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NUMBERS.[1.CALL TO ORDER/PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE/MOMENT OF SILENCE]
CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER.PLEASE JOIN ME FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
AND TWO, THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS.
ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVIDUAL WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL, AND A MOMENT OF SILENCE.
UH, MADAM CLERK, WOULD YOU PLEASE READ THE ROLL CALL, PLEASE? MAYOR JALO.
[3.a.AB 2719 Presentation/discussion/possible direction regarding the draft CommunityPlan 2023.]
SPECIAL BUSINESS THREE.DISCUSSION, POSSIBLE DIRECTION REGARDING THE THE DRAFT COMMITTEE PLAN 2023.
SO TODAY WE ARE GOING TO GO THROUGH THE COMMUNITY PLAN UPDATE PROCESS.
AND WE, LET ME JUST ACTUALLY SWITCH OVER HERE SO WE HAVE A LITTLE AGENDA FOR OUR PRESENTATION.
UH, SO WE WILL BE STARTING OUT WITH AN OVERVIEW OF ALL OF THE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT OVER THE LAST TWO YEARS.
UM, AND WE WILL HAVE, UM, OUR PARTNERS, WE'VE GOT ANDY ROGERS AND CARRIE EBERLY FROM SOUTHWEST DECISION RESOURCES.
AND THEY'LL GO THROUGH THAT AND THEN SHIFT OVER.
I WILL START OFF TALKING ABOUT THE PLAN.
WE'LL DO SOME MORE GENERAL DISCUSSION ABOUT THE SCOPE OF THE PLAN, SOME OF THE CHANGES WITH THE LAST PLAN.
UM, AND THEN THE THOUGHT IS TO GO THROUGH EACH CHAPTER AND SO YOU CAN ASK QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS AS WE GO.
AND SO THINGS LIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, IF THERE WAS A PLANNING AND ZONING, UH, COMMISSION ADDED A POLICY, FOR EXAMPLE, WHEN WE GET TO THAT CHAPTER, I CAN ADDRESS IT THERE.
UM, THAT WILL BE, I THINK, CLEANER AND, AND KNOWING FULL WELL THAT WE'LL PROBABLY BE DOING, JUMPING BACK AND FORTH ON CHAPTERS, WHICH IS, WHICH IS FINE AND EXPECTED, UM, SAFETY BEFORE YOU MOVE FORWARD.
UH, I SEE WE HAVE ONE MEMBER OF THE COMMUNITY, UH, IN THE AUDIENCE TODAY,
AND WAS JUST WONDERING HOW WE'RE HANDLING COMMUNITY, UH, INPUT, RIGHT? GIVEN WHAT CYNTHIA JUST DESCRIBED, AND WHETHER WE'RE GONNA MAKE ONE PERSON WAIT RIGHT.
ALL THE WAY TO THE END, OR WHAT WAS THE PLAN ON THAT? THAT'S A GOOD, GOOD THOUGHT.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE JOHN, UH, JOHN'S COMMENT WOULD WANNA COME IN.
I ORIGINALLY, IF WE HAD A LOT OF PEOPLE, I WASN'T PLANNING ON TAKING ANY PUBLIC COMMENT.
'CAUSE THIS IS A WORK SESSION AND WE, WE HAVE A LOT, I DON'T EVEN KNOW IF THREE HOURS WILL COVER WHAT WE HAVE.
SO, BUT BEING, WE HAVE A VERY ESTEEM, UH, MEMBER OF THE COMMUNITY HERE, I DON'T THINK HAVING ONE PERSON TO SPEAK WOULD BE, UH, THAT DAUNTING TO US.
UM, JOHN, YOU WANT TO COME IN SOON OR YOU WANT TO, UH, YOU HAVE TO FILL OUT A CARD.
UH, YOU COULD DO THE, THE CARD AFTER.
UH, MS. MAYOR, IF THIS, IF THIS IS A PROBLEM AND, UM, I CAN, I CAN WRITE A, A COUPLE COMMENTS AND, AND SEND THEM INTO YOU.
I DON'T WANNA, NO, UM, WELL JUST START WITH THE NAME AND I, DO YOU LIVE IN SEDONA? I THINK I DON'T, YES.
UH, JOHN GRIFFIN, UM, LIVE IN SEDONA.
UM, SO DO YOU, ARE YOU, DO YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH ME DOING A, A SHORT NO.
UM, ANYWAY, I, I HAD, YOU KNOW, I HAD ORIGINALLY PLANNED TO DO, UM, TO GIVE A SMALL HISTORY LESSON.
I HATE TO SAY THAT WORD, UM, ABOUT, UM, SEDONAS IGNORING SOME OF THE SIGNS OF THE FUTURE HOUSING, UH, PROBLEMS, UH, EVEN QUOTING, UH, AN ARTICLE THAT, UM, THAT WAS WRITTEN, UH, AFTER AN, I HAD AN INTERVIEW WHILE I WAS, UM, ON THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION, AND IT WAS CALLED
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SOLVE NOW OR PAY LATER.AND, UM, WHERE I DISCUSSED THE, THE LACK OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING, BUT THAT WAS IN 2001.
SO, UM, BUT THAT WAS THEN AND, AND, AND WE ARE HERE NOW, SO, BUT IN RECENT YEARS, UM, THE CITY HAS PLAYED CATCHUP, UH, AND MADE SOME POSITIVE STEPS FORWARD, UM, INCLUDING THE PURCHASE OF THE, UH, CULTURAL PARK LAND, UM, WHICH I FEEL IS, WAS AN IMPORTANT DECISION, UM, AND WILL EVENTUALLY BE, UM, A HUGE BENEFIT TO THE CITY.
BUT AS I'VE TALKED TO SOME OF YOU, UM, PERSONALLY ABOUT THIS, I, I DON'T THINK THE CITY CAN SOLVE THIS TOTAL PROBLEM.
AND, UM, SO I THINK CHANGES NEED TO BE MADE TO REALLY, UM, CONVINCE THE PUBLIC AND PRIVATE DEVELOPERS AND ALL TO HELP US SOLVE THIS HOUSING PROBLEM.
UM, AS FAR AS THE UPDATED COMMUNITY PLAN, UH, THESE MINOR CHANGES AND ALL, I HAVE REVIEWED THEM, BUT, UM, I'M NOT SURE HOW MUCH OF A DIFFERENCE, UM, THEY WILL MAKE IN, AGAIN, TRYING TO SOLVE THIS DIFFICULT PROBLEM.
UM, AND I WISHED I KNEW WHETHER OR NOT THEY WOULD, THEY, THEY WOULD HELP IN WHETHER OR NOT THIS WILL PULL US OUT OF THIS DILEMMA THAT WE'RE IN RIGHT NOW.
I DO KNOW THAT OTHER COMMUNITIES, UH, ALL OVER THE WEST ARE DEALING WITH THIS SAME WITH THIS SAME PROBLEM.
AND, UM, SOME ARE REV, UH, REVISING THEIR LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THEIR ZONING.
UM, BUT MEANWHILE, THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING SHORTAGE SHORTAGES ARE AFFECTING NOT ONLY THE QUALITY OF OUR LIFE, BUT THE EDUCATION OF OUR CHILDREN BY LIMITING GOOD TEACHERS WHO CAN'T AFFORD TO LIVE HERE AS A SCHOOL BOARD MEMBER, THIS SITUATION FOR ME IS UNACCEPTABLE.
AND, UM, THERE'S AN APPROPRIATE QUOTE, A QUOTE THAT MY WIFE GAVE TO ME WHILE I WAS KIND OF STRUGGLING WITH THIS, AND IT SAID, WE WON'T SOLVE, UM, A PROBLEM USING THE SAME TOOLS THAT CREATED IT.
SO I HOPE THAT WE CAN MAKE SOME CHANGES TO THE EXISTING TOOLS THAT WE HAVE IN THE FUTURE.
I APPRECIATE YOUR ALLOWING ME TO, OF COURSE, SPEAK BRIEFLY.
UH, AND HAND IT TO THE, THE DEPUTY CLERK.
BRIAN, WAS THERE ANYTHING ELSE THAT YOU WANTED TO TOUCH ON? THAT WAS IT, MAYOR.
UM, I DON'T THINK I, DID I FINISH THIS
THANKS FOR HAVING US MAYOR, VICE MAYOR AND COUNSELORS.
WE'VE BEEN ON A LONG JOURNEY WITH YOU AND A COUPLE DIFFERENT ARENAS IN SEDONA OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS.
I'M GONNA TALK JUST BRIEFLY TODAY AND MY COLLEAGUE CARRIE WILL INTRODUCE HERSELF HERE IN A MINUTE.
SO I'LL JUST KIND OF GET US GOING.
UM, WE'RE GONNA BE TALKING ABOUT THE ROBUST COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT THAT WE'VE HAD, THE PRIVILEGE OF HELPING CYNTHIA AND THE TEAM, UM, AND SOME OF YOU AS WELL OVER THE LAST COUPLE YEARS.
AND AS A REMINDER, YOU HAVE ALL OF THAT IN THIS DOCUMENT, THIS COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT DOCUMENT.
SO WE'LL BE BRIEFLY JUST GOING OVER SOME OF THE, THE HIGHLIGHTS OF WHAT WE'VE DONE, BUT YOU CAN FIND MORE DETAIL IN THIS DOCUMENT.
SO, LIKE I SAID, WE'VE BEEN, WE'VE BEEN AT THIS FOR ABOUT THE LAST 22 MONTHS.
AND AS A REMINDER, NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE.
THIS IS WHAT YOUR COMMUNITY SAID ABOUT SEDONA EARLY ON IN THE KICKOFF WORKSHOP.
AND I THINK THESE WORD CLOUDS CAN BE REALLY POWERFUL AND YOU'LL SEE THAT THESE LARGER WORDS, WHICH INDICATE MORE PEOPLE SAID IT ARE CARRIED OUT THROUGHOUT THE DOCUMENT IN DISCUSSIONS, IN NOTES, AND SOMETIMES IN POLICIES THROUGHOUT ALL OF THE CHAPTERS WITHIN THE PLAN.
AND I WANTED TO TALK JUST A LITTLE BIT ABOUT OUR ENGAGEMENT APPROACH.
SO WE ARRIVED BACK IN MARCH OF 2022, AND WE INHERITED A LOVELY CITIZEN WORK GROUP, AND CARRIE WILL TALK ABOUT THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE.
THANKS BRIAN, FOR BEING A PART OF THAT FOR A LITTLE WHILE.
AND WE HAD A LOOSE IDEA THAT WAS PUT TOGETHER, EXCUSE ME, A GOOD IDEA PUT TOGETHER BY THE CITY.
BUT WE KNOW THAT COMMUNITIES AND HUMANS ARE ARE PET MESSY, RIGHT? AND SO OUR APPROACH TO ENGAGEMENT
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IS ALWAYS ONE OF, OF EQUITY AND INCLUSIVITY, ROBUST PARTICIPATION TO THE, AS MUCH AS WE CAN AND HAVING A CLEAR COLLABORATIVE PROCESS OVER TIME.BUT THOSE COLLABORATIVE PROCESSES CAN CHANGE, RIGHT? AND WE REALLY BELIEVE IN THIS PLACE-BASED, ITERATIVE APPROACH, AND IT'S DESERVING OF EVERY COMMUNITY THAT WE WORK IN.
AND SO WE'VE ORGANIZED THE NEXT SECTION OF COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT SLIDES BASED ON WHAT WE DID AND WHAT WE LEARNED.
AND EACH TIME WE DID SOMETHING AND LEARNED SOMETHING, WE MODIFIED APPROACH A LITTLE BIT IN ORDER TO CONTINUE TO DRILL DEEPER IN A SPECIFIC TOPIC.
AND SO CARRIE'S GONNA GO THROUGH THIS IN DEPTH, BUT WE SPLIT OUR ENGAGEMENT INTO THREE PARTS, THE EARLY ENGAGEMENT.
SO WE'LL GO THROUGH WHAT THAT ENTAILED, THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT ITSELF, AND THEN MOST RECENTLY, THIS PLAN REVIEW AND REFINEMENT.
AND THERE WAS A LOT OF COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT THROUGHOUT ALL THREE OF THOSE PHASES.
SO I'M GONNA HAND IT OVER TO CARRIE.
GOOD AFTERNOON, MAYOR, VICE MAYOR, COUNSELORS, CARRIE EBERLY.
I WORK SIDE BY SIDE WITH ANDY AND WITH CYNTHIA THROUGHOUT THIS PROCESS AND WITH STEVE, BUT HE WASN'T HERE FOR THE ENTIRETY OF, OH, THERE YOU GO,
SO, UM, AS ANDY SAID, WE CAME IN IN MARCH OF 2022.
THERE HAD ALREADY BEEN A HOUSEHOLD SURVEY, WHICH I HOPE ALL OF YOU WERE ABLE TO, UM, FILL OUT AS THE VERY FIRST TIP OF THE ICEBERG OF COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.
SO THIS WAS A SURVEY THAT EVERY HOUSEHOLD RECEIVED.
THIS IS JUST AN OVERVIEW, UM, KIND OF A REMINDER OF WHERE THIS STARTED, HIGHLIGHTING KEY ISSUES FROM THE COMMUNITY AS WELL AS HIGHLIGHTING THOSE ONGOING VALUES WITHIN SEDONA.
AND AS, AS ANDY MENTIONED AS WELL, WE HAD THIS CITIZEN WORK GROUP.
UM, IT STARTED IN DECEMBER OF 2021, AND WE CAME IN IN MARCH, 2022.
AND, UM, THE, THE CITIZEN WORK GROUP WAS REALLY KEY IN HELPING US CRAFT WHAT COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT COULD LOOK LIKE.
UM, THEY WERE, THEY PROVIDED KEY INPUT INTO THE PLANNING PROCESS, OUTREACH METHODS, NETWORKING MATERIALS AND MESSAGING.
UM, THEY ALSO USED THEIR PERSONAL NETWORK FRIENDS, NEIGHBORS, COMMUNITY GROUPS TO REALLY ENHANCE PARTICIPATION AT THE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT LEVELS.
UM, THEY ALSO PROVIDED KEY COMMUNITY INPUT OR KEY INPUT, I'M SORRY, ON COMMUNITY ISSUES IN THE PLAN.
SO THOSE WERE, SOME OF THOSE FIRST MEETINGS WAS REVIEWING THE 2013 PLAN AND REALLY DIVING INTO THOSE TO BEST MAKE AN UPDATE AND TO FIND AREAS TO ENGAGE THE COMMUNITY FOR, UM, KEY INPUT.
AND LASTLY, THEY, UM, DID A REALLY GREAT JOB OF HELPING EVALUATE THE PLAN AS IT WOULD BE READ BY COMMUNITY MEMBERS, UM, FORMATTING, READABILITY, GRAPHICS LAYOUT, PRESENTATION, AS WELL AS KEY CONTENT.
SO A BIG THANK YOU TO THE CITIZEN WORK GROUP, WHICH WAS COMPOSED OF RICK HENDERSON, MARY GARLAND, MONICA GARLAND, MERCY TAYLOR, AND KELLY BRIAN FOLTZ INITIALLY, UM, TONY HANSEN, MIKE TAYLOR, ERNIE STRO, LILIANA MORALES VASQUEZ, JOHN SAYER, AND LINDA MARTINEZ.
SO, UM, A HUGE THANK YOU TO THEM.
UNFORTUNATELY, NO, THEY'RE NOT HERE FOR ME TO THANK IN PERSON, BUT THEIR CONTRIBUTIONS WERE INTEGRAL IN DEVELOPING, IMPLEMENTING REALLY ROBUST COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT THROUGHOUT THIS ENTIRETY OF AN EFFORT.
SO, UM, 30 MEETINGS OVER 22 MONTHS, SOME IN PERSON, SOME VIRTUAL, AND SOME HYBRID.
SO THEY PUT IN A LOT OF WORK AND WE ARE REALLY GRATEFUL FOR THEIR EFFORTS.
SO AS ANDY MENTIONED, THESE PHASES, EARLY ENGAGEMENT.
SO THERE WAS THE HOUSEHOLD SURVEY THAT HAPPENED A LITTLE BIT BEFORE WE CAME ON BOARD.
UM, WE WORKED WITH THE CITIZEN WORK GROUP AND THEN WE DECIDED TO HAVE THIS, WE PUT TOGETHER A COMMUNITY KICKOFF EVENT.
IT WAS AT THE SPAC, OVER 350 PEOPLE PARTICIPATED.
AND THIS WAS REALLY FOCUSED ON VISIONING, RIGHT? KIND OF TAKING A LITTLE BIT OF A STEP BACK.
WHAT DOES SEDONA WANT TO BE IN 10 YEARS? WHERE DO WE WANNA GO? UM, AS WELL AS HIGHLIGHTING POTENTIAL SOLUTIONS TO EXISTING CHALLENGES.
UM, NO COMMUNITY IS WITHOUT THOSE CHALLENGES, AND IT REALLY TAKES THE COMMUNITY AS WELL TO FORMULATE SOLUTIONS.
UM, WE ALSO DID SOME PLACE-BASED MAPPING OF WHERE PEOPLE FELT THERE WERE OPPORTUNITIES ACROSS THE CITY OF SEDONA FOR, FOR FUTURE IMPLEMENTATION.
WE THEN, UM, REFINED SOME, YOU KNOW, LISTENING AND LEARNING SESSIONS.
WE RECOGNIZE THAT PEOPLE PARTICIPATE IN MANY WAYS.
THE COMMUNITY FORUM WAS A BIG IN-PERSON EVENT.
THOSE CAN BE KIND OF DAUNTING SOMETIMES FOR SOME FOLKS.
SO WE DID TWO VIRTUAL ONLINE FORUMS. UM, THESE WERE VIA ZOOM.
WE HAD PANEL PRESENTERS HIGHLIGHTING CIRCULATION, WHICH WAS REALLY IMPORTANT.
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YOU GUYS ARE NOT UNFAMILIAR WITH THE FACT THAT PEOPLE THINK TRAFFIC IS A BIG ISSUE IN SEDONA.SO WE THOUGHT THAT WAS REALLY IMPORTANT TO HAVE PUBLIC WORKS COME AND TALK ABOUT ALL THE WORK THAT IS ONGOING, WHAT'S HAPPENED, WHAT'S IN THE QUEUE, WHAT'S PLANNED TO REALLY EDUCATE FOLKS ON WHAT, WHAT THAT FUTURE IS GONNA LOOK LIKE REGARDING CIRCULATION.
DOES ECONOMIC VITALITY, IS THAT SYNONYMOUS WITH GROWTH? IF NOT, WHAT, WHAT ARE THE DIFFERENCES THERE? WE ALSO ENGAGE 45 KEY STAKEHOLDER PARTNERS TO REALLY TALK TO THEM ABOUT WHAT THEY ENVISIONED WERE CURRENT CHALLENGES AS WELL AS SOLUTIONS FROM THEIR PERSPECTIVE FROM AGENCIES AND ORGANIZATIONS.
AND ALONG THE WAY, THE CITIZEN WORK GROUP CONVENED, THEY, WE DOVE INTO CHAPTERS HIGHLIGHTED AREAS THAT ARE, IS THIS STILL AN ISSUE? IF IT IS, LET'S THINK ABOUT SOLUTIONS.
IS THIS NO LONGER AN ISSUE? GREAT, WE CAN SCRATCH THAT OFF.
UM, THIS IS WORK GROUP DOVE INTO EVERY CHAPTER OF THE 2013 PLAN.
UM, AND THEY REALLY HELPED WITH DESIGNING THIS ENGAGEMENT STRATEGY FOR THE LISTENING AND LEARNING SESSIONS AND THE, UM, COMMUNITY KICKOFF FORUM, UM, AS WELL AS IDENTIFYING CONTENT, POTENTIAL SPEAKERS, IF YOU GUYS RECOLLECT, IF YOU WERE THERE, HOPEFULLY YOU WERE ABLE TO ATTEND.
WE HAD SPEAKERS AT THAT VERY FIRST EVENT WHO THEY WERE, WHAT WAS KIND OF THE TONE THAT WE WANTED TO SET THERE.
AND WHAT WE LEARNED THROUGH THIS INITIAL EARLY ENGAGEMENT, WHICH REALLY HELPED, AS ANDY SAID, AS THIS ITERATIVE EFFECT OF REFINING FOR THE NEXT PORTION OF ENGAGEMENT, WAS THAT AMONG ALL THE ISSUES IN SEDONA, OF WHICH THERE ARE MANY AND MANY ARE VERY IMPORTANT, THE THREE THAT WERE REALLY SALIENT ACROSS WHAT EVERYONE WAS SAYING AS BEING VERY IMPORTANT, HOUSING, LAND USE, AND TOURISM.
AND BASED ON THAT, THE NEXT SLIDE WE STARTED THINKING ABOUT HOW DO WE TAKE THOSE ISSUES AND START DEVELOPING CONTENT FROM THE PLAN BASED ON THOSE ISSUES.
HOPEFULLY, AGAIN, YOU GUYS WERE ABLE TO ATTEND OUR PLANNING A LIVABLE COMMUNITY WORKSHOP, WHICH WAS FOCUSED SOLELY ON HOUSING AND LAND USE.
SO IT FOCUSED ON INFORMATION SHARING, LOTS OF INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT'S THE CURRENT STATUS, WHAT ARE THE REALITIES OF HOUSING IN SEDONA, AS WELL AS WHAT ARE THOSE POTENTIAL SOLUTIONS TO ADDRESS THOSE CHALLENGES.
WE RECOGNIZE YOU GUYS ARE A BEAUTIFUL AND VERY WELL VISITED CITY, BUT YOU ARE A SMALL CITY IN, IN REGARDS TO POPULATION, RIGHT? BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT DOESN'T COME WITHOUT THE CHALLENGES, ESPECIALLY REGARDING HOUSING AS WAS MENTIONED EARLIER.
SO, AND, AND WHAT COULD A VISION OF BETTER HOUSING IN SEDONA LOOK LIKE? SO THAT WAS THAT BIG WORKSHOP.
WE ALSO WERE SO FORTUNATE TO HAVE COMMUNITY, UM, MEMBERS ON OUR CITIZEN WORK GROUP THAT WERE REALLY PASSIONATE ABOUT HOUSING AND TOOK THIS ON TO DEVELOP, UM, WITH THE HELP OF SDR AND WITH THE CITY GUIDANCE, WHAT THESE SMALL COMMUNITY MEETINGS COULD LOOK LIKE.
THEY WENT OUT AND THEY ENGAGED THEIR NEIGHBORS, THEIR FRIENDS, THEIR NETWORKS IN A SERIES OF SEVEN MEETINGS OVER THE MONTH OF AUGUST OF LAST YEAR TO REALLY TALK ABOUT HERE ARE SOME POTENTIAL SOLUTIONS TO THE HOUSING REALITY IN SEDONA.
AND REALLY HELPING GAUGE, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S THE LEVEL OF SUPPORT FOR THESE POTENTIAL SOLUTIONS.
SO WE'RE REALLY FORTUNATE TO HAVE COMMUNITY MEMBERS AS WELL AS CITIZEN WORK GROUP MEMBERS TO REALLY LEAD THE CHARGE ON THOSE COMMUNITY HOUSING MEETINGS.
WE ALSO WERE FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO MEET WITH, UM, A LARGE SECTION OF THE SPANISH SPEAKING COMMUNITY TO TALK ABOUT HOUSING AS WELL AS OTHER ISSUES THAT REALLY ARE TOP OF MIND FOR THEM.
AGAIN, THE CITIZEN WORK GROUP.
DURING THIS PHASE, THIS PLAN DEVELOPMENT PHASE, WERE HELPING US TALK ABOUT CONTENT, HOW TO REACH OUT TO PEOPLE FOR THESE VARIETY OF WAYS TO ENGAGE AS WELL AS FOCUS ON DRAFTING NEW PLAN CONTENT, RIGHT? RECOGNIZING THERE'S THIS REALLY BIG ISSUE THAT HAPPENED BETWEEN 2013 AND NOW, AND THAT IS A HUGE INFLUX OF TOURISTS, RIGHT? TOURISTS HAVE ALWAYS BEEN VISITING SEDONA, IT FEELS LIKE MAYBE A LITTLE BIT MORE SO IN THE PAST DECADE.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, DOES THAT, DID THAT REALLY WARRANT A CHAPTER REALLY FOCUSED ON THE ECONOMY AND TOURISM? AND SO THE CITIZEN WORK GROUP HELPED US USE ALL THIS COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT TO HELP REFINE HOW TO MOVE FORWARD.
THIS IS A SUPER TRUNCATED, IT WASN'T LIKE WE JUST DID IT.
UM, YOU KNOW, CYNTHIA WAS DOING HER MAGIC IN THE BACKGROUND CRAFTING PLAN LANGUAGE.
THE CITIZEN WORK GROUP WAS CONTINUING TO HELP AND OUTLINING POTENTIAL NEW CHAPTERS SUCH AS TOURISM, SEPARATING LAND USE FROM HOUSING, AND WHAT WOULD THAT LOOK LIKE IN A NEW PLAN, UM, FORMAT.
AND SO AT THAT SAME TIME, UM, THE DRAFT PLAN WAS UPLOADED ONTO CONVEO AND I HOPE
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YOU GUYS ALL WERE ABLE TO PUT YOUR COMMENTS ON THERE.UM, WE'LL HIGHLIGHT HOW MANY COMMENTS THERE WERE.
AND 696, I WAS REALLY HOPING WE WOULD GET TO AROUND 700, BUT NOT QUITE.
UM, BUT UH, YOU KNOW, AND THEN AT THAT TIME, SDR R'S ROLE WAS REALLY TO TRY AND HELP CYNTHIA WITH THE SYNTHESIS, WITH THE SUMMARIZING OF CONTENT, UM, OF COMMENTS REALLY HELPING, YOU KNOW, STRATIFY THE COMMENTS.
IS THIS A COPY, EDIT COMMENT? IS THIS A QUESTION THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED? IS THIS A SUBSTANTIVE COMMENT? SO, UM, THAT WAS A LOT OF WORK.
UM, AND THEN THE NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE.
RECOGNIZING THAT THE PLAN WAS ONLINE AND IT WAS UP THERE FOR 60 DAYS.
WE ALSO, UM, WITH THE, WITH THE HELP OF THE CITIZEN WORK GROUP, AGAIN, PUT TOGETHER THIS LAST BIG COMMUNITY FORUM EFFORT, TWO COMMUNITY FORUMS CALLED THE PLAN PASSPORT.
UM, IN THE FIRST COUPLE WEEKS OF JANUARY, WE REALLY WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT WHAT WAS ALREADY ONLINE, WHAT THIS DRAFT PLAN CONSISTED OF.
AND SO, UM, THIS WAS A REALLY GREAT EFFORT, UM, FROM EVERYBODY'S PERSPECTIVE.
UM, YOU KNOW, REALLY HOW DO WE EDUCATE THE BROADER COMMUNITY ON WHAT'S IN THE PLAN? AND AT THE SAME TIME, GIVEN THAT EDUCATION, YOU KNOW, WHAT KINDS OF COMMENTS, WHAT KIND OF FEEDBACK WOULD WE BE SOLICITING SO THAT THEY COULD MAKE INFORMED COMMENTS ABOUT THE CONTENT OF THE PLAN? SO, UM, THAT'S A COPY OF THE AGENDA, THE FIRST PAGE OF THE AGENDA FROM THE PLA PLAN PASSPORT.
UM, AND THE WORK GROUP REALLY CONTINUED TO PROVIDE FEEDBACK ON, ON THAT EVENT.
THEY WERE REALLY CRITICAL IN HELPING US FIGURE OUT HOW TO BEST ENGAGE THE COMMUNITY AT THIS STAGE, UM, OF THE PROCESS.
AND THEN WE ALL, WE ASKED THEM TO ADDITIONALLY PROVIDE FEEDBACK AND COMMENTS ON THE PLAN AS COMMUNITY MEMBERS.
'CAUSE IN ADDITION TO BEING CITIZEN WORK GROUP MEMBERS, THEIR, THEIR COMMUNITY MEMBERS FIRST.
SO WE REALLY WANTED TO MAKE SURE, ENSURE THAT THEY HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO PROVIDE INDIVIDUAL NON-WORK GROUP ASSOCIATED COMMENTS.
SO IN SUMMARY, UM, LIKE I SAID, A 30 CITIZEN WORK GROUP MEETINGS IN PERSON VIRTUAL AND HYBRID.
THROUGHOUT THE, UM, THE ENTIRE PROCESS OF IN-PERSON COMMUNITY WORKSHOP EVENTS, WE HAD, UM, 775 COMMUNITY MEMBERS ATTEND THOSE IN PERSON.
UM, THAT'S NOT TO SAY THAT THAT WAS 775 DISTINCT INDIVIDUALS.
THIS WAS BASED ON SIGN IN SHEETS.
UM, WE HAD 60 PARTICIPANTS PARTICIPATE IN THOSE TWO VIRTUAL, UM, LISTENING AND LEARNING SESSIONS.
45 STAKEHOLDERS AT THE PARTNER WORKSHOP.
LIKE I SAID, 696 TOTAL COMMENTS, AGAIN, A DIFFERENT FORMAT OF OF COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.
AND ONCE, SOMETHING THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO HIGHLIGHT HERE IS THAT 62% OF PARTICIPANTS, SO 84 OF THE TOTAL 136 PARTICIPANTS THAT INDICATED THEIR, UM, WHETHER IT WAS THEIR FIRST TIME OR THEY HAD PARTICIPATED AGAIN AT THE PLANNED PASSPORT, 84%, OR I'M SORRY, 84 PARTICIPANTS OF THE 136 WERE FIRST TIME PARTICIPANTS.
SO THROUGHOUT 22 MONTHS, AT THE VERY END OF THAT, WE WERE STILL ENGAGING NEW COMMUNITY MEMBERS WHO HAD NOT PARTICIPATED TO DATE.
SO THAT SUMS UP THE, UM, THE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT PORTION.
