* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [00:00:02] OKAY. OKAY. OKAY. [1. CALL TO ORDER/PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE/MOMENT OF SILENCE ] THE FOUR 30 MEETING WILL, UH, CALL ME TO ORDER. UH, PLEASE JOIN ME FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA REPUBLIC, WHICH STAND ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVIDUAL WITH LIBERTY, JUSTICE, AND NOW A MOMENT OF SILENCE, IF YOU WILL. OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. [2. ROLL CALL ] MADAM CLERK, THE FINAL ROLL CALL. WHERE ARE YOU? THERE YOU ARE. MAYOR JALO. HERE, VICE MAYOR PLU. PRESENT. COUNCILOR DUNN? HERE. COUNCILOR FOLTZ. PRESENT. COUNCILOR FURMAN? HERE. COUNCILOR KINSELLA. PRESENT. COUNCILOR WILLIAMSON? HERE. OKAY. THANK YOU MADAM CLERK. OKAY, ITEM THREE, [3. CONSENT ITEMS - APPROVE] CONSENT ITEMS. UH, DO WE HAVE ANY REQUESTS FROM THE COUNCIL OR STAFF TO PULL ANY OF THE ITEMS? OKAY. SO CAN I HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE A THROUGH EI MOVE TO APPROVE CONSENT ITEMS A THROUGH E. SECONDED BY SECOND. COUNCIL DUNN. OKAY. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. ALL. ANY OPPOSED? OKAY, WERE UNANIMOUS APPOINTMENTS. ITEM FOUR, WE HAVE NONE [5. SUMMARY OF CURRENT EVENTS BY MAYOR/COUNCILORS/CITY MANAGER & COUNCIL ASSIGNMENTS] SUR SUMMARY OF CURRENT EVENTS BY MYSELF, THE COUNCIL OR THE MANAGER, OR ON COUNCIL ASSIGNMENTS. B. THANK YOU MAYOR. UH, I WANTED TO GIVE, UH, MY COLLEAGUES A REPORT ON THE JUNE 13TH PS M MEETING FOR THE LEAGUE WHERE WE TOOK THE, UM, POLICE AIDS AS TRAFFIC CONDUCTORS ITEM TO THE LEAGUE. GOOD. PS PSM. IT WAS A VERY INTERESTING CONVERSATION. I WOULD SAY THAT THERE MIGHT HAVE BEEN A THIRD OF THE CITY REPRESENTATIVES WHOSE RESPONSE WAS WHAT, THIS IS ILLEGAL, I NEED TO KNOW MORE. AND THE THIRD OF 'EM SAID, WHAT? THIS IS ILLEGAL, I DON'T WANNA KNOW ANYMORE. AND THE OTHER THIRD SAID, THIS MIGHT BE ILLEGAL AND WE DON'T WANT ASK THE LEGISLATOR TO FIX IT. . SO, UH, THE LEAGUE STAFF DID, UH, PROMISE TO WORK WITH, UH, SEDONA AND KURT CHRISTENSEN ON GETTING A FORMAL, UH, OPINION SOMEWHERE THAT WOULD PERHAPS ANSWER THE QUESTION IN A, A MORE DIRECT WAY WITHOUT HAVING TO SEEK LEGISLATION. AND I THINK KURT HAS TOLD ME THAT THERE HAS BEEN A LITTLE BIT OF PROGRESS AND THE LEAGUE CONTINUES TO WORK, UH, THAT ISSUE WITH US. SO, SO IT WON'T BE GOING TO THE RESOLUTION COMMITTEE? IT WILL NOT BE GOING TO THE RESOLUTION COMMITTEE. OKAY. UNDERSTAND. OKAY. ANYTHING ELSE? ANY OTHER ASSIGNMENTS? NO. OKAY. ALRIGHT. PUBLIC FORUM. [6. PUBLIC FORUM] WE'RE GONNA OPEN THE PUBLIC FORUM AND WE HAVE CARDS IF ANYBODY WISHES TO, UH, SAY ANYTHING THAT'S NOT ON TODAY'S AGENDA, THIS IS A TIME TO DO IT. OKAY. WE HAVE, UH, NANCY, ROB DNCE. NANCY, YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES. UH, START WITH YOUR NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE AND, UH, THE CLOCK IS UP ON THE WALL. OKAY. MY NAME IS NANCY ROB DUNS, AND I WANNA SAY GOOD EVENING TO MAYOR JALO AND TO CITY COUNSELORS. I LIVE AT, UH, 2 5 1 BARE WALLO LANE, SEDONA, ARIZONA. I HAVE LIVED IN, UH, SEDONA FOR 30 YEARS, AND I AM A PUBLIC ART ARTIST. I AM SURE THAT MOST OF YOU NOW KNOW THAT THE 1999 ARTWORK ENTITLED THE MURAL PROJECT CREATED BY MARLI MALLET AND KEVIN NCE AT THE SEDONA ART CENTER HAS BEEN PAINTED OVER. ORIGINALLY IT WAS A COMMISSION BY THE SEDONA ART CENTER AND THE CITY OF SEDONA. THE ART CENTER WAS THE RESULT. THIS ARTWORK WAS THE RESULT OF A PUBLIC ART COMMISSION INVOLVING SEVERAL COMMUNITY ARTISTS, OF WHICH I WAS ONE. AN ART EXHIBITION WAS HELD WITH ALL OF THE DRAWINGS AND THE MAQUETTES AND THE WINNER, MARLI MALLET THEN MS. POWELL WAS ANNOUNCED AT THE OPENING OF THE EXHIBITION. I MUST TELL YOU, I AM STUNNED THAT THIS PIECE OF ART HAS BEEN PAINTED OVER. ACCORDING TO THE FEDERAL VISUAL ARTIST RIGHTS ACT OF 1990, THE ARTIST SHOULD FIRST HAVE BEEN [00:05:01] ASKED IF SHE APPROVED OF THE DESTRUCTION, MUTILATION, OR MODIFICATION OF THE ARTWORK. IF THIS CAN HAPPEN TO THE ARTIST, MARLI MALLET, IT COULD HAPPEN TO ANY OF OUR PUBLIC ARTISTS. THIS IS A TRAVESTY BECAUSE THIS ART PIECE WAS IN THE COLLECTION OF THE CITY AND IT ALSO WAS HISTORIC IN THAT IT TOLD THE HISTORY OF THE SEDONA ART CENTER THROUGH VIEWING. I'M TELLING YOU THIS, THIS EVENING AND ASKING THAT IT BE IN THE CITY COUNCIL RECORDS SO THAT YOU'LL NOW HAVE THIS KNOWLEDGE AND HOPEFULLY IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN AGAIN UNDER YOUR WATCHFUL EYES. AND I HAVE COPIES FOR EACH OF YOU AND ALSO FOR THE TWO CANDIDATES THAT ARE RUNNING. OKAY. IF YOU WANNA HAND THOSE OVER TO THE CITY CLERK. OKAY. THANK YOU. YOU'RE COMPLETED. OKAY. THANK YOU. ANYBODY ELSE WISH TO SPEAK ABOUT ANYTHING? NOT ON THE AGENDA TODAY. OKAY. THEN WE'RE GOING TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC FORUM AND WE WILL MOVE TO ITEM SEVEN, WHICH IS PROCLAMATION, RECOGNITIONS AND AWARDS. WE HAVE NONE FOR ITEM EIGHT REGULAR [8.b. AB 3073 Discussion/possible action regarding approval of an Agreement for Sharing of Information Regarding Water Consumption and Water Service Disconnection with Arizona Water Company. ] BUSINESS. WE'RE GOING TO, UH, SWITCH TO ITEMS. UH, WE'RE GOING TO, UH, BRING, UH, UM, ITEM B TO ITEM A, WHICH IS AB 30 73. DISCUSSION, POSSIBLE ACTION REGARDING APPROVAL OF AN AGREEMENT FOR SHARING OF INFORMATION REGARDING THE, THE WATER CONSUMPTION AND WATER SERVICE DISCONNECTION WITH THE ARIZONA WATER COMPANY AND WHO WILL BE MAKING A PRESENTATION. THANK. THANK YOU MR. MAYOR AND COUNCIL, I DON'T HAVE A PRESENTATION. UH, THIS WAS BROUGHT BACK AT THE REQUEST OF COUNCIL, UH, WHO INITIALLY WANTED TO, UH, BE ABLE TO OBTAIN MORE INFORMATION ON WATER USAGE WITHIN THE CITY. UH, THE WAY, UH, ARIZONA WATER COMPANIES IS THE PRIMARY WATER, UH, COMPANY WITHIN THE CITY. UH, THE OTHER COMPANY IS OAK CREEK WATER. UH, THIS IS ONLY WITH ARIZONA WATER COMPANY WOULD ALLOW THE CITY TO HAVE CONSUMPTION DATA, UM, ON AN INDIVIDUAL HOUSEHOLD BASIS AS AN ANCILLARY TO THAT IT WOULD ALSO ALLOW THE CITY TO, UH, SHUT OFF WATER IF, UH, UH, WATER USERS NOT PAYING, UH, THEIR WASTEWATER, UH, CITY, UH, BILL. UH, THE CITY HOPES TO NEVER USE IT FOR THAT PURPOSE, BUT IT IS AN OPTION. UH, AS STATED IN THE AGENDA BILL, THERE IS CURRENTLY, UH, ALMOST, I BELIEVE, OR MAYBE I DIDN'T PUT IT THERE. YEAH, IT'S 76,600. THAT WAS ABOUT A MONTH AGO, SO I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S GONE UP OR NOW, BUT ABOUT $76,000 IN OUTSTANDING WASTEWATER. UM, BILLS THAT ARE, UH, WITH US, UH, 40 DIFFERENT ACCOUNTS THAT ARE OVER 90 DAYS DUE. UH, SO THIS WILL ALLOW THE CITY TO TAKE ACTION ON THE MOST EGREGIOUS ACCOUNTS. OKAY. YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? NOTHING ON THIS SIDE. OKAY. WE'RE GONNA OPEN PUBLIC COMMENTS. DOES ANYBODY ANY CAUSES TO THIS? NO. MAYOR. OKAY. WE'LL CLOSE PUBLIC COMMENT. ANY COMMENTS FROM THE COUNCIL? OKAY. HEARING NONE. DO I HAVE A MOTION? I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION, MAYOR. OKAY. PLEASE. I MOVE TO APPROVE THE AGREEMENT FOR THE SHARING OF INFORMATION REGARDING WATER CONSUMPTION AND WATER SERVICE DISCONNECTION WITH ARIZONA WATER COMPANY AND AUTHORIZE THE CITY ATTORNEY TO EXECUTE THE JOINT APPLICATION FOR APPROVAL OF WATER INFORMATION SHARING AGREEMENT AND WATER SERVICE DISCONNECTION WITH THE ARIZONA CORPORATION COMMISSION. I'D LIKE TO SECOND THAT. OKAY. SECOND. UH, MY COUNCILOR KINSELLA. ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. ANY OPPOSED? NO, WE'RE UNANIMOUS. OKAY. NOW, CAN I JUST THANK THE ARIZONA WATER COMPANY FOR ACTING ON THIS IN A VERY QUICK MANNER AND SO APPRECIATE THAT. THANK YOU. AND THANK YOU FOR COMING TODAY. NOW YOU UNDERSTAND WHY WE REVERSED THE TWO ITEMS. SO [8.a. AB 3061 Public hearing/discussion/possible action regarding an appeal of the Planning and Zoning Commission's April 16, 2024, approval of a development review application for the Oak Creek Heritage Lodge located at 65-195 Schnebly Hill Road & 20 Bear Wallow Lane. PZ23-00004 (DEV), APPE24-00001, APPE24-00002. ] NOW WE'LL GO, UH, TO, UH, AB 30 61 PUBLIC HEARING DISCUSSION, POSSIBLE ACTION REGARDING AN APPEAL OF PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION. UH, APRIL 16TH, 2024, UH, APPROVAL OF A, UH, DEVELOPMENT REVIEW APPLICATION FOR THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE LODGE LOCATED, UH, AT 16, I'M SORRY, 65 DASH 1 95 CHANEL HILL ROAD AND 20 BEAR WALLOW LANE Z 20 DASH 0 0 0 0 4. UH, DEV APPLICATION. WELL, THE REST ARE JUST CODES. OKAY, SO CARRIE, OKAY. OKAY. SO THE PARTIES OF THIS APPEAL ARE, UH, SEDONA RESIDENCE UNITE, AND [00:10:01] LAUREN THOMAS AND CHRISTINE WAGNER AND WITH THE APPELLANTS, UH, AND RD OLSON. OKAY. AND ALL, ALL THE PARTIES HERE. DO WE HAVE RESIDENCE TONIGHT? I KNOW WE HAVE THE RESIDENCE NIGHT. DO WE HAVE, UH, LAUREN THOMAS AND CHRISTIAN WAGNER? ARE YOU HERE? RAISE YOUR HAND. OKAY. AND YOUR ATTORNEYS? I BELIEVE THAT'S RD OLSON. RD OLSEN'S THE APPLICANT. OH, I'M SORRY. THE APPLICANT. EXCUSE ME. OKAY. UH, ALL PARTIES ARE PRESENT AS A PRELIMINARY MATTER. I ASK THAT ALL COUNCIL MEMBERS INDICATE THAT THEY HAVE RECEIVED AND REVIEWED THE ADMINISTRATIVE RECORD ON IN THIS MATTER, INCLUDING THE WRITTEN APPEALS, THE STAFF REPORT, ANY ITEMS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT IN ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS RECEIVED. I'M GONNA GO DOWN THE LIST, UH, TO MY RIGHT. UH, BRIAN, HAVE YOU RECEIVED EVERYTHING? RECEIVED? OKAY. COUNCILOR DUNN RECEIVED VICE MAYOR RECEIVED AND I HAVE RECEIVED AS WELL. RECEIVED. RECEIVED. RECEIVED. OKAY, THANK YOU FOR THE RECORD. UH, I ASK EACH COUNCIL MEMBER TO STATE WHETHER THEY HAVE SPOKEN WITH THE, UH, APPELLANT OR THE APPLICANT REGARDING THE APPEAL. AGAIN, TO MY RIGHT, HAVE SPOKEN WITH SEDONA RESIDENTS UNITE HAD INCONSEQUENTIAL EMAIL WITH THE APPLICANT. OKAY. COUNCIL DUNN, UM, SPOKE WITH SEDONA RESIDENCE UNITE AND WAS UNABLE TO MAKE ANY OF THE TIMES GIVEN TO ME BY THE APPLICANT. VICE MA'AM. SPOKE WITH THE APPLICANT AND SEDONA RESIDENCE UNITE AND WAS NOT CONTACTED BY THE OTHER APPELLANT. SO, AND I AM THE SAME. I SPOKE WITH THE APPLICANT RESIDENCE UNITE AND WAS NEVER CONTACTED BY THE, UH, OTHER APPELLANTS, UH, COUNSEL KINSELLA. I SPOKE WITH THE APPLICANT, UH, MET WITH SEDONA RESIDENCE UNITE AND DID RECEIVE EMAILS BUT NEVER WAS REQUESTED TO HAVE A MEETING WITH THE OTHER APPELLANT. UH, YES, WELL MET WITH THE APPLICANT AND SEDONA RESIDENT UNITE AND DID NOT RECEIVE A REQUEST TO MEET WITH ANYBODY ELSE. COUNCIL WINSTON, I MET WITH THE APPLICANT AND WITH, UH, RESIDENCE UNITE AND WAS NOT ASKED TO MEET, WAS NOT REQUESTED FOR A MEETING WITH THE OTHER APPELLANT. OKAY, THANK YOU. ITEM FOUR. AS A FINAL PRELIMINARY MATTER OF THE APPLICANT HAS ACCUSED TWO CITY COUNSELORS OF AN OPEN MEETING LAW VIOLATION AND ASKED IF THEY BE RECUSED. THIS STEMS FROM A PETITION THAT WAS INCLUDED IN THE PUBLIC COMMENTS OF A P AND Z, UH, MEETING AND SIGNED BY THE COUNSELORS IN 2022 BEFORE THEY WERE ON CITY COUNCIL. UH, MR. WOOD, UH, IS THAT STILL THE REQUEST? YOU COME UP TO THE MIC, PLEASE? YES, MA'AM. OR THE PODIUM, WHICHEVER YOU'RE, YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL, NICK WOOD, SNELLEN, WIER ONE, UH, EAST WASHINGTON STREET, PHOENIX. UM, I'VE BEEN IN ZONING AND LAND USE ATTORNEY FOR OVER 40 YEARS. I HAVE GREAT ADMIRATION FOR ANYONE WHO'S WILLING TO SERVE ON A CITY COUNCIL, MAYOR AND COUNCIL MEMBERS ALIKE. YOU'RE GIVING UP YOUR TIME. IT'S OFTEN A THANKLESS BUSINESS, BUT THERE'S ONE OVERRIDING RULE THAT IS CRITICALLY IMPORTANT TO YOU, FULFILLING, UM, WHAT YOU DO AS MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL. AND THAT'S THE OPEN MEETING LAW STATUTORILY. THE OPEN MEETING LAW IS VERY CLEAR, AND THAT IS WHEN MEMBERS OF A COUNCIL HAVE COMMUNICATIONS WITH OTHER MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL THAT TOGETHER REPRESENT A QUORUM PRIOR TO A HEARING IN WHICH, WHICH IS SUBJECT TO AN OPEN MEETING LAW THAT IS A VIOLATION. NOW, I'VE BEEN, LIKE I SAID, I'VE BEEN DOING THIS OVER 42 YEARS. I HAVE NEVER SEEN A COUNCIL MEMBER INTENTIONALLY VIOLATE THE OPEN MEETING LAW. AND I'M NOT SUGGESTING THAT THAT WAS DONE HERE, BUT THE LAW DOESN'T MAKE A DISTINCTION BETWEEN INTENTIONAL ACTS OR INADVERTENT ACTS, OR EVEN INNOCENT ACTS. THE IMPORTANCE OF THE LAW IS SIMPLY THAT WHATEVER HAPPENS AT A PUBLIC HEARING THAT'S SUBJECT TO THE STATUTE ITSELF IS DONE IN FRONT OF THE PUBLIC. MORE IMPORTANTLY FOR US AS THE APPLICANT UNDER THIS, THIS CASE, UH, AND THE APPELLEE UNDER THIS APPEAL, WE NOW KNOW THAT TWO OF YOU WHO SIGNED THE PETITION BEFORE YOU ARE COUNCIL MEMBERS, OUR KNOWS THAT YOU ARE NOT IN SUPPORT OF THIS CASE. THAT LEAVES US WITH AN OBLIGATION TO ACTUALLY HAVE A SUPER [00:15:01] MAJORITY VOTE IN ORDER TO WIN, BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT OUT OF THE FIVE REMAINING, WE HAVE TO HAVE FOUR OF THE REMAINING FIVE. IN ADDITION, IF YOU CONTINUE TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS HEARING AND NOT RECUSE YOURSELF, IT HAS FURTHER ABILITY TO IMPACT THE DECISION MAKING OF ALL OF THE OTHER MEMBERS OF THIS COUNCIL. SO THE QUESTION IS, WHEN DID OUR ALLEGED, UH, VIOLATION OF THE OPEN MEETING LAW OCCUR? WELL, IT CERTAIN DIDN'T OCCUR IN 2022 WHEN TWO OF YOU WERE CANDIDATES RUNNING FOR COUNCIL AND YOU WERE NOT ELECTED. IT OCCURRED WHEN THE CLERK DISTRIBUTED THE PACKETS TO YOU, AND THAT PACKET CONTAINED THE SIGNATURES OF THE TWO OF YOU. UM, AND NOW IT BECAME A COMMUNICATION TO YOU TELLING EVERYONE ON THIS COUNCIL AND EVERYONE IN THIS ROOM AND US PARTICULARLY WHERE YOUR VOTES ARE, THAT IS A VIOLATION OF THE OPEN MEETING LAW. AGAIN, VERY INNOCENT. SHOULD IT HAVE BEEN REDACTED? SURE. BEFORE THAT PACKET WAS SENT TO YOU AS A COUNSEL, THOSE TWO NAMES ON THAT PETITION SHOULD HAVE BEEN REDACTED. I DON'T KNOW WHY IT WASN'T, IT'S REALLY NONE OF MY BUSINESS WHY IT WASN'T. BUT I SIT HERE TODAY WITH A CLEAR VIOLATION, AN INNOCENT ONE, CLEARLY, OF THE OPEN MEETING LAW, AND MY CLIENT HAS BEEN DAMAGED BECAUSE OF THAT. UM, AND WE'VE BEEN PUT IN A VERY UNTENABLE POSITION OF AGAIN, HAVING TO OBTAIN FOUR OUT OF FIVE VOTES KNOWING THAT TWO OF YOU ARE NOT. SO IN ORDER TO MINIMIZE THE DAMAGE, WE'VE ASKED THAT THE TWO OF YOU RECUSE YOURSELVES. UM, BUT AGAIN, IT'S A DECISION THAT YOU HAVE TO MAKE. UH, UM, AND THAT'S MR. MAYOR. THAT'S ALL I HAVE TO SAY. OKAY. KURT, YOU WANNA OPINE ON THAT? SURE. UH, THANK YOU MR. MAYOR AND COUNSEL. I'VE REVIEWED THE PETITION, UH, AND CONCLUDED THAT IT'S NOT AN OPEN MEETING LAW VIOLATION, UH, FOR A NUMBER OF REASONS, BUT I'LL JUST STATE A COUPLE HERE. FIRST. UH, SIGNING A PETITION PRIOR TO BEING A MEMBER OF COUNCIL COULD NEVER RESULT IN OPEN MEETING LAW VIOLATION. UH, AS A RESIDENT AT THAT TIME, YOU'RE FREE TO SIGN ANY PETITIONS YOU WANT. UH, YOU'RE NOT ABLE TO CONTROL HOW THAT PETITION'S USED LATER ON. UH, BUT IT CERTAINLY DOES NOT REFLECT YOUR PATI YOUR OPINION TODAY. UH, FOR A PETITION THAT WAS SIGNED UP TO TWO OVER TWO YEARS AGO. UH, ALSO THE, UM, UH, THE PETITION DOESN'T, UH, ADDRESS THE, THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE LAWS, PARTICULARLY, UH, IF YOU READ THE LANGUAGE OF THE PETITION, IT SPECIFICALLY ONLY STATES THAT, UH, IT REQUESTS P AND Z TO APPLY, UH, THE SNUBBY, UH, CFA, UM, TO ENFORCE THE S NLY CFA, THE COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA AS WRITTEN, THAT'S ALL IT STATES. IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY STATE ANYTHING FOR OR AGAINST THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE LODGE. SO IT'S A HUGE STRETCH TO SAY THAT THIS IS A DECISION AGAINST OAK CREEK HERITAGE LODGE. ALREADY. IT'S JUST ASKING THAT P AND Z, UH, UH, COMPLY WITH THE S NLY CFA. AND THEN LASTLY, UM, SIGNING A PETITION IS NOT A GATHERING OF COUNSELORS. IT'S, UH, DOESN'T CONSTITUTE A MEETING. A PETITION IS A FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHT THAT YOU DON'T LOSE JUST BECAUSE YOU, YOU COME IN OPEN JUST BECAUSE YOU BECOME AN ELECTED OFFICIAL, YOU STILL HAVE THE RIGHT TO, UH, SIGN PETITIONS AND IT'S TOO INDIRECT. UH, THE CASE LAW AND THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S BEEN CLEAR THAT JUST BECAUSE, UH, SOMEONE ELSE FINDS OUT YOUR OPINION ON A TOPIC, UH, NOT THROUGH THE OPEN MEETING, DOESN'T MEAN THAT'S A NECESSARY OPEN MEETING LAW VIOLATION. FOR EXAMPLE, A COUNSELOR COULD TALK TO THE MEDIA AND THEN IF THEY, UH, ANOTHER COUNSELOR READS THE NEW ARTICLE, NEWS ARTICLE, UM, THAT IS STILL A FIRST AMENDED PROTECTED RIGHT TO SPEAK TO THE NEWS AND OTHERS CAN READ IT, AND THAT'S NOT AN OPEN MEETING LAW. SO, UH, MY CONCLUSION, UH, IS THAT THERE WAS NO OPEN MEETING LAW VIOLATION IN THE COUNSELORS, UM, WHILE FREE TO RECUSE, RECUSE THEMSELVES IF THEY WANTED TO OR ARE NOT REQUIRED TO. OKAY. DOES ANYBODY WISH TO RECUSE THEMSELVES? OKAY, SO WE WILL CONTINUE ON ITEM FIVE. THIS IS AN ADMINISTRATIVE HEARING WHICH DIFFERS FROM A COURT PROCEEDING. THE RULES OF CIVIL PROCEDURE AND EVIDENCE DO NOT APPLY. COUNSEL WILL NOT ENTERTAIN OBJECTIONS AND REQUEST THAT EACH PARTY REMAIN SILENT WHILE THE OTHER PARTIES ARE PRESENTING. ITEM SIX, THE BURDEN OF PROOF IS ON THE APPELLANT TO PROVE THE NECESSARY FACTS THAT WOULD WARRANT THE CITY COUNCIL TO REVERSE OR AMEND THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSIONING DECISION. ITEM SEVEN, STAFF WILL PROVIDE A SHORT PRESENTATION BEFORE THE HEARING BEGINS. ITEM EIGHT, EACH PARTY WILL BE GIVEN 20 MINUTES TO PRESENT THEIR POSITION AND RESPOND TO QUESTIONS FROM COUNSEL. SINCE THE APPELLANTS BEAR, UH, THE APPELLANT'S BEAR, THE BURDEN OF PROOF, THEY WILL GO FIRST AND THEN THE, UH, APPLICANT. THE APPLICANT WILL BE GIVEN 40 [00:20:01] MINUTES TO RESPOND TO BOTH, UH, APPEALS. THE COUNSEL WILL THEN ALLOW PUBLIC COMMENT, UH, IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE THREE MINUTE RULE GOVERNING SUCH COMMENT FOLLOWING THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD. EACH PARTY WILL BE GIVEN FIVE MINUTES FOR REBUTTAL. THE APPELLANTS ARE GOING FIRST AND THEN THE APPLICANT, THE COUNSEL WILL THEN ASK ANY REMAINING QUESTIONS, DELIBERATE AND REACH A DECISION ON THE APPEAL. COULD I ASK FOR A CLARIFICATION PLEASE, PLEASE? SURE. THE 20 MINUTES, KURT, THAT FOR THE PRESENTATION SAID AND QUESTIONS. SO IS THE PRESENTATION NO, NO, NO, NO. I, THAT WAS MY CLARIFICATION. SO THE PRESENTATION IS 20 MINUTES AND THE QUESTIONS CAN BE AS LONG AS THEY ARE. SO, UH, MAYOR AND COUNCIL, YOU CAN ASK THE APPLICANTS IF THEY'D LIKE TO TAKE QUESTIONS DURING THE PRESENTATION, THAT WOULD EAT INTO THEIR TIME. UH, AT THE END OF ALL THE PRESENTATIONS, COUNCIL'S FREE YOU TO ASK ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS AT ONCE. SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH. OKAY. CARRIE, YOU'LL BE REPRESENTING STAFF, OF COURSE. YEAH. YEAH. SO AS YOU READ IN THE, THE RULES OF PROCEDURE, UM, WE WILL GIVE A BRIEF PRESENTATION, BUT THE MAIN PRESENTATIONS FOR THIS CASE WILL BE GIVEN BY THE APPELLANTS AND THE APPLICANTS. UM, SO I JUST WANTED TO SUMMARIZE WHAT WAS IN YOUR AGENDA, BILL, UM, ABOUT KIND OF THE, THE HISTORY OF THIS PROJECT AND, UM, KIND OF WHAT HAS HAPPENED UP UNTIL THIS POINT. UM, SO THERE'S A LOT OF, UM, DIFFERENT, UM, KIND OF, I, I DON'T KNOW MOVING PARTS IS THE RIGHT WORD, BUT IN 20, IN THE 20 13 20 14 COMMUNITY PLAN, THE AREA ALONG SNUB HILL ROAD WAS ADOPTED IN THAT PLAN AS A COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA, WHICH WERE IDENTIFIED AS AREAS IN NEED OF ADDITIONAL PLANNING. UM, THAT, AGAIN, THAT COMMUNITY PLAN WAS VOTED ON IN 2014 AND ADOPTED BY THE VOTERS. AND SOON AFTER THAT, STAFF RECEIVED A REQUEST FROM THE RESIDENTS OF THE SCHLEY AREA TO START THE CFA PLANNING PROCESS FOR THIS AREA, BECAUSE THERE WAS, BECAUSE OF THE LEVEL OF INTEREST OF THE NEIGHBORS THAT THIS ONE WAS MOVED UP ON THE LIST OF PRIORITIES FOR THE CITY, UM, THERE WAS A LOT OF INPUT FROM THE NEIGHBORS. THERE WAS A LOT OF PUBLIC OUTREACH DURING THAT CFA PLANNING PROCESS, AND IT WENT TO PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION AND CITY COUNCIL IN, IN END OF 2016, BEGINNING OF 2017. AND CITY COUNCIL ADOPTED THAT SCHLEY CFA PLAN IN 2017. UM, AT THE SAME TIME AS WE WERE GOING THROUGH THAT, WE WERE GOING THROUGH AN UPDATE TO THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, AND ONE OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE SCHLEY CFA PLAN WAS THAT THERE WOULD BE A NEW ZONING DISTRICT CREATED SPECIFICALLY TO IMPLEMENT THE CFA PLAN. SO AS PART OF THE ADOPTION OF OUR REVAMPED LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE IN 2018, THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE DISTRICT WAS CREATED WITH ITS, UM, WITH ITS ALLOWED USES, WITH ITS DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS. AND ALL OF THESE WERE DIFFERENT. THERE WAS A, THERE'S A LOT IN THE OC DISTRICT THAT THERE WAS A REASON WHY WE DIDN'T JUST SAY YOU SHOULD REZONE TO X ZONING DISTRICT THAT ALREADY EXISTED BECAUSE THE ZONING DISTRICT, UH, THAT WAS CREATED FOR THE OC DISTRICT WAS VERY SPECIFIC TO IMPLEMENT THE, THE SCHLEY CFA PLAN. AFTER THE CREATION OF THAT DISTRICT, WE CONTACTED THE, UM, PROPERTY OWNERS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OFFERING TO TAKE THEM THROUGH THE REZONING PROCESS AS A GROUP, UM, A NUMBER. SO STAFF SPEARHEADED THAT EFFORT, BUT PROPERTY OWNERS HAD TO SIGN ON. WE DID NOT JUST BLINDLY REZONE EVERY PROPERTY IN THAT DISTRICT TO THE OC ZONE, WE TOOK THEM ALL THROUGH TOGETHER, BUT AGAIN, THE PROPERTY OWNERS HAD TO AGREE TO THE ZONE CHANGE. UM, AS WE WERE GOING THROUGH THAT ZONE CHANGE, THERE BECAME A LOT OF, THERE STARTED TO BECOME A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT WHAT THIS ZONE CHANGE. THIS ZONING DISTRICT THAT WE HAD CREATED WOULD MEAN IN PRACTICALITY. WE STARTED, UM, SOME, THERE WAS SOME INTEREST FROM DEVELOPERS IN WHAT THEY COULD DO ON THESE PROPERTIES IF THEY WERE ZONED OC. SO BEFORE WE REZONED ANY PROPERTIES TO THE OC DISTRICT, WE ALL, WE TOOK A STEP BACK AND DID SOME AMENDMENTS TO THE OC DISTRICT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE WEREN'T CHANGING THE ZONING DISTRICT AFTER PROPERTIES HAD ALREADY BEEN ZONED TO THAT. SO THAT'S WHY YOU SEE ABOUT, UM, I THINK WE GAVE YOU SOME DATES. THERE'S ABOUT A TWO YEAR GAP BETWEEN THE CREATION OF THE OC DISTRICT AND ANY PROPERTIES BEING REZONED BECAUSE AS PART OF THAT PROCESS, WE ACKNOWLEDGED THERE NEEDED TO BE SOME CHANGES TO THE OC ZONE BEFORE WE GAVE THOSE, GAVE THAT [00:25:01] ZONING TO ANY OF THE PROPERTIES. SO, UM, IN 2020, THOSE DISTRICT, THOSE OC DISTRICT AMENDMENTS WERE APPROVED. AND THEN THIS GROUP OF PROPERTIES WAS REZONED TO OC GIVING THEM THE RIGHT TO DEVELOP UNDER THE STANDARDS THAT WERE ADOPTED AS PART OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE. THIS CURRENT APPLICANT, UM, SUBMITTED THEIR CONCEPTUAL REVIEW APPLICATION IN JULY OF 2021, AND WE HAD TWO DIFFERENT HEARINGS WITH THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION ON THAT CONCEPTUAL REVIEW PROJECT IN DECEMBER OF 2021 AND MAY OF 2022. A CONCEPTUAL REVIEW IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR AN APPLICANT TO PRESENT THEIR PROJECT TO STAFF, TO THE PUBLIC, AND TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION TO GET FEEDBACK BEFORE THEY GET INTO A LOT OF THE DETAILS TO TRY TO GET THEM WHAT ARE THE, WHAT ARE THE CONCERNS OF THE COMMUNITY, WHAT ARE THE CONCERNS OF STAFF, WHAT ARE THE CONCERNS OF THE COMMISSION AS THEY DEVELOP THEIR PROJECT. UM, FOLLOWING THE MAY, 2022 WORK SESSION, UM, THE APPLICANT THEN IN MARCH OF 2023, SO ABOUT 10 MONTHS LATER, SUBMITTED THEIR COMPLETE DEVELOPMENT REVIEW APPLICATION. THAT ONE HAS GONE THROUGH, UM, A COUPLE DIFFERENT STAFF REVIEWS AND WENT THROUGH A WORK SESSION WITH THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION LAST NOVEMBER, AND THEN THE PUBLIC HEARING IN APRIL. AND THROUGH THIS PROCESS, THEY ALSO HAD TO DO THEIR PUBLIC OUTREACH. SO THAT WAS NOTIFYING THE, UM, THE PROPERTY OWNERS WITHIN 300 FEET OF THE PROPERTY, MEETING WITH THEM, HEARING THEIR CONCERNS, RESPONDING TO THEIR CONCERNS. UM, AND SO ALL OF THAT WAS PRESENTED TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION, HOW THEY GOT TO THAT POINT. SO AT THE APRIL HEARING, THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION REVIEWED THE PROJECT, REVIEWED THE PROPOSAL, UM, STAFF DID RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE PROJECT AND THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION ULTIMATELY VOTED SEVEN ZERO TO APPROVE THE PROJECT. UM, AND I TRANSPOSED SOME NUMBERS IN YOUR AGENDA, BILL. I'M SORRY. SO IN 20, NOT IN, ON APRIL 30TH, 2024, NOT 2204, UM, WE DID RECEIVE TWO SEPARATE APPEALS. UM, THEY, THE TWO APPELLANTS THAT YOU'LL HEAR TONIGHT DID SUBMIT SEPARATELY. THERE IS NOT ONE APPEAL WITH TWO DIFFERENT PEOPLE. IT IS TWO SEPARATE APPEALS, WHICH IS WHY THEY WILL BOTH BE GIVEN THE 20 MINUTE ALLOTTED TIME. UM, SO AFTER PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MAKES A DECISION, THERE WAS A 15 DAY APPEAL WINDOW WHEN, UM, I BELIEVE THE CODE SAYS ANY AGGRIEVED PARTY CAN APPEAL. AND SO THAT HAPPENED WITHIN ABOUT 14 DAYS AFTER THE APPROVAL. AND SO AFTER THE APPEALS WERE SUBMITTED, UM, THEY, UH, WE COORDINATED BETWEEN THE APPLICANT AND THE APPELLANTS AND OBVIOUSLY CITY COUNCIL'S AGENDA TO GET IT ON THE NEXT, TO GET IT ON AN AVAILABLE COUNCIL AGENDA. AND THAT'S WHAT BRINGS US HERE TONIGHT. UM, CITY STAFF IS HERE. WE HAVE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS, BUT WE'RE GONNA TURN IT OVER TO THE APPELLANTS AND THE APPLICANT NOW. THANK YOU, CARRIE. OKAY, BEFORE WE BEGIN, IS THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR CARRIE FROM TODAY? OKAY, SO WE HAVE, UH, REPRESENTATIVES FROM RESIDENCE UNITE COME UP. UH, CARRIE, YOU GONNA STAY THERE? I CAN STAY HERE UNLESS THEY NEED THE SPACE ON THE TABLE. USE THE SPACE. OKAY. OKAY. LET ME JUST GET THE, THIS, YOU CAN JUST USE THIS TO YOU GOT IT. I'M ON MY LEASH. UH, THANK YOU FOR THIS OPPORTUNITY TO, UH, ADDRESS YOU TODAY. UH, WE'RE HERE FROM, UH, UH, SEDONA RESIDENCE UNITE. THAT'S, UH, CAROL BREEN, NANCY FRIEDMAN, UH, ANN KELLY, SEAN SMITH, AND I'M MARK 10 BROOKE. WHAT WE'D LIKE TO DO FIRST IS TALK ABOUT WHAT'S THE FUNDAMENTAL BASIS FOR THIS APPEAL, AND IT HAS TO DO WITH, UH, LAND USE, UH, IN THE SENSE OF PLACE. THE STRUCTURES AND THE PROPOSED LODGING AND ACCESSORY BUILDINGS ARE OUTTA SCALE OF THE RURAL CHARACTER FROM THE CFA VISION. UH, THE DEVELOPMENT ALSO GENERATES SIGNIFICANTLY MORE TRAFFIC COMPARED TO WHAT SINGLE FAMILY HOMES WOULD ENVIRONMENTALLY. UH, WE'RE LOOKING AT THE PROTECTION OF OAK CREEK AND WILDLIFE. THE DEVELOPMENT HAS OBVIOUS FLOOD, UH, RISKS, AND ALSO THE DEVELOPMENT DOES NOT PROTECT THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. THE DEVELOPMENT FUNDAMENTALLY IMPACTS THE ENVIRONMENTAL BIOME. SO AS BACKGROUND AS SHERRY, UH, CARRIE STATED THE ORIGINAL WAS ZONED RESIDENTIAL, AND WE'RE CONCERNED ABOUT ALLOWING HIGH DENSITY DEVELOPMENT