMETIMES IN MY MIND, IT'S BETTER TO WORK WITH INDIVIDUALS AND ACCOMPLISH AND GET, NOT ALL THAT WE WANT, BUT SOME OF WHAT WE WANT. 
          AND WHAT I REALLY WANT IS THAT PERMIT SYSTEM AND THEY'VE AGREED TO SUPPORT THAT PERMIT SYSTEM. 
          I ALSO WANT THE OTHER SAFETY ISSUES. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT I CONSIDER SAFETY, THE SPEED LIMIT. 
          YOU KNOW, YOU SAY, WELL, WE HAVEN'T REALLY HAD ACCIDENTS. 
          WELL, WE'VE HAD FOUR ACCIDENTS, NOT ACCIDENTS, SIR. 
          ROLLOVERS SPEEDING TICKETS. 
          I DON'T BELIEVE THEY'RE SPEEDING TICKETS. 
          THEY'RE ACTUAL ACCIDENTS. 
          NO, SHE'S, NO, NO, SIR. 
          I'M, I WAS SAYING THAT THE 35 MILE AN HOUR SPEED LIMIT AND LIMITING TO THAT, THERE'S THE IMPLICATION THAT THERE'S SOME KIND OF SPEEDING PROBLEM WITH THE OHVS AND THEY'RE GOING TO HANDLE THAT VIA THIS, THIS GOVERNING TO 35 MILES AN HOUR. 
          I'M SAYING I'M NOT SURE THAT THAT IS TRUE, THAT THERE IS A SPEEDING ISSUE, THAT WE NEED TO GOVERN THEIR SPEED DOWN TO 35. 
          SO THAT'S WHAT I WAS SAYING, SIR, I STAND CORRECTED THEN. 
          UM, YOU TALKED ABOUT THE, THE STATE SUBCOMMITTEE. 
          UH, I WATCHED THAT, UH, THE ONE MEETING THAT'S SUPPOSED TO BE ANOTHER MEETING SOON. 
          UH, I, LET'S SEE IF THEY EVER HAVE, IF IT EVER HAPPENS. 
          BUT I, I DON'T WANNA WAIT FOR THEM TO COME AND DO SOMETHING BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR ULTIMATE OUTCOME'S GOING TO BE. 
          SO AGAIN, IF WE HAVE A FEW OF THESE, UH, COMPROMISES, WE'RE AHEAD OF THE GAME NOW AS OPPOSED TO WAITING FOR THE SUBCOMMITTEE. 
          WE RECEIVED A LETTER FROM OUR, UH, STATE REPRESENTATIVE THAT SAID, DON'T IMPLEMENT THE ORDINANCE. 
          WAIT TILL SEPTEMBER. 
          AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS, BUT IT WAS WAIT TILL SEPTEMBER. 
          THE STATE LEGISLATORS ARE WATCHING AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE, THEY WILL, UH, WHETHER IT'S A THREAT, WHETHER IT'S NOT, WHETHER WHATEVER IT IS, WE NEED TO MOVE NOW. 
          AND I THINK BY WORKING TOGETHER THIS, THE MUFFLERS WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS DISCUSSED YEARS AGO, UH, BY A O H V COMMITTEE. 
          AND YET THEY WERE NEVER IMPLEMENTED. 
          NOW WE'RE GOING TO HAVE DATES WHEN THEY'RE GONNA BE DONE BY, THEIR INVENTORY WILL BE DONE BY, AS OPPOSED TO WAITING THREE TO FOUR YEARS FOR SOMETHING TO HAPPEN. 
          SO I WOULD RATHER HAVE THAT PERMIT SYSTEM BEING THE PROCESS STARTED NOW. 
          UM, I THINK THAT COVERS MUCH OF WHAT YOU SAID. 
          OKAY. 
          I BELIEVE SO WE'RE GONNA GO, COME DOWN. 
          OKAY. 
          TODAY, VICE MAYOR. 
          YES. 
          UH, SO MORE THAN TWO YEARS AGO WE HAD A MEETING WITH THE FOREST SERVICE HERE, . 
          AND WE SAID WE NEED A PERMIT SYSTEM. 
          AND MORGAN ROAD WAS MOSTLY FOCUSED ON MORGAN ROAD, NOT EXCLUSIVELY, BUT WE HAD A LOT OF PEOPLE FROM MORGAN ROAD TESTIFY AND THE FOREST SERVICE TALKED ABOUT G SS R C DIDN'T HAVE A NAME AT THAT POINT. 
          IT WAS COMMITTEE THAT WAS GONNA BE FORMED. 
          WE ACTUALLY FUNDED IT. 
          UH, INITIALLY WE GAVE THE INITIAL FUNDING AND THEN MORE OF THE CONVENERS KICKED IN SOME MONEY SO THAT A FACILITATOR COULD BE HIRED. 
          THEN WE HAD AN UPDATE FROM THE G S R C WHO DIDN'T MEET FOR WHAT, A YEAR AND A HALF. 
          IT COULDN'T EVEN, THEY, THEY HAD TO GET THE CONVENERS. 
          IT, IT'S VERY SLOW BUREAUCRATIC PROCESS. 
          PEOPLE HAD TO BE NAMED AFTER THEY WERE NAMED AND THEY HAVE TO BE A MEETING. 
          SO NOW WE GET AN UPDATE AND PERMITTING IS NOT EVEN PART OF THE UPDATE. 
          AND THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT THE WHOLE PURPOSE WAS AND WHY. 
          I'M REALLY PLEASED TO HEAR FROM CARL THAT ON FRIDAY PERMITTING ROSE UP TO THE TOP. 
          'CAUSE I WAS REALLY DISAPPOINTED. 
          AND I THINK THAT IN, SINCE WE HAD THAT UPDATE, YOU GUYS HADN'T REALLY EVEN MET OR MET ONCE. 
          I THINK A LOT OF ACTIVITY HAS HAPPENED. 
          A LOT OF COMMITTEES HAVE BEEN FORMED AND WORK HAS BEEN DONE. 
          AND IT SOUNDS LIKE IT'S GOING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION, 
          [02:55:01]
BUT IT'S STILL WAYS AWAY. 
          SO WHAT DO WE DO? SO WE HAD AN ORDINANCE AND UH, WE GOT A LOT OF MIXED REVIEWS ON THE ORDINANCE. 
          A LOT OF PEOPLE SUPPORTED IT, A LOT OF PEOPLE DID NOT SUPPORT. 
          IT GOT OUR LEGISLATORS THREATENING US TO POTENTIALLY DO SOMETHING AT THE LEGISLATURE TO PREVENT US FROM HAVING THIS ORDINANCE OR FILING A 1487 COMPLAINT OR FILING A LAWSUIT. 
          AND JUST LIKE, UH, BRIAN SAID, WHEN WE HAD OUR FIRST MEETINGS WITH THE RENTAL COMPANIES, IT WAS, YOU'RE HERE, YOU'RE HERE, WE'RE GOING AFTER YOU, WE'RE GOING AFTER YOU, BLAH, BLAH BLAH. 
          IT WAS HARD TO BELIEVE THAT WE COULD EVER ACHIEVE ANY KIND OF AN AGREEMENT 'CAUSE PEOPLE WERE SO ANGRY ON BOTH SIDES. 
          SO I GO BACK TO THE PRACTICAL, WHAT IS IT THAT WE CAN DO? 'CAUSE EVERYTHING WE LOOKED AT WAS GONNA SHUT DOWN. 
          THESE COMPANIES WAS GONNA SHUT DOWN THESE BUSINESSES, TOM. 
          SO WE TOOK INTO CONSIDERATION, WE HAVE THESE SMALL BUSINESSES HERE, AND DO WE WANNA PUT THEM OUTTA BUSINESS? BECAUSE THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT WAS GONNA HAPPEN. 
          AND WE DIDN'T, WE ALL SAT HERE ON THE DAAS, WE DON'T WANNA PUT THESE COMPANIES OUTTA BUSINESS. 
          SO WHAT DO WE DO? AND WE THRASH THIS AROUND. 
          I MEAN, WE'VE BEEN MEETING FOR WEEKS AND WEEKS AND WEEKS, I GUESS IT'S MONTHS NOW. 
          AND IT'S HARD. 
          IT'S A VERY TOUGH ISSUE. 
          WE HAD VERY COMPLICATED AND A LOT OF UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES. 
          A LOT OF STAKEHOLDERS THAT WE HAVE NO CONTROL OVER WHO ARE VERY, VERY INVOLVED IN THE PROCESS AND HAVE TO, WE HAVE TO AGREE WITH THEM. 
          WE HAVE TO MEET, HAVE A MEETING OF THE MINDS. 
          SO IT'S, IT'S NOT EASY. 
          AND I THINK IF IT WAS, IT WOULD'VE BEEN, IT WOULD'VE BEEN RESOLVED YEARS AGO WHEN THEY HAD THE OTHER COMMITTEE. 
          AND THAT REPORT BASICALLY SAID, THERE'S NOTHING WE CAN DO. 
          WELL, I DON'T WANNA BE THE WRITER OF ANOTHER REPORT THAT SAYS THERE'S NOTHING WE CAN DO. 
          SO WE LOOKED AT OUR ULTIMATE GOAL IS TO GET A PERMITTING SYSTEM. 
          IT WAS THEN, IT IS NOW. 
          IT WILL ALWAYS BE. 
          AND SO I DON'T WANNA WAIT ANOTHER TWO YEARS, HOWEVER, I DON'T WANNA PUT THESE PEOPLE OUTTA BUSINESS. 