WE ARE MORE THAN HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS, MAYOR, VICE MAYOR AND COUNSELORS, YOU MAY HAVE BRIAN FIRST.
CARRIE, HOW, HOW DO, OR ANY OF THE FOUR OF YOU, HOW DO YOU THINK WE SHOULD FEEL ABOUT 26 PEOPLE WEIGHING IN ON THE PLAN WHERE IT'S AT RIGHT NOW? AND, AND I'M ASKING IT KIND OF OUT LOUD RELATIVE TO MY COLLEAGUES UP HERE OVER THE FACT THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT REPRESENTATIVE BLISS TRYING TO GET A BILL PASSED SO THAT THIS HAS TO GO TO THE COMMUNITY FOR APPROVAL.
BUT WE'VE ONLY HAD 26 PEOPLE SO FAR WEIGH IN ON IT.
I'M JUST KIND OF LIKE TRYING TO WEIGH IS, IS THIS LEGISLATIVE EFFORT NOTHING MORE THAN OPTICS OR DOES IT REALLY MATTER? SO I'M NOT SURE IF I, IF IT'S NOTHING MORE THAN A RHETORICAL QUESTION AT THE MOMENT, I THINK IT IS.
I I CAN ADDRESS THAT AS WELL, PLEASE.
OH, UM, HAVING, HAVING BEEN INTIMATELY INVOLVED IN THE SPREADSHEET AND COLLATION OF COMMENTS FROM, UM, CONVEO, UNFORTUNATELY THE WAY CONVEO TRACKS THE COMMENT TOURS IS INACCURATE.
UM, AND I'M NOT EXACTLY SURE, BUT OF THE 696 COMMENTS, I WOULD SAY, AND I CAN LOOK ON MY COMPUTER, WHICH I DIDN'T BRING, BUT WE CAN FIGURE OUT HOW MANY INDIVIDUAL COMMENTERS SIGNIFICANTLY MORE THAN 26.
I'M NOT SURE HOW CONVEO TRACKS THAT, BUT THERE WERE UPWARDS OF HUNDREDS OF INDIVIDUAL COMMENTORS.
UNFORTUNATELY, THE COMMENTORS TRACKED ON CONVEO DOES NOT REFLECT THAT.
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MIGHT HAVE TO DO WITH THE SIGN IN.UH, SOMETIMES THEY'LL SHOW UP AS ANONYMOUS.
SOMETIMES THEY'VE ENTERED THEIR NAME AND OTHER INFORMATION.
I MIGHT SUGGEST THAT YOU ALTER THAT SLIDE TO SAY ESTIMATED AT A HUNDRED PLUS THEN, OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, BECAUSE YEAH, THAT'S JUST, THAT CERTAINLY UNDERSTATES THE REALITY.
UM, CONVEO PRODUCES THAT AT THE TOP OF THE REPORT TO INDICATE HOW MANY TIMES IT WAS VIEWED, HOW MANY TOTAL COMMENTS THERE WERE.
AND UNFORTUNATELY, WE, WE WERE MID-DECEMBER AND IT SAID THAT WE HAD 12 COMMENTORS AND WE ALREADY HAD 400 COMMENTS.
AND THAT WAS NOT REFLECTIVE OF, OF THE ACTUAL AMOUNT OF COMMENTARY.
SO THANK YOU FOR THAT COMMENT.
AND THEN REGARDING THE PARTICIPATION OF THE CITIZEN WORKING GROUP, DID YOU GUYS END UP DOING ANY KIND OF, SORT OF END OF PROJECT SURVEY OF THEM TO GET THEIR SENSE OF SATISFACTION, WHETHER THEY FEEL LIKE, YOU KNOW, THEIR EFFORTS MATTERED, WHETHER THEY FEEL LIKE THE PLAN REFLECTS THE INPUT WELL, UH, FROM THE COMMUNITY, ANYTHING LIKE THAT? NOT YET, BUT IT'S COMING.
SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WEAVE IN, IN ALL OF OUR PROCESSES.
WE DID DO SEVERAL ONE-ON-ONE CHECK-INS, MID-PROCESS WITH THEM.
THERE'S A LOT OF TIME, YOU KNOW, AND THERE'S, THEY ALL HAVE INDIVIDUAL INDI YOU KNOW, INDIVIDUAL, UM, OPINIONS ON THINGS.
SO WE TRIED TO CONTINUE TO STAY IN TOUCH WITH THEM.
WE DO HAVE AN UPCOMING MEETING WITH THEM TO CELEBRATE ALL THEIR HARD WORK AND TO ASK THOSE VERY QUESTIONS.
SO WE WILL HAVE THAT INFORMATION AND CAN GET THAT TO YOU.
THE REASON I ASK IS I'M JUST REFLECTING ON THE BUDGET REVIEW PROCESS THAT WE WENT THROUGH THIS PAST YEAR, AND THE MEMBERS OF THAT RESIDENT WORKING GROUP, FOR THE MOST PART WERE PRESENT WHEN THE BUDGET WAS PRESENTED AND ACTUALLY PARTICIPATED IN SPEAKING TO CERTAIN PARTS OF IT AND WHATNOT.
AND I'M NOT SUGGESTING TO PULL THEM INTO THIS AT THAT POINT OR AT THIS POINT, BUT IT JUST SEEMS LIKE THESE FOLKS SPENT TWO PLUS YEARS, 30 PLUS MEETINGS.
AND IT'D BE GOOD TO GET SOME SENSE OF WHERE THEIR HEADS ARE AT NOW THAT IT'S AT THE END.
'CAUSE WE CERTAINLY GOT IT FROM THE BUDGET GROUP AND THEY ONLY MET A FEW TIMES OVER A FEW MONTHS.
UH, PETE, DO YOU HAVE A QUESTION? I DID.
I, I CAN'T IMAGINE HOW YOU FEEL NOW AF AND THE WHOLE TEAM AFTER.
IT'S LIKE GIVING BIRTH TO A CHILD, I IMAGINE A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF WORK AND IT WOULD'VE BEEN FUN TO HAVE THE HOURS PUT IN ESTIMATE FROM THE COMMUNITY MEMBERS.
JUST KIND OF TOUCHING ON BRIAN'S POINT THERE, THERE WAS A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF TIME PUT IN BY A LOT OF PEOPLE.
AND SO, UH, YOU WAVED AROUND THAT DOCUMENT AND I KNOW THAT I'VE SEEN THAT SUMMARY DOCUMENT BEFORE.
I DON'T, I KNOW THAT I WENT THIS WEEKEND TO LOOK ON YOUR WEBSITE AND DIDN'T SEE IT AND WAS WONDERING WHEN IT WILL BE THERE.
IT'S ON THE PLAN SEDONA.COM WEBSITE.
IT'S UNDER WHAT WE'VE HEARD OR IF YOU OPEN UP THE WEBSITE, THERE'S THE THREE BLOCKS.
YEAH, THE ONE ON THE RIGHT ABOUT COMMUNITY OR COMMENTS, COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT SUMMARY SUMMARY REPORT.
SO I, I WENT HERE, YOU KNOW, ON THE HOMEPAGE, THIS IS ONE, THE, THE DRAFT PLAN THREE IS ON THE HOMEPAGE.
THIS IS ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE FINAL DOCUMENTS.
IT JUST SHOULD BE EASY TO FIND.
AND I, I WOULD LOVE TO REMIND MYSELF OF WHAT SOME OF THOSE COMMUNITY SURVEYS AND THINGS, UH, SAID AS I GO THROUGH IT WHEN I CLICK ON WHAT WE HEARD.
I DON'T SEE IT HERE, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHY.
I THINK IT'S ON THE WOULD YOU LIKE THIS COPY? I HAVEN'T READ.
NO, I DON'T NEED IT RIGHT NOW.
AND MAYBE WHAT I'LL DO IS PUT THE PICTURES PRETTY RECOGNIZABLE AS A IT IS.
THERE'S A BUTTON THAT SAYS, YOU KNOW, COMMENT FORM RIGHT ABOVE IT IN BLUE IS THE SUMMARY REPORT.
UH, KATHY, YOU HAVE A COMMENT QUESTION? I'M SORRY.
AND JUST TO CLARIFY, SO THAT DOCUMENT I'M ON THE PLANNED SEDONA, WHERE WOULD I FIND THAT? BECAUSE I'M, NOBODY HAS IT HERE.
SO ON THE HOME PAGE OF PLANNED SEDONA.COM, THERE SHOULD BE THREE ICONS.
BELOW ON THE RIGHT ICON IN BLUE TEXT IT SHOULD SAY COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT SUMMARY.
THIS WAY WE COULD FOLLOW ALONG.
I'M NOT SEEING IT EITHER HERE.
NOT ON THE, WHAT WE'VE HEARD PAGE, I'M SORRY, I MISSPOKE EARLIER ON THE ACTUAL JUST HOMEPAGE FOR PLANT SEDONA.COM.
YOU DON'T HAVE IT, IS IT? HE'S GOT IT.
YOU DON'T HAVE, ARE YOU UP? HE'S GOT IT UP AND I'M LOOKING RIGHT AT HIM NOT SEEING IT AND I'M LOOKING RIGHT HERE AT HIM.
I COULD BRING IT UP, BUT IT MIGHT TAKE A FEW MINUTES.
I COULDN'T FIND UNTIL THEY HELPED.
OKAY, WHERE WERE WE? OKAY, SO BEFORE WE JUMP INTO TALKING ABOUT EACH CHAPTER, UM,
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I JUST KIND OF WANTED TO TALK ABOUT SOME OF THE BIGGER PICTURE THINGS THAT WE LEARNED FROM THE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.UM, AND ONE OF THE, NOT JUST ONE, THERE'S BEEN A FEW PEOPLE THAT HAVE SAID, YOU KNOW, HOW, HOW COME MY IDEA ISN'T IN THERE? I DON'T SEE THAT IN THE DOCUMENT.
UM, WHAT WE NOTICED IN ALL OF THOSE COMMENTS IS THAT A LOT OF THEM WERE VERY DETAILED AND SPECIFIC.
AND THE COMMUNITY PLAN IS A VERY GENERAL HIGH LEVEL BIG PICTURE PLAN.
AND SO MANY OF THE THINGS THAT PEOPLE MAY HAVE SUGGESTED OR WANTED TO SEE IN THE PLAN, THEY'RE EITHER ACTION ITEMS OR THEY WOULD HAPPEN DURING AN ACTION ITEM.
SO THE EXAMPLE IS WE HAVE ACTION ITEMS ABOUT AMENDING THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE.
UM, AND THEN WE ALSO HAVE ACTION ITEMS FOR DOING, UH, TWO LARGE COMMUNITY FOCUS AREAS.
AND SO THROUGH THOSE EFFORTS IS REALLY WHERE YOU GET INTO THE REGULATORY SIDE OF THINGS.
AND IT'S ALSO WHERE YOU GET DOWN TO TALKING PARCEL LEVEL AND I'M THINKING MORE OF A CFA PLAN, UM, THAT THE COMMUNITY PLAN DOES NOT GET INTO AS MUCH DETAIL.
UM, SO WE, WE RECOGNIZE THAT THERE WERE A LOT OF EXCELLENT IDEAS OUT THERE AND THEY'VE, THEY ARE IN HERE AT A HIGH LEVEL AND THEY WILL, UH, BE DISCUSSED IN THE FUTURE.
AS I SAID, WE'VE GOT ACTION ITEMS TO AMEND THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE SO THAT IT BETTER ALIGNS AND ALSO JUST IMPLEMENTS, IT'S A MAJOR TOOL OF THE COMMUNITY PLAN.
AND SO THOSE SPECIFICS WILL HAPPEN DURING AN UPDATE TO THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE.
UM, MOST LIKELY WE'RE GONNA DO ONE LARGE UPDATE.
IT COULD BE, UM, MULTIPLE SMALLER UPDATES.
AND THEN COMMUNITY FOCUS AREAS WILL BE COMING ALONG AS WELL.
AND THEN ANOTHER QUESTION WAS, CYNTHIA, WE HAVE A QUESTION, BRIAN.
WE'VE PROVIDED WORK DIRECTION ABOUT THE LDC BEING UPDATED TO ALLOW FOR DUPLEX TRIPLEX IN SINGLE FAMILY ZONING.
SO IS THAT BEING WORKED ON OR, I KNOW THAT'S NOT GERMANE TO THIS PARTICULAR PIECE OF WORK, BUT WHAT YOU JUST SAID, CYNTHIA, OF SOUNDED TO ME LIKE IT'S NOT BEING WORKED ON OR NOT GONNA BE ADDRESSED IN A TIMELY FASHION ACCORDING TO WHAT I THINK COUNSEL PROVIDED DIRECTION ON FOR ANSWER, WELL, MAYBE I CAN ANSWER THAT BECAUSE IT'S REALLY, THE LEAD ON THAT IS OUR HOUSING STAFF.
SO THIS IS A SHANNON BOONE PROJECT.
IT IS ON THE LIST, IT'S ON THE COUNCIL, NOT ON THE COUNCIL PRIORITY LIST, BUT THAT OTHER LIST THAT WE ESTABLISHED.
SO IT'S FULLY DOCUMENTED THAT, THAT WE UNDERSTAND THAT THAT IS A HIGH PRIORITY FOR COUNCIL.
SHANNON WILL NEED TO WORK VERY CLOSELY WITH STEVE AND WITH CARRIE MEYER AND WITH CYNTHIA.
UM, BUT YES, ABSOLUTELY THAT WILL MOVE FORWARD.
AND JUST TO ADD TO THAT, UM, THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE UPDATE THAT WE'LL BE DOING GOES FAR BEYOND HOUSING.
AND SO YOU WILL NOTICE IN DIFFERENT CHAPTERS ON DIFFERENT TOPICS WHERE WE TALK ABOUT AMENDING THE CODE.
SO IT COULD BE THINGS LIKE, UM, IN ENVIRONMENT CHAPTER, LOOKING AT, UH, WATER REQUIREMENTS, LANDSCAPING REQUIREMENTS, THAT SORT OF THING.
SO THAT'S WHERE THE CODE WILL LOOK AT MANY DIFFERENT TOPICS.
JESSICA HAS A QUESTION FIRST BEFORE I DO, REGARDING BRIAN'S QUESTION, I, AND MAYBE WE BETTER TALK ABOUT THIS WHEN WE GET TO HOUSING, TO THE HOUSING SECTION.
'CAUSE I LOOK AT HOUSING DIVERSITY, WHICH IS WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AND IT'S NOT IN THERE, OR, SO IN FACT, IT WOULD APPEAR TO ME TO PERHAPS PRECLUDE IT BY THE WORDING OF, WELL, WE GET THE HOUSING, WE SHOULD TALK ABOUT THIS.
AND SO I JUST WANNA PUT THAT ON THE TABLE.
SO
BUT, UM, PAGE 56, HOUSING ACTIONS NUMBER TWO IS AMEND THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE TO ADVANCE CITY HOUSING INITIATIVES AS OUTLINED IN THIS PLAN.
IT MAY NOT CALL OUT THAT SPECIFIC ITEM OF SAY, DUPLEXES.
WELL, WHAT IT SAYS IN POLICY FIVE POINT, WELL, NOT 5.5
UM, AS LONG AS THERE'S NOTHING IN HERE THAT PRECLUDES IT.
AND IS THERE ANYTHING IN THERE THAT WHEN IT COMES FORWARD YOU COULD POINT TO, TO SUPPORT
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IT, THEN IT'S FINE WITH ME.WE DON'T HAVE TO TALK ABOUT IT FURTHER.
AS LONG AS IT'S, IT'S SUPPORTABLE IN THIS DOCUMENT AND ENCOURAGED.
DO YOU WANT ME TO ADDRESS THAT NOW OR WAIT? NO, LET'S WAIT TILL LATER.
I THINK THAT'S THE RIGHT THING TO DO.
I DON'T WANNA GET INTO A WHOLE HOUSING DISCUSSION.
UH, LET'S SEE, WHERE WERE WE? OKAY, SO THAT WAS TALKING ABOUT, UM, LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND COMMUNITY FOCUS AREAS.
WHAT WERE THE MAJOR CHANGES BETWEEN THE CURRENT 2013 COMMUNITY PLAN AND WHAT WE HAVE BEFORE US NOW? UM, AND I WOULD SAY FROM ALL OF THE COMMUNITY INPUT AS WAS MENTIONED EARLIER, TOURISM, HOUSING, SUSTAINABILITY, LAND USE, UM, THOSE WERE THE TOP PRIORITIES, WHICH IS A SHIFT FROM THE 2013 PLAN.
UM, COVID HAD A HUGE IMPACT ON THE TOURISM.
UM, THERE'S ALSO JUST CHANGING ATTITUDES ABOUT SUSTAINABILITY.
AND THEN OUR HOUSING CRISIS HAS CHANGED QUITE A BIT BECAUSE OF THE SHORT TERM RENTALS.
UM, AND THEN, SO WHAT WE'VE DONE IS IN THE PREVIOUS PLAN YOU DIDN'T SEE A TOURISM CHAPTER.
UM, IT WAS SCATTERED THROUGHOUT AND WE DEBATED A LOT AS TO WHETHER THAT NEEDED TO BE A STANDALONE CHAPTER BECAUSE IT'S A CROSS-CUTTING TOPIC AND YOU WILL FIND TOURISM ADDRESSED IN EVERY CHAPTER REALLY.
UM, BUT WE DID ELEVATE IT AND PUT IT IN WITH THE ECONOMY 'CAUSE IT'S A CRITICAL PART OF OUR ECONOMY.
UM, OTHER ASPECTS OF TOURISM YOU'LL FIND IN CIRCULATION ENVIRONMENT, UH, COMMUNITY, ET CETERA.
UM, AND THEN SIMILARLY WITH HOUSING, THAT ONE YOU'LL OBVIOUSLY FIND UNDER LAND USE AS WELL AS THE HOUSING CHAPTER.
SO IT'S, IT'S ALSO SCATTERED AROUND A BIT, UM, BECAUSE IT IS A ANOTHER CROSSCUTTING TOPIC, EVEN IF YOU LOOK AT SOMETHING LIKE THE ECONOMY.
UM, AND SO THOSE ARE, I THINK THE, THE REALLY BIG CHANGES.
AND THEN ALSO BASED ON COMMUNITY INPUT, UM, WE DID CHANGE UP THE FORMATTING OF THE DOCUMENT.
AND I THINK ONE OF THE MOST, UM, PROBABLY MORE SIGNIFICANT CHANGES IS THAT THE OLD PLAN, IF YOU REMEMBER AT THE END OF A CHAPTER, WOULD BE A LIST OF POLICIES.
AND WE WOULD OFTEN GET QUESTIONS ABOUT A POLICY AND WHAT WAS THE INTENT AND THE MEETING BEHIND IT.
AND SO THIS TIME AROUND, WHAT WE'VE DONE IS THAT FOR MOST OF OUR POLICIES, THERE SHOULD BE A PARAGRAPH AFTER THE POLICY THAT GIVES A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND INFORMATION, DESCRIPTION, UM, EXPLANATION.
UM, AND THEN THE OTHER PIECE OF THAT IS THAT THE OLD PLAN MIGHT HAVE, YOU KNOW, A PAGE OR TWO OF BACKGROUND INFORMATION AND ONE OF THE, UM, COMMENTS WAS THAT IT DIDN'T TIE NECESSARILY TO THE POLICY, MEANING THERE MIGHT BE A DISCUSSION ON A TOPIC IN THE BACKGROUND, BUT THEN THERE WASN'T AN ASSOCIATED POLICY.
UH, SO WE THINK THAT WE'VE IMPROVED UPON THAT.
UM, AND NOW YOU'LL SEE THAT MOST OF THE POLICIES HAVE SOME SORT OF AN EXPLANATION AND PUTS THINGS INTO CONTEXT.
UH, AND THEN AS WE GO THROUGH EACH CHAPTER, I'LL POINT OUT OTHER CHANGES FROM THE 2013 PLAN.
SO JUMPING IN, UH, STARTING OUT WITH THE INTRODUCTION, UM, MAJOR CHANGES TO THIS ONE.
UM, THE COMMUNITY PROFILE AND DEMOGRAPHICS, WE COMBINED IT WITH GROWTH.
AND IN THE PREVIOUS PLANS, NOT JUST THE 2013 PLAN, GROWTH WAS A SEPARATE SECTION.
AND THAT ACTUALLY TIES BACK TO THE, UM, ARIZONA STATE REQUIREMENTS.
AND FOR CITIES OVER A CERTAIN SIZE, IT'S A REQUIRED ELEMENT GROWTH.
AND REALLY WHAT THEY ARE LOOKING AT IS GROWTH AREAS.
AND DUE TO THE FACT THAT WE ARE ABOUT 82% OR SO BUILT OUT, THERE ARE NO GROWTH AREAS HERE,
NOW I RECOGNIZE THAT, YOU KNOW, IF YOU LOOK AT THE DELLS, UM, THAT'S A SORT OF A DIFFERENT ISSUE.
UM, BUT WHAT THE STATE INTENDED IS THINGS THAT YOU MIGHT SEE DOWN, SAY IN PHOENIX WHERE THEY'RE SPREADING OUTWARDS.
UM, AND SO WHAT WE'VE EMPHASIZED IN THAT INTRODUCTION CHAPTER IS, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT A CHART ABOUT THE RATE OF DEVELOPMENT, UM, THE
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POPULATION GROWTH OR NOT GROWTH, UM, OVER TIME.SO THAT IS ANOTHER DIFFERENCE THAT YOU'LL SEE.
UM, AND THEN THE SUMMARY OF KEY ISSUES.
WE DID GO INTO MORE DETAIL, ESPECIALLY ON THE REVISED DRAFT OF, UH, DESCRIBING WHAT THOSE PRIMARY KEY ISSUES.
I KNOW THAT PROBABLY SOUNDS WEIRD, UM, BUT THE MAJOR ISSUES THAT CAME UP, UM, HAVING SOME EXPLANATORY, UM, INFORMATION UPFRONT IN THE INTRODUCTION.
AND THEN FOR THE MOST PART, THESE ARE ALSO ADDRESSED AS YOU MOVE THROUGH THE PLAN.
UM, CYNTHIA, I APPRECIATE YOU MENTIONING MANY OF THOSE THINGS.
I'M VERY CURIOUS ABOUT THE GROWTH TOPIC THAT YOU, THAT YOU TALKED ABOUT, ESPECIALLY WHEN I LOOK AT THE OLD PLAN AND I LOOK AT THE GOAL ON PAGE 17 THAT SAYS GROW ONLY WITHIN CURRENTLY ESTABLISHED RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL LIMITS.
AND YOU SORT OF INDICATED THAT THERE ISN'T MUCH OF A CHANGE, BUT YOU DID ALLUDE TO THE FACT THAT ANNEXATION IS IN THIS PLAN.
AND SO THAT TO ME IS A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE FROM THE OLD PLAN TO THE CURRENT PLAN.
AND I'M KIND OF CURIOUS ABOUT HOW MUCH OF THE COMMUNITY CONVERSATION WAS ABOUT THAT.
I CERTAINLY TRIED TO PARTICIPATE AS MUCH AS I COULD, AND I DON'T RECALL REALLY HEARING THAT BEING ADDRESSED IN THE COMMUNITY CONVERSATION AT ALL.
SO I'D LIKE TO KNOW SOME MORE BACKGROUND AS TO WHERE THAT CHANGE CAME FROM.
UM, A COUPLE OF OF DIFFERENT ASPECTS OF THAT.
UM, ONE OF 'EM THAT HAS BEEN DEBATED, I, I'D SAY DEFINITELY MORE RECENTLY, IT FEELS LIKE THE LAST SIX MONTHS IS WHETHER OR NOT, UM, WE COULD CHANGE THE NATIONAL FOREST BOUNDARIES.
AND SO THERE HAVE BEEN SUGGESTIONS THAT WE CHANGE COURSE AND TALK TO THE FOREST SERVICE ABOUT POSSIBLE LAND EXCHANGES, WHEREAS IN THE PAST THAT WAS, THAT WAS STRONGLY UM, OPPOSED.
UM, WHEREAS THAT HAS LOOSENED UP LATELY, BUT IN THE PLAN WE ARE NOT RECOMMENDING THAT.
UM, AND THEN THE SECOND ASPECT OF THAT WOULD BE THE DELLS LOOKING OUTSIDE THE CITY.
UM, SO THE ORIGINAL POLICY THAT YOU'RE REFERENCING ABOUT, UM, NOT EXPANDING BEYOND THE RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL, I THINK A LOT OF THAT HAD TO DO WITH BOTH THE NATIONAL FOREST AND THE OPEN SPACE PROPERTIES.
UM, AND ALSO THE RATIO BETWEEN RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL.
UM, AND SO THAT WAS ONE OF THOSE THAT WITHOUT HAVING AN EXPLANATION TO GO WITH IT, EVERYBODY WAS INTERPRETING THAT POLICY A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY.
UM, AND THIS IS ONE WHERE I DON'T KNOW IF, IF KAREN HAS SOME EXPERIENCES ON THAT ONE WHERE IT WOULD COME UP AND PEOPLE WOULD, WOULD MAYBE INTERPRET IT IN A WAY THAT WAS NOT THE ORIGINAL INTENT OF THAT.
UM, I DO NOT FEEL LIKE IT WAS REFERRING TO THE DELLS WHEN IT WAS WRITTEN IN 2013.
SO, SO TO ANSWER THE PART OF THE QUESTION I ASKED WAS, DID THE COMMUNITY GET ENGAGED IN THIS TOPIC IN, IN A WAY, DID I MISS IT SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINE I WOULD IF I COULD.
UM, I WOULD SAY THAT MAYBE I HADN'T IN THE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT THAT WE PARTICIPATED IN, ESPECIALLY RECENTLY, I WOULD SAY IN REGARDING HOUSING.
AND THEN AGAIN AT THE LAST COMMUNITY FORUMS HERE IN JANUARY, THE CONCEPT OF THE DELLS WAS MENTIONED MANY TIMES.
UM, AND WITH THE, ESPECIALLY IN REGARDS TO HOUSING, BECAUSE RECOGNIZING THERE IS HOUSING SHORTAGE, RECOGNIZING THAT THERE ISN'T AN ABUNDANCE OF LAND TO, UM, DEVELOP NEW HOUSING, UM, OPPORTUNITIES FOR FOLKS.
THE DELLS WAS BROUGHT UP IN THAT CONTEXT PRIMARILY IT FROM, FROM WHAT I SYNTHESIZED IN COMMENTS, COMMENT CARDS, ONLINE, COMMENTS ON, ON CONVEO, THAT IS MY PERCEPTION OF THE MAJORITY OF THE DELL'S COMMENTS.
AND I WOULD ADD TO THAT, THAT I, I DON'T THINK THERE WAS CONSENSUS.
UM, THE WORK GROUP TALKED ABOUT IT A LOT, ESPECIALLY IN THE BEGINNING.
UM, WE HAD ONE MEMBER IN PARTICULAR THAT FELT IT WAS REALLY IMPORTANT TO NOT PUT RESIDENTIAL OUT THERE TO NOT SPRAWL.
SO IT, IT DEFINITELY CAME UP, BUT WE HAD DIFFERENCES OF OPINION OUT THERE.
BUT I GUESS I, WHAT I WANT TO HONE IN ON MORE IS WHEN THE COMMENTS CAME FROM THE PUBLIC ABOUT POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT OF THE DELLS REGARDING HOUSING, WAS THE COMMENT THAT, AND IT SHOULD
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BE WITHIN CITY LIMITS OR I MEAN, WAS THAT EVER SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSED? DID PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THE, DID THE COMMENTS REFLECT AN UNDERSTANDING OF THE FACT THAT IT IS OUTSIDE THE CITY LIMITS AND THE CHALLENGES THAT THAT CREATES SO THAT THERE WAS AN ACKNOWLEDGED DESIRE TO LOOK AT ANNEXATION? I'M JUST TRYING TO GET TO MORE SPECIFIC ON THAT.WOULD YOU AGREE CYNTHIA? AND MANY OF THE CON MANY OF THE CONVERSATIONS WE HAD, THERE WAS AN ASSUMPTION THAT THE DELLS WAS AVAILABLE AND THAT THERE WAS MAYBE A MISPERCEPTION THAT IT WAS ALREADY PART OF THE CITY.
CYNTHIA, WOULD YOU NO, GO AHEAD.
UM, YOU KNOW, LIKE, LIKE MANY TOPICS THAT WE HEAR TODAY, UM, IT'S, IT WAS A RALLYING CRY FOR SOME WITHOUT FULLY UNDERSTANDING.
AND THEN I, I WOULD ALSO SAY THAT, UH, THERE WERE QUITE A FEW CONVERSATIONS AND SOME WRITTEN COMMENTS ABOUT THE FACT THAT SOME PEOPLE DID NOT SEE THAT AS THE OPTIMAL SOLUTION, AT LEAST FOR HOUSING, BECAUSE THEY RECOGNIZED THAT THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING THAT PEOPLE NEEDED REALLY NEEDED TO BE CLOSE INTO TOWN.
OTHERWISE, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE JUST ADDING TO YOUR TRAFFIC PROBLEMS, ET CETERA.
JESSICA, YOU HAVE A QUESTION? I JUST WANNA SAY SINCE WE OWN IT, I THINK THAT STOOD IN FOR IT BEING PART OF THE CITY.
SO I THINK IT'S A TECHNICAL, TECHNICAL DISTINCTION, WHICH PEOPLE REALLY HAVE.
CL I MEAN, I THINK INTU INTUITIVELY, I BELIEVE YOU WOULD THINK THAT HAVE NO CLUE ABOUT THAT AT ALL.
A CONNECTION BETWEEN BUILDING WITHIN THE CITY.
IF WE OWN IT, IT'S WITHIN THE CITY.
SO
SO ON THE DELLS, WAS IT EXPLAINED TO THEM THAT IT'S STILL BEING USED FOR A VERY IMPORTANT SPECIFIC PURPOSE? YES.
AND ALS ALSO EXPLAINED THAT THE COST OF ANY IMPROVEMENTS IN THAT REGARD WOULD BE QUITE HIGH.