THAT'S INCONSISTENT WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE CFA. SO THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE, UH, ZONING AREA, GO AHEAD. [00:30:03] OKAY. IS THIS ONE ON? YES. OKAY. SO THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE, UH, ZONING DISTRICT WAS ESTABLISHED AND THE IDEA WAS THAT THIS NEW DISTRICT WOULD ALLOW LODGING IN A DIFFERENT WAY, A SPECIAL NICHE THAT WOULD DIVERSIFY THE CITY'S LODGING AND INVENTORY WITH A SMALL, INTIMATE OPTION SUCH AS A COTTAGE OR CABIN THE PROPERTY'S OWNED. UH, OC THEN MUST TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION BOTH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THE SCHLEY CFA PLAN, WHICH IS UNIQUE COMPARED TO THE OTHER CFAS. SO THE BOTTOM LINE IS THE DEVELOPER MUST COMPLY WITH CONDITIONS OUTLINED IN THE CFA IN THE VISION OF THE CFA. THE KEY THINGS WE WANT TO FOCUS ON IS THE PRESERVATION OF THE OAK CREEK RIPARIAN CORRIDOR AND THE MODESTLY SCALED BUILDINGS. THE, UH, EXPECTATIONS OF THE CFA. AGAIN, WE WANT TO FOCUS ON, THEY WERE GOING AFTER RURAL CHARACTER, SOMETHING THAT WOULD GENERATE LESS TRAFFIC THAN PUTTING IN HOMES, WHICH WAS THE ORIGINAL ZONING AND PROTECTING THE RIPARIAN ENVIRONMENT ALONG OAK CREEK. THE FIRST PART OF OUR, UH, BASIS IS A SENSE OF PLACE, THE BEING OUT OF SCALE, AND THE FACT THAT WE'LL ACTUALLY GENERATE MORE TRAFFIC WITH THIS DESIGN THAN HAVING FAMILY HOMES. THIS IS FROM THE, UH, PLANNING GROUP, AND THEY CONCLUDED FOR TWO OF THE STRATEGIES THAT THE DEVELOPER WAS IN COMPLIANCE. UH, ONE OF THEM IS STYLE AND SCALE, AND THE OTHER ONE IS PRESERVING THE OPEN SPACE. UH, THIS PROJECT, IT SAYS IN HERE, PROJECT DESIGN IS COMPLIANCE WITH THE LDC REQUIREMENTS. THAT IS TRUE, BUT IT IS NOT IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE CFA, THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE. SO IT DOES NOT MEET THE STYLE AND SCALE EXPECTATIONS OF THE CFA, AND WE DON'T BELIEVE THE DESIGN THAT'S BEEN BROUGHT FORWARD PRESERVES OPEN SPACE. THE, UH, CFA IMPLEMENTATION, AGAIN, IF YOU READ THIS AND JUST CLOSE YOUR EYES AND READ THESE WORDS, INCLUDE A SMALL DESIGNER, HOTEL, HOTEL, BED, AND BREAKFAST INNS, COTTAGES, BUNGALOWS, INCLUDING CABINS, AND THE OTHER SIMILAR PERMANENT STRUCTURES. SO EVEN THE OTHER PERMANENT STRUCTURES SHOULD BE SMALL AND INTIMATE AND SWEET. THEY DIDN'T LEAVE IT TO OUR IMAGINATION. THEY GAVE US PICTURES, SIX BEAUTIFUL PICTURES OF WHAT A COTTAGE OR A CABIN LOOKS LIKE. NOW COMPARE THAT TO WHAT THE DEVELOPER IS BRINGING US HERE IS THEIR COTTAGE. THEY CALL IT A COTTAGE, BUT THIS IS ACTUALLY TO SCALE OF THE PICTURES THAT WERE IN THE CFA. THESE ARE HUGE BUILDINGS, TWO STORY BUILDINGS WITH ELEVATORS. I HAVEN'T BEEN IN A CABIN THAT HAD AN ELEVATOR. HERE'S THEIR LOBBY. AGAIN, LARGE BUILDINGS, GLASS, MASSIVE BUILDINGS, THEIR RESTAURANT HUGE. IT'S JUST NOT WHAT THE CFA INTENDED AS WE READ IT TOP DOWN, JUST THE SQUARE FOOTAGE IS JUST OVER THE TOP COVERING THE PROPERTY WITH BUILDINGS, AND HERE'S OUR ELEVATORS IN THE COTTAGES AND IN THE OTHER BUILDINGS. MARK DID SOME WONDERFUL ANALYSIS, WENT UP TO HOLES, CABINS, THAT HAS SOMETHING THAT REALLY RESEMBLES WHAT THE CFA DESCRIBES WITH THE SAME LAND AND DID THE CALCULATIONS. MY WONDERFUL ENGINEER FRIEND, WELL, LET ME EXPLAIN THIS A LITTLE BIT. THIS INCLUDES ALL THE SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THE DIFFERENT BUILDINGS ON THE DIFFERENT FLOORS. SO FOR THE, UH, PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT, WE HAVE SOMETHING ON THE ORDER OF SEVEN 2000 SQUARE FEET. AND THEN I'M JUST COMPARING THAT WITH OIL'S, CABINS, WHICH IS UP, UP THE CREEK A LITTLE BIT. IT HAS, UH, ON THE SAME AREA, 11 ACRES, THEY HAVE 18 CABINS AND IT AVERAGES OUT TO ABOUT 200, UH, SQUARE FEET PER BUILDING. SO, UH, LOMAE COTTAGES IS JUST, JUST UPSTREAM WITHIN THE CITY. HAD 17, UH, COTTAGES ON ABOUT SEVEN ACRES. AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE, UH, JUST THE COMPARISON OF THE SQUARE FOOTAGE, UH, THERE'S 21 TIMES AS MANY SQUARE FOOT UNDER THIS DEVELOPMENT COMPARED TO WHAT COTTAGES AND CABINS OR A SMALL INTIMATE DEVELOPMENT WOULD BE. UH, THE OTHER THING IS TRAFFIC AND CON AND CONGESTION. I HEARD AT A RECENT CANDIDATE, UH, FORUM THAT THE THREE BIGGEST THINGS THAT THEY WORRY ABOUT HERE ARE TRAFFIC, TRAFFIC AND TRAFFIC CLOSELY FOLLOWED BY EMPLOYMENT AND ALSO BY THE NEED FOR HOUSING FOR THAT EMPLOYMENT. UH, IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, THE GOAL IS TO GENERATE LESS TRAFFIC THAN MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL. SO THAT'S KIND OF THE, UH, THAT'S, THAT'S THE LANDMARK THAT WE'RE TRYING TO JUDGE THIS, UH, DEVELOPMENT AGAINST. SO TRAFFIC SOURCES, THEY HAVE 70 HOTEL ROOMS, UH, THAT ARE, THAT ARE PROPOSED RESTAURANT THAT WILL ALSO INCLUDE OUTSIDE CUSTOMERS. THERE'S EMPLOYEES THAT COME AND GO, UH, FROM THE HOTEL. [00:35:01] AND WE NOTED THE DEVELOPERS STATED THERE'D BE 60 EMPLOYEES WHEN RIGHT ACROSS THE CREEK IS, UH, URGH SIZE. THEY HAVE VALET, THEY HAVE A RESTAURANT, THEY HAVE 200 EMPLOYEES THAT'S REPORTED TO US DURING THE PARKING, SO I THINK THAT MIGHT BE A LOW BALL. THEY ALSO HAVE WEDDING GUESTS THAT'LL BE LODGED ELSEWHERE THAT ARE COMING HERE, CATERING TO WEDDING SUPPORT AND TRAFFIC FROM TOUR BUSINESSES. AND THE OTHER THING TO CONSIDER IS THAT LEY ROAD IS ON A LEVEL OF SERVICE F INTERSECTION WITH, UH, 1 79. SO WE NEED REALLY NEED TO CONSIDER EVACUATION OF THE FACILITY GIVEN THAT, UH, VALET PARKING LIMITS THE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE THAT CAN GO IN AND OUT. SO WE'VE ADDED UP ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE OF THIS TABLE, UH, WHAT A RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT LOOK LIKE. THERE'S ABOUT 6.7 ACRES THAT'S DEVELOPABLE. AND IF YOU GO IN WITH, UH, FOUR, UH, RESIDENTS PER HOME, THAT ENDS UP WITH A PEAK HOUR OF ABOUT 27.3. AND WHAT WE'RE USING IS THE, UH, INSTITUTE OF TRANSPORTATION ENGINEERS, WHICH IS A TYPICAL SOURCE USED FOR PEAK HOUR. AND WE'VE ESTIMATED THAT'S 27.3 PER HOUR ON A PEAK HOUR FOR A RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT. CABOTS AND COTTAGES, LIKE, UH, WE WOULD SEE FROM HOEL OR FROM CASA LOMAE WOULD BE SOMETHING LESS THAN THAT AT 15, 16 TRIPS PER HOUR. YOU LOOK AT THIS DEVELOPMENT AND WITH, UH, 70 ROOMS AND WHAT ITE SAYS ABOUT THAT, WE'D GET 61 TRIPS PER HOUR JUST OUT OF THAT. UH, THERE'S THE RESTAURANT AND WE'RE ASSUMING THAT 50% OF THE PEOPLE THAT ARE USING THAT WOULD COME FROM OUTSIDE. SO THAT'S ANOTHER 38. THERE'S THE EMPLOYEES AND I'M USING THEIR LOWER NUMBER OF 60, ASSUMING THAT HALF COME IN DURING THIS PEAK HOUR, IT'S ANOTHER SEVEN, THERE'S THE SHUTTLE THAT THEY'RE PLANNING ON RUNNING THAT'S GONNA GO IN AND OUT OF THE PROPERTY EVERY 15 MINUTES. THAT COMES OUT TO ANOTHER EIGHT TRIPS PER HOUR. THEN THERE'S ALSO WEDDING GUESTS THAT WOULD BE HOUSED OFFSITE. IF YOU ADD THAT ALL YOU ADD UP WITH 121 TRIPS PER HOUR, COMPARE THAT WITH THE RESIDENTIAL, AND YOU'RE FOUR AND A HALF TIMES AS LARGE. SO THAT'S A, A HUGE SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT THEY'RE PROPOSING AND WHAT SHOULD BE ALLOWED. SO THE SECOND, UH, APPEAL BASIS IS THE ENVIRONMENT AND PROTECTION OF OAK CREEK. WE SAY THAT EVERYWHERE WE NEED TO PROTECT OAK CREEK. IT'S A VALUABLE, IT'S VALUABLE FOR A LOT OF THINGS, UH, BUT THIS DEVELOPMENT HAS OBVIOUSLY FLOOD ISSUES. UH, IT DOES NOT PROTECT THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR AND IT'S FUNDAMENTALLY IMPACTS THE ENVIRONMENTAL BIOME THAT WE HAVE, UH, IN THE AREA. AND AGAIN, THIS IS THE PART OF THE, UH, STAFF EVALUATION. AND WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE STRATEGY IN TERMS OF THE ENVIRONMENT, UH, THE NUMBER ONE IS THAT IT MUST MAINTAIN OAK CREEK FLOODWAY IN A NATURAL STATE WITH ONLY MINOR IMPROVEMENTS TO THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. AND IN THE EVALUATION BY STAFF, IT TALKS ABOUT KEEPING DEVELOPMENT OUT OF THE FLOODWAY, BUT DOESN'T REALLY DISCUSS THE NATURAL STATE OF THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. SECONDLY, WE NEED TO PERMANENTLY PROTECT OAK CREEK FROM THE LAND USING LAND PRESERVATION MATTERS. AGAIN, WE THINK THIS DEVELOPMENT ONLY PARTIALLY ACHIEVES THAT. SO IN THE SN CFA, IT STATES ALL STRUCTURES ARE TO BE LOCATED OUTSIDE OF THE FLOODWAY AND THEY WILL PRESERVE THE CREEK'S NATURAL HABITAT, MAINTAIN THE STORMWATER FUNCTION, AND MINIMIZE FLOOD DAMAGE. SO HERE'S A DIAGRAM THAT COMES FROM THE DEVELOPER ITSELF, AND WHAT YOU SEE IS THE LARGE BLUE AREA ON TOP, AND THAT'S THE AREA THAT'S CALLED THE FLOODWAY. AND THAT'S FOR FLOOD PURPOSES. THAT'S WHERE THE HIGH VELOCITY WATERS THAT ARE EIGHT TO 12 FEET PER SECOND THAT TAKE PLACE DURING, DURING A FLOODING EVENT. THE BLUE AREA IN BETWEEN, UH, THE DARKER BLUE IS THE A HUNDRED YEAR FLOOD PLAIN. UH, THAT'S AN AREA WHERE THE VELOCITIES ARE LOWER, BUT IT'S ALSO AN AREA WHERE DEVELOPMENT, UH, CAN TAKE PLACE IF ELEVATED A FOOT ABOVE THE, UH, UH, THE A HUNDRED DEER FLOOD. AND THEN THE AREA BELOW IS THE 500 DEER FLOODPLAIN. UH, YOU CAN TELL THAT MANY OF THESE STRUCTURES ARE LINED UP ALONG THE FLOODWAY LINE, AN AREA THAT IS, UH, POTENTIALLY SUBJECT TO HIGH VELOCITIES. I JUST WANTED TO POINT OUT, UH, THAT RECENTLY THE, UH, THE FLOOD MAPS HAVE BEEN UPDATED FOR SEDONA AND THE COUNTY ON THE LEFT IS THE ORIGINAL, UH, FLOOD ZONES THAT WE HAD IN THE DARK BLUE AREA. ON THIS DIAGRAM ON THE LEFT IS THE FLOODWAY, AND YOU CAN SEE HOW IT EXTENDS ALL THE WAY TO SCH NIBLEY ROAD ON THE RIGHT. IT WAS UPDATED, IT'S VERY SIMILAR. THERE'S A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAIL, BUT IT ALSO EXTENDS ALL THE WAY TO SCHLEY ROAD. AND THE REASON, AND, AND WHAT WE'VE DONE IN THIS DIAGRAM IS WE SIMPLY POINTED OUT THE AREA THAT THIS DEVELOPMENT COVERS WITHIN THAT FLOODWAY AREA, THE FLOOD PLAINS, AND THE AREAS THAT ARE OUTSIDE OF THESE TWO OWNS. SO WHY IS THAT IMPORTANT? WELL, THIS DIAGRAM THAT WE HAVE ON THIS PAGE IS DIRECTLY OUT OF THE SCHNEIER CFA AND IT PROPOSES ONE SCENARIO FOR BUILDING, AND [00:40:01] IN THIS CASE, ALL OF THE STRUCTURES AND THE DARK, UH, BLACK STRUCTURES ARE THOSE THAT ARE NEW, ARE ALL OUTSIDE OF THE FLOODPLAIN. UH, THE GRAY STRUCTURES ARE EXISTING STRUCTURES THAT ARE OUT THERE THAT WOULD BE DEMOLISHED AS PART OF ANY DEVELOPMENT, MOST LIKELY. SO IN THIS CASE, THE SCH NIBLEY CFA, UH, INDICATED THAT THEY WOULDN'T DEVELOP ANYTHING WITHIN THE FLOODPLAIN. AND IN THIS CASE, THE DEVELOPER IS PROPOSING A WHOLE SERIES OF STRUCTURES LINED UP ALONG THE FLOODWAY THAT'S ALSO WITHIN THE FLOODPLAIN. SO WHAT WE'VE SHOWN IS THAT ORIGINAL DEVELOPMENT DIAGRAM FROM THE DEVELOPER AND SHOWN THE REVISED 2023 FLOODWAY LINE. AND IN THIS CASE, YOU CAN SEE THAT THEY'RE BOTH IN THE A HUNDRED YEAR FLOOD PLAIN AND THEY'RE ALSO IN THE LOWER LEFT HAND CORNER, HAVE A NUMBER OF STRUCTURES THAT ARE LOCATED WITHIN THE REVISED FLOODWAY FROM THE 2023 FLOOD MAPPING. SO WHY DO WE WORRY ABOUT FLOODING? UH, WELL, FIRST OF ALL, THE A HUNDRED YEAR FLOOD WHERE IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S, IT'S NEVER GONNA HAPPEN. WELL, THOSE THINGS DO HAPPEN. UH, WE HAD, WE HAVE LARGE, UH, FLOODS FROM TIME TO TIME, AND THE TWO INCIDENTS AT LABERGE IN, UH, THE EIGHTIES CAUSED SIGNIFICANT DAMAGE. UH, THEY ALSO HAD FLOODING LAST YEAR THAT CAUSED DAMAGE WITHIN LABERGE ACROSS THE CREEK. THE BREWER ROAD MOBILE HOME PARK WAS COMPLETELY WIPED OUT BY A, A HIGH WATER EVENT. K LOCKY POCKY FLOODED IN 2014 WITH CARS BEING, UH, MOVED ALL AROUND AND A LOT OF DAMAGE THAT TOOK PLACE. WITH CLIMATE CHANGE, THERE'S HIGHER INTENSITY STORMS, SO WE CAN EXPECT THAT TO HAPPEN. AND THEN BURN SCARS, LIKE WHAT HAPPENED UP IN, IN FLAGSTAFF, THEY'VE HAD SIGNIFICANT FLOODING. 'CAUSE YOU GET SIGNIFICANTLY MORE RUNOFF WITH THE SAME AMOUNT OF RAIN. THEY'RE, THEY'RE HAVING ALL SORTS OF PROBLEMS IN THE SUBDIVISION THAT SEE ON THE NEWS EVERY MONTH OR TWO IT SEEMS DURING, UH, THIS SEASON. SO I'M AN ENGINEER AND THIS IS ONE OF MY FAVORITE GRAPHS AND, AND WHAT IT SHOWS, IF YOU LOOK IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS, THERE'S THE 1 79 BRIDGE, AND THE WAY THAT BRIDGE IS DESIGNED IS TO PASS A HUNDRED YEAR STORM FLOOD EVENT. UH, BEYOND THAT, UH, IT REALLY CAN'T PASS THAT. SO, SO WHAT YOU SEE ON THE UPSTREAM SIDE TO THE RIGHT OF THAT LITTLE HUMP IS THE AREA AND THE DASHED BLUE LINE IS A HUNDRED YEAR FLOOD. IF YOU MODESTLY GO ABOVE THAT, THE FLOWS CANNOT BE PASSED BY THAT BRIDGE AS EFFECTIVELY AND VERY QUICKLY THE ELEVATIONS RISE. SO YOU'RE IN A, YOU'RE IN A SITUATION HERE WHERE IF YOU MODESTLY EXCEED THE A HUNDRED YEAR STORM, YOU ARE GONNA HAVE FLOODS THAT ARE ON THE ORDER OF SIX TO SEVEN FEET HIGHER IN THAT UPSTREAM AREA, HAPPENS TO BE WHERE THIS DEVELOPMENT IS LOCATED. JUST POINT THAT OUT BECAUSE I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT THE CITY IS NOT JUST, UH, YOU'RE NOT A POSITION TO JUST, UH, PREVENT DAMAGE TO STRUCTURES, BUT ALSO LOSS OF LIFE. UH, WE ALSO THINK THAT BECAUSE IT'S IN THE COMMUNITY PLAN, THERE'S VALUE IN PRESERVING THE RIPARIAN HABITAT. IT REPRESENTS ONLY ABOUT A HALF A PERCENT OF ARIZONA IN TOTAL. UH, BUT THE RIPARIAN HABITAT IS REALLY A STREAM OF LIFE AND IT'S FUNDAMENTAL SURVIVAL OF 60 TO 75% OF ARIZONA RESIDENT WILDLIFE SPECIES. IT'S CRITICAL FOR US TO PROTECT THAT UNIQUE HABITAT. SO WHAT DOES, WHAT DOES CFA SAY ABOUT THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR? IT DOESN'T DIRECTLY DEFINE IT. I THINK PLANNING DEFINED THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR AS THE FLOODWAY, AND THAT'S NOT WHAT IT IS. IT REALLY, UH, EXTENDS BEYOND THAT. UH, WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS MAINTAIN THE FLOODWAY IN THE NATURAL STATE WITH MINOR IMPROVEMENTS ONLY IN THIS QUARTER. SO THIS DIAGRAM SHOWS, UH, MAYBE NOT PERFECTLY, BUT IT SHOWS HOW IT EXTENDS BEYOND THE AREAS THAT ARE GONNA BE FLOODED UP INTO AREAS THAT ARE IMPACTED BY THE GROUNDWATER. SO ANY VEGETATION THAT'S IMPACTED BY OR IS USED BY THE PLANT LIFE IS PART OF THIS RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. THIS IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE. IT COMES OUTTA THE SCHS NIBLEY, UH, CFA AND IT SHOWS A MAP ALL THE WAY OVER TO SCH NIBLEY HILL ROAD. YOU SEE A DIFFERENT TYPE OF TREE IN THE FOREGROUND. THOSE ARE ALL DECIDUOUS TREES THAT ARE DEPENDENT ON GROUNDWATER. BEYOND THAT, YOU SEE THE REST OF, UH, THE COCONINO FOREST, WHICH IS THE UPLAND JUNIPER PIN FOREST. IT'S VERY DIFFERENT. IT'S NOT DEPENDENT ON GROUNDWATER. SO WHY IS IT IMPORTANT FOR THIS RIPARIAN HABITAT? ALL THE REASONS WE TALKED ABOUT. SO IN SUMMARY, UH, THERE ARE MULTIPLE STRUCTURES WITHIN THIS DEVELOPMENT THAT ARE PROPOSED IN THE FLOODWAY AND THE A HUNDRED YEAR FLOODPLAIN. THE GRADING PLAN THAT WE SAW REALLY REMOVES ALL THE SOILS AND VERY LITTLE IS REMAINING IN THE RIPARIAN HABITAT. WE'RE GONNA HAVE A VERY MANICURED NON-NATURAL STATE ALONG THE CREEK IN AN AREA THAT REALLY CAN'T ALLOW THAT. THE STRUCTURES ARE LINED UP ALONG THE FLOODWAY BOUNDARY, WHICH IS NICE FOR THOSE PEOPLE VIEWING THE CREEK, BUT IS ALSO IN NOT A VERY SAFE POSITION. SO WE ALSO, UH, THINK THAT THE EXISTING ECOLOGY OF THE PROPERTY WILL BE COMPLETELY ALTERED, WHICH IS NOT SOMETHING [00:45:01] THAT'S CONSISTENT WITH OUR COMMUNITY PLAN. SO HERE'S A FUNDAMENTAL BASIS OF OUR APPEAL. I WON'T READ IT TO YOU AGAIN. WHAT WE ASK IS PLEASE DENY THE P AND Z APPROVAL AND ADVISE THE DEVELOPER TO GO BACK AND DESIGN CONSISTENT WITH THE CFA SINGLE STORY. MODEST STRUCTURES DELIVER A DEVELOPMENT DESIGN THAT'S LESS TRAFFIC THAN MEDIUM DENSITY. SINGLE FAMILY CHANGE THE DESIGN TO MOVE STRUCTURES ENTIRELY OUT OF THE FLOODWAY TO PRESERVE THE CREEK'S NATURAL HABITAT AND REDUCE THE TOTAL NUMBER OF STRUCTURES TO PROVIDE MORE OPEN SPACE AND CREEK ACCESS. THIS IS WHAT WE THINK THE DEVELOPMENT AREA SHOULD LOOK LIKE. THE, THE YELLOW, WHICH WHEN IT GETS ONTO THE GREEN, TURNS INTO LIKE A LIME GREEN. SO THAT AREA IS WHERE WE LEAVE A WILDLIFE CORRIDOR AND WE LEAVE ROOM TO, UH, FOR THE RIPARIAN HABITAT. WE, WE ALSO MIGHT SUGGEST THAT UH, IF THE DEVELOPER WERE TO MAKE THIS INTO A PLANNED DEVELOPMENT, UH, THEY COULD LOCATE ALL OF THE STRUCTURES COMPLETELY OUT OF BOTH THE 100 DEER AND 500 DEER FLOODPLAIN AND DEVELOP THE AREA THAT'S IN THE TRUE YELLOW AREA AND ALLOW THE OTHER AREAS TO BE REWILD SO THAT THIS WOULD TURN INTO THE TYPE OF HABITAT THAT WE DON'T HAVE MUCH OF WITHIN ARIZONA AND WOULD HELP, UH, PROVIDE, UH, MORE CO COVER, UH, FOR WILDLIFE AND ALSO WOULD PROVIDE A MORE NATURAL SETTING SOMETHING THAT, UH, SEDONA DOES NOT HAVE MUCH WITHIN, UH, WITHIN ITS BOUNDARIES. THANK YOU. OKAY, THANK YOU. UH, AS OF COURSE OF PROCEDURE, DO YOU WANT TO ASK QUESTIONS NOW FOR THIS GROUP? WE'LL WAIT, UH, HAVE THE SECOND GROUP AND GO TO THE END AND THEN ASK QUESTION WHAT ARE YOU POINTING TO IT? KURT WANTS THIS. YEAH. MAY MAYOR AND COUNSEL THE PROCEDURES. THEY, I MEAN THEY DO HAVE TWO MINUTES LEFT SO YOU CAN ASK TWO MINUTES LEFT RIGHT NOW. BUT THE PRIMARILY, UH, MOST OF THE QUESTIONS WILL BE AT THE VERY END, AT THE VERY END. I JUST WANTED TO BE SURE. UH, A AFTER THE, SO ALRIGHT, WHAT, ANY QUESTIONS NOW DO YOU WANNA, UH, BRIAN, JUST ONE QUICK ONE. CAN YOU GO BACK TO, GO BACK ONE SLIDE AND JUST CLARIFY AGAIN YOUR RECOMMENDATION OF A DEVELOPMENT AREA IS THE YELLOW AND THAT GREEN YES. OR JUST THE YELLOW? YEAH, I MEAN WHAT WE'RE THINKING IS THAT AT A MINIMUM THAT WOULD HELP TO, UH, GET THE DEVELOPMENT OUT OF AN AREA WHERE THERE'S A HIGH POTENTIAL FOR LOSS OF LIFE AND PROPERTY. UH, THE FURTHER OUTSIDE OF THE FLOODPLAIN THAT YOU MOVE, THE BETTER OFF YOU ARE. FOR MANY YEARS WE'VE STRUGGLED IN THIS COUNTRY WITH PEOPLE BUILDING IN THE FLOODPLAIN, GETTING FLOODED, LOTS OF DAMAGE AND WHAT WE THINK IS THE MORE PRUDENT THING TO DO FOR LOSS OF LIFE AND UH, AND UH, LIFE AND UH, PROPERTY IS TO MOVE OUT OF THOSE ZONES AND ACCEPT THE FACT THAT UH, THE STREAM NEEDS TO EXPAND PERIODICALLY AND IT NEEDS TO ALSO OPERATE DIFFERENTLY THAN TRYING TO MANICURE IT AND MAKE IT INTO A, UH, A NON-NATURAL AREA SO THAT IT ACTUALLY IS A RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. OKAY, THANK YOU. THANK YOU MAYOR. COUNCIL ELLA, THE CFA ON PAGE 13 IN STRATEGY ONE DOES STATE, UM, THE MINOR IMPROVEMENTS WITHIN THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. UH, YOU ARE ASSERTING THAT THE DEVELOPMENT PROPOSAL IS BEYOND MINOR. CAN YOU JUST SPECIFY WHAT THOSE ARE PLEASE? IF, IF YOU LOOK AT THAT SENTENCE IT, BECAUSE WE HAVE IT IN HERE, IT SAYS, UM, LEMME GET BACK TO IT. WHERE WAS IT? IT SAYS MAINTAIN THE OAK CREEK FLOODWAY IN A NATURAL STATE. SO THAT MEANS THE FLOODWAY SHOULD BE UNTOUCHED WITH ONLY MINOR IMPROVEMENTS WITHIN THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. SO MY UNDERSTANDING OF ENGLISH, THAT IMPLIES THAT THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR IS AT LEAST IN THE A HUNDRED YEAR FLOOD SECTION BECAUSE YOU CAN, YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING TO THE FLOODWAY AND YOU CAN DO MINOR THINGS TO THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. OKAY. DID I ANSWER YOUR QUESTION? NO. OKAY. SO, UH, WE'LL STOP THIS, THESE QUESTIONS NOW SINCE WE'VE USED UP THEIR TIME. WE'RE GOING TO ASK YOU TO STAND DOWN AND WE'LL, WE'LL ASK THE NEXT GROUP. THAT WOULD BE, UM, LAUREN THOMAS AND KRISTEN WAGNER TO COME UP. OKAY. LET ME SWITCH OVER TO YOUR PRESENTATION. THANK YOU. I CAME FROM HERE. YES, THANK YOU. OKAY. OKAY. THANK YOU. YOU PLEASE GIMME A CALL. THANK YOU. [00:50:03] YOU WANT SOME WATER? OKAY. ALRIGHT. HELLO, I'M LAUREN THOMAS. UM, OBVIOUSLY ONE OF THE APPELLANTS AND WE'RE HERE TO DISCUSS THE, UM, PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION APPROVAL OF CASE PZ 2 3 0 0 4. UM, THIS VERY COUNCIL HAS SUBMITTED MULTIPLE RESOLUTIONS ACKNOWLEDGING THE PEOPLE OF SEDONA DON'T WANT MORE HOTELS, AND AS SUCH HAVE REMOVED IT FROM TWO OF THE THREE CFAS THAT HAD LODGING AS AN ALLOWED USE. THEY HAVE SUBMITTED A RESOLUTION ASKING CONGRESS TO DECLARE THIS A WILD AND SCENIC RIVER. YET HERE WE ARE TODAY TO PLEAD OUR CASE AS TO WHY THIS DEVELOPMENT ISN'T RIGHT FOR SEDONA. AT THIS SCALE, WE NEED TO PRESERVE AND PROTECT, NOT KEEP DEVELOPING. UM, LDC EIGHT THREE E LAYS OUT THE APPROVAL CRITERIA FOR DEVELOPMENT APPLICATIONS. THE ONES HIGHLIGHTED ARE THE ONES THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE DISCUSSING IN MORE DETAIL TODAY. FOR CONTEXT WITH ALL OF THE SLIDES, UM, IT STARTS WITH THE CODE LANGUAGE AND THEN THE STAFF REPORTS, UM, EVALUATION AND WE'VE ADDED SOME BOLD EMPHASIS FOR THE WORDS THAT WE THINK HAVE SUFFICIENT MEANING. SO THE, FOR ITEM C, IT SAYS THAT IT SHALL BE CONSISTENT WITH AND CONFORM TO THE SEDONA COMMUNITY PLAN, COMMUNITY FOCUSED AREA PLANS AND ANY OTHER APPLICABLE PLANS. WE UNDERSTAND THAT UM, MODIFY MODIFICATIONS CAN BE MADE IF IT PROVIDES A PUBLIC BENEFIT, BUT GENERALLY SPEAKING IT SHOULD MEET THOSE GOALS. SO THE COMMUNITY PLAN STATES A NEED FOR RESIDENTIAL HOUSING AND AS I STATED EARLIER, THIS COUNCIL REMOVED LODGING FROM TWO OF THE THREE CFAS THAT HAD LODGING. UM, IN THOSE RESOLUTIONS IT STATED THAT SHORT, UH, 3,829 TOTAL ROOMS AND SHORT-TERM RENTALS HAVE BEEN ADDED IN THE SEDONA AREA AND THAT THERE IS A NEED OF 1500 HOUSEHOLDS FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND THAT THE, UH, REQUEST ACTION OF THE NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES OF INCREASED TOURISM, INCLUDING IMPACTS ON HOUSING AFFORDABILITY AND AVAILABILITY. RESIDENTS HAVE EXPRESSED STRONG OPPOSITION TO ADDING HOTEL ROOMS. RESIDENTIAL LAND USES ARE LESS IMPACTFUL TO THE ENVIRONMENT THAN TRANSIENT VISITORS. PEOPLE THAT LIVE HERE WANT TO PROTECT WHAT THEY HAVE AND THEY WANT TO TAKE CARE OF WHERE THEY LIVE. VISITORS COME AND GO AND IT'S NOT ANY SKIN OFF OF THEIR BACK. ADDITIONALLY, ONE OF THE COMMUNITY EXPECTATIONS FOR THE SIBLEY HILLS CFA IS THAT IT SUPPORTS NON-RESIDENTIAL USES IF TIED TO THE PRESERVATION OF LONG, LARGE LAND AREAS AND GENERATES LAST TRAFFIC, THE MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL. IT ALSO CALLS FOR PROTECTION OF THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR, WHICH THE OTHER PEOPLE HAVE JUST GONE OVER IN DETAIL. HOWEVER, IN THE TRAFFIC ANALYSIS THAT WAS SUBMITTED AS PART OF THE DEVELOPER'S APPLICATION, THEY CAME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT THE HOTEL DID IN FACT MEET THAT. HOWEVER, WHEN THEY DID THEIR CALCULATIONS, THEY DID THE CALCULATION OF EIGHT HOMES PER ACRE WHEN THE ACTUAL CALCULATION THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN PERFORMED IS FOUR HOUSES PER ACRE. WHEN YOU APPLY THE RIGHT CALCULATION THROUGH, YOU FIND OUT THAT THE HOTEL ACTUALLY DOES CREATE MORE TRAFFIC THAN SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL, THEREFORE VIOLATING CFA. ADDITIONALLY, IT CALLS FOR PROTECTION OF THE OAK CREEK OR RIPERIAN CORRIDOR AND STATES TO LEAVE IT IN A NATURAL STATE. NATURAL, UM, DEFINITION IS A WILD PRIMITIVE STATE UNTOUCHED BY CIVILIZATION. ALSO, AS THE OTHER PEOPLE HAVE JUST MENTIONED, THERE'S VERY LITTLE AREAS OF LIKE THIS IN ARIZONA AND ALL OF THE SOUTHWESTERN UNITED STATES. SO IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO PRESERVE FROM THE DEVELOPER'S DRAWING, IT APPEARS AT LEAST THAT THIS IS A SUPPORT PILLAR AND FLOODWAY, THIS IS NOT A MINOR IMPROVEMENT AND THEREFORE IT CONFLICTS A STAFF REPORT. ADDITIONALLY, ALL OF THESE TREES HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW ARE BEING CALLED FOR REMOVAL. WHILE MOST OF THE TREES ARE NOT IN A HEALTHY STATE, NATURE TAKES CARE OF ITSELF. IT GETS RID OF THE TREES AND IT BURS IN ITSELF OUT THROUGH FLOOD EVENTS AND EVERYTHING ELSE. ADDITIONALLY, THESE TREES HELP KEEP THE GROUND TOGETHER SO WHEN THERE IS FLOODING EVENTS, THERE'S NOT AS MUCH EROSION. ALSO, THE REMOVAL OF STRUCTURES FROM THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR, YOU CAN'T DO THAT WITHOUT TAKING HEAVY MACHINERY BACK THERE. THEREFORE IT IS QUESTIONABLE IF IT WILL OR WON'T DAMAGE THE AREA. MOVING TO SECTION D, UM, WE'VE PRESENTED OBVIOUSLY THROUGH OUR APPEAL AND THROUGH HERE TODAY MULTIPLE WAYS THAT WE DON'T FEEL THAT IT APPEALS. BUT WHAT ARE SOME OTHER ONES? UM, ACCORDING TO COCONINO COUNTY, THE ACREAGE FOR THIS AREA IS 11.41 ACRES. WHEN YOU DO THE IMPERVIOUS COVERAGE WITH THAT ACREAGE, THIS PROPOSAL VIOLATES IT BY OVER 2000 ACRES. SO AS YOU CAN SEE IN THE CALCULATION HERE, [00:55:01] UM, WHEN YOU TAKE 11.41 ACRES AND YOU FIND OUT SQUARE FOOTAGE, IT'S 4,970,000 SQUARE FEET. TAKE IT OUT BY 30% AND YOU CAN SEE THE ALLOWED WHEN YOU COMPARE THAT TO THEIR DEVELOPMENT, IT EXCEEDS. AND THEN IN THE CORNER THERE IS THE ACREAGE AS DOCUMENTED BY COCONINO COUNTY ALSO FOR PARKING. WHILE THE REPORT DOES SAY THAT IT'S, UH, ANALYSIS WAS UH, SUBMITTED AND ACCEPTED AND IT'S UP TO THE DISCRETION, IT DOESN'T STATE WHAT THE ANALYSIS SAID. THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE CALLS FOR 204 PARKING SPOTS FOR THE SORRY, PER THE DEVELOPER'S OWN DOCUMENTS. THEY ARE PROVIDING 90 WITH A MAX NEED OF 87 SIP WATER. WHILE WE ALL KNOW THAT WE ALREADY HAVE PARKING ISSUES IN SEDONA, HENCE BUILDING MORE PARKING GARAGES. THIS REDUCTION OF LESS THAN HALF WHAT THE CODE CALLS FOR DOESN'T SEEM TO BE CONSISTENT WITH THE SCALE IN SIZE OF ALL THE BUILDINGS AND ACCESSORY USES THEY HAVE. ADDITIONALLY, IT STATES IN MULTIPLE PLACES IN THE REPORT THAT THE FIRE DEPARTMENT DID REVIEW THIS, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT REVIEWED A CONCEPTUAL SUBMITTAL FROM 2021 AND IS YET TO REVIEW A SUBMITTAL FROM THE COMPREHENSIVE. ALSO, WHEN THAT REVIEW WAS PERFORMED, IT WAS PERFORMED AGAINST OLD CODE. IT WAS PERFORMED AGAINST THE 2012 INTERNATIONAL FIRE CODE, NOT THE CURRENT 2018 INTERNATIONAL WILDLAND, URBAN FA URBAN INTERFACE CODE. UM, ALSO THERE'S BEEN SIGNIFICANT CHANGES IN THE DESIGN SINCE THEN. THEREFORE WE FEEL IT SHOULD BE REVIEWED AGAIN AGAINST THE ACCURATE CODE AS IT IS TODAY. NEXT, UM, THE TRAFFIC CODE, UH, SORRY, THE TRAFFIC INPUT STUDY DOES NOT COMPLY WITH THE STON CITY CODE SECTION 14 10 0 7 0. THAT STATES WHERE A STATE HIGHWAY IS INVOLVED APPROVAL BY THE DISTRICT ENGINEER IN THE ASSISTANT STATE ENGINEER. THE TRAFFIC ENGINEERING SECTION A OT SHALL BE OBTAINED BY THE DEVELOPER PRIOR TO CONSIDERATION BY THE CITY. THE ONLY WAY TO ACCESS SNUBBY HILL ROAD IS VIA THE 1 79 A STATE HIGHWAY. THE NEXT SECTION IS ACCESSORY USES, UM, PER THE OC DISTRICT AND PER SNUBBY HILL CFA. THESE ARE THE ALLOWED LIST OF ACCESSORY USES. HOWEVER, WHEN YOU LOOK AT LDC 3.2, IT SHOWS MEETING SPACES AND AS AN ACCESSORY USE, BUT NEITHER THE OC OR THE SIBLEY CFA CALL FOR THAT TO BE ALLOWED. MEETING SPACES IS ONLY DEFINED IN THE SEDONA LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE UNDER 9.4, WHICH IS PUBLIC, INSTITUTIONAL AND CIVIC USES, WHICH STATES THAT THEY'RE TO PROVIDE A SERVICE TO THE PUBLIC IN TWO OF THE DEVELOPERS' DOCUMENTS. THE USE OF THE MEETING SPACE IS SUGGESTED FOR WEDDING USE AND IT ALSO IS SUGGESTED AS BUSINESS