          SO WE REACHED, YOU KNOW, A COMPROMISE, WHICH I THINK DOES GIVE US, UH, A COMMITMENT. 
          NOW, IS IT PERFECT? NO. 
          IS IT SQUISHY? YES. 
          BUT WE CAN STILL WORK ON THE LANGUAGE. 
          WE'RE NOT APPROVING ANYTHING HERE. 
          AND WE WENT BACK AT OUR LAST MEETING, IT WAS LAST WEEK, AND SAID, WE NEED SOME STRONGER LANGUAGE IN HERE. 
          SO I'M HOPING THAT COUNCIL WILL, UH, PROVIDE SOME DIRECTION TO THE COM COMMITTEE AS TO WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE ADDED TO THE LANGUAGE. 
          UH, AND THEN WE CAN CONTINUE TO WORK ON IT. 
          WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE REVIEWING THIS. 
          I MEAN, WE'LL WAIT, WE WILL BE REVIEWING THIS AGAIN IN TWO WEEKS. 
          SO IN TWO WEEKS WE'LL HAVE A THEORETICALLY, A BETTER, STRONGER AGREEMENT THAT WE CAN REVIEW. 
          ONCE AGAIN, IT'LL BE THREE WEEKS. 
          THERE'S A FIFTH TUESDAY THIS MONTH. 
          THAT'S RIGHT. 
          YEAH. 
          THREE WEEKS FROM NOW. 
          SO THAT'S, THAT'S TIME. 
          THERE'S WILLINGNESS RIGHT NOW ON BOTH SIDES TO WORK ON THESE THINGS, TO GET IT MORE, TO GET IT MORE SOLID AND, UH, TO ELIMINATE WHAT S I AGREE IS SQUISHY LANGUAGE. 
          UH, SO I SUPPORT CONTINUING DOWN THIS PATH TO SEE WHAT WE CAN ACHIEVE. 
          AND THEN THREE WEEKS WHEN WE COME BACK TOGETHER, THEN WE'LL SEE IF IT MEETS ENOUGH, YOU KNOW, IF IT'S GOOD ENOUGH. 
          AND, UH, AND BASICALLY THAT'S MY, THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS. 
          THANK YOU FOR GIVING THE HISTORY. 
          I OMITTED THAT AND THERE WAS A LOT OF WORK INVOLVED AND A LOT OF CONCERN. 
          SO THANK YOU ON THIS SIDE. 
          COUNCILOR KINSELLA. 
          THANK YOU. 
          IT'S NOT AN EASY TOPIC, YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE THERE THERE IS NO, THERE ARE NOT GREAT SOLUTIONS. 
          UM, I THINK COUNCILOR DUNS POINTS ARE VERY, I'M GRATEFUL TO YOU FOR PUTTING THEM OUT THERE ON THE TABLE. 
          SO CLEARLY BECAUSE THAT'S PART OF WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO WRAP OUR HEADS AROUND AND OUR AUTHORITY AROUND THE LIMITED AUTHORITY THAT WE HAVE HERE. 
          UM, THE GERMANE QUESTION WAS, WHICH WAS JUST ADDRESSED AS WELL BY THE VICE MAYORS. 
          WHAT IS IT THAT WE ACTUALLY WANT TO DO AND WHAT IS THE BEST WAY TO GET THERE? UM, 
          [03:00:01]
THE ORDINANCE IS NOT PERFECT BECAUSE IT IS LIMITED IN WHAT IT CAN ADDRESS. 
          AND IT DOESN'T ADDRESS ISSUES THAT I HAVE THAT GO BEYOND WHAT HAPPENS IN A BROADER SENSE, NOT JUST ON THIS PARTICULAR STREET, IN THIS CITY LIMIT. 
          UM, BUT AGAIN, THE AGREEMENT IS NOT PERFECT BECAUSE IT DOESN'T ADDRESS ALL THE ISSUES AND IT CERTAINLY DOESN'T ADDRESS SOME OF THE SAFETY CONCERNS THAT HAVE BEEN RAISED. 
          'CAUSE THOSE HAVE BEEN RAISED AND THEY ARE OUT THERE. 
          AND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT THE PUBLIC HAS TO KNOW WHEN THEY ARE UTILIZING THIS PARTICULAR AMUSEMENT AS WELL, THAT, THAT THESE THINGS EXIST. 
          SO, I MEAN, I'D LOVE TO SEE SOME MORE EDUCATION ON THAT. 
          UM, BUT I DO THINK THAT THE AGREEMENT IN THE SHORT TERM ANYWAY, IS THE BETTER WAY TO GO BECAUSE IT DOES ALLOW THE DIALOGUE TO CONTINUE. 
          WE'RE NOT AT A POINT OF PERFECTION, BUT WE'RE NOT GONNA GET THERE, I DON'T THINK IF WE GO THE ORDINANCE ROUTE. 
          AND THE ONLY REASON THAT I HAVE ANY LEVEL OF COMFORT IN SAYING THAT IS BECAUSE I'VE, YOU KNOW, BEEN ASSURED THAT WE CAN GO BACK TO THE ORDINANCE PRETTY QUICKLY AND PRETTY EASILY, WHICH IS AN IMPORTANT COMPONENT TO ME. 
          UM, ONE OF THE MAIN THINGS THAT THE MAYOR POINTED OUT IS, AGAIN, THE PERMITTING SYSTEM, WHICH I DO THINK IS KEY IN THIS POLL QUESTION, IS THERE'S AN OVERSATURATION OF THIS USE IN THE FOREST AREA. 
          THERE IS AN OVERSATURATION OF THIS USE ON THE CITY STREETS OF SEDONA, OF PERMITTING SYSTEM IS THE ONLY THING THAT'S OTHER THAN A, A VOLUNTARY REDUCTION THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT IS GOING TO LIMIT THAT AND ADDRESS THAT CORE ISSUE. 
          AND I THINK HAVING THE INDUSTRY SUPPORT, WHICH I'M GRATEFUL FOR, FOR A PERMITTING SYSTEM, THAT'S A BIG GIFT. 
          TO ME, THAT'S AN IMPORTANT COMPONENT TO THIS. 
          WITHOUT, WITHOUT THAT SUPPORT, HONESTLY, I DON'T KNOW THAT I WOULD BE SO WILLING TO SAY, LET'S, LET'S PURSUE THE VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT FOR NOW. 
          'CAUSE IT IS CORE. 
          SO WITH THAT BEING SAID, AND ON THOSE, THE BASIS THAT WE CAN BRING IT BACK AND THAT THE INDUSTRY SUPPORT IS THERE FOR THE PERMITTING, I DO SUPPORT GOING FORWARD WITH THE AGREEMENT BECAUSE IT ALLOWS THE DIALOGUE TO CONTINUE FOR THE MOMENT. 
          THANK YOU, PETE. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          UH, I TOO SEE PROGRESS BEING MADE HERE AND I'M HAPPY ABOUT THAT. 
          AND, AND I THANK THE, THIS BRANCH OF, UH, THE DAIS UP HERE FOR GIVING ME MORE INFORMATION TODAY, UH, ON THIS TOPIC THAN I HAD BEEN, UH, AWARE OF BECAUSE I'M NOT IN ANY ONE OF THOSE WORKING GROUPS IN OUR RULES PERMIT PROHIBIT PERMIT ONLY CERTAIN NUMBERS. 
          SO WE, WE ALL UNDERSTAND THAT, AND I APPRECIATE THAT THERE'S WORK BEING DONE. 
          I'M NOT HAPPY THAT G R C AND THE FOREST SERVICE IS NOT HERE WITH US TODAY. 
          NOW, I APPRECIATE THAT WE HAD CARL AND CRAIG AND, UH, UH, MELISSA AND MELISSA, UH, TO HERE TO GIVE US THEIR OPINION, THEIR VIEW, THEIR SUMMARY OF WHAT'S BEEN GOING ON. 
          BUT THERE'S A, YEAH, I, I, I, I, I WOULD, AND I DON'T KNOW, NO ONE HAS TOLD ME WHY G S R C AS A GROUP HASN'T MADE A, A STATEMENT HERE. 
          WE'RE PLAYING IN THEIR SANDBOX AND, UH, AND WE COULD POTENTIALLY TAKE SOME ACTIONS HERE THAT COULD DESTROY SOME PROGRESS THAT THEY'RE MAKING. 
          AND SO I, YOU KNOW, AND THE FOREST SERVICES GOT LOTS AT STAKE AS WELL. 
          SO I, I DON'T KNOW WHY THEY'RE NOT HERE. 
          AND I SURE WOULD LIKE TO SEE THEM HERE IN THE FUTURE WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THIS STUFF. 
          I, UH, ALSO SUPPORT THE IDEA OF US GETTING TO A VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT BECAUSE LIKE THE COUNCIL MEMBER DUNN WAS, WAS POINTING OUT THE ORDINANCE IS FOCUSED ON THE THINGS THAT AN ORDINANCE CAN DO. 
          THIS VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT CAN GO BEYOND THAT AND WE CAN MAKE SOME PROGRESS THAT WE CAN MAKE IN AREAS WITH A VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT THAT WE CAN'T, WITH AN ORDINANCE. 
          IT DOESN'T APPLY TO EVERYBODY. 
          I GET THAT. 
          BUT WE CAN SORT OF SET THE STANDARD AND HOPEFULLY THAT CULTURE STARTS TO CHANGE AS WELL. 
          SO, UH, I'M SUPPORTIVE OF, OF CONTINUING TO WORK. 