DID THAT CHANGE YOUR OPINIONS ONCE THEY LEARNED A LITTLE BIT MORE? LIKE ANY ENGAGEMENT? YES AND NO
AND SO, SO OUR RESPONSE TO THIS, UM, IS ON PAGE 48, WE ADDED AN ACTION ITEM, WHICH IS CONDUCT A FEASIBILITY STUDY OF FUTURE DEVELOPMENT AT THE DELLS.
UM, AND THE IDEA OF DOING A FEASIBILITY STUDY FIRST DOES NOT RULE OUT DOING A MASTER PLAN, BUT WE FELT A FEASIBILITY STUDY WAS IMPORTANT BECAUSE IN TALKING WITH PEOPLE, AT LEAST I DIDN'T FEEL THAT THEY REALLY GRASPED THE EXTENT OF THE CHALLENGES, WHETHER IT'S HOW MUCH MONEY IT WOULD COST TO DO TWO INJECTION WELLS, WHICH THE LAST I HEARD AND I'M SURE IS COMPLETELY OUT OF DATE, WAS LIKE $2 MILLION PER WELL OR SOMETHING.
UM, SO THE FEASIBILITY COULD OUTLINE ALL OF THE CHALLENGES AND THE STEPS THAT WOULD NEED TO BE TAKEN, UM, IN ORDER TO DEVELOP IT.
AND SO AT THAT POINT, ONCE YOU HAVE A FEASIBILITY STUDY, THEN YOU CAN SAY, OKAY, SHOULD WE DO A MASTER PLAN? AND IF SO, IT WOULD GO THROUGH A PUBLIC PROCESS.
YOU WANNA FINISH UP JESSICA? I DO, I DO.
I JUST WANNA, I ALSO WANTED THE FEASIBILITY STUDY WAS ALSO TALK ABOUT HOW LONG IT WOULD TAKE, RIGHT? TO GET IT, IF YOU WANT A SOLUTION, YOU'RE TALKING EVEN BEGINNING TO START LIKE SIX OR SEVEN YEARS.
SO AS LONG IT WOULD HAVE THAT, I ASSUME, UM, A TIMELINE FOR EVEN BEGINNING TO GET TO THE STAGE WHERE YOU COULD MASTER PLAN.
OKAY, HOLLY, YOU WANNA HAVE SOMETHING TO ADD, WHICH IS THAT THE, THE COUNCIL APPROVED A FEASIBILITY STUDY AND THEN PUT IT ON HOLD BECAUSE OF THE PURCHASE OF THE CULTURAL PARK AND OUR NEED TO MASTER PLAN THE CULTURAL PARK AND THE LIMITATION OF THE RESOURCES WE HAVE AVAILABLE TO BE ABLE TO DO BOTH AT THIS CONCURRENTLY IT A TENURE PLAN.
AND, UH, IT IS IN HERE KNOWING THAT AS A TENURE PLAN, IT'S STILL A RIGHT, YEAH.
THIS IS SORT OF, SINCE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT GENERAL THINGS MM-HMM.
YEAH, BUT THAT'S A WASTE DOWN.
WHERE WAS THAT FROM? YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT FROM WHAT
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PART OF THE COMMUNITY THERE, THERE'S A BIG HISTORY ON THAT ONE.UM, SO A LOT OF, FROM THE COMMUNITY PERSPECTIVE IS JUST THE SAFETY AND WANTING TO SEE IMPROVEMENTS ON PARTICULARLY WEST SEDONA.
AND THEN THE OTHER WOULD BE PUBLIC WORKS.
AND THAT WAS, UM, AT LEAST KURT IN PARTICULAR, WE TALKED TO HIM ABOUT THAT.
UM, IT WAS THEIR PREFERENCE, UM, THAT THE CITY TAKE OVER THAT.
SO, AND I DON'T KNOW IF PUBLIC WORKS, CAN WE GET A LITTLE BIT MORE EXPLANATION ON THAT? I MEAN,
AND WE, YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU SEE WHAT WE'RE ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH ON THAT SHORT STRETCH OF HIGHWAY IN UPTOWN.
THAT'S BECAUSE WE CAN MAKE THOSE DECISIONS AND WE CAN EXECUTE THOSE WITHOUT THE ARRAY OF, OF HOOPS AND CHALLENGES AND TRYING TO WORK WITH THE STATE.
AND THEY'VE GOT A LOT OF PRIORITIES AND UM, YOU KNOW, OTHER THINGS THAT THEY'RE DEALING WITH.
SO FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE, YEAH, THERE HAVE BEEN MANY TIMES WHERE INTERNALLY WE'RE LIKE, SHOULD WE LOOK AT THIS AGAIN? IS THIS WORTH? SO I DON'T THINK THAT THE PLAN INTENDS TO SAY WE SHOULD TAKE IT OVER EITHER ROADWAY, BUT RATHER THIS MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT WE'D WANT TO TAKE A LOT A A BIGGER PICTURE, LOOK AT PROS, CONS, SHORT TERM, LONG TERM, WHAT ARE THE PROJECTS WE'RE TRYING TO DO? WHAT DO WE THINK WE NEED TO DO IN THE FUTURE? AND THEN COME BACK TO THE COMMUNITY, TO THE COUNCIL AND, AND TRY TO DECIDE WHETHER IT MAKES SENSE OR IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.
DID ANYBODY EXPLAIN TO THE PEOPLE WHO WERE ASKING ABOUT THIS THAT IT HAS TO GO TO A REFERENDUM FOR THE PUBLIC BEFORE WE COULD EVEN CONSIDER? AND DID ANYONE EXPLAIN TO THEM THE HISTORY? COUNCILOR WILLIAMS AND I WERE BOTH, I THINK WERE THE ONLY ONES ON COUNCIL THAT WENT THROUGH THAT, RIGHT? KAREN WAS HERE, ANDY WAS HERE, KURT WAS SOMEPLACE ELSE.
BUT THE, THE AMOUNT OF PUSHBACK YES.
THAT WE EXPERIENCED, THAT WE WERE PART OF, AND THEN THE EXPENSE INVOLVED ON, UH, I MEAN I THINK ADOT WAS GONNA GIVE US $20 MILLION IN THE ROAD AND SAY, HAVE A NICE DAY JUST FOR THE, YOU KNOW, FOR THE LIGHTS.
THERE'S A LOT OF HISTORY THERE, RIGHT.
I DON'T WANNA TAKE THE TIME UP HERE, BUT DID ANYBODY EXPLAIN TO THEM THAT THERE IS A LEGAL COMPONENT THAT IT HAS TO GO TO THE VOTERS? I DON'T KNOW THAT THE LEGAL COMPONENT NECESSARILY CAME OUT.
I, I WASN'T AWARE OF IT UNTIL TOWARDS THE END, BUT IF WE WERE IN MORE OF A DISCUSSION LIKE WORKSHOP, UM, ENVIRONMENT, WHAT I WAS SEEING IS THAT THOSE WHO HAD LIVED HERE AT THAT TIME, THEY CERTAINLY BROUGHT IT UP ABOUT THE LIGHTS AND THAT, THE WHOLE HISTORY OF THAT.
UM, AND SO IF, IF WE HAD PEOPLE THAT EXPERIENCED IT, THEY DEFINITELY SHARED THAT WITH OTHERS.
MAYOR, IF I COULD, PETE, GO AHEAD.
JUST ADDING ONTO THAT, CYNTHIA KNOW WHEN WE SPOKE, UH, I HAD MENTIONED THAT I ACTUALLY THINK THE DOCUMENT SHOULD HAVE SOME WORDS IN THERE THAT IT, IT'S SUBJECT TO A PUBLIC VOTE WHEREVER WE TALK ABOUT IT IN THERE, JUST BECAUSE IT'S SUCH A, A HURDLE THAT'S NOT REALLY IN COMPLETELY OUR CONTROL AND IT'S A SIGNIFICANT ITEM.
AND I, I NOW HAVE THE ACTUAL REFERENCE FROM KURT LEGAL THAT WE CAN ADD IN HERE.
SO I DIDN'T WANT TO SKIP TO THAT POINT TILL WAY FURTHER DOWN THE ROAD, BUT SINCE YOU TOUCHED ON IT, I MEAN, DO YOU WANT TO CONTINUE MORE ON THAT? UH, COULD WE GO BACK TO WE CAN GO BACK.
YEAH, NO, I KNEW WE'D BE SKIPPING AROUND.
SO JUST A LITTLE BRIEF BACKGROUND ON WHY IT LOOKS DIFFERENT.
UM, WE DID GET QUITE A BIT OF INPUT, UM, BOTH FROM THE COMMUNITY AND DEFINITELY FROM THE WORK GROUP ABOUT THE VISION CHAPTER.
AND I THINK THE MAJOR COMMENT THAT WE HEARD, UM, AND THIS ISN'T JUST FROM WORK GROUP AND COMMUNITY, BUT EVEN COUNSELORS, COMMISSIONERS IN THE OLD PLAN UP IN THE FRONT EXECUTIVE SUMMARY, THE FOLDOUT, WE HAD MAJOR OUTCOMES AND THEN WE ALSO HAD SIX VISION THEMES.
UM, AND SO THE, UH, KIND OF THE GOAL THAT THE WORK GROUP WANTED TO SEE IS TO TRY TO SIMPLIFY AND CONSOLIDATE THOSE, UM, AND IMPROVE READABILITY.
UM, AND SO WHAT WE DID IS WE MERGED THOSE DESIRED OUTCOMES AND THE VISION THEMES.
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AND AS FAR AS KIND OF IMPROVING THE UNDERSTANDING, UM, THE SUGGESTIONS WAS TO GO WITH THE TERMS CORE VALUES AND GUIDING PRINCIPLES.UM, AGAIN, AS OPPOSED TO PEOPLE USED TO STRUGGLE WITH THE SIX VISION STATEMENTS ARE THOSE VISION THEMES OR GOALS, THERE WAS SOME CONFUSION OVER THAT.
UM, AND THEN AS FAR AS THE SENTIMENT, UM, WE FELT LIKE EVEN THOUGH IT HAS CHANGED AND SHIFTED THAT THE PRIORITIES ARE BASICALLY THE SAME AND STILL REFLECT, UM, KIND OF WHAT WE SAW IN THE HOUSEHOLD SURVEY, THAT EARLIER SLIDE, UM, THAT EVERYBODY STILL SUPPORTS THE ORIGINAL VISION WHERE ENVIRONMENT IS NUMBER ONE.
SO ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS CHAPTER? DID ANYBODY WELL, AS FAR AS THE VISION OF ACCOMPLISHMENTS, DID ANYONE TALK ABOUT, YOU KNOW, BACK THEN WE DIDN'T HAVE A SIM, WE DIDN'T HAVE THE DRIVING FORCE TO DO A SIM PROGRAM.
IT'S BEEN DONE WELL EFFECTIVE I THINK AS FAR AS GETTING THOSE PINCH POINTS.
BUT HOW ARE THE TRAFFIC STUDIES OR HAVE THERE BEEN ANY STUDIES TO SEE IF WHAT WE HAVE SO FAR? 'CAUSE WE STILL SEE TRAFFIC, BUT WE KNOW IT COULD BE A LOT WORSE IF WE DIDN'T HAVE THE, THE, THE BUSES IF WE DIDN'T HAVE A LOT OF THE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE CERTAINLY IN UPTOWN, THE SOUTHBOUND, IT'S BEEN DRAMATICALLY IMPROVED.
PART OF WHAT WE DO NOW IS, IS WE'RE CONTINUALLY UPDATING OUR VIS MODEL SO THAT WE CAN, YOU KNOW, LOOK AT ADDITIONAL IMPROVEMENTS THAT WE'RE GONNA MAKE AS WELL AS IMPLEMENT THE ONES THAT WE'VE MADE INTO THE MODEL TO SEE WHAT THOSE IMPACTS ARE ARE DOING.
UM, SO, YOU KNOW, AS, AS WE GIVE OUR QUARTERLY SIM UPDATES, THAT'S, THAT'S OUR INTENT IS TO GIVE AN UPDATE ON, ON OUR PROGRESS WITH THAT.
I'M JUST CONCERNED THAT PEOPLE HAVE AN EXPECTATION THAT THIS DOCUMENT AND WHATEVER WE'RE DOING IS GONNA SOLVE TRAFFIC.
SOME PEOPLE EXPECT TO SEE NO TRAFFIC COME SPRING BREAK IN THE FUTURE.
AND WHETHER THAT'S GONNA HAPPEN OR NOT, I, I WOULD TEND TO THINK OTHERWISE THERE'D BE NO TRAFFIC IN MANHATTAN OR IN LA, BUT IT COULD ALWAYS BE WORSE AND ELIMINATING THE PINCH POINTS AND DOING ALL THE WORK, I, I JUST WANNA DO SOMETHING TO NOT, I DON'T WANNA SAY LOWER EXPECTATION, BUT EDUCATE PEOPLE TO WHAT A, A BEAR TRAFFIC IS.
WELL, YOU KNOW, WE'VE TRIED TO KIND OF REMIND FOLKS WHEN WE GIVE THOSE SIM UPDATES WHAT THE, WHAT THE STRATEGY OF SIM WAS.
AND REALLY THE FOCUS OF THAT AS, AS YOU STATED, WAS TO REMOVE THE CHOKE POINTS AND THEN FROM THERE, GIVE OURSELVES TOOLS TO BE ABLE TO MANAGE TRAFFIC, UM, THROUGH TRANSIT, MULTIMODAL AND, AND YOU KNOW, ADDITIONAL ROAD CONNECTIONS AND THOSE SORTS OF THINGS.
SO WE CAN CERTAINLY TRY TO MAKE THAT EMPHASIS AS WE CONTINUE TO GIVE SOME OBJECTS IN THE FUTURE.
I'M, I'M TALKING ABOUT THIS DOCUMENT.
YEAH, SOME PEOPLE MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS DOCUMENT, BUT, AND ANOTHER 10 YEARS FROM NOW THEY'RE CAN SAY, WELL, WE STILL HAVE TRAFFIC.
THEY, THEY DIDN'T DO A GOOD JOB.
AND THAT'S NOT THE CASE THAT, THAT, I GUESS THAT POINT COULD ALSO BE REFLECTED IN THAT CIRCULATION SECTION.
WHERE WE'VE DISCUSSED THOSE IMPROVEMENTS AND THAT'S WHERE I PULLED UP PAGE 61, UH, WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT A MULTIMODAL NETWORK AND YOU'VE GOT THAT LITTLE IMAGE THERE.
UM, THE POLICIES TALK ABOUT TAKING THE COMPREHENSIVE HOLISTIC APPROACH, UM, AND THEN WE'VE GOT THE DEVELOPING MULTIMODAL CIRCULATION NETWORK, ET CETERA.
SO THE THOUGHT WAS THAT THIS SECTION REALLY GETS TO THE POINT THAT WE HAVE TO MAKE PROGRESS ON ALL OF THESE THINGS.
AND IT'S NOT JUST GONNA BE ONE PROJECT OR ONE TYPE OF IMPROVEMENT.
I, I I, FROM WHAT I HEAR THE MAYOR SAYING, AND THIS IS AN ASPIRATIONAL DOCUMENT, I THINK AS WE ALL SAID ABOUT A THOUSAND TIMES AT, AT SOME MEETING, IS THAT AT SOME POINT, AND I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS THE RIGHT ONE OR NOT.
I THINK, I THINK, I REALLY THINK SAYING THAT IT'S MULTIMODAL, THIS IS, THAT ISN'T THE POINT THAT PEOPLE HEAR, THE POINT THAT PEOPLE HAVE TO HEAR IS THERE ARE REASONABLE EXPECTATIONS ABOUT WHAT WE CAN DO WITH TRAFFIC.
AND THAT THAT REASONABLE EXPECTATION MEANS IT CAN BE BETTER THAN IT IS.
BUT I THINK THAT'S WHAT HE'S SAYING.
AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT BELONGS SOMEWHERE IN THIS DOCUMENT OR NOT.
I MEAN, I THINK DIDN'T JUSTIN GET IN A LOT OF IT SAYS IT.
I THINK IT'S, I I YOU THINK IT DOES, I CONSIDER THAT ADDRESSED ON PAGE 60.
[01:00:01]
I DIDN'T GET THAT FAR BECAUSE WE JUST GOT OTHERS MAY NOT AGREE WITH ME, BUT I I, I SEE THAT AS WELL.IS THAT THE EXPECTATION THAT THAT WILL BE COVERED THERE? BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE DO EXPECT PAGE WHAT, 60 THAT ULTIMATELY WE'RE GONNA SOLVE TRAFFIC
UNLESS WE PUT FOUR LANES UP TO THE CANYON AND, AND THE SWITCHBACKS AND EVERYTHING ELSE, AND EVEN THEN, WHO KNOWS WHERE WE'RE GONNA BE IN 10 YEARS FROM NOW? MM-HMM.
SO, BUT THANK YOU, UH, MELISSA AND THE VICE MAYOR.
SO JUST SORT OF GENERALLY I UNDERSTAND ABOUT SETTING EXPECTATIONS AND HOW THESE PROJECTS WORK WITH THAT.
YOU MAKE A STATEMENT SOMEWHERE IN HERE, IN THE 103 PAGES, YOU HAVE A STATEMENT AROUND THE IDEA THAT IN ORDER FOR US TO REDUCE TRAFFIC, WE HAVE TO GET PEOPLE OUT OF THEIR VEHICLES.
THAT IS ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, GOD BLESS YOU, YAY, VERILY, WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE.
WHAT YOU REALLY NEED IS YOU NEED THAT CAVEAT SOMEWHERE IN THE DOCUMENT THAT SAYS, WE CAN'T MAKE ANYONE GET OUTTA THEIR VEHICLE.
RIGHT? WE CAN'T MAKE PEOPLE USE OUR TRANSIT SYSTEM.
WE CAN'T MAKE PEOPLE RIDE A BIKE.
WE CAN'T MAKE PEOPLE WALK, RIGHT? I'M, I'M SORRY.
PEOPLE ARE USING OUR SHUTTLE SYSTEM TO WALK A, TO NOT WALK A MILE BETWEEN POSSE GROUND AND THE TRAILHEAD.
SO WE HAVE TO BE MAYBE JUST SET THE EXPECTATION THAT YOU CAN SAY WHAT YOU WANT, BUT YOU CAN'T MAKE PEOPLE DO WHAT YOU NEED FOR THEM TO DO TO GET TO THE GOAL THAT YOU WANNA ACHIEVE.
AND MAYBE THAT'S REALLY WHAT'S MISSING IS THAT WE'RE NOT SETTING THE EXPECTATION THAT WE, THAT ALL THE THINGS THAT WE'RE DOING WILL ACHIEVE THE GOAL THAT WE'RE HOPING IT WILL ACHIEVE.
SO THAT'S JUST THAT A GOOD WAY OF DOING IT.
WELL, GETTING BACK TO THE, THE POINT YOU WERE MAKING EARLIER, MAYOR ON THAT PAGE 60 WHERE WE TALK ABOUT OUR SUCCESSES AND COMPLETED PROJECTS, IT WOULD BE GOOD POTENTIALLY TO PUT SOMETHING IN THERE THAT PEAK TRAFFIC TOOK 30 MINUTES NOW TAKES 10 COMING DOWN THE CANYON OR WHATEVER.
THAT'S, THAT'S SHOWING THAT YES, IT, IT'S AN ADD VALUE TO WHAT WE'VE BEEN DOING AND REDUCES IT, BUT IT DOESN'T ELIMINATE IT.
THAT'S THE EXACT THING THAT WE'RE LOOKING TO BE ABLE TO PORTRAY IS WHAT OUR INCREMENTAL IMPROVEMENTS ARE ON THAT TRAVEL TIME.
SO WE COULD, YOU KNOW, COORDINATE WITH, WITH THIS EFFORT AND GETTING THAT INFORMATION YEAH.
AND THE PLAN DOES HAVE A REFERENCE TO THE DASHBOARD AND OTHER TECHNOLOGICAL IMPROVEMENTS, ET CETERA.
SO MAYOR, IF I COULD, I'M SORRY, PETER, GO AHEAD.
BACK UP AT, AT A DIFFERENT LEVEL.
YOU HAD MENTIONED THAT WE STARTED OFF IN WITH THE LAST DOCUMENT, WHICH I OFTEN CALL 2017, BUT IT'S 2014.
SIX MAJOR OUTCOMES, SIX VISION THEMES, SIX DIFFERENT CHAPTERS, EACH WITH THE GOAL POLICIES AND AN ACTION PLAN.
AND OUR NEW PLAN HAS SIX KEY ISSUES, VISION STATEMENT, TWO CORE VALUES, THREE GUIDING PRINCIPLES, SIX CHAPTER GOALS, EACH WITH SOME KEY ISSUES AND SYNOPI A SYNOPSIS POLICIES AND ACTIONS.
IT'S NOT CLEAR TO ME THAT WE ACHIEVED A GOAL OF SIMPLIFYING THE COMPLEXITY OF THE PLAN FROM 2014, AND IT'S KIND OF FAR DOWN THE PIPE TO BE BRINGING THAT UP AT, AT THIS PARTICULAR POINT.
BUT I, I MUST ADMIT, IT MAKES ME I, I KNOW THAT IN THE LAST FIVE YEARS OR SO OF, OF THIS CURRENT PLAN, WE ALWAYS, PEOPLE REFERENCED IT AND THERE WAS ALWAYS KIND OF A LITTLE JOKE ABOUT HOW COMPLEX IT WAS WITH ALL THE MAJOR OUTCOMES AND VISION THEMES AND, AND HOW TO SORT THAT ALL OUT.
AND, AND NOW I SEE THAT WE'VE ACTUALLY GOTTEN MORE COMPLEX IN THIS SORT OF ATTITUDE.
IT WILL JUST PERPETUATE THIS DOCUMENT HAS GOTTEN MORE COMPLEX.
AND OF COURSE OUR TOWN HAS GOTTEN MORE COMPLEX.
SO MAYBE THAT THAT'S PART OF THE ANSWER, BUT I, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH THAT OTHER THAN I LOOK AT THAT AND, AND I REACT, AND I KNOW THAT THAT WAS PART OF OUR GOAL WAS TO MAKE IT MORE STRAIGHTFORWARD AND IT JUST DIDN'T LOOK LIKE WE ACHIEVED THAT.
SO IN SOME AREAS, I FEEL LIKE WE HAVE, UM, THE GOALS, WE PARED IT DOWN SO THAT FOR EACH CHAPTER, THERE'S ONE GOAL THAT WE'RE TRYING TO ACHIEVE.
THE VISIONS, YES, IT WENT FROM SIX TO FIVE
[01:05:01]
I THINK THE CHAPTERS DID GET CLEARER FROM SOME OF THAT SENSE, AND IT'S REALLY JUST THAT INTRODUCTORY PART THAT GOT MORE COMPLEX IN A WAY.AND MAYBE THAT'S THE RESULT OF WORKING WITH A COMMUNITY GROUP.
ALTHOUGH WE WORKED WITH A COMMUNITY GROUP, YOU KNOW, THE LAST TIME IT WAS OUT TOO, AND IT, IT DIDN'T GET THAT COMPLEX, BUT THAT'S JUST, OH, IT WAS COMPLEX BACK THEN, RIGHT? OH, IT WAS VERY COMPLEX.
WHAT'S THAT? JESS JESSICA SAID THAT YOU REMEMBERS VERY CLEARLY HOW COMPLEX IT GOT BACK.
WELL, AND THAT WAS ONE REASON WE HAD MAJOR OUTCOMES IN ONE PLACE AND VISION THEMES IN ANOTHER.
AND THAT WAS A STEERING COMMITTEE SUGGESTION.
SO WE WERE ON THE VISION CHAPTER
I DON'T KNOW IF WE'RE DONE WITH THAT ONE.
WHY DON'T YOU JUST, WHY DON'T YOU JUST ASK YOU QUESTIONS? OKAY.
I MEAN, I ONLY HAVE ONE ON THE VISION CHAPTER THAT WE WOULDN'T HAVE ALREADY DISCUSSED.
SO ON COMMUNITY PARTNERSHIPS POLICY 3.1, UH, AND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT JUST CAME UP, CAME TO MIND.
UH, SO WE DIDN'T TALK ABOUT IT THE OTHER DAY.
UH, WE SAY POLICY 3.1, FACILITATE CONNECTIONS BETWEEN RESIDENTS, LOCAL ORGANIZATIONS AND SCHOOL TO BUILD A STRONGER SENSE OF COMMUNITY.
I THINK WE SHOULD INCLUDE BUSINESSES AS PART OF THAT COMMUNITY, BECAUSE THAT IS A FRACTURED ASPECT OF COMMUNITY QUITE FREQUENTLY NOW BETWEEN RESIDENTS AND BUSINESSES, PARTICULARLY THOSE BUSINESSES THAT ARE PART OF THE HOSPITALITY INDUSTRY.
SO I THINK THAT INCLUDING THEM IN POLICY 3.1 AS WELL AS THE, UH, SUPPORTING PARAGRAPH UNDERNEATH WOULD BE A WORTHWHILE ADDITION.
SO JUST TO ORIENT EVERY ONE PAGE, I MISSED, I MISSED THE PAGE 26 SECTION.
SO PAGE 26, POLICY 3.1, COMMUNITY PARTNERSHIPS.
MAYOR, IF YOU DON'T MIND, I, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THIS IS A WORK SESSION.
STAFF IS GONNA GO AWAY FROM THIS WORK SESSION AND MAKE EDITS TO THIS DOCUMENT BASED ON THE FEEDBACK THAT THEY'RE HEARING FROM ALL OF YOU.
SO WHEREVER POSSIBLE, WHEN THERE IS AN INDIVIDUAL COMMENT, UM, OR SUGGESTED EDIT, IF WE COULD TRY TO GET A SENSE OF IS THERE CONSENSUS ON THAT OR NOT.
SO THAT WE AREN'T TAKING JUST INDIVIDUAL EDITS AND MAKING ALL OF THOSE WHEN THAT MIGHT NOT BE THE CONSENSUS OF THE BODY.
SO IN, IN THIS SECTION, THE COMMENT I WANNA MAKE WILL BLEED BACK TO THE INTRODUCTORY SECTION.
I'D, I'D LIKE TO HEAR YOU TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT NUMBERING VERSUS NOT NUMBERING OF THE THINGS THAT HAPPEN HERE.
BECAUSE WHEN PEOPLE SEE NUMBERS, THEY JUST IMMEDIATELY RESPOND TO THINK AND PRIORITIZATION.
AND SO WHAT'S BEEN YOUR THOUGHT ABOUT THAT USE OF NUMBERS AND WHETHER THERE'S AN ALTERNATIVE TO NUMBERS THAT GETS US AWAY FROM THAT, THAT ISSUE? OKAY.
SO WITH THE VISION CHAPTER, UM, EVEN THOUGH IT STILL SAYS 1, 2, 3,
UM, BUT THERE WAS STILL A LOT OF DISCUSSION OF WHICH ONE SHOULD COME FIRST.
UM, SO ENVIRONMENT IS FIRST, COMMUNITY IS SECOND ON THIS LIST.
AND HONESTLY, BY USING NUMBERS, YOU COULD SWITCH IT TO A, B, OR C IF YOU WANTED
BUT IT'S, IT'S HELPFUL AS AN IDENTIFIER.
UM, AND THAT IS DEFINITELY THE CASE.
I DON'T, NOT SURE IF THIS IS WHAT YOU MEANT, UM, BY NUMBERING, BUT WHEN WE GET TO POLICIES, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THE PREVIOUS PLAN DIDN'T HAVE THAT THIS ONE DOES, IS BY SAYING, GIVING A POLICY A NUMBER, KIND OF LIKE WE JUST DID, UH, PAGE 26, POLICY 3.1.
WHEREAS IN THE PAST, I CAN REMEMBER PEOPLE SAYING HALFWAY DOWN THE PAGE, THE THIRD SENTENCE ON THE RIGHT
UM, SO, SO THAT WOULD BE A REASON TO KEEP THE NUMBERING SYSTEM.
BUT YOU DO MAKE A GOOD POINT, AND I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE IS ANY PERFECT WAY TO RESOLVE IT, THAT PEOPLE HAVE A TENDENCY TO SEE NUMBERS AS A RANKING ORDER.
AND I THINK WITH THE POLICIES, THAT WAS NOT NECESSARILY THE CASE, ESPECIALLY WITH THIS BACK AND FORTH, YOU KNOW, THE PUBLIC COMMENTS, P AND Z COMMENTS, THINGS
[01:10:01]
GOT SHIFTED AND ADDED.AND SO THAT'S THE SORT OF THING WE CAN DO OUR BEST TO RANK THEM, BUT THAT'S SUBJECTIVE.
PEOPLE ARE NOT GONNA AGREE ON WHAT THE RANKING IS.
SO IT'S NOT BY PRIORITY ORDER.
THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION? YEAH.
MELISSA COMPLEX, IT'S, OH, YEAH.
SO, SO I'M, I'M PROBABLY GONNA PARTY ON YOURS JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE.
AND THEN SOME OTHER QUESTIONS.
AND AGAIN, THIS IS JUST POTENTIALLY IGNORANCE ON MY PART AND JUST GETTING EDUCATED.
UM, FOR ME, WHERE I WAS CONCERNED WITH THE NUMBERING WAS ON THE INTRODUCTORY SECTION, PRIMARY ISSUES, RIGHT? LIKE TRAFFIC, WHATEVER.
UM, BECAUSE DEPENDING ON WHERE YOU ARE AND WHAT YOU'RE EXPERIENCING IN YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD OR IN YOUR LIFE OR WHATEVER, TRAFFIC MAY NOT BE THE NUMBER ONE THING.
IT MIGHT BE OHVS MIGHT BE THE NUMBER ONE THING.
SO IT, IT, THAT TO ME IS WHERE I WAS WORRIED ABOUT USING RANKING, UM, IN PARTICULAR MORE THAN THAN ANYWHERE ELSE.
AND I THINK THAT THOSE, TO YOUR POINT, CYNTHIA, YOU'RE, YOU'RE CORRECT.