RETREATS. BOTH WEDDINGS AND RETREATS ARE IDENTIFIED IN 9.4 G AS SPECIAL EVENTS IN 3.5 E FOUR. IT SPECIFIES HOW OFTEN YOU CAN HAVE THOSE SPECIAL EVENTS. THEY CAN OCCUR 10 SPECIAL EVENTS A YEAR, LASTING A MAX OF THREE DAYS, AND THERE HAS TO BE 10 DAYS ELAPSED IN BETWEEN. CURRENTLY THE OTHER RESORTS THAT ARE ON THE CREEK ARE ABSOLUTELY NOT FOLLOWING THIS. SO WE ARE CURIOUS AS TO HOW THIS WILL BE FOLLOWED AND IF THIS IS A PROPER ACCESSORY USE. MOVING ON TO IMPACTS OF SURROUNDING PROPERTY OWNERS. IF IT DIDN'T IMPACT US, WE WOULDN'T BE HERE TODAY. BEAR WALLOW AND SNUBBY HILL ARE THE ONLY WAY FOR US TO LEAVE OUR HOMES. TRAFFIC CONGESTION CAUSED BY THIS DEVELOPMENT WILL IMPACT OUR ABILITY TO GET OUT AND GET INTO OUR HOMES IF THERE WERE TO BE AN EMERGENCY. IT WILL ALSO IMPACT OUR ABILITY TO GET THAT HELP. DISRUPTIONS DUE TO CONSTRUCTION ALSO WILL IMPACT US AS WELL AS INCREASING TRESPASSING THAT WE DEAL WITH EVERY DAY. NEXT IS, UH, MINIMIZING ADVERSE IMPACTS OR ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS. UM, NO ENVIRONMENTAL STUDY HAS BEEN DONE TO SAY WHETHER THIS WILL OR WILL NOT IMPACT THE ENVIRONMENT AND IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO KNOW, AND IT'S NEVER BEEN MENTIONED THAT THIS AREA IS DESIGNATED CRITICAL HABITAT OF TWO THREATENED SPECIES BY THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT. AS YOU CAN SEE ON THE SCREEN, THE CENTER PART IS THE CRITICAL HABITAT FOR THE UM, NARROW HEADED GARTER SNAKE. AND THE INSIDE PIECE IS FOR THE YELLOW BUILD. COCO. IF YOU LOOK AT THAT JUST OVER THE PARCEL MAP AS IT IS PROVIDED BY THE UNITED STATES [01:00:01] FISH AND WILDLIFE SERVICES, YOU CAN SEE THAT A LARGE AMOUNT OF THESE AREAS ARE PART OF THE CRITICALLY HABITAT, UM, PROTECTED THROUGH THAT ACT. SOME IMPORTANT NOTES THAT ARE MENTIONED IN THERE IS THAT THIS AREA CONTAINS THE LOWER OAK CREEK IMPORTANT BIRD AREA WHERE THE WESTERN YELLOW BUILD CUCKOOS ARE IDENTIFIED AS A BREEDING BIRD AND THAT EVERYTHING NEEDS TO BE DONE POSSIBLE TO PROTECT THE SNAKE FOR THE BOTH PHYSICAL, PHYSICAL OR BIOLOGICAL FEATURES. IF YOU LOOK AT THAT OVERLAID OF THE DEVELOPER'S MAP, THOSE TREES THAT I MENTIONED EARLIER, THAT'S WHERE THAT BIRD BREEDS. SO TAKING DOWN THOSE TREES CAN AND WILL IMPACT THE ABILITY OF THAT BIRD TO BREATHE. SO WITHOUT TALKING TO THAT GROUP, HOW IS IT KNOWN THAT IT WON'T CAUSE A SIGNIFICANT IMPACT? NEX IS COMPLIANCE WITH UTILITY SERVICE AND IMPROVEMENT STANDARDS. IT SAYS IT SHALL COMPLY WITH FEDERAL, STATE COUNTY SERVICE DISTRICT'S, CITY AND OTHER REGULATORY AUTHORITY STANDARDS. LACK OF REVIEW DOES NOT EQUAL COMPLIANCE. THE STAFF REPORTS STATES THAT THREE AGENCIES PROVIDED COMMENTS. THE CITY OF SEDONA COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT, THE CITY OF SEDONA PUBLIC WORKS AND THE CITY OF SEDONA SUSTAINABILITY PROGRAM. WE ARE WONDERING IF SOME OF THESE OTHER AGENCIES HAVE REVIEWED, FOR INSTANCE, COCONINO FLOOD CONTROL SINCE THEY WERE, UM, MADE THE FLOODPLAIN MANAGEMENT THROUGH RECENT RESOLUTION, THE DEPARTMENT OF INTERIOR FISH AND WILDLIFE SERVICE TO SEE HOW THIS DEVELOPMENT IMPACTS BOTH THE SNAKE AND THE BIRD AND COCONINO COUNTY SINCE THERE'S AN INTERGOVERNMENTAL AGREEMENT FOR FIGURING OUT AN EVACUATION PLAN FOR SEDONA AND COCONINO COUNTY, WHICH DIRECTLY IMPACTS US. UM, NEXT IS, UH, PROVIDES ADEQUATE ROAD SYSTEMS AND TRAFFIC MITIGATION. EVERYONE KNOWS SEDONA HAS TRAFFIC PROBLEMS. WE ARE NOT, UH, ASSUMING THAT THE LEVEL OF SERVICE F IS GONNA GET FIXED IN A DAY. HOWEVER, THE CONTRIBUTOR FROM MOST I GUESS DISCUSSIONS IS THAT THE CROSSWALK IS WHAT MAKES THAT LEVEL OF SERVICE SO BAD. THIS DEVELOPMENT IS GONNA PROPOSE A CROSSWALK ON SNUBBY HILL ROAD IN FRONT OF THEIR DEVELOPMENT. NO ONE HAS LOOKED INTO WHAT THAT CROSSWALK MIGHT DO TO BACKING TRAFFIC UP INTO THE ROUNDABOUT. THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT ARE ALSO DRIVING ON THAT ROAD WITH TRAILERS THAT ARE VERY LONG AND TRUCKS THAT ARE TOWING THEM. ALL IT TAKES IS A COUPLE PEOPLE TO WALK, CREATE A BACKUP AND WE WILL HAVE EVEN WORSE TRAFFIC AT THAT SAME ROUNDABOUT. ADDITIONALLY, SINCE THE FIRE DEPARTMENT HASN'T REVIEWED IT AGAINST THE UPDATED CODE, THERE'S NO SHOWING THAT IT HAS ENOUGH WATER PRESSURE TO MEET THE NEEDS TO PUT OUT THE FIRES AND THAT WE WILL BE ABLE TO GET OUT IN THE TERM WHEN THERE IS AN EMERGENCY EVENT. IF YOU LOOK AT ANY OF THE ADDRESSES IN THIS AREA ON REALTOR.COM, THEY HAVE NINE OUTTA 10 FOR FLOOD RATINGS AND NINE OUTTA 10 FOR FIRE RATINGS. PEOPLE NEED TO BE ABLE TO GET OUT OF THEIR HOMES AND WE NEED TO BE THOUGHT ABOUT WHEN DEVELOPMENTS LIKE THIS ARE HAPPENING AND THERE'S NO SHOWING THAT OUR EVACUATION HAS EVER BEEN TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION. NEXT IS PROVIDE ADEQUATE PUBLIC SERVICES AND FACILITIES. SO THE STAFF BELIEVES THAT THERE'S ADEQUATE PUBLIC FACILITIES, BUT WE HAVE SOME QUESTIONS THAT MAKE IT SEEM AS IF THEY DON'T. ON THE LEFT IS THE LETTER THAT WAS USED AS THE WILL SERVE LETTER FROM THE GAS COMPANY AND IT'S FROM FEBRUARY OF 2021. IN AUGUST OF 2021, THE GAS COMPANY SAID THAT THEY COULD NOT PROVIDE A WILL SERVE LETTER BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T KNOW THE AMOUNT OF GAS THAT WAS GOING TO BE USED. THIS IS MONTHS AFTER THE LETTER THAT THEY'RE USING FOR THE WILL SERVE LETTER. ADDITIONALLY, THE ARIZONA WATER COMPANY WAS ASKED IF THEY WOULD PROVIDE WATER. THEY STATE, YEAH, IT'S IN OUR AREA AND WE WILL PROVIDE IT, BUT THERE'S NO TELLING OF HOW MUCH WATER IS BEING ASKED FROM THEM. IF YOU LOOK AT THE DEVELOPER'S ESTIMATED WATER DEMAND LETTER, IT STATES THAT THERE'S A MAX OF 21,600 GALLONS A DAY. THIS IS SEEMING TO ACCOUNT FOR THE 70 ROOMS AND 300 GALLONS PER ROOM. IT LEAVES OUT THE RESTAURANT MEETING, FACILITIES, LAUNDRY, EVERYTHING ELSE THAT GOES WITH HAVING A RESORT. UM, AND INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, IF YOU LOOK AT THE PRELIMINARY WASTE WATER REPORT, IT STATES THAT THE MAX FLUSHABLE WATER IS 31,716 GALLONS. SO THEY'RE GOING TO FLUSH 10,000 MORE GALLONS A DAY THAN THEIR MAX USE. I WANNA CLOSE OUT WITH SOME LYRICS THAT ARE IMPACTFUL HERE BY, UH, JONI MITCHELL AND BIG YELLOW TAXI. THEY PAVE PARADISE TO PUT UP A PARKING LOT WITH PINK HOTEL, A BOUTIQUE IN A SWINGING HOTSPOT. DON'T IT ALWAYS SEEM TO GO THAT YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'VE GOT TILL IT'S GONE. THEY PAVE PARADISE AND PUT UP A PARKING LOT. [01:05:05] THANK YOU, LAUREN. THANK YOU, COUNSEL. SO THAT WAS SOME OF THE, UM, MANY OF THE SUBSTANTIVE, UM, ARGUMENTS BOTH FACTUALLY AND LEGALLY, UM, THAT WERE PRESENTED BY THE DEVELOPER AND THE DEVELOPMENT, UM, DEPARTMENT IN, IN SUPPORT OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION'S DECISION. UM, BUT I WANNA JUMP TO PROCEDURAL, UM, YOUR PROCEDURE AS I'M HEARING IT TODAY. I'M, I'M, I'M TROUBLED BY THE, UH, DEVELOPER BEING ABLE TO COME AND PRESENT TO YOU AGAIN TODAY. I, I BELIEVE THAT THAT IS A CONFLICT OF YOUR RULES OF PROCEDURE AND, UH, CONFLICTS WITH THE, UM, WITH THE APPEAL, THE, UH, APPEAL CODE SECTION OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE. I, I EXCHANGED SOME CORRESPONDENCE WITH THE CITY ATTORNEY ABOUT THIS. UM, HE HAD ALLUDED TO THE FACT THAT THE DEVELOPER COULD, AGAIN, COME AND, UH, PRESENT THEIR CASE TO YOU. THAT'S NOT HOW WE READ THE RULES OF PROCEDURE. THE CITY ATTORNEY DID ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION WAS THE DECISION MAKER. UM, AND THAT'S THE DECISION THAT WE ARE APPEALING UNDER YOUR RULES OF PROCEDURE Q4 AT PAGE 16, IT SAYS IF THE ITEM BEFORE THE CITY COUNCIL CONCERNS AN APPEAL OF A PLANNING AND ZONING ISSUE, THE APPEALING PARTY, WHICH IS US, AND THE, AND THE PARTY DEFENDING THE PRIOR DECISION, WILL EACH BE GIVEN 20 MINUTES. THE PARTY DEFENDING THE PRIOR DECISION IS THE PLANNING COMMISSION. SO THAT'S THE PARTY THAT SHOULD BE COMING UP HERE AND DEFENDING THAT ACTION, GENERALLY SPEAKING. UH, AND YEAH, GENERALLY SPEAKING, THE APPEALING PARTY IN MOST INSTANCES IS A DEVELOPER APPEALING A DENIAL OF A PLANNING COM, OF A PLANNING COMMISSION DECISION. IN THIS CASE, AT THE PLANNING COMMISSION LEVEL, IN, IN THIS CASE, WE ARE AFFECTED RESIDENTS AND THE PARTY DEFENDING THE DECISION. IS THE PLANNING COMMISSION THROUGH SOMEONE IN THE CITY AGENCY DEFENDING THAT DECISION? WHY DID THEY MAKE THOSE DECISIONS THAT THEY MADE? WHY DO THEY THINK IT'S COMPLIANT WITH THE COMMUNITY PLAN AND THE COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA PLAN AND THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND ALL THE REST OF THE CODES? UM, IT'S VERY CONCERNING TO THINK THAT THE DEVELOPER'S GONNA BE ABLE TO COME UP HERE AGAIN, ESPECIALLY IF THEY'RE, IF THEY'RE INTENDING TO PROVIDE NEW INFORMATION TO YOU. THEY HAD THEIR, THEY HAD THEIR BITE AT THE APPLE. THEY APPLIED, THEY SUBMITTED THEIR DEVELOPMENT APPLICATION, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY SHOULD BE REVIEWED ON. IF THEY, IF THEY, UH, AND SO I'M CONCERNED THAT THEIR WHOLE ARMY OF PEOPLE HERE IS GONNA PRESENT TO YOU NEW INFORMATION THAT WE'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO CHALLENGE. SO IF THEY THINK THAT THEY HAVE NEW INFORMATION, AND IF THEY THINK THEIR PROJECT IS GOOD FOR THIS LOCATION, THEN THEY SHOULD RESUBMIT THEIR APPLICATION. THERE SHOULD BE NO NEW INFORMATION COMING IN FROM THE DEVELOPER AT THIS HEARING TODAY. IT, IT'S A CLOSED RECORD. IT'S BASED ON WHAT THEY SUBMITTED TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND WHAT THE DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT REVIEWED IN PREPARING THEIR FINDINGS AND SUBMITTING THEIR RECOMMENDATIONS WITH THAT. UM, ANYTHING ELSE? LET'S SEE. I THINK WE'LL BE DONE AND, AND, UH, LOOK FORWARD TO COMING BACK WITH OUR REBUTTAL COMMENTS. OKAY. WHILE WE HAVE A MINUTE AND 15 SECONDS, DO WE HAVE A QUESTION? I HAVE A QUESTION FOR OUR LEGAL COUNSEL. OKAY. UM, WHICH IS, UH, TWO QUESTIONS ACTUALLY. ONE IS REGARDING THE ASSERTION THAT THERE'S A CONFLICT OF THE RULES OF PROCEDURE BY HAVING TO DEVELOP DEVELOPER PRESENT INSTEAD OF P AND Z. I'D LIKE YOU TO SPEAK TO THAT. AND THE SECOND THING THAT I'D LIKE, UM, I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT IS THE COMMENT ABOUT THIS THERE BEING A CLOSED RECORD AND WHAT NEW INFORMATION MIGHT BE PRESENTED BY THE APPLICANT? THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR AND COUNSEL. SO, UH, THIS IS NOT A CLOSED RECORD. UH, IF IT WAS A CLOSED RECORD, THEN THE APPELLANTS SEDONA RESIDENCE UNITE, AND MS. WAGNER AND THOMAS WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO PRESENT ANYTHING NEW EITHER, WHICH THEY PRESENTED A LOT OF NEW THINGS. SO, UH, THIS IS, UH, AN OPEN RECORD IS AN ADMINISTRATIVE REVIEW. IT'S NOT A JUDICIAL REVIEW, SO IT'S NOT THAT TYPE OF, UM, UH, CLOSED RECORD. UH, ALSO, UH, AS FAR AS THE DECISION MAKER WAS PLANNING AND ZONING, BUT THEY DON'T DEFEND THEIR DECISION. UH, THAT'S UP TO THE APPLICANT TO DEFEND PLANNING AND ZONING'S DECISION IF IT'S FOR THEM. UM, IN SOME CASES IT MIGHT, IF IT [01:10:01] WAS A CITY PROJECT, SOMETIMES THE CITY COUNCIL, UH, OR THE CITY ATTORNEY WOULD, WOULD BE DEFENDING P AND Z'S DECISION. UH, AND, AND THIS IS AKIN, THAT PART IS AKIN TO A, A JUDICIAL APPEAL, UH, WHERE A, UH, TRIAL JUDGE MAY MAKE THE DECISION, BUT HE DOESN'T GO UP ON APPEAL TO THE APPELLATE COURT TO DEFEND HIS OWN DECISION. IT'S UP TO THE PARTIES TO DO THAT. THANK YOU. OKAY. SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR PRESENTATION. THANK YOU. OKAY. THE APPLICANT WILL NOW HAVE 40 MINUTES, AND AT THAT TIME WE WILL TAKE A, A COUNCIL WILL TAKE A BREAK. THANK YOU. OKAY, GENTLEMEN, START WITH YOUR NAME AND WHO YOU ARE AND, UH, WE KNOW WHO YOU REPRESENT. AND THEN WE GOT 40 MINUTES. MAYOR, MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL, NICK WOOD SNELLEN WILMER, ONE EAST WASHINGTON STREET, PHOENIX CENTER, REPRESENT RD OLSON. CAN I ASK THE PO THE AUDIENCE TO PLEASE KEEP YOUR VOICES DOWN OR NOT TO, UH, TALK, PLEASE. IT IS VERY DISTURBING UP HERE. WE CAN HEAR EVERY WORD CONTINUE. GENTLEMEN. THANK YOU. MY NAME, UH, ROBERT OLSEN, PRESIDENT OF ORDE OLSEN COMPANIES. AND ANTHONY TONY EK, VICE PRESIDENT WITH ARTIE OLSON. MAYOR, WITH YOUR PERMISSION, I'LL KIND OF START THIS OFF. GO RIGHT AHEAD, YOU FOR TIME. UM, MAYOR, MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL, I JUST SPENT THE LAST 40 MINUTES LISTENING TO A SERIES OF ARGUMENTS THAT AS A ZONING ATTORNEY, I HEAR WHEN I'M PROCESSING A ZONING CASE, THEY'RE NOT ARGUMENTS THAT ARE RELEVANT TO AN ADMINISTRATIVE DECISION AND AN ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS. SO, IF I MAY, I WANT TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE TWO HATS THAT CITY COUNCIL'S, WHERE ONE IS LEGISLATIVE AND THE OTHER IS ADMINISTRATIVE. LEGISLATIVE MEANS THAT YOU'RE MAKING A DECISION ON SOMETHING THAT'S SUBJECT TO A REFERENDUM. WHEN I FILE AND PROCESSES ON A CASE, AND I'VE DONE HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF FROM MY CAREER, MAYBE YOU KNOW, WAY MORE THAN I CAN REMEMBER, A ZONING CASE IS A LEGISLATIVE APPLICATION. AND WHEN A MAYOR AND COUNCIL MAKES THEIR DECISION, YOU ARE EXERCISING WHAT I CALL THE LEG YOUR LEGISLATIVE PREROGATIVE. YOU HAVE THE DISCRETION TO APPROVE OR DISAPPROVE ANYTHING REGARDING THE ZONING APPLICATION. AND THAT PREROGATIVE IS SOMETHING THAT'S VERY SPECIAL. BUT ONCE THE COUNCIL HAS EXERCISED THAT LEGISLATIVE PREROGATIVE, NOW WE MOVE INTO THE WORLD OF ADMINISTRATIVE APPROVALS. AND MAYOR, WHEN YOU WENT THROUGH YOUR LIST AT THE BEGINNING, YOU SAID, THIS IS AN ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS, THE HAT THAT YOU WEAR AS A COUNCIL, AND ANY COUNCIL WEARS FOR ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS. THERE IS NO LEGISLATIVE PREROGATIVE. YOU REALLY DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO EXERCISE CHANGES TO THE UNDERLYING ZONING THAT'S THERE. YOU HAVE VERY LITTLE DISCRETION AS YOU OTHERWISE WOULD. IN THE ZONING CASE, FOR EXAMPLE, WHEN A, A, UH, SUBDIVISION PLAT, A FINAL PLAT COMES BEFORE YOU FOR APPROVAL. NOW SUBDIVISION PLATS ARE REQUIRED RIGHT THROUGH THE STATE STATUTES AND THROUGH YOUR SUBDIVISION ORDINANCE TO BE PROCESSED AND ULTIMATELY BE APPROVED BY THIS CITY COUNCIL. HOWEVER, SO LONG AS THE, UM, PLAT COMPLIES WITH THE STATUTORY REQUIREMENTS AS WELL AS THE ORDINANCE REQUIREMENTS OF SEDONA, YOU HAVE NO DISCRETION TO DENY IT. YOU HAVE NO ABILITY TO DENY IT BECAUSE IT'S ADMINISTRATIVE. SAME THING GOES WITH SITE PLAN APPROVALS. SAME THING GOES WITH BUILDING ELEVATIONS. SAME [01:15:01] THING GOES WITH LANDSCAPE PLAN. SAME THINGS GOES WITH THIS DEVELOPMENT PLAN. REVIEW YOU. WHAT YOU DO AS AN ADMINISTRATIVE BODY IS YOU BASICALLY LOOK AT WHAT IS THE UNDERLYING ZONING. NOW, THIS COUNCIL APPROVED THE ZONING BACK IN 2020, AND WHEN THIS ZONING WAS APPROVED, THE COUNCIL HAD THE LEGISLATIVE PREROGATIVE. THE COUNCIL HAD THE DISCRETION TO APPLY ANY RESTRICTIONS OR CONDITIONS THAT YOU THOUGHT OR THE CO THAT SITTING COUNCIL THOUGHT WAS APPROPRIATE. YOU COULD SAY, WE WANT BUILDINGS LOCATED HERE, RIGHT? OR WE DON'T WANT THEM LOCATED HERE. WE ONLY WANT ONE STORY BUILDINGS. YOU CAN'T HAVE TWO STORY BUILDINGS. YOU CAN'T BUILD IN A FLOODPLAIN. WE KNOW THAT LEGALLY WE CAN'T BUILD IN A FLOOD WAY, BUT THERE'S NO LEGAL PROHIBITION AGAINST BUILDING IN A FLOODPLAIN. THAT'S WHY THEY HAVE FLOOD PLAIN INSURANCE. SO YOU HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO ESTABLISH ALL THE RESTRICTIONS THAT YOU HEARD. THEIR ARGUMENT, RIGHT, WAS ONE FOR A ZONING CASE, BOTH SIDES, RIGHT? FOR 40 MINUTES, THEY WERE ARGUING A ZONING CASE. THIS IS NOT A ZONING CASE. ALL THE THINGS THEY BROUGHT UP, THINGS SUCH AS LAND USE. THE LAND USE DECISION WAS MADE, RIGHT? THE LAND USE DECISION WAS MADE IN 2020. AND AS I SAID, IN THAT DECISION, YOU COULD HAVE PUT ALL THE RESTRICTIONS THEY'RE ASKING FOR. YOU HAD THE ABILITY TO PLACE THOSE AS CONDITIONS TO THE ZONING THAT WAS NOT DONE. I DON'T KNOW IF THEY WERE HERE TALKING ABOUT THOSE AT THE TIME. BUT THE POINT IS, THE DECISION WAS MADE. TRAFFIC, AGAIN, TRAFFIC AND TRAFFIC IMPACT ANALYSES AND HOW TRAFFIC IMPACTS A ZONING CASE IS FAIR GAME. THE CITY COUNCIL HAS THE ABILITY TO SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT? YOU'RE JUST GENERATING TOO MUCH TRAFFIC. WE'RE NOT GONNA PROVE YOUR ZONING CASE. BUT ONCE YOU PROVE THE ZONING CASE, RIGHT, TRAFFIC IS NO LONGER ON, UH, ON THE PLATE FOR YOU TO RECONSIDER. UM, ENVIRONMENTAL LOCATIONS OF BUILDINGS, AS I MENTIONED, YOU COULD HAVE PUT ALL KINDS OF RESTRICTIONS IN THE ZONING, BUT YOU DID NOT. UM, IS IT ZONED FOR A HOTEL? OF COURSE, IT'S THE ZONING PERMITS A HOTEL, AND THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO USE IT. IN FACT, THEY HAVE A RIGHT THAT'S PROTECTED UNDER PROP 2 0 7 AND UNDER THE FIFTH AMENDMENT TO USE THE ZONING THAT THEY'VE BEEN GIVEN. UM, THERE'S A LOT OF REFERENCE TO THE COMMUNITY PLAN AND THE SCH HILL COMMUNITY FOCUS PLAN. THAT'S PART OF THE GENERAL PLAN. WHEN THE ZONING CASE WAS PRESENTED TO THE, THE COUNCIL FOR APPROVAL, ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE LAW IS VERY CLEAR. AND THAT IS THE UNDERLYING ZONING MUST COMPLY WITH THE GENERAL PLAN. HOWEVER, THESE TWO AREA PLANS, THEY'RE NOT REGULATORY. THEY'RE BASICALLY JUST GUIDELINES. AND WHEN THE CITY COUNCIL CONSIDERED THE ZONING, THE CITY COUNCIL HAD THE RIGHT TO IMPLEMENT AND CREATE ANY ONE OF THOSE CONDITIONS AS A CONDITION OF THE ZONING THAT MUST BE COMPLIED WITH GOING FORWARD. SO THE SITE PLAN THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT TODAY WOULD HAVE BEEN COMPELLED TO INCLUDE ALL OF THOSE RESTRICTIONS AND CONDITIONS, BUT THERE WERE NONE WITH RESPECT TO THINGS SUCH AS BUILDING CODE, FIRE CODE, WATER. YOU HAVE A WONDERFUL STAFF. YOU HAVE, I DO ZONING IN SO MANY DIFFERENT CITIES. THIS STAFF DOES AN INCREDIBLE JOB. ONE OF THE THINGS THEY WON'T DO IS ISSUE A BUILDING PERMIT. IF YOU DON'T HAVE WATER, IF YOU DON'T HAVE FIRE SERVICE, YOU DON'T HAVE ENOUGH VOLUME IN THE SYSTEM FOR FIRE. SO BASICALLY ALL THE THINGS THAT THEY TALKED ABOUT ARE IRRELEVANT TO WHAT YOU'RE CONSIDERING TONIGHT. AND THAT IS, IS THE SITE PLAN AND CONFORMANCE WITH THE UNDERLYING ZONING? WELL, THERE WAS NO CONDITIONS TO SITE PLAN IN THE UNDERLYING ZONING. THERE'S TWO CONDITIONS. ONE OF THE PROPERTY OWNERS NEXT DOOR HAD TO DO A LOT SPLIT. AND THE OTHER WAS A PROP 2 0 7 WAIVER HAD TO BE SIGNED. BUT THERE'S NO SITE PLAN INCLUDED. THERE'S NO BILLING ELEVATION RESTRICTIONS. THERE WASN'T SAYING, WELL, YOU CAN'T GO HERE, YOU CAN GO HERE, NOTHING. SO BASICALLY WHAT YOU HAVE TONIGHT IS SOMETHING WHERE YOU HAVE VERY LITTLE DISCRETION. AND THAT IS, SO LONG AS THERE'S COMPLIANCE WITH THE UNDERLYING ZONING, THIS MUST BE APPROVED. AND THAT'S WHY STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION WAS CLEAR. THEY'RE IN COMPLIANCE AND EVERY ASPECT OF THE APPLICATION, YOUR PLANNING COMMISSION, UNANIMOUSLY, UNANIMOUSLY SAID, YEP, WE AGREE WITH STAFF, WE AGREE WITH THE APPLICANT. YOU'RE IN COMPLIANCE WITH ALL THE UNDERLYING ZONING. BECAUSE THIS IS ADMINISTRATIVE, YOU DON'T HAVE THE SAME ABILITY TO USE LEGISLATIVE PREROGATIVE TO CHANGE THE UNDER DESIGN ZONING, TO CHANGE THE USE, ALL THE TRAFFIC, ALL THE OTHER THINGS. YOU DON'T HAVE ANY DISCRETION IN [01:20:01] THAT REGARD. THAT DISCRETION WAS EXERCISED WHEN THE ZONING WAS APPROVED. THIS IS STRICTLY ADMINISTRATIVE, AND THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS WHY IT'S NOT SUBJECT'S REFERENDUM. SO, UM, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND I WILL TURN IT OVER TO MY CLIENT WHO PAID ME TO DRIVE UP HERE . THANK YOU NICK, AND THANK YOU COUNSELORS FOR YOUR TIME THIS EVENING. I TRULY APPRECIATE YOUR CONSIDERATION. UH, FOR OUR, UH, DEVELOPMENT AS YOU SEE ON THE SCREEN, OUR PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT, AS YOU ARE AWARE, UH, INVOLVES APPROXIMATELY 11 AND A HALF ACRES, 70 LODGING UNITS IN WHICH 92 IS THE MAXIMUM ALLOWABLE ALSO HAS A RESTAURANT MEETING ROOM, WELLNESS SPA COMPONENT THAT IS ALLOWED AS PERMIT OR ACCESSORY OR ANCILLARY USE. AND ALSO FOR EMPLOYEE, UH, HOUSING UNITS ARE INCORPORATED, WHICH IS A PERMITTED USE UNDER A DWELLING UNITS WITHIN THE OAK CREEK DISTRICT. UH, JUST TO TOUCH ON HISTORY, UH, THIS IS OUR INITIAL CONCEPT. IT, IT DID PROPOSE 92 LODGING UNITS AND IT DID HAVE LARGER ANCILLARY FUNCTIONS INCLUDING LARGER BUILDING FOOTPRINTS. UH, WE HAVE SIGNIFICANTLY SCALED BACK THE DEVELOPMENT AS A RESULT OF WORK SESSIONS AND COMMUNITY OUTREACH MEETINGS AT THE JOB SITE. AND AS YOU CAN SEE, THE BUILDINGS HERE, OUR LARGER FOOTPRINT, AND MOST NOTABLY, WE STARTED OUT WITH OUR MORE PUBLIC OR COMMON, UH, BUILDINGS TO THE NORTH OF OUR PARCEL. AND OUR, OUR NEIGHBORS, UH, COMMENTED THAT THEY WOULD PREFER IF WE RELOCATE THOSE PUBLIC TYPE BUILDINGS THAT MAY GENERATE MORE NOISE TO THE SOUTHERN HALF OF OUR SITE, WHICH AFTER LONG AND HARD THOUGHTS, UH, WE, WE ACTUALLY AGREED THAT THAT WAS A PRUDENT MOVE, ESPECIALLY BECAUSE THE SOUTH BOUNDARY OF OUR PROPERTY IS ADJACENT AND ABUTTING A COMMERCIAL ZONE. SO THESE FACILITIES THAT ARE THE HIGHER NOISE GENERATORS, THEY HAVE BEEN RELOCATED TO THE SOUTHERN HALF OF THE, OF THE SITE. AND THE PROJECT HAS BEEN SCALED DOWN. UH, THIS HAS FEWER LARGER BUILDINGS AND WE HAVE REDESIGNED TO ACCOMMODATE SMALLER BUILDINGS STILL WITHIN THE 5,000 SQUARE FOOT FOOTPRINT THAT'S ALLOWED, BUT ALSO INCORPORATING CABINS AND AND COTTAGES WITHIN OUR SITE. AS I'VE TOUCHED ON, WE, WE DID HAVE AN EXTENSIVE COLLABORATIVE PROCESS WITH THE NEIGHBORS, WITH THE CITY, WITH PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSIONERS, UH, THREE WORK SESSIONS, UH, TWO DURING CONCEPT AND ONE DURING COMPREHENSIVE REVIEW. IN ADDITION TO THREE PUBLIC OPEN HOUSES WITH THE NEIGHBORS, UH, THE PROJECT IS IN COMPLIANCE, UH, AS NICK HAS MENTIONED WITH THE ZONING ORDINANCE, THE OAK CREEK DISTRICT, UH, ZONING ORDINANCE. UH, WE ARE PROPOSING LESS LODGING ONLY SIX PER ACRE, SO LESS IN DENSITY. AND IT HAS GONE THROUGH AN EXTENSIVE REVIEW BY PLANNING STAFF. AND THEY'VE DETERMINED AND SHOWN THAT WE ARE FULLY COMPLIANT WITH ALL CHECKLIST ITEMS THAT THOSE ARE OVER 50 VERY IMPORTANT STRATEGY AND CODE ITEMS, UH, FOR THIS SPECIFIC SITE BEING IN FULL COMPLIANCE. AS MENTIONED, THE SEDONA COMMUNITY PLAN IS REGULATORY AND IT LITERALLY STATES THAT WITHIN YOUR COMMUNITY PLAN, IT IS A GUIDE OR IS NOT REGULATORY, SORRY. AND WITHIN THE COMMUNITY PLAN, AS INDICATED ON THE LAND USE MAP, IT DOES, THE COMMUNITY PLAN DOES REFERENCE THE SCH NIBLEY CFA, AND THAT'S REFERENCED ON THE LAND USE MAP. THE SNUBBY CFA DOES CLEARLY LIST PERMITTED USES. AND THE DEFINITION OF HOTELS OR LODGING WITHIN THE CFA IS, IS OUR TYPE, WHICH IS LODGING STYLE SUPPORTED INCLUDES SMALL DESIGNER HOTELS. OTHER OBJECTIVES THAT WERE VERY IMPORTANT THAT HAVE BEEN INCORPORATED INTO OUR SITE WAS NO PERMANENT BUILDINGS WITHIN THE FLOODWAY. AND YOU CAN SEE THAT LINE HERE. UH, IN ADDITION, UH, THE BUILDINGS WERE RECOMMENDED TO BE CLUSTERED, SO THERE'S MORE VIEW SHED CORRIDORS AND IMPLIED OPEN SPACE WITHIN THE PROPERTY. [01:25:08] THE SLIDES, WE ARE INCORPORATING OUR PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION PRESENTATION FOR REFERENCE, UH, WITHIN THIS SLIDE. BUT WE'RE TRYING TO TOUCH ON THE PERTINENT ISSUES THAT ARE AT HAND. UH, THIS SLIDE SHOWS PAGE 11 FROM THE SNOBBY CFA. UH, YOU, YOU'VE SEEN THIS MENTIONED PREVIOUSLY, BUT WHAT WHAT WE FEEL IS SIGNIFICANT IS THE SIZE AND SCALE OF THE BUILDINGS THAT ARE SHOWN IN THE CFA AS AN EXAMPLE OF A PREFERRED DEVELOPMENT SCENARIO. AND WITH, WITHIN THIS PROPOSED SCENARIO, AS COMPARED TO OUR DEVELOPMENT ON THE RIGHT IN ALL CATEGORIES OR IN TERMS OF BUILDING FOOTPRINT, WE HAVE LESS OF AN IMPACT, A SMALLER BUILDING FOOTPRINT IN TERMS OF NUMBER OF LODGING UNITS. UH, WE HAVE LESS LODGING UNITS THAT IMPLIED HERE. IN ADDITION, UH, THE TOPIC OF CABINETS AND COTTAGES, THESE ARE SIGNIFICANTLY LARGER THAN CABINS AND COTTAGES. SO THE INTENT WAS NOT TO HAVE ALL BUILDINGS AS CABINET AND COTTAGES IN THE ILLUSTRATIONS. IT DOESN'T IMPLY THAT IN THE TEXT, IT DOESN'T IMPLY THAT. IT JUST MEANS THAT THERE ALSO MAY BE CABINS AND COTTAGES, AND I'LL GET TO THAT IN A MINUTE. UH, HERE'S EXCERPTS FROM THE ACTUAL, UH, LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE. IN TERMS OF OAK CREEK DISTRICT, UH, DWELLING IS A PERMITTED USE CONFERENCE. MEETING CENTERS IS AN ACCESSORY ALLOWED USE BAR TAVERN LOUNGE, A PERMITTED USE RESTAURANT, A PERMITTED USE LODGING, MEDIUM DENSITY, A PERMITTED USE AND PERSONAL SERVICES WELLNESS SPA, A PERMITTED USE. SO THE DEFINITION OF LODGING. WE'VE ALREADY TOUCHED ON THE DEFINITION THAT APPEARS IN THE CFA SMALL DESIGNER HOTELS, WHICH WE ARE, UH, WITHIN THE LDC, THE DEFINITION IS LODGING MEDIUM DENSITY UP TO FOUR, OR SORRY, UP TO EIGHT LODGING UNITS PER ACRE. AND THIS INCLUDES HOTELS, MOTELS, TIMESHARES, BOARDING HOUSES, BED BREAKFASTS, COLLEGES, BUNGALOWS, AND SIMILAR LODGING. UH, IT GOES ON TO SAY THAT IN THE ZONING DISTRICT, THAT ALTERNATIVE LODS, SUCH AS CABINS ARE ALLOWED, AGAIN, IMPLYING A DIVERSITY OF, OF TYPES OF BUILDINGS. IN FACT, MEDIUM DENSITY LODGING IS DEFINED AS SEVEN OR MORE UNITS WITHIN THE BUILDING. SO THE INTENT WAS, WAS NEVER TO HAVE SINGLE GUEST ROOM COTTAGES EVERYWHERE ON THIS SITE. IT WAS MEANT TO BE DIVERSE. AND ON THE SOUTH HALF OF OUR PARCEL, THE LDC CLEARLY STATES THAT UP TO 750 FEET WITHIN THE ROUNDABOUT PRIMARY USE COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS ARE ALLOWED. THAT MEANS A RETAIL CENTER CAN BE DEVELOPED. THAT MEANS AN OFFICE BUILDING CAN BE DEVELOPED. THAT MEANS A FULL SERVICE SPA CAN BE DEVELOPED WITHIN 750 FEET OF THE RIGHT OF WAY. ON OUR SITE. NOW, WE'VE BEEN A BIT MORE MODEST THAN OFFERING THESE PRIMARY LARGE FACILITIES, BUT WE HAVE INCORPORATED THESE ELEMENTS AS ANCILLARY SERVICES, AND THEY ARE ON THE SOUTHERN HALF OF OUR SITE. UH, I WILL NOW LIKE TO TURN IT OVER TO OUR ARCHITECT, GREG VIEGAS, WHO WILL TOUCH ON SIZE, SCALE, AND CHARACTER OF THE PROJECT. GREAT. GOOD EVENING. COUNCIL MEMBERS, MAYOR. MY NAME'S GREG VIEGA WITH WATG ARCHITECTS, AND I'D JUST LIKE TO UTILIZE A FEW SLIDES HERE TO, UH, INDICATE SOME OF THE CARE AND THE DESIGN THAT WENT INTO SOME OF THESE DECISIONS AS WELL AS TO INDICATE, UH, SOME OF THE HEIGHT AND ADDRESS SOME OF THE HEIGHT AND SCALE CONCERNS, SO WE ALL KNOW WHERE THE SITE IS. TONY, NEXT SLIDE. SO THIS SLIDE WAS IMPORTANT BECAUSE IT IDENTIFIES THE SURROUNDING ZONE USES THAT, THAT TONY MENTIONED. AND YOU'LL NOTICE TO THE NORTH OF OUR SITE AND TO THE EAST OF OUR SITE, IT'S ALL RESIDENTIAL ZONED TO THE SOUTH AND THE EAST. SORRY, SOUTH AND WEST IS ALL THE COMMERCIAL ZONES IN THE BLUE. AND THAT DID HAVE AN IMPACT ON HOW THE SITE WAS POSITIONED AND LAID OUT. TONY, NEXT SLIDE. SO ON THIS SLIDE, I THINK THE BEST WAY TO DESCRIBE IT IS WE ROTATED THE PLAN. SO NORTH IS TO THE RIGHT, SOUTH IS TO THE LEFT. IF YOU START WITH THE HEART PUMP HOUSE AT THE TOP, AND YOU GO TO THAT MIDDLE PICTURE AND YOU GO TO THE LEFT, TWO PICTURES DOWN AND