          UH, I'M ALSO PLEASED THAT WE'RE CONTINUING TO SHARPEN THE ORDINANCE. 
          YOU KNOW, IT'S MY OPINION THAT WE DISCOVERED THIS HAMMER LINE ON THE SIDEWALK AND WE PICKED IT UP AND SHARPENED IT UP A LITTLE BIT HERE. 
          AND CONSEQUENTLY, PROGRESS HAS BEEN MADE ON THIS ISSUE. 
          GENERALLY, I'M NOT WILLING TO PUT DOWN THE HAMMER YET, THE HAMMER OF THE ORDINANCE. 
          SO I WANT US TO STILL SEE THAT THAT'S A POTENTIAL. 
          UM, AND I WANT TO SEE IMPROVEMENTS THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT. 
          MAYOR ASKED ABOUT WHAT AREAS SPECIFICALLY THAT WE MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN. 
          AND, 
          [03:05:01]
YOU KNOW, AND I'VE SAID THAT FROM MY STANDPOINT, I THINK THERE'S VOLUNTEER AGREEMENT THAT CAN TOUCH ON TIRES. 
          I THINK THERE'S VOLUNTEER AGREEMENT CAN STILL FOCUS IN ON SPEED A LITTLE BIT. 
          I LIKE WHAT SEDONA AT T V HAS DONE IN THEIR OWN AGREEMENT AND WHAT THEY'RE ASKING THEIR CUSTOMERS TO DO. 
          UM, I THINK THAT THERE'S A PRIVATE ENFORCEMENT OF SPEED THAT THE VOLUNTEER AGREEMENT COULD ALSO BE SUBJECT HERE TO, YOU KNOW, REAL SERIOUS COMMITMENT BY THESE RENTAL COMPANIES TO IMPLEMENTING THE FINES WHEN CUSTOMERS MISBEHAVE. 
          AND SO, YOU KNOW, I I, THOSE ARE AREAS THAT COME TO MY MIND ABOUT POTENTIALLY CHANGES AND THEN THE TIGHTENING SOME OF THE LANGUAGE, I I AGREE THAT THE LANGUAGE IS STILL A LITTLE BIT LOOSE. 
          THEY ALWAYS ARE WHEN YOU START AND WE'RE STILL MAKING PROGRESS. 
          AND SO I'M HAPPY TO SEE THIS THING COME BACK IN A FEW WEEKS AND, UM, I I WANT US TO MAKE PROGRESS HERE. 
          IT'S AN IMPORTANT ISSUE FOR ALL OF US. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU PETE. 
          JESSICA , IN A PERFECT WORLD, I'D BAD ATVS, BUT I ALSO BOUGHT MOTORCYCLES AND PEOPLES WHO DON'T USE THEIR TURN TICKERS. 
          SO, UH, WE DON'T LIVE IN A PERFECT WORLD. 
          WE LIVE IN A WORLD OF A LOT OF STAKEHOLDERS. 
          UM, THE ASSUMPTION THAT RESIDENTS ARE THE ONLY STAKEHOLDER BECAUSE THERE'S MORE RESIDENTS THAN THERE ARE OWNERS OF, OF A T V COMPANIES. 
          SOMEHOW THE RESIDENTS SHOULD BE ABLE TO, HOW HAVE YOU DETERMINED THE RESIDENTS BE ABLE TO KIND OF TOTALLY PREVAIL? I DON'T THINK THAT'S THE REAL WORLD, AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S THE JOB OF COUNCIL WHO, WHO HAS AN OBLIGATION TO BUSINESSES AND TO, TO OTHER ENTITIES IN THIS, IN THIS COMMUNITY. 
          UM, THE POINT WAS BROUGHT UP ABOUT FAIRNESS OR WHAT DO RESIDENTS GET? WELL, YOU KNOW, RESIDENTS ARE GOING TO GET, UH, WHAT DO I SAY HERE? UM, IN THE VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT, THEY'RE GONNA GET QUIETER VEHICLES. 
          YOU CAN, YOU CAN SORT OF TALK ABOUT THE SQUISHYNESS OF WHAT'S LESS, AND IT WOULD BE PERFECT IF THERE WAS NO NOISE. 
          BUT I THINK IT IS LESS, I THINK WE'VE HAD PEOPLE HERE SAY IT IS LESS NOISY. 
          IT IS QUIETER. 
          SO WHETHER IT'S MARGINALLY QUIETER THAN NOTHING, IT'S, IT'S SORT OF, THEY WILL GET A QUIETER VEHICLES ALSO GET INCREASED SCRUTINY ON BAD ACTORS ON THE PART OF THE, OF THE COMPANIES AS TECHNOLOGY IMPROVES. 
          YEAH, I LOOK FORWARD TO, UM, TO A TIME WHEN IF SOMEONE GOES OVER 50 MILES AN HOUR ON THAT TRAIL, THE COMPUTER SHOUTS SLOW DOWN. 
          I MEAN, THAT COULD ALWAYS HAPPEN. 
          MY, MY, MY CAR'S ALWAYS TELLING ME BREAK. 
          SO I THINK THAT'S POSSIBLE. 
          UM, WHAT WE DON'T GET IS A RADICAL ELIMINATION OF ONE CLASS OF VEHICLE. 
          UM, WHICH I MEAN, I DO WANNA POINT OUT HERE THAT'S SOME NUMBER OF SEDONA RESIDENTS, UH, NOT AN INSIGNIFICANT NUMBER OWN O H H A. 
          WHAT AM I CALLING H V OHVS SO THAT IT'S NOT TRUE THAT ALL THE RESIDENTS WANT THE BAND OR THAT ALL THE RESIDENTS WANT ANYTHING. 
          A LOT OF THE RESIDENTS, STAKEHOLDERS OWN THESE VEHICLES. 
          AND SO I THINK WE HAVE TO BE COGNIZANT OF THAT. 
          I AGREE, THE PERMITTING SYSTEM'S KEY. 
          UM, NOT EVERYBODY'S GONNA BE HAPPY. 
          IT'S ALWAYS EASIER TO BE ABSOLUTE. 
          IT'S SORT OF SAY, I CAN'T BEAR THE NUANCES. 
          I, LET'S JUST, LET'S JUST KILL 'EM OR LET'S JUST LET 'EM ALL LIVE. 
          IT'S, YOU KNOW, I THINK THIS IS AN, A LOT OF STUFF WE DEAL WITH CALLS FOR PAYING ATTENTION TO THE NUANCES. 
          UM, AND THEN WHATEVER SQUISHINESS ADDRESSED, YOU KNOW, CAN BE ADDRESSED. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, THE COMPANIES CAN'T COMMIT TO GETTING A PRODUCT THAT DOES NOT EXIST. 
          AND SO EXPECTING THAT LEVEL OF SQUISHYNESS TO GO AWAY IS KIND OF UNREALISTIC, SAME WAY. 
          WE CAN'T COMMIT TO GETTING A PERMIT SYSTEM BECAUSE WE DON'T CONTROL THAT, BUT WE CAN WORK TOWARD IT. 
          AND I THINK THE COMPANIES HAVE SHOWN THE WILLINGNESS TO DO THAT. 
          AND I THINK THAT'S ALL THEY COULD DO. 
          UM, AND I THINK THE LANGUAGE WILL ALWAYS BE SQUISHIER THAN THE UNILATERAL BAN. 
          A UNILATERAL BAN IS JUST MUCH EASIER SAYING, OKAY, LET'S MAKE THIS EASY. 
          LET'S JUST DO THIS IS A LOT OF STUFF WE DID WITH CALLS. 
          SORRY, I THOUGHT, WHAT LIVESTREAM? OH, . 
          I THOUGHT, WHOA, A VOICE . 
          SO I, UM, I DON'T SEE ANY BENEFIT TO THE CITY OR 
          [03:10:01]
THE RESIDENTS TO BE CAUGHT UP IN LITIGATION FOR THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE WHERE NOTHING GETS BETTER WITHOUT ANY, ANY GUARANTEE OR ANY ACTUAL REASON TO THINK THAT AT THE END OF IT, THE CITY WOULD PREVAIL ANYWAY. 
          I THINK THIS VOLUNTARY AGREEMENT, I THINK HAVING TIES BETWEEN BUSINESSES AND THE CITY TOWARD A COMMON GOAL, I THINK WHOEVER SAID THAT, I THINK THAT IS IMPORTANT. 
          AND I THINK A COMMITMENT TO OUR SMALL BUSINESSES IS ALSO IMPORTANT. 
          AND I THINK IF WE CAN FASHION A COMPROMISE THAT GIVES RESIDENTS WHO, WHO OBJECT TO H OOVS SOME RELIEF AND GIVES THE COMPANIES AN ABILITY TO CONTINUE TO HIRE AND EMPLOY THE PEOPLE WHO RELY ON THOSE JOBS. 
          AND, AND OUR, OUR PROBLEM, OUR RESIDENTS TOO, IS A REALLY IMPORTANT STEP FORWARD. 
          AND I THINK COMPROMISE IS UNDERAPPRECIATED IN OUR ERA OF PURITY. 
          AND, AND ABSOLUTISM AND I SUPPORT IT. 
          SUPPORT MOVING AHEAD. 
          I DON'T, I JUST WANNA SAY I DON'T SUPPORT, UM, THE MORGAN ROAD RECOMMENDATION. 
          I JUST WANNA SAY THAT I, UM, I THINK IT RAISES ALL THE ISSUES THAT COUNCILOR DUNN RAISED, AND I DON'T THINK THAT IT'S ANY DIFFERENT THAN THE REST OF THE CITY. 
          I KNOW THAT THE IMPACT IS GREATER. 
          I DO UNDERSTAND THAT. 
          BUT I ALSO THINK THAT WE HAVE TO, WE HAVE TO GET THE PERMITTING AS QUICKLY AS WE CAN. 
          AND I WAS VERY GLAD TO HEAR FROM CARL THAT PROGRESS HAS BEEN MADE IN THAT, IN THAT REGARD. 
          I, I CAN'T THINK OF, OH, I WOULD LIKE SOMETHING ABOUT INSPECTIONS ADDED TO THE, ADDED TO THE DOCUMENT. 
          THE, THE COMPROMISE. 
          I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT HAPPENS, BUT YEAH, IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE SPECIFIC. 
          I DON'T THINK WE HAVE TO HAVE THAT MECHANISM IN PLACE, BUT I THINK SOMETHING HAS TO BE, BE ADDED FOR THAT. 
          SO THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU, JESSICA. 
          OKAY. 
          CAN I JUST SPEAK TO YOUR PERMITTING? YES. 
          SO, SO FOR JUST A SECOND, I'M GOING TO PUT ON MY G S R C HAT. 
          SO THERE IS NO O PERSON WHO IS THE G S R C. 
          THE G S R C IS A SERIES OF ALMOST 40 PEOPLE, PRETTY MUCH, PLUS SOME ALTERNATES, UM, WHO HAVE COME TOGETHER TO TRY AND SOLVE ISSUES ON THE MOTORIZED TRAILS, WHICH HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE CITY STREETS OF SEDONA. 
          IT'S JUST THE MOTORIZED TRAILS. 
          SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT, WE'RE HAVING A CONVERSATION AROUND PERMITTING, IT'S ONE OF MANY POSSIBLE APPROACHES WHICH INCLUDE HOW DO YOU CHANGE USER BEHAVIOR? SO THAT GOES TO THE EDUCATION PIECE THAT IS IN YOUR AGREEMENT. 
          UM, THERE, THE THING ABOUT THE PERMITTING IS YOU TALK ABOUT NOT WANTING TO WAIT YEARS GET COMFORTABLE 'CAUSE YOU'RE GONNA BE WAITING. 
          UM, THERE'S GOING TO BE DIFFERENT APPROACHES THAT ARE GONNA HAVE TO BE DISCUSSED. 
          AND EVEN IF THOSE ARE THEN FORWARDED ON TO THE FOREST SERVICE IN THE LANGUAGE IN WHICH THEY ACTUALLY TALK ABOUT THEIR DESIRABLE CONDITIONS AND SO FORTH AND SO ON, UM, THAT'S GONNA HAVE TO GO THROUGH APPROVAL. 
          PERMITTING IS NON-TRIVIAL, UM, FOR THE FOREST SERVICE. 
          THEY HAVE TO GET PUBLIC OPINION, THEY HAVE TO DO A WHOLE LOT OF STEPS TO DO PERMITTING. 
          AND THEN THERE'S THE IMPACT OF PERMITTING. 
          SO WHEN YOU GUYS ARE THINKING PERMITTING, IT'S NOT GONNA BE NECESSARILY, YOU KNOW, LIKE SOLDIERS PASS, 12, 12 PERMITS ARE ISSUED TODAY. 
          HOW MANY VEHICLES ACTUALLY GO UP THERE AS A DIFFERENT CONVERSATION? BUT THERE'S ONLY 12 PERMITS ISSUED TODAY. 
          THAT'S NOT GONNA HAPPEN IN THE WESTERN CANYONS, RIGHT? WHERE YOU'VE GOT SEVEN OF THE 11 O H V TRAILS. 
          SO YOU'RE GONNA HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT ARE GONNA GO OUT ON DRY CREEK IN ORDER TO GET OUT THERE. 
          POTENTIALLY. 
          IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN ON MORGAN. 
          I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THEY'RE GONNA THINK ABOUT WITH MORGAN. 
          UM, WE'VE HEARD THAT'S THE REASON WHY THEY HAVE MORGAN AS MORGAN IS IT GIVES THE O H V GUYS A CHANCE TO GO UP ON BEAR ROCK IN INSTEAD OF THE OTHER PLACES WHERE THERE'S NO BEAR ROCK. 
          SO WHAT DOES THAT REALLY MEAN? I THINK ALL OF THOSE QUESTIONS, AS COMPLICATED AS ALL OF THIS IS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, THAT'S EQUALLY COMPLICATED. 
          AND IT HAS TO BE SEEN IN THE BROADER PERSPECTIVE OF THE WHOLE MANAGEMENT DISTRICT FOR RED ROCK RANGERS, NOT JUST THE ONES THAT ARE AT THE END OF OUR ROADS. 
          SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT IS GOING TO MEAN ULTIMATELY FOR HOW MANY VEHICLES WILL NO LONGER BE RUNNING UP AND DOWN. 
          89 A AND 1 79 
          [03:15:02]
COULD BE A LOT BECAUSE THEY'RE GONNA GO BETWEEN ALL THESE DIFFERENT THINGS. 
          NOBODY HAS AN ANSWER FOR ANY OF THIS. 
          SO IF YOU'RE EXPECTING G S R C TO BE ABLE TO COME IN WITH A PERMITTING SYSTEM AND HAVE THAT IMPLEMENTED BY THE FOREST SERVICE, UM, IN A SHORT AMOUNT OF TIME THAT THAT WON'T HAPPEN, THIS WILL BE YEARS. 
          AND SO WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT WHAT IS IT, WHAT IS IT WE WANT FOR SEDONA WHILE WE'RE WAITING FOR THIS TO HAPPEN, ASSUMING IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN. 
          SO I HOPE FOR, YOU KNOW, I REALIZE YOU GUYS MAY HAVE KNOWN ALL THIS, BUT I WAS HOPING FOR THE BROADER AUDIENCE TO UNDERSTAND THAT PERMITTING IS NON-TRIVIAL TO THE FOREST SERVICE. 
          AND G S R C IS IN THE PROCESS RIGHT NOW OF ACTUALLY TRYING TO DO SOME DATA GATHERING AROUND THE IMPACT OF DUST AND AROUND THE IMPACT OF NOISE. 
          UM, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT'S IMPORTANT IN THE FOREST. 
          SO, UM, BE BE PATIENT AND UNDERSTAND THAT FOR ME, THE CONFUSION IS, I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO FOR THE, THE BOUNDARIES OF SEDONA BECAUSE THE PERMITTING SYSTEM IS WELL OUT OF OUR CONTROL. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THA THANK YOU FOR CLARIFYING. 
          I JUST WANNA BE CLEAR, I WANT TO THANK COUNCILOR DUNN FOR HER ROLE IN G S R C AND, AND HER COMMENTS TODAY. 
          I REALLY APPRECIATE, AND I DON'T DISAGREE WITH HER ON IT, REALLY ANYTHING BECAUSE WHAT EVERYTHING SHE SAID AS WELL AS EVERYBODY ELSE SAID IS CORRECT. 
          IT WILL TAKE A LONG TIME FOR THE FOREST SERVICE TO AGREE TO A PERMIT SYSTEM. 
          AND IT WILL TAKE A LONG TIME FOR THE G S R C TO COME UP WITH THE GUIDANCE THAT THE FOREST SERVICE IS LOOKING FOR. 
          I GET THAT. 
          BUT AS THE VICE MAYOR SAID EARLIER, WE'VE GOT NOTHING, NO COMMITMENTS WHATSOEVER FROM THE FOREST SERVICE AFTER YEARS AND YEARS AND US FUNDING THOSE STUDIES. 
          AND WE'VE GOTTEN NOWHERE. 
          I HAVE HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH DIFFERENT PEOPLE FROM THE FOREST SERVICE WHO HOLD THE G S R C AT VERY HIGH REGARD. 
          THEY FEEL THAT A PUBLIC BODY, THE G S R C IS WHAT THEY NEED TO COME TO THEM WITH A PLAN. 
          AND IT WOULDN'T BE A PLAN OVERNIGHT. 
          THERE'D BE A LOT OF THOUGHT AND IT WILL BE DATA-DRIVEN AND THAT THEY CAN THEN STAND BY THE FORESTER AS THEY BEING OKAY TO STAND BY THAT REPORT AND THEN MOVE FORWARD TO COME UP WITH ALL THE, IT HAS TO BE A NEPA STUDY. 
          AND WE ALL KNOW THAT BAD WORD NEPA STUDY, THAT COULD TAKE A LONG TIME. 
          I GET IT. 
          BUT WE NEED TO MOVE FORWARD SOMEWHERE RIGHT NOW. 
          WE HAVEN'T MOVED OFF THAT, THAT POINT FOR YEARS. 
          SO TO ME, THE PERMIT SYSTEM IS KEY, LIKE I SAID. 
          UM, AND THE O H V GUYS WILL TELL YOU, AND I STARTED A CONVERSATION EARLIER, THIS WHAT DIDN'T START WELL AT ALL. 
          I WAS FOCUSED ON AN ORDINANCE AND I I, UP UNTIL THE O H V GUYS, THE RENTAL COMPANIES CAME FORWARD, I WAS LOCKED ON THE ORDINANCE. 
          THEY'LL TELL YOU I WAS LOCKED ON THAT ORDINANCE. 
          BUT THEM COMING FORWARD WAS A BIG STEP FOR THEM. 
          IS IT PERFECT? NO, IT'S CERTAINLY NOT PERFECT. 
          AND I THINK IT WAS COUNCILOR WILLIAMSON THAT SAID, WELL, THEY CAN'T BUY VEHICLES THAT AREN'T MADE. 
          THEY'RE JUST NOT MADE. 
          SO NO MATTER, EVEN IF THEY WANTED TO, I THINK THE ONLY CLOSEST THING IT'S GONNA BE IS ELECTRIC. 
          LIKE I SAID, IF THAT EVER HAPPENS, BUT THEY, IT'S STILL NOT GONNA HAVE THE ANTILOCK BRAKES. 
          IT'S STILL NOT GONNA HAVE THE CRUMPLE ZONES OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. 
          BUT IT'LL, IT'D DEFINITELY BE QUIETER WITHOUT A DOUBT, BUT IT WOULD HAVE ITS OWN PROBLEMS. BUT I STILL THINK AN AGREEMENT WORKING WITH THE BUSINESSES. 
          I WANNA GO BACK TO WHAT THE VICE MAYOR SAID. 
          I WAS CONVINCED AFTER HAVING THE MEETINGS THAT WE HAD PUBLIC HERE AND, AND CLOSED MEETINGS THAT WE HAD JUST THE COMMITTEE, IT MIGHT PUT THEM OUTTA BUSINESS. 
          I DON'T WANNA PUT THEM OUTTA BUSINESS. 
          I JUST WANNA HAVE SAFER VEHICLES AS SAFE AS WE CAN GET IN OUR CITY. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          AND WHAT WAS REALLY RANG TRUE WITH ME, NOT ONLY WOULD I WOULD PUT THEM OUTTA BUSINESS, BUT THEIR EMPLOYEES CAME AND SAID HOW WELL THEY WERE PAID, HOW WELL THEY WERE TAKEN CARE OF. 
          AND THEY WERE WITH THIS COMPANY, ESPECIALLY RED ROCK, FOR TO, TO BEING ONE FOR YEARS. 
          THEY GREW UP IN THAT BUSINESS. 
          I DON'T WANNA PUT THAT OUTTA BUSINESS, I JUST DON'T, I JUST WANNA HAVE BUT MOVE THE, THE DIAL IN OUR DIRECTION. 
          AND I THINK IT'S NOT A LITTLE DIRECTION. 
          I THINK IT'S A GONNA GO FAR, NOT FAR ENOUGH, BUT IT'S A START. 
          AND WE, IT WAS MENTIONED BEFORE, WE CAN ALWAYS BRING BACK THE ORDINANCE. 
          IT'S NOT GOING AWAY. 
          AND I'M 
          [03:20:01]
NOT USING THAT AS A HAMMER. 
          I'M HOPING IT NEVER COMES TO, TO PASS. 
          BUT IF THE G S R C DECIDES NO PERMITS, IF THE FOREIGN SERVICE DECIDES NO PERMITS, WELL THEN WE GO WITH THE LEGAL ROUTE AND WE'LL GET SUED AND, BUT IT'S ANOTHER STEP THAT WE CAN TAKE. 
          SO I DO AGREE WITH EVERYTHING YOU SAID. 
          I WANNA GO BACK TO THAT. 
          BUT THIS IS A STEP FORWARD THAT WE CAN DO NOW. 
          SO OBVIOUSLY I DO SUPPORT, UH, THE AGREEMENT, BUT WE NEED TO GO BACK TO THE TABLE. 
          THERE WAS DISCUSSION BEFORE IN THREE WEEKS. 
          WE, WE TALKED ABOUT, AND INTERNALLY WE TALKED ABOUT THREE WEEKS. 
          I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS REALISTIC BECAUSE WE HAVE TO MEET WITH THE FOUR RENTAL COMPANIES. 
          WE HAVE A, A CONVENTION CONFERENCE THAT WE'RE GOING TO NEXT WEEK THAT'S GONNA LIMIT US ON HOW MUCH TIME WE CAN SPEND WITH THEM. 
          IT MAY NOT BE THREE WEEKS, IT MAY HAVE TO BE THE END OF SEPTEMBER. 
          I DON'T WANNA STOP PUTTING SOMETHING OUT THERE AND PULLING IT BACK AGAIN. 
          I WANT, 'CAUSE I WANT TO KEEP THIS DIALOGUE OPEN WITH THEM. 
          WE ARE MAKING PROGRESS AND IF WE CAN GET SOMETHING LIKE PETE SAID FOR THE TIRES, THAT'S SOMETHING WE HADN'T DISCUSSED, MAYBE WE SHOULD, I THINK WE SHOULD, UH, IF ANYTHING ELSE THAT WE CAN ADD TO IT THAT WE CAN MUTUALLY AGREE ON, IT'S ALL PART OF THE PROCESS OF WORKING TOGETHER. 
          SO, UH, KURT, DO YOU HAVE WHAT YOU NEED? YES, MR. MAYOR AND COUNSEL. 
          SO THE, IT SOUNDS LIKE THE DIRECTION, THE CONSENSUS WOULD BE TO PROCEED, UH, WITH CONTINUING THE O H V COMMITMENT, UH, LETTER FROM THE O H V RENTAL COMPANIES, UM, SEEING HOW MANY OF THESE COMMENTS WE CAN INCORPORATE FROM COUNCIL. 
          OKAY. 
          AND ANYBODY WANT TO ADD ANYTHING? COUNCILOR KINSELLA AND, AND THANK YOU. 
          I KNOW IN, IN THE ORDINANCE LANGUAGE, YOU, YOU KNOW, YOU'VE BEEN, UM, VERY RESPONSIVE TO COMMENTS THAT WE BROUGHT UP. 
          I SAW SOME CHANGES I HAD BEEN LOOKING FOR THAT WERE REFLECTED IN THERE. 
          SO I WANTED TO THANK YOU FOR THAT CURRENT, BUT ALSO ON THE COMPROMISE OR THE AGREEMENT LANGUAGE, IF WE'RE, IF THIS IS PROCEEDING FORWARD AND THERE WAS DIRECTION BEING LOOKED AT FROM THE GROUP THAT'S WORKING ON THAT, UM, I THINK TWO OF THE AREAS THAT I'D LIKE TO SEE ADDRESSED IN THAT ARE ONE STRONGER LANGUAGE AROUND EXACTLY HOW THE, UM, THE BUSINESSES WILL SUPPORT THE GOING FOR THE PERMITTING SYSTEM. 
          BECAUSE I THINK THAT IS IMPORTANT. 
          IF THERE IS, THAT IS GONNA, I UNDERSTAND ALL YOUR CONCERNS THAT YOU RAISE, BUT I THINK THE ONLY HOPE WE HAVE OF THE FOREST SERVICE LISTENING TO THAT IS WHEN THERE IS A SUPPORT FROM THE INDUSTRY AS WELL. 
          UM, SO I'D LIKE TITLE LANGUAGE AROUND THAT, ABOUT EXACTLY WHAT THAT MEANS. 
          SUPPORT, SUPPORT, HOW, UH, ADVOCATE WILL TESTIFY, WE'LL PUT IN LETTERS OF SUPPORT, WHATEVER THAT WORKS OUT. 
          BUT THAT'S THE DIRECTION. 
          AND THE SECOND AREA IN WHICH I'D LIKE TO GIVE SOME, I'D LIKE SOME CLARIFICATION IN TERMS OF THIS EVOLVING IS WHAT DOES INSPECTION MEAN? GOING BACK TO HOW WOULD WE DO THAT IF THERE'S, IF THERE ARE PHYSICAL COMPONENTS, I DON'T KNOW THAT THE CITY IS EQUIPPED TO DO ANY OF THAT AND WE DON'T HAVE, THIS IS LIKE CREATING ANOTHER DEPARTMENT. 
          WELL, WE DISCUSSED THAT. 
          I I'M SAYING THIS IS WHAT I WANT IN THE LANGUAGE GOING FORWARD TO BE INCLUDED. 
          SO IF THAT COULD, THOSE ARE THE TWO THINGS THAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE AND, AND I, I AGREE WITH YOU AND I WILL CONTACT TREAD LIGHTLY, UH, POSSIBLY THIS WEEK AND SEE IF THEIR INTEREST IN COLLABORATING WITH US ON, ON JUST WHAT YOU'RE ASKING ABOUT THE INSPECTIONS. 
          AND WE WILL DISCUSS THAT AT OUR NEXT MEETING WITH, WITH THE RENTAL COMPANIES AS WELL. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, ANYTHING ELSE? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          HEARING NOTHING ELSE, UH, WE WILL TAKE A 20 MINUTE BREAK. 
          WE WILL COME BACK AT, UH, EIGHT 15. 
          OKAY. 
          WE ARE BACK. 
          AND GLASSES AD 
          [8.d. AB 2986 Discussion/possible action regarding an Ordinance amending the Sedona City Code Title 13 (Public Services and Utilities) Division II (Storm Water) by amending Chapter 13.50 (Storm Water Discharge). (First Public Meeting).]
AB 29 86. 
          DISCUSSION, POSSIBLE ACTION REGARDING AN ORDINANCE. 
          GREAT. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, AMENDING, THIS IS ON CITY CODE TITLE 13, PUBLIC SERVICE AND UTILITIES DIVISION TWO, STORMWATER BY AMENDING CHAPTER 13.50 STORMWATER DISCHARGE. 
          THIS IS THE FIRST PUBLIC MEETING. 
          I KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          SANDY HANCO. 
          HANCO. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU SO MUCH MAYOR. 
          VICE MAYOR COUNCIL, THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE SO LATE AND GIVING ME THE, WELL, THE OTHER ONE THAT'S STICKING IT OUT, OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT TODAY INSTEAD OF PUSHING IT BACK. 
          I APPRECIATE THAT. 
          UM, AND I WILL TRY TO MAKE IT AS FAST AS POSSIBLE. 
          BUT HELLO, I AM HANUKAH ADA, I'M AN ASSISTANT ENGINEER IN PUBLIC WORKS. 
          YOU'RE OF COURSE FAMILIAR WITH MY SUPERVISOR, SANDY PHILLIPS. 
          UM, AND WE'RE HERE TO TALK ABOUT SOME PROPOSED CHANGES TO OUR STORMWATER DISCHARGE 
          [03:25:01]
CODE. 
          UM, AND I ONLY HAVE A FEW SLIDES. 
          I'M TRYING TO KEEP IT QUICK. 
          PLEASE FEEL FREE TO, TO STOP ME AND ASK ANY QUESTIONS. 
          WELL, THAT'S A BAD THING TO SAY. 
          OH, NO, . 
          OKAY. 
          UM, AND I'M HOPING THE VOLUME'S OKAY TOO. 
          UM, SO REAL QUICK HISTORY, WE'VE GOTTEN AN INCREASE IN COMPLAINTS REGARDING PRIVATE LOT TO LOT DRAINAGE. 
          AND TO BE FAIR, OF COURSE, WE EXPECT AN INCREASE RIGHT NOW DURING MONSOONS. 
          AND IN THE PAST YEAR OR SO, WE'VE PROBABLY HAD, YOU KNOW, ABOVE AVERAGE, UH, RAINFALL. 
          SO THAT'S FAIR. 
          UM, WE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A LOT OF PROBABLY NEW OUT OF STATE RESIDENTS TOO WHO AREN'T VERY USED TO OUR NORTHERN ARIZONA MONSOONS AND OUR TOPOGRAPHY. 
          AND OUR SOILS. 
          UM, AND SO WHETHER IT'S TO CODE ENFORCEMENT OR USUALLY STRAIGHT TO PUBLIC WORKS, WE'RE ABLE TO RESOLVE MOST ISSUES JUST WITH EDUCATION AND DIALOGUE. 
          UM, BUT THERE ARE SOME CERTAIN TIMES WHERE WE DO NEED TO GO THROUGH CODE ENFORCEMENT OR, OR WE DON'T ACTUALLY KNOW WHAT THE CAUSE WAS. 
          AND SO I'M SURE YOU'RE USED TO GETTING PHONE CALLS ALSO THAT SOUND LIKE MY NEIGHBOR IS DOING X, Y, Z AND NOW I AM BEING FLOODED. 
          OR, AND, AND FOR US IT COULD ACTUALLY GO IN THE OTHER DIRECTION. 
          MAYBE IT'S SOMEONE ALONG OAK CREEK WHO HAS WATER RIGHTS AND SOMEONE, OR A FLOOD EVENT, CHANGE SOME TOPOGRAPHY AND NOW THEY'RE NOT GETTING ANYTHING. 
          UM, BUT OUR HANDS ARE PRETTY TIED AT THAT POINT BECAUSE AS YOU CAN SEE ON THE IMAGE, DRAINAGE DOESN'T CARE ABOUT PROPERTY LINES. 
          UM, BUT WE DO, I CAN'T JUST GO TRESPASS AND, AND INVESTIGATE. 
          UM, SO MOST OF THE TIME, YOU KNOW, WE GIVE THEM OUR STORM DRAINAGE CODE, SOME RECOMMENDATIONS. 
          UM, BUT THEN DOING, SO WE NOTICED A FEW WEAKNESSES IN OUR STORM CODE. 
          SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE TODAY TRYING TO DO A LOT OF, MY PHRASE TODAY IS GOING TO BE CLARIFICATION AND REDUNDANCY. 
          SO TRYING TO MAKE IT A LITTLE BIT MORE STRONG. 
          AND SO, LUCKILY WE ALREADY HAVE THIS ARIZONA REVISED STATUTE THAT STATES IT IS UNLAWFUL FOR A PERSON ENGAGED IN ANY DEVELOPMENT OR TO DIVERT, RETARD OR OBSTRUCT THE FLOW OF WATERS IN A WATER COURSE. 
          UM, KEEP THAT KEYWORD IN MIND WITHOUT FOR SECURING WRITTEN AUTHORIZATION OR IN OUR CASE IT WOULD BE PERMITS, RIGHT? UM, AND SO IT'S GREAT WHEN WE DO GET PERMITS, I, I'M ONE OF THE REVIEWERS FOR THIS. 
          YOU KNOW, WE LOOK AT YOUR TOPOGRAPHY SURROUNDING YOU, WHERE IS YOUR WATER COMING FROM? WHERE IS THE WATER SUPPOSED TO BE GOING? HOW IS YOUR DEVELOPMENT GOING TO IMPACT THAT? AND THEN WE COME UP WITH CONDITIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS TO TRY TO MITIGATE THOSE NEGATIVE IMPACTS, RIGHT? AND SO IT WORKS GREAT WHEN PEOPLE GET PERMITS. 
          UM, BUT OF COURSE YOU HAD MENTIONED WE'RE NOT IN A PUBLIC AND WE'RE NOT IN A PERFECT WORLD. 
          UM, SO OF COURSE WE, WE RUN INTO SOME ISSUES AND LET'S SEE, AND IT'S USUALLY A CIVIL MATTER BECAUSE IT'S BETWEEN TWO PRIVATE PROPERTIES. 
          UM, SO OUR HANDS ARE A LITTLE BIT TIED, BUT WE WANT IT TO STRENGTHEN THE CODE SO AT LEAST THE RESIDENTS HAVE SOMETHING TO POINT AT IF IT GOES TO LITIGATION, ATTORNEYS AND JUDGES HAVE SOMETHING TO LOOK AT. 
          UM, SO YEAH. 
          OH, AND I WANTED TO, WANTED TO MAKE IT VERY CLEAR THAT THE CHANGES I'M MAKING OR OR I'M PROPOSING TO THE CODE DOES NOT ACTUALLY CHANGE ANY, THE WAY I DO MY REVIEWS, THE WAY PEOPLE BUILD THINGS. 
          IT'S JUST, AGAIN, CLARIFICATION. 
          SO IT'S NOT GOING TO PROHIBIT ANYONE FROM DEVELOPING OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. 
          AND I'M GONNA GO A LITTLE BIT MORE INTO DETAIL. 
          OKAY? ALRIGHT. 
          SO THE FIRST CHANGE, PRETTY CLEAR AND SIMPLE, UM, THIS, I BELIEVE WAS IN YOUR PERMIT PACKAGE 96 THROUGH 97. 
          THE WHOLE, I THINK, 17 PAGE CODES IN THERE. 
          I, UM, DON'T, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE, IF YOU HAVE SOME INSOMNIA, I HIGHLY RECOMMEND IT. 
          UM, BUT I'VE, I'VE TRIED TO CONDENSE IT ALL IN INTO MY PRESENTATION. 
          SO THE FIRST CHANGE, SO THIS PURPOSE AND INTENT SECTION ALREADY EXISTS IN OUR CODE. 
          UM, BUT IT REALLY FOCUSES ON THE PUBLIC RIGHT OF WAY AND PUBLIC STORM DRAIN SYSTEM AND REMEDIATION MONITORING, REPORTING ILLICIT DISCHARGES. 
          AND IT REALLY FOCUSES MORE ON THE CHEMICAL QUALITY SIDE OF STORMWATER RATHER THAN THE PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTICS OR, OR PUBLIC, UM, PARCELS AND PUBLIC LAND. 
          SO I'VE ADDED THIS SECOND IN RED SUBSECTION DISCUSSING REGULATION OF STORMWATER RUNOFF AND LOT DRAINAGE TRYING TO ENCOMPASS BOTH THE CHEMICAL AND PHYSICAL PROPERTIES OF STORMWATER AS WELL AS THE PRIVATE SIDE. 
          SO, SO THAT'S JUST THE ONE. 
          [03:30:01]
UM, THAT'S THE FIRST CHANGE YOU HAVE. 
          ANY QUESTIONS, PLEASE FEEL FREE TO STOP. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          SECOND CHANGE. 
          THIS IS, THIS IS THE MEAT OF IT. 
          UM, AND IT'S VERY, VERY, VERY SIMILAR TO THE PREVIOUS A R S LANGUAGE THAT I SAID EARLIER ABOUT. 
          SO IT'S THE SECTIONS ON LOT DRAINAGE. 
          IT STILL SAYS IT SHALL BE UNLAWFUL FOR ANY PERSON'S OR ENTITY TO ALTER ANY NATURAL DRAINAGE COURSE, TOPOGRAPHY, EXISTING DRAINAGE. 
          UM, AND, AND NOTICE HOW I SPECIFICALLY DIDN'T USE THE WORD WATERCOURSE LIKE IT DID IN A R S AND THAT'S BECAUSE I, I WANTED TO GO A LITTLE BIT ONE STEP FURTHER. 
          A R S IS A MINIMUM STANDARD. 
          AND I WANTED TO CLARIFY BY SAYING THAT AN ALTERATION ALSO INCLUDES ANY CHANGE TO SURFACE SHEET FLOW, UM, BY OBSTRUCTION OF DIVERSION THROUGH FENCES, BERMS, CURBS, WHAT HAVE YOU. 
          AND AGAIN, WE'RE NOT PROHIBITING YOU FROM BUILDING ANY OF THESE THINGS. 
          I JUST WANNA SEE A PERMIT SO THEN I CAN GIVE THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS ON HOW THAT IMPROVEMENT IS NOT GOING TO NEGATIVELY IMPACT YOUR NEIGHBORS. 
          RIGHT? UM, THE WRITTEN APPROVAL BY THE CITY ENGINEER, OF COURSE, THAT WOULD BE A APPROVED PERMIT, WHETHER THAT'S A BUILDING GRADING FENCE, UM, AND THEN THE SECOND SUBSECTION TALKING ABOUT REDUNDANCY AND CLARIFICATION, UNLAWFUL TO CHANGE NOT JUST THE QUALITY, BUT ALSO THE FLOW RATES OR FLOW PATTERNS OF SURFACE RUNOFF WHERE IT ENTERS OR EXITS A PROPERTY. 
          AND SO THAT'S REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT, RIGHT? WE'RE WE'RE TRYING TO, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT TRYING TO TAKE AWAY DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS WHATSOEVER. 
          I DON'T CARE WHAT YOU DO WITH THE WATER ONCE IT'S ON YOUR LAND, BUT AS, AS LONG AS IT ENTERS YOUR PROPERTY AND EXITS YOUR PROPERTY IN THE SAME LOCATION AND MANNER BECAUSE YOUR NEIGHBORS ARE ALSO EXPECTING TO ACCEPT THE WATER FROM THIS DIRECTION IN THIS MANNER IN THE HISTORIC WAY, RIGHT? SO THEN IF YOU CHANGE THAT SUDDENLY, THEN, THEN ALL HELL BREAKS LOOSE. 
          UM, SO WE GET ABOUT 20 COMPLAINTS A YEAR, UM, FROM OBSTRUCTION FROM LOT TO LOT DRAINAGE. 
          AND BECAUSE, UH, CITY OF SEDONA IS NOT MASQUERADED, A LOT OF PEOPLE COME FROM, YOU KNOW, OUT OF TOWN AND THEY'RE USED TO A MASQUERADED WHERE ALL THE FLOWS ARE KICKED TO THE STREET. 
          WHAT, WHAT, WHERE YOU JUST, YOU DON'T FOLLOW THE EXISTING CONTOURS OF THE LAND, YOU JUST FLATTEN THE LAND AND MAKE EVERYTHING FLOW OUT TO THE STREET. 
          SO WE HAVEN'T DONE THAT. 
          WE LIKE OUR UNDULATIONS AND OUR HILLS AND OUR TREES, AND SO WE KEEP ALL THAT. 
          AND SO THE DRAINAGE PATTERNS GO FROM BACKYARD TO BACKYARD. 
          AND SO WHAT HAPPENS IS SOMEONE WILL SAY, I DON'T WANT THAT COMING IN MY YARD ANYMORE, AND THEY'LL BUILD A WALL. 
          AND SO WHAT THIS IS DOING, AND THAT ADVERSELY IMPACTS THE UPSTREAM. 
          AND SO, AND IT ALSO THE NEIGHBORS, BECAUSE WHEN YOU BLOCK IT, IT GOES AROUND YOUR LOT ONTO YOUR NEIGHBORS AND IT NEVER HAD. 
          SO THAT'S THE INTENT. 
          SO SANDY, I'VE SEEN IN THE CHAPEL NEIGHBORHOOD NEW CONSTRUCTION MM-HMM. 
           WHERE I GUESS ENGINEERING OR YOU GUYS WOULD TELL A DEVELOPER IF THEY HAVE A, IF THEY'RE PART OF THE FLOOD ZONE, THEY HAVE TO BUILD A, YOU KNOW, THEY CAN'T STOP THE WATER FROM COMING ON. 
          THEY HAVE TO DIRECT IT INTO A, A POND MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO IT, THAT'S NOT A BAD THING, RIGHT? NO, THAT'S PART OF OUR DETENTION BECAUSE IT USED TO BE GROUND, AND SO IT USED TO SINK IN, BUT WHEN YOU BUILD A HOUSE AND PUT PAVERS AND A HARD SURFACE, IT CAN NO LONGER SINK IN. 
          SO IT'S, WE'RE TRYING TO OFFSET THAT, UM, FLOW THAT COULD GO DOWNSTREAM. 
          WHAT ABOUT WHERE YOU HAVE THE ON PROPERTY SWALES AND PEOPLE BLOCK IT OR THEY DON'T CLEAN IT? WELL, THERE'S BIG THING IS JAVELINA, MONDAY, TUESDAY, WEDNESDAY, KNOCK OVER THE, THE TRASH CANS OF O H V, UH, O H V SDRS AND THEY DON'T GET CLEANED RIGHT AWAY AND THEY BLOCK THE, THE WATERWAY. 
          NOW WHAT'S THE ISSUE FOR THAT NOW THAT'S CAUSING A, A BLOCKAGE AND IT GOES ON TO SOMEONE ELSE'S PROPERTY. 
          WOULD THIS HELP FOR ANY KIND OF ENFORCEMENT WITH THAT? WELL, WE WOULD LOVE FOR PEOPLE TO BE GOOD NEIGHBORS AND NOT HAVE TO GO THERE. 
          HAVE TO BE THERE IN ORDER TO BE GOOD. 
          YEAH. 
          AND SO WE REALLY, IT'S REALLY A NEIGHBOR TO NEIGHBOR ISSUE. 
          LIKE, UH, HANUKAH LET OFF IS, UM, IT'S NOT SOMETHING, IF IT'S NOT IN THE PUBLIC RIGHT OF WAY, THEN IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT WE'RE GONNA GET INVOLVED WITH UNLESS THERE'S A PERMIT APPLICATION OF SOMEONE, UH, BLOCKING SOMETHING, AND THEN WE'RE GONNA ASK THEM TO CLEAN THAT UP AS PART OF THE PERMIT. 
          AND IF IT WAS REALLY SERIOUS, LIKE AN ILLICIT DISCHARGE, THEN THERE WOULD BE YEAH, SOME METHODS. 
          BUT, UM, OKAY. 
          ANY QUESTIONS ON THE LOT DRAINAGE? AWESOME. 
          ALL RIGHT, THIS IS THE LAST ONE. 
          I PROMISE I'M GOING FAST. 
          UM, SO IN MY RESEARCH OF OTHER TOWNS DRAINAGE CODES, THIS ONE'S NOT NECESSARILY A LOT TO LOT DRAINAGE, BUT I THOUGHT IT WAS A REALLY GREAT LIABILITY WAIVER TO INCLUDE, UM, AND ESSENTIALLY 
          [03:35:01]
ABSOLVES THE CITY OF POOR CONSTRUCTION OR INSUFFICIENT DESIGN. 
          SO IT SAYS, YOU KNOW, WE REVIEWED AND APPROVED YOUR PLAN BASED ON OUR ORDINANCES, WHICH ARE MINIMUM STANDARDS, BUT IF YOU DESIGNED IT INCORRECTLY OR BUILT IT INCORRECTLY, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT OUR PROBLEM. 
          UM, AND THEN ON THE OPPOSITE END, THE SECOND HIGHLIGHT I REALLY LIKED BECAUSE IT'S, IT SAYS IT, YOU'RE NOT GUARANTEED, EVEN IF YOU HAVE AN ENGINEERED STRUCTURE, YOU'RE NOT GUARANTEED TO BE FREE FROM FLOODS, GEOLOGIC DISASTERS, RIGHT? YOU'RE NEVER FREE, WE, YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO IT. 
          THERE'S ALWAYS GONNA BE A POSSIBILITY OF FAILURE. 
          UM, SO JUST ADDITIONAL LIABILITY AND, UM, JUST COVERING OURSELVES AND THEY THOUGHT THAT WAS GOOD. 
          SO PART OF THE PROBLEM IS, UM, WE GET PLANS AND, AND WE'RE REQUIRED TO TURN THOSE PLANS AROUND AND WE GIVE AS THOROUGH RED LINES AS WE CAN ON THOSE PLANS. 
          BUT SOMETIMES THE PLANS ARE SKETCHES TO START OFF AND WE DO THE BEST WE CAN TO GIVE THEM FEEDBACK. 
          AND THEN WHEN WE GET THE SECOND ONE, WE CATCH EVERYTHING WE POSSIBLY CAN. 
          BUT YOU SOMETIMES THE, THERE'S, YOU KNOW, IF YOU GET A COMPLETE PLAN THAT PAINTS EVERYTHING CLEARLY, THEN YOUR COMMENTS AND THAT'S IT. 
          AND WE CAN APPROVE THE PERMIT, BUT SOMETIMES WE GET PLANS THAT ARE NOT COMPLETE. 
          AND SO WE'RE TRYING TO APPROVE THE PERMIT AND GET THE PROJECT MOVING FORWARD AS FAST AS POSSIBLE. 
          SO THIS, UM, JUST HELPS THE SITUATION. 
          YEAH. 
          AND REALLY EMPHASIZING THAT RESPONSIBILITY OF GOOD DESIGN ON THE OWNER AND DESIGNER RATHER THAN US DOING THE QC. 
          UM, SO THOSE ARE ALL, THAT'S IT FOR JUST THE CHANGES. 
          HERE ARE A COUPLE OF EXCELLENT, UM, PERMITTED EXAMPLES. 
          I HAVE NO INTEREST IN POSTING VIOLATIONS IN PUBLIC SHAMING. 
          UM, BUT THIS LEFT, UH, THIS LEFT PICTURE IS A GREAT EXAMPLE OF A WALL THAT IF IT DIDN'T HAVE THESE HOLES, IT WOULD STOP SHEET FLOW. 
          BUT THEY HAD, BUT WE, YOU KNOW, WE JUST ASK FOR THESE SIMPLE THINGS LIKE PERIODIC OPENING SO THAT YOU CAN CONTINUE TO MOVE THE WATER. 
          THIS PICTURE ON THE RIGHT IS A GREAT EXAMPLE OF DOING A LOT OF ALTERATIONS ON THE PRIVATE SIDE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, IF IT'S COMMERCIAL, YOU WANNA MAXIMIZE YOUR LAND, RIGHT? SO IF YOU HAVE DRAINAGES, THIS PERSON JUST INSIDE OF THEIR PROPERTY LINE, SO IT'S ALL UNDISTURBED ON THIS SIDE AND JUST INSIDE THEIR PROPERTY LINE, THEY'RE CATCHING THE WATER, PUTTING IT IN A CULVERT, PUTTING IT UNDERGROUND, SO THEN THEY HAVE MORE DEVELOPABLE SPACE. 
          IT STILL EXITS THE PROPERTY AT THE SAME LOCATION HISTORICALLY. 
          UM, BUT, SO YEAH, THESE ARE JUST A COUPLE OF OPTIONS ARE EASY. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          YEAH. 
          AND SO IT'S NOT OBTRUSIVE WHAT WE'RE YEAH. 
          REQUESTS WE'RE, WE'RE NOT, YEAH, WE'RE, WE'RE NOT TRYING TO BE UNREASONABLE. 
          AGAIN, THESE ARE ALREADY THINGS THAT WE ASK FOR. 
          WE'RE JUST TRYING TO BE A LITTLE BIT CLEARER, UM, AND REDUNDANT. 
          SO THAT IS ALL. 
          ANY QUESTIONS? YEAH, GO AHEAD PETE. 
          THANKS, KO. 
          I JUST WANT, AND I THINK YOU JUST ANSWERED MY QUESTION, BUT I WANT TO JUST PUT IT IN A, IN A DIFFERENT WAY AND HAVE YOU ANSWER IT AGAIN IN 71 AND 72 WHERE YOU'VE ADDED EXTRA LANGUAGE. 
          IS IT IN ANY WAY REQUIRING DEVELOPERS TO SPEND MORE TIME OR MONEY PUTTING TOGETHER THEIR PLANS? NO. 
          THIS IS A REQUIREMENT THAT'S ALREADY IN PLACE AND WE'RE CLARIFYING THE EXISTING LANGUAGE. 
          YEAH, THAT'S, THAT. 
          IT'S NOT JUST APPLICABLE. 
          OH, KATHY, SO HANUKKAH, DID YOU SAY, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I HAVE THIS RIGHT, THAT THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO WATER COURSES. 
          SO I JUST WANNA KNOW WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF SOMEBODY, UM, HAS WATER RIGHTS ALONG THE CREEK AND SOMETHING THEY ALTER SOMETHING THAT WOULD AFFECT THE DOWNSTREAM FLOW. 
          YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. 
          SO I JUST DIDN'T USE THE WORD WATER COURSE BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE THAT LIMITS IT TO VERY CLEAR CHANNELS. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          UM, SO I INSTEAD I USED, SO WE INCLUDE NATURAL DRAINAGE COURSE, WHICH WOULD ALSO INCLUDE THAT, BUT ALSO TOPOGRAPHY AND, AND SHEET FLOW SO THAT, SO IT STILL INCLUDES WATER COURSES. 
          SO IF SOMEBODY DID DO SOMETHING IN THE CREEK, THEN THAT THIS WOULD BE COVERED. 
          YEAH. 
          AND THEN MY OTHER QUESTION IS IF IT'S, IF IT IS SOMETHING, BECAUSE I, I GET THE PART ABOUT THE OVERLAND FLOW AND EVERYTHING, IT MAKES COMPLETE SENSE TO ME, THE SURFACE. 
          BUT THEN, BUT HOW DO WE COORDINATE, AND THIS MIGHT BE A LEGAL QUESTION, I DON'T KNOW, UM, WITH OTHER REGULATORY AGENCIES WHEN IT COMES TO SOMETHING LIKE THE CREEK, BECAUSE WOULDN'T THE ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEERS OR THE COUNTY OR SOMEBODY LIKE WHAT, WHAT, HOW DOES THIS ORDINANCE LANGUAGE AFFECT THE INTERACTION BETWEEN THE DIFFERENT ENTITIES? IT DOES NOT SUCH GOOD QUESTION. 
          SO IT'S A FLOOD, YOU KNOW, FEMA FLOODPLAIN FOR OAK CREEK AND SO IT'S OKAY. 
          AND WE'RE IN CONSTANT, VERY CLOSE COMMUNICATION WITH ALL THOSE OTHER AGENCIES TOO. 
          SO IT FITS PERFECTLY. 
          THERE'S NO, AND IF THEY'RE 
          [03:40:01]
TOUCHING OAK CREEK, THERE'S WHOLE OTHER ISSUES. 
          YEAH. 
          NOT JUST OURS, SO. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          ALRIGHT, MAKE A COMMENT WHEN WE'RE OKAY. 
          JUST WANNA BE SURE. 
          OKAY. 
          NO OTHER QUESTIONS. 
          WE'LL OPEN THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD. 
          I SEE THERE'S NO CARDS, THERE'S NO PEOPLE. 
          SO WE'LL CLOSE THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD. 
          LET'S GO TO, UH, COMMENTS. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU FOR MAKING AN ORDINANCE READING INTERESTING. 
          AFTER 8:00 PM I RECOMMEND YOU PRESENT ALL FUTURE ORDINANCES ON BEHALF OF THE CITY WHEN THEY COME AFTER 8:00 PM THANK YOU MAYOR . 
          I'LL SECOND THAT. 
          MELISSA, ANY SMILE? SHE DOES ALL THE TIME. 
          , YOU DID A GOOD JOB AND I APPRECIATE THE CLARITY. 
          UM, LIKE I HAD MENTIONED TO SANDY, I WAS, MY FIRST READING, I WENT, OH MY GOD, THIS IS GONNA REALLY BE HORRIBLE 'CAUSE I HAVE A PERSONAL PERMIT WAITING . 
          UM, BUT UM, IT'S REALLY CLEARLY WRITTEN. 
          I DON'T KNOW IF YOU JUST PRESENTING OR IF YOU ACTUALLY WROTE IT, BUT IT'S VERY CLEAR IN THE WRITING AND, UM, YOU PRESENTED IT IN A REALLY, IN A REALLY CLEAR AND ACTUALLY QUITE CONCISE WAY. 
          SO THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          I'D LIKE TO THANK OUR ATTORNEY, OUR ASSISTANT ATTORNEY, DOUG, FOR OUR HELP. 
          THANK YOUR MOTHER. 
          OKAY. 
          HOLLY, I SUPPORT ANYTHING THAT CLARIFIES COMPLICATED LANGUAGE SO THAT PEOPLE HAVE UNDERSTAND WHAT THE EXPECTATIONS ARE. 
          SO THANK YOU FOR DOING THAT AND TAKING THE BULL BY THE HORN AND MOVING IT FORWARD. 
          OKAY. 
          THANKS. 
          APPRECIATE IT, KATHY. 
          SO I SEE WHERE THESE CLARIFICATIONS WILL ACTUALLY REALLY HELP OUR CITIZENS THAT MIGHT BE HAVING A DISPUTE. 
          SO THIS GOES A LONG WAY AND I AM JUST JUICED BY YOUR ENTHUSIASM FOR IT. 
          SO THANK YOU . 
          THANK YOU. 
          I'LL HAVE MORE CODES COMING UP TOO, SO, ALRIGHT. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          PETE, DITO. 
          NOTHING FURTHER. 
          ADD, MAYOR. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          CAN I HAVE, THIS IS THE FIRST READING. 
          UH, CAN I HAVE A MOTION? OH, YOU GO, GO RIGHT AHEAD. 
          THERE'S, THERE'S NO MOTION. 
          NO, I MOVED BECAUSE IT'S THE FIRST READ. 
          OH, I SEE. 
          THAT'S HOW YOU, SO IT'S, IT'S LISTED THERE AND I, I LEFT IT FOR ACTION FOR FUTURE NOTICE OF COUNSEL COUNCIL IN CASE THERE'S EVER AN EMERGENCY. 
          AND COUNCIL WANTED TO PASS IT AS AN EMERGENCY. 
          OH, AN EMERGENCY. 
          BUT THERE'S NOT ONE TONIGHT. 
          YOU SURE? OKAY. 
          IT MAY BE RAINING, SO. 
          OKAY. 
          ALL RIGHT THEN. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          REPORTS, DISCUSSION, UH, REGARDING COUNCIL ASSIGNMENTS. 
          DO WE HAVE ANYTHING TO REPORT? OKAY. 
          NOTHING. 
          UH, LET'S SEE. 
          [8.e. Discussion/possible action regarding future meeting/agenda items. ]
FUTURE MEETING AND AGENDA ITEMS. WE HAVE A MEETING DOWN IN TUCSON COMING UP ON TUESDAY. 
          LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING ALL OF YOU THERE. 
          AND IF WE, IF THERE'S NOTHING ELSE, THEN THIS MEETING IS 
          [10. ADJOURNMENT]
ADJOURNED. 
          THANK YOU.
* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.