IT'S SO MUCH EASIER TO SAY 3.1 FOR SOME THINGS, BUT FOR HERE, I THINK EVERYONE'S GONNA SAY TRAFFIC OR THEY'RE GONNA SAY OHV, SO THEY'RE GOING TO SAY WHAT THE ISSUE IS AS OPPOSED TO A NUMBER.
SO THAT, FOR ME WAS A, A BIG CONCERN ABOUT RANKING THE ISSUES BECAUSE I, I THINK IT'LL DEPEND ON YOUR PERSPECTIVE IN THE COMMUNITY.
UM, UM, JUST SORT OF GENERAL, AGAIN, JUST SORT OF EDUCATE ME A LITTLE BIT HERE.
UM, I'M REALLY CONFUSED BY THE WORD POLICY.
SO, UM, THESE SEEM LIKE PRIORITIES, LIKE, LIKE COUNCIL PRIORITIES OR, UM, PRIORITIES.
SOME OF THEM ARE LIKE DIRECTIVES WE SHOULD BE GIVING STAFF.
SOME ARE THINGS THAT COUNT THAT THE CITIZENS WANNA DIRECT THE COUNCIL TO BE CONCERNED ABOUT.
SO I WAS JUST A LITTLE CONFUSED ABOUT THAT.
AND THE FACT THAT SOMETIMES THOSE ARE VERY HIGH LEVEL AND THEREFORE MAKE SENSE AS AN OVERARCHING, WHILE LOTS OF STUFF CAN SORT OF FIT IN THIS, AND OVER THE COURSE OF 10 YEARS, LOTS OF STUFF IS GONNA COME IN AND OUT OF THIS AS FAR AS ACTIONS ARE CONCERNED, WHETHER THERE ARE DIRECTIVES FROM US TO STAFF, WHETHER IT'S STAFF COMING BACK WITH A PROJECT BASED ON THAT DIRECTIVE.
AND SOMETIMES THEY FEEL LIKE THEY'RE PROJECTS, LIKE THEY'RE ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THAT, THAT DO, YOU KNOW, FIX THE, THE, THEY'RE LIKE ACTION ITEMS. UM, AND THEN WE HAVE ACTION ITEMS. SO I WAS JUST A LITTLE CONFUSED AS TO HOW ALL OF THOSE THINGS SORT OF WORK TOGETHER.
SO I'LL, I'LL SHUT UP FOR A SECOND AND, AND HOPEFULLY HAVE YOU EXPLAIN ALL THIS TO ME.
SO MAYBE OTHER PEOPLE IN THE WORLD ARE A LITTLE CONFUSED TOO.
AND I MIGHT HAVE KURT JUMP IN 'CAUSE I ASKED HIM A QUESTION ABOUT THIS A WHILE BACK,
UM, BUT WHAT WE HAVE ON PAGE SEVEN COMPONENTS OF THE PLAN WHERE WE TRY TO EXPLAIN WHAT EACH OF THESE THINGS ARE, WHICH IS GOALS, POLICIES, AND ACTIONS.
AND I GUESS MY QUESTION MAYBE BACK TO YOU IS, DOES THIS NOT REALLY PROVIDE A GOOD EXPLANATION? UM, SO FOR POLICIES, THEY'RE INTENDED TO GUIDE FUTURE DECISION MAKING IN ORDER, IN ORDER TO ACCOMPLISH THE PLAN'S VISION AND GOALS.
UM, AND I HAD ASKED KURT A FEW MONTHS BACK BECAUSE THIS KEPT COMING UP, I'M LIKE, IS THERE A LEGAL DEFINITION OF POLICY
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU WANNA ELABORATE ON THAT, BUT, OH, I, I DON'T HAVE MUCH MORE TO SAY CYNTHIA AND MAYOR AND COUNCIL, BUT THERE'S NOT A LEGAL DEFINITION OF POLICY.
AND AS WE KNOW, THE ONLY PLACE WHERE, WHEN IT, OTHER THAN WHAT THE CITY CONTINUES TO DO TO IMPLEMENT THE PLAN DOWN ITSELF, WHERE THE RUBBER MEETS THE ROAD IS WHEN ON A, ON A REZONE, UH, AND WHETHER IT'S GOING TO COMPLY WITH THE, UM, THE COMMUNITY PLAN AND COMMUNITY FOCUS AREAS, UM, AND DURING A REZONE OR, UM, A DEVELOPMENT VIEW AND THOSE, THOSE TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS THAT WE REVIEW IN THE LDC.
SO, UH, OTHER THAN THAT, THIS IS THE CITY'S, UH, DESIRED VISION, UH, FOR, FOR THE COMMUNITY GOING FORWARD.
BRIAN, DID YOU HAVE A QUESTION? AND, UH, I WAS JUST GONNA ANSWER CYNTHIA'S QUESTION.
LIKE, I'M FINE WITH HOW YOU'VE STRUCTURED AND WHAT YOU'VE DEFINED ON PAGE SEVEN, AND MAYBE YOU SHOULD JUST PUT SOME OTHER SENTENCE ON PAGE SEVEN THAT SAYS, IT DOESN'T, WHAT, WHAT YOU SEE LISTED DOES NOT IMPLY A RANK ORDER OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
JESSICA, SO THAT'S TWO DIFFERENT QUESTIONS.
I JUST WANT TO, I, I THINK, I THINK WE CAN LOOK AT, AT THIS COUNCIL AS WHAT POLICY MEANS.
WE ALL HAVE A DIFFERENT IDEA OF WHAT POLICY MEANS ON THIS COUNCIL.
SO I THINK IT'S A VERY BROAD CATEGORY AND I THINK IT'S FINE THE WAY THEY'VE USED IT.
I DON'T THINK IT HAS AN EXACT, AND I THINK IT, IT BASICALLY IT'S, IT'S, UH,
[01:15:01]
IT, WE DON'T AGREE ON WHAT POLICY IS.SOME OF US THINK IT'S THIS LEVEL.
SOME OF US THINK IT'S THIS LEVEL, UM, AND WE ALL THINK WE'RE RIGHT.
SO I THINK THAT IN THIS DOCUMENT POLICY IS VERY BROAD, HAS A VERY BROAD MEANING.
AND I, I THINK IT SHOULD JUST BE ALLOWED TO SORT OF STAND THERE AS A, AS A CONUNDRUM FOR YOU.
SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE NOBODY ELSE WANTS TO JUMP IN ON THAT BEFORE I NO, I THINK I'M JUST FINE WITH POLICY WITH THE TERMS THAT ARE BEING USED.
CAN I JUST JUMP IN FOR ONE SECOND PLEASE.
I MEAN, I'M NOT, THIS IS ABOUT, THIS ISN'T ABOUT WORDSMITHING.
THIS IS ABOUT THE FACT THAT SOMETIMES THEY SEEM REALLY BROAD AND SOMETIMES THEY SEEM REALLY, REALLY NARROW, RIGHT? AND THEY SEEM LIKE ACTION ITEMS, LIKE SOMEBODY SHOULD GO DO THIS SPECIFIC THING AND THEN THERE'S ACTION ITEMS WHICH ARE ABOUT DOING THIS SPECIFIC THING.
AND SO THAT'S WHERE I, I FIND IT CONFUSING TO HAVE TWO PLACES WHERE YOU'RE BASICALLY AT THE SAME LEVEL AS OPPOSED TO BEING AT DIFFERENT LEVELS.
DO YOU, DO YOU, DO YOU BELIEVE THAT THERE ARE THINGS IN THERE THAT ARE TASK ITEMS, CYNTHIA, AT THAT LEVEL, THAT ARE MISCATEGORIZED AS POLICY? PERHAPS THE DIRECTION THAT WE COULD GIVE WOULD BE TO GO BACK AND REVIEW THOSE
I THINK SOME OF IT IS HOW YOU INTERPRET IT EXACTLY LIKE ON, ON COUNCIL, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT WHAT'S POLICY.
'CAUSE WE ALL KNOW THAT OUR JOB IS POLICY AND YET WE DIFFER SIGNIFICANTLY ON WHAT THAT MEANS.
SO IF I COULD JUMP IN, I THINK THAT WAS PART OF THE THOUGHT PROCESS IN THIS, UM, UNDERSTANDING THAT THE MAIN COMPONENTS ARE GONNA BE THESE POLICIES AND THE ACTION ITEMS. AND SO WE DID HAVE A FORMAL THOUGHT PROCESS ON WHAT BELONGED WHERE NOT TO SAY THAT WE ARE CORRECT.
SO WE WOULD LOVE TO HEAR THE DIRECTION, IF YOU SEE A SPECIFIC ITEM, A SPECIFIC POLICY THAT YOU FEEL IS TOO NARROW, UM, AND BELONGS IN AN ACTION ITEM, WE'D LOVE TO HEAR THAT.
SO AN EXAMPLE OF THAT MIGHT BE, UM, PAGE 61 UNDER CIRCULATION, COMMUNICATE THE SEDONA IN MOTION PROGRAM GOALS, PRIORITIES, AND PROGRESS.
SO COMMUNICATE, MAYBE SOME PEOPLE WOULD ARGUE THAT, THAT THAT'S A SPECIFIC THING.
MAYBE THAT SHOULD BE A POLICY.
UM, BUT BECAUSE IT'S TALKING ABOUT PROGRAM GOALS, PRIORITIES, PROJECTS, ET CETERA, UM, WE DO HAVE AN ACTION ITEM AND THAT'S THE ONE THAT TALKS ABOUT DOING A DASHBOARD.
UM, SO LIKE AN, A DASHBOARD EXAMPLE OF GETTING A LOT MORE SPECIFIC.
WHEREAS PROGRAMS, PROJECTS, THOSE ARE VERY DIFFERENT THINGS.
SO I DON'T KNOW IF THAT HELPS TO EXPLAIN IT OR NOT.
SO ACTUALLY I THOUGHT ALL OF THOSE WERE HIGH LEVEL
YOU DIDN'T HAVE A PROBLEM THERE
AND WHEN YOU'VE DONE THAT INVESTIGATION, YOU'RE DONE WITH THAT INVESTIGATION.
RIGHT? UM, AND, AND SO FOR ME THAT, THAT WAS WHAT I WAS LOOKING AT.
LIKE, COULD I TWO YEARS FROM NOW STILL USE THIS POLICY AS A GUIDING TWO WAY OF SAYING, OH, THAT PROJECT OR WHATEVER IT IS THAT ACTION WE'RE GONNA TAKE FITS UNDERNEATH HERE.
THIS IS WHY WE WANT TO DO IT, IS BECAUSE IT'S PART OF THE COMMUNITY POLICIES.
ONCE I'VE DONE THAT ONE, I'M DONE.
AND SO IT JUST FEELS LIKE THAT THAT WAS MORE ACTION ITEM THAN IT WAS POLICY.
AND SO THAT'S WHY I ASKED THAT QUESTION.
SO I WOULD SAY ANOTHER WAY TO INTERPRET THIS IS IT'S A 10 YEAR PLAN AND MAYBE WE EXPLORE THIS, YOU KNOW, TWO MONTHS FROM NOW AND IT'S NOT FEASIBLE, BUT MAYBE IN EIGHT YEARS, A O COMES UP WITH SOME NEW SYSTEM OF PARTNERING OR LEASING OR WHO KNOWS WHAT.
UM, SO THAT, THAT ONE CAN GO EITHER WAY.
I THINK LET'S HAVE A CONVERSATION AFTER THIS 'CAUSE 'CAUSE WE'LL GET, WE'LL, WE'LL RUN INTO I THINK, PROBLEMS ELSEWHERE.
BUT EIGHT YEARS FROM NOW, WE MIGHT NEED TO BE ABLE TO IMPROVE THE DIGA BECAUSE THINGS HAVE CHANGED.
SO IT BECOMES A SLIPPERY THING.
WE JUST NEED TO MAKE A DECISION AROUND WHETHER OR NOT, UH, ACTION THAT CAN BE COMPLETED AND, AND HAS, UH, OUTCOME IS A POLICY OR THERE'S OTHER THINGS THAT WOULD FIT UNDERNEATH POLICIES AND, AND THOSE WILL SHIFT.
[01:20:01]
I DON'T KNOW.SO AS I SAID, WE COULD, WE COULD ARGUE THIS FOREVER, RIGHT.
UH, ON THAT, AND I DON'T WANT TO ARGUE THIS FOREVER.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE'RE CONSISTENT AS WE GO THROUGH THIS AND WHEN WE SAY SOMETHING'S A POLICY AND WHEN WE SAY SOMETHING'S AN ACTION ITEM AND WE CAN GO THROUGH IT AND, UM, EVALUATE EACH ONE AND SEE IF WE NEED TO MAKE ADJUSTMENTS.
UH, I DON'T KNOW IF POLICIES BOTHERED ME ALSO, JUST IN GENERAL, I FEEL LIKE COUNCIL MAKES POLICIES.
THESE ARE HANDED TO US AS OUR POLICIES.
SO IF WE'RE GONNA KEEP THEM IN THERE, AND I HOPE EVERYONE READS THEM REALLY CAREFULLY 'CAUSE WE'RE ADOPTING THEM AND THEY DON'T NECESSARILY EXIST.
SO THAT HAS ME CONCERNED BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THAT, THAT WE HAVE, AS A COUNCIL, WE VOTE ON THIS, WE WILL BE VOTING ON THAT.
THESE ARE OUR POLICIES, THEY WERE OUR STRATEGIES.
SO I'LL, I'LL JUMP IN ON THAT, ON THE POLICY THING BEFORE I GET TO MY OTHER POINT, WHICH IS I HAD A SIMILAR REACTION TO IT THAT POLICIES OR SOMETHING THAT IT'S MORE A SYNONYM WITH THESE ARE OUR ADOPTED RULES, REGULATIONS, THESE ARE WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO VERSUS GUIDELINES OR SOMETHING LIKE THE MORE ASPIRATIONAL, IT SEEMS LIKE A LESS ASPIRATIONAL TERM.
AND IF THIS IS AN ASPIRATIONAL DOCUMENT FOR THOSE THINGS, I, I, I WOULD REVISIT TRYING TO FIND A WORD.
I I HAD THE SAME REACTION TO THAT.
THE POINT I WANTED TO BRING UP ABOUT NUMBERS AND WAS, UH, ACTUALLY I THINK SOMETHING, MAYBE A PROBLEM I CREATED IN A CONVERSATION THAT I HAD WITH YOU, CYNTHIA, ON PAGE 19.
I HAD REACTED TO THE GUIDING PRINCIPLES IN THIS SECTION THAT THEY WERE NUMBERED BECAUSE AGAIN, I REACTED THAT NUMBERS GAVE AN ORDER, A PRIORITIZATION, YOU VERY RESPONSIBLY, UM, CHANGED THEM TO BULLET POINTS ON CHANGE 19 OF DRAFT THREE.
THE PROBLEM NOW THOUGH, IS THAT WHEN YOU GO TO PAGE 20, 21 AND 22, THERE'S STILL GUIDING PRINCIPLE ONE, TWO, AND THREE.
SO EITHER I, I SAY BYE-BYE TO MY REACTION.
AND YOU GO BACK TO THE WAY YOU ORIGINALLY HAD IT.
OR THESE BECOME GUIDING PRINCIPLE COLON ENVIRONMENT AND HERITAGE GUIDING PRINCIPLE COLON, UH, CUNY LIVABILITY AND CONNECTIONS.
SO SOMETHING THAT EITHER THE NUMBERS EITHER HAVE TO BE CONSISTENT OR, OR DISAPPEAR 1, 1 1 OR THE OTHER.
UM, OTHERWISE I THINK YOU'LL BE CONFUSING.
AND I GUESS WE NEED TO LOOK AT THAT THROUGH THE DOCUMENT AS WELL.
THANK YOU KATHY, FOR STIRRING UP THE POT.
WHAT WOULD I THINK BRIAN MAYBE MENTIONED THAT BEFORE OR MAYBE NOT.
UH, ON, ON THE, THE FOOTER OF EVERY PAGE PUT DOWN, JUST BECAUSE THINGS ARE IN NUMBER, HOWEVER YOU PHRASE IT, THE NUMBERS AREN'T IN TO INDICATE IN ANY SPECIFIC PREFERENCE OR ORDER.
IF, SO, IF YOU DID NUMBERS HERE TO TAKE, YOU'LL GO BACK TO WHERE YOU WENT WITH, UH, KATHY, YOU PUT NUMBERS IN, BUT YOU CLARIFY IN EVERY PAGE ON THE, THE FOOTER OR THE BORDER, THE NUMBERS ARE NO INDICATION OF, UH, IMPORTANCE OF PREFERENCE.
WOULD THAT SOLVE ANYTHING OR MAKE IT WORSE? WELL, IT SOUNDS LIKE FROM THIS CONVERSATION, WE HAVE A COUPLE DIFFERENT TYPES OF NUMBERING.
AND IT SOUNDS LIKE KEY ISSUES DO NOT NEED NUMBERING.
UM, BUT THE POLICIES, JUST FOR LOGISTICS, IT'S NICE TO HAVE THE NUMBERS.
SO WE CAN TAKE NUMBERING OUT OF THE INTRODUCTION AND THE VISION CHAPTERS.
AND I, I DO LIKE THE SUGGESTION OF SAYING GUIDING ENVIRONMENT GUIDING PRINCIPLE, FOR EXAMPLE, JUST, THEY JUST HAVE A, THIS IS THE COMMUNITY PLAN POLICIES THAT GO OVER THREE OR FOUR DIFFERENT COUNCILS,
SO CAN THERE NOT BE POLICIES IN A COMMUNITY PLAN THAT WILL DIFFER FROM INDIVIDUAL POLICIES THAT THESE, THE, THE COUNCIL MIGHT ADOPT OVER THE NEXT 10 YEARS? UM, IT, IT JUST, IT'S, I STILL HAVE NO TROUBLE WITH IT.
I DON'T MIND IT IF YOU FIND A DIFFERENT WORD FOR IT.
BUT I, THE PROCESS HAS TO COME TO AN END AT SOME POINT.
SO
[01:25:01]
ARE SPECIFIC, SPECIFIC POLICIES SEPARATE FROM THE BIGGER POLICIES IN THE COMMUNITY PLAN, THE ASPIRA, THE VISION POLICIES, THE ASPIRATIONAL POLICIES.UM, AND THERE'S OUR POLICIES WE ADOPT ARE SUPPOSED TO BE IN CONFORMANCE WITH OR SUPPORTED, SUPPORTIVE OF THE COMMUNITY PLANS POLICY.
SO, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE DIFFERENT LEVELS OF POLICY AS WELL AS DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS OF POLICY.
AND SO I, MY TEMPTATION, I MEAN MY, I I, I WOULD LEAVE IT JUST BECAUSE I DON'T THINK IT'S THAT SUBSTITUTE.
AND I THINK THE FACT THAT WE MAKE POLICIES IS TOTALLY ANOTHER THING ALTOGETHER.
UH, DIFFERENT COUNCILS MAKE DIFFERENT POLICIES, ALL OF WHICH ARE SUPPOSEDLY SUPPORTED BY THE SAME COMMUNITY PLAN.
UM, I UNDERSTAND THE POINT THAT YOU'RE MAKING, BUT I DO THINK THAT WE UP HERE HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING THAT WE ARE A TEMPORARY COUNCIL, THAT COUNCILS CHANGE, THAT POLICIES CHANGE WITH COUNCILS.
BUT THE AVERAGE PERSON WHO MAY HAVE JUST MOVED HERE SIX MONTHS AGO AND WANTS TO KNOW MORE ABOUT THE CITY AND PICKS UP THE COMMUNITY PLAN MAY NOT, MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE THAT UNDERSTANDING.
SO I WANNA WRITE A DOCUMENT FOR THE AUDIENCE THAT'S GONNA BE READING THE DOCUMENT VERSUS THEN WRITE A DOCUMENT THAT MAKES, YOU KNOW, THE SENSE TO US.
AND I THINK USING THE WORD POLICY IN THAT CONTEXT DOES CONFUSE THAT FOR WHO MIGHT, WHO THE AUDIENCE MAY BE.
WHAT ABOUT USING THE WORD OBJECTIVE? I, THERE WE, THERE'S NOTHING THAT SAYS WE HAVE TO USE THE WORD POLICY STRATEGY.
I SEE STRATEGIES AS MORE SPECIFIC LIKE AN ACTION
I WOULD SAY TALK ABOUT YOURSELF.
STRATEGY IS HIGH STRATEGIZE AND A TACTIC IS PRACTICAL.
SO WE HAVE BIG STRATEGIES AND IN ORDER TO AFFECT IT A STRATEGY, WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING, WHICH IS THE TACTICS THAT WE TAKE.
WE HAD THIS CONVERSATION IN ANOTHER GROUP.
SO, UM, I DON'T THINK, I THINK TO JESSICA'S MAIN POINT, I CERTAINLY DON'T WANNA BE HERE WORDSMITHING.
UM, I JUST WANT CONSISTENCY AND I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IT WILL MAKE SENSE TO, TO AN AVERAGE INDIVIDUAL WHO'S, WHO'S COMING HERE.
THAT'S, SO THAT'S ALL I'M HOPING FOR.
YOU'VE BROUGHT UP A NUMBER OF CONCERNS ABOUT THE CURRENT VERBIAGE.
SO THERE HAVE BEEN A NUMBER OF SUGGESTIONS AND NOW YOU'RE SAYING, WELL, YOU JUST FIGURE IT OUT,
BUT, BUT IF THEY DO
SO YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO ACCEPT WHATEVER IT IS THAT, THAT THEY'VE COME UP WITH.
CAN YOU JUST MAKE A NOTE THAT AT THE NEXT MEETING, THE REGULAR, YOU KNOW, COUNCIL MEETING, WHEN WE START ASKING YOU THE SAME QUESTIONS THAT YOU'LL JUST REMIND US AND SAY, OH, BY THE WAY, WE HAD THIS DISCUSSION JUST IN CASE SOME OF US DON'T REMEMBER.
WAIT FOR THE, FOR KAREN'S POINT, FOR THE SPECIFICS IS I THINK WE DO NEED TO GIVE AT LEAST A FEW WORDS FOR CONSIDERATION, WHICH I THINK STRATEGIES OBJECTIVES ARE TWO WORDS THAT, UH, HAVE BEEN BANDIED BOW.
I HEARD THEM, I DIDN'T SAY THEM.
THEY WERE HEARD, I HEARD THEM UP HERE.
THAT I THINK MIGHT BE MORE REFLECTIVE OF, OF WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO PRESENT.
BUT I THINK, I DON'T WANNA GIVE A COUPLE OF WORDS.
I THINK KAREN'S POINT IS THERE'S A TIME WHERE IF WE WANT SPECIAL WORDS, WE TELL THEM WHAT WORD WE WANT, NOT GIVE A COUPLE OF WORDS.
'CAUSE THEY HAVE TO COME BACK WITH 94 VERSIONS LATER WE'LL STILL HAVE THESE ISSUES.
GO AHEAD AND THEN WE'RE GONNA TAKE A BREAK.
IT IS A STRATEGIC PLAN AFTER ALL.
ARE WE CLEAR SOMEWHAT AS MUD IS THERE CONSENSUS? WE, SO WE ARE CURRENTLY LOOKING UP THE STATE STATUTE TO SEE WHAT LANGUAGE THEY USE.
THE GENERAL PLAN SHALL CONSIST OF A STATEMENT OF COMMUNITY GOALS AND DEVELOPMENT POLICIES.
BUT THE PLAN SHALL INCLUDE MAPS, ANY NECESSARY DIAGRAMS AND TEXT SETTING FORTH OBJECTIVES, PRINCIPLES, STANDARDS, AND PLAN PROPOSALS.
WHY DON'T WE GET A, A LEGISLATIVE CHANGE.
I DON'T THINK THAT CHANGES THE MEAN, I MEAN,
[01:30:02]
I APPRECIATE THAT.'CAUSE THAT'S HELPFUL TO HAVE THAT, THAT LEGAL.
BUT I THINK AGAIN, I, I GO WITH WHAT BRIAN SAID.
THERE'S A WORD THAT THE CONSENSUS WOULD BE STRATEGY, THE ACTION TOO.
IS THAT, IS THAT A GOOD NOTE? DO YOU HAVE A CONSENSUS NOW FROM US? KEEP YOUR NUMBERS.
BECAUSE THAT WAS GONNA BE MY QUESTION.
DO WE HAVE A CONSENSUS ON THE NUMBERING? YES.
AND TO REPEAT THAT WOULD BE NO NUMBERS IN THE VISION AND THE INTRODUCTION, BUT KEEPING THE NUMBERS FOR THE STRATEGIES AND ACTIONS.
THAT BEING SAID, WE'RE TAKING A FIVE, A 10 MINUTE BREAK.
IT'LL BE BACK AT, UH, FOUR 40 AT THIS ATED.
I HAVE, HAVE TIME IF WE CAN HAVE EVERYBODY TAKE THE SEATS, PLEASE.
BACK WHERE WE WERE AND LET'S, I DUNNO IF THE COUNCIL WANTS TO DISCUSS, IF YOU WANT TO STOP AT, UH, AFTER THREE HOURS, AT SIX O'CLOCK AND THEN WE CONTINUE THIS ON TO ANOTHER DAY, OR WE HAVE TO BE COGNIZANT OF THE STAFF TIME THAT'S BEING USED.
AND, UM, SO WOULD SIX O'CLOCK BE WORK FOR THE STAFF? KAREN? I, I WOULD ASK CYNTHIA
WELL, I DON'T HAVE ANY PLANS LATER THIS EVENING.
SO YOU'RE SAYING YOU, YOU'D RATHER STAY AND I THINK WE WERE HOPEFUL IF, IF WE BELIEVE THAT WE CAN COMPLETE THE REVIEW AND, AND COMMENTS TODAY WE ARE, UM, ADVERTISED FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING AND THE ADOPTION ON THE 12TH.
SO THAT WOULD BE I OUR IDEAL SCHEDULE.
UNLESS IT IS JUST WAY TOO MASSIVE AN UNDERTAKING.
AND YOU STILL HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS, UM, THAT YOU BELIEVE WE NEED A SECOND FULL WORK SESSION.
SO LET'S TRY TO GET THIS MOVING WITHOUT RUSHING BECAUSE THERE'S TOO MUCH IMPORTANT CONTENT HERE.
SO FOR CLARIFICATION, WE ARE GOING TILL SIX POSSIBLY.
IF WE NEED TO, WE'LL GO TILL SIX.
I THINK THERE'S NO QUESTION WE'RE GONNA BE GOING TO SIX.
BUT THAT IT'S NOT, WE'RE NOT GOING TO AIM TOWARD FINISHING IT TODAY.
IF YES, WE ARE, WE ARE, WE ARE GONNA TRY TO FINISH IT TODAY DEPENDING ON WHERE WE ARE AT SIX O'CLOCK IF WE'RE ALMOST DONE.
'CAUSE KAREN JUST SAID WE ARE ALREADY NOTICED FOR I HEARD YEAH.
THE NEXT SET OF NEXT BANK OF MEETINGS.
I KNOW, BUT THAT COULD BE PUT OFF TILL THE SECOND MEETING.
I'M ASSUMING NOT IF WE'RE ALREADY ADVERTISED FOR ANOTHER MEETING.
I MEAN, WE, WE CAN RE ADVERTISE IF WE NEED TO.
I THINK OUR PREFERENCE WOULD BE TO ADHERE TO THAT SCHEDULE MINE IF WE CAN.
SO LET'S TRY TO KEEP THAT IN IN MIND.
WE ONLY HAVE WHAT, ANOTHER HUNDRED PAGES TO GO VICE MAYOR.
SO I SEE THAT YOU'VE MOVED US TO COMMUNITY, BUT I HAVE A STILL HAVE A QUESTION ON VISION.
UH, SO WE HAVE A VISION STATEMENT FOR 2033.
WE HAVE A VISION THAT WE SHOW BEFORE EVERY COUNCIL MEETING.
WE HAVE VISIONS HERE AND VISIONS THERE.
SO HOW DO THEY ALIGN LINE? THAT'S A REALLY GOOD QUESTION.
MAYBE THAT'S WHERE NUMBERING COMES BACK IN.
SO TO UH, ADDRESS, UM, VICE MAYOR'S QUESTION, UM, WE'VE HAD THIS QUESTION FOR 10 YEARS NOW.
UM, AND SO WHEN WE DID THE UPDATE 10 YEARS AGO TO THE PLAN, WE DID COME UP WITH, AGAIN, THIS WAS FEEDBACK TO TRY TO SIMPLIFY.
UM, WE CAME UP WITH A MORE CONCISE VISION STATEMENT.
AND THAT'S WHAT YOU SEE IN THE PLAN.
AND THIS ONE IS VERY SIMILAR TO THAT.
WHAT IS READ, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S STILL READ AT THE BEGINNING OF MEETINGS, IS THAT LONGER VISION STATEMENT.
AND THAT IS FROM, ACTUALLY I THINK DATES BACK TO THE FIRST PLAN.
UH, SO WHAT HAPPENED AT THAT POINT? PEOPLE REALLY LIKED THAT LONGER VERSION.
AND SO THEY KEPT USING IT, UM, IN COUNCIL MEETINGS, ET CETERA.
SO WE PUT IT ON THE SCREEN NOW.
[01:35:01]
IT USED TO BE RED, CORRECT? RIGHT.BUT THE, THE INTENT ORIGINALLY WAS THAT THE SINGLE SENTENCE, UM, IN THE 2013 PLAN, THE IDEA WAS IT WAS GOING TO REPLACE THAT, BUT IT WAS GOING TO REPLACE THE LONGER ONE.
NOW, IS THERE ANYTHING, I DIDN'T GO BACK AND DO A SIDE BY SIDE COMPARISON.
IS THERE ANYTHING THAT'S INCONSISTENT, UH, BETWEEN THE LIKE ORIGINAL 2000 VISION? I THINK THAT ONE WAS, WAS PROBABLY A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAILED.
UM, LIKE THE THING THAT COMES TO MIND ANIMATED BY THE ARTS, IF YOU RECALL THE, THERE'S LIKE FIVE OR SIX LINES.
UM, IT'S JUST A, A DIFFERENT STYLE OF A VISION STATEMENT.
UM, WHEREAS IN THE PREVIOUS PLAY, THE 2013 AND IT'S ONE NOW, THEY'RE VERY SIMILAR.
SO, SO WHY DIDN'T THE VISION STATEMENT THAT WAS READ AT COUNCIL MEETINGS NOW ON THE SCREEN GET MODIFIED? WHAT CHANGED THAT? IT IT WAS MODIFIED IN THE COMMUNITY PLAN, BUT I, I'M NOT SURE THE BEST WAY TO DESCRIBE IT, BUT I FEEL LIKE COUNCIL BACK THEN REALLY LIKED, UH, THE READING OF THAT ORIGINAL ONE.
SO MAYBE ONE WAY TO LOOK AT IT IS THAT MAYBE THEY SAW IT NOT SO MUCH AS A VISION STATEMENT, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT ELSE IT WOULD BE CALLED A COMMITMENT.
YOU WANNA GO BACK TO THE, UH, I WANT TO HEAR WHAT, I MEAN, THIS IS A BIG DEAL.
I THINK THANK OUR VISION STATEMENT.
AND AM I RIGHT THAT THERE ARE OTHER VISION STATEMENTS IN OTHER DOCUMENTS YES.
THAT ARE DIFFERENT? SO WE HAVE A CLIMATE ACTION VISION STATEMENT AND WE HAVE A, PROBABLY DON'T, BUT I MEAN, WE COULD HAVE A TRANSPORTATION VISION STATEMENT AND, YOU KNOW, I JUST HOUSING, HOUSING DOCUMENT IS VISION STATEMENT.
SO I, I AM WORRIED ABOUT THERE BEING INCONSISTENCIES OR AGAIN, A PERCEIVED PERCEIVE MISALIGNMENT OF PRIORITIES OR SOMETHING.
SO HOW DO WE, HOW DO WE DO SOMETHING THAT CONSOLIDATES THESE? I WOULD LIKE SOME SORT OF CONSOLIDATION.
SO THE INTENT IS THAT THE COMMUNITY PLAN WOULD, IS THE UMBRELLA OVER ALL OF THOSE OTHER PLANS.
AND IF WE HAVE DONE A PLAN, UM, IT SHOULD ALIGN WITH THE COMMUNITY PLAN.
SO YOU'LL SEE, IF YOU LOOK AT THE TRANSPORTATION MASTER PLAN, I THINK THE FIRST COUPLE PAGES IN THE INTRODUCTION, THEY DO REFERENCE THE COMMUNITY PLAN.
UM, I'M NOT, I'M NOT AS SURE ABOUT THE COMMUNITY ACTION PLAN, BUT I, I'M, I DON'T KNOW THAT IT DIRECTLY REFERENCES THE COMMUNITY PLAN, BUT I THINK IT'S IN LINE WITH IT.
UM, AND SO ANOTHER EXAMPLE IS THAT WHEN WE GO TO UPDATE THINGS LIKE SAY THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, WHEN WE UPDATE 'EM, WE MAKE SURE THAT IT ALIGNS WITH THE COMMUNITY PLAN.
SO IF WE DO AN UPDATE TO SAY THE CLIMATE ACTION PLAN, IF THEY NEED TO MODIFY SOMETHING SO THAT IT'S IN LINE WITH THIS, OR PERHAPS THEY DON'T HAVE A SEPARATE VISIONS AND THEY USE THIS VISIONS STATEMENT.
THE IN LINE WITH THOUGH MEANS THERE'S NOT A CONTRADICTION, BUT YET THERE'S STILL THESE DIFFERENT PIECES OF VERBIAGE THAT ARE OUT THERE.
WHICH AGAIN, I'M LOOKING FOR SOME CONSISTENCY.
SO BACK TO MY, UM, EXAMPLE OF SOMEBODY WHO'S NEW TO THE COMMUNITY AND WANTS TO KNOW WHAT THE COMMUNITY PRIORITIES, THE COMMUNITY VISION ARE, THAT THEY'RE NOT SEEING SOMETHING THAT CONFUSES IT.
I'M, I'M THINKING OF THE AUDIENCE, AGAIN, THE AUDIENCE, THESE DOCUMENTS AND, AND THROUGHOUT THE PLAN WE'VE, I'VE NOTICED THAT WE'VE INCLUDED ARTS A LOT.
BUT IT'S NOT IN OUR VISION STATEMENT AT ALL.
AND AGAIN, I THINK THAT JUST GOES BACK TO STYLE OF VISION STATEMENTS.
DO YOU WANT IT TO BE SHORT? DO YOU WANT IT TO BE LONG? DO YOU WANT IT TO CALL OUT EVERYTHING OF IMPORTANCE? OR, THE WAY IT IS APPROACHED HERE IS THAT THOSE ITEMS ARE CALLED OUT IN THE CORE VALUES AND GUIDING PRINCIPLES.
YOU CAN GO EITHER, EITHER WAY.
UN UNTIL THE VICE MAYOR WAS SPEAKING, I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT WE HAVE NO REFERENCE TO THE ARTS IN THE VISION STATEMENT, WHICH WE MAKE A BIG DEAL OF
[01:40:01]
IN OUR COMMUNITY, EVEN THOUGH YOU DO UNDERNEATH ECONOMY, IT'S THE LAST BULLET POINT ABOUT A, AN ACTIVE ARTISTIC COMMUNITY.AND, AND, AND MAYBE THIS CAN BE SOLVED AS EASILY AS JUST ADDING THE WORD A PLATE ENCOURAGES HEALTHY, CREATIVE, AND ACTIVE LIFESTYLES.
I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE NEED TO SAY ANIMATED BY THE ARTS, BUT TO HAVE A REFERENCE SOMEWHERE INSIDE OF THE VISION STATEMENT THAT TALKS ABOUT, WE, WE LIKE TO PERCEIVE OURSELVES AS A PLACE, A COMMUNITY WHERE CREATIVE PEOPLE WILL COME AND CREATE AND NOT JUST HIKE.
WELL, WHEN THEY, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT VIBRANT COMMUNITY, WOULD THAT BECOME UNDER BEING ARTISTIC AND BEING VIBRANT AND, YOU KNOW, BUT I THINK IT SHOULD BE CALLED OUT BECAUSE IT'S THE ART IS A BIG PART OF THE CITY.
I THINK THAT, FOR ME, THE WORD VIBRANT DOESN'T NECESSARILY REFLECT A PLACE WHERE PEOPLE CAN COME AND FEEL CREATIVE AND BE RESPECTED FOR BEING CREATIVE.
VIBRANT MEANS, TO ME IT MEANS THAT A VIBRANT COMMUNITY IS ONE THAT IS ENGAGED IN THE COMMUNITY, AND THEY DO COMMUNITY THINGS.
AND THERE'S, THERE'S A PLACE FOR THEM TO, TO MEET AND RECREATE.
AND, AND ALL THE SOCIAL, THE SUSTAINABLE PIECES ARE THERE AND PEOPLE ARE USING THEM AS OPPOSED TO THEY'RE THERE AND NOBODY USES THEM.
I'M NOT LOCKED IN ON ANYTHING.
I JUST WANT IT TO BE A GOOD REPRESENTATION OF WHAT WE REALLY ARE TRYING TO ATTRACT AND, AND HAVE PEOPLE FEEL.
AND ALSO JUST TO TIE THE STATEMENT TO THE CORE VALUES, WHICH I HAVE UP ON THE SCREEN, UM, LIVABLE AND VIBRANT, YOU'LL SEE A BUNCH OF BULLET POINTS THAT HOPEFULLY IS PROVIDING YOU A DESCRIPTION OF WHAT IS MEANT BY LIVABLE AND VIBRANT.
THERE'S ALSO SO MANY OTHER THINGS.
IT DOESN'T TALK ABOUT DIVERSE.
IT DOESN'T TALK ABOUT, IT DOESN'T TALK.
IT DOES SAY, IT DOES SAY DIVERSE THE FIRST WORD.
SO DON'T IS A DIVERSE, LIVABLE, AND VIBRANT COMMUNITY.
CAN I POINT OUT THAT ON, UM, ON PAGE 17, IN THE BULLET POINTS UP THERE, THE THIRD ONE, THE SUPPORT REGIONAL ECONOMIC DIVERSITY, LOCAL BUSINESS RESPONSIBLE TOURISM EQUATES BACK TO PAGE 22, WHERE UNDER ECONOMY, THE LAST BULLET POINT SAYS, SEDONA HAS A THRIVING ARTS COMMUNITY.
SO THAT WOULD TO ME SAY THAT THE WORD ART SHOULD GO UP IN THIS CHAPTER.
CONTENTS BULLET POINT, SUPPORT, REGIONAL ECONOMIC DIVERSITY, LOCAL BUSINESSES, ARTS, THE, THE ARTS AND RESPONSIBLE TOURISM.
I THINK IT'S MISSING FROM THE GUIDING PRINCIPLE THAT CORRELATES TO IT.
WELL, IT'S STILL NOT IN THE VISION STATEMENT, BUT IS THAT ENOUGH? YEAH, I KNOW.
IT'S, I'M JUST PUTTING OUT 'CAUSE THAT IT ALL CORRELATES TOGETHER.
SO THAT WOULD THEN SPEAK TO IT GOING BACK DOWN THE VISION STATEMENT AS WELL.
COULD, COULD BOTH OF THOSE, LET'S PUT IT THIS WAY, DOES THE COUNCIL FEEL THAT BOTH OF THOSE CHANGES SHOULD BE MADE? JUST HAVE THE, THE WORD ARTS IN THERE, THAT'S NOT MAKING IT TOO LONG.
MELISSA, I THINK FOUR LETTERS.
DOES IT MAKE IT TOO LONG? YEAH, THAT'S NOT RIGHT.
SO, SO WE CAN ADD ARTS INTO THE VISION STATEMENT.
AND ALSO UP ABOVE ON THE BULLET POINT, THE THIRD, THE LAST BULLET POINT.
DO YOU WANT IT, UH, AFTER LOCAL BUSINESSES? YEAH, THE ARTS.
UM, IT SHOULD BE THERE BECAUSE IT IS IN YOUR CORRESPONDING LANGUAGE ON PAGE 22.
UH, COMMUNITY LIVABILITY AND CONNECTIONS.
THE FIRST BULLET POINT, WHICH LET ME POINT TO THAT.
THAT WOULD HELP TO HAVE IT IN BOTH PLACES.
ANYTHING ELSE ON THE VISION CHAPTER? NO.
MOVING ON TO THE COMMUNITY CHAPTER AFTER, UM, LET'S SEE, CHANGES FROM THE 2013 PLAN.
UM, WE DID REORGANIZE SOME OF THESE CATEGORIES AND WE MOVED THE PARKS AND RECREATION, UH, MERGED IT WITH THE COMMUNITY CHAPTER BECAUSE WE FELT THAT OUR PARKS AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT, PRETTY MUCH EVERYTHING THEY DO IS COMMUNITY ORIENTED.
AND THAT THOSE SHOULD GO TOGETHER.
UM, AND THEN AS FAR AS SOME OF THE COMMUNITY INPUT THAT WE HEARD, UM, THERE WAS A LOT OF TALK ABOUT NEEDING TO IMPROVE OUR SENSE OF COMMUNITY.
UH, A LOT OF COMMENTS SAYING WE NEED MORE EVENTS, ACTIVITIES, AND PLACES FOR RESIDENTS.
UM, AND SO ONE OF THE, THE THINGS THAT WE DID IN RESPONSE TO THAT IS WE HAVE THESE CALL OUT BOXES
[01:45:01]
IN THE PLAN.UM, AND WE'VE HAD QUESTIONS OF, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT IS THE PURPOSE OF THOSE? UM, SO YOU'LL SEE AN EXAMPLE ON PAGE 26.
UM, IT'S USUALLY A COLOR COLORED BOX.
SO WE'VE LISTED OUT EXISTING ORGANIZATIONS, AND THEN WE'LL HAVE A LIST OF, UM, EXISTING COMMUNITY PLACES, ACTIVITIES, AND EVENTS.
SO THE REASON THAT THOSE ARE IN HERE IS TO ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION.
UM, IT, IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY ANSWER THAT WE NEED MORE THAT WOULD BE FOUND IN THE POLICIES.
UM, BUT ESPECIALLY PEOPLE THAT ARE NEW TO TOWN, UM, IF THEY PICK THIS UP AND THEY MAY NOT KNOW THAT WE HAVE ALL OF THESE EVENTS, ACTIVITIES AND PROGRAMS. SO SOME OF THE INFORMATION THAT YOU FIND IN THE PLAN, LIKE THESE TEXT BOXES, THEY'RE JUST INTENDED TO BE INFORMATIONAL, EDUCATIONAL.
UM, BECAUSE AS I SAID, WHEN WE WOULD READ OUR PUBLIC COMMENTS, IT'S LIKE YOU'D KIND OF SCRATCH YOUR HEAD AND BE LIKE, DO THEY KNOW
AND SOMEBODY WAS LIKE, THAT EXISTS.
SO, SO THAT, THAT'S KIND OF THE REASONING WHY YOU SEE SOME OF THESE SIDE BOXES OF INFORMATION.
UM, BUT THOSE ARE THE MAJOR CHANGES.
AND IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS ON THE COMMUNITY CHAPTER, I DO VICE MAYOR AND THEN KATHY.
OH, THIS IS A REALLY A KNIT, BUT I'M GONNA DO IT ANYWAY.
WHICH ONE? SO IF YOU LOOK UNDER COMMUNITY SOCIAL, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 BULLETS DOWN, IT SAYS RED ROCKS ROTARY.
SO THERE'S MORE THAN ONE ROTARY CLUB.
AND I'LL, I'LL TELL YOU WHY LATER, BUT NO, THAT'S VERY, YEAH, THAT'S A REALLY GOOD CALL.
BUT TWO IN PARENTHESES AFTER THAT.
AND ISN'T THERE A THIRD IN THE, IN THE VILLAGE? YEAH.
SO, BUT THAT'S IN THE VILLAGE.
AND WE DID HAVE A LOT OF SUGGESTIONS LIKE THAT WITH PUBLIC COMMENTS.
YOU FORGOT TO LIST THIS AND THAT AND THAT.
AND SO WE DID PUT A LITTLE DISCLAIMER.
IT'S, IT'S DOESN'T INCLUDE EVERY SINGLE ORGANIZATION.
ISN'T NORTHERN ARIZONA, UH, INTERFAITH COUNCIL STILL ACTIVE? YES.
WE WORKED WITH THEM ON THIS PROJECT.
UM, OUR SPANISH SPEAKING MEETINGS, DEFINITELY.
YEAH, I HAD ONE, OH, I'M SORRY, KATHY.
YEAH, ON PAGE 28, UH, ON, ON THE CALL OUT BOX AGAIN.
AND BY THE TIME THAT THIS ACTUALLY GETS INTO PUBLIC CIR CIRCULATION, THAT PARK WILL BE OPEN AND FUNCTIONING.
SO I THINK THE WORD FUTURE, FILL THEM OUT,
AND HOPEFULLY WE, WE CAUGHT THAT ONE IN THE THIRD DRAFT.
YEAH, IT'S IN THE, YES, I GOT IT.
IT'S IN THE THIRD DRAFT THAT I'M LOOKING AT.
WE'LL, YES MA'AM, WE WILL CHECK IT.
NOT UNLESS IT'S UP IN THE POLICY BULLET ON THE RIGHT, ON THE RIGHT, ON THE RIGHT BOX HERE.
WE CHANGED IT IN ONE SPOT BUT NOT THE OTHER.
THAT'S WHY WE PAY STEVE THE BIG BUCKS.
ANOTHER QUESTION THAT I HAD, DID I STILL HAVE THE FLOOR? YOU STILL HAVE THE FLOOR.
PAGE 31, UM, SEVEN, EIGHT, AND NINE.
I KNOW THEY WEREN'T IN THE ORIGINAL DRAFT.
UM, AGAIN, THERE, STARTING FROM THE BOTTOM BACK, THERE WAS A MASTER PLAN UNDERWAY FOR POSSE GROUNDS PARK.
AND I DON'T KNOW, THERE'S NOT ONE THAT I'M AWARE OF AT THE MOMENT IN THE PRIORITY LIST, OR IT WAS KICKED DOWN.
IT'S NOT ON THE PRIORITY LIST.
IT'S ON THE OTHER LIST, I THINK.
SO, UM, I JUST, I MEAN, I JUST NOT SURE BASED ON OUR PRIORITIES, IF THAT STILL BELONGS HERE, THE PERFORMING ARTS CENTER AS A PLACE, AGAIN, NOT JUST UP TO US.
SO THAT SHOULD BE A DISCLAIMER BECAUSE IT'S NOT OUR, IT'S NOT OUR BUILDING, IT'S NOT OUR PROPERTY.
UM, AND RENOVATE THE HUB BUILDING.
I THOUGHT WE HAD DONE SOME RENOVATIONS THERE.
I MEAN, IS THIS, THAT SHOULD BE LOOKED AT FOR MORE RENOVATIONS? WELL, KEEP IN MIND THIS IS A 10 YEAR PLAN.
IT, IT MOST LIKELY WILL NEED SOME RENOVATION IN THE NEXT 10 YEARS.
BUT THOSE ARE ALL IN RESPONSE TO, UM, PUBLIC COMMENTS ABOUT MM-HMM.
BUT ESTABLISH THE SOOMO PERFORMING ARTS CENTER AS A PLACE.
[01:50:01]
WE DON'T HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO ESTABLISH IT IN AND OF OURSELVES.IT'S NOT, IT, UM, IT MENTIONS A PARTNERSHIP.
UM, AND I THINK WITH ALL OF THESE, WE'RE GONNA FIND A LOT OF THESE ACTIONS REQUIRE PARTNERSHIPS.
UM, SO WOULD ENCOURAGE INSTEAD OF ESTABLISH BE MORE ACCURATE, 'CAUSE WE CAN'T ESTABLISH, WE CAN ENCOURAGE, RIGHT.
OR WE CAN EXPLORE, INVESTIGATE WITH THE SEDONA PERFORMING ARTS CENTER TO BECOME A PLACE FOR COMMUNITY.
OR WE CAN FLIP THE WHOLE THING AROUND AND JUST SAY, TO BETTER USE, UTILIZE THIS VENUE FOR ARTS, CULTURE AND ENTERTAINMENT.
UM, WE SHOULD EXPLORE PARTNERSHIP WITH THE SCHOOL DISTRICT.
IT'S THE WORD ESTABLISHED THAT I'M REACTING TO THERE.
UM, AND AS I SAID, THE NUMBER NINE, THE POSSY GROUNDS PARK, AGAIN, IT'S A 10 YEAR PLAN, BUT THAT IS AT THE MOMENT ON THE BACK BURNER, BUT IT'S ON A LIST THAT'S ACTIVE.
SO I DON'T, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW THAT I FEEL THAT THIS PIECE, I COULD GO EITHER WAY, BUT I'M JUST QUESTIONING ITS PRESENCE HERE.
IT MAY NOT BE A PERFECT MATCH, BUT I WOULD HOPE THAT EVERYTHING ON THE COUNCIL PRIORITY LIST SHOULD BE REFLECTED IN THE PLAN.
NOW THAT, UH, EVERYBODY'S CAUGHT UP WITH ME FROM WHERE I WAS AN HOUR AGO.
UH, STRATEGY 3.1, UH, PER KAREN'S COMMENT, WE NEED CONSENSUS.
IF YOU ALL AGREE TO ADD BUSINESSES AS PART OF WHAT THAT'S RIGHT.
YOU WANT TO FACILITATE CONNECTIONS BETWEEN NO, UNTIL WE FOUND THAT IT WAS IN THERE.
WAIT, WHAT IS THE LANGUAGE YOU COMPOSE JUST TO INCLUDE BUSINESSES AS ONE OF THE ENTITIES AMONGST THE LIST THERE TO FACILITATE CONNECTIONS? MM-HMM.
SO TO KAREN'S POINT, WE NEED CONSENSUS FOR THAT.
JESSICA, ARE YOU FOR OKAY WITH THAT? I THINK WE SHARE BUSINESSES TO EVERYONE.
YOU'RE NOT, YOU HAVE UNANIMOUS CONSENSUS.
UM, POLICY 3.2 OR STRATEGY 3.2 OR WHATEVER IT IS.
UM, TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE, THERE'S NO THREAT TO THE SMALL GRANTS PROGRAM.
CONTINUE THE SMALL GRANTS PROGRAM.
UM, I UNDERSTAND YOU WANNA ADD CRITERIA TO, TO IT, BUT, UM, I DIDN'T KNOW IT WAS A, THERE WAS A THREAT TO IT.
I DON'T SEE A THREAT IMPLIED BY THE USE OF THIS LANGUAGE.
CONTINUE THE SMALL GRANTS PROGRAM.
I DON'T, I JUST A THREAT THAT JUST GONNA CONTINUE.
I I WOULD JUST, TO ME IT JUST FEELS LIKE, JUST SAY YOU WANNA ADD CRITERION TO THE SMALL GRANTS PROGRAM.
I, UM, AND THEN YOU HAVE AN ACTION ITEM.
I'M SORRY, I HAVE TO LIKE GO GENTLY DOWN HERE, WHICH IS ON 31.
AND THAT, UM, SAYS, UPDATE THE CRITERIA OF THE CITY SMALL GRANTS PROGRAM TO FUND PROGRAMS THAT BUILD COMMUNITY.
AND THAT SEEMS LIKE THAT'S REDUNDANT BECAUSE THAT IS THE POLICY.
SO IF I MAY, MAYOR, I, I WOULDN'T LEAVE IT ON 31, FRANKLY, AND ELIMINATE STRATEGY 3.2, BUT THAT'S JUST ME.
UM, SO WE HAVE CON WE'RE GONNA LEAVE IT THE WAY IT IS.
I THINK ABOUT THE ACTION, STEVE, IF WE WOULD JUST GET SOME CLARIFICATION.
WE'RE LEAVING IT THE WAY IT IS FOR BOTH THE POLICY STRATEGY.
SO YOU WANNA LEAVE THE ACT REDUNDANT ACTION ITEM.
SO WE WANNA LEAVE THE REDUNDANT ACTION ITEM AS WELL.
IT'S NOT REDUNDANT IN MY OPINION.
SO I THINK THE COUNCIL HAS AGREED TO KEEP IT THE WAY IT IS.
SO I WANTED TO FIRST GO OVER THE CHANGES FROM THE 2013 PLAN.
[01:55:01]
UM, LET'S SEE.SO ONE OF THOSE IS THE COMMUNITY FOCUS AREAS.
AND THERE WAS A QUESTION ABOUT, UH, THE CHANGES.
UM, BUT THE MAIN REASON IS WE COMBINED CFAS.
SO THE PREVIOUS PLAN HAD 12 DIFFERENT COMMUNITY FOCUS AREAS.
UM, AND FOR THIS ONE, WE ARE PROPOSING TO LOOK AT THE WEST SEDONA COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR AS ONE CFA, WHERE IT WAS SPLIT BETWEEN DRY CREEK AND THE RODEO COFFEE POT.
UM, AND THEN SIMILARLY WITH UPTOWN, WE WOULD LIKE TO COMBINE THE RANGER ROAD AREA UPTOWN AND THE NORTH OAK CREEK, UM, INTO ONE.
AND WHAT MIGHT HAPPEN IS WHAT YOU'LL SEE IN THE WESTERN GATE WHERE, WHERE THEY ARE BROKEN INTO CHARACTER DISTRICTS, UM, IF THERE ARE SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH DIFFERENCES.
UM, AND THEN WE DID REMOVE, UH, TWO OF THE CFAS.
WE HAD REALLY SMALL ONES AT MORGAN ROAD AND COPPER CLIFFS.
AND WE DON'T SEE THOSE AS BEING PRIORITIES FOR FUTURE DEVELOPMENT.
WHAT WAS THE ONES ON MORGAN ROAD YOU SAID? YEAH, THERE WAS A SMALL COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA PROPOSED.
WHAT WAS IT? JUST THE INTERSECTION ONE SHOULD ME 1 7 9 OR THE WHOLE, WHOLE WHOLE, RIGHT.
THERE'S SOME, UH, COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES THERE IS IN THAT AREA.
A COUPLE VACANT AND A COUPLE ACTIVE.
UM, AND THEN THE DELLS WAS ALSO CONSIDERED A CFA, UM, AT THE TIME.
AND THERE WAS SOME DEBATE AS TO WHETHER OR NOT IT SHOULD BE A CFA AND YOU COULD STILL DEBATE THAT ONE.
UM, BUT WE SAW, SAW IT AS, UM, JUST BEING A REALLY DIFFERENT CIRCUMSTANCE, MAINLY BECAUSE IT'S IN THE COUNTY JURISDICTION AND WOULDN'T REALLY QUITE FUNCTION THE SAME AS A CFA PROCESS.
AND THE EXAMPLE OF THAT IS WHEN THEY DID DO, UH, UM, A PLANNING EFFORT, I CAN'T REMEMBER WHAT YEAR IT WAS DONE.
UM, THEY DID A MASTER PLANNING EFFORT AND IT WAS OUTSIDE OF THE CFA PROCESS.
UM, ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT, PETE? I DO, SINCE YOU AND I TALKED ABOUT THIS, ABOUT THE WEST CFA PLAN, I, I DON'T KNOW THAT ONE BIG CFA PLAN IS THE WAY TO GO
SOMETIMES YOU DO THESE TO DIVIDE AND CONQUER.
I LOOK AT THE SHEER NUMBER OF PROPERTIES THE CFA WILL TOUCH VERSUS THE OTHER CFAS THAT WE HAVE.
AND IT'S A, IT'S A BIGGER SCALE THING, WHICH INVITES PEOPLE WAY ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE CFA TO FIGHT THINGS THAT THEY MIGHT THINK INFLUENCES THEIR LITTLE AREA.
AND SO, AND I'M SURE THAT RIGHT, IT'S A PLANNING PHILOSOPHY THING.
AND I'D, I'D LIKE TO LEARN A LITTLE BIT MORE AS TO HOW YOU DETERMINED THAT ONE BIG CFA WAS THE RIGHT WAY TO GO.
SO ON THE COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR, THAT'S ONE REASON WE PUT THOSE WORDS IN THERE.
UM, I GUESS FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE, IT, IT'S VERY SIMILAR FROM ONE END TO THE OTHER IN THAT YOU'VE GOT THE STATE HIGHWAY AND THEN YOU HAVE ALMOST ENTIRELY COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES FRONTING THE HIGHWAY, AND THEN A MIX OF USES BEHIND THAT.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT IT FROM THAT POINT OF VIEW, THEN IT'S NOT THAT DIFFERENT ALONG THAT CORRIDOR.
UM, I ACTUALLY THINK THE, THE RANGER AND UPTOWN ARE VERY DIFFERENT, BUT VERY CONNECTED.
UM, IT'S ALSO SOMETHING THAT WE, WE NOTE IN HERE ON, LET'S SEE, PAGE, PAGE 44, WHERE WE HAVE A MAP OF THE CFAS THAT WE WILL DETERMINE THE BOUNDARIES, UM, AT THE TIME OF THE CFA.
SO IT COULD BE THAT, AGAIN, NOT KNOWING IN THE NEXT 10 YEARS WHEN WE WOULD BE WORKING ON EACH OF THESE, THAT WHEN WE START TO WORK ON IT, IT MIGHT BE DECIDED THAT THEY SHOULD BE SPLIT.
SO YOU COULD EITHER PROPOSE THAT THEY'RE SPLIT NOW OR IN THE FUTURE.
I THINK THAT KNOWING THAT IN YOUR MIND AS WE WORK THROUGH PROCESSES LIKE WE'D NEED TO, THE OPTION OF A FUTURE SPLITTING IS ON THE TABLE IS, IS ENOUGH FOR ME TO THINK ABOUT.
'CAUSE WHEN I THINK ABOUT WHAT IT'S GONNA TAKE ABOUT TO REDEVELOP 89 A IN THE WEST END OF TOWN, REALLY YOU'RE GONNA FOCUS ON THE MAJOR INTERSECTIONS FIRST.
AND, AND THAT'S WHERE THEY GET THE MOST INTEREST FROM DEVELOPERS PERHAPS WHO WANNA THINK ABOUT IT.
AND YOU EVEN DO THINGS LIKE FOREIGN-BASED
[02:00:01]
ZONING AND YOU RIGHT, YOU GET REALLY CREATIVE ABOUT HOW TO CHANGE THIS THING THAT IS STUCK IN TIME RIGHT NOW.AND, AND YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO DO THAT IF YOU'RE REALLY THINKING ABOUT THE BIG ZONE ALL AT A TIME.
BUT IF, IF YOU'RE SAYING THAT OUR PROCESS COULD ACCOMMODATE, OKAY, WE'RE, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THIS, BUT LET'S FOCUS ON THIS SEGMENT NOW AND GET THAT PART DONE AND WORK THROUGH A PROCESS LIKE THAT, THEN I THINK THAT MAKES ME FEEL A LITTLE BIT MORE CONFIDENT THAT WE COULD ACTUALLY SEE CHANGE.
WE CAN ALSO ADD A SENTENCE, UM, FOR EXAMPLE, PAGE 44, UM, IN THE BEGINNING THERE UNDER AREAS, UM, CFA PLAN HAS A FOLLOWING TWO AREAS.
WE CAN ADD SOME SORT OF LANGUAGE THAT THEY COULD ALL BE TREATED AS ONE CFA OR SEPARATE.
SO, UM, BUT YOU SAID EARLIER THAT THERE WOULD BE SPECIAL CHARACTER AREAS.
AND WOULDN'T THOSE BE INDIVIDUAL CFA, LIKE THAT SPECIAL CHARACTER? AND YOU MIGHT HAVE MORE OF THEM IN THE UPTOWN BREWER AREA THAN YOU DO IN THE CORRIDOR, RIGHT? BUT THOSE WOULD BE HANDLED PIECE BY PIECE.
IF YOU RECALL THE WESTERN GATEWAY COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA, IT ACTUALLY WAS THREE CFAS COMBINED.
RIGHT? AND SO IT HAS CHARACTER DISTRICTS, I THINK IS WHAT THEY'RE CALLED.
UM, SO THAT WOULD BE ANOTHER APPROACH THAT YOU COULD TAKE KEEPING IT AS ONE WEST SEDONA CORRIDOR WITH TWO OR THREE OR FOUR DISTRICTS CHARACTER DISTRICTS AND CER AND CERTAINLY THE UPTOWN RANGER LENDS ITSELF MORE TO THAT.
THEN MAYOR, I ALSO HAVE A, A QUESTION ABOUT THE BOUNDARIES.
AND IT'S REALLY THE LAND USE DESIGNATION.
AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S A QUESTION NOW WHERE WE DO LATER, WHEN I LOOK AT THE BOUNDARIES OF THE WESTERN GATEWAY COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR, SOME OF THE MAP AREAS INCLUDE RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES.
AND I THINK THAT'S A, I THINK MY QUESTION IS ABOUT THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP DESIGNATION OF THAT.
BUT IF THIS IS THE COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR, IS THERE SOME CONSISTENCY THAT WE SHOULD BE THINKING ABOUT THAT THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP SHOULD REFLECT A COMMERCIAL OR MIXED USE OR WHATEVER, MORE OTHER INTENSITY RATHER THAN THE, THE GREEN RESIDENTIAL ZONES THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A COUPLE LITTLE SPOTS ON THE EAST SIDE NORTH OF 89 A AND THEN ON THE WEST SIDE, SOUTH OF 89 A, THERE'S THE BOUNDARIES INCORPORATE RESIDENTIAL ZONES, RIGHT? AND AGAIN, THERE'S THE STATEMENT ABOUT HOW THE EXACT BOUNDARIES WILL BE DETERMINED LATER.
AND TO REALLY ANSWER THAT QUESTION, I'D HAVE TO GO OUT AND LOOK AND SEE, BUT AT A GLANCE, THOSE PARCELS ARE INCLUDED BECAUSE IT MIGHT HAVE, UM, EITHER A MIX OF USES OR UNUSUAL USES.
AND I THINK I'M OKAY WITH THE BOUNDARIES.
SO MY QUESTION WAS REALLY WHEN WE THINK ABOUT THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP, WHICH WE'RE NOT QUITE THERE YET, SHOULD WE, SHOULD WE THINK ABOUT THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP OF THOSE PARCELS THAT ARE WITHIN THAT COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR? SO THE WAY WE WOULD APPROACH THAT IS WHEN WE DO THE, THE COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA FOR THIS CORRIDOR, UM, ONCE WE COMPLETE IT, AND YOU'LL SEE THAT ON THE MAP, IT WOULD THEN SHIFT SO THAT IT WOULD BE A BLANKET COLOR, WHICH WE'VE TURNED ALL OF OUR CFAS INTO PINK.
UM, AND THEN WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IS IT WOULD SAY, REFER TO THE CFA FOR GUIDANCE ON FUTURE DEVELOPMENT.
NOW THE, WE'RE JUMPING INTO THE MAP, WHICH WE CAN DO
I HAVE, I JUST HAVE A GENERAL QUESTION.
DOES THIS DOCUMENT, SINCE IT'S NOT GOING TO THE VOTERS, IS IT INTENDED THAT IT WOULD BE AT OVER THE 10 YEAR PERIOD OF ITS LIFE EXPECTANCY THAT IT WOULD BE ALTERED IN ANY WAY? YES.
UM, SO WHEN WE GET TO THE IMPLEMENTATION CHAPTER DISCUSSION, I'LL TALK ABOUT MORE OF THE SPECIFICS ABOUT HOW TO AMEND IT AND WHAT THE CRITERIA ARE.
BUT YOU KNOW, IT COULD BE AMENDED FOR THOSE REASONS IN THE
[02:05:01]
IMPLEMENTATION CHAPTER, UH, WHERE A PROPERTY OWNER COMES TO THE CITY.UM, OR IT COULD JUST BE THE, THE CITY THAT MIGHT WANT TO AMEND SOMETHING IN THE PLAN.
SO ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON THE COM UH, THIS CHAPTER BEFORE I GO TO THE MAP, MELISSA AND THEN BRIAN.
SO I GOT A LITTLE CONFUSED BY THE LANGUAGE, SO I JUST NEED TO UNDERSTAND IT BETTER.
UM, ON PAGE 39, IT TALKS ABOUT MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL AND, AND THE DEFINITION SAYS MULTIFAMILY DESIGNATIONS CAN SERVE AS A TRANSITION OR BUFFER BETWEEN NON-RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT AND SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT, AND MAY BE CONSIDERED IN AREAS WITH ACCESS TO TRANSIT, SHARED USEPA OR OTHER AMENITIES.
DOES THIS, TO ME, WHEN I READ IT SAID THAT THOSE FEATURES NEED TO EXIST BEFORE YOU CAN DO THE MULTI-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL.
UM, HOWEVER, LATER YOU TALK, I THINK MORE ACCURATELY ABOUT HOW YOU NEED TO DO HOLISTIC PLANNING BETWEEN TRANSIT AND, UM, BUILDING DEVELOPMENT AND SO FORTH AND SO ON.
SO IT JUST FELT TO ME THAT THIS, I WAS CONFUSED BY THIS WORDING BECAUSE I WAS HOPING IT DIDN'T MEAN THE WAY MY BRAIN IMMEDIATELY TRANSLATED IT.
BECAUSE IF I WANNA PUT IN SOME MULTIFAMILY AND THERE ISN'T, UM, A TRANSIT STOP ANYWHERE NEARBY, UM, AND THERE'S NO SHARED USE PATH ANYWHERE NEARBY, AND IT'S KIND OF, SORT OF MAYBE IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE AS FAR AS AMENITIES ARE CONCERNED, MEANING GROCERY STORES OR WHATEVER WITHIN WALKING DISTANCE, THEN I CAN'T DO A MULTI-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL THERE.
AND THAT SEEMS REALLY RESTRICTIVE.
I GUESS MAYBE THE, THE BEST WAY TO ANSWER THAT IS THAT KEEPING IN MIND THAT THIS IS MORE OF A, A GUIDING DOCUMENT AND IT DOES SAY THINGS LIKE MAY BE CONSIDERED, UM, CAN SERVE AS A TRANSITION, ET CETERA.
UM, SO THERE'S THAT ASPECT IN THAT IT'S NOT A DISTINCT CRITERIA THAT YOU HAVE TO MEET.
UM, AND THEN THE OTHER ASPECT OF IT IS WHEN WE DO A COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA, THAT'S WHEN IT WILL REALLY LOOK AT WHERE IT MIGHT BE APPROPRIATE TO DO MULTIFAMILY.
BUT KEEPING IN MIND THAT MAYBE WE DON'T GET TO A CFA FOR ANOTHER FIVE YEARS AND SOMEBODY COMES IN, UH, WITH A PROPOSAL TO DO MULTIFAMILY, THAT'S WHEN YOU WOULD LOOK TO THIS DESCRIPTION AND OTHER PARTS OF THE PLAN TO SEE IF IT'S APPROPRIATE.
BUT IF WE NEED TO REWORD THIS, IT'S, IT'S NOT INTENDED TO BE CRI UH, CRITERIA.
SO, SO JUST AS AN EXAMPLE, WE HAVE THE PROPERTY AT SHELBY WHERE WE'RE PLANNING ON PUTTING IN MULTIFAMILY MM-HMM.
I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THERE IS A TRANSIT STOP ANYWHERE NEARBY.
I DON'T BELIEVE THERE'S ANY SHARED USE PASS.
AND THERE CERTAINLY AREN'T ANY AMENITIES THAT ARE RIGHT IN THAT AREA.
AND I WOULD HATE FOR SOMEONE TO, TO BRING THAT UP TO P AND Z FOR INSTANCE.
AND THERE'S THE, IT MAY BE CONSIDERED AND SOMEONE SAYS, WELL, BUT IT DOESN'T HAVE THESE THINGS.
IT'S ALL GONNA BE ABOUT THAT INTERPRETATION OF THE WORDING, UM, BECAUSE WE'RE HUMANS.
SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE DON'T DO ANYTHING THAT MAY, UM, MAKE IT MORE DIFFICULT.
AN UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCE BECAUSE OF THE WORDING.
SO IF YOU GUYS ARE HAPPY WITH IT, THEN, THEN I'M FINE.
NO, I THINK THAT YOUR CONCERN MAY MEANS TO ME IS RESTRICTIVE.
IT MAY BE CONSIDERED, BUT IT MAY NOT IF IT DOESN'T HAVE THOSE THINGS.
SO I THINK THAT THAT JUST NEEDS TO BE CLARIFIED, MAY BE CONSIDERED AS APPROPRIATE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
STEVE AND BRIAN DID HAVE HIS HAND UP BEFORE STEVE.
UM, ALONG WITH THE SUGGESTION, IF WE WERE TO ADD WORDING SUCH AS, UH, CURRENT AND FUTURE ACCESS TO TRANSIT AND SHARED USE PATHS AND, UM, THAT, THAT MIGHT SOFTEN, COULD YOU REPEAT THAT PLEASE, STEVE? YES.
UM, SO IF, IF WE READ THAT, UH, THE LAST PART OF THAT SENTENCE, IT SAYS, AND MAYBE CONSIDERED IN AREAS WITH ACCESS TO TRANSIT, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, IF WE WERE TO ADD MAYBE CONSIDERED IN AREAS WITH CURRENT AND FUTURE ACCESS TO TRANSIT, UH, SHARED USE PATH AND OTHER AMENITIES.
AND THAT'S A, A GOOD EXAMPLE FOR, UM, THE SHELBY PROPERTY, WHICH IS IN THE SUNSET, CFA, WHICH DOES PROPOSE FUTURE ACCESS TO TRANSIT.
UM, IT ALSO PROPOSED SHARED USE PATH, WHICH HAS SINCE BEEN BUILT,
[02:10:01]
UM, ON SHELBY ROAD.I WAS GONNA SAY THAT, AND IT ALSO, THE CFA PLAN CALLS FOR OTHER AMENITIES.
UM, BUT I DO THINK THAT THE INTENT IS, IS REALLY WHAT STEVE JUST SAID, CURRENT AND FUTURE PROPOSED.
BRIAN, DID YOU HAVE A QUESTION ON THIS PARTICULAR POINT? OTHERWISE, JESSICA WILL GO NO.
OTHER THAN LEST WE FORGET, WE DO HAVE THE RED WALL DISTILLERY ON THE, HAS AN AMENITY.
AND THE HUMANE SOCIETY PEOPLE CAN WALK DOGS EVERY DAY OR AT LEAST GO SEE THEM.
I, MY QUESTION'S BEEN ANSWERED.
CAN I ASK ONE MORE QUESTION? ABSOLUTELY.
SO IT'S, UM, OVER ON THE DEFINITION OF MOBILE HOME PARKS.
AND, UM, THE REASON WHY I'M ASKING THIS QUESTION IS WE HEAR A LOT FROM THE COMMUNITY ABOUT TINY HOMES.
SO I JUST WANT TO, TO MAKE SURE THAT IT IS CLEAR THAT TINY HOMES, UH, FIT MORE INTO THE MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE NOT REALLY MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL AT ALL.
THEY'RE JUST, THERE'S NO DENSITY THERE.
BUT, UM, IF THEY'RE MANUFACTURED, DO THEY HAVE TO BE IN A MOBILE PARK, MOBILE HOME PARK? BECAUSE MOBILE HOMES ARE TYPICALLY CONSIDERED MANUFACTURED HOMES.
SO THIS BRINGS UP A MUCH BROADER DISCUSSION, UH, OF WHAT PEOPLE IDENTIFY AS TINY HOMES.
UM, SOME PEOPLE SEE TINY HOMES ON WHEELS, AND TO THEM, THAT'S THE SAME THING AS AN IRC COMPLIANT TINY HOME.
UM, WE HAVE IDENTIFIED TINY HOMES AS THOSE IRC COMPLIANT HOMES, UH, UH, THAT ARE 400 SQUARE FOOT OR LESS.
UM, IF THEY ARE BUILT IN A FACTORY THAT STILL DOESN'T PRECLUDE THEM FROM HAVING TO MEET THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE IRC.
IN FACT, THE ARIZONA DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING, UH, HAS A, AN IRC COMPLIANCE PROGRAM FOR FACTORY BUILT HOMES.
SO IT WOULD STILL BE AN ALLOWED TYPE OF A SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE.
THAT WOULD BE THE INTERNATIONAL RESIDENTIAL CODE.
UH, COUNSELOR FURMAN, UH, BROUGHT UP AT WEST 89 A CFA.
UM, I MEAN, RIGHT NOW IT JUST FEELS LIKE A FANTASY LOOKING AT THAT.
SO I ECHO WHAT COUNCILOR FURMAN, UH, EXPRESSED AS SOME CONCERNS ABOUT ITS SIZE AND WHATNOT.
AND I GUESS I HAVE A QUESTION OVERALL, JUST THIS IS AN EDUCATIONAL QUESTION FOR ME BECAUSE, UH, I'VE NOT SAT THROUGH THE, UM, UH, ADOPTION OF A CFA OR EVEN THE CHANGE OF A-C-F-A-I DON'T THINK, UH, AT THIS POINT.
SO, UH, THE QUESTION IS PROBABLY TO KAREN AND OR STEVE, LIKE IT FEELS LIKE RIGHT NOW, EVERYTHING FOR COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT THAT'S A BIG DEAL, IS VERY SEQUENTIAL.
LIKE, LIKE WE'RE GETTING THROUGH THE COMMUNITY PLAN RIGHT NOW, THEN WE'RE GONNA MASTER PLAN CULTURAL PARK.
THEN I THINK THE NEXT ONE AFTER THAT IS A PARKING TRANSIT CITYWIDE STUDY.
AND I KNOW WE JUST ASKED THE COMMUNITY, I DON'T KNOW WHAT SURVEY IT WAS OF, WHICH WOULD BE MORE IMPORTANT TO DO WEST 89 A AS A CFA OR UPTOWN AS A CFA.
DO YOU ENVISION THAT WE WILL JUST CONTINUE TO BE VERY SEQUENTIAL ON THESE THINGS BECAUSE WE'RE JUST GOING TO PLAN ON BEING CAPACITY CONSTRAINED FROM A STAFFING AND, AND RESOURCE PERSPECTIVE.
SO, UH, STEVE MIGHT KNOW MORE SPECIFIC ABOUT HIS STAFFING CAPACITY.
I THINK MOST OF THAT IS DRIVEN BY STAFF CAPACITY.
TO SOME EXTENT IT'S COMMUNITY CAPACITY TOO, RIGHT? WHEN WE GO OUT TO THE COMMUNITY TO DO SOMETHING LIKE MASTER PLAN, THE CULTURAL PARK, HOW MANY OTHER MAJOR PLANNING EXERCISES CAN YOU GET THEM ENGAGED IN? UM, AT THE SAME TIME.
BUT FOR EXAMPLE, WE'VE BEEN DOING BUDGET MEETINGS THIS LAST COUPLE OF WEEKS AND THE CONVERSATION CAME UP ABOUT THIS SORT OF PARKING MASTER PLANNING EFFORT AND THE UP THE PICKING BACK UP OF THE UPTOWN CFA, THOSE TWO THINGS, BECAUSE PARKING IN UPTOWN AND THE WORK THAT WE'RE ABOUT TO DO BASED ON YOUR DIRECTION ABOUT EMPLOYEE PARKING, RESIDENTIAL, ON STREET PERMIT PARKING, FIGURING OUT CAPACITY, IF WE END UP MOVING FORWARD WITH THE GARAGE AND CONSOLIDATION, THERE IS NO QUESTION THAT THOSE TWO THINGS
[02:15:01]
ARE ABSOLUTELY MARRIED TOGETHER.SO WE WOULD PROBABLY WANT TO TRY TO DO THOSE SIMULTANEOUSLY.
OTHER EFFORTS LIKE CULTURAL PARK ARE MORE STANDALONE.
THOSE THINGS ALL HAVE TO HAPPEN TOMORROW.
SO WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT, OKAY, THEN MAYBE THE WESTONA CFA OR CFA'S, IT'S DEPRIORITIZATION THEN AT THAT POINT, RIGHT? THOSE WILL PROBABLY NEED TO WAIT UNTIL THIS WORK IS DONE.
SO IT DEPENDS, BUT BASED ON EXISTING RESOURCES, IT IS LIKELY THAT THE, THE BIGGER EFFORTS YOU COULD MAYBE DO A COUPLE OF THOSE AT, AT A TIME, MAYBE HAVE A COUPLE THAT DO NEED TO HAPPEN SIMULTANEOUSLY, AND THEN OTHERS WILL JUST NEED TO HAVE IT BE IN A QUEUE.
AND SO THINKING ABOUT A COMMENT, UH, MR. GRIFFIN MADE OUT THERE, UH, YEAH, I'M TALKING ABOUT YOU JOHN.
UH, YOU KNOW, IF NOT NOW, WHEN KIND OF, UH, YOU KNOW, OBSERVATION SO LIKELY THEN THAT THE WEST 89 A CFA DOESN'T SEE LIGHT OF DAY FOR QUITE SOME TIME.
BUT CAN'T WE GET ANY CONVERSATIONS GOING WITH ANY OF THE MAJOR PROPERTY OWNERS TO SAY, HEY, IF THE CITY WERE AMENABLE TO SOME CHANGES IN WHATEVER ZONING OR LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE TO FOSTER MIXED USE ON ONE OF THE PROPERTIES THAT POPULARLY HAS BEEN BANTERED ABOUT OF OH YEAH, THAT ONE, THAT'S, THAT, THAT'S RIPE FOR REDEVELOPMENT AND THAT ONE'S RIPE FOR REDEVELOPMENT.
SO IS THERE ANY WAY TO ONE OFF, MAKE ANY PROGRESS? I MEAN, PARTICULARLY 'CAUSE IT'S ABOUT HOUSING, RIGHT? MIXED USE THAT INCORPORATES HOUSING.
IS THERE ANY WAY WE CAN MAKE PROGRESS WITHOUT IT COMING IN THE FORM OF, YOU KNOW, A CFA PROCESS THAT THEN GETS ADOPTED AND THEN WE START TALKING TO THOSE PROPERTY OWNERS? I KNOW WE WOULD BE AS PART OF THE CREATION, BUT JUST KNOWING THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT BEING YEARS OFF POTENTIALLY BEFORE WE TOUCH IT, I'LL STOP.
I KEEP ASKING THIS OVER AND OVER HERE.
IT LOOKS LIKE CYNTHIA WANTS TO TAKE A SHOT AT THAT.
I WOULD ALSO SAY THAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE DID A FEW YEARS AGO, BECAUSE TO FACILITATE THIS HOUSING ISSUE, WAS TO MODIFY THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE TO ALLOW MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT IN COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL AREAS THAT ACTUALLY HAS FACILITATED SOME MULTIFAMILY HOUSING.
YOU HAVE A SORT OF SIMILAR CONVERSATION ABOUT MIXED USE AND COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL AREA WHEN THEY ALREADY HAVE COMMERCIAL ZONING.
SO THOSE ARE THE KINDS OF THINGS EVEN YOU BROUGHT UP EARLIER.
UM, THE DISCUSSION ABOUT DUPLEXES OR TRIPLEX IN SINGLE FAMILY ZONING, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT WE DISCUSSED IN DECEMBER, WE BELIEVE CAN BE DONE EXPLORED.
I'M NOT SAYING FOR SURE THAT'S THE OUTCOME, BUT THOSE KINDS OF ADDITIONAL TOOLS IN THE TOOLBOX ALLOWANCES IN OUR LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE TO SUPPORT HOUSING, FOR EXAMPLE, CAN BE DONE AS A STANDALONE, RIGHT? EVERY SIX MONTHS OR SO WE'RE BRINGING YOU SOME TWEAKS TO THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE.
THERE WILL BE OTHER THINGS LIKE COLORS, UM, YOU KNOW, AND, AND HOW DOES THAT COMPORT WITH SUSTAINABILITY OBJECTIVES THAT ARE MUCH LARGER IN SCALE AND NEED TO BE DONE SO AT THE SAME TIME SO THEY CAN RECONCILE.
SO WE'RE NOT UNINTENTIONALLY CHANGING CODES THAT HAVE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES SOMEWHERE ELSE, BUT THERE ARE CERTAIN THINGS THAT CAN BE ACCELERATED.
UM, AND I THINK THE COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL ZONING AND PROVIDING ADDITIONAL ALLOWANCES THERE IS, IS ONE THAT WE'VE EVIDENCED HAS BEEN EFFECTIVE.
I THINK THAT'S A REALLY GOOD SEGUE TO TALKING ABOUT THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP.
WELL, HANG ON, I STILL HAVE ANOTHER TOPIC I WANNA DISCUSS.
SO, OKAY, SO I WANNA TALK ABOUT LODGING, AND I FEEL LIKE THE COMMUNITY PLAN NEEDS TO BE PRETTY EXPLICIT ABOUT THE FACT THAT WE DON'T NEED MORE LODGING IN TOWN AND UNDER THE LAND USE KEY ISSUES.
YOU KNOW, THERE'S IMPACT OF SHORT TERM RENTALS THERE, BUT TO ME, WE HAVE AN EXCESS OF LODGING IN THE TOWN BETWEEN TRADITIONAL PLUS WHAT SHORT TERM HAS FORCED UPON US, RIGHT? BECAUSE SHERRY'S REPORT LAST NIGHT SHOWED THAT, UM, TRADITIONAL LODGING IS STILL RUNNING A GOOD FIVE POINTS SHORT OCCUPANCY WISE FROM A MORE HISTORICAL HIGH LEVEL AND NOT JUST A-C-O-V-I-D
[02:20:01]
HIGH, BUT AN OVERALL HIGH.SO, UM, WHY DON'T WE BE MORE EXPLICIT ABOUT THE FACT THAT WE DON'T NEED MORE LODGING.
LIKE, I DON'T EVEN WANT TO ENCOURAGE ANYBODY TO THINK THAT THEY SHOULD COME FORWARD WITH A REZONING REQUEST IF THEY DON'T HAVE RIGHT BY TITLE.
UM, SO I'M CURIOUS WHAT MY COLLEAGUES, YOU KNOW, THINK ABOUT THAT AS SOMETHING TO ADD IN HERE AND BE EXPLICIT ABOUT.
KATHY, PETE, UH, I, I APPRECIATE YOU BRINGING THAT UP, COUNSELOR, AND I THINK IT'S A VERY COMPLEX TOPIC AND ONE THAT WE SHOULD BE VERY CAUTIOUS ABOUT.
JUST AN COMING UP WITH AN ANSWER RIGHT HERE ON THE DAAS FOR ONE ELEMENT OF THAT CONVERSATION.
I SAY IF WE WERE TO JUST COME OUT AND SAY NO MORE LODGING, THEN I THINK THE MARKET RESPONSE TO THAT WOULD JUST PUT ADDITIONAL PRESSURE ON SDRS.
AND WE SHOULD THINK ABOUT THESE THINGS FROM STAFF AND PROFESSIONALS WHO CAN REALLY HELP US THINK THROUGH THAT RATHER THAN JUST US DEBATING THAT TOPIC AND MAKING A CHANGE IN A DOCUMENT LIKE THIS TODAY, JESSICA, I AM RELUCTANT TO, YOU KNOW, IT'S A BUSINESS DECISION.
YOU MAY NOT THINK THERE'S THE, I I I THINK THERE MIGHT BE, I REALLY HATE CLOSING THE DOOR ON 10 YEARS.
OVER THE 10 YEARS SOMETHING MIGHT HAPPEN WHERE IN FACT IT'S WORTHWHILE DOING IT.
UM, IF WE'RE HAVING TROUBLE BUILDING HOUSING, UM, IS IT, IS IT NOT, IS IT NOT POSSIBLE THAT SOMEONE MIGHT COME IN WITH THE PROPOSAL? UM, I'M NOT, I DON'T, I DON'T ACTUALLY THINK THAT I CAN STAY CATEGORICALLY.
I MEAN, THAT'S THE FACT THAT, THAT THEIR OCCUPANCY IS LOWER NOW, BUT SOMEONE WANTS TO COME IN WITH A WHOLE DIFFERENT SET OF PLANS AND IDEAS.
AND SO I JUST REALLY HATE THE CITY TO SORT OF START SECOND GUESSING.
UM, AND I'M, I'M OPPOSED TO SORT OF PUTTING SUCH A BLANKET ABSOLUTE STATEMENT.
HOW, I MEAN, I, I JUST, I JUST, IT JUST GOES AGAINST EVERY, EVERY NERVE IN MY BODY TO SORT OF SIT HERE IN OPINE AS THOUGH WE REALLY KNOW.
UM, I AGREE THAT THERE'S A QUESTION AS TO IN FACT, UM, TRADITIONAL LODGING IS FAR SUPERIOR TO SHORT TERM RENT IN A LOT OF DIFFERENT WAYS.
UM, AND THERE ARE SOME, LIKE SOME SITES THAT ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, MIGHT BE REALLY GOOD.
SO I'M REALLY, I JUST REALLY HATE PUTTING A PROHIBITION LIKE THAT, UM, IN A, IN A DOCUMENT THAT'S, IT'S SORT OF AN, AS, YOU KNOW, IT PROBABLY IS ASPIRATIONAL.
WE OUGHT TO ALSO SAY WE DON'T WANT AS MANY TOURISTS.
I MEAN,
I JUST THINK THAT THAT'S NOT THE RIGHT WAY TO WRITE THIS KIND OF A DOCUMENT.
KATHY, IT'S AN INTERESTING POINT.
UM, I HAVE TO MARIN LET IT MARINATE A LITTLE BIT MORE, BUT IT, BUT I DO WANNA POINT OUT THAT WE, PREVIOUS COUNCIL, WAS IT THIS COUNCIL OR THE PREVIOUS ONE DID REMOVE LODGING FROM CFAS FROM TWO CFAS.
SO WE HAVE TAKEN THESE POSITIONS AND WE HAVE ESTABLISHED THIS LANGUAGE.
SO IT'S NOT LIKE YOU'RE COMING OUT WITH A SUGGESTION THAT WE HAVE NOT GIVEN SOME CONSIDERATION TO.
AND BASED ON THAT, DO WE WANT TO BE CONSISTENT IN THIS DOCUMENT WITH THE ACTIONS THAT WE'VE TAKEN? SO I'M, I'M, I'M THINKING I'M WEIGHING THESE THINGS.
I, I, ONE ADDITIONAL, I'VE ALWAYS THOUGHT THAT THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT HOTELS TRADITIONAL LODGING CAN BRING TO THE TABLE THAT THE UN ORGANIZED NETWORK OF ST.
STR CAUSES A DETRIMENT THAT DOES NOT BRING TO THE TABLE.
SO I, IF THERE WERE, I'D BE MORE COMFORTABLE IF THERE WAS A WAY TO DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN THOSE TWO AS WELL.
BUT WE HAVE GONE THERE BEFORE, SO YOU'RE PERFECTLY IN LINE, I THINK MAKING THIS SUGGESTION FOR CONSIDERATION.
THANK YOU BOTH FOR YOUR COMMENTS.
UM, YOU KNOW, ON PAGE 41, THERE ARE THE, UH, IN A
[02:25:01]
MANNER THAT FIVE ENUMERATED POINTS AND AMONG THEM IS NOT SOMETHING ALONG THE LINES OF PROVIDES COMMUNITY BENEFITS.AND IF IT, IF, IF THE, IF, IF A, I GUESS THE QUESTION IS, IS LIKE IF YOU ALREADY HAVE THIS, UH, ZONING, YOU DON'T NEED TO PROVIDE ANY COMMUNITY BENEFITS 'CAUSE YOU HAVE RIGHT BY TITLE, RIGHT? AS LONG AS YOU COMPLY WITH THE LDC, RIGHT? UM, SO I'M READING THIS AS REALLY AS SOMEBODY COMING IN AS AN APPLICANT ON A NEW PROJECT, IN WHICH CASE TO ME THERE NEEDS TO BE A NUMBER SIX IN HERE, WHICH IS HAS TO BRING COMMUNITY BENEFITS.
I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT KURT HAS TO SAY ABOUT THE, THE COMMUNITY BENEFITS POINT.
CAN WE REQUIRE EXCEPT IF IT'S NOT ZONED.
IF IT'S ZONED, THEY DON'T HAVE TO DO THAT.
RIGHT? SO, AND THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.
BUT YEAH, IF, IF THEY, IF THEY HAVE ZONING, I UNDERSTAND THEY HAVE RIGHT BY TITLE, AND AS LONG AS THEY COMPLY WITH LDC, THEN THEY GET TO GO BUILD THEIR PROPERTY.
BUT IT'S REALLY, IT'S FOR ANY APPLICANT THAT NEEDS A REZONING, WELL, THAT'S IN THERE AUTOMATICALLY ANYWAY.
BUT I, HAVING IT HERE WOULD MAKE A GOOD POINT.
SO IT'S, IT'S IN WRITING, IT'S MORALIZED.
SO LOOKS LIKE KURT'S READY TO WEIGH IN.
WHAT COUNSELOR, UM, FO SAID, AND IN ADDITION TO THE POINT HE JUST MADE, IT'S POLICY 4.8 THAT TALKS ABOUT LIMITING IT TO THOSE CURRENTLY, UM, LISTED AS LODGING ON THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP.
SO I THINK THAT KIND OF REFLECTS WHAT COUNCILOR FOLTZ IS GETTING TO.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S SUFFICIENT, BUT WHAT PAGE IS THAT ON? 41 47.
AND IT ALSO, IT, THE OTHER PLACE THAT WE TALK ABOUT LODGING OR WE DON'T TALK ABOUT IT, UM, ONE OF THE THINGS I WAS GONNA POINT OUT, I DON'T THINK WE GOT TO, UM, FROM THE 2013 PLAN, WE USED TO HAVE LODGING AREA LIMITS.
UM, AND SO THE, UM, POLICY 4.7 GETS AT THIS IDEA THAT, UM, LODGING AS A FUTURE LAND USE IS RESTRICTED TO DO THEY HAVE AS EXISTING, UM, ZONING.
UM, AND THEN FOR THOSE THAT MAYBE AREN'T LOOKING AT THE PLAN, I'LL READ 4.7 LIMIT LODGING USES TO LOCATIONS WITH THE COMMERCIAL LODGING DESIGNATION ON THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP OR OTHERWISE IDENTIFIED IT, AN ADOPTED PLAN, AND THAT THOSE WERE ACTUALLY REMOVED FROM THE EARLIER, UH, CFA PLANS.
AND THEN FOR THE ZONING, THERE'S VERY FEW LEFT THAT DON'T ALREADY HAVE LODGING INSTEAD OF COMMERCIAL SLASH LODGING, SHOULD THAT SAY MIXED USE SLASH LODGING, IT'S REFERRING TO THE DESIGNATION.
UM, SO LOWERCASE, SO THE RED, UM, PURPLE WE HAVE RED AS COMMERCIAL PURPLE DESIGNATION AS COMMERCIAL SLASH LODGING.
THAT'S A CARRYOVER FROM EARLIER PLANS.
SO YOUR POINT IS THAT THE PLAN ALREADY DOES THAT WITHOUT BEING SPECIFIC THAT SPECIFIC LANGUAGE.
IT DOES IT TO AN EXTENT IN, IN THAT POLICY ALREADY.
I'M NOT SURE IF THAT SATISFIES COUNSELOR.
I, I MEAN, I KNOW IT WAS THERE, IT'S JUST HOW MUCH MORE BOLD DO YOU WANT TO GET ABOUT IT? RIGHT.
I WOULD BE MORE BOLD ABOUT IT, BUT I DON'T THINK THE CONSENSUS IS FOR THAT.
HOWEVER, I STILL WOULD, I I STILL, UNLESS IT'S COVERED BY LDC LANGUAGE ABOUT COMMUNITY BENEFITS SOMEWHERE, THERE NEEDS TO BE SOMETHING THAT IS SAYING THERE IS AN EXPECTATION OF COMMUNITY BENEFITS FOR REZONING IF YOU'RE LOOKING FOR A LODGE AND REZONING.
AND THAT CAN BE ADDED THE, THE 0.6 THAT YOU MENTIONED EARLIER.
ON PAGE 41, IS THERE CONSENSUS FOR THAT? YES.
NO, CYNTHIA, WHERE ARE YOU NOW? UM, THE MAP DID THAT, LET'S SEE.
OKAY, JUST GOING BACK TO OUR POWERPOINT, UM, LAND USE CHAPTER, JUST WANTED TO POINT OUT THE CHANGES THAT P AND Z RECOMMENDED AT THEIR LAST MEETING.
UM, AND THERE WERE TWO, ONE OF WHICH WAS TO EXPAND THE DESIGNATION OF MIXED USE WHERE APPROPRIATE, UM, AS DETERMINED THROUGH THE CFA PLANNING PROCESS.
AND THE OTHER WOULD BE EVALUATE THE ANNEXATION OF LAND.
UM, WHAT WAS THAT? SAY IT AGAIN? EVALUATE THE ANNEXATION.
[02:30:02]
AND, AND THEN FOR THE MAP CHANGES, UH, LET'S SEE.THE MOST COMMON CHANGE ON OUR MAP IS THAT WE WERE, WE BASICALLY GOT RID OF THE PLANNED AREA DESIGNATION.
UM, THAT WAS PROBLEMATIC IN THAT IT WAS JUST TOO VAGUE FOR MOST PEOPLE.
UM, AND SO THE MAJORITY OF THE PROPERTIES THAT WERE PLANNED AREAS WERE CHANGED TO MIXED USE.
UM, IT GIVES YOU A LITTLE BIT MORE DIRECTION, UM, IF YOU WANTED TO CHANGE THE USE ON YOUR PROPERTY.
IT DOESN'T AFFECT EXISTING PROPERTIES, THEIR EXISTING ZONING OR THEIR EXISTING USES.
UM, BUT THE IDEA WOULD BE THAT MIXED USE IS ALONG COMMERCIAL CORRIDORS.
IT IS USED IN TRANSITIONAL AREAS.
AND YEAH, FOR THE MOST PART IT WOULD REPRESENT WHAT YOU'LL SEE THERE NOW OR MAYBE WHAT'S PREFERRED IN THE FUTURE.
UM, AND THEN WE ALSO MADE SOME CHANGES TO THE MAP ON, AND THIS GETS AT, UH, ONE OF THE QUESTIONS THAT BRIAN BROUGHT, BROUGHT UP IN THAT WE HAVE BEEN TALKING WITH PROPERTY OWNERS FOR QUITE A WHILE ON CERTAIN PROPERTIES.
UM, AND SO WE ARE MAKING SOME CHANGES, UM, TO PARCELS, FOR EXAMPLE, SWITCHING TO A MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL WHERE THE PROPERTY OWNER HAS HAD AN INTEREST IN DOING THAT, BUT THEY KIND OF HAD THEIR HANDS TIED A LITTLE BIT, UM, BY THE COMMUNITY PLAN DESIGNATION.
AND THIS WILL FACILITATE THAT.
UM, AND THOSE TYPE OF CHANGES, UM, AS I SAID, WE SPOKE WITH THE OWNERS AND IT, IT SHOULD NOT BE A SURPRISE TO THEM.
UM, AND THEN THE OTHER BIG CHANGE I ALREADY MENTIONED WAS THE CFA PLANNED AREAS ARE NOW SHOWN AS, UM, A CFA, WHICH IS THE COLOR PINK ON YOUR MAP.
SO CYNTHIA, ON THAT NOTE, MM-HMM,
CAN WE OR CAN WE, KURT, IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO NOW EXPAND THEIR PROPERTY AND GO TO MULTI-USE OF MULTI-FAMILY.
SO THIS IS JUST THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP.
IT'S NOT THE THE REZONE TO DO SO YET.
AND SO THAT CAN BE A DISCUSSION AS PART OF A DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT DEPENDING ON THE BENEFITS THEY'RE PROVIDING, WHAT THE CITY'S GIVING, UM, THEY, THEY, THAT CAN BE DISCUSSION AS INDIVIDUAL PROJECTS COME FORWARD UNDER COMMUNITY BENEFITS.
UH, JUST ANOTHER QUICK COMMENT, UH, IN THE FINAL PLAN, UM, WE WILL IMPROVE THE IMAGE SO THAT YOU DON'T NEED A MAGNIFYING GLASS.
AND WE ARE ALSO LOOKING AT DOING IT, UH, INTERACTIVE MAP SO THAT YOU, IT WILL PROBABLY BE RELATED TO GIS WHERE YOU CAN CLICK ON A PARCEL AND IT'LL POP UP.
UM, SO THAT WILL BE IMPROVED AND PEOPLE WON'T HAVE TO LOOK AT THIS MAP WITH A MAGNIFIER.
AND I THINK THAT, THAT, THAT'S IT FOR ME FOR THE MAP.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON THE MAP? YEP.
UH, CYNTHIA, ONE REACTION THAT I'VE GOT FROM SOME PEOPLE, AND I THINK IT ACTUALLY WAS PART OF OUR PLANNING AND ZONING HEARING THAT WHEN WE LOOK AT THE MIXED USE DESIGNATIONS ON THE MAP, I THINK PEOPLE ARE WELCOMING OF THAT.
BUT THEN I THINK THERE'S ANOTHER REACTION THAT SAYS IT LOOKS PRETTY SMALL, THAT WE'RE, WE'RE NOT ACTUALLY BEING BOLD AROUND MIXED USE AND IS IN THE COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR, WE ALLOW HOUSING, CORRECT? MM-HMM,
SO WOULD YOU SAY THAT THE COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR IS ALSO MIXED USE? MIXED USE PLUS MAYBE.
AND IS THERE A WAY TO COMMUNICATE THAT THROUGH THIS MAP? THAT SEDONA IS ACTUALLY BEING QUITE BOLD HERE AND THINKING ABOUT MIXED USE IN THE FUTURE CHANGES AND SOME DENSIFICATION, ESPECIALLY REGARDS TO HOUSING, BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE MAP, IT DOESN'T ACTUALLY COMMUNICATE THAT TO ME AND VERY, VERY STRONGLY.
AND SO I WONDER IF THERE ISN'T SOME WAY TO COMMUNICATE THAT MORE.
BUT SO WE, WE TALKED ABOUT THAT INTERNALLY, UM, PLANNING STAFF.
AND ON THE ONE HAND THERE WAS A COMMENT, WELL, IT'S ALREADY ALLOWED, YOU KNOW, WHY WOULD WE, WE PUT IT IN HERE.
AND THEN WE ALSO DISCUSSED THE FACT THAT A LOT OF PROPERTY OWNERS MAY NOT REALIZE THAT THEY CAN DO THAT.
SO IF THEY HAVE A PROPERTY THAT IS ZONED COMMERCIAL AND MAYBE THEY'VE OWNED THE PROPERTY FOR 30 YEARS, UM, THEY MAY NOT BE AWARE OF THAT POSSIBILITY.
[02:35:01]
IN THE HOUSING CHAPTER, SORRY, I'M TRYING TO FIND IT.UM,
UH, MULTIFAMILY HOUSING CAN BE BUILT IN COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICTS.
AND THAT WAS THE RESPONSE TO THAT QUESTION, UM, OF WHETHER OR NOT IT NEEDS TO BE IN HERE.
UM, SO IF IF NOTHING ELSE, IT'S IN HERE AS AN INFORMATIONAL ITEM IN CASE PEOPLE HAPPEN TO READ THIS THAT OWN COMMERCIAL PROPERTY
WELL, BUT PEOPLE WILL ASK, THEY'RE ALWAYS ASKING QUESTIONS ANYWAY.
SO I'M SURE THEY'LL GET THE SAME ANSWER AT THE RIGHT INFORMATION AT THE DESK AT COM DEV.
SO, AND THEN AS FAR AS EXPANDING THAT, THAT GOES BACK TO THAT PLANNING AND ZONING CHANGE.
UM, RATHER THAN EXPANDING IT NOW, WHICH REALLY GETS DOWN TO A, A PARCEL SPECIFIC ANALYSIS THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WOULD HAPPEN DURING A CFA PLANNING PROCESS.
SO IS THERE, IS THAT, SO YOU POINTED TO PAGE 55 OR WHATEVER THAT PAGE WAS, 51 55.
I'M WONDERING IN THE MIXED USE CONVERSATION ON PAGE 40, WHETHER IT'S ALSO WORTH IT ENHANCING THE FACT THAT MIXED USE DOESN'T ONLY HAVE TO BE IN THE MIXED USE DESIGNATION, BUT IS ALSO IN COMMERCIAL.
SO IT IS STATED, UM, IN THERE, BUT IT MIGHT BE MORE EFFECTIVE IF, IF IT'S ANOTHER CALL OUT BOX NEXT TO THAT COMMERCIAL DESCRIPTION BECAUSE IT'S THE LAST ITEM ON THE LIST.
ON THIS MAP, WERE THERE PROPERTIES THAT WERE MOVED IN THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP FROM COMMERCIAL TO MIXED USE FROM COMMERCIAL TO MIXED USE? SO THIS IS OUR LIST OF ALL THE PARCELS AND WE HAVE SOME PARCELS THAT WERE PLANNED AREA THAT WERE CHANGED TO COMMERCIAL.
UM, WE HAVE, LET'S SEE, A LOT OF THESE WERE JUST REFLECTING WHAT'S ALREADY THERE.
SO WE HAD SOME LODGING, EXISTING LODGING THAT WAS SHOWN AS PA THAT CHANGED COMMERCIAL LODGING.
UM, SO THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF EACH, UM, CATEGORY, BUT THE MAJORITY OF THE PLANNED AREAS WENT TO MIXED USE.
AND BY MAJORITY YOU GOT THREE PAGES OF THE SPREADSHEET HERE.
WE DIDN'T REDESIGNATE ANY FUTURE LAND USE MAP COMMERCIAL TO FUTURE LAND USE MAP MIXED USE.
SO DOWN ESSENTIALLY A DOWN ZONING THERE.
YEAH, THERE WAS A QUESTION AT P AND Z ABOUT THE PROPERTY OWNER COMMENTS AND WHETHER THEY WERE AVAILABLE.
AND IS THAT, I DON'T THINK THAT I'VE SEEN PROPERTY OWNER COMMENTS FEEDBACK.
WE HAD THE ONE WRITTEN, UM, COMMENT WHICH W WILL BE IN YOUR PACKET FOR THE, THE NEXT HEARING OR THE HEARING.
UM, AND THEN ON THE OTHERS WE SPOKE TO THEM ON THE PHONE.
SO THERE, THERE WAS REALLY ONLY ONE WRITTEN PROPERTY OWNER COMMENT.
AND THEN ANOTHER QUESTION I HAD, YOU'D MENTIONED THAT YOU HAD SPOKEN TO PROPERTY OWNERS WHO EXPRESS DESIRE TO PERHAPS DO A, A MULTI-FAMILY PROJECT AND, AND YOU MIGHT HAVE MADE A CHANGE.
WHAT'S THE STATUS, UM, IN THE FUTURE LANDUS MAP? I CAN'T SEE FROM THIS SCALE OF OUR NEW FOREST ROAD EXTENSION FOREST EXTENSION.
I'M GOING TO SWITCH TO THE POWERPOINT WHERE I DO HAVE A SLIGHTLY LARGER MAP.
UM, THE FOREST ROAD EXTENSION WOULD THAT AREA, WHICH THE SCALE IS REALLY NOT HELPFUL.
UM, THIS IS ONE WHERE WE DID TALK ABOUT THAT AND IT'S RIGHT ON THE EDGE OF THE CFA BOUNDARY.
AND SO OUR THOUGHT WAS WHEN WE WORK ON THE CFA, THAT IS ONE WHERE WE CAN DISCUSS, AND WE DID THIS IN THE, THE DRAFT UPTOWN PLAN, UM, WHETHER OR NOT IT SHOULD BE IN OR OUT OF THE CFA AND WHERE THAT CFA LINE SHOULD BE DRAWN.
IF THAT ANSWERS YOUR QUESTION, IT KIND OF DOES.
AND, AND I WOULD THINK THAT COUNCIL HIGH PRIORITY AMONGST ALL OF US HAS BEEN TO
[02:40:01]
FACILITATE THE DEVELOPMENT OF MULTIFAMILY HOUSING THROUGH THIS TOWN.AND IS THIS FUTURE LAND USE MAP AN AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO SHOW THAT AND TO MAKE SOME FUTURE LAND USE MAP CHANGES SAYING THAT THIS IS WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE THESE ARE, AND THE, AND THE FOREST ROAD EXTENSION IS ONE ELEMENT THAT I THINK IS PERFECT.
WE ALL KNOW THAT'S GONNA BE A BUSY TRANSFER TRANSPORTATION CORRIDOR AND THERE'S A MIXED OR A SHARED USE PATH THAT GOES UP IT, AND IT, IT JUST BEGS TO BE MULTIFAMILY.
AND I WOULD THINK THAT WE JUST MIGHT GO AHEAD AND MAKE THAT MOVE.
NOW SAYING THAT THIS IS COUNCIL'S DESIRE, AND I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THERE'S OTHER AREAS ON THE MAP WHERE THIS COUNCIL MIGHT GET BOLDER THEN, UH, IF THERE HASN'T BEEN CHANGES.
BUT, YOU KNOW, I, I WOULD THINK THAT WE WOULD WANT TO EXAMINE THOSE CLOSELY AND TRY TO MOVE THAT DIRECTION.
I GUESS THE QUESTION THAT I WOULD HAVE IS WE CAN CHANGE THE, THE LINE ON THE MAP.
UM, THAT IS NOT TOO DIFFICULT TO DO.
UM, AND FOR THOSE THAT AREN'T FAMILIAR, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN TELL FROM MY CURSOR, IT'S THE YELLOW SQUARE, UM, RIGHT.
NORTHWEST OF THE Y AND SO IF WE WERE TO DO THAT, WE WOULD MOVE THAT, UM, CFA BOUNDARY AROUND THAT SQUARE AND THEN WE CAN DESIGNATE THAT AS MIXED USE OR MULTIFAMILY, EITHER ONE MA, MAYOR AND COUNCIL, THAT PARCEL HAS A IS COMING TO P AND Z IN LESS THAN THREE WEEKS TO BE, UH, AS A, UH, AS A SUBDIVISION FOR FOUR SINGLE FAMILY LOTS.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT CHANGES YOUR OH, THAT'S WHY WE DIDN'T CHANGE IT.
DIVISION OF FOUR SINGLE FAMILY LOTS DOESN'T, I THINK WE, WE CUT THE PARCEL IN HALF WITH THE FOREST ROAD EXTENSION LEAVING, UM, THIS IS AN ACRE OR THIS IS THE FUTURE LANDUS MAP.
WE'RE NOT CHANGING THE IMP ENVIRONMENTS.
BUT THAT'S ESSENTIALLY THAT EXPRESSION FROM THE COUNCIL THAT WE THINK THAT THERE ARE AREAS OF THIS TOWN THAT SHOULD MOVE IN THAT DIRECTION.
THERE COULD BE MANY, MANY AREAS THAT ONE IS, WE COULD DO IT, BUT IT'S GOING, IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S COMING THROUGH AS A SUBDIVISION ALREADY WITH JUST FOUR LOTS.
THEY'RE GONNA BE DIFFERENT HEIGHTS.
IT'D BE VERY HARD TO CHANGE THE FOUR AFTER THE FACT BY DOING CHANGES.
ONE ONE YOU MIGHT CONSIDER IS ALONG SOLDIERS PASS.
I WAS GONNA ASK, JUST ASK ABOUT THAT ALONG THE ONE THAT THE CITY OWNED PARCEL.
THERE'S ONE THAT IS JUST EMPTY AND HAS NO PLANS RIGHT NOW.
I WAS GONNA WAIT UNTIL YOU FINISH THIS, PETE.
NOW I WAS GONNA SUGGEST WE LOOK AT THAT TOO.
THAT'S NINE ACRES, RIGHT? SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
RIGHT? BUT YOU KNOW, I I I I'M TRYING TO EXPRESS HERE WHETHER I CAN SAY WHAT I WANNA SAY AND I THINK I CAN.
SO I SPOKE TO THE PROPERTY OWNER THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT, AND I KNOW THAT HE'S GOT AN APPLICATION, BUT HE ALSO EXPRESSES A DESIRE TO BUILD MULTIFAMILY IN THAT.
AND RIGHT NOW IT'S A MAJOR, RIGHT NOW IT'S A MAJOR PLAN CHANGE.
AND IF WE WERE TO START THE PROCESS BY SAYING THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP IS NOW MIXED USE, IT MAKES IT EASIER TO DO WHAT HE WANTS TO DO.
AND SO IT'S, AND STAFF TOLD THEM TWO YEARS AGO THAT THEY SUPPORTED MULTIFAMILY THERE AND THEY DIDN'T PURSUE THAT.
BUT YOU CAN CHANGE IT ON THE MAP.
IF THE SINGLE, IF IT IS ZONED SINGLE FAMILY NOW AND WE CHANGE THE MAP, THERE'S NO IMMEDIATE IMPLICATIONS THERE, BUT IT, IT WOULD FACILITATE FUTURE MULTIFAMILY IF WE MAKE THE CHANGE QUESTION.
SO CHANGING THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP DOESN'T ACTUALLY CREATE THE CHANGE IN ZONING ITSELF THAT STILL HAS TO BE CORRECT, APPLIED FOR AND GO THROUGH P AND Z AND POSSIBLY TO COUNCIL.
I, I MEAN I SUPPORT WHERE COUNCILOR FURMAN'S GOING ON THIS, THAT, YOU KNOW, LET'S BE BOLD AND LAY OUT AS MUCH AS WE CAN FOR THE FUTURE THAT ENCOURAGES AND INCENSE PEOPLE TO TAKE THE ACTIONS THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE.
I THINK THE VICE MAYOR AND KATHY, AND I'M OKAY.
VICE MAYOR, DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING YOU WANTED TO ADD? I, I WOULD JUST LIKE TO SEE SOME, WHAT I THOUGHT WAS A, IN THE PRIOR CFA FOR UPTOWN IS THAT IT JUST DEALT WITH THE COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR OR WITHIN UPTOWN AND NOT IN THE RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS, WHICH I THINK THAT SHOULD BE EXPANDED TO INCLUDE SOME OF THAT RESIDENTIAL AREA.
[02:45:01]
WE GOT TO THE DRAFT STAGE, IT DID LOOK AT, UM, RESIDENTIAL, UM, AND THAT'S WHERE I HAVE MY CURSOR HERE IN THE OLD, UH, SEDONA SUBDIVISION, WHICH ARE THE STREETS, UH, VANDER AND WILSON SMITH, THAT AREA.UM, AND THAT IS ONE ON THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP WHERE WE, IT WAS PORTIONS OF IT WERE PLANNED AREA NOW ARE SHOWING US A MIXED USE.
UM, BUT IN THE UPTOWN PLAN WE WERE PROPOSING MIXED USE FOR THAT AREA.
AGAIN, IF YOU LOOK AT IT, ESPECIALLY THE ROADS THAT ARE CLOSER IN TO MAIN STREET, IT'S ALREADY A MIX OF USES.
UM, AND SO THERE'S THAT PLUS THE, UM, THE POINT THAT WE, WE CHANGE THE BOUNDARY ONCE WE GET INTO IT AND START NOW ANALYZING THINGS, MEETING WITH OWNERS, ET CETERA.
BUT, BUT THE PARCEL, UM, WHERE THE FOREST ROAD EXTENSION IS GOING THROUGH IS, IS DEFINITELY AN UNUSUAL SITUATION BETWEEN THE TOPOGRAPHY, THE ROAD, GOING THROUGH IT, ET CETERA.
ANY, ARE YOU GOOD, PETE? SO WHERE ARE WE ON THIS? IT, I'VE HEARD LOTS OF COMMENTARY AND I'VE ALSO HEARD, SHOULD WE DO THIS, WHICH WOULD REQUIRE US TO HAVE FOUR PEOPLE WHO AGREE THAT WE SHOULD CHANGE THAT ONE AREA AND THEN WE CAN TALK ABOUT OTHER AREAS.
BUT ON THIS ONE THAT COUNSELOR VERMAN HAS BROUGHT UP, WHERE ARE WE ON THIS? ARE WE, ARE WE GOING TO SAY YES PLEASE AND, AND, AND MAKE A DECISION? OR WHERE ARE WE
SO TO THAT, I WOULD NOT BE WILLING TO SUPPORT THAT AT THE MOMENT BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THIS IS THE RIGHT PROCESS FOR THAT.
I MEAN, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO ENCOURAGE SEND THE MESSAGE THAT THIS IS IMPLIED ZONING AND THERE HASN'T BEEN ANY REVIEW OF ANYTHING THAT I JUST DON'T, I JUST DON'T THINK, TO ME PROCESS WISE, THIS IS NOT THE RIGHT WAY.
IT HASN'T BEEN LOOKED AT BY P AND Z EITHER.
RIGHT? SO, I MEAN, IT'S, IT'S AN INTERESTING CONCEPT AND I THINK IT'S COULD BEAR A FRUIT, BUT I DON'T THINK THIS IS A PROPER FORUM FOR IT.
I, KURT, IS THAT SOMETHING WE COULD LOOK AT NOW? OR IT SHOULD BE VETTED THROUGH P AND Z PRIOR TO IT CAN BE LOOKED AT NOW.
UM, I MEAN IT'S A DIFFERENCE OF OPINIONS.
THIS IS THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP AND THIS IS COUNCIL GETS TO DECIDE WHAT THEY FEEL LIKE SHOULD GO IN THOSE, THOSE, THOSE, UH, PARCELS.
ARE WE, IT DOESN'T INSTILL ANY RIGHTS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
I DON'T, FOR COMMUNITY, WE CAN'T GET EVERY RE ZONE WOULD STILL NEED TO GO THROUGH P AND Z AND THEN TO CITY COUNCIL.
JESSICA, I, I SUPPORT MAKING THOSE AREAS AS BROAD AS POSSIBLE.
JUST GIVE, SENDING A MESSAGE THAT THIS IS, THIS IS WHAT WE WANT DONE.
AS LONG AS WE COULD DO IT LEGALLY AND WE WON'T HAVE ANY BACKLASH, I WOULD SUPPORT THAT.
SO ARE WE GOING TO DO THIS ONE PROPERTY OR NOT? WELL,
I, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE NEED TO RUSH THROUGH.
THIS IS ONE OF, I THINK ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS WE DO IN THE COMMUNITY PLAN.
SO WHY DON'T WE, SO TO ADDRESS THAT ISSUE, WE, WE DID DO THAT
UM, AND THAT, HONESTLY, THAT WAS ABOUT ALL WE CAME UP WITH.
WERE THESE THE TWO YOU'VE ALREADY IDENTIFIED AND THE ONE OTHER OKAY.
UM, I'M GONNA ZOOM IN A LITTLE BIT HERE.
UM, IT IS OFF OF PAYNE PLACE AND ON THE MAP YOU'LL SEE THAT DASHED OUTLINE WITH THE YELLOW ON THE INSIDE.
AND IF YOU'VE EVER BEEN UP THERE TOPOGRAPHICALLY, YOU GO UP A HILL, IT'S VERY HIDDEN.
IT HAS SOME VERY, VERY OLD MOBILE HOMES.
UM, THIS IS THE PARCEL THAT I WAS REFERRING TO EARLIER IN MY COMMENTS ABOUT THE BOUNDARIES OF THIS COMMERCIAL.
THERE'S A, THERE'S GREEN RESIDENTIAL INSIDE OF THAT BOUNDARY THAT WE'RE DESIGNATED THAT I THINK WE SHOULD THINK ABOUT SINCE IT IS OUR ZONE HERE WHERE WE'RE LOOKING AT OF INCREASING THE DENSITY.
SO DO WE WANT TO DO, DO WE WANT TO SAY ALL THREE SHOULD BE DESIGNATED? AND I THINK THAT'S
[02:50:01]
THE ISSUE ON THE TABLE.WELL, I THINK, SORRY, THE QUESTION IS, PETE SAID, WELL, WE SHOULD, STAFF SHOULD BE DOING THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE DUE DILIGENCE.
WELL, IF YOU'VE ALREADY DONE THAT UHHUH, AND THAT'S WHAT I WANT TO UNDERSTAND.
I JUST WANNA BE CLEAR THAT THAT HAS BEEN DONE.
I'M LOOKING AT KURT AND KAREN.
YEAH, I, I JUST WANNA OFFER SOMETHING.
I MEAN, IF, IF YOU'RE TRYING TO BE BOLD, BE BOLD.
UM, I, I, YOU KNOW, WE'VE SPENT TWO YEARS MM-HMM.
I I DON'T HAVE ANY CONCERNS ABOUT THE FORCE ROAD PROPERTY AREA.
IT'S ADJACENT TO EXISTING COMMERCIAL.
SAME THING WITH THE PAIN PLACE PROPERTY FOR THE REASONS THAT CYNTHIA POINTED OUT.
THE SOLDIERS PAST NINE ACRES IS CURRENTLY ZONED LARGE OR DESIGNATED AND ZONED LARGE LOT SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL IMMEDIATELY ADJACENT TO NOTHING BUT QUARTER ACRE, 0.2 ACRE, SINGLE FAMILY SUBDIVISION.
THERE IS NO COMMERCIAL ANYWHERE NEAR THERE.
AND SO IS THAT THE RIGHT PLACE FOR MIXED USE OR MULTIFAMILY? I'M NOT SURE THAT ANALYSIS HAS BEEN DONE SUFFICIENT TO BE ABLE TO, TO MAKE THAT DECISION TODAY.
IT IS ULTIMATELY UP TO YOU, BUT I JUST FELT LIKE I NEEDED TO SHARE THAT.
AND, AND I DON'T LIKE THE IDEA OF SEPARATING OUT ONE PROPERTY FROM THE OTHER.
THEY WERE LOOKING AT THESE THAT HAVE COMMON FEATURES, YOU KNOW, TO MAKE A, A CHANGE TO ENCOURAGE POLICY IN A CERTAIN KIND OF DEVELOPMENT OR NOT.
I WOULD, I DON'T, I DON'T SUPPORT CHANGING ANY OF THOSE BECAUSE I THINK THEY SHOULD ALL BE LOOKED AT.
THEY SHOULD GO THROUGH A PROCESS.
THEY SHOULD GO TO P AND ZI, I DON'T WANNA SEPARATE ONE OUT FROM THE OTHERS AND DO PIECEMEAL.
IT'S ENCOURAGING PIECEMEAL ZONING WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE.
I I DON'T, THIS JUST DOES NOT SIT RIGHT WITH ME.
AND THAT'S, I DON'T KNOW IF IT IS PART OF WHAT WE'RE DOING, BUT TO ME IT'S LIKE WE'RE RUSHING TRYING TO RUSH THIS THROUGH.
AND I DON'T WANNA MAKE MISTAKES.
I WANNA DO IT RIGHT AS DO WE ALL.
BUT I THINK BY DOING THIS NOW, I THINK WE ARE RUSHING.
I'D LIKE TO GET SOME MORE INFORMATION TO BE SURE.
AND THE WAY WE HAVE THIS PRESENTED NOW IS THAT THOSE WOULD BE, AT LEAST TWO OF THOSE WOULD BE ADDRESSED THROUGH THE CFA PLANNING PROCESS WHERE YOU DO HAVE TIME TO LOOK INTO IT.
THAT'S WHAT I, THE SOLDIERS' PAST PROPERTY THAT COULD COME FORWARD ON ITS OWN SEPARATELY AT ANY TIME.
PETE, DOES THAT SOLVE YOUR, YOUR ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS? YOU, I KNOW YOU HAVE THE, YOU BROUGHT UP AN INTERESTING POINT ABOUT THAT PARTICULAR PROPERTY, BUT, UM, YOU FINE WITH MOVING ON.
THE, THE, THE SOLDIER PASSED PROPERTY THAT'S THE CITY OWNED PROPERTY YES.
AND RIGHT BEHIND CASA CONTENT.
I MEAN, I I, I APPRECIATE THE ANSWER GOING THROUGH THIS CFA PROCESS IS GONNA TAKE MORE TIME.
AND WE HAVE PROJECTS THAT WE'D, YOU KNOW, LIKE TO ENCOURAGE AND SEND SIGNALS THAT WE'RE OPEN AND ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO THINK ABOUT THEIR PROPERTIES AND THE USE AND THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP IS THE TIME TO DO THAT.
I THINK THE CITY MANAGER BROUGHT UP SOME GREAT POINTS ABOUT THE CITY OWNED PROPERTY AND SOLDIER PASS ROAD.
THAT'S A, IT SITS OUT ON ITS OWN.
THESE OTHER ONES ARE CONNECTED.
THEY SIT WITHIN THE BOUNDARIES THAT WE'RE TRYING TO DRAW.
THEY ARE IN THE AREAS THAT WE'RE TRYING RIGHT NOW TO MOVE AND, AND, AND TO CHANGE.
AND SO I, I'M SUPPORTIVE OF I TWO PROPERTIES BEING IN THE PLAN, MELISSA.
SO I WANNA JUST MAKE SURE THAT I UNDERSTAND THIS CLEARLY.
THERE IS NO LEGAL REZONING, P AND Z REQUIRED ANYTHING.
WE ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING OTHER THAN SAYING WE WANT TO EXAMINE THIS.
WE WANT TO PUT THIS AS, UM, MULTIUSE SO WE CAN GET MULTIFAMILY IN THERE, OR SORRY, MIXED USE SO WE CAN GET MULTIFAMILY IN THERE.
THIS IS ASPIRATIONAL AS TO WHAT WE WANT TO DO WITH THIS PROPERTY.
THIS IS NOT DETERMINING WHAT WILL BE DONE WITH THIS PROPERTY THAT WILL GO THROUGH P AND Z AND IT WILL GO THROUGH ALL THE STANDARD PROCESSES.
SO I HAPPEN TO AGREE THAT IF WE ARE GOING TO KEEP SAYING THAT WE CARE ABOUT MULTIFAMILY AND THAT WE CARE ABOUT AFFORDABLE MULTIFAMILY, UM, AND THEN WE DON'T TAKE EVERY OPPORTUNITY TO TRY AND SAY, HEY, THIS IS WHAT WE THINK IS IMPORTANT.
'CAUSE IT DOESN'T IMPACT THEM.
THEY CAN STILL BUILD THEIR SINGLE FAMILY FOUR HOME
[02:55:01]
SUBDIVISION, BUT THIS IS WHAT WE THINK SHOULD HAPPEN.AND WE GIVE THAT DIRECTION TO P AND Z VIA THE CFAS AND, AND VIA THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP.
THAT IS OUR PURVIEW, AND THIS IS OUR OPPORTUNITY TO SAY WE'RE SERIOUS ABOUT THIS.
SO I I'M IN FAVOR OF DOING THIS BECAUSE IT, IT'S NOT, DOESN'T DO ANY HARM TO THE PEOPLE WHO OWN THIS PROPERTY.
KATHY, I I THINK A KEY PHRASE THERE IS OUR OPPORTUNITY PROBLEM THAT I'M HAVING A COUPLE PROBLEMS, BUT ONE OF THE PROBLEMS I'M HAVING IS THAT WE ARE DOING THIS EXERCISE TONIGHT OF GOING THROUGH THIS PROGRAM, UH, THIS, THIS, UH, DOCUMENT THAT HAS BEEN VETTED THROUGH A COMMUNITY, A LARGE SCALE COMMUNITY EFFORT, WHICH WAS OUTLINED BEFORE AND THEN WENT AND WAS REVIEWED BY PLANNING AND ZONING TO GIVE RECOMMENDATIONS TO US TO BE CONSIDERED AS PART OF OUR REVIEW.
UM, SO YES, WE CAN COME WITH SOMETHING THAT HASN'T GONE THROUGH THAT, BUT THAT'S WHAT WE'RE DOING.
UH, WE HAVE THE RIGHT, BUT THAT DOESN'T MAKE IT TO ME SEEM APPROPRIATE.
UH, NOW ALSO, THE VICE MAYOR ASKED A QUESTION ON A DIFFERENT TOPIC BEFORE THAT MIGHT PERTAIN HERE, WHICH IS, SINCE THIS IS NOT SOMETHING THAT'S GOING OUT TO THE, THE PLAN, IT'S NOT GOING OUT TO THE, UH, VOTE COMMUNITY FOR A PUBLIC VOTE.
IS IT SOMETHING THAT COULD BE CONCEIVABLY CHANGED WITHIN THE NEXT 10 YEARS WITHOUT HAVING TO WAIT FOR THE NEXT COMMUNITY PLAN REVIEW? AND THE ANSWER IS THAT YES IT IS.
SO WHY WOULD WE JUMP A GUN AND, AND IGNORE THE ADVISORY PROCESSES THAT ARE IN PLACE TO HELP US FORM OUR JUDGEMENTS AND MAKE THE BEST INFORMED DECISIONS WHEN THIS COULD CHANGE AT ANY OTHER TIME ONCE WE HAVE THAT? AGAIN, I, I, I OPPOSE THIS SUGGESTION, VICE MAYOR, UH, BRIAN.
SO I'M LOOKING AT THIS PAGE THAT WE WERE GIVEN ABOUT SUBSTANTIVE CHANGES TO POLICIES OR ACTIONS BY P AND Z.
THE FIRST THING ON THE LIST, THE VERY FIRST ITEM SAYS EXPAND MIXED USE.
AND THEN THE PROPOSED REVISION IS EXPAND THE DESIGNATION OF MIXED USE WHERE APPROPRIATE AS DETERMINED THROUGH THE CFA PLANNING PROCESS.
SO I THINK P AND Z HAS ALREADY WEIGHED IN AND OFFERED, BUT THROUGH THE CS CFA PLANNING PROCESS.
BUT THAT'S WHAT THEY CAME UP WITH.
THAT'S WHAT THEY CAME UP WITH.
SEE, AND THEN AFTER, BEFORE, UH, YOU STARTED SPEAKING, I WAS GONNA ASK CYNTHIA, HAD IT BEEN DISCUSSED, HAVE THESE LOTS BEEN DISCUSSED IN BY THE EACH COMMITTEE? SO LET'S SEE.
UM, WITH THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION, THE PROPERTY OWNER LETTER THAT WE RECEIVED, UM, WAS QUESTIONING THE CHANGE.
AND IT DID KIND OF COME DOWN TO, IT'S A LITTLE HARD IN THESE SORT OF FORUMS AFTER THIS PLANNING PROCESS TO START TALKING ABOUT SPECIFIC PROPERTIES AND CHANGING 'EM.
AND SO THAT'S WHERE WE CAME UP WITH THIS IDEA THAT YEAH, WE ARE INTERESTED IN EXPANDING, UM, MIXED USE OR EVEN MULTIFAMILY, BUT THAT THAT WOULD BE DONE THROUGH THE CFA PROCESS.
AND THEN THE OTHER SIDE OF IT, WHICH I THINK HAS BEEN ALLUDED TO HERE, IS THAT BY MAKING THE CHANGES, WE MAY BE FAMILIAR WITH PROPERTY OWNERS, BUT IT WOULD BE THE SURROUNDING, UM, PROPERTY OWNERS THAT WOULD DEFINITELY HAVE AN INTEREST IN THAT.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT KAREN POINTED OUT ON THE SOLDIER'S PAST PROPERTY.
SO, WELL, THERE WAS DISCUSSION BEFORE WITH THE, THIS, THE, UH, ADJACENT COMMUNITY, DIDN'T THEY? THERE WAS DISCUSSION ABOUT THIS ABOUT A YEAR OR SO AGO.
WELL, MAYBE MORE COSTA CONTENTA WEIGHED IN.
WAS IT THEM OR SOMEBODY ELSE? I'M NOT FAMILIAR WITH THAT, NO.
MAYBE I'M CONFUSING THE TWO, BUT, OKAY.
SO LIKE THE VICE MAYOR SAID IT IS IN HERE, BUT DO WE WANNA NOW BYPASS, WHICH WE CAN DO BYPASS P AND Z? BECAUSE THEY'RE SAYING THE CFA PLAN.
JESSICA'S WE BY BE BYPASSING P AND Z.
AND I DON'T REALLY WANNA DO THAT, BUT, UH, BRIAN, OKAY.
I DON'T SEE WHERE WE'RE BYPASSING, UH, P AND ZI WOULD'VE BEEN SURPRISED IF P AND Z HAD, UH, SOME WAY SOMEHOW PUNTED THIS UP TO US TO TAKE THIS ACTION.
SO ULTIMATELY WE DO HAVE THIS AUTHORITY TO DO SO.
WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT COMMITTING THE PROPERTY TO THAT FUTURE DESIGNATION.
IT STILL HAS TO GO THROUGH PNZ FOR A POTENTIAL FUTURE REZONING.
[03:00:01]
I DON'T SEE WHERE WE'RE ULTIMATELY PRECLUDING THE MOST IMPORTANT ASPECTS OF HOW, UH, A LAND USE CHANGES.SO I SEE NO DOWNSIDE TO THOSE TWO PROPERTIES IN PARTICULAR, THE FOREST ROAD AND THE PAYNE PLACE.
I, I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH GOING AHEAD AND CHANGING THE FUTURE USE FOR, FOR BOTH OF THOSE VICE MAYOR.
AND THEN WE'LL TRY TO WRAP THIS UP.
UH, YOU KNOW, KURT, WE'VE HAD SOME LAY PROPERTY OWNERS WHO HAVE TAKEN EXCEPTION TO ACTIONS THAT WE HAVE, THAT WE HAVE DONE AS A COUNCIL AND HAVE IN THOSE OBJECTIONS, UH, GIVEN US POINTED TO CFAS, POINTED TO LDCS, POINTED TO OTHER CITY ORDINANCES, CITY REGULATIONS, CITY ASPIRATIONS THROUGH A CFA, WHICH WE ALL SAY HAS NO LEGAL RIGHT, UH, RAMIFICATIONS.
BUT, BUT YET WHEN THEY'RE WRITING TO US OR THEY'RE SPEAKING WITH US, THEY POINT TO ALL THESE THINGS SAYING IT'S ALLOWED IN THE CFA, IT'S IN THE CFA, AND SO THEREFORE WE HAVE A RIGHT TO RELY ON THE CFA.
NOW WE'RE SAYING IT DOESN'T HAVE ANY LEGAL SIGNIFICANCE, BUT YET THAT'S NOT WHAT WE SAY IN OTHER, AT OTHER TIMES IN OTHER PLACES.
SO, SO VICE MAYOR PLU, THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT RELYING ON IT.
THEY'RE USING IT AS A PERSUASION TOOL TO SUPPORT A REZONE.
UM, BUT THEY'RE NOT SAYING THAT THEY DESERVE OR GET A REZONE BECAUSE IT'S IN THE CFA.
THE, THEY, THEY CAN SAY THAT THEY'RE NOT LEGALLY OBLIGATED TO GET A REZONE BECAUSE IT'S IN THE CFA.
AND NO ONE'S, THIS IS A PLANNING DOCUMENT.
IT IS NOT LEGALLY BINDING ON ANY PARCEL.
WHAT THEY HAVE IS THEIR CURRENT ZONING, NO MATTER WHAT THE, UH, FUTURE LAND MOOSE MAP SAYS.
SO NO ONE'S ENTITLED TO A, A REZONE.
SO IF YOU, LIKE COUNCILOR T SAID IF IT'S, UH, REZO, IF IT'S THE FUTURE LAND MOOSE USE MAP IS DESIGNATED MULTIFAMILY OR MIXED USE ON ANY PARCEL ON HERE, UM, ESPECIALLY IF IT'S AN UPZONING FROM A SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL TO A MULTIFAMILY OR MIXED USE, THAT'S WOULD BE LEADING TOWARDS WHAT COULD BE A, A FUTURE, UH, UPZONING, THEN THERE'S NO LEGAL CLAIM THERE.
AND WE DON'T REMOVE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR COMMITTEE, UH, BENEFIT FOR AN UP ZONE.
THE FUTURE LAND USE MOP, THAT'S A PART OF A REZONING PROCESS.
WHAT LET'S, I'M TRYING TO GET MY, YEAH, LET'S TRY TO GET THIS.
DO WE, DO WE HAVE FOUR PEOPLE HERE WHO WANT TO MO UH, MOVE FORWARD WITH JUST THESE TWO, UH, TWO PROPERTIES? NOT THE, UH, THREE, RIGHT? IT'S THREE.
NO, THAT'S PI YES, IT GOES THREE.
SO JUST TO RECAP THE FOREST ROAD AND NO, NO CHANGE.
KAREN, YOU HAVE SOMETHING YOU WANNA ASK? I WOULD JUST POINT OUT IT'S SIX 20.
SO WE'VE BEEN AT THIS FOR ALMOST THREE AND A HALF HOURS.
WE ARE LESS THAN HALFWAY THROUGH THE CHAPTERS STILL TO BE DISCUSSED, INCLUDE HOUSING, TRAFFIC, SUSTAINABILITY, UM, AND TOURISM.
SO I SUSPECT THAT THOSE CHAPTERS MAY TAKE LONGER THAN THE FIRST HALF OF THIS DISCUSSION.
SO I, I MEAN, I, I DON'T, I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU ALL WANT TO DO OR WHAT THE STAFF, UM, AND SDR FEEL, UH, LIKE THEY'D LIKE TO, TO DO.
BUT I'M NOT SURE THAT WE'RE GONNA GET THROUGH THIS TONIGHT.
SO IF WE DON'T GET THROUGH IT TONIGHT, THEN DO WE CONTINUE IT ON WHAT DATE, I GUESS IS MY QUESTION.
JUST, I WOULD LIKE TO AT LEAST GET FURTHER TONIGHT THOUGH.
UM, BECAUSE AS YOU POINT OUT, KAREN, YES.
I THINK THEY WILL TAKE A LOT OF DISCUSSION AND PUTTING, PUTTING IT THAT MUCH OFF.
WE MAY NOT GET THROUGH IT IN A SECOND SIMILARLY TIMED SESSION.
SO, I MEAN, I, I THINK THIS IS AN IMPORTANT DOCUMENT.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO GET THROUGH FURTHER IF WE CAN.
I UNDERSTAND THAT WE PROBABLY WILL NOT BE ABLE TO FINISH AND I, WE'LL NEED ANOTHER DATE, BUT I THINK IF WE STOP SOON, WE'LL NEED A THIRD DATE AS WELL.
SO I AM, I AM WILLING TO PUT MORE TIME IN HERE.
[03:05:01]
I GOT A HOTEL ROOM TONIGHT, SO GEE, I FIGURED IT WOULD GO LATE.I, I AM WILLING TO, I MEAN, I DO NOT WANNA GO ON AND ON AND ON AND ON FOR HOURS AND HOURS.
I KNOW IT'S IMPORTANT AND I KNOW THAT THIS IS WHAT PEOPLE TELL ME I SIGNED UP TO DO, BUT I THINK THERE'S KIND OF A LIMIT TO WHAT STAFF CAN DO AND WHAT I FEEL LIKE I CAN DO.
AND IF, IF WE, WE ALL MET WITH THEM.
WE ALL MET WITH THEM AND, AND I ASSUME WE MET WITH THEM SO THAT WE WOULDN'T HAVE ALL THESE COMMENTS.
I MEAN, THAT WAS MY ASSUMPTION.
UM, SO GIVEN THAT WE ARE GOING IN DETAIL, I JUST, I I DO NOT WANT TO, I DO NOT WANNA GO ON FOR HOURS AND HOURS AND HOURS.
SO I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE HAS TO BE SOME SORT OF REASONABLENESS TO, TO THIS DISCUSSION.
WOULD IT? AND I DON'T, I, I'M NOT SURE THERE, AND I KNOW EVERY, I, I KNOW I'M IN THE MINORITY HERE, BUT, WELL, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU, I DON'T KNOW THAT YOU'RE IN THE MINORITY.
WELL, I, I, I AM SAYING, I, I THINK IT'S, IT'S UNREASONABLE TO TAKE 10 OR 12 HOURS TO DISCUSS A DOCUMENT THAT WE ALL DISCUSSED WITH STAFF ALREADY
AND SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, THAT'S MY FEELING.
I'M WILLING, I'M WILLING TO COME BACK AND DISCUSS IT AGAIN.
UM, IT MIGHT BE USEFUL TO CONTINUE TO CONTINUE.
UM, SO THAT'S, THAT'S MY 2 CENTS VICE MAYOR.
UH, WELL WE HAVE, WE HAD HELD MARCH 13TH OPEN.
SO WHY DON'T WE GO TO MARCH 13TH? BUT WE HAVE HOUSING IS NEXT ON THE LIST.
WELL, MY QUESTION IS, WE'VE NOTICED FOR A PUBLIC HEARING ON MARCH 12TH.
SO DO WE CONTINUE THIS TO MARCH 12TH? DO WE CANCEL THE PUBLIC HEARING? POSTPONE IT, AND WE'RE NOT GONNA BE DOING A PUBLIC HEARING.
SO CAN WE CANCEL THE PUBLIC HEARING? IT'S NOT GONNA HAPPEN ON THE 12TH OR THE 13TH.
IT CAN BE MOVED TO THE 26TH OR WHENEVER THE NEXT COUNCIL MEETING IS.
CAN YOU DO A, LIKE A SPECIAL MEETING NEXT WEEK ON THE SIXTH? IT'S UP TO, I'M TOTALLY FREE.
I DON'T KNOW IF I HAVE ANYBODY ELSE, BUT WHAT WEEK ARE WE TALKING? WHAT ARE WE TALKING HERE? THE WEEK OF THE FOURTH? I'M GOOD ON THE FIFTH.
ANYBODY'S GOOD ON THE FIFTH? WE HAVE A P AND Z MEETING ON THE FIFTH.
WELL, WHAT ARE WE TALKING ABOUT? THREE O'CLOCK? OR WE HAVE A P AND Z MEETING ON THE FIFTH.
WE HAVE A TAB MEETING ON THE SIXTH.
AND THE SEVENTH IS, UH, I CAN'T MEET ON THE SEVENTH
SO THEN WE'RE GONNA LOOK THEN TO, UH, THE 13TH.
WHY IS THE, YOU SAID THERE'S A TAB MEETING ON THE SIXTH.
WHY? WHY IS THAT A CONFLICT FOR US? THEY, THEY MEET IN HERE.
WHAT TIME FROM TWO, THERE'S UM, STAFF SETS UP AT TWO, THEY START THEIR MEETING AT THREE.
IT'S SHOWING US TWO, BUT SO CAN WE DO THE MORNING OF THAT DAY? MORNING? I CAN'T, BUT WELL, WE NEED, YOU NEED, WE HAVE TO TORTURE YOU WITH THIS.
SO THE 13TH DO IT ON THE 13TH.
SO THAT MEANS WITH THE 12TH, I CAN'T DO ANYTHING IN THE MORNINGS OF, WE, I CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION FOR THREE O'CLOCK.
BUT ANYTHING EARLIER THAN THAT, I CAN'T MAKE THAT DAY.
MAYBE LIKE TWO O'CLOCK I COULD MAKE OR ONE 30, BUT NOT WHAT DAY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE 13TH.
BUT THAT IS A CITY COUNCIL, I KNOW AT THREE O'CLOCK.
BUT I THINK WE WERE TALKING ALSO ABOUT TIMES TO GET MORE, MORE TIME AVAILABLE.
WELL, THERE, THERE'S, IT IS SCHEDULED ON THE 12TH AS WELL, THAT COUNCIL MEETING, YOU MIGHT SPEND AN HOUR, RIGHT? OR TWO ON IT THEN.
AND THEN ALSO WE HAD AN HOUR TWO SCHEDULED FOR YOU.
AND SO ON THE 13TH, WE WANNA SCHEDULE A STARTING AT ONE 30 OR TWO.
SO IF WE'RE SAYING THAT WE WOULD DO IT ON THE 12TH AND THE 13TH IS THAT, OH, WELL THE 13TH CAN BE A, IF NEEDED IF WE DON'T FINISH ON THE 12TH.
[03:10:02]
OKAY.BECAUSE I THINK THAT KATHY'S QUITE RIGHT THAT IT'S GOING TO TAKE QUITE A BIT OF TIME.
AND I THINK WE MIGHT NEED ALL THOSE ALL THAT TIME.
BUT THE 12TH IS ALSO SAFE PLACE TO PARK.
WHICH WILL GO FOR, THAT'S TRUE.
AND IT'S ACTUALLY AGENDIZED AFTER THIS TOPIC, STRANGELY ENOUGH.
BECAUSE IT WAS EXPECTED THAT THIS TOPIC WOULD MOVE OVER TO THE 13TH OR THAT IT WOULD BE WORKED THROUGH TO THE EX TO THE EXTENT THAT IT WOULD BE ABLE TO BE A SHORTER ITEM WHEN IT GOES TO PUBLIC HEARING.
SO ARE WE ALL MEETING ON THE 13TH NOW? WHAT IS, WHAT IS THE REST OF THIS GROUP WAS? OKAY.
SO THE PROPOSAL IS TO SPEND AN HOUR PLUS OR MINUS ON THE 12TH AND THEN MOVE IT OVER TO THE 13TH.
THAT'S WHAT YOU HAD PROPOSED? THAT'S WHAT I'M PROPOSING.
WHAT HAPPENED TO THE TAB WOULD, IS IT CHANGE THE ORDER? NO, THE TAB.
THAT'S POSSIBLE PRIOR WEEK IF THEY GOT THROUGH AN HOUR, HOUR AND A HALF ON THE 12TH FINISHED THE DISCUSSION ON THE 13TH.
AND THOSE WERE CONTINUANCES OF THE PUBLIC HEARING.
AND THE PUBLIC HEARING WAS HELD ON THE 12TH.
COULD THEY ADOPT AT THE CONTINUED MEETING ON THE 13TH? I THINK WE NOTICED IT JUST AS THE 12TH.
AND IT'S PROBABLY TOO LATE TO CHANGE THAT.
WE JUST, THEN IT WOULD COME BACK FOR ADOPTION ON THE 26TH.
IS THAT BECAUSE OF THE 26TH IS A PUBLIC HEARING DATE AS OPPOSED TO THE 13TH? WE CAN, BECAUSE WE CAN SCHEDULE IT WHENEVER, BUT WE GOTTA POST NOTICE OUT.
AND I DON'T KNOW THAT WE, UH, HAVE TIME TO REDO IF, REDO IT.
BUT IF WE HOLD THE PUBLIC HEARING ON THE 12TH AND THEN CONTINUE THE MEETING FOR THE NEXT DAY, USUALLY YOU'RE GONNA ADOPT IT AT THE SAME YEAH.
YOU WANT TO HAVE ALL YOUR PUBLIC, YOU DON'T WANT TO HAVE YOUR PUBLIC HEARING ONE DAY AND THEN ADOPT IT LATER.
I MEAN, YOU COULD, I I DON'T THINK THERE'S A LEGAL REASON.
YOU COULDN'T, I GUESS, BUT, SO WE, DO WE NEED TO REPOST IT FOR THE 26TH OR FOR A HEARING OR? NO, IF WE'RE GONNA CARRY OVER TO THE 13TH, THEN I THINK IT'D BE BEST TO REPOST IT FOR THE 26TH.
I WOULD FEEL REALLY WEIRD ABOUT HAVING A PUBLIC HEARING AND THEN HAVING SUBSTITUTE THINGS DECIDED THE NEXT DAY.
WELL, AND IF, IF WE'RE GONNA POSTPONE, THEN LET'S JUST POSTPONE
AND THEN, AND THEN HAVE A WORK SESSION ON THE 13TH.
AND THEN WE CAN ALSO LOOK AT THE CALENDAR FOR, AND BECAUSE WE, WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THINGS LIKE NOTICING, UM, YOU KNOW, DO WE HAVE ENOUGH TIME? BECAUSE THE, THE STATE REQUIREMENTS ARE A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT FROM SOME OF OUR OTHER PUBLIC HEARINGS.
UM, SO I DON'T KNOW THAT WE CAN SAY TODAY WHEN THE PUBLIC HEARING SHOULD BE.
BUT WE COULD PLAN ON THE 13TH FOR THE CONTINUATION OF THIS.
BUT JUST TO CLARIFY, AND MAYBE I MISSED IT WHEN I STEPPED OUT.
I MEAN, 'CAUSE WE'VE SO SAY CAN, YOU CAN ALWAYS MOVE IT, BUT YEAH, WE, WE CAN DOUBLE CHECK.
BUT DON'T WE HAVE THE 12TH AND 13TH FOR THE, UM, SAFE PLACE TO PARK 12TH? NO, I'M NOT SAYING WE WOULD DO IT ON THE 12TH, BUT I'M JUST SAYING IT'S ALREADY BEEN NOTICED FOR THE 12TH.
AND WE CAN AMEND THAT TO THE 26TH.
WE, WE HAVE A SAFE PLACE TO PARK AND, AND THE COMMUNITY PLAN ON THE 12TH WITH THE IDEA THAT THIS, THE COMMUNITY PLAN DISCUSSION, IF NEED BE, WE WOULD GO TO THE 13TH.
THAT WAS OUR ORIGINAL THOUGHT PROCESS.
NOW WE'RE JUST SAYING WE'RE GONNA DO IT ON THE 13TH, SO NOTHING ON THE 12TH ON.
SO WHAT TIME DO PEOPLE WANT TO DO START NOTICE OF THE HEARING HAS TO BE GIVEN JUST 15 DAYS BEFORE.
SO WE, IF WE PUT IT IN THE NEWSPAPER, WE HAVE TO MEET THEIR DEADLINES AS WELL, SIR.
BUT, SO WE'D BE FINE FOR THE 26TH COUNT BACK, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT WE'LL MAKE IT FORWARD TO REDO IT FROM THE 12TH OR 13TH.
SO TODAY'S THE 28TH, SO YOU ALREADY CAN'T DO IT, RIGHT? YEAH, WELL IT'S A PERIOD.
IS IT CALENDAR DAYS OR BUSINESS DAYS? I GUESS WE CAN'T, YOU'RE RIGHT.
SO ON THE 13TH, WHAT TIME, WHAT TIME DOES COUNCIL WANT TO GET HERE? I'LL FIND IT.
I CAN'T, I CAN'T, I HAVE OTHER COMMITMENTS FOR THAT MORNING.
12 O'CLOCK IS STILL, UH, NOT LATE ENOUGH.
I HAVE A MEETING THAT RUNS UNTIL 1230 AND THEN I HAVE SOMETHING AFTER THAT.
THAT'S NOT GONNA GIVE US ENOUGH TIME.
[03:15:01]
IT'LL HAVE TO GIVE US ENOUGH TIME.LET'S MAKE, WE'LL HAVE TO MAKE IT WORK.
LET'S MAKE IT, GIVE, GIVE US ENOUGH TIME, FOLKS.
AND AGAIN, WE CAN LEAVE IT ON THE CALENDAR FOR THE 12TH, BUT REVERSE THE ORDER.
SO IF SAFE PLACE TO PARK GOT DONE EARLY, WE COULD DO AN HOUR OR SO THAT NIGHT.
WE SHOULD REVERSE THE ORDER ANYWAY.
LET'S, YEAH, LET'S NOT, I, LET'S, I WOULD PREFER NOT TO JUST HAVE EVERYBODY ON STANDBY FOR A WHAT IF, RIGHT? MM-HMM.
JUST, WELL, WE'RE NOT GONNA GET IT DONE ON THE 12TH, SO WE WILL NEED THE 13TH.
AND IF WE START AT TWO AND WE WENT TO SIX TO SIX, I MEAN, I THINK MAYBE SEVEN PEOPLE SHOULD COME IN WITH THE EXPECTATION THAT IT COULD BE A LONG SESSION TO WHAT, WHAT DO YOU CONSIDER A LONG SESSION? SEVEN AT LEAST.
MAYBE WE COULD TALK TO STAFF BETWEEN NOW AND THEN IF WE HAVE ISSUES.
TO ME, THIS IS ABOUT US VETTING THIS, UH, THAT'S OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO, I NEED TO HEAR WHAT YOU THINK JESSICA AND WHAT MELISSA THINKS AND EVERYBODY THINKS, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE I, NOT ONLY THAT, BUT YOU, YOU MAY HAVE AN OPINION, RIGHT.
AND STAFF CAN'T MAKE THAT DECISION WITHOUT GIVING IT TO ALL OF US.
CAN'T WE ALL AGREE ON THE 13TH? YES.
CONTINUED WORK SESSION AT TWO O'CLOCK.
AND THEN WE WILL HAVE TO LOOK AT, UH, CALENDARS REGARDING A PUBLIC HEARING AND WHETHER OR NOT WE NEED A THIRD WORK SESSION.
THEN YOU WANNA END NOW? I'M FINE WITH DOING THAT.
IT DOESN'T PAY TO START ANOTHER TOPIC.
SO WE'RE GOING TO, UH, CONTINUE THIS, THIS, UH, PARTICULARLY MAY TO, UH, MARCH 13TH.
WELL, NO, IT'LL BE A NEW MEETING.
YOU OKAY? SO THEN THIS MEETING, THEN THIS MEETING IS WHAT? SO IT'LL CONTINUE ADJOURNED? NO, I WANNA SEE WHAT HE'S, IF I'M SORRY.
IF WE DON'T CONTINUE THIS MEETING, DO WE HAVE TO REPOST FOR THE 13TH? NO, BECAUSE THAT WILL BE, THAT'S NOT THE PUBLIC HEARING.
[5. ADJOURNMENT]
THIS IS A WORK SESSION, RIGHT? RIGHT.