THEN BACK TO THE BOTTOM IN THE MIDDLE, ALL OF THOSE IMAGES [01:30:01] ARE FROM THE ADJACENT COMMERCIAL ZONE SITE. YOU'LL NOTICE THEY'RE ALL MODEST, TWO STORY AND ONE STORY STRUCTURES. WE, THE PLATE HEIGHTS ON THESE OFFICE BUILDINGS ARE ABOUT PROBABLY 11 AND 11 FEET ARE, OURS ARE MUCH LOWER RELATIVE TO OUR TWO STORY DEVELOPMENTS. SO WE JUST REALLY WANTED TO SHOW THIS TO INDICATE WHAT THE, THE SCALE OF THE CONTEXT IS TO OUR EAST AND TO OUR SOUTH. IF YOU LOOK AT THE OTHER PICTURES STARTING FROM THE SECOND TOP RIGHT DOWN TO THE RIGHT, AND EVEN ON THE BOTTOM, THOSE ARE ALL IMAGES THAT REPRESENT THE MODEST RESIDENCES THAT ARE ALONG BARE WALLOW ALONG THE CREEK. AND YOU'LL SEE 'EM TO THE NORTHER SITE. SO AS WE GET THROUGH SOME OF THESE IMAGES THAT WE SHOW OF OUR DESIGN, IT'S CLEARLY WITHIN THE SCALE AND CONTEXT OF ONE AND TWO STORY STRUCTURES, UH, ON ADJACENT WITHIN THIS, UH, OAK CREEK ZONE. AND GREG, IF YOU DON'T MIND, OH, SURE. I'D JUST LIKE TO BE CLEAR THAT THE RESIDENCE'S PICTURED TO THE, THE UPPER RIGHT CORNERS ARE THE RESIDENCE IN THE BARE WALLOW NEIGHBORHOOD BEING TWO STORY VERY LARGE HOMES. YEAH. EXCUSE ME. NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. EXCUSE ME. WE WON'T BE HAVING A CALLING OUT FROM THE AUDIENCE. THANK YOU. OKAY, SO THIS IS STANDING UP ON 89 A LOOKING, UH, UH, EASTWARD. AND IF YOU LOOK BETWEEN THE TWO WHITE SIGNS, MAYBE JUST, UH, AT THE LIMIT OF THE BRIGHT GREEN, UH, TREES THERE, YOU'LL SEE THREE SORT OF DARKER ROOF AREAS. THAT'S IN FACT OUR MODEL OF THE ONE ON THE LEFT, UM, WHICH IS JUST TO THE RIGHT OF THAT TREE IS OUR NORTH CLUSTER. YOU BARELY SEE A FEW OF THE TOP OF THE ROOFS ON TWO OF THE BUILDINGS. THE ONE IN THE MIDDLE IS OUR CENTRAL CLUSTER, AND TO THE RIGHT IS SOUTH CLUSTER CLEARLY NOT IMPACTING, UH, THE ZONE ALONG THAT. WHEN YOU GO TO THE NEXT ONE HERE, THIS IS LOOKING NORTH ON SCHLEY AT OUR NORTH CLUSTER. AND YOU CLEARLY SEE THAT WE'RE NOT HINDERING THE LONG VIEWS. AND IN FACT, THE, UH, WHAT YOU'RE SEEING IS A SINGLE STORY COTTAGE, AND THE ONE TO THE FAR LEFT IS ACTUALLY A TWO STORY COTTAGE. BUT IF YOU LOOK, THE ROOF LINES ARE NEARLY THE SAME. AND THAT'S BECAUSE WE'RE UTILIZING THE GRADE OF THE SITE TO PUSH THE TWO STORIES DOWN INTO THE SITE SO THAT THEY'RE LESS VISIBLE FROM SLI. YOU'RE LOOKING HERE AT BARE WALLOW TO THE RIGHT AND OUR PARKING AREA, WHICH WILL BE COMPLETELY, UH, PLANTED AND, AND AND, UH, HIDDEN BY TREES IN THE NATURAL VEGETATION. NEXT, TONY. SO HERE WE'RE LOOKING SOUTH, COMING AROUND THE BEND, LOOKING SOUTH, DRIVING SOUTH. THE, UM, BUILDING THAT YOU SEE TO THE LEFT IS OUR SPA BUILDING. THE BUILDINGS TO THE RIGHT ARE ACTUALLY OUR NORTH CLUSTER BUILDINGS IN WHICH THAT'S NOT ONE BUILDING. THERE'S ACTUALLY A SMALL ONE STORY BUILDING IN FRONT WITH A FUR, THE BUILDING FURTHER IN THE BACK NEXT. SO JUST TAKING A MINUTE TO ADDRESS SOME OF THE CHARACTER ISSUES. THESE FOUR CLUSTERS ARE ESSENTIALLY OF THE PLACE AND OF THE CHARACTER. AND IN FACT, THE CENTRAL CLUSTER IS, UM, WE ARE USING THE GASAWAY HOUSE. WE ARE USING THE, THE, UH, THE JORDAN HISTORICAL BUILDINGS AS INSPIRATION. AND IF YOU LOOK, UH, AND I'LL SHOW SOME RENDERINGS HERE IN A MOMENT, THAT THE CENTRAL CLUSTER, UH, IS UTILIZING THE SEDONA REDSTONE AND MUCH OF THE VERTICAL SIDING THAT WE SEE IN THE JORDAN, THAT'S THE INSPIRATION. THE SOUTH CLUSTER WE'RE USING, WE WANNA MAKE A LITTLE MORE CONNECTION TO THE CREEK. SO WE'RE USING THE HEART PUMP HOUSE, THE, UH, RIVER ROCK AS THE STRONG MATERIAL FOR THE SOUTH CLUSTER, AS WELL AS THE MUCH OF THE TYPOLOGY AND THE HERITAGE VERNACULAR THAT RUNS THROUGHOUT ALL OF THESE, WHICH ARE THE SMALL SHEDS THAT YOU SEE, THE GABLE ROOFS, UM, LITTLE, UH, PATIOS AND SUCH AND ALL USING NATURAL MATERIALS. THE WEST CLUSTER IS BASED A LITTLE BIT MORE ON THE TOPAL LAKI WHERE IT, THAT'S THE ONLY CLUSTER WHERE WE'RE BRINGING SOME PLASTER INTO, INTO THE, UH, THE SCHEME AS WELL AS UTILIZING, UH, A LOT OF HORIZONTAL SIDING IN THAT ONE FROM THE SIBLEY HOUSE, WHICH IS, UH, ONE THE HISTORIC HOUSE IN THAT IMAGE ON THE LOWER LEFT. AND THEN THE NORTH CLUSTER IS THE HIGHEST. THE GREEN, UH, CLUSTER IS THE HIGHEST PART ON THE SITE. FIVE OF THOSE SIX BUILDINGS ARE SINGLE STORY. THE SECOND, THE TWO STORY BUILDING IS PUSHED BACK, AND I'LL DEMONSTRATE THAT IN A MOMENT. AND, UM, THESE WERE INSPIRED BY THE FARLEY HOMESTEAD AND THE WEISSMAN, UH, CABIN RELATIVE TO THE SHEDS. AND AGAIN, IT'S THAT VERNACULAR AND THAT TYPOLOGY OF THE HISTORICAL HOUSES IN THE AREA. SO THIS IS AN IMAGE OF OUR ENTRY BUILDING LOBBY THAT IS A ONE AND A HALF STORY HEIGHT. THAT'S NOT EVEN A FULL TWO STORY HEIGHT. THE AREA TO THE LEFT IS A SINGLE STORY, AND AGAIN, THIS IS A STRONG, UH, USE OF THE SEDONA STONE AND NATURAL MATERIALS AT THE ENTRY. NEXT SLIDE, TONY. [01:35:01] SO THIS IS IN OUR SOUTH CLUSTER. SO WHAT'S IMPORTANT ABOUT THE SOUTH CLUSTER THAT I WANTED TO, UH, MAKE A COMMENT ON IS THAT IS OUR SMALL MEETING FACILITY TO THE RIGHT, YOU KNOW, PERSPECTIVES SOMETIMES ARE TRICKY. UM, BUT I WAS SITTING, UH, IN MY CHAIR COUNTING THE CEILING TILES AND FROM THAT WALL WHERE THAT TV IS TO THAT WALL. THIS WAY, THIS ROOM'S 1,480 SQUARE FEET. OUR MEETING SPACE IS 1,253. IT'S A VERY MODEST MEETING SPACE. VERY MODEST WEDDINGS. THIS IS NOT GLORIFIED LARGE ARCHITECTURE. IT'S SMALLER THAN THIS ROOM. THE MEETING, THE MEETING ROOM TO THE LEFT OVER THERE ON THE, ON THE GREENHOUSE IS ONLY 434 SQUARE FEET WITH A EVENT LAWN IN BETWEEN. AND YOU'RE LOOKING EAST AT, UH, SNOOPY SNOOPY ROCK NEXT IN THE NORTH. THIS IS OUR, UH, COTTAGES SINGLE STORY. TWO STORY TO THE LEFT NEXT, TONY. AND I'LL LET, UH, THIS'LL COME UP IN OUR HISTORICAL RESPECT TO THE SITE. THIS IS THE 90, SORRY, I ALWAYS GET THAT NUMBER WRONG. THIS IS THE 95 SCHLEY HOUSE FROM 1950, THE OWNER. AND AS A RESULT OF WORKING WITH P AND Z, WE ARE GONNA RELOCATE THE EXISTING, UM, 1950 ORIGINAL PORTION OF THAT HOUSE AND REUSE THOSE MATERIALS. THOSE ARE THE CASEMENT WINDOWS THAT ARE OUT THERE TODAY, THE VERTICAL SIGHTING THAT'S OUT THERE TODAY. AND WE ARE GONNA CREATE THAT AS THE GALLERY, THE EDUCATIONAL SPACE FOR ALL THE GUESTS TO VISIT. THIS IS RIGHT AT THE ENTRY. IN FACT, THE POOL BUILDING IS BEHIND THIS TO THE LEFT. WANTED TO SHOW THE 27 BUILDINGS. YOU KNOW, IN MANY RESPECTS, THIS IS WHY WE DID THE 27 BUILDINGS. THEY ARE SMALLER. HALF ARE ONE STORY. THAT'S ALL THE BLUE DOTS. THE OTHER HALF ARE THE TWO STORY, AND THEY'RE PUSHED ALL AWAY FROM EPLEY HILL AND DOWN THE SITE, UTILIZING THE GRADE AND CREATING THE VIEW QUARTERS NEXT. SO FOR THAT, I'LL TURN IT OVER TO THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT. THANK YOU. DO YOU START WITH YOUR NAME, PLEASE? YES. UH, MY NAME IS SANDEEP WIA. I'M THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT ON THE PROJECT. UH, GOOD EVENING, MAYOR AND COUNSELORS. UM, I'LL START WITH TALKING A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE PLANTING PLAN AND IN COM. IN COMPLYING WITH THE LDC AS WELL AS THE CFA, UM, WE'VE BASICALLY FOCUSED ON, YOU KNOW, ESTABLISHING A NATIVE PLANT PALATE ON THE SITE. SO INSTEAD OF THE REQUIRED 75% ON THE SITE, WE ARE PROVIDING 87%. WE HAVE THREE TYPOLOGIES THAT COVER THE SITE, THE FIRST BEING THE RIPARIAN, THE SECOND THE RIPARIAN, UH, NONT TRANSITIONAL. AND THE THIRD IS THE, UM, AGRICULTURE. I DON'T WANNA EMPHASIZE THAT THE RIPARIAN TYPOLOGY ACTUALLY EXTENDS ALL THE WAY TO THE 500 YEAR FLOODPLAIN. AND WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO BASICALLY DO IS JUST BUILD UPON WHAT'S ALREADY ON THE SITE AND STRENGTHEN SOME OF THE EXISTING, UH, PLANT PALLETS. WE WORKED WITH MAX LECHER, UH, TO ESTABLISH THE PLANTING PALLETS WITHIN EACH ZONES TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL THOSE, UM, CRITERIA WERE BEING MET, THE AG. SO THE NEXT ONE IS THE, UH, PEDESTRIAN AND BICYCLE NETWORK. THIS IS A PLAN FROM THE, UH, FROM THE CFA. AND WHAT YOU CAN SEE HERE IN THE DASH GREEN LINE IS THE, UM, THE BICYCLE, UH, AND PEDESTRIAN NETWORK THAT IS MEANT TO CONNECT WITH THE HUCKABEE TRAIL EVENTUALLY. AND, UH, AS WE ZOOM INTO THE SITE, YOU CAN SEE THAT THE, UM, THE MAIN, THE TRAIL GOES ALONG SNE HILL ROAD, WHICH IS A PUBLIC TRAIL. THERE'S A PORTION THAT EXTENDS ON BARE WALLER LANE, AND THERE'S A 12 FOOT EASEMENT ON THE WESTERN PART OF THE SITE. UH, TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION, WE PRESENTED FOUR OPTIONS. THEY CHOSE THE FIRST ONE, WHICH IS PRETTY MUCH WHAT WE HAVE PROPOSED, WHERE THE, UM, SO IN, IN THIS SLIDE, WE'RE, UH, FOCUSING ON THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION. WE ARE PRESERVING IN PLACE THE TWO IRRIGATION CHANNELS AS WELL AS, UM, THE TWO WELLHEADS. WE HAVE ACCESS TO THEM AS WELL AS PLAQUES THAT WOULD CELEBRATE THE HISTORY, UH, OF THE, OF THOSE. UM, THEN WE LOOKED ALSO AT THE SEDONA PUBLIC ART AND BASICALLY ADDING TO IT THROUGH OUR PROJECT. YOU CAN WITHIN HERE, WE THROUGH THE ORANGE DOTS. THERE ARE A LOT OF OPPORTUNITIES FOR THOSE WITHIN THE SITE. AND THE THREE RED DOTS THAT YOU SEE AT ALONG NLI HILL ARE THE PUBLIC ART COMPONENTS, WHICH WOULD BE VISIBLE AS, UM, PEOPLE MOVE THROUGH THE PEDESTRIAN NETWORK AS WELL AS THE STREET ITSELF. AND WE ARE COMMITTED TO HIRING LOCAL ARTISTS FOR THOSE PIECES OF PUBLIC ARTS. THAT WILL BE ALONG SNE HILL ROAD. GOOD EVENING, MAYOR AND CITY COUNCILORS. UM, I'M ERIC BRANT, LOCAL ARCHITECT. UM, AS A CONSULTANT FOR THE, UH, LANDOWNER AND THE, UH, DESIGN TEAM. UM, [01:40:01] I GET TO TALK ABOUT THE, UH, HISTORIC RESOURCES, WHICH ARE A FUN COMPONENT OF, UH, THE, UH, MASTER PLANNING OF THESE EIGHT PROPERTIES. UM, THE, THE LODGE DOES PROVIDE MANY COMMUNITY BENEFITS, AND ONE BENEFIT IS THE CELEBRATION OF THE HISTORIC RESOURCES OF THE PROPERTY. UM, FOR INSTANCE, THE, UH, HIS HISTORIC, UH, RESOURCE OF THE IRRIGATION CHANNELS, UM, COMMEMORATES THE FARLEY AND STEEL FAMILIES AND THEIR LEGACY WITH FRUIT FARMING. UM, THE STONE, WELL BUILDINGS ARE, UH, PRESERVED IN PLACE. UM, THE LAST SLIDE IS OF THE, UH, UM, ALREADY BEEN TOUCHED ON AS FAR AS THE, UH, PRESERVATION OR RESTORATION OF THE, UH, ONE OF THE BUILDINGS ON SITE TO BE A, UH, A LOCAL, UM, HISTORY, UH, OPEN MUSEUM, A SLICE OF THE MUSEUM, SO TO SPEAK. SO, UM, PRESERVING AND PROVIDING A DEMONSTRATION OF OUR HISTORY IS ONE OF THE MANY BENEFITS THE LODGE FOR THE COMMUNITY. GOOD EVENING MAYOR, VICE MAYOR, UM, COUNSEL. I'M LUKE SEFTON WITH SEFTON ENGINEERING. UM, FIRST OF ALL, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, WORKED A LONG TIME WITH CARRIE AND YOU DON'T GET ANYTHING BY HER. SHE'S PRETTY THOROUGH ON EVERYTHING, EVERYTHING ELSE. BUT ON THE FLOOD MAPPING, WE HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE COUNTY AND FEMA TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE NOT IMPACTING IT OR WE'RE NOT ADDING DAMAGES. I WAS A NATIONAL GUARD COMMANDER AT THE 93 FLOOD FOR THE SOLDIERS THAT WERE ACTIVATED TO COME DOWN HERE. I HAD HUMVEES ON TILLOCK BRIDGE AND OVER IN COTTONWOOD AND CA OR ANYWAYS, DIFFERENT TOWNS AROUND THE VERDE VALLEY HELPING WITH THE FLOODING. SO DID ALL THAT. UM, THE OTHER ITEM, UM, UTILITIES. UM, AT THIS POINT WE JUST HAVE LETTERS OF SERVICEABILITY, BUT WHEN WE GET THE PLANS, THE UTILITIES WILL LOOK AT 'EM AND THEY'LL SAY, OKAY, LIKE FOR INSTANCE, THE WATER LINE CURRENTLY IN SNOBBY HILL ROAD, THE WATER LINE'S FOUR INCHES. THEY WILL MAKE US IMPROVE THAT ALONG WITH ANY OTHER UTILITIES, THE WATER COMPANY, UM, GAS COMPANY, AND ELECTRIC. UM, THEY WILL NOT JEOPARDIZE EXISTING, UM, CUSTOMERS 'CAUSE THAT'S THEIR FIRST OBLIGATION. UM, AND THEN ON THE FIRE, I KNOW THERE ARE GOING TO BE SOME OTHER PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT FIRE, BUT I DID MEET WITH DORY AND KURT, THE FIRE MARSHAL AND ASSISTANT, UM, AND WENT OVER OUR PLANS HERE. UM, AGAIN, THEY WON'T MAKE THEIR FULL FORMAL, UH, COMMENTS UNTIL THEY GET ALL THE CONSTRUCTION PLANS BECAUSE THEY, THEY WANT TO SEE THAT BEFORE THEY MAKE A DECISION. BUT THEY DID HELP US WITH, UH, WHERE TO PUT THE, UH, FIRE LANES, HOW TO DO THAT. THEY LOOKED AT THAT. THEY ALSO LOOKED AT THE LENGTH OF HOSES, UM, THAT WENT AROUND THERE AND RECOMMENDED WHERE WE WOULD PUT FDC DEVICES. SO, UM, THAT'S IT. GOOD EVENING. GOOD EVENING, EVERYONE. UM, MY NAME'S MICHAEL LAPORE. I'M WITH KIMLEY HORN AND I REPRESENT THE OWNER. UM, I'M A CIVIL ENGINEER BY TRADE. THE FIRE FLOW REQUIREMENTS ARE BASED ON BUILDING CODE, AND THAT COMES FROM THE TYPE OF BUILDING, WHETHER IT'S MADE OF METAL OR WOOD OR CONCRETE, AND THE SIZE OF THE BUILDING. SO OUR PROPOSED PROJECT REQUIRES 1500 GPM OF, OF FIRE FLOW, AND WE HAVE DETERMINED THAT AN EIGHT INCH WATER MAIN WOULD BE SUFFICIENT TO DELIVER THE PRESSURE AND FLOW REQUIREMENTS FOR THE PROJECT. UH, WATER RIGHTS, THE EXISTING PROPERTIES HAVE THE RIGHT TO WITHDRAW UP TO 28.2 ACRE FEET OF WATER PER YEAR FROM THE OAK CREEK. BASED ON USGS STREAM DATA, UM, THE CREEK FLOWS AT A TOTAL YEARLY VOLUME OF 21,000 ACRE FEET, AND THAT ACCOUNTS FOR APPROXIMATELY 0.1% OF THE TOTAL FLOW FROM THE, UH, ANNUAL CREEK FLOW. AND AT THAT POINT, 1% WITHDRAWAL WOULD NOT SIGNIFICANTLY IMPACT ANY KIND OF CREEK FLOWS. UM, NEXT IS THE FLOODWAY. SO FIGURE SIX IN THE CFA CLEARLY DEFINES WHAT THE FLOODWAY IS AND ALSO CLEARLY DEFINES THE RIPARIAN [01:45:01] HABITAT AS THE SAME AREA. SO NO BUILDINGS ARE ALLOWED TO BE DEVELOPED WITHIN THE FLOODWAY. AND ALL PERMANENT STRUCTURES, APART FROM, SORRY, ALL PERMANENT STRUCTURES SHALL BE LOCATED OUTSIDE THE FLOODWAY AND ONLY MINOR IMPROVEMENTS SUCH AS TRAILS ALLOWED WITHIN THE FLOODWAY. THE NEXT AREA THAT'S DEFINED, UM, ON A FEDERAL LEVEL, IS THE FLOODPLAIN. A SERIES OF AGENCIES INCLUDING, UM, THE COO COUNTY AND THE CITY OF SEDONA HAVE, HAVE DONE A, AN INTENSE STUDY TO MAP THE FLOODPLAIN. UM, THIS WAS DONE RECENTLY IN 2023 AND 2024, AND THEY USED STATE-OF-THE-ART AERIAL MAPPING. TO FURTHER DEFINE THAT FLOODPLAIN BUILDINGS ARE ALLOWED TO BE CONSTRUCTED WITHIN THE FLOODPLAIN IF THEY COMPLY WITH SOME CERTAIN REGULATIONS. AND THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THAT IS THAT THEY'RE SET AT A CERTAIN ELEVATION ABOVE THE FLOOD PLANE. UM, I'D LIKE TO TURN IT OVER TO BRENT TRAFFIC. MY NAME IS BRENT CROWLER WITH KIMLEY HORN, UH, LEADING TRANSPORTATION. KEY PART OF OF THIS SLIDE IS, IS TELLING US HOW MANY TRIPS WE ANTICIPATE, UH, DURING THE SATURDAY PEAK HOUR, THE BUSIEST TIME OF, OF, OF THE ADJACENT STREET SYSTEM, 52 VEHICLES PER HOUR. SO IF YOU WATCH THAT CLOCK, IT'S FIVE MINUTES NOW. BY THE TIME IT GETS TO FOUR MINUTES, WE'LL HAVE ONE VEHICLE THAT WILL PASS COMING THROUGH TO OR FROM, FROM THE, THE DEVELOPMENT, IT IS VERY CONSIDERED A VERY LOW IMPACT DEVELOPMENT, UH, FROM A PERSPECTIVE OF OF TRAFFIC, IT DOES INCREASE DELAY A NOMINAL 1% OR LESS THAN 1% AVERAGE OF 4.9, UH, SECONDS OF AVERAGE DELAY. THE APPLICANT HAS COMMITTED TO SEVERAL, UH, IMPROVEMENTS TO TRY AND MITIGATE SPEED. I IMPROVE THE, THE QUALITY OF LIFE OF THOSE LIVING ON, UH, SCH NIBLEY HILL ROAD, UH, INCLUDING, UH, SHOULDER WIDENING, UH, SPEED FEEDBACK SIGNS TO HELP TR CALM TRAFFIC. AND I WON'T GET INTO EACH OF THOSE, BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, A TRAVEL DEMAND MANAGEMENT PROGRAM. IF WE GO TO, UH, TWO SLIDES DOWN, BUT, UM, THIS JUST WANT TO EMPHASIZE, ALL THESE IMPROVEMENTS ARE DONE IN COLLABORATION WITH THE CITY OF SEDONA. ANDY'S BEEN WORKING FOR SEVERAL YEARS ON THE, ON THE SIM PROGRAM. IT'S A SYSTEM AS A CITY CONTINUES TO MAKE IMPROVEMENTS. EVERY LITTLE IMPROVEMENT WORKS COLLECTIVELY TO TRY AND REDUCE, UH, DELAY AND IMPROVE THE TRAFFIC CONDITIONS WITHIN, UH, WITHIN THE CITY. THE TRAVEL DEMAND MANAGEMENT PROGRAM THAT WILL BE IMPLEMENTED, UH, IS, IS AGGRESSIVE. UH, IT ENCOURAGES ACTIVE MODES WALKING, BICYCLING FROM, FROM THE DEVELOPMENT, UH, TO TRY AND DISCOURAGE ANY, UH, PERSONAL VEHICLE USE BY THOSE, UH, VISITORS. UH, THERE'S A TRAVEL MANAGEMENT TRAVEL DEMAND MANAGEMENT COORDINATOR THAT WILL BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THAT, UH, SHUTTLE SYSTEM, ET CETERA, TO REALLY TRY AND REDUCE, UH, ANY USE OF PERSONAL VEHICLES BY, BY THOSE COMING, UH, AND VISITING, UH, THE DEVELOPMENT. MY NAME IS SAMUEL HORDE. I'M WITH MD ACOUSTICS. WE PERFORMED THE NOISE ANALYSIS REGARDING THE PROJECT. UH, MY BACKGROUND IS IN MECHANICAL ENGINEERING. I HAVE A DEGREE FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF TEXAS AT AUSTIN. UH, OUR PROCESS WAS AN ENGINEERING PROCESS. WE WENT, WE TRAVELED TO THE PROJECT SITE. WE MEASURED THE AMBIENT NOISE CONDITION. WE SIMULATED A WEDDING TYPE EVENT USING LOUDSPEAKERS ON LOCATION. UH, WE MEASURED AT EACH PROPERTY LINE DURING THE SIMULATED EVENT WITH, UM, WITH LEVELS THAT WERE APPROPRIATE FOR THAT TYPE OF EVENT AS COMPARED TO REAL WORLD VALUES. UH, USING THESE REAL WORLD MEASUREMENTS, WE WERE ABLE TO INPUT THOSE INTO OUR COMPUTER MODEL, WHICH ALSO TAKES INTO ACCOUNT THE SIGNIFICANT TOPOGRAPHY OF THE AREA, AND WE'RE ABLE TO PREDICT HOW LOUD IT WILL BE AT THE SURROUNDING USES. UH, THIS FIGURE, UH, SHOWN ON THIS SLIDE SHOWS THAT THE, UH, THAT EVEN DURING A, DURING A WEDDING TYPE EVENT, ON AN OUTDOOR WEDDING TYPE EVENT, THE USE WILL WILL COMPLY WITH THE NOISE ORDINANCE OF SEDONA, WHICH PROVIDES A 60 DB LIMIT AT THE PROPERTY LINE. SO LET ME JUST MAKE A FEW COMMENTS. UM, AGAIN, BOB OLSON, PRESIDENT OF RD OLSEN COMPANIES, CLEARLY YOU CAN SEE THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF WORK DONE, UH, THROUGH THIS PROCESS. WE DID IT WITH THE INCLUSION OF ALL WITH OUR NEIGHBORS. WE'VE MADE CHANGES THROUGHOUT THE PROCESS. WE'VE WORKED WITH STAFF WHO HAVE BEEN, AS LUKE SAID EARLIER, NOT MUCH THERE. NOTHING [01:50:01] GETS BY HER. AND, AND SO I THINK AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE'VE PROVEN THAT WE'VE GOT A GOOD PLAN, A GREAT PLAN. UM, THESE ARE ALL PROFESSIONALS THAT WE HAVE WORKED WITH HERE OVER, UH, WE PURCHASED OVER THE LAST THREE YEARS. WE PURCHASED THIS PROPERTY SHORTLY AFTER THE ZONING WAS APPROVED, KNOWING THAT WE HAD THE RIGHT, WHAT WE HAD THE RIGHTS FOR, AND WE FOLLOWED THOSE GUIDELINES AGAIN, WE MET 100% OF THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE CFA. I THINK THAT'S CLEAR AND THAT, UM, THE PLANNING, UM, UH, AT THE PLANNING HEARING, WE RECEIVED SEVEN ZERO, UM, VOTE. SO I THINK IT'S CLEAR THAT WE'VE, WE HAVE DONE, GONE THROUGH THE PROCESS FOUR, YOUR PROCESS IN TOTAL FOR US. UM, AND SO WE JUST ASK THAT WE, UH, APPROVE. WELL, I DON'T KNOW. I GUESS IT'S A DENY THE, THE TWO APPEALS TO THIS SO THAT WE CAN MOVE THIS PROPERTY ALONG. I THINK THAT AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE'RE PROVIDING A VERY HIGH QUALITY PROPERTY AND LOOK FORWARD TO MOVING AHEAD. THANK YOU, MAYOR. MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL, I HAVE 26 SECONDS LEFT. ESSENTIALLY, DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS, USE STANDARDS, DESIGN STANDARDS, THOSE ALL SHOULD HAVE BEEN INCORPORATED IF THE COUNCIL FELT THEY WERE IMPORTANT IN THE UNDERLYING ZONING, BUT THEY WEREN'T WHERE THEY'RE LOCATED, HEIGHTS, ALL OF THOSE THINGS, EVERYTHING YOU SEE HERE IS IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE UNDERLYING ORDINANCE AND NOT UNDER ANY RESTRICTIONS. SO, THANK YOU. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WOW. GOOD PLANNING. OKAY, WE WILL, COUNCIL WILL TAKE A, A 20 MINUTE SURE. 15 WHAT? 20. WE WILL BE BACK AT, UH, TEN TWO SEVEN. IF ANYBODY HAS NOT FILLED OUT THEIR A CARD, A, A PUBLIC COMMENT CARD. NOW IS THE TIME TO DO THAT. THANK YOU. THAT'S SO COLD IN HERE TONIGHT. NICE. HIDDEN. OKAY. HAVE AN ALERT SET. WE'LL COME BACK AT THE SESSION. I ACTUALLY STEPPED YES, HE DID. HE DID. ABSOLUTELY. HE DID. THERE WAS TWO SIDES, TWO IN DIRECTIONS. OKAY. WE HAD ONLY AN ENGINEER. WOW. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU FOR INDULGING US. WE'VE HAD SEVERAL MEETINGS BEFORE THE ONE TODAY, SO WE'VE GOT A LOT GOING ON. OKAY. SO NOW WE ARE GOING TO GO TO, UH, COMMENTS FROM THE COUNCIL. QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? QUESTION, UH, QUESTIONS. I'M SORRY. QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMENTS. AND I'M GOING TO JUST RELATE TO THE AUDIENCE, UH, HAVING JOINT CONVERSATIONS AMONGST YOURSELVES IS HEARD UP HERE. IT'S VERY DISTRACTING TO US UP HERE. SO I'M GONNA ASK YOU TO, UH, PLEASE NOT DO THAT. IF THERE WAS ONE INDIVIDUAL WHO WAS DOING IT REPEATEDLY, IF THAT HAPPENS, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO ASK SOMEONE TO LEAVE. SO I DON'T WANNA HAVE TO DO THAT, BUT WE DON'T WANNA BE DISTURBED AND WE WANNA HEAR EVERYTHING THAT'S BEING SAID. OKAY, MR. MAYOR. UH, TYPICALLY AFTER, AT THIS POINT, WE DO PUBLIC COMMENT AND THEN REBUTTALS, AND THEN ALL THE COUNCIL COMBINES ALL THEIR DISCUSSION AND QUESTIONS TOGETHER. UH, YOU CAN DO IT IN A DIFFERENT ORDER IF YOU'D LIKE. NO, WHATEVER YOU YEAH, THAT'S FINE. THAT'S GOOD. SO WE'RE GONNA DO COMMENTS. OKAY. PUBLIC COMMENT, PUBLIC COMMENTS. I HAVE THE CARDS HERE. OKAY, EVERYBODY, WE'LL HAVE THREE MINUTES TO, UH, TO SPEAK. WE'LL START WITH, UH, NANCY ROB DUNS, UH, AT THE PODIUM AND ON DECK WOULD BE STEVEN THOMPSON. NANCY, YOU KNOW THE DRILL. UH, NAME AND CITY. MY NAME IS NANCY ROB DUN. I LIVE IN THE CITY OF SEDONA. UM, I LIVE ON BARE WALLO. UM, I, I WROTE NOTES ON MY IPAD, BUT I CAN'T FIND IT. SO , SO HERE'S WHAT I'M GONNA SAY. THIS IS WHAT I REMEMBER. THERE WAS A MEETING AT THE CREATIVE LIFE CENTER, UM, PROMOTED BY A STAFF MEMBER. I DON'T REMEMBER WHO, BUT, UM, AT THE CREATIVE LIFE CENTER, THE BARE WALLOW RESIDENTS, ALL OF US WHO LIVED THERE AND WHO WERE THERE TALKED ABOUT, UM, REZONING. AND WE TALKED ABOUT REZONING BECAUSE WE DIDN'T WANT BIG, UM, HUGE HOTELS AND RESORTS COMING IN AND TAKING OVER THE WHOLE LAND [01:55:01] AND, YOU KNOW, WRECKING THE ENVIRONMENT. AND, UM, SO THAT WAS WHY WE AGREED FOR, TO CHANGE IT FROM WHATEVER IT WAS TO, UM, THE KIND OF ZONING IT IS NOW. AND, AND THEN, UM, I HEARD ABOUT, WE HEARD ABOUT, AND AT THAT TIME WE WERE TALKING ABOUT LOW LODGING, YOU KNOW, KIND OF LODGING THAT FIT IN TO THE AREA. I LIVE IN A TWO STORY RED BARN HOUSE. IT'S HISTORIC. UM, I HAVE A LITTLE MORE SQUARE FOOTAGE NOW, BUT, UM, THAT'S THE, THAT'S WHERE I LIVE NOW. THE REST OF THE HOUSES IN THE AREA AREN'T QUITE LIKE MINE, BUT THEY'RE A LITTLE, YOU KNOW, CLEANER LOOKING. BUT, SO I WAS KIND OF HOPING, YOU KNOW, FOR SOMETHING KIND OF, UM, THAT WOULD BE KIND OF, UH, FORESTY, WOODSY CABINS, THAT KIND OF THING. YOU KNOW, AT LEAST AT THE LODGE, YOU KNOW, A, A LONG LODGE THAT HAS MAYBE TWO, THREE DOORS. AND, BUT, UM, SO THAT'S WHAT I WAS THINKING OF WAS MY CONCEPT. SO, SO THEN, THEN WE WENT TO A MEETING, UM, FOR THIS HOTEL, AND I BEGAN TO REALIZE THAT, UM, THEIR IDEA AND OUR IDEA WAS VERY, VERY DIFFERENT. AND, BUT I, I THINK THAT'S FIXABLE. I DON'T, WE DID TALK ABOUT STONE HOUSES AND WOOD HOUSES AND, AND OTHER KINDS OF HOUSES. I MEAN, THAT IS WHAT I REMEMBER USING DIFFERENT KINDS OF MATERIALS. AND I EVEN HAVE PICTURES OF THE KINDS OF HOUSES THAT THEY SUGGESTED. AND, UM, SO I'M GOING TO GO WITH THAT. 'CAUSE THAT'S WHAT I REMEMBER. AND I HAVE, OH MY, ON MY, UH, IPHONE. THE THING, ONE OF THE, UM, THINGS THAT I'M VERY CONCERNED ABOUT IS THE RIPARIAN AREA. UM, RIGHT NOW, UH, WE HAVE HAD DEER ON OUR FRONT LAWNS BECAUSE THEY COME DOWN FROM THE MOUNTAINS TO GET TO THE WATER. WE ALSO HAVE HUGE BLUE HERONS WHO LIVE DOWN BY WHERE WE ARE. SORRY, NANCY. THAT WAS IT. THAT WAS IT. WE, AND WE HAVE TO, WE HAVE A LOT GOING ON. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. EXCUSE ME. STEVEN THOMPSON WILL BE FOLLOWED BY JAKE WEBER. GOOD EVENING. MARY JALO, UH, VICE MAYOR PLU COUNSEL. UM, STEVEN THOMPSON. I HAVE BEEN IN SEDONA ABOUT 40 YEARS. UM, JUST IN PREFACE TO A COUPLE THINGS. I'M GONNA SAY, I, TWO OF MY FIRST HOUSES I DID IN THIS CITY ARE IN BARE WALLO , ODDLY ENOUGH. AND I ALSO DID WAS THE RESTORATIVE REGENER, UH, UH, REUSE ARCHITECT FOR THE GAS WAY HOUSE. SO I HAVE A HISTORY WITH HISTORIC STRUCTURES. THIS IS A LAND OF HISTORY. THIS, THIS PLACE, ESPECIALLY FROM THE HASAM. AND 1200 YEARS AGO, USING IT AS A HUNTING AND FISHING CAMP AND DIGGING TRICKLES THAT ARE NOW, UH, DITCHES THAT WERE PROVIDED BY THE, UH, PIONEER DAYS. IT, THERE'S A LOT OF INTRIGUING, INTERESTING THINGS GOING ON HERE. I HAD A LOT OF THINGS TO SAY. IT'S BEEN COVERED BY, BY, UM, OLSON'S COUNSEL AND BY SOME OF THE OPPOSITION. SO I'M NOT GONNA REHASH ANY OF THAT. UH, IT WAS ALL, I THINK A LOT OF VALID POINTS. UH, AND WITH REGARD TO, UM, THE RIPARIAN ZONE, I THINK I'D LIKE TO LIMIT MY, UH, MY, UH, KIND OF DISCUSSION TO THAT. I, UM, I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT. WE LIVE IN A, A TYPICAL, ALTHOUGH IT'S NOT TYPICAL, WE LIVE IN A TYPICAL SCENARIO IN WESTERN RESORT AREAS WHERE THE WATERWAYS WERE THE FIRST SETTLED. IT'S HARD TO GET ACCESS TO THEM. THEY'VE BEEN DEVELOPED, THEY'RE CUT OFF, THEY'RE ALTERED. UH, THIS OAK CREEK AND THE VERDE RIVER ARE 90% PRIVATE LAND, MUCH OF WHICH HAS BEEN, UH, MANIPULATED. THERE ARE AGENCIES OUT THERE ON A, UH, A FED LEVEL. UH, AND, AND THE URBAN INTERFACE CODE WAS REFERENCED BY I THINK, SOME OF THE OPPOSITION. UM, AND I THINK IT'S VIABLE BECAUSE IT WAS FORMED TO DEAL WITH JUST EXACTLY WHAT WE HAVE BEFORE US. WHAT DO YOU DO ONCE THE LAND HAS BEEN, IN ESSENCE CHANGED? AND IT'S NOT THE WAY IT SHOULD BE. THERE ARE WAYS FROM UNDEVELOPED LAND LIKE THIS PARCEL, THESE PARCELS TO BARE WALLOW, WHICH TO MY KNOWLEDGE, IT, THERE'S NOT MUCH RIPARIAN ZONE LEFT THERE. IT'S PRETTY MUCH A LANDSCAPE RIGHT TO THE WATER'S EDGE. A COUPLE OF MY PROJECTS ARE THAT WAY. THE ONLY, THE ONLY LOTS I SEE THERE ARE THE LAST THREE UPSTREAM, [02:00:01] WHICH ARE INDEED A REAL BONAFIDE RIPARIAN ZONE. NOW, IF, IF AND WHEN THIS PROJECT GETS APPROVED, IF THEY CAN COOPERATE WITH HOMEOWNERS AND NEIGHBORS, AND I KNOW THESE PEOPLE, I KNOW THEY'RE NOT BEYOND THAT, IT WOULD BE TO EVERYONE'S BENEFIT TO LOOK AT WAYS, NOT ONLY BRING RIPARIAN BACK, FINGER IT INTO THE HERITAGE PROJECT, BUT BRING IT BACK INTO BARE WALLOW TOO. IT'S IN SMALL STEPS. MAYBE THE LAWNS START TO GO AWAY AND IT BEGINS TO LOOK MORE NATURAL. UH, I THINK IF WE CAN ALL LIVE TOGETHER AND WORK TOGETHER, OUR CITY WILL BE BETTER FOR THAT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU STEVEN. JAKE WEBER WILL BE FOLLOWED BY PANDORA HARRIS. HELLO MAYOR. COUNSEL, UH, MARTIN JACOB WEBER. I'VE LIVE IN THE VILLAGE OF OAK CREEK. I'VE BEEN IN, UH, GREATER SEDONA AREA SINCE 1981. WE OWN TWO HOMES IN SEDONA AND RESIDED HERE FOR OVER 20 YEARS BEFORE WE MOVED BACK OUT TO THE VILLAGE. UH, I CURRENTLY OWN THE GASAWAY HOUSE. UM, I WAS FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO PICK THAT UP IN 2017. I ALSO HAVE ANOTHER HISTORIC HOME IN CROSS CREEK. I WAS ABLE TO GET DOWN ON THE NATIONAL REGISTRY. THE GASAWAY HOUSE IS ON THE SEDONA LANDMARK, UH, REGISTRY. SO, UM, I'M HERE BECAUSE I'M WITHIN 300 FEET OF THE, UH, DEVELOPMENT. I'VE SENT IN LETTERS OF SUPPORT. I'VE FOLLOWED THE DEVELOPMENT. I'M NOT RELATED OR I DO NOT, UH, GO TO DINNER. WE DON'T, UH, YOU KNOW, UH, COINLIST WITH, UH, WITH THE OLSON OR THEIR TEAM. BUT OVER MY TIME IN SEDONA, OFTENTIMES WE SAW DEVELOPERS COME INTO TOWN AND WE SEE THEM LEAVE, AND THEY DO A QUICK, QUICK FLIP. YOU COULD TELL PEOPLE BY WHO THEY PUT AROUND THEM. I'M SO IMPRESSED BY THE TEAM THAT MR. OLSON HAS THAT I'VE BEEN ABLE TO SEE WITH THE, UH, PUBLIC, UM, UH, EVENTS THAT THEY PUT ON. I DIDN'T PARTICIPATE ON TELLING 'EM WHAT COLOR IT NEEDED TO BE AND WHAT ROCK AND SO FORTH. BUT EVERYTHING FROM HAWAII TO NEWPORT VILLAGE, ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS A SIMPLE GOOGLE AND THE TEAM THAT'S SITTING OVER HERE, AND THEY'RE COMING TO SEDONA. SEDONA HAS, WHAT, 16, 17,000 PEOPLE AND THEN ADD IN THE VILLAGE ON TOP OF THAT, WHERE DO WE GET OUR RESOURCES? OVER 3 MILLION PEOPLE IS WHAT KEPT ME IN BUSINESS, BUT WE CATER TO THE, UH, UH, TO THE CITIZENRY, TO THE LOCALS. OFTENTIMES THE LOCALS ONLY SPEND PART OF THE TIME HERE. SO IT'S IMPORTANT TO ME ON OWNING THE PROPERTY ACROSS THE STREET, THAT WE HAVE QUALITY DEVELOPMENTS AND COME HERE BECAUSE EVERY TIME WE CAN PUT A TOURIST IN A STAY, A MULTI STAY WHERE THEY STAY MORE THAN ONE DAY, UH, WE DON'T BECOME, UM, A CITY THAT ONLY HAS CONVENIENCE STORES AND THEY'RE STOPPING TO BUY ICE AND LIQUOR. UH, WE HAVE A REASON FOR THEM TO KEEP THE OTHER SERVICES FOR THE CITIZENRY ALIVE THAT YOU GUYS TRY TO TAKE CARE OF WITH THE TRAFFIC AND WITH THE OTHER PARTS. BUT THOSE ARE ALL FUNDED BY TOURIST DOLLARS. UH, I'M NOT SAYING IT'S NOT A BALANCE, BECAUSE THE EMOTION THAT COMES OUT OF THE RESIDENCE THAT HERE, THAT ARE APPEALING, I FEEL FOR THEM. AND I'VE SEEN THAT OVER THE 40 PLUS YEARS THAT I'VE BEEN HERE. UM, AND I CAN RELATE TO IT BECAUSE I HAD TO GO THROUGH PEOPLE THAT APPEALED THE GROCERY STORE GOING INTO THE VILLAGE OF OAK CREEK. AND AT THAT TIME IT WAS VERY EMOTIONAL FOR ME, FOR MY FAMILY. AND THOSE SAME PEOPLE SHOPPED WITH ME AFTER WE WERE THERE. SO I WOULD HOPE IT WOULD BE THE SAME THING WITH THE OLSON, UM, UH, PIECE. AND THAT WITH WHAT YOU'RE CHARGED WITH TODAY IS, UH, IT'S BEEN APPROVED AND IT WENT THROUGH, UH, THE, THE PROCESS. AND IT WENT OVER AND ABOVE, I BELIEVE, TO BE ABLE TO PROVE THAT THERE'RE GONNA BE A GOOD PART OF THE CITIZENRY OF SEDONA AND A BUSINESS THAT WILL ENHANCE THE COMMUNITY, ENHANCE THE AREA OF THE, UH, OF THAT, UH, SNUBBY HILL, UH, ZONE. THANK YOU, JUDGE. THANK YOU, JUDGE. UH, THANK YOU. THANK YOU. EX EXCUSE ME, UH, CALLING OUT. NO, NO. JAKE, YOU'RE GOOD. CALLING OUT OR STOPPING PEOPLE IS UP TO ME TO, TO DO THAT. OKAY. I, I KNOW MY JOB. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. OKAY. PANDORA HARRIS WILL BE FOLLOWED BY MICHAEL, WHO DID NOT LEAVE A LAST NAME, BUT RESIDES IN BEAR WALLOW. UM, I LIVE IN 2 8 7 SHELBY HILL ROAD. MY NAME'S, I LIVE AT 2 8 7 SHELBY HILL ROAD. I'VE NEVER BEEN, UM, EVEN SPOKEN TO BY THE PEOPLE OVER THERE EVER. UM, THE CITY OF SEDONA SHOULD NEVER APPROVE THIS PROJECT. I WAS IN THE MEETING THAT THEY HAD AT THE CREATIVE LIFE CENTER, AND IT PRETTY MUCH HAD ALREADY BEEN DECIDED BEFORE WE GOT THERE THAT THEY WERE GONNA ZONE A COMMERCIAL. UM, THE OTHER THING I WANT TO SAY IS THAT IN MY MIND, THE DEVELOPER HAS NOT, UM, MET THE CFA. THE LODGING IS NOT, [02:05:01] IS A LODGE, IT'S A HOTEL. IT'S A 70 UNIT HOTELS, NOT A BOUTIQUE HOTEL, WHICH IS WHAT WE ARE PROMISED. IT'S, UM, VERY, IT LOOKS LIKE A DUPLEX. THAT'S WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE. AND IT'S A TWO STORY DUPLEX. THE OTHER THING I DO NOT LIKE ABOUT IT IS THE FACT THAT THE TRAFFIC, EVERYONE HAS BEEN MENTIONED ABOUT THE F ROUNDABOUT. WELL, MY QUESTION TO EVERYBODY HERE IS, IF YOU HAVE AN OLD PERSON, AND I'M NOT THAT OLD, BUT BASICALLY THE FIRE RESPONSE TIME HAS NEVER BEEN DISCUSSED. WE HAVE AN F ROUNDABOUT AND I CAN TELL YOU RIGHT NOW DURING A HIGH PEAK TIME THAT THE FIRE DEPARTMENT OR THE AMBULANCE AT THIS TIME COULD NOT GO THERE. AND THE RESPONSE TIME REQUIRED TO SAY SOMEONE'S LIFE, SECONDLY, THE PARKING IS NEVER GONNA WORK. WE HAVE A NEW COFFEE SHOP ON SCH HILL ROAD. EVERYBODY PARKS UP THE SIDE OF THE ROAD. SO THE PARKING THAT THEY SAY THEY'RE GONNA ALLOW OR HAVE ON THEIR SITE IS NOT ENOUGH PARKING. SECONDLY, UM, I DO FEEL THAT TO A CERTAIN DEGREE, THAT, UM, IN THE BE BEGINNING IT WAS THE PEOPLE THAT WERE INVOLVED IN THE DISCUSSION WERE THE PEOPLE THAT WERE VESTED AND THEY WERE THE ONES THAT WERE GONNA GET THE MONEY FOR THE PROPERTIES. I DO THINK IT'S ABOUT THE MONEY, NOT JUST FOR THE, THE PEOPLE THAT THE PROPERTIES WERE BOUGHT OR THESE PEOPLE BOUGHT THE PROPERTIES FROM, BUT ALSO FROM THE BED TAX THAT THE CITY OF SEDONA IS GONNA GET FOR THIS PROPERTY. AND THAT'S ALL I HAVE TO SAY. OKAY. WELL THANK YOU VERY MUCH. PANDORA MICHAEL IS NEXT. WE BE FOLLOWED BY UH, CHRIS HUSS. I AM MIKE MCCARTHY. I LIVE ON BEAR WALLOW THERE ACROSS FROM NANCY THAT SPOKE EARLIER. AND, UH, FIRST I WANT TO THANK THE GROUP OVER HERE 'CAUSE I HAVE GIVEN THEM INPUT ABOUT MOVING THINGS TO THE SOUTH. AND THEY DID FOLLOW THAT, WHICH I THINK IS STILL A GOOD IDEA. AND PART OF WHAT THAT CAME ABOUT WITH IS, UH, THE SOUND THAT WE GET ON BARE WALLER. WE GET TREMENDOUS NOISE FROM WEDDINGS. AND BY TREMENDOUS NOISE, I MEAN THAT IF YOU'RE IN YOUR HOUSE WATCHING TV, YOU NO LONGER CAN HEAR IT. YOUR WINDOWS ARE RATTLING LIKE THAT TOO. AND IT'S JUST ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT WE DEAL WITH FROM THE HOTELS. AND SO MY CONCERNS, NOT SO MUCH WITH THIS HOTEL, BUT HOW THE CITY CAN MANAGE THE HOTELS THAT ARE ALONG THE CREEK THERE AND WHAT WE CAN DO. I MORE OPTIMISTIC AFTER BEING HERE TODAY AND THE LAST TWO MONTHS, UH, THERE'S BEEN SOME LESS WEDDINGS, LESS NOISE HITTING ME. AFTER I CAME TO YOUR MARCH MEETING AND I TALKED WITH YOU ABOUT SOUND MITIGATION, THAT THERE WAS NO SOUND MITIGATION IN YOUR 10 YEAR PLAN, UH, THAT THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDED TO THAT THERE TOO. TODAY THOUGH, JUST VERY TODAY, TO GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE, THERE ARE POWER WASHING AT THE HOTEL ACROSS FROM ME. IT'S AT 75 DECIMAL. AND YOU HEARD YOUR ENGINEER TALK ABOUT THAT EARLIER AT 60 75. DECIMALS, SOMETIMES AN HOUR, SOMETIMES THREE HOURS. JUST JUST ONE OF THESE ADDITIONAL KINDS OF NOISE THAT GOES ON. SO SOMEHOW WHEN YOU ADD A NEW HOTEL, IF THERE CAN BE A PLAN TO THINK ABOUT ALL THE OTHER OUTSIDE NOISE AND TO HAVE A PLAN TO DEAL WITH THAT THERE TOO. A COUPLE OF RECOMMENDATIONS I WOULD MAKE FOR THIS COUNSELOR TO CONSIDER. I KNOW THAT THERE'S A POLICE REPORT THAT INFORMATION GOES TO THE MAYOR, BUT IF THERE'S A COMPLAINT REPORT THAT DOESN'T NECESSARILY GO TO YOU. I THINK YOU SHOULD GET COPIES OF ALL COMPLAINTS. I'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS FOR FOUR YEARS TO REDUCE THE SOUND. IF I MADE A COMPLAINT, I POST IT, IT'D BE TAKEN DOWN THE NEXT DAY. SO I THINK YOU SHOULD HAVE A PLAN THAT YOU SEE, WHAT ARE ALL THE COMPLAINTS OUT THERE ON THAT PROCESS THERE TOO. THERE'S OTHER ISSUES WITH HOTELS TOO, IN TERMS OF NOISE FROM PEOPLE OF, UH, CELEBRATING TOO MUCH. HOW THEY HANDLE FIRE PITS, HOW THEY HANDLE THAT. THERE'S FIRE PITS ACROSS FROM ME. THEY RUN ALL NIGHT LONG, A HUNDRED YARDS FROM ANYBODY WATCHING THEM. WE'RE VERY AFRAID THAT THAT'S GONNA BE A FIRE THERE TOO. SO A LOT OF WHAT YOU'RE HEARING FROM THE RESIDENTS TODAY IS FEAR THAT WE'VE HAD FOR FOUR YEARS, UH, BECAUSE OF NOT PROPER MANAGEMENT THERE. AND SO I, I THINK THIS IS A RESPECTED GROUP. I THINK THEY'LL MANAGE PRETTY GOOD, BUT SOMEHOW COME UP WITH A PLAN HOW YOU'RE GONNA MANAGE THESE HOTELS. THANK YOU. OKAY, THANK YOU. UH, MICHAEL, UH, CHRIS HUSS WILL BE FOLLOWED BY ALEC CHAPMAN. UH, GOOD EVENING. UH, MY NAME'S CHRIS HUSA. I LIVE IN THE CHA AREA. UM, I'M NOT OPPOSED TO DEVELOPMENTS. I'M NOT EVEN OPPOSED TO THIS DEVELOPMENT. WHAT I'M OPPOSED OF IS HOW IT'S BEING HANDLED. LIKE MR. RIVER WAS SAYING. HE MADE A DEVELOPMENT. BUT IF YOU GO TO WHERE WEBER'S USED TO BE, WHICH IS ANOTHER STORE, THEY HAVE ACTUAL LANES TO GET OUT AND INTO THEIR STORE. THIS DOES NOT HAVE THAT. I CAN BE IN SNUBBY HILL ROAD IN THE ROUNDABOUT FOR TWO OR THREE MINUTES, AND THAT'S THIS BEFORE THIS DEVELOPMENT [02:10:01] STARTED. I'LL TELL YOU HOW BAD IT IS THAT COFFEE SHOP AT THE END OF THE STREET IS A SMALL SHOP THAT HAS PEOPLE BACKED UP THERE NOW. SO IMAGINE THIS HERE NOW WITHOUT ANY IMPLEMENTS OR TAKING CARE OF THAT, THAT'S, YOU GOTTA TAKE CARE OF THAT FIRST. WITHOUT THAT ALL THE OTHER STUFF I CAN REPEAT AND GO ON, THESE GUYS HAVE DONE A GREAT JOB ABOUT THAT, BUT IT'S GONNA BE DEVELOPED SOMEDAY OR WHATEVER IT IS. BUT UNTIL YOU TAKE CARE OF THIS, IT'S A HUGE PROBLEM. THAT, AND I HAVE SAID THAT FOR ALL, I DON'T KNOW, LAST FOUR YEARS, NOTHING. AND NOW, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY KNOWS THEY HAS A TRAFFIC PROBLEM. THIS HAS AN EXCEPTIONALLY BAD TRAFFIC PROBLEM. AND YOU HAVE, IF YOU PUT ANOTHER CROSSWALK WHERE THEY'RE TALKING TO BRING ANOTHER SIDEWALK DOWN AND YOU GOT A PEDESTRIAN WHEN THEY STOP IT, PEOPLE DON'T RUN OVER PEOPLE, THEY STOP. YOU KNOW? I MEAN, THAT CROSSWALK IS STOPS TRAFFIC. YOU CAN SEE IT BUILD UP BEFORE NOW YOU'RE GONNA HAVE SOMETHING COMING UP THE OTHER WAY NOW. AND THAT'S A BIG DEVELOPMENT. SO IF YOU WOULD CONSIDER THAT, 'CAUSE IT WILL BE DEVELOPED, LIKE I WAS SAYING, BUT HE, HE HAS ENTRANCES GOING TO HIS STORE. THIS DOES NOT, THAT'S ALL I'VE GOTTA SAY. THANK YOU. ALEX CHAPMAN WILL BE FOLLOWED BY SARAH WATTS. HI, MY NAME IS ALEC CHAPMAN, AND I OWN THE PROPERTY ACROSS THE STREET AT 1 26 S NLY HILL ROAD. UM, I'VE LIVED IN SEDONA ALMOST 20 YEARS NOW. UH, AND I'M 28. SO, UH, SO I JUST WANT TO BRING UP A FEW THINGS. UM, THE NOISE IS A REAL CONCERN. LIKE OTHERS, I'VE HEARD MUSIC FROM WEDDINGS INSIDE MY HOME, UM, FROM LABERT, UM, OUTSIDE, I CAN, I CAN HEAR NOISE FROM, UH, SECRET GARDEN CAFE, THE, UH, SOLOMON, THE GUITARIST WHO HAS A 10 INCH LITTLE AMP. THAT SOUND TRAVELS ALL THE WAY OVER TO ME, AND I CAN HEAR IT OUTSIDE MY PROPERTY. UM, THE MEETING ROOM SHOULD BE USED AS A MEETING ROOM AND NOT A WEDDING VENUE. AND A LOT OF WEDDINGS ARE OUTDOORS, SO, AND I UNDERSTAND THERE IS SOME SOUND MITIGATION GOING ON, BUT, UH, I THINK THAT NEEDS A LOT MORE INVESTIGATION. THE NOISE IS GONNA BE A REAL ISSUE OVER THERE. UH, IT ALSO MORE NOISE, UH, GET, YOU KNOW, UH, SCARES ANIMALS AWAY. I WATCH THEM EVERY DAY, COME FROM THE MOUNTAINS, GO DOWN MY DRIVEWAY LIKE OTHERS HAVE SAID, AND THEY GO GET WATER, AND THEY COME RIGHT BACK, UM, REGARDING, UH, YOU KNOW, POSSIBLE FIRE HAZARDS OVER THERE. UM, SO FOR EXAMPLE, MY NEIGHBORS FIRE INSURANCE RECENTLY WAS DROPPED BECAUSE, UH, THEY'RE NOT INSURING, AND THEY SAID THAT ACTUALLY, UH, WE'RE WORSE THAN PARADISE, CALIFORNIA. UH, IT'S HIGHER RISK. UH, SO THERE'S, UH, JUST REAL RISK THERE FOR EVACUATING PEOPLE, AND IT'S A SAFETY CONCERN. AND, UH, WITH THE TRAFFIC, I'D LIKE TO GIVE A SUGGESTION OF MAYBE A DOUBLE ROUNDABOUT AT THAT ROUNDABOUT, UH, THAT MIGHT HELP ALLEVIATE, UH, TRAFFIC. BUT THE NOISE IS A REAL CONCERN OF MINE, AND IT'S SO PEACEFUL AND QUIET OVER THERE. AND I, I DO NOT WANT THAT TO BE RUINED, AND I DON'T WANT TO BE CALLING ALL THE TIME TO COMPLAIN ABOUT NOISE COMPLAINTS AGAIN, LIKE OTHERS HAVE SAID. SO THANK YOU. THANK YOU, ALEC. SARAH WATTS WILL BE FOLLOWED BY, UH, MICHELLE TOM THOMAS. WELL, MICHAEL THOMAS. I, I CAN'T READ MICHELLE THOMAS, I BELIEVE. HI, SARAH. HI, UM, MAYOR, VICE MAYOR. COUNCIL, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME. I APPRECIATE THE LONG DAY YOU'VE HAD AND ADDING ALL OF OUR VOICES. I, I UNDERSTAND YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO THAT IN THE WAYS YOU RUN THE CITY, BUT, SO WE APPRECIATE THIS. THANK, JUST START WITH YOUR NAME. YOU HAVE TO SAY IT. SARAH WATTS. THANK YOU, WEST SEDONA. PERFECT. UM, SO I'M, UM, I WENT DOWN TO THE PROPERTY FOR THE SECOND TIME YESTERDAY, AND, UM, FOR THE FIRST TIME I WALKED ALONG THE CREEK, EVEN TO THE SOUTH SIDE, TO THE BACKYARDS OR THE RIPARIAN AREA OF THE PEOPLE WHOSE PROPERTIES HAVE BEEN BOUGHT. SO I KNOW PRETTY MUCH, UH, THE, THE BLACKBERRIES AND I KNOW PRETTY MUCH WHAT'S GOING ON RIGHT AT THE EDGE OF THE CREEK. UM, AND I CAN TELL SOME OF YOU HAVE BEEN DOWN THERE, IF YOU HAVEN'T, I'M IMPLORING YOU TO GO DOWN TO THE RIPARIAN AREA. THE BIG SYCAMORES THAT ARE AKIN TO THOSE IN QUE ARE DOWN THERE. AND THE TREE, THE TREE, UH, INVENTORY IS ON THE PACKET. AND IN THAT INVENTORY ARE SOME QUITE ASTONISHING THINGS LIKE A REDWOOD TREE. UM, THE BANK EROSION IS SOMETHING TO BE CONSIDERED THAT BANK ERODING DOES NOT EVEN CONFORM TO GOOGLE EARTH BECAUSE IT'S ERODING EVEN FASTER THAN [02:15:01] GOOGLE EARTH CAN MAP. THE ERODING. THERE IS NOW AN ISLAND ON THE SOUTH PART OF THE, OF THE PLAN, UM, WHERE THOSE CASITAS ARE CLOSEST TO BOTH THE RIPARIAN AREA AND THE FLOODWAY, THAT THERE IS AN ISLAND THAT'S BEEN CREATED AND SOME BANK, BANK EROSION. AND THERE'S SOME TREES ON THE ISLAND, UH, OUT IN THE MIDDLE THAT WON'T BE THERE LONG. THERE'S DEBRIS. THERE WAS A TREE, PROB, I'M GUESSING, 30 FEET TALL THAT HAD COME DOWN THE CREEK POINTING SOUTHWARD WITH ITS BRANCHES CAUGHT IN SOME OF THE TREES ON THE EDGE OF THE BANK, AND ITS ROOT BALL SITTING ON THE EDGE OF THE BANK TOO. SO EVEN IF YOU WERE TO BUILD SOMETHING THERE, THIS KIND OF STUFF IS GONNA COME DOWN THE CREEK AND THE CREEK'S GONNA DO WHAT THE CREEK WANTS TO DO, REGARDLESS OF THE LINES WE DRAW AND THE BUILDINGS WE BUILD. AND THERE'S ALSO A QUESTION ABOUT THE FLOODWAY. I, I QUESTION THE FLOODWAY MAP AND THE LINES BECAUSE ABOUT 130 FEET FROM THE CREEK UP, YOU CAN STILL SEE BIG, ROUND, SMOOTH ROCKS THAT THAT CREEK HAS PUT THERE. UM, AND 130 FEET IS A LONG WAY INTO THIS DEVELOPMENT FROM THE, THE EDGE OF THE CREEK, THE FLOOD HEIGHT. I HAVE PICTURES, ALL THESE PICTURES ON MY PHONE. ANYONE'S WELCOME TO SEE THEM. UH, WE HAVE A 15 FOOT TREE WITH FLOOD DEBRIS IN THE TOP OF THIS 15 FOOT TREE, AND WE TRIANGULATED IT, UM, AND FOUND ROUGHLY, UM, THE HEIGHT OF THE TREE, 15 FEET, AND IT'S 105 FEET AWAY FROM THE CREEK. THANK YOU, SARAH. YOU'RE WELCOME. THANK YOU, SCOTT. MICHELLE THOMAS. WE'LL BE FOLLOWED BY SUZANNE GOZA, G-O-S-Z-R, I BELIEVE. OKAY. HELLO, I'M MICHELLE THOMAS AND I, UM, RESIDE IN SCOTTSDALE, BUT I'M HERE ON BEHALF OF BARE WALLA, WHERE MY GRANDPA HAS A HOUSE. AND SOME OF THE THINGS IN THE PROJECT THAT I'VE MENTIONED MULTIPLE TIMES AS CONCERNS. R THERE'S A PUBLIC WALK PATH, THEY'RE PUTTING IT DOWN SCHLEY HILL ROAD AND THE PUBLIC WALK PATH DROPS PEOPLE OFF DOWN BARE WALLOW. IT'S DROPPING PEOPLE OFF INTO PRIVATE PROPERTY WHERE THE PEOPLE SUPPOSED TO GO FROM THERE. IT'S GONNA LEAD TO TRESPASSING. TRESPASSING IS A PROBLEM WE ALREADY HAVE. EVEN THE DEVELOPERS TOOK IT BEHIND UPON THEMSELVES TO GO INTO OUR NEIGHBORHOOD AND TAKE A PICTURE OF OUR HOUSE TO USE ON THEIR PACKET, EVEN THOUGH IT'S POSTED MULTIPLE TIMES THAT IT'S PRIVATE PROPERTY. IF THEY PUT A PUBLIC WALK PATH TO PRIVATE PROPERTY, WHAT DO THEY EXPECT PEOPLE TO DO? ADDITIONALLY, THE CITY OF SEDONA, WHAT THEY GET FROM THIS IS THEY GET A CREEK EASEMENT. AND THAT'S WHAT THE WHOLE CITY OF SEDONA HAS BEEN ALL WILD ABOUT. WELL, IF YOU LOOK AT THE CREEK ACCESS, THERE IS NO AVAILABILITY FOR ANYONE BESIDES RESORT GUESTS TO GO THERE. SO WHAT'S THE POINT OF A CREEK ACCESS IF NO ONE CAN GET THERE? YOU'RE HAVING A PUBLIC WALK PATH THAT'S CLOSE TO THE CREEK ACCESS, BUT IT'S NOT CONNECTED. SO PEOPLE ARE GONNA HAVE TO TRESPASS TO GET TO YOUR CREEK ACCESS. IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE. IT DOESN'T PROVIDE ANY PUBLIC VALUE TO ANYONE BESIDES THE HOTEL GUEST. ADDITIONALLY, WITH THE PEOPLE WALKING ACROSS THE STREET IN FRONT OF THE HOTEL ENTRANCE, THAT'S GONNA BE TRAFFIC. I MEAN, THE ONLY WAY TO GET INTO THE HOTEL IS GONNA BE A LEFT HAND TURN, A LEFT HAND TURN IN GENERALS TRAFFIC. YOU HAVE PEOPLE LEAVING THE RV PARK, AND A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T KNOW HOW TO DRIVE RVS. I WOULD NOT KNOW HOW TO DRIVE AN RV IF I HAD TO DRIVE ONE. YOU'RE GONNA HAVE PEOPLE GOING, WAITING FOR PEOPLE TO TURN LEFT. YOU HAVE RVS GOING DOWN THERE. IT'S A CURVED DRIVEWAY TO GET OUT OF BARE WALLOW. IT'S A TRAFFIC NIGHTMARE, LIKE THE WAY SNOBBY HILL IS. IT'S ONE WAY IN, ONE WAY OUT. THERE'S NOT EVEN A SUICIDE LANE. AND YOU'RE GONNA ADD ADDITIONAL CARS, PEOPLE THAT DON'T KNOW WHERE THEY'RE GOING, MAKING LEFT TURNS, AND THEN, HEY, LET'S PUT A PEDESTRIAN PATH RIGHT IN THE FRONT OF IT. I MEAN, IT SOUNDS LIKE LITERALLY A TRAFFIC NIGHTMARE TO A ROUNDABOUT THAT ALREADY HAS HORRIBLE PROBLEMS. UM, I, I JUST REALLY THINK THAT THE PROJECT IS NOT THINKING OF THE RESIDENCE OR THE TRAFFIC IT'LL CAUSE, AND EVEN THE PARKING WHERE IT'S 90 PARKING SPOTS, WHEN IT SHOULD BE 204 BY CODE, WHERE ARE THE EXTRA PEOPLE GONNA PARK? ARE THEY'RE GONNA GO, YOU KNOW, START PARKING DOWN BARE WALLOW? ARE THEY GONNA PARK DOWN SNUBBY HILL? WHAT HAPPENS IF THEY GET OVER THE 90 CARS? BECAUSE IN ALL OF THE PLAN, I DON'T SEE ANY, ANY BACKUP FOR THAT. DO THEY HAVE ANOTHER PIECE OF LAND THEY'RE PURCHASING? THEY'RE GONNA PUT THEIR CARS THERE LATER, AND THEY JUST DON'T LET ANYONE KNOW ABOUT THEIR PLAN. I JUST REALLY DON'T THINK THAT THE PLAN HAS THE RIGHT INFORMATION IN ORDER TO APPROVE IT IN THE FIRST PLACE. ADDITIONALLY, I DON'T THINK THAT FOR THE CITY OF SEDONA, IF YOU GO TRAFFIC IS A CONCERN AND YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR RESIDENCE, THIS ISN'T FOR THEM. THAT'S ALL. THANK YOU SO MUCH. WELL, THANK YOU. OKAY. SUZANNE WILL BE FOLLOWED BY, UH, JACK ARMSTRONG. MY NAME'S SUZANNE GOSAR. I HAVE OWNED [02:20:01] MY PROPERTY IN SEDONA SINCE 1985. IT'S ALMOST ADJACENT TO, UM, THE DEVELOPMENT THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, PERHAPS IN APPROVING. MY OBJECTION IS ALWAYS, NATURE HAS NO VOICE. WE ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF A HISTORIC DROUGHT. AND TO APPROVE ANYTHING THAT IS GOING TO TAKE MORE WATER IS, IN MY OPINION, IRRESPONSIBLE AND NOT A GOOD IDEA. BUT THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR LETTING US EXPRESS OUR OPINION, AND PLEASE ALWAYS THINK ABOUT THE WATER ISSUE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, SUZANNE. OKAY, WE HAVE JACK ARMSTRONG AND THEN, UH, MICHAEL THOMAS. HELLO, I'M JACK. I'M HERE FROM, UM, THE ARIZONA REPUBLIC, JACK ARMSTRONG. UM, I JUST, THIS WON'T TAKE THREE MINUTES. I COULD YOU PLEASE START WITH, YOU SAID YOUR NAME, CITY OF RESIDENCE? UM, YEAH, I LIVE IN PHOENIX. THANK YOU. AND, UM, I WON'T NEED THREE MINUTES. I JUST HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE DEVELOPERS. I'M CURIOUS IF YOU'D BE ABLE TO ADDRESS SOME OF THE MORE SPECIFIC ENVIRONMENTAL CONCERNS THE APPELLANTS BROUGHT UP. UM, I'M SORRY, THIS IS NOT THAT FOR THAT YOU CAN'T ASK THE DEVELOPERS. YOU, YOU'RE GIVING YOUR COMMENTS TO US, THE COUNCIL, AND THEN WE WILL, WE'LL, WE WILL BE ANSWERING THEM LATER. IF YOU WANNA DO AN INTERVIEW, YOU SHOULD HAVE CONTACTED THE DEVELOPER, UH, PRIOR TO OR AFTER TODAY. I'M SORRY. I SPOKE WITH ONE OF THE COUNSELORS AND HE TOLD ME I COULD RELEASE A QUESTION. IF THEY CHOOSE TO ANSWER, THEY COULD DO. SO. THAT'S OKAY. YOU CAN'T, SO YOU'LL HAVE A, A COMMENT TO MAKE TO US ABOUT THE PROJECT FOR OUR COMMUNITY. WE'LL, WE'D LOVE TO HEAR WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY, BUT IT'S REALLY NOT TO CONDUCT AN INTERVIEW FROM OUR PODIUM. I UNDERSTAND. THANK YOU. OKAY, THANK YOU. MICHAEL THOMAS IS THE LAST QUESTION, UH, THE LAST CARD. IF ANYBODY ELSE HAS ANYTHING MORE THAT THEY'D LIKE TO SAY BY, BY ALL MEANS, UH, FILL OUT A CARD NOW. HELLO, I'M MIKE THOMAS. I LIVE IN MESA, ARIZONA. MY FAMILY OWNS PROPERTY UP HERE, AND I'VE BEEN COMING UP TO SEDONA FOR OVER FOUR YEARS. UM, MY CONCERN IS THE CRITICAL HABITAT HAS THAT BEEN ADDRESSED WITH THE US FISH AND WILDLIFE SERVICE? I'M A AVID OUTDOORS MAN, AND WE HAVE A LOT OF CRITICAL HABITAT. AND TO THINK THAT WE'RE GONNA JUST DISTURB ANY OF THAT HABITAT IN THERE WHEN WE HAVE TWO THREATENED SPECIES THAT ARE LISTED UNDER THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT, THAT HAS TO BE PRESERVED. I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW THIS EVER GOT A PASSED IN ZONING WITHOUT THAT MINIMUM, YOU KNOW, THING BEING ADDRESSED. NOW, IF THAT'S NOT THE CRITICAL HABITAT, THEN THAT'S, YOU KNOW, ONE THING. AND THEN THE OTHER QUESTION I HAVE IS, I SAW IN THE THINGS THAT THERE'S, THE ZONING WAS APPROVED FOR 11.8 ACRES, BUT THE, SOME OF THE DATA SHOWED THAT IT WAS ONLY 11.4 ACRES. DOES THAT MAKE WHAT WAS PUT PUT IN FOR THE ZONING APPROVAL? IF THE, IF THE ACREAGE IS INACCURATE, HOW COULD YOU APPROVE THAT? AND THAT IN THERE, AND I SAW SOME THINGS WHERE THE PROPERTY BEEN CHANGED, WHERE THE EASEMENT THAT WE HAVE TO GO INTO BARE WALLOW IS NOW TAKEN OFF ONE OF THE PROPERTIES TO MAKE IT LOOK LIKE IT'S BIGGER THAN IT ACTUALLY IS. AND SO I'M NOT SURE IF THAT'S ALL ACCURATE, BUT THAT IS SOMETHING THAT SHOULD REALLY BE ADDRESSED BECAUSE IF THIS IS ALL BASED ON 11.88 ACRES AND IT'S NOT 11 POINT ACRES, THEN I THINK THE WHOLE ZONING THING SHOULD BE REJECTED AND REDONE. AND, UM, YOU KNOW, WITH ALL THIS THING, I'VE BEEN FISHING THAT SECTION OF THE RIVER FROM THE BRIDGE UP FOR, YOU KNOW, 40 YEARS. AND I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE FISH IN THERE. AND THERE'S SOME ENDANGERED SPECIES OF FISH THAT IS IN THAT HABITAT TOO. UM, THE GAME AND FISH HAS STOCKED GILA TROUT, WHICH WAS AN ENDANGERED SPECIES THAT THEY BROUGHT BACK. THAT'S UP IN THE WEST FORK, BUT IT'S INTO THE OAK CREEK TOO. AND THERE'S A LOT OF THIS, YOU KNOW, YOU TALK ONE OUTTA ONE SIDE OF YOUR MOUTH, THE COUNCIL AND THE CITY DOES, AND THEN YOU GUYS GO AND YOU MAKE THESE, YOU KNOW, DEVELOPMENTS WHERE YOU TAKE AWAY WHAT MAKES SEDONA SPECIAL. AND THERE'S A LITTLE SECTION OF, OF THE RIPARIAN AREA LEFT. AND THIS IS A REAL BIG PART THAT'S IN THE MIDDLE OF TOWN THAT'S GONNA BE, YOU KNOW, CHANGED IF THEY'RE GONNA TAKE DOWN TREES. NOW, IF THEY'RE NOT GONNA DISTURB IT, AND THEY'RE GONNA PUT SOME HABITAT IN THERE, MAYBE TRANSPLANT SOME OF THE YELLOW BELT, UM, CUCKOO INTO THE AREA AND, AND, YOU KNOW, PRESERVE SOME OF THE AREA. SO THIS, THE, THE, UH, NARROW HEADED GARTER SNAKE. AND I ALSO THINK SOME OF THIS HABITAT IS ALSO, UM, FOR THE MEXICAN GARTER SNAKE THAT IS ALSO ENDANGERED. SO THERE'S A LOT OF STUFF IN THERE THAT, UM, WE [02:25:01] JUST SAW THE ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS SUE THE FOREST SERVICE ABOUT THE SALT RIVER, UM, HORSES. AND I'M PRETTY SURE THAT A LOT OF THESE ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS THAT THEY HEAR THAT WE'RE GONNA DISTURB CRITICAL HABITAT FOR ENDANGERED SPECIES ARE GONNA TACK THE RESOURCES OF THIS CITY WITH LAWSUITS. AND THEY'RE KNOWN FOR DOING IT. THEY SUE, THEY SUE, THEY SUE THE STATE, THEY SUE THE FOREST SERVICE AND ALL THAT. AND SO, OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. OKAY. UH, JOE, ANY ADDITIONAL CARDS? I DIDN'T SEE ANYBODY. THERE'S ONE MINUTE. OH, THERE IS. OKAY. YOU HAVE TO GIVE IT TO THE, UH, CITY CLERK AND THEN YOU CAN COME UP AND TALK. ANY OTHER CARDS? ANY OTHER PEOPLE INTERESTED? OKAY, MA'AM, COME UP TO THE MICROPHONE. START WITH YOUR NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE. UH, MY NAME IS, UH, DR. DONNA SIGLIA, AND I LIVE IN SEDONA. AND I'VE BEEN HERE SINCE, UM, UM, 1988. AND, UH, WHAT I WANTED TO SAY IS, I, I KNOW WE TALKED ABOUT, WE SAW THE FLOOD PLAIN AND, AND ALL THE WATER. BUT, YOU KNOW, WHEN I FIRST CAME HERE, I THOUGHT, OH, WELL, YEAH, OKAY, OUR LITTLE CREEK IS NOT GONNA GET CARRIED AWAY. WELL, I'VE SEEN A LOT OF FLOODS. I MEAN THAT THE WATER, LIKE IN WHAT, 2014? I CAN'T REMEMBER ALL THE TIMES THAT, UM, IT FLOODED, BUT IT FLOODED UP UNDER THE BRIDGE. I MEAN, AND IT CAME UP ALMOST OVER THE BRIDGE, NOT OVER THE SIZE OF THE BRIDGE, BUT THE, WHEN THE WATER COMES, IT COMES. AND SO, I DON'T KNOW , WHY ANYONE WOULD EVEN CONSIDER BUILDING BY A FLOODPLAIN OR WHATEVER YOU'RE GONNA CALL IT, BECAUSE WHEN THAT WATER MOVES, IT MOVES THOSE TREES LIKE YOU CAN'T BELIEVE. SO I JUST WANTED TO SAY IT REALLY FLOODS WHEN IT FLOODS. SO I REMEMBER TO LOCK A HOCKEY, JUST CARS JUST TOPPLED OVER AND, YOU KNOW, ALL THOSE TO THE PRETTY STORES. WATER WAS UP LIKE FEET, YOU KNOW, DESTROYING THINGS. SO, UM, IT'S, IT'S A REALITY. THAT'S WHAT I WANTED TO SAY. SO, OKAY. THANK YOU, DONNA. OKAY, WE'RE GOING TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD, BRING IT BACK TO COUNCIL. AND, UM, HOW DO YOU WANNA DO THIS AS FAR AS BRINGING PE EVERYBODY REBUTTAL FIRST. AH, THERE'S A FIVE MINUTE REBUTTAL. YES. GENERALLY. AND THEN I DO THAT BEFORE THEN. COUNCIL GOES, GOES LAST. OH, I THOUGHT YOU'D WANNA DO US FIRST, BUT, OKAY. FIVE MINUTE REBUTTAL. SO LET'S GO F BACK IN THE SAME ORDER WE STARTED BEFORE. YES. COME BACK OVER HERE IF THAT WORKS FOR YOU, OR THE PODIUM, WHICHEVER WORKS QUICKER UP HERE. I WOULD THINK SO, BUT WE HAVE TO SAY, UH, WE STILL, UH, SEDONA RESIDENCE UNITE. WE STILL CONTEND THAT THE CFA IS PART OF THE ZONING DOCUMENT. IT PROVIDES THE RESTRICTIONS AND CONDITIONS UNDER WHICH DEVELOPMENT CAN OCCUR. IT TALKS ABOUT SCALE, TALKS ABOUT TRAFFIC, TALKS ABOUT PROTECTION OF THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. AND I'M SURE BY THE END OF THE NIGHT, UH, OUR WONDERFUL MAYOR, I MEAN, ATTORNEY WILL OPINE AS TO WHO HAS THE RIGHT ANSWER ON THIS. I'M SURE THE MAYOR WILL JUMP IN THERE TOO. MARK'S GONNA TALK ABOUT THE, UH, RIPARIAN COURT. THANKS, MARK BROOK WITH, UH, SEDONA RESIDENCE UNITE. I JUST WANTED TO COMMENT, UH, QUICKLY ON TRAFFIC ISSUES. UH, I, I THINK THAT WE'VE NEVER SEEN ANY KIND OF COMPARISON FROM THE DEVELOPER ON PEAK HOUR OF, UH, RESIDENTIAL VERSUS THE, THE TRAFFIC LOADING THAT THEY WOULD, UH, PUT ON. I THINK THAT'S A KEY QUESTION THAT NEEDS TO BE ANSWERED. I THINK OUR ANALYSIS SHOWS THAT RESIDENTIAL WOULD HAVE A MUCH LOWER IMPACT ON TRAFFIC, UH, IN THIS AREA. SECONDLY, IN JUST TALKING ABOUT THE RIPARIAN AREA, THERE BEEN SOME VERY GOOD COMMENTS FROM OTHER FOLKS ON THE IMPORTANCE OF THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. I WAS, UH, IT WAS VERY HELPFUL THAT THE, UH, LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT FROM THE DEVELOPER, UH, NOTED THAT THE 500 YEAR, UH, FLOODPLAIN IS PART OF THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. UH, IT PROVIDES COVER AND HABITAT FOR ANIMALS, AND IT'S CRITICAL, UH, TO, UH, TO SEDONA. AND I THINK IT'S PART OF OUR, IT'S PART OF OUR, UH, OUR NATURE. WE, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S, UH, RETAINED. WHAT'S KIND OF CONCERNING TO ME IN LOOKING AT THE RENDERINGS IS THEY TALK ABOUT THE FACT THAT IT'S, IT'S MINIMAL IMPACT. BUT EVERYWHERE I LOOK, I SEE A, UH, HIGHLY MANICURED LANDSCAPE WITH MAYBE SOME, UH, UH, RIPARIAN, UH, UH, PLANTS THAT ARE USED, BUT IT'S PATHWAYS AND WALKWAYS THAT ARE GONNA BE GARDENED AND LANDSCAPED, AND IT'S, IT'S, IT'S NOT GONNA BE THE TYPE OF HABITAT THAT'S REALLY ESSENTIAL, UH, TO MAINTAINING THE WILDLIFE IN OUR AREA. AND FINALLY, UH, UH, BEING A, A CIVIL ENGINEER AND, AND LIKE TO GET INVOLVED IN STORM WATER, I AM VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE, UH, THE FLOOD RISKS. I KNOW INITIALLY I TALKED IN, UH, IN THE ORIGINAL FILING ABOUT THE BIG THOMPSON, UH, AND THE FLOOD THAT TOOK PLACE THERE, VERY SIMILAR HABITAT OR, UH, CREEK TO THIS, UH, GOING INTO ROCKY MOUNTAIN NATIONAL PARK. THEY HAD A, A LARGE STORM THERE THAT STALLED MONSOON [02:30:01] STORM IN JULY, KILLED 144 PEOPLE, DESTROYED 400 CARS, DESTROYED 400 STRUCTURES, UH, THAT COULD VERY EASILY TAKE PLACE HERE, ESPECIALLY WITH BURN SCARS AND INCREASED INTENSITY STORMS. SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, YOU KNOW, AS COUNSELORS, YOU, YOU, YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY CAN GET INSURANCE TO PROTECT THEIR PROPERTIES, BUT I THINK, UH, IT BEHOOVES YOU TO MAKE SURE THAT, UH, WE DON'T PUT DEVELOPMENT IN HARM'S WAY. UH, WE CAN GET FLOWS OUT THERE THAT ARE EIGHT TO 12 FEET PER MINUTE, AND I KNOW THE WHITEWATER RAFTERS IN THE GROUP KNOW THAT THAT'S A LOT OF, THAT'S A LOT OF VELOCITY AND, AND CAN DO A LOT OF DAMAGE AND CAUSE A LOT OF DESTRUCTION AND DEATH. AND WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE THAT WITHIN SADA. SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH. AND, UH, I THINK THAT'S ALL WE'VE GOT. OKAY. THANK YOU. OKAY. I APPRECIATE THAT. OKAY, THEN WE'LL GO BACK WITH, UH, UH, LAUREN THOMAS AND CHRISTINE WAGNER. EITHER OR BOTH. HOLD ON ONE SECOND WHILE WE SET THE CLOCK. OKAY. WE'RE GOOD ON THE CLOCK. THANK YOU. CITY COUNCIL, YOU HAVE BEEN ELECTED TO EXERCISE AND PROMOTE THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE AT SEDONA TO TAKE REASONED ACTION AND TO EXERCISE SOUND DISCRETION IN MAKING DECISIONS THAT WILL SUPPORT THE COMMUNITY AND BE OF SERVICE TO IT. NOW, I WANNA ADDRESS THE DEVELOPER ATTORNEY'S COMMENTS OVER HERE THAT YOU HAVE NO DISCRETIONARY AUTHORITY. THIS IS AN ADMINISTRATIVE THING, JUST BECAUSE THEY THINK THAT THEIR PROJECT MEETS THE CFA AND THE OC ZONE CRITERIA. WELL, THAT IS NOT THE CASE. IF, IF THAT LINE OF THOUGHT WAS TRUE, DISCRETIONARY, DISCRETIONARY REVIEW OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION WOULD NOT BE NEEDED. IN FACT, IT IS BECAUSE THE PLANNING COMMISSION DID NOT EXERCISE THEIR DISCRETION THAT WE HAVE THIS APPEAL. LD, LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE 8.3 E FIVE IS THE APPEAL. IT'S THE APPROVAL CRITERIA APPLICABLE TO ALL ZONING APPLICATIONS. THIS IS THE CRITERIA THAT WE PUT UP BEFORE, UM, IT'S HERE. AND IT SPEAKS TO NOT, IT SPEAKS TO COMPLIANCE WITH CODE AND OTHER APPLICABLE REGULATIONS. IT ALSO SPEAKS TO CONSISTENCY WITH SEDONA COMMUNITY PLAN AND OTHER APPLICABLE PLANS SHALL WEIGH COMPETING PLANS, GOALS AND STRATEGIES. THIS IS DISTRESS DISCRETIONARY ACTION. UM, UNDER LDC, UM, APPEAL LANGUAGE 8.8 E, SECTION THREE E. THE APPROVAL CRITERIA FOR APPEALS BY THIS BODY, ONE OF THEM IS, UM, YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE APPROPRIATE DECISION MAKING BODY SHALL CONSIDER THE FOLLOWING, IN DETERMINING WHETHER TO AFFIRM, REVERSE OR AMEND A DECISION OR INTERPRETATION MADE BY ANOTHER DECISION MAKING BODY INTERPRETATION. UM, ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS IS, DID THE, YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE REQUIREMENTS AND INTENT OF APPLICABLE STANDARDS FOR THIS CODE. THIS COUNCIL KNOWS THAT IT HAS DISCRETIONARY AUTHORITY AND SHOULD EXERCISE THAT DISCRETIONARY AUTHORITY IN REVIEWING THIS PROJECT. HOLD ON A MINUTE. NOW, I'M GONNA TRY TO GET THROUGH MY, THE REST OF MY CLOSING ARGUMENTS, BECAUSE THIS IS SIMPLY NOT AN EMOTIONAL APPEAL. THROUGH OUR APPEAL AND ADDENDUM DOCUMENTS PREVIOUSLY SUBMITTED TO YOU, AS WELL AS OUR PRESENTATION TODAY, WE HAVE PRESENTED NUMEROUS LEGAL AND FACTUAL ARGUMENTS AND BASIS FOR REVERSING PLAN, COMMISSION APPROVAL, LEGAL AND FACTUAL ARGUMENTS THAT SERVE AS RATIONALE FOR CITY COUNCIL TO TAKE CORRECTIVE ACTION AND DENY THE DEVELOPMENT PERMIT. IN OUR REVIEW OF THE DEVELOPER'S APPLICATION SUBMITTAL DOCUMENTS AND STAFF REPORT FINDINGS, WE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT THE DEVELOPER APPLICATION SUBMITTAL MATERIALS ARE TO VARYING DEGREES, INCOMPLETE, INACCURATE, NON-COMPLIANT, CONTRADICTORY, MISLEADING, AND OR OUTDATED. AND THAT VARIOUS DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT STAFF REPORT FINDINGS HAVE BEEN IDENTIFIED TO BE INACCURATE CONCLUSORY AND ARE NOT SUPPORTED BY THE FACTS OR APPLICATION OF LEGAL CRITERIA. IN SO DEMONSTRATING, WE HAVE ARGUED THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION'S BLANKET ADOPTION OF THE STAFF REPORT FINDINGS AND RECOMMENDATIONS AND RESULTING APPROVAL OF THE DEVELOPMENT PERMIT TO BE AN ABUSE OF ITS DISCRETION AND AN ERROR IN I'LL REVIEW AND APPLICATION OF LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE 8.3 E FIVE REVIEW CRITERIA TO THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT. WE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT THE SCHLEY HILLS, CFA, AND THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE AREA ZONING DISTRICT CODE PROVISIONS HAVE CREATED UNEQUAL LAND USE OPPORTUNITIES AND RESTRICTIONS FOR PROPERTIES WITHIN THE CFA BOUNDARY, LARGELY TO THE DETRIMENT OF PREEXISTING RESIDENTIAL AND OWNERS, WHICH IS A CONSTITUTIONAL CONCERN, A CONSTITUTIONAL EQUAL PROTECTION CONCERN. WE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT THE DEVELOPMENT DOES NOT COMPLY WITH NOR CONFORM TO THE SEDONA COMMUNITY PLAN. THE CITY'S GUIDING DOCUMENT WITH REGARDS TO ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AND SUSTAINABILITY, VITAL RESOURCE CONSERVATION, TRAFFIC AND CIRCULATION, HOUSING, PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY AND WELFARE, LOCAL ECONOMY, AND [02:35:01] RESPONSIBLE TOURISM. WE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT AND APPLICATION HAS NOT, OR DOES NOT COMPLY WITH VARIOUS PROVISIONS OF THE SEDONA LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND CITY CODE AND OTHER APPLICABLE REGULATIONS. WE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT WILL SIGNIFICANTLY AND ADVERSELY IMPACT THE SURROUNDING NEIGHBORHOODS, INCLUDING BARE WALLOW ENCLAVE. WE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT WILL SIGNIFICANTLY AND ADVERSELY IMPACT THE NATURAL ENVIRONMENT, INCLUDING CRITICAL HABITAT AND SENSITIVE OAK CREEK ECOSYSTEM AND RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. WE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT APPLICATION DOES NOT SATISFY THE CRITERIA TO PROVIDE FOR ADEQUATE ROAD SYSTEMS. AND TRAFFIC MITIGATION WILL INCREASE TRAFFIC AND WILL EXACERBATE ROADWAY CIRCULATION PROBLEMS. WE HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT APPLICATION DOES NOT SHOW THAT ADEQUATE PUBLIC SERVICES AND FACILITIES EXIST TO ACCOMMODATE PROPOSED COMMERCIAL USES OF THE RESORT, INCLUDING, BUT NOT TO ROADS, POTABLE WATER, SEWER, FIRE PROTECTION, AND EMERGENCY INGRESS AND EGRESS ACCESS. NOR HAS THE DEVELOPMENT APPLICATION SHOWN THAT ADEQUATE LEVELS OF SERVICE TO EXISTING DEVELOPMENT WILL BE MAINTAINED GIVEN THE HOST OF ERRORS. THANK MUCH COMMISSIONS AND UNCERTAINTIES SURROUNDING THE BOOK ABOUT THANK MUCH. EXCUSE ME. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. OKAY. NOW, GENTLEMEN, YOU WANNA COME BACK UP AND YOU COULDN'T LET HER FINISH. EXCUSE ME. YOU COULDN'T LET HER FINISH. I DON'T, IT WAS INTERESTING. YEAH. GENTLEMEN, IF YOU'D LIKE TO, UH, STEP UP. LET HER FINISH. EXCUSE ME. THIS IS, I'M RUNNING THE MEETING. EVERYBODY HAS THE SAME AMOUNT OF TIME. THAT'S JUST THE WAY IT IS. HE DIDN'T YOU LET HIM GO FOR ANOTHER MINUTE? IF YOU'RE NOT HAPPY, SIR, UH, YOU CAN GO OUTSIDE. IT'S YOUR CHOICE. I'M NOT ASKING YOU TO LEAVE, BUT IF YOU, IF I'M NOT RUNNING THE MEETING TO YOUR SATISFACTION, WE TREAT EVERYBODY THE SAME HERE. EVERYBODY HAS THE SAME AMOUNT OF TIME. FIVE MINUTES. THAT'S GENTLEMEN FOR FIVE MINUTES, WOULD YOU? YEAH. ONE WOULD YOU LIKE TO, DO THEY HAVE 10? UH OH, DID THEY GET 10? NO, THERE WERE TWO APPEALS. AND SO THEY GET TO RESPOND TO BOTH. UH, SO IT COULD BE 10. YES. THERE WERE A LOT OF QUESTIONS AND THINGS POSED TO YOU, NOT, NOT EVEN FROM US, US YET, BUT THE PUBLIC. IF YOU WANNA ADDRESS SOME OF THOSE, IT'S YOUR CHOICE TO FI TO FINISH UP MAYOR, MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL. THINGS SUCH AS THE LAND USE. THERE WAS A ZONING CASE IN 2020. THE QUESTIONS THAT ARE BEING ASKED REGARDING IS THE USE PERMITTED IS THE APPROPRIATE USE FOR THE SITE. THAT WAS ALL DECIDED BY THE CITY COUNCIL BACK IN 2020 WITH RESPECT TO TRAFFIC. IF THERE WAS A CONCERN BY THE COUNCIL THAT THERE WERE JUST TOO MANY BUILDINGS, TOO MUCH SQUARE FOOTAGE, TOO MANY ADDITIONAL USES THAT ARE OTHERWISE PERMITTED, AND THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO DO EVERYTHING FROM THE WEDDINGS, EVERYTHING FROM THE RESTAURANTS, ALL THOSE THINGS ARE PERMITTED UNDER THE CODE. IF THE COUNCIL IN 2020 DETERMINED THAT THE TRAFFIC GENERATION WOULD BE TOO GREAT BY THE NUMBER OF BUILDINGS AND THE USES THAT ARE THERE, THE COUNCIL HAD THE ABILITY TO RESTRICT THEM. YOU DIDN'T, ESPECIALLY WITH THE SI, ESPECIALLY WITH THE SIZE OF THE BUILDINGS, LOCATIONS OF THE BUILDINGS. IF THIS COUNCIL DECIDED WE DON'T WANT ANY BUILDINGS IN ANY OF THE FLOODPLAINS, THE COUNCIL COULD HAVE RESTRICTED THEM AS PART OF THE ZONING. UM, WITH RESPECT TO, UH, AGAIN, THAT GOES TO THE ENVIRONMENT. THE BOTTOM LINE IS THE COUNCIL LOOKED AT ALL OF THE THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN RAISED TONIGHT. THEY HAD THE ABILITY TO CONSIDER ALL OF THE ISSUES THAT ARE BEING RAISED TONIGHT. AND THE COUNCIL MADE A DECISION, THEY MADE A DECISION TO APPROVE IT WITHOUT ANY RESTRICTIONS THAT ARE BEING SUGGESTED TODAY. AND AS I'VE MENTIONED, YOU COULD HAVE, YOU COULD HAVE RESTRICTED THEM TO A SITE PLAN, BUILDING LOCATIONS, NUMBER OF BUILDINGS, PARKING SPACES, ALL OF THOSE THINGS. YOU HAD THE ABILITY, OR THE COUNCIL SITTING AT THE TIME IN 2020 HAD THE ABILITY TO RESTRICT. THEY DID NOT, YOU'RE NOT BEING ASKED TONIGHT, RIGHT. ABOUT APPROVING THE, THE DEVELOPMENT [02:40:01] PLAN, WHICH IS ADMINISTRATIVE, WHERE YOU ARE RESTRICTED WITH RESPECT TO YOUR ABILITY TO EXERCISE DISCRETION, BECAUSE THEY'RE ASKING YOU TO CHANGE THE UNDERLYING ZONING, RIGHT? THERE'S NOT A ZONING CASE IN FRONT OF YOU RIGHT NOW. THERE'S SIMPLY A SITE PLAN AND BUILDING ELEVATIONS AND A LANDSCAPE PLAN. THAT'S THE ONLY THING WITHIN YOUR PURVIEW. AND AS LONG AS THEY ARE WITHIN WHAT'S PERMITTED AS A MATTER OF RIGHT, WAS PERMITTED UNDER THE ZONING WAS PERMITTED AS A MATTER OF LAW, YOU HAVE TO APPROVE IT. IF THEY WENT ASTRAY, IF THEY BUILT THREE, FOUR STORY BUILDINGS, OR THEY WENT TOO MUCH DENSITY, RIGHT? OR ANYTHING, THAT'S, AND THAT'S WHY YOUR STAFFED DOES SUCH A GREAT JOB OF THE ANALYSIS. AND THAT'S WHY YOUR PLANNING COMMISSION, NOT ONE PERSON SAID NO. AND THE REASON IS WHAT'S PERMITTED. SO UNDER THESE CIRCUMSTANCES, RIGHT, WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT A SITE PLAN. WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT, UH, LANDSCAPE PLAN. WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT BUILDING ELEVATIONS, NONE OF WHICH WE'RE RESTRICTED OR CONDITIONS AS PART OF THE UNDERLYING ZONING CASE. THEY'RE ASKING YOU TO CHANGE THE ZONING, RIGHT? THAT'S NOT SOMETHING YOU CAN DO. TRAFFIC IS IS NOT UP FOR DISCUSSION. THE USES ARE NOT UP FOR DISCUSSION. LOCATION OF BUILDINGS ARE NOT UP FOR DISCUSSION AS LONG AS WE'VE COMPLIED WITH THE LAW AND THE RULES, RIGHT? THAT'S ALL THAT THIS ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS IS ABOUT. SO, UH, I'LL JUST ADD A LAST COMMENT. WE, UM, WE'VE GONE THROUGH A RIGOROUS PROCESS. WE HAVE TAKEN NUMEROUS MEETINGS OUT THE SITE, UH, MET WITH OUR NEIGHBORS AND WHOEVER ELSE WE COULD GET TO COME. WE'VE MADE NUMEROUS CHANGES. UM, WE'VE COME TO PLANNING THREE TIMES AND HEARD A LOT OF, UM, INPUT. AND WE'VE MADE CHANGES TO THOSE. WE'VE BROUGHT IN THE PEOPLE THAT WERE ORIGINALLY PLANNERS FOR THE CFA AND THEY HELPED GUIDE US. UM, MAX CERTAINLY WAS ONE OF THE LEAD HELP FOR US TO MAKE SURE THAT WE WERE FOLLOWING THE GUIDELINES. AND SO WE DID THAT. UH, THE PLANNING COMMISSION AGREED AT SEVEN TO ZERO. AND SO, UH, WE FOLLOWED THIS PROCESS. WE BROUGHT IN THE BEST, UH, UH, IN OUR INDUSTRY. UH, AND WE WERE VOTED SEVEN ZERO. I'M NOT SURE HOW, AS A LANDOWNER NOW WHAT THE PROCESS WOULD BE IF WE GO THROUGH THAT PROCESS AND THEN WE ARE DENIED. UM, I WILL SAY THAT, UH, I HEAR SOME OF THE, UH, COMPLAINTS. WE'VE HEARD SOME OF THESE BEFORE. UM, WE'VE ADDRESSED, UH, EVERYTHING, UH, AND CERTAINLY IN, IN OUR OPINION, UM, AND THE OPINION OF, OF, UH, THE, UH, PLANNING. UM, BUT WE'VE, WE HAVE BEEN HERE BEFORE, UH, AND MULTIPLE TIMES WHERE WE'VE HAD OUR NEIGHBORS CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT WE WILL END UP WITH. AT THE END OF THE DAY, THEY'RE OUR BEST CUSTOMERS. AND, AND SO I WOULD SAY TO THEM, WAIT UNTIL YOU'LL SEE WHAT WE BRING TO THE COMMUNITY, BECAUSE WE WILL BE PART OF THIS COMMUNITY IN A VERY GOOD AND POSITIVE WAY. AND SO TO THAT, UH, COMMITMENT, UM, WE JUST WANT TO CONTINUE TO BE PART OF THIS COMMUNITY. WE HAVE BEEN PART OF THIS COMMUNITY FOR FOUR YEARS NOW, AND WE WANT TO BE HERE FOR A LONG TIME AND BE, UM, AND REPRESENT SEDONA IN A VERY HIGH QUALITY WAY. AND SO WITH THAT, I JUST THANK ALL OF YOU, UM, FOR HEARING US, UH, HEARING US OUT. UH, THANK, UH, STAFF FOR HAVING BROUGHT US THROUGH THIS PROCESS, UM, AND TO THANK PLANNING COMMISSIONERS FOR THEIR SEVEN TO ZERO VOTE. AND SO WITH THAT, I RESPECTFULLY REQUEST THAT, UH, YOU MOVE US FORWARD. THANK YOU. OKAY. YOU GUYS ARE DONE. YOU STILL HAVE THREE AND A HALF MINUTES LEFT. JUST, IT'S UP TO YOU GUYS. I'M NOT PUSHING YOU TO YOU, YOU GIVE A LAWYER SOME EXTRA TIME. HE IS GONNA USE IT. UM, I'M TRYING TO BE FAIR. THAT'S FINE. THANK YOU, MAYOR. I, I APPRECIATE THAT THE STEPS IN THIS PROCESS HAVE BEEN ESTABLISHED BY STATUTE. THE STEPS IN THIS PROCESS ARE DEFINED AS LEGISLATIVE FIRST. THAT'S WHERE, AS I MENTIONED EARLIER, YOUR LEGISLATIVE PREROGATIVE, YOUR DISCRETION TO SAY, WE DON'T LIKE THE PROJECT AT ALL, OR WE WANNA RESTRICT THE NUMBER OF BUILDINGS, THE [02:45:01] BUILDING HEIGHTS, PARKING, TRAFFIC, ALL OF THOSE THINGS. ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTIONS. YOU CANNOT BUILD IN ANY OF THE FLOODWAYS. THE COUNCIL CHOSE NOT TO DO THAT. THE ZONING CASES THAT I HANDLE, AND I'VE GOT A HUNDRED ZONING CASES GOING ON RIGHT NOW IN MY OFFICE. EVERY ONE OF THOSE ZONING CASES WILL HAVE A LIST OF CONDITIONS AS RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL. AND SOMETIMES THEY'RE PAGES LONG IF THEY DIDN'T WANT A WEDDING, RIGHT? OR ANY, YOU CAN JUST RESTRICT THAT. THIS COUNCIL COULD HAVE RESTRICTED THE RESTAURANT. IT COULD HAVE RESTRICTED ANY, YOU COULD HAVE RESTRICTED THE USE TO SIMPLY SINGLE FAMILY HOMES. BUT THE COUNCIL CHOSE NOT TO DO THAT. NOW IT'S ADMINISTRATIVE. THERE IS NO LEGISLATIVE PREROGATIVE RIGHT NOW. BASICALLY, IT'S AGAIN, IMPLEMENTING THE UNDERLYING ZONING THAT'S THERE, THAT'S ALL THAT THIS IS ABOUT IMPLEMENTATION, TAKING WHAT'S PERMITTED, PUTTING IT ON PAPER. AND AS LONG AS THEY ARE WITHIN, UM, CONFORMANCE WITH THAT, THEY HAVE LESS DENSITY, THEY HAVE LESS EVERYTHING, RIGHT? AS LONG AS THEY'RE IN CONFORMANCE, YOU REALLY HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO APPROVE IT. BECAUSE AGAIN, THIS IS NOT A REZONING CASE. AND I APPRECIATE THE PASSION. I APPRECIATE THE CONCERNS. BUT THOSE CONCERNS SHOULD HAVE BEEN RAISED IN 2020, NOT TODAY. ARE YOU GONNA JUST REPEAT YOURSELF? NO, I'M SORRY, MAYOR. OKAY. BECAUSE WE'VE HEARD THAT FROM YOU TWICE ALREADY. SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH. OKAY. LET'S MOVE ON. UH, VICE MAYOR HAS A QUESTION FOR OUR LEGAL COUNSEL. I DO. THANK YOU. UH, SO WE'VE HEARD CONFLICTING COMMENTARY ABOUT WHAT OUR ROLE IS HERE TONIGHT. SO ONE WOULD SAY WE COULD ALL LEAVE BECAUSE WE HAVE NO RESPONSIBILITY, CAN'T DO ANYTHING. SO WE MIGHT AS WELL CANCEL THIS HEARING AND MOVE ON. ANOTHER SAYS, WE HAVE COMPLETE DISCRETION. SO COULD YOU PLEASE EXPLAIN TO US AND THE AUDIENCE WHAT EXACTLY WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, WHAT OUR RESPONSIBILITY IS AND WHAT ADMINISTRATIVE VERSUS JUDICIAL ACTUALLY MEANS FOR US? SURE. THANK YOU. UM, MADAM VICE MAYOR AND MR. MAYOR AND COUNCIL. UH, SO I, I THINK THAT THE, THE TRUTH LIES IN THE MIDDLE OF THOSE TWO. UM, YOU DON'T HAVE ABSOLUTE DISCRETION LIKE YOU WOULD IN A LEGISLATIVE ACT, LIKE IN A REZONE AS WELL, UH, POINTED OUT BY THE APPLICANT. UH, BUT THEN CONTRARY TO THE APPLICANT, THIS IS NOT JUST A RUBBER STAMP, A DEVELOPMENT REVIEW, UM, ISN'T JUST, THERE'S NO DISCRETION LEFT. THERE'S, THERE'S STILL, UM, ALL THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE THAT HAS TO BE APPLIED TO, UH, CITY COUNCIL CAN ONLY AFFIRM THIS. AND PZ ONLY AFFIRMED, UH, ORIGINALLY APPROVED THIS DEVELOPMENT REVIEW BASED ON THE 12 APPROVAL CRITERIA AND FINDING THAT THIS DEVELOPMENT COMPLIED WITH THE 12 APPROVAL CRITERIA. UH, AND THAT'S NOT QUESTIONING THE USE OF THE PROJECT, THE USE OF THE PROJECT, UM, YOU KNOW, AS A RESTAURANT HOTEL, THAT'S, THAT'S GUARANTEE, THAT'S IN THE, THE ZONING ORDINANCE. UH, BUT IT IS, UH, ASSURING THAT THE DEVELOPMENT COMPLIES WITH THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE LDC AND THERE'S 12 APPROVAL CRITERIA. AND THOSE INCLUDE THINGS, UH, SUCH AS, UH, UH, COMPLIANCE WITH THE LDC. AND THAT WOULD INCLUDE THINGS INCLUDING, UH, BUILDING LOCATION, THAT IT'S OUT OF THE FLOODWAY, UM, HIGH FOOTPRINTS, THINGS LIKE THAT. SO, UH, THOSE ARE ALL CHECKED OUT. IT ALSO INCLUDES THAT IT DOESN'T SIGNIFICANTLY IMPACT THE, HAVE INVERSE IMPACT ON THE SURROUNDING NEIGHBORS. UH, THAT IT DOESN'T HAVE A NEGATIVE IMPACT, UH, ON THE ENVIRONMENT, UH, THAT IT PROVIDES ADEQUATE ROAD SYSTEMS. AND PROBABLY MOST IMPORTANTLY, THAT IT COMPLIES WITH THE, UH, COMMUNITY PLAN AND ANY APPLICABLE, UH, COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA SPECIFIC PLANS, WHICH IN THIS CASE IS THE SNUGLY CFA. SO, UH, MAYOR AND COUNCIL, THIS N AND THIS WHERE THIS ONE IS MORE UNIQUE THAN A NORMAL, UH, DEVELOPMENT REVIEW, UH, BECAUSE THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE, UH, ZONING DISTRICT HAS, UH, UH, A AFFIRMED OR INCORPORATED THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE SEDLEY CFA INTO, UH, THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE ZONING AREA. SO IN A TYPICAL DEVELOPMENT REVIEW, YOU WOULD NOT HAVE A CFA CHECKLIST, BUT IN THIS SCENARIO, YOU DO HAVE A CFA CHECKLIST. THE STAFF WENT THROUGH SPECIFICALLY TO, TO ADDRESS THE CFA, UH, AS IT APPLIES TO THIS DEVELOPMENT. UH, SO IT'S, IT, IT LANDS IN THE MIDDLE. UM, THIS IS, IT'S, THIS IS AN ADMINISTRATIVE REVIEW, THE APPLICANT'S CORRECT ON THAT. SO IT'S NOT, UM, UH, A JUDICIAL REVIEW, UH, IF ANYONE, UH, STILL THINKS ABOUT, THINKS OF IT THAT WAY. UM, AND SO THAT'S, UH, WHY STAFF INCLUDED THE CFA CHECKLIST. UH, AND SO IT HAS TO CONFORM WITH THE CFA, UH, IN ORDER TO BE DEVELOPED. 'CAUSE THAT'S PART OF THE UNDERLYING ZONING, THIS OAK CREEK HERITAGE ZONING AREA. SO YOU COULD CALL THOSE RESTRICTIONS. YES. YEP. OKAY. THANK [02:50:01] YOU. OKAY, SO NOW WE'RE GOING TO TAKE THE TIME AND ASK QUESTIONS. UH, I'LL GO BACK TO WHERE I WAS BEFORE. HOW DO YOU WANNA COUNSEL, HOW DO YOU WANT TO HAVE ONE PERSON UP FROM EACH GROUP? UH, AND WE'LL ASK QUESTIONS. AND IF THAT PERSON CAN'T ANSWER THE QUESTION THAT WE'RE POSING TO THEM, THEY COULD SWITCH OUT WITH SOMEBODY ELSE. UM, AND I DON'T WANNA HAVE EVERYBODY ELSE STANDING UP THERE, SO, UH, ARE YOU IN AGREEMENT WITH THAT? I, NO. NO. OKAY. SO WE HAVE THREE, FOUR SEATS UP HERE. IF WE CAN HAVE ONE, UH, REPRESENTATIVE FROM EACH GROUP, UH, COME UP TO THE TABLE. MAYOR, WILL WE BE ABLE TO DIRECT QUESTIONS TO STAFF AS WELL? YES, OF COURSE. OKAY. JUST ONE FROM EACH GROUP, PLEASE. OKAY. AND ABSOLUTELY WE COULD STAFF, OR, UH, KURT, THIS IS KIND OF UNIQUE FOR US. SO, UM, JUST BEAR WITH US A LITTLE BIT AND WE HAVE ANY PREFERENCE, UH, AS TO WHO WOULD LIKE TO BEGIN. WE'RE TAKING, WE HAVE UNLIMITED AMOUNTS OF QUESTIONS, BUT WE, BECAUSE WE WANNA MAKE SURE THAT SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WERE POSED BY THE COMMUNITY ARE NOW POSED TO, UH, EACH GROUP. SO ANY PEOPLE WHO'D LIKE TO START, OTHERWISE I MIGHT EVEN START. SO, UH, WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO START? GOD, EVERYONE'S STARING AT ME. . OKAY. SO WHY, WHY DON'T I BREAK TRADITION? I'LL START TODAY. OKAY. SO I UNDERSTAND ABOUT TRAFFIC. I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE CARS, UH, AND NOT SO MUCH. UH, I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE, YOU'RE HAVING, UH, A SHUTTLE SERVICE THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE SHUTTLING CARS. MM-HMM. ARE THOSE CARS, HOW MANY SHUTTLES ARE YOU GOING TO BE PROVIDING TO, UH, YOUR GUESS HOW MANY ARE AT THE READY? IF YOU HAVE 20 PEOPLE GOING TO 20 DIFFERENT PLACES, DO YOU HAVE 20 SHUTTLES? UH, NO. THE OBJECTIVE IS NOT TO TAKE INDIVIDUALS BECAUSE THAT DOES NOT IMPROVE TRAFFIC. THAT ACTUALLY IMPACTS TRAFFIC A BIT WORSE. THE, THE INTENT IS TO HAVE A SHUTTLE ON A TIMETABLE THAT WOULD ENCOURAGE GROUPS OF GUESTS TO TAKE THE SHUTTLE IN GROUPS TO MINIMIZE ANY IMPACT. OKAY. AT MAXIMUM CAPACITY. HOW MANY UNITS? WELL, YOU HAVE HOW MANY? 70 UNITS? 70 UNITS PER, OKAY. SO YOU CAN HAVE 70 GROUPS AT ONE TIME AT NINE O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING, THEY WANNA GO TO DEVIL'S BRIDGE OR THEY WANNA GO TO MULTIPLE DIFFERENT PLACES. MM-HMM. , THAT'S HOW, HOW MANY UNITS WILL YOU HAVE SHUTTLING WITH MY QUESTION? GREAT QUESTION. WE WOULD THEN CREATE A TIMETABLE AND STATE OF CAPACITY AND HAVE OUR REALLY, OUR ASSISTANT GENERAL MANAGER THAT CONTROL THE SIGNUP FOR, FOR THOSE TRIPS. OKAY. ALRIGHT. THE PROBLEM IS, AND YOU'VE HEARD IT BEFORE, THAT THE SCHLEY HILL ROUNDABOUT IS THE SECOND WORST, UH, ROUNDABOUT THAT WE HAVE IN THE CITY ALREADY. AND YES, WE CAN'T DO ANY WORSE IN THE CATEGORY, WAS IT F RIGHT, BUT IT STILL IS WORSE AND STILL A PROBLEM. SO THAT'S A PROBLEM FOR ME. BUT WE CAN'T ADDRESS TRAFFIC. OKAY. FROM WHAT, OR AS MUCH AS WE CAN SOME OTHER THINGS, BUT I WANNA GO TO THE REAL BASICS FOR ME. SO THE NEL COMMUNITY FOCUS AREA PLAN, I'M GONNA READ A, A PARAGRAPH TO YOU THAT'S UP HERE THAT'S BETTER WITHOUT THE GLASSES. THE CFA IS LOCATED WITHIN THE HEART OF SEDONA, A PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY AREA FOCUSED ON OAK CREEK AND SEDONAS HERITAGE FUTURE DEVELOPMENT AND REDEVELOPMENT IS A MIX OF USES THAT PRESERVE THE OAK CREEK RIPARIAN CORRIDOR WITH NATURAL HILLSIDES, OPEN FIELDS, AND A VARIETY OF MODESTLY SCALED BUILDINGS, THUS SUSTAINING THE DISTRICT'S HISTORIC CONTEXT AND CHARACTER. SO WHAT I ENVISIONED WHEN THIS WAS ALL GOING TO START BEFORE I, SO BEFORE I DID MEET WITH YOU OR, OR REPRESENTATIVES, I EXPECTED TO SEE SOMETHING SIMILAR TO WHAT WE HAVE IN, IN OUR COMMUNITY. WE HAVE A PHENOMENAL, VERY, VERY HIGH END LODGING ESTABLISHMENT HERE WITH SMALL, INTIMATE, AND MOSTLY, UH, MODESTLY SCALED BUILDINGS, BUT ULTRA HIGH END, AND THEY ARE 560, I'M SORRY, 576 SQUARE FEET. THAT'S WHAT I ENVISIONED BEFORE I MET WITH YOU. NOW, LOOKING AT TWO OF YOUR UNITS, UH, FOUR CA TOTAL TOP, YOU KNOW, SECOND FLOOR, AND [02:55:01] B UH, FIRST FLOOR, A TOTAL OF SIXTY FOUR HUNDRED AND SEVENTY ONE SQUARE FEET. MM-HMM, , THAT'S A BIG DIFFERENCE FROM, IN MY MIND, MODESTLY SCALED BUILDINGS. SO, AND YOU HAVE, WHAT, TWO OR THREE MODESTLY SCALED BUILDINGS, A THOUSAND SQUARE FEET? I COULD, I COULD EVEN GO WITH THAT, BUT DO YOU, CAN YOU ADDRESS WHAT YOU, HOW YOU THOUGHT YOU WERE FULFILLING THE C FFA, WHICH IS VERY CLEAR WITH A 6,400, UH, SQUARE FOOT, AND THEN THERE'S ANOTHER ONE, A 6,000 SQUARE FOOT, AND YOU HAVE MANY, MANY OTHERS THAT ARE IN THAT KIND OF SQUARE FOOTAGE. HOW DO YOU FEEL THAT THAT IS ADDRESSING THE, THE CORE VALUE OF THE CFA? YEAH, SO THE, THE LIMIT IS 5,000 SQUARE FEET OF BUILDING FOOTPRINT, RIGHT? AND SO IF THERE IS A 6,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING THAT HAS A NUMBER OF GUEST ROOMS IN IT, THAT'S SPLIT BETWEEN TWO FLOORS, SO THE FOOTPRINT IS, UH, CLOSER TO 3000, JUST SO WE CAN GET A SENSE OF SCALE. THOSE YES, THOSE, AND, AND THOSE BUILDINGS ARE PLACED DOWN WITHIN THE DEPTH OF, OF THE SITE. UH, THE SITE DOES SLOPE DOWN AT LEAST ONE STORY. SO THE SENSE OF SCALE, UH, THE PERCEPTION AS WE LOOK ACROSS THE SITE AT THOSE BUILDINGS THAT ARE FAR FROM SCH HILL ROAD, THE PERCEPTION AND AND HEIGHT WOULD, WOULD BE EQUIVALENT TO A ONE STORY BUILDING. UH, SO TWO UP TO 5,000 SQUARE FOOT FOOTPRINT, TWO STORY OR MORE IS ALLOWED IN OAK CREEK DISTRICT, SPECIFICALLY AT THE SITE. AND, AND MANY OF OUR BUILDINGS DON'T APPROACH THOSE LIMITS. SO YES, WE, WE BELIEVE THAT THEY ARE MODESTLY SCALED. THEY, THEY DO NOT APPROACH. THERE MAY BE THE RESTAURANT THAT IS OVER 4,000 SQUARE FEET IN FOOTPRINT, BUT MANY OF THE BUILDINGS, UH, DO NOT EVEN COME CLOSE TO THAT LIMIT, THUS BEING MODESTLY SKILLED. OKAY. I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING ABOUT FOOTPRINT. I'M TALKING ABOUT TOTAL SQUARE FEET. SO THAT THIS ONE UNIT A, UH, FOUR CA IS THAT ONE OF THE UNITS THAT HAS AN ELEVATOR? THE, UH, YES. THE ELEVATORS ARE TO ACCOMMODATE THE HANDICAP. I KNOW, I, I, I UNDERSTAND. I KNOW WHAT THEY'RE THERE FOR. BUT IT, THIS DOES, BECAUSE IT'S TWO STORY, IT HAS THE ELEVATOR IS THAT ONE LODGING UNIT FOR A FAMILY THAT MAY COME, OR MAYBE MULTIPLE FAMILIES TOGETHER? OH, THOSE ARE MULTIPLE GUEST ROOMS IN THAT BUILDING. THOSE ARE MULTIPLE GUEST ROOMS. CORRECT. OUR, OUR TYPICAL, SO IF WE WENT TOGETHER, YOU'D BE IN ONE ROOM AND I'D BE IN THE OTHER, OR MY FAMILY WOULD COME WITH MY, MY, MAYBE MY COUSINS AND WE'D BE IN ONE GROUP. SO WE HAVE SEPARATE ROOMS WITH MAYBE THERE'S KITCHEN OR, MM-HMM. . BUT, SO IT'S FOR ONE GROUP OF PEOPLE. UH, WE DO HAVE ADJOINING ROOMS FOR FAMILIES. UH, THE THE 6,000 SQUARE FEET THAT, THAT YOU SPEAK OF IS, IS, IF I MAY LOOK SURE AT HOW MANY ROOMS ARE WITHIN THAT BUILDING. I WILL GIVE YOU ANOTHER MINUTE. OKAY. SO OUR ROOM SIZES VER YOU HAVE THE PLAN. WELL, THIS IS GIVEN THE AREAS FOUR C SPRINGFIELD. OKAY. FOUR C HAS NINE GUEST ROOMS. RIGHT. BUT THAT, SO THAT'S FOR MAYBE A FAMILY OF NINE OR NINE SEPARATE FAMILIES. IT I UNDERSTAND. I UNDERSTAND. BUT SOMEONE, A FAMILY, A, A LARGE EXTENDED FAMILY COULD STAY THERE TOGETHER, SORT OF LIKE A SHORT TERM RENTAL. UH, CORRECT. WE, WE HAVE. OKAY. SO THAT, THAT'S THE ANSWER I WAS LOOKING FOR. MM-HMM. . SO, BUT THAT STILL DOESN'T, TO ME ANSWER THE QUESTION OF HOW IT REALLY EQUATES TO MEETING THE GUIDELINES IN THE FOCUS AREA [03:00:02] WHERE MODESTLY SCALED BUILDINGS. I'M JUST LETTING YOU KNOW THAT'S A PROBLEM FOR ME. AND THAT'S MY QUESTION. AND, UM, I'LL LET THE REST OF THE COUNCIL OPINE FURTHER. I MIGHT MIGHT COME BACK. MAY I ADD JUST ONE COMMENT? SURE, SURE. SO THE, THE SCENARIO NUMBER TWO, THAT'S AN EXAMPLE OF A PREFERRED DEVELOPMENT DESIGN SITE PLAN. THAT OUR BUILDINGS ARE MUCH SMALLER IN FOOTPRINT IN SCALE THAN WHAT THE CFA SHOWS WITHIN THAT SCENARIO. JUST ONE SECOND. JUST A SECOND. JESSICA, I WANNA GO BACK TO THE LIST THAT I HAD HERE. HMM. I HAVE TOO MANY PAGES OPEN, SO I'M SEEING HERE. AND YOU, YOU DO HAVE SIX 90. THAT'S GREAT. A COUPLE OF SIX NINETIES. WONDERFUL. BUT I SEE 6,460 6,000. I'M ROUNDING UP OR ENDING DOWN 6100 4800, 4800 2300, 2500, 2300 3700 MM-HMM. 11, A COUPLE, 11 HUNDREDS. SO YOU HAVE A MIX AND I UNDERSTAND THAT. CORRECT. AND THAT JUST ANSWERS MY QUESTION. MM-HMM, . SO COUNCILOR WILLIAMSON, DID YOU WANT TO, I JUST HAVE A QUICK, YOU, YOU WERE PASSING IT ON, RIGHT? YES, I WAS. AND I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION. GO FOR IT. JUST ONE QUESTION TO START WITH. THERE WAS A DISCREPANCY IN ALLEGED IN THE, UM, NUMBER OF HOMES PER ACRE THAT WERE ON WHICH THE TRAFFIC ANALYSIS WAS BASED. ONE OF THE APPELLATES SAID YOU USED EIGHT AND YOU SHOULD HAVE USED FOUR AND, OR WAS THAT IT? YES. YEAH. AND THAT IF YOU USED THE RIGHT NUMBER, YOU WOULD GET A DIFFERENT NUMBER OF CHIPS PER DAY. SO COULD THAT BE CLARIFIED, PLEASE? UH, YES. THAT STATEMENT ORIGINATED IN THE, IN THE PRIOR WHICH STATEMENT? REGARDING, REGARDING, UH, NOT NON-RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT, NOT EXCEEDING MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL AS AN EXPECTATION. THAT STATEMENT ORIGINATED IN THE OLD COMMUNITY PLAN, AND IT, IT WAS AN EXPECTATION TO CREATE THE SCHS NLI CFA AND MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL TO THE COMM. THE NEW COMMUNITY PLAN IDENTIFIES MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL IS UP TO 16 UNITS PER ACRE. OKAY. HOWEVER, BACK THEN THE OLD COMMUNITY PLAN IDENTIFIED MEDIUM RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT AS EIGHT UNITS PER ACRE. SO THAT'S WHY YOU USED EIGHT. CORRECT. OKAY. CORRECT. THANK YOU. THAT WAS, THAT WAS MY QUESTION. WOW. OKAY. PETE, YOU HAD, SO CAN I COMMENT ON THAT THOUGH? UM, UH, NO. YEAH, I MEAN, I WOULD SURE I WOULD. ALL OF EVERYBODY COULD COMMENT ON IT. SURE. OKAY. IF YOU'D LIKE TO GO AHEAD. SO, UM, IN THE OAK OR THE SHIBLEY HILLS, CFA, IT SAYS THAT RESIDENTIAL CANNOT EXCEED THE PREVIOUSLY ZONED RESIDENTIAL OF THAT AREA. THAT AREA WAS ZONED RS 10, WHICH IS FOUR UNITS PER ACRE. AND IT SAYS CLEARLY IN THE CFA THAT IT CAN'T EXCEED WHAT THE DENSITY WAS FOR RESIDENTIAL. BUT IF THE CA CFA SAYS MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL, IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY MEAN THE PRIOR ZONING FOR RESIDENTIAL AS I HEAR IT. IS THAT WHAT YOU WOULD, OKAY. CORRECT. THANK YOU. WE'RE NOT GOING BACK AND FORTH. YEAH. SO THAT ANSWERED MY QUESTION. WHAT'S THAT? CAN WE ASK CARRIE? CARRIE? SURE. CARRIE, HAS WE SHOULDA A LIGHT OVER? CAN WE HAVE, CAN WE HAVE CLARIFICATION FROM FROM STAFF, PLEASE, CARRIE? HI. UM, SO THE PROPERTY WAS PREVIOUSLY ZONED RSS 10, WHICH IS FOUR UNITS PER ACRE. THE CFA AND THE ZONING ALLOW FOR LODGING UNITS TO BE BUILT AT A MAXIMUM DENSITY OF DOUBLE THE RESIDENTIAL DENSITY. SO IT WOULD ALLOW, ON PROPERTIES THAT WERE ALLOWED FOUR UNITS PER ACRE, IT WOULD ALLOW EIGHT LODGING UNITS PER ACRE. THERE ARE OTHER PROPERTIES WITHIN THE CFA AREA THAT WERE ZONE, THAT WERE ZONED RSS 18, WHICH IS TWO UNITS PER ACRE. AND SO ON THOSE, IT WOULD BE FOUR LODGING UNITS PER ACRE IF THEY HAD THE OC ZONING. UM, WHEN WE DID THE CFA PLAN AND WHEN WE WENT THROUGH THE ZONING CASE, OBVIOUSLY WE DID NOT HAVE ANY DEVELOPMENT PLANS AT THAT TIME. WE DID A BASIC TRAFFIC ANALYSIS OF THE RESIDENTIAL DENSITY VERSUS THE [03:05:01] POTENTIAL LODGING DENSITY AND THE RESULTS OF THAT. AND AGAIN, WITHOUT ANY OF THE DETAILS OF EXACTLY HOW MANY UNITS, JUST KIND OF A BASIC BARE BONES NUMBER. THE RESULT OF THAT WAS THAT THE LODGING UNITS AT EIGHT UNITS PER ACRE WOULD HAVE A LOWER TRAFFIC GENERATION THAN A FOUR UNIT PER ACRE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT. AND SO THAT WAS HOW THAT FINDING WAS MET FOR THE ZONING CASE. I THINK. UH, OKAY. DID THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION? IT WAS HER QUESTION. OKAY. MARK? YEAH, I WAS JUST SAYING MARK HAD A COMMENT ON THE SAME, WELL, I DON'T, I DON'T WANNA GO BACK AND FORTH. ALRIGHT. 'CAUSE I, OTHERWISE WE'LL NEVER GET OUTTA HERE BEFORE MIDNIGHT. I'M GONNA STAY ON THE SAME TOPIC. WELL FINISH. I I THINK WE NEED CLARIFICATION. OKAY. CARRIE JUST CLARIFIED, UH, JESSICA, DID YOU WANT MORE INFORMATION? NO, I THINK THAT'S FINE. I THINK I'VE GOTTEN THE ANSWER THAT I THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK IF EVERYBODY UP THERE ARGUES WITH EVERY ANSWER THAT SOMEONE ELSE GIVES. WELL, THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO AVOID AND THAT'S NOT GOING TO WORK. RIGHT. AND I'M NOT GOING TO ALLOW, SO I THINK WE HAVE TO FIND A WAY TO, TO KIND OF HAVE IT END SO TRIAL BY ERROR. AND SO NOW WE, NO, I, I, LOOK, I DON'T HAVE A GREAT IDEA FOR HOW TO DO THIS, SCOTT. I'M JUST SAYING IF, IF HE SAYS SOMETHING AND SHE ARGUES AND THEN HE ARGUES WE'RE NOT GONNA ALLOW THAT, WE, IT CAN'T GO ON THAT WAY. RIGHT. SO, THANK YOU. OKAY. PETE, I KNOW YOU HAVE ONE OR TWO OR 10, NOT 10. OKAY. MAYBE MORE THAN TWO THOUGH. OKAY. THANK YOU MAYOR . SO, LET'S SEE. I'M JUST GONNA GO THROUGH THE ORDER IN WHICH I WROTE THESE QUESTIONS DOWN BASED ON THE PRESENTATIONS THAT I HEARD. CARRIE, I THINK I, I WILL START WITH YOU THOUGH PERHAPS TO SEE, SEE IF YOU CAN GIMME AN ANSWER TO THIS. I, I WANT YOU TO REMIND ME ABOUT THAT. WE USED AN ALTERNATIVE PARKING STANDARD IN THIS PROJECT THAT WENT FROM 2 0 4 DOWN TO 90. CAN YOU PLEASE JUST GIVE ME THE OUTLINE OF THAT THEN? YEAH, WELL, SO THE 2 0 4 WOULD BE THAT EVERYTHING WAS A STANDALONE USE AND HAD PARKING RESERVED FOR JUST THAT USE. SO IF THE 70 LODGING UNITS HAD THIS PARKING, THE RESTAURANT HAD THIS PARKING, THE MM-HMM. SPA FACILITY HAD THIS PARKING THAT WOULD GIVE YOU 204 SPACES. UNDERSTANDING THAT THESE OR ACCESSORY USES TO THE HOTEL THAT THERE ARE IS SOME OVERLAP THAT PEAK HOURS ARE NOT THE SAME. WHEREAS WHERE, UH, THE SPA MIGHT BE AT FULL CAPACITY WHILE PEOPLE ARE NOT IN THEIR ROOMS, UM, THEY PROVIDED A PARKING ANALYSIS THAT SHOWED HOW ALL OF THOSE PARKING USES WOULD INTERACT. AND THAT ANALYSIS RESULTED IN A NET MAXIMUM DEMAND AT ANY ONE TIME OF 87 SPACES. AND THEY WERE PROVIDING 90 SPACES. GREAT. THANK YOU. AND THEN WHAT HAPPENS, CARRIE, WHAT'S, AND, AND MAYBE THIS IS STEVE QUESTION, BUT A STAFF QUESTION IN GENERAL, WHAT HAPPENS WHEN NEIGHBORS START CALLING IN SAYING, HEY, PARKING HAS NOW OVERFLOWN OVERFLOWED THE, THE AVAILABLE. WHAT, WHAT, WHAT DO WE DO? WHAT'S OUR RESPONSE IF, IF SOMEHOW EVENTS ARE TAKING PLACE? AND DON'T WORRY, I'VE GOT A QUESTION THAT I WANNA ASK ABOUT THAT, BUT, MM-HMM. . SO THE SHELBY HILL ROAD IS NOT WIDE ENOUGH TO HAVE ON STREET PARKING. RIGHT. UM, SO ANY PARKING ON THE ROAD WOULD NOT BE ALLOWED. IT WOULD BE TICKETED. UM, IF THEY ARE NOT, AND THEN ALL THE OTHER ROADS IN THE AREA, I THINK BARE WALLA WOULD BE THE ONLY OTHER ONE THAT IS A PRIVATE ROAD. AGAIN, IT'S NOT WIDE ENOUGH FOR ON STREET PARKING. SO IF THEY CANNOT CONTAIN ALL OF THEIR PARKING ON SITE, THERE IS NO OTHER LEGAL PLACE IN THE AREA FOR THEM TO PARK. AND THEY WOULD NEED TO ADJUST THEIR OPERATIONS TO BE ABLE TO, UM, MEET THEIR PARKING DEMAND. OKAY. THEN A QUESTION THAT FLOWS AND BACK TO THE APPLICANT HERE ABOUT THE EVENTS THAT ARE PLANNED HERE. AND, AND I THINK IN MANY PEOPLE'S MINDS, THESE WEDDING EVENTS ARE GONNA BE ATTENDED BY EXCLUSIVELY NON-RESIDENT, NON PEOPLE STAYING AT THE HOTEL IN THE WORST CASE. RIGHT. AND IT WOULD MAKE A, A MUCH BIGGER DEMAND ON PARKING AND TRAFFIC, EXCUSE ME. WHICH I THINK YOU'RE SAYING THAT NON GUESTS, NON STAYING GUESTS CAN ATTEND THESE EVENTS AND GO TO THE RESTAURANT. SO HOW ARE YOU GONNA MANAGE THAT PROBLEM? CORRECT. AND THAT CAPTIVE NON CAPTIVE RATE IS WORKED INTO THE PARKING, THE SHARED PARKING ANALYSIS. AND AS STATED, IT'S BASED ON PEAK HOUR DEMAND OF DIFFERENT USES. KEEP IN MIND THAT EACH OF THESE USES THE RESTAURANT AND THE EATING ROOM, THE WELLNESS SPA ARE NOT PRIMARY STANDALONE USES. UH, SO IT'S, IT'S, IT'S A SHARED ANCILLARY USE FACILITY. AND IF THERE IS A NEED FOR MORE PARKING, [03:10:01] WE ARE 100% VALET. AND WE ARE VERY FLEXIBLE. IN FACT, THERE ARE NON STRIPED SPACES THAT CAN BE USED WITHIN THE DRY VALVES TO FIT ADDITIONAL CARS. SO WE DO HAVE A BUILT-IN BUFFER TO ALLOW MORE CARS TO BE PARKED ONSITE. IF, IF THERE IS AN EVENT OR, OR IF THERE IS A NEED GOT MORE ON THIS TOPIC, AGAIN, A 100% VALET. AND, AND OUR OBJECTIVE IS TO MAKE THIS HOTEL THIS NEIGHBORHOOD AS EXTREMELY WALKABLE AS POSSIBLE. OUR GUESTS WILL BE ENCOURAGED AND, AND THE HOTEL WILL BE MARKETED AS SUCH. IT'S 100 HUNDRED PERCENT VALET. THE GOAL IS LEAVE YOUR CAR, ENJOY LONG WEEKEND AND WALK AROUND, WALK TO THE TRAILS, WALK TO , WALK TO UPTOWN. IT'S A, IT'S A, IT'S A DECENT WALK, BUT IT'S DOABLE. UH, SO ARE YOU GONNA ALLOW PEOPLE TO BOOK AN EVENT, A WEDDING, AND YOU START TO NOTICE, HEY, THERE'S ONLY THREE GUESTS STAYING HERE, BUT THERE'S A HOW MANY, HOW MANY PEOPLE CAN FIT IN YOUR EVENT ROOM THAT YOU SAID WAS JUST SMALLER THAN THIS? MM-HMM, . HOW MANY PEOPLE CAN FIT IN THE EVENT ROOM? UH, GREG MAY HAVE THAT ANSWER. OUR ARCHITECTS, I BELIEVE IT'S, UH, IT'S 80 BASED ON FIRE OCCUPANCY CODE. CLOSE ENOUGH. YES. YEAH, IT'LL BE UNDER 200 BASED ON OCCUPANCY. WELL, HANG ON. THAT'S BIG DIFFERENCE BASED ON, THERE'S, THERE'S A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT WAYS TO LOOK AT THIS. THERE'S A BUILDING CODE THAT WILL BE APPLIED AT, AND THAT IS USUALLY A SEVEN SQUARE FOOT DIVISIBLE NUMBER, WHICH WILL BE UNDER 200. HOWEVER, WHEN YOU DO A LAYOUT FOR A 10 PERSON TABLE OR EIGHT PERSON TABLE, A TABLE UP FRONT, A DANCE, ET CETERA, AND HAVE THE APPROPRIATE EXITING AROUND IT, THAT NUMBER GOES WAY DOWN. SO THE, THE BUILDING CODE WILL LOOK AT IT AS COMPLETELY EMPTY, SHOULDER TO SHOULDER WITH EXITING AROUND. THAT'S THAT MAXIMUM NUMBER PER TABLE WITH, WITH THE TABLE ARRANGEMENT FOR A WEDDING, IT'S ABOUT 80, SO 80 A HUNDRED SAY EIGHT. SO LET'S SAY SOMEONE'S BOOKING AN EVENT THERE, IT'S GONNA BE A HUNDRED PEOPLE, A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN YOU THINK, BUT MAYBE LESS THAN ALL STANDING FIRE CODE CAPACITY. ARE YOU GONNA ALLOW PEOPLE TO BOOK AN EVENT WHEN YOU SEE THERE'S ONLY THREE ROOMS BOOKED IN YOUR, IN, IN THE HOTEL? SO YOU KNOW, THERE'S GONNA BE THIS HUGE PARKING DEMAND THAT IS NOT PART OF YOUR ALTERNATIVE PARKING STANDARD. WE, OUR, OUR MANAGERS AND SALES STAFF WOULD NOT RISK GUEST EXPERIENCE. THAT'S, THAT'S THE FIRST AND FOREMOST PRIORITY. IF WE HAVE A UNPLEASANT GUEST EXPERIENCE, WE'LL GO OUT OF BUSINESS VERY QUICKLY. REPEAT BUSINESS IS, IS IS THE GOAL AND OUR PRIORITY IS GUEST EXPERIENCE. SO WE WILL BE ABLE TO MANAGE AND, AND MAKE THOSE, THOSE ADJUSTMENTS WHEN WE ARE RESERVING. SO I'M GONNA MOVE ON. DID YOU, CAN I TOUCH, THANK YOU. SURE. TO FOLLOW UP ON THAT. SO YOU JUST MENTIONED THAT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE VALET PARKING AND IF NEED BE, THERE'S SPACES ALONG THE DRIVEWAY THAT AREN'T MARKED THAT YOU COULD PARK. CORRECT. WHAT'S THE WIDTH OF THE DRIVEWAY? UH, 26. OKAY. SO THAT PUTTING CARS ON A PARKED ROAD, A DRIVEWAY WOULD NOT STILL GIVE YOU, I DON'T THINK IT'LL GIVE YOU ENOUGH WIDTH FOR A FIRE TRUCK. YEAH. EXCLUDING THE FIRE LANE. THERE'S, THERE'S MULTIPLE DRIVE AISLES WITHIN OUR PARKING LOT. I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT YOU, YOU SPECIFICALLY SAID I, THAT'S WHY I WANNA CLARIFY RIGHT. THAT IF NEED BE, YOU WILL PARK CARS ON THE DRIVEWAY. YOU WERE VERY CLEAR ABOUT THE DRIVEWAY, NOT THE PARKING LOT. SO IF YOUR, YOUR DRIVEWAY IS 26 FEET. RIGHT? UH, THAT, UH, ANDY, I KNEW YOU WERE GONNA JUMP IN. CAN YOU GIVE ME WHAT? A PARKED DRIVEWAY CAR? EXCUSE ME. OKAY, GO AHEAD. SO I HAVE MY, ALRIGHT, SO WITH 26 FEET, YOU COULD PARK A CAR ON ONE SIDE OF THE STREET. MM-HMM. . SO, YOU KNOW, YOU NEED TO LEAVE 20 FEET WIDTH CLEAR. BUT THAT WOULD MEAN THAT A PORTION OF THE CAR IS EXTENDING INTO THE SHOULDER OF THE ROAD. SO IT'S OUTSIDE OF THE ACTUAL ROAD, BUT THEORETICALLY IT, IT SHOULD FIT, IT SHOULD FIT. BUT WAS THAT TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION WHEN THE FIRE DEPARTMENT DID THEIR ASSESSMENT? YES, IT WAS AT PARKING ON THE DRIVEWAY. UH, AS LONG AS THERE IS 20 FEET CLEAR. AND, AND THE, THE, THE DESIGN SOLUTION IS TO STABILIZE THE SOIL OR HAVE, UH, PERVIOUS PAVERS ALONG THE EDGE TO ACCOMMODATE THAT. OKAY. AND IT'S YOUR INTENTION THAT THERE WILL BE NO, BECAUSE YOU'RE MAKING CORRECTIONS ROAD CORRECTIONS TO SNAY HILL ROAD, AND SO NOBODY COULD PARK THERE. SO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'LL BE NO PARKING ON SNAY HILL ROAD OR THERE'LL BE CITED AND TOW. ABSOLUTELY. [03:15:01] YES. AND BY THAT TIME, MAYBE WE'LL HAVE A BOOTING PROCESS IN PLACE BY THEN. YEP. RIGHT. COUNCILOR WILLIAMSON, YOU WANTED TO JUMP IN ON, ON THAT? YEAH. OKAY. I'LL GIVE IT BACK TO YOU. YEAH. OTHERWISE IT FEELS LIKE IT'S MY TIME. AND YOU'RE GOING TO EVENTUALLY JUMP ON ME FOR TAKING TOO MUCH TIME. SO, SO I'D LIKE TO GO BACK TO THE QUESTIONS I'D LIKE TO ASK. I HEARD SOMETHING TODAY THAT I JUST DIDN'T KNOW BEFORE. ARE, ARE TREES BEING REMOVED IN THE FLOODWAY? UH, THOSE ARE TREES THAT HAVE BEEN LABELED AS DYING OR DISEASED BY OUR ARBORIST. MAY I SPEAK ON THAT AS WELL? ARE YOU REALLY DON'T WANNA GO GET I'LL TRY IT. SO THERE, THERE ARE SOME TREES, AS I SAID, MOST OF THEM ARE THAT WAY, BUT THERE ARE SOME TREES ADDITIONALLY THAT AREN'T BAD, THAT ARE BEING REMOVED AND THEY'RE ON THEIR DRAWINGS IN BLUE CIRCLES, SIGNIFYING THAT. OKAY. MY NEXT QUESTION IS, I HEARD SOMETHING TODAY ABOUT A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN COCONINO COUNTY LAND SIZE AND WHAT IT'S IN THE APPLICATION. CARRIE, DID YOU HEAR THAT DIFFERENCE AND HOW DOES THAT PLAY OUT FOR US? SO I DON'T KNOW HOW ON, LIKE THE COUNTY GIS MAP, OUR GIS MAP, THE NUMBERS ARE ALWAYS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW THOSE NUMBERS ARE CALCULATED. UM, AS PART OF EVERY APPLICATION, THE APPLICANT IS REQUIRED TO WRITE A SURVEY, UH, LIKE WITHIN, THAT'S BEEN DONE WITHIN THE LAST TWO YEARS OF THE PROPERTY, THE PROPERTY BOUNDARIES, ALL, ALL OF THAT. SO WE USE THE NUMBERS THAT COME OFF OF THAT FROM SURVEY. THAT SURVEY OKAY. FOR PROCESSING AN APPLICATION. GREAT, THANK YOU. AND THEN ANOTHER QUESTION THAT I HADN'T IN ENCOUNTERED BEFORE IN MY YEARS ON P AND Z OR SITTING HERE AT THIS DIOCESE, HOW DO WE, HOW DO WE DEAL WITH ENDANGERED SPECIES? WE HEARD A CLAIM ABOUT TWO ENDANGERED SPECIES AND WHERE DOES THAT HOOK INTO OUR PROCESS? SO WE HAVE THE US FOREST SERVICE AND THE ARIZONA DEPARTMENT OF FISH AND GAME ON OUR REVIEW AGENCY LIST. SO THEY ARE NOTIFIED OF EVERY PROJECT AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR REVIEW PROCEDURE IS, BUT THEY ARE, AGAIN, THEY'RE ON OUR NOTIFICATION LIST AND IF THEY HAVEN'T HAVE AN ISSUE, I WOULD HOPE THAT THEY WOULD BE LOOKING THROUGH THE PROJECT AND LETTING US KNOW. OKAY, GREAT. AND THEN I THINK, MAYOR, MY FINAL QUESTION MIGHT ACTUALLY TAKE JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE TIME BECAUSE I'M GONNA ASK THE APPLICANT TO PULL UP PAGE 10 OF THEIR PRESENTATION IF I COULD, WHICH WAS THAT, AND THIS INITIALLY CAME UP WITH THE SRU PRESENTATION. IT WAS THE PICTURE FROM THE CFA DOCUMENT OF THAT LAYOUT OF A SUGGESTED LAYOUT OR A, AN IDEA FOR A LAYOUT. BUT THEN IN THE APPLICANT'S PRESENTATION, THEY HAD THAT SIDE BY SIDE WITH THE, THE PLAN AND I HAD NOT SEEN THAT DIAGRAM BEFORE AND I THOUGHT IT WAS INSIGHTFUL HERE. NO. IS THAT THE DOUBLE MAPS? YEAH, THE DOUBLE MAPS. OKAY. THAT'S THE ONE. OKAY. SO I JUST WANNA VERIFY THAT THE PICTURE ON THE LEFT IS FROM PAGE 11 OF THE CFA PLAN. IS THAT CORRECT? CORRECT. FOR SO THAT CARRIE CAME FROM US WHEN WE PUT TOGETHER THE CFA PLAN? YES. AND, AND DO YOU KNOW CARRIE MM-HMM. IF, HMM. THIS PICTURE WAS PROBABLY GENERATED BEFORE WE DID THE EXACT LANGUAGE IN THE LDC TWO 20. UH, I'M, MY QUESTION IS THOSE BUILDING SIZES, HAVE YOU EVER SCOPED WHAT THOSE BUILDING SIZES ARE AND DO THEY REFLECT THE STANDARD THAT'S IN THE LDC? SO I DON'T REMEMBER ALL OF THE SPECIFICS FROM SEVEN, EIGHT YEARS AGO, BUT I DO KNOW THAT THE CFA PLAN AND THE ZONING WERE BEING DEVELOPED MORE OR LESS AT THE SAME TIME. THE, THE ZONING CAME ABOUT A YEAR LATER BECAUSE WE LUMPED IT INTO THE, UM, OVERALL CODE UPDATE. BUT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THEM ALL AT THE SAME TIME. AND MY RECOLLECTION IS THAT THOSE ARE APPROXIMATELY 5,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING FOOTPRINTS THAT WERE DONE ON IN THE CFA BECAUSE WE KNEW THAT THAT WAS THE DIRECTION THAT WE WERE GOING WITH THE ZONING DISTRICT. AND MARK, YOU'RE THE SECOND BIGGEST NERD IN THIS ROOM BEHIND ME. , HAVE YOU DONE ANY OF THAT WORK? HAVE YOU LOOKED AT THE SCALE OF THOSE BUILDINGS? DO YOU ALSO BELIEVE THOSE MIGHT BE 5,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDINGS? UH, I, I DON'T HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT, WHAT SCALE THAT THEY ARE. OKAY. UH, THE ONLY THING IS I CAN NOTE THE DIFFERENCE IN THE PLACEMENT IN THE, IN THE FLOODWAY, EXCUSE ME. THE FLOOD, UH, PLAIN, UH, IN THE DEVELOPERS VERSUS NO PLACEMENT WITHIN THE, UH, FLOODPLAIN AND THE CFA AND ALSO DIFFERENT, THERE IS A DIFFERENCE IN THE, UH, LOCATION OF THE FLOODWAY IN BOTH OF THOSE DIAGRAMS. IF YOU NOTICE AT THE BOTTOM OF BOTH OF THEM, THEY'RE, THEY'RE DIFFERENT. ALRIGHT THEN. SO BACK TO THE APPLICANT ON THE RIGHT SIDE, [03:20:01] THAT PICTURE IS THAT SCALED TO YOUR BUILDINGS? IS THAT BOTH OF THESE ARE SCALED AT, AT THE SAME SCALE, BOTH SAME SCALE FOR COMPARISON PURPOSES. AND YOU CAN SEE WITH THE RED LINE, WE SUPERIMPOSED OUR PROPERTY LINE, THE RED LINE ON THE CFA MAP, JUST TO GUARANTEE THAT THESE ARE AT THE SAME SCALE. SO, SO GOOD. THEY'RE THE SAME SCALE. ARE THOSE BUILDINGS AN ACCURATE REPRESENTATION OF YOUR PROPOSAL? THE BUILDINGS UNDER, RIGHT? CORRECT. YES. AND SO WE DO KNOW THAT SOME OF THOSE ARE 5,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDINGS AND IT DOES LOOK LIKE THE SAME RELATIVE SCALE, THE BUILDINGS ON THE LEFT. SO I THINK I WOULD AGREE WITH YOU, CARRIE, THAT THOSE BUILDINGS ARE PROBABLY APPROPRIATELY SCALED AND YEAH, I, THAT, THAT CAUGHT MY ATTENTION. I HAD NOT, I HAD THAT QUESTION IN MY MIND THAT I'M WAS, CAME UP WHEN YOU FIRST CAME UP. I THOUGHT THAT WAS PRETTY INSIGHTFUL. MAYOR, I THINK THAT IS THE LIST OF MY QUESTIONS FOR NOW. THANK YOU. VERY GOOD. THANK YOU, KATHY. THAT ANSWERED ONE OF MY QUESTIONS. SO, UM, I WANNA GO BACK TO THE DISCUSSION ABOUT THE, UM, OCCUPANCY, UM, THE 200 PEOPLE ALLOWED BY THE BUILDING OCCUPANCY, BUT THAT'S NOT REALISTIC BECAUSE OF THE TABLE LAYOUT. HOWEVER, I WAS RECENTLY AT AN EVENT WHERE THERE WAS AN OCCUPANCY ON THE ROOM. USUALLY THERE WERE TABLES. WE REQUESTED THE EVENT TO BE PLACED IN A WAY THAT THERE WERE NO TABLES AND IT WAS JUST, UM, YOU KNOW, CHAIR SEATING FOR THAT PARTICULAR EVENT THAT BROUGHT US UP TO THAT, TO THAT OCCUPANCY LEVEL. WHAT IF YOU, IF THAT HAPPENS, ARE YOU GOING TO ENTERTAIN SOMEBODY WHO WANTED TO SAY, LOOK, WE'RE JUST GONNA HAVE A LECTURE IN HERE, SO WE DON'T NEED THE TABLES, WE'RE JUST GONNA HAVE AUDIENCE STYLE SEATING, SO THEREFORE THERE WOULD BE 200 PEOPLE, UH, WHICH WOULD THEN COMBINE WITH YOUR SPA GUESTS, THE CARS LEFT BEHIND BY YOUR GUESTS THAT ARE STAYING THERE THAT ARE NOT USING THEIR VEHICLE OUT THAT DAY. SO I, I'M TRYING TO SEE HOW YOU GOT TO THE 87 CARS THAT, UH, PARKING THAT WAS REQUIRED THAT YOU SAID WOULD, WOULD BE SUFFICIENT WHEN THERE COULD EASILY BE THE 200 PEOPLE IF YOU DO ENTERTAIN ALTERNATE SEATING PLANS. OKAY, SO FIRST OFF, I SAID UNDER 200, SO I JUST DID AN ACCURATE, ACCURATE CALCULATION. SO THE WORST CASE SCENARIO, NO TABLES, CHAIRS. MM-HMM. , IT'S BASED ON GROSS OR THE NET AREA, IT'D BE 178 PEOPLE, PLUS OR MINUS. THERE'S ALSO A BUILT IN BAR SHOWN INTO OUR PLANS, AND I HAVEN'T TAKEN THAT OUT. SO TO BE, TO BE FAIR, IT'S, IT'S PROBABLY AROUND 1 75 AS A MAX THAT TELLS ME HOW MANY EXITS WE NEED, HOW, HOW THE DISTANCES THEY NEED TO BE APART. AND THAT'LL HAVE AN OCCUPANT LOAD SIGN FROM THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, SAYS NO MORE THAN 178 PEOPLE CAN BE IN THAT BUILDING. THAT IS A CODE ISSUE SEPARATE FROM HOW THEY CHOOSE TO OPERATE IT. IT'S, IT'S A LIFE. RIGHT. SO IT'S A LIFE SAFETY QUESTION. HAS TO GO TO THE OPERATIONS. WILL YOU LIMIT THE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE SO THAT YOU NOT OVERBURDENING THE 90 PARKING SPACES? CAN CAN I COMMENT ON THAT? JUST SO, SO I WANTED TO CAN I, I'M SORRY. I WANTED TO ADD TO THAT FROM THE OPERATIONAL PERSPECTIVE, BUT NO, NO, NO. I WAS JUST, EXCUSE ME. JUST CHEWING ON MY PAD. ONE PERSON. ONE, YES. ONE PERSON. JESSICA. KATHY'S NOT DONE YET. HE'S NOT DONE YET. SO JUST YOU CAN ASK YOUR QUESTION. CAN I MAKE A SUGGESTION THAT THE PER WHOEVER IT IS THAT HAS THE FLOOR, THAT THEY DIRECT THEIR QUESTION AND IF SOMEBODY ELSE WANTS TO OPINE THAT THE PERSON GET TO SAY YES OR NO TO CONTINUING IT? YEAH. IS THAT ALL RIGHT? YEAH, THAT'S WHY IT SHOULD BE ANYWAY. OKAY. SO I AM, I WOULD LIKE YOU TO FINISH TAGGING ONTO THERE AND THEN I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM CARRIE AND THEN THAT'S GONNA CLOSE MY, THAT QUESTION OF MINE. SO, UM, LET'S EX, UH, JUST IMAGINE THAT A HOTEL, IT'S A NICE DAY. YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE INSIDE. YOU COULD BE OUTSIDE WHERE YOU COULD FIT 400 PEOPLE. I MEAN, AND, AND THAT'S THE REALITY. ANY HOTEL HERE, BUT YOU WOULD NEVER DO THAT. THAT WOULD BE OPERATIONAL SUICIDE. YOU JUST CAN'T, NOT DO, YOU CANNOT FILL A HOTEL BEYOND OR ANY EVENT BEYOND THE CAPACITY OF WHAT THE HOTEL CAN DELIVER. THAT THAT'S, THAT'S LITERALLY OPERATIONAL SUICIDE. YOU JUST WON'T DO IT. YOU CAN'T. SO I HEAR THAT TO SAY, AND PLEASE CONFIRM YES OR NO, THAT YOU WILL LIMIT THE OCCUPANTS SO THAT YOU WILL NOT BE EXCEEDING THE 87, THE, THE 90 PARKING SPACES WE WILL MANAGE TO OUR PARKING. ABSOLUTELY. WE HAVE TO. CARRIE, YOU HAD COMMENTS? YEAH, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY THAT THE MEETING SPACE, UM, IS AN ACCESSORY USE. IT'S ONLY PERMITTED AS AN ACCESSORY [03:25:01] USE IN THIS ZONING DISTRICT. AND WE HAVE DEALT WITH THAT. I MEAN, MOST HOTELS HAVE SOME KIND OF MEETING ROOM, UM, AND THEY HAVE, WHEN WE HAVE DEALT WITH THAT, AND WITHOUT MENTIONING ANY SPECIFICS OF, YOU KNOW, TO, YOU KNOW, PROTECT THE, MAYBE THE GUILTY, UM, BUT WE HAVE HAD A SIX UNIT BED AND BREAKFAST COME AND SAY WE'RE GOING TO HAVE AN ACCESSORY ACCESSORY USE OF A WEDDING OF 400 PEOPLE, . AND WE SAID, NO, THAT'S NOT ACCESSORY TO A SIX UNIT BED AND BREAKFAST. I KNOW WHO THAT, WE'VE HAD OTHER PEOPLE COME IN AND SAY, WE'RE GONNA HAVE A 20 PERSON WEDDING AT A HUNDRED ROOM HOTEL. WE'D SAID, OKAY, THAT'S AN ACCESSORY USE. AND SO WE HAVE MANAGED THAT. UM, WHEN THEY EXCEED WHAT WE DETERMINE TO BE WHAT IS APPROPRIATE BASED ON THE SIZE OF THE PARKING AND THE HOTEL AND ALSO THE FACILITIES AVAILABLE LIKE BATHROOMS AND THAT SORT OF THING, UM, WE WOULD SAY YOU EITHER CAN'T HAVE IT OR YOU HAVE TO HAVE A TEMPORARY USE PERMIT WHERE WE'RE LOOKING MUCH MORE CLOSELY AT A LOT OF THOSE THINGS. SO WE HAVE DEALT WITH THAT WITH OTHER HOTELS. BUT JUST KEEPING IN MIND THAT THE EVENT, THE CONFERENCE MEETING FACILITY MUST BE AN ACCESSORY USE ON THIS PROPERTY IN ORDER TO BE A, TO BE ALLOWED. OKAY. THANK YOU FOR THAT. CAN I ASK A QUESTION FOR THAT POINT? JESSICA HAD A QUESTION. NO, NO, SHE DIDN'T. I WAS JUST CHEWING ON MY PEN. OKAY. , CARRIE, A HOTEL IS BUILT AND THERE OPERATING. RIGHT? WHY WOULD THEY COME TO YOU AND ASK YOU FOR PERMISSION? OH, THEY DON'T. UM, PEOPLE COMPLAIN BECAUSE A 400 PERSON WEDDING AT SOMEWHERE WITH SIX PARKING SPACES IMPACTS THE NEIGHBORHOOD QUITE A BIT. SURE. BUT IS THAT AFTER THE FACT? YEAH, BUT THEY, IF THEY'RE DOING IT ONCE, THEY'RE GONNA DO IT AGAIN. AND, UM, SO YEAH, WE'VE DEALT WITH IT AND ONCE, I MEAN, IT'S A ROUGH COUPLE MONTHS GETTING THEM TO UNDERSTAND OUR CODES, BUT, UH, WE HAVE, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? WE DEALT WITH IT. WE, WE TOLD HAVE YOU REVOKED ANYBODY'S ABILITY TO OPERATE? UM, NOT THEIR ABILITY TO OPERATE, BUT WE HAVE NOT APPROVED THE ADDITIONAL EVENTS. UM, AND SO WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN TO THE POINT WHERE WE'VE HAD TO REVOKE A CFO. UM, OKAY, BUT YOU SAY, BUT, BUT WE JUST TALKED ABOUT THE FACT THAT DON'T COME TO YOU FOR PERMISSION TO BEGIN WITH. SO HOW CAN YOU NOT APPROVE THEIR EVENTS UNLESS YOU PUT A RESTRICTION OF SOME SORT AND SAY YOU MUST GET ALL YOUR EVENTS APPROVED BY US IN ADVANCE. I MEAN, HOW ELSE WOULD YOU DO IT? IT, UM, SO THERE'S DIFFERENT WAYS WE CAN DO IT. UM, AGAIN, WE JUST, MOST PEOPLE IF YOU TELL 'EM, SORRY, NO, THAT'S NOT ALLOWED AND HERE'S THE BUILDING CODE REASONS, THE PLANNING REASONS. MOST PEOPLE WILL OBEY THE RULES. UM, WE HAVE A COUPLE OTHER SITUATIONS WHERE AT SOME POINT, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ARE ASKING FOR PERMITS TO REMODEL. SO WE CAN WITHHOLD PERMITS, WE CAN, UM, DO OTHER, THERE'S, THERE'S OTHER WAYS. MOST OF IT IS VOLUNTARY COMPLIANCE. OKAY. THANK YOU. I'D LIKE TO CONTINUE WITH MY OTHER QUESTIONS. YES. I WANTED TO MAKE SURE YOU WERE DONE. GO AHEAD. THANK YOU. UM, I, THERE'S BEEN REFERENCE TO THE TREES IN THE RIPARIAN AREA AND THAT WILL BE REMOVED. AND THEN THERE WAS A COMMENT THAT WAS MADE BY ONE OF THE APPELLATES ABOUT THAT SOME OF THE TREES ARE MAYBE NOT SICK OR DYING AS WAS ALLEGED BY THE APPLICANT. SO I'M CURIOUS AS TO, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT IS, DO YOU HAVE AN ARBORIST REPORT? THE DEVELOPER POSTED A, A PICTURE AND IN THE PICTURE IT HAS A KEY OF WHAT IS HAPPENING WITH CERTAIN TREES AND IF THEY ARE BLUE OR PURPLE, UM, THERE FOR REMOVAL OR RELOCATION. AND I JUST LOOKED AT THE PICTURE AND WHAT THE LEGEND SAID IN THE PICTURE. SO THEY HAVE A DOCUMENT THAT SHOWS WHAT TREES THEY'RE GOING TO REMOVE. AND YOU'RE ALLEGING THAT THOSE TREES ARE HEALTHY, VIBRANT TREES. THEY HAVE STATED THAT THEY ARE SALVAGEABLE TREES. OKAY, THANK YOU. AND DO YOU HAVE AN ARBORIST REPORT THAT SHOWS OTHERWISE OR? YES, WE DO HAVE A, A DETAILED ARBORIST REPORT. AND, AND IF THERE ARE DISCREPANCIES, WE, WE WILL OFFER TO HAVE THE CITY ARBORISTS AND OUR ARBORISTS MAKE A DECISION IF THERE'S AN ISSUE ON ANY SPECIFIC TREE WHILE WE'RE UNDER CONSTRUCTION. AND, AND CARRIE, THIS GOES BACK TO YOU, IF THERE'S A DISPUTE ABOUT THAT AND CONSTRUCTION IS UNDERWAY AND A TREE IS REMOVED AGAIN, HOW DO WE PREVENT THAT FROM HAPPENING? IT'S ONLY AN AFTER THE FACT. SO SOMETHING THAT WE FIND OUT WHAT WOULD HAPPEN FOR THIS TYPE OF PROJECT DURING CONSTRUCTION IS BEFORE THEY'RE ALLOWED TO START CONSTRUCTION, THEY WOULD HAVE TO INSTALL CONSTRUCTION FENCING. MM-HMM. . UM, AND WE WOULD GO [03:30:01] OUT AND INSPECT AND MAKE SURE THAT ALL OF THE TREES THAT THEY HAVE IDENTIFIED AS TO BE SAVED ARE FENCED AND PROTECTED. UM, IF WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT ANY OF THE TREES WHILE WE'RE OUT THERE, THAT WOULD BE THE TIME TO SAY LIKE, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS, WHAT'S THIS ONE? IS IT BEING REMOVED? AND HAVE THAT DISCUSSION. AND SO BEFORE THEY WERE A, ARE ABLE TO START CONSTRUCTION AGAIN, EVERYTHING WOULD HAVE TO BE FENCED. OUR BUILDING INSPECTOR, AS THEY'RE GOING OUT THERE, UM, ENGINEERING INSPECTORS GO OUT THERE AS WELL TO CHECK FOR THE STORM WATER ITEMS. UM, THEY CHECK TO MAKE SURE THE FENCING REMAINS IN PLACE. OKAY. AND CARRIE, THIS ONE IS, IS JUST FOR YOU. UM, MM-HMM. WE SEND OUT FOR OUTSIDE AGENCY REVIEW. RIGHT. AGENCIES OFTEN DON'T RESPOND. CORRECT. DO WE ALWAYS INTERPRET THE NON-RESPONSE AS A NO OBJECTION. DO WE EVER CHASE DOWN RESPONSES? UM, IF WE ARE AWARE THAT, SO THERE HAVE BEEN SITUATIONS WHERE THE PROPERTY BORDERS THE NATIONAL FOREST, UM, WHERE WE HAVE DIRECTLY REACHED OUT TO THE FOREST SERVANTS AND SAID, CAN YOU CONFIRM THAT YOU HAVE NO, UM, COMMENTS ON THIS? UM, AND OR IF THERE'S, IF THERE'S SOMETHING THAT WE KNOW IS MAYBE A LITTLE SENSITIVE, WE WILL REACH OUT. BUT, UM, I DON'T BELIEVE WE DID THAT FOR ANYTHING ON THIS ONE. UM, ALSO AS THE PROJECT MOVES FORWARD, WE DON'T ALWAYS, IN, IN SUBSEQUENT REVIEWS, WE DON'T SEND IT TO THE ENTIRE GROUP AGAIN UNLESS THERE'S A MAJOR CHANGE. AND SO AS THEY MENTIONED IN THEIR PROJECT, YOU KNOW, THEY, YOU KNOW, WERE REDUCING SOME OF THE ROOM COUNTS, THEY WERE REDUCING SOME OF THE BUILDING FOOTPRINTS. WE DIDN'T EVER FEEL LIKE IT GOT TO THE POINT WHERE THERE WAS A SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH, SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH CHANGE AND ANY CHANGES WERE REDUCING. SO WE, WE DIDN'T, WE WOULDN'T SEND IT OUT TO THE ENTIRE GROUP EVERY TIME WE WOULD JUST PARE IT DOWN TO THE PEOPLE WHO HAD COMMENTS IN THE PAST. SO DO YOU FEEL THAT THERE WAS ANY REPORT THAT YOU ARE MISSING OR LACKING IN THE REVIEW THAT WAS DONE IN THE P AND Z APPROVAL? DID YOU HAVE EVERYTHING IN THAT YOU FELT NEEDED TO BE IN? YES. YEAH. OKAY. THANK YOU. YOU GOOD? DONE. OKAY. UH, VICE MAYOR, YOU GOOD? OKAY. YEAH, I WAS, KATHY, I WAS JUST GONNA, I USED IN MY BRAIN WHEN I WAS FORMULATING THAT QUESTION, I USED SOME OF THE EXACT WORDS THAT YOU USED. I KNOW. I WONDER WHY YOU'RE NOT SURPRISED. , UH, WRONG. IT'S THE REASON WE'RE FRIENDS . RIGHT. BECAUSE I, I WANNA, I WANT TO GO DOWN THAT PATH A LITTLE BIT TOO. I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THESE, UM, TWO THREATENED SPECIES. AND IT SEEMS TO ME THAT WE SHOULD BE REACHING OUT TO FISH AND GAME OR WHOEVER IT IS THAT COULD VALIDATE WHETHER OR NOT THESE PLANS ARE GOING TO NEGATIVELY IMPACT THESE BIRDS AND THE SNAKE. IF THEY HAVEN'T RESPONDED, I WOULDN'T ASSUME THAT THAT MEANS IT'S OKAY. I HAD NOT HEARD ABOUT THE THREATENED ENDANGERED SPECIES BEFORE TODAY. THAT IS ONE OF THE REASONS WE TRY TO DO SOME OF THE EARLIER OUTREACH TO FIND LIKE IF THERE WAS SOMEONE WITH SOME DIFFERENT LOCAL KNOWLEDGE TO KNOW ABOUT. UM, AND SO IF WE HADN'T KNOWN ABOUT IT EARLIER, WE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE, BUT I JUST HEARD ABOUT THEM TONIGHT. KURT, DID YOU WANNA SAY SOMETHING? YEAH, MAYOR. MAYOR AND COUNCIL. SO AS FAR AS THE, UM, CRITICAL CRITICAL HABITATS AREAS, THOSE, UH, DON'T GENERALLY APPLY TO CITIZENS ENGAGED IN PRIVATE PROPERTY. UM, AND SO WE DO SEND THIS TO THE COCONINO NATIONAL FORCE AND THE ARIZONA, UH, UH, GAMING FISH OR, UM, OR WILDLIFE. AND, BUT IF IT DOESN'T INVOLVE FEDERAL FUNDING OR, UM, PUBLIC PROPERTY, THEN THEY GENERALLY, THOSE GENERALLY DON'T HAVE ANY PROHIBITION ON, ON BUILDING. YOU'RE WRONG ON THAT. SO, EXCUSE ME, DIRECTLY FROM THE WEBSITE OF THEIR, OF THE, I'M NOT GONNA ASK YOU AGAIN TO STOP CALLING OUT FROM THE AUDIENCE. THE US UH, FISH, UM, AND WILDLIFE SERVICES IS A PRIVATE LANDOWNER UNDERTAKING A PROJECT THAT INVOLVES NO FEDERAL FUNDING OR PERMITTING. IT DOESN'T, THE CRITICAL HABITAT REQUIREMENTS DO NOT APPLY. CAN I ASK A QUESTION ABOUT THAT? YEAH, I DON'T, NO, IT'S, IT'S VICE MAYOR, IT'S YOUR TIME IF YOU WANNA YES, YOU MAY. OKAY. OKAY. SO, UM, SINCE IT'S IN A FLOODPLAIN, THEY HAVE TO GET A PERMIT FROM COCONINO COUNTY. AND IF YOU REVIEW WHAT COCONINO COUNTY REQUIRES FOR A FLOOD PERMIT, THEY NEED AN ARMY CORP 4 0 4 PERMIT, WHICH IS A FEDERAL PERMIT. SO THE CITY JUST ACQUIRED A 4 0 4 PERMIT [03:35:01] FOR THE PEDESTRIAN CROSSING PROJECT, AND WE DID COMPLY WITH RESTRICTIONS RELATED TO THESE, THESE ENDANGERED SPECIES. UM, BUT WHAT, WHEN YOU ENACT THE, UM, THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THE 4 0 4 PERMIT, THAT'S WHEN YOUR DISTURBANCE IS WITHIN THE ORDINARY HIGH WATER MARK. SO THAT'S EVEN MORE REFINED THAN THE FLOODPLAIN. THAT'S WHEN THEY'RE LOOKING AT A RESTRICTED AREA OF A RIPARIAN ZONE. THAT'S WHAT THEY CONSIDER WETLAND. SO IT'S, IT'S MUCH MORE NARROW THAN EVEN THE FLOODPLAIN OR FLOOD FLOODWAY. MM-HMM. , IT'S, IT'S MUCH MORE NARROW THAN THE FLOODPLAIN, BUT IT'S MORE NARROW EVEN THAN THE FLOODWAY. AND THAT WAS ON PUBLIC PROPERTY. RIGHT. PROPERTY. OKAY. THANK YOU. UH, SO I WANNA TALK ABOUT PARKING ALSO BECAUSE THE, THE EMPLOYEES, YOU ASSUME 60 EMPLOYEES, WHICH IS LESS THAN YOUR NEIGHBORS WITH, I ASSUME YOU'RE GONNA HAVE HIGH TOUCH SERVICE. RIGHT. SO HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN 200 EMPLOYEES AT LOW BEARS AND 60 AT YOUR LOCATION? I'M NOT SURE THAT NUMBER IS SUBSTANTIATED FOR LE BEARISH , HOWEVER, WE STATED THAT WE'D HAVE 60, UM, TOTAL EMPLOYEES AND THERE ARE THREE SHIFTS. AND OUR PEAK SHIFT WOULD HAVE APPROXIMATELY 35 EMPLOYEES ON SITE. AND WE OPERATE A VERY, VERY EFFICIENT HOTEL, UH, WITHOUT SACRIFICING GUEST EXPERIENCE. IF YOU, IF YOU CAN IMAGINE, UH, IT'S, IT'S A PROVEN MODEL AND TO BOUTIQUE HOTELS THAT WE DO HAVE, AND WE'LL APPLY IT AGAIN. SO PEAK, PEAK SHIFT, PRIMARY SHIFT WOULD BE 35 AND THE OTHER SHIFTS WOULD BE EVEN LESS. SO DO YOU DO CENTRALIZED, UH, OPERATIONS IN SOMEPLACE THAT GIVES YOU THE EFFICIENCY? SO YOU'RE NOT, EVERYBODY'S NOT IN THE SINGLE LOCATION, BUT YOU DO SOME BACK OFFICE OPERATIONS AND SOME HEADQUARTERS SALES. SALES IS OFFSITE. YEP. SALES, FOR EXAMPLE, SALES IS OFFSITE. MM-HMM. . OKAY. BUT YOU'RE ASSUMING 30, I I READ THIS SOMEWHERE. SO 30 EMPLOYEES AT A GIVEN TIME, PARKING. CORRECT. AND THAT'S, AND THAT'S WHY WE DO HAVE THE TDM PROGRAM TO ENCOURAGE CARPOOLING TO DO WHATEVER WE CAN TO INCENTIVIZE OUR EMPLOYEES, UH, TO HAVE LESS CARS OUT THERE. OKAY. SO THAT'S NOT, AND YOU'VE BEEN SUCCESSFUL IN DOING THAT IN OTHER LOCATIONS? YES. YES. BECAUSE IT JUST FEELS TO ME LIKE YOU DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH PARKING HERE IF YOU HAVE 30 PARKING, LET'S JUST DO WORST CASE. SURE. AND I, I'LL JUST BELIEVE YOU FOR A MINUTE, THAT IT'S ONLY 30 PEOPLE. MM-HMM. , WHICH I FIND TO BE UNBELIEVABLE, BUT I'LL BELIEVE YOU. SO YOU HAVE 30, YOU HAVE 70 UNITS, YOU HAVE 30 PEOPLE, EMPLOYEES, SO THAT YOU HAVE 90 PARKING SPACES THAT CUTS DOWN TO 60 PARKING SPACES. YOU HAVE 70 UNITS, YOU HAVE A RESTAURANT, YOU HAVE POTENTIALLY FOR CONFERENCES, AND YOU HAVE A SPA. YOU HAVE, YOU MAY HAVE A BEAUTY SALON. I DON'T KNOW HOW IT DOESN'T FEEL LIKE I, I, YOU GOTTA GIVE ME SOMETHING ABOUT HOW YOU CAME UP WITH THIS. 'CAUSE IT JUST DOES NOT FEEL LIKE ENOUGH PARKING AND WE KNOW THERE'S NO PLACE ELSE TO GO FOR PARKING. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAVE A THOUGHT THROUGH SPILLOVER AND WHERE YOU'RE GONNA HAVE YOUR VALETS GO OUTSIDE THE PROPERTY. SO, VERY GOOD QUESTION. AND WE DO HAVE HOTELS WHERE WE HAVE MULTIPLE USES ON THE PROPERTY. SO I'LL GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE. THERE'S FIVE OF US IN OUR CAR TODAY. WE HAVE FIVE ROOMS AT THE HOTEL THAT WE'RE STAYING AT. UM, SO TO ASSUME THAT EVERY ROOM HAS TO HAVE ONE CAR IS NOT, I MEAN, IT, IT SIMPLY DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY. AND AGAIN, WE ARE MANAGING TO OUR PARKING. WE ARE EXPERIENCED AT THIS. UH, WE, WE WANT OUR PARKING TO FIT AND TO WORK. IT WOULD BE A, IT WOULD BE A BAD INVESTMENT ON THIS. I MEAN, WE'RE TALKING A SUBSTANTIAL INVESTMENT. AND FOR US TO COME UP 15 OR 20 PARKING STALL SHORT IS A REALLY BAD IDEA. SO [03:40:02] WE ARE MANAGING AND DEVELOPING TO WHAT MAKES, WHAT WORKS AND WHAT MAKES SENSE. UM, THE OTHER HOTELS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, I SUSPECT THAT THAT'S A, UH, A TOTAL EMPLOYEE'S NUMBER. AND I DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S EVEN REAL. UM, BUT WE TALK ABOUT OPERATIONAL, UM, EFFICIENCIES WHERE WE WILL HAVE, OUR VALET PERSON WILL TAKE THE GUEST TO THE ROOM, OFTENTIMES VALET HANDED OFF TO THE BELLMAN BELLMAN TANKS IN THE FRONT DESK. I MEAN, THREE OR FOUR PEOPLE TOUCH TO GET TO THE ROOM. WE, WE FIND IT'S A MUCH BETTER GUEST EXPERIENCE. VALET TAKE THE GUEST TO THE ROOM WITH THEIR KEY. SO MUCH MORE EFFICIENT, MUCH MORE CUSTOMER FRIENDLY. SO BESIDES PARKING IN THE DRIVEWAY, DO YOU HAVE A BACKUP PLAN? DO YOU WANNA TAKE THAT? DO YOU HAVE A SITE PLAN? SURE. AND WHAT PAGE WOULD THAT BE WHEN YOU FIND IT? UM, LET'S SEE. IT'S PAGE FIVE. PAGE FIVE. IT'S RIGHT THERE. OKAY. OKAY. SO THE 90 SPACES ARE THE STRIPED SPACES THAT ARE SHOWN IN THE PLAN. AND WE HAVE TWO DRY VALVES IN ADDITION TO THE, UH, ACCESS AISLE FOR THE VALETS. AND THE LENGTH OF THIS DRY VALVE, IF YOU CAN VISUALIZE IT AT APPROXIMATELY 20 FEET EACH, UH, WE HAVE THE POTENTIAL TO PUT IN AN ADDITIONAL 25 TO 30 CARS, UH, TO MEET EXTRA DEMAND. SO IT'S THE DRIVEWAY, BASICALLY. WELL, NOT TECHNICALLY THE, THE ENGINE DRIVE, BECAUSE OUR ENTRANCE DRIVE IS HERE TURNING TO THE LEFT. AND WE WOULDN'T WANNA, WE WOULDN'T WANT TO IMPACT GUEST EXPERIENCE AS THEY ARRIVE TO THE HOTEL. SO WE WOULD NOT, WE WOULD NOT HAVE CARS PARKED WITHIN THAT MAIN ENTRANCE DRIVE. AND THE, THE SHARED, THE SHARED PARKING ANALYSIS, IT'S, IT'S ANALYSIS, A PROFESSIONAL ANALYSIS, UH, PUT TOGETHER BY KIMLEY HORNE. IT'S IN THE EXHIBITS. IT'S BASED ON ULI AND ITE STANDARDS FOR ALL OF THESE USES. AND THEY'RE BASED, AGAIN, ON PEAK HOUR DEMAND. SO EACH ONE OF THESE USES TRENDS TO HAVE A HIGHER PARKING REQUIREMENT AT DIFFERENT HOURS OF THE DAY. AND THUS YOU CAN HAVE CARS MOVING IN AND OUT TO ACCOMMODATE THAT DEMAND. UH, THAT'S WHY SHARED PARKING ANALYSIS OR ALTERNATE PARKING ANALYSIS ARE APPROVED BY CITIES, UH, UH, THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY BECAUSE OF, OF THIS CONCEPT. IT, IT'S ABOUT PEAK HOUR DEMAND. WHAT IS THE, WHAT ARE THE PEAK HOURS YOU'RE USING? PARDON? WHAT ARE THE PEAK HOURS YOU'RE USING? UH, BRENT CAN IS SHOWING MICROPHONE. COULD YOU PLEASE COME TO THE MIC? WE, WE, WE LOOKED AT IT FROM 6:00 AM THROUGH THE, THE ENTIRE COURSE OF THE DAY TILL CLEAR. 24 HOURS. AND THE PEAK DEMAND IS 5:00 PM ONE FOR, FOR HOW LONG? WELL, IT, IT VARIES. IT'S FROM FIVE TO SIX. IT'S 80, 85, AND THEN IT GOES DOWN TO 83, AND THEN 87. SO THOSE ARE ONE HOUR INCREMENTS. AND YOU DID WHAT, HOW DID YOU ARRIVE AT THOSE NUMBERS? IT'S THROUGH THAT ULI RESOURCE NATIONAL STUDIES THAT SAY, THIS IS THE USE, THIS IS THE PEAK DEMANDS, AND WE ADD THOSE ALL UP TOGETHER AND SHOW THOSE OVERLAPPING, UH, PEAK HOURS AND THEN STACK THOSE ON TOP OF EACH OTHER. AND STACKED GIVES US OUR TOTAL OF A PEAK OF, OF THE 85 STALLS. BUT IT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH SEDONA WAS SOME STANDARDS. IT'S, IT'S ULI NATIONAL STANDARDS. [03:45:04] OKAY. UH, AND I WANTED, I THINK MY LAST QUESTION IS ABOUT CREEK ACCESS. SOMEBODY WAS, GAVE TESTIMONY ABOUT CREEK ACCESS, THAT THERE WOULDN'T BE A WAY FOR THE PUBLIC TO USE THE CREEK ONLY GUEST RESORT GUESTS. COULD YOU TALK TO ABOUT THAT? YES. IF I'M, IF I MAY PULL UP THE SLIDE FOR THE CREEK ACCESS. SO THIS IS AN, AN EXCERPT ALSO FROM THE CFA. WHAT, WHAT PAGE IS THAT? THIS IS 33, WELL, 33 OF THE PDF, BUT I'M SORRY, WE DON'T HAVE THE REFERENCE OF THE PAGE OF, OF CFA. THAT'S THE NUMBER 33. OKAY. AND, UH, THIS DIAGRAM, WHICH IS IN THE CFA SHOWS THE CONCEPTUAL LAYOUT, THE INTENDED LAYOUT FOR PUBLIC PATHS ALONG SCHLEY HILL ROAD, ALONG BARE WALLA LANE, AND OVER THE CREEK AND ALONG THE CREEK. AND WE SUPERIMPOSED OUR PROPERTY LINES ON THIS EXHIBIT, UH, SHOWN IN RED. AND AS YOU CAN SEE, WE ARE IMPLEMENTING THE PUBLIC PATH ALONG SNUGGLEY HILL ROAD AND ALONG BEAR WALLOW AND EVEN OFFERING AN EASEMENT TO THE CITY. UH, THERE WAS A, A QUESTION REGARDING THE FEASIBILITY OF A FUTURE PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE THAT THE CITY HAS BEEN CONTEMPLATING, UH, BECAUSE THAT IS STILL IN FEASIBILITY AND CONCEPTUAL PHASE. THEY REQUESTED FLEXIBILITY TO WORK ON OUR SITE TO DETERMINE THE BEST AND MOST FINANCIALLY, UH, FEASIBLE LOCATION FOR THAT PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE ACROSS OAK CREEK. SO WE OFFERED AS A COMMUNITY BENEFIT AND EASEMENT, UH, TO, TO CONTINUE A CREEK WALK HERE ALONG THIS SEGMENT OF OUR PROPERTY, AND THEN ALONG THE ENTIRE LENGTH OF THE CREEK, ESSENTIALLY OUR, THE NORTHWEST CORNER OF OUR SITE. AND AT THE REQUEST OF PUBLIC WORKS AND THE PLANNING DEPARTMENTS, WE'RE GONNA DEDICATE THAT EASEMENT TO PROVIDE FLEXIBILITY FOR THE CITY IF AND WHEN THIS PUBLIC PATH DOES, UH, BECOME REAL WITH ITS PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE. MR. MAYOR, JUST FOR THE RECORD, THAT'S CFA PAGE 23. IS THAT DIAGRAM? SAME, SAME ONE WE HAVE. OKAY. THANK YOU. SO, UH, I'M GONNA BE QUICK AND THEN MOVE ON TO MY COLLEAGUES, BUT WOULD SOMEBODY HAVE TO, THE ONLY ACCESS THEY COULD GET FROM IS FROM A PATH THAT DOESN'T EXIST NOW. I MEAN, THAT WILL EXIST THEN, BUT WOULD THEY HAVE TO GO ON YOUR PROPERTY? SO WE'RE, WE'RE IN THE HOSPITALITY BUSINESS AND, AND WE'RE HERE TO BE GREAT NEIGHBORS. SO IF, IF NEIGHBORS WOULD LIKE TO JUST SCROLL THROUGH OUR SITE, IF, IF GUESTS OR PATRONS THAT ARE JUST VISITING, UH, FOR A, A MEAL OR A DRINK WOULD LIKE TO BE ON SITE, ABSOLUTELY. WE'LL, WE'LL WELCOME ANY RESPECTFUL INDIVIDUAL THAT, THAT SHOWS RESPECT TO OUR PROPERTY AND TO THE CREEK. SO YOU'RE NOT INTENDING TO HAVE LIKE A GATEHOUSE AND NO PEOPLE HAVE TO SHOW CREDENTIALS AND THINGS LIKE THAT? NO, NO. WE, WE WOULDN'T EVEN WANNA DO THAT TO OUR GUESTS. . OKAY. THANK YOU. OKAY. COUNCILOR WILLIAMSON, YOU WANT TO, I JUST HAD A QUICK QUESTION TAG ON TO THAT LAST ONE. UH, I'M GOING BACK TO TRAFFIC TO PARKING. OKAY. WELL, BEFORE WE GO DO THAT, WE HAVE TO FINISH UP THE PEOPLE, THE REST OF THE COUNCIL. OKAY. THANK YOU. ABSOLUTELY. OKAY. COUNCILOR DUNN, I WOULD, I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR WHAT COUNCILOR WILLIAMSON HAS TO ASK ABOUT PARKING, BECAUSE I ALSO HAVE QUESTIONS ON PARKING. OKAY, THEN. THERE YOU GO. I'M NOT EITHER AN OPERATOR OF A HOTEL OR A TRAFFIC ENGINEER, SO I WOULD, THEY HAVE SAID THAT THE AMOUNT OF PARKING WILL WORK FOR THEM. I WOULD LIKE TO ASK ANDY, DO YOU BELIEVE THAT THAT'S ENOUGH PARKING FOR THIS FACILITY? WELL, KURT'S IN THE BACK THERE, HE'S JUST NOT DOING ANYTHING. OKAY. KURT, DO YOU THINK THAT THIS IS ENOUGH PARKING FOR THIS FACILITY? [03:50:02] YES. WE'VE, UH, LOOKED AT ALL THE FACTS, WORK WITH COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT. HANUKAH BEHIND ME LOOKED AT ALL THAT. OKAY. FOR WHAT THEY PROPOSED. WE'VE ACCEPTED IT AS, UM, LIKELY TO HANDLE MOST OF THE PARTIES. AND CARRIE, ARE YOU IN CONCURRENCE WITH THAT? YES. AS NEITHER A TRAFFIC ENGINEER OR AN OPERATOR OF A HIGH END HOTEL? YES. OKAY. THANK YOU. THAT'S MY ONLY QUESTION, SORRY. OKAY, COUNSEL DUNN. SO MY QUESTIONS ORIGINALLY WERE ORDERED RATHER LOGICALLY, AND NOW THEY'RE ALL OVER MY PAGE, SO I WILL BE BOUNCING. SO I, I APOLOGIZE IN ADVANCE. UM, I HEAR STAFF AND I ACKNOWLEDGE THAT YOU ARE CERTAINLY BETTER EQUIPPED AT ENGINEERING THAN I AM. UM, HOWEVER, I STILL HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT PARKING HERE. UM, I HAVE CONCERNS BECAUSE WE HAVE ONE EVENT ROOM WE'VE SPOKEN ABOUT ON, I'M STARING AT YOU IN THE BACK. UM, THE ARCHITECT, I BELIEVE, UM, WHERE YOU'VE SAID THE LARGE EVENT ROOM IS BETWEEN A HUNDRED AND 150, I'M GIVING YOU A SMALLER NUMBER THAN THE ONE 70 THAT YOU DID FOR FIRE. HOWEVER, THERE'S A SECOND MEETING ROOM THAT NO ONE'S MENTIONED. SO WHAT ABOUT THAT MEETING ROOM? HOW MANY PEOPLE FIT INTO THAT MEETING ROOM? OH, AND THEN YOU HAVE A PUBLIC GALLERY, AND HOW MANY PEOPLE COULD FIT INTO THE PUBLIC GALLERY WHO WANNA COME FROM, SAY, EVEN THE COMMUNITY TO COME AND SEE? BECAUSE THAT'S ONE OF YOUR, YOUR PUBLIC BENEFITS IS THIS, THIS GALLERY. SO YOU DO HAVE THESE OTHER BUILDINGS. I'D REALLY LIKE TO KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE YOU THINK CAN FIT IN THERE. I'LL SHUT UP AND LET YOU SPEAK. MAY I COMMENT? TONY? GO AHEAD. FIRST BEFOREHAND. THANK YOU, COUNSELOR. I JUST WANNA CLARIFY THAT, THAT THERE, THERE WOULD BE MANY BUILDING CODE RESTRICTIONS THAT ARE MORE SEVERE THAN PLANNING OR ZONING WOULD CONTEMPLATE. MM-HMM. . AND, AND, AND THOSE ARE FUNDAMENTALLY FOR LIFE SAFETY AND HEALTH. AND WE WELFARE. AND OBVIOUSLY IT'S, WE WILL MEET THOSE BUILDING CODES AND, AND THAT, THAT WAS GREG'S REFERENCE, UH, TO THAT OCCUPANCY. THAT THAT'S THE OCCUPANCY THAT THE FIRE DEPARTMENT WOULD HAVE US DESIGNED TO IN TERMS OF EGRESS AND LIFE SAFETY AND ALSO THE, THE RATINGS OF THE WALLS, UH, ALL FOR THE BENEFIT OF, OF ANY, UH, OCCUPANTS. WE DON'T WANT TO PUT ANYBODY AT RISK, BUT, BUT IT'S BUILDING CODE REQUIREMENTS AND IT'S, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT NECESSARILY, UH, THE AMOUNT OF GUESTS THAT WE'LL HAVE WITHIN THAT SPACE. I FULLY, I FULLY UNDERSTAND. I'M JUST TRYING TO GET CLEAR. AND I ALSO HAVE HEARD THE STATEMENT ABOUT HOW YOU'RE GONNA, YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T WANT TO BE OPERATIONALLY INCOMPETENT. UM, AND I HEARD THAT AS WELL. HOWEVER, WE HAVE THESE ROOMS. YOU PLAN ON USING THESE ROOMS. YOU'RE PLANNING ON BUILDING PART OF YOUR FINANCIAL PLAN ON THE SALE OF THESE ROOMS. I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE SOME UNDERSTANDING OF HOW MANY POTENTIAL INDIVIDUALS YOU MIGHT HAVE AND FIGURE OUT WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE FOR THE NUMBER OF CARS THAT ARE GOING TO BE COMING IN. UM, AND, AND I HAVE OTHER ISSUES AS WELL, BUT I'LL LET THIS GENTLEMAN SPEAK. OKAY. WELL, TO, TO THAT SPECIFIC, I THINK IT WAS ANSWERED IN THE SHARED PARKING ANALYSIS AT PEAK TIME USE, THEY'RE NOT ALL COMPLETELY OCCUPIED AT THE SAME TIME. AT ANY RATE, THE SMALL CONFERENCE ROOM IS 434, UH, NET AREA. AND IF YOU DO THE MATH ON THAT ONE, THAT IS A DIVISIBLE NUMBER BY 15 AND NOT SEVEN. AND THAT'S ABOUT 28.9. AGAIN, THAT'S WHAT IT'S SIGNED THAT IN, IN THE BUILDING CODES. THAT'S WHAT THE MAXIMUM CAPACITY OF THAT ROOM CAN BE. BUT TO TONY'S POINT, MM-HMM. , IT'S A SMALL ROOM. IF YOU HAVE A TABLE, IT MIGHT BE A 12 PERSON TABLE. THE TABLE WE'VE LAID OUT IS 14, SO 14 PEOPLE AT A TABLE WILL FIT IN THAT ROOM COMFORTABLY. OKAY. AND WHAT ABOUT THE GALLERY? HOW MANY THE GALLERY SPACE TO, UM, IN MY OPINION WOULDN'T EVEN REALLY, THAT'S A TRICKY ONE TO PROVIDE EVEN AN OCCUPANCY TO. IT'S NOT INTENDED AS AN ASSEMBLY SPACE. UM, WE WOULD CALL IT A B OCCUPANCY AND ONE TO ONE. IT'S BASICALLY LIKE A HUNDRED SQUARE FEET. IT'S LIKE TWO PEOPLE, THREE PEOPLE MAX. OKAY. SO, SO BASICALLY YOU'RE ON THE GALLERY. IT'S, IT'S A PASS THROUGH. IT'S A PASS THROUGH. CORRECT. YOU EXPECT PEOPLE TO COME IN, WANDER AROUND AND, AND, AND EXIT IT. THAT IS THE USE OF THAT BUILDING? YES. OKAY. SO, UM, SO HERE ARE MY ISSUES AROUND PARKING. I UNDERSTAND THESE PROBABLY THERE'S A GOOD CHANCE NONE OF THEM WILL BE USED SIMULTANEOUSLY, BUT YOU COULD HAVE A WEDDING AND YOU COULD HAVE A SMALL MEETING AT THE SAME TIME. IT'S POSSIBLE. MY UNDERSTANDING FROM READING THE MATERIALS IS THAT THESE ROOMS WOULD BE USED BETWEEN 8:00 AM AND 10:00 PM [03:55:01] WHICH BASICALLY RUNS WITH THE NOISE ORDINANCE, UM, FOR THE CITY. UM, IF AN EVENT STARTS, EVERYONE'S GONNA COME IN AT ONE TIME. WHEN AN EVENT ENDS, EVERYONE'S GONNA LEAVE AT THE SAME TIME. AND THAT SEEMS TO ME IN A, EVEN IN A VALE SITUATION WHERE YOU CAN POTENTIALLY SLOW THE FLOW DOWN BY, YOU HAVE TO, YOU HAVE TWO HUMANS OR ONE HUMAN, AND THEY HAVE TO GO GET A CAR, UM, THAT'S STILL A LOT OF PRESSURE ON, ON SIBLEY ROUNDABOUT, UM, AS THOSE PEOPLE COME IN AT ONE TIME AND THEN THEY GO OUT AT ONE TIME. AND, UM, THAT, THAT I FIND CONCERNING BECAUSE WE DO BACK UP AT SNUBBY ALREADY. AND EVEN IF IT'S ONLY FOR 20 OR 30 MINUTES TO GET ALL THOSE PEOPLE IN AND OUT AGAIN, THAT DURING A SATURDAY WHEN A LOT OF THESE EVENTS MAY HAPPEN, OR A SUNDAY WHEN A LOT OF THESE EVENTS WOULD HAPPEN, OR A FRIDAY NIGHT WHEN THESE EVENTS WOULD HAPPEN, THAT'S A LOT OF TRAFFIC WE ALREADY HAVE IN THE CITY. AND SO I AM CONCERNED ABOUT THAT. THIS IS NOT 2020, THIS IS 2024 AND, UM, THE CITY HAS CHANGED AND THE NUMBER OF VISITORS TO THE CITY HAS CHANGED. AND SO THAT, THAT I FIND CONCERNING AS FAR AS NOT JUST PARKING, BUT TRAFFIC FLOW. SURE. UM, SO YEAH, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU WANNA RESPOND TO THAT OR I DO. THANK YOU. SURE. IF, IF THIS IS AN EXTREMELY IMPORTANT ISSUE FOR YOU, WE CAN LIMIT THE NUMBER OF OCCUPANTS AND HAVE THAT AS A CONDITION OF APPROVAL. WE CAN'T, WE'RE NOT GONNA NEGOTIATE HERE. MM-HMM. FROM THEAS. WE'RE GOING TO, THAT'S JUST NOT WHAT WE'RE GONNA BE DOING TODAY. WE'RE GONNA ASK OUR QUESTIONS. THEY WON'T MAKE A DETERMINATION, BUT WE'RE NOT GONNA HAVE THAT GIVE AND TAKE. THANK YOU. OKAY. UNDERSTAND. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. SO I JUST WANNA TAG ONE LAST THING ONTO THAT, AND I'M GONNA MOVE ON TO A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT TOPIC. SO WHEN IT COMES TO, UM, WELL ACTUALLY TWO, ONE TINY COMMENT AND ONE BIG COMMENT. THE TINY COMMENT IS YOU'RE ASKING A HUMAN TO UNDERSTAND 20 FEET QUESTION AS THEY PARK, AS THEY PARK THE CAR. WHAT IS THAT QUESTION? QUESTION? WELL, I, I AM, I'M JUST DO THE QUESTIONS FIRST. OKAY. PLEASE. THANK YOU. SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE EXPECTING YOUR VALETS TO KNOW HOW TO, TO MEASURE 20 FEET. SO HOW ARE, 'CAUSE IT'S NOT MARKED. SO HOW ARE YOU GOING TO HELP THEM, UH, THE, ON THE ROADWAY AS THEY PARK? HOW ARE YOU GONNA HELP THEM? OUR VALE, BELIEVE IT OR NOT, OUR VALET OUR VERY, VERY EXPERIENCED AT MANEUVERING CARS AND PARKING THEM, UH, WITHIN INCHES OF EACH OTHER. AND WE, WE COULD HAVE A GUIDE MARKED WITHIN THAT ASPHALT. IT COULD BE AS SIMPLE AS JUST PEGS THAT ARE THERE EMBEDDED THAT ACT AS A GUIDE. BUT, BUT I TRULY BELIEVE THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO EYEBALL IT, SO TO SPEAK. OKAY. THANK YOU. UM, I'M GONNA SWITCH OVER TO THE RIPARIAN AREAS. UM, AS YOU KNOW, PRETTY PRETTY SENSITIVE TOPIC FOR PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN SEDONA. UM, SO, UH, WHAT, WHAT IS BEING DONE? I, AND I'M, AND I DID LISTEN TO P AND Z MORE THAN ONCE. SO, UH, I AM TRYING TO ASK QUESTIONS I DIDN'T FIND ANSWERS TO, JUST TO LET YOU KNOW WHAT'S BEING DONE TO PROTECT THE CREEK FROM DIRECT SUNLIGHT IMPACTS. SO AS YOU REMOVE TREES AND EVEN WITH CANTILEVER, UM, YOU KNOW, BALCONIES, YOU'RE RIGHT NOW RIPARIAN AREAS IN THE CREEK NEEDS THAT SHADE. SO WHAT ARE YOU DOING TO, UM, MAKE SURE WE DON'T GET DIRECT SUNLIGHT IMPACTS, UM, ON THE CREEK, WHICH IS NEGATIVE IF THAT, IF THAT IS AN ISSUE WITH SOME OF THE TREE REMOVAL WE COULD OFFER TO REPLANT. SO YOU HAVE NOT AT THIS MOMENT STUDIED WHETHER OR NOT YOU WOULD, YOU COULD POSSIBLY CREATE ANY DIRECT SUNLIGHT IMPACTS LG GROVE CHANGE THE FLOW OF THE CREEK. YOU HAVEN'T REALLY TAKEN A LOOK AT THAT, OR YOU HAVE WE, WE HAVE NOT. IT'S, IF CARRIE CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION ON THE REQUIREMENTS OF THOSE STUDIES, THERE'S NOTHING AND, AND THE CODE THAT TALKS TO THAT, AND BECAUSE THEY ARE LEAVING, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE KEEPING THE DEVELOPMENT OUT OF THE FLOODWAY AND ONLY REMOVING THE TREES THAT ARE ESSENTIALLY, YOU KNOW, DEAD OR DISEASED. THERE IS, BUT THAT WAS NOT A CONCERN DURING OUR REVIEW. OKAY. UM, I KNOW LUKE, YOU, YOU SPOKE TO THIS A LITTLE BIT IN P AND Z. UH, WHAT IS BEING DONE TO AMELIORATE OR MITIGATE THE IMPACT OF SEDIMENTATION? UM, I, I KNOW YOU TALKED ABOUT IT [04:00:01] WHEN YOU'RE DOING THE BUILDING, BUT WHAT ABOUT, UH, WHEN WE HAVE A STORM LIKE SUNDAY OR EVEN TODAY? YES. UM, WE WOULD, WE'RE LOOKING AT, WE HAVE A LOT OF IMPERVIOUS AREAS IN AREAS THAT WE WERE, UH, DIRECTING IT. WE WENT IN MINUTE DETAIL ABOUT EVERY DROP OF WATER WHERE IT'S GOING. UM, I LIKE THIS PROJECT BECAUSE THEY'RE ALLOWING ME TO USE THE RAIN CATCHMENTS, UM, AND SOME OTHER, UH, METHODS TO RETAIN THE WATER. UM, SO THAT SEDIMENTATION WILL NOT GO OFF SITE, UH, WILL GO INTO THE TANKS OR INTO THE AREAS THERE, AND IT'LL BE USED AGAIN THAT WATERS BE USED ON SITE FOR LANDSCAPING. OKAY. THANK YOU. I, I DON'T KNOW IF I SHOULD DIRECT THIS TO CARRIE. UH, WHATEVER YOU WANT. SO, OKAY. PART OF THE CFA, THE CFA IS, IS ABOUT NOT DAMAGING THE ENVIRONMENT, NOT CREATING ADVERSE IMPACTS, UM, ON THE REP RIPARIAN AREA, SO FORTH AND SO ON. AND, UH, ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT I AM CONCERNED ABOUT IS WHAT'S BEING DONE TO MITIGATE THE IMPACT OF HUMAN BEHAVIOR AROUND AND IN THE CREEK. UM, WE, WE, WE KNOW WE HAVE ISSUES WITH PEOPLE THROWING THINGS AND LEAVING THINGS THAT ARE ACTUALLY HARMFUL, UM, NOT ONLY TO THE CREEK, BUT TO WILDLIFE THAT WILL COME DOWN TO THE CREEK. UM, AND ALSO WE KNOW THAT WE'VE HEARD TESTIMONY THAT THERE ARE WILDLIFE CORRIDORS THAT ARE CURRENTLY THERE THAT ARE GOING DOWN INTO THE CREEK. SO FROM YOUR PERSPECTIVE, SINCE THAT'S ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS IS TO NOT ADVERSELY IMPACT WILDLIFE, ET CETERA, WHAT DO YOU THINK IS, IS HAPPENING HERE? DO YOU THINK THEY HAVE MITIGATED AND TAKEN CARE OF THAT? SO THE CFA OBJECTIVE BEING TO PROTECT THE, THE FLOODWAY IN THE RIPARIAN AREA TRANSLATED INTO THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE REQUIREMENT TO KEEP ALL DEVELOPMENT EXCEPT FOR SOME, MAYBE SOME TRAILS OUTSIDE OF THE FLOODWAY. UM, SO THEY ARE MEETING THAT CODE REQUIREMENT. I THINK EVERYTHING ELSE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IS A BEHAVIOR THING AND, YOU KNOW, PART OF THE, THE CREEK WALK. UM, GOING BACK TO THAT QUESTION, UM, WE ARE NOT ANTICIPATING THAT SOMEONE WOULD GO OUT THERE AS SOON AS THIS IS BUILT AND BUILD A, BUILD A, YOU KNOW, WALK ALONG THEIR CORNER OF THE PROPERTY. WE HAVE ANTICIPATED ALL ALONG THAT THE CITY WOULD BE KIND OF PIECING TOGETHER A CREEK WALK. AND THAT IS A, THE MANAGEMENT OF THOSE AREAS IS A CONCERN TO EVERY PROPERTY OWNER ALONG THIS AREA. ALL OF THE CREEK IN THIS AREA IS PRIVATELY OWNED. AND SO WHAT WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT IN THE PAST IS THAT IF WE ARE ABLE TO PIECE TOGETHER A CREEK WALK AND, YOU KNOW, ACROSS IT WOULD BE, AGAIN, ACROSS MULTIPLE PROPERTIES, THERE WOULD BE RULES AND REGULATIONS FOR HOW THAT NEEDS TO BE USED, OR ELSE IT MIGHT NOT BE AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC ANYMORE IF IT'S BEING ABUSED. UM, BUT THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT IF WE, IF WE ARE ABLE TO PIECE TOGETHER A CREEK WALK, UM, IN THE COMING YEARS WITH THIS BEING PART OF IT, UM, ONE OF THE MAJOR CONCERNS, AGAIN, OF ALL THE PROPERTY OWNERS ALONG THERE IS THAT THERE'D BE SOME KIND OF, UM, USE REGULATIONS FOR THAT THAT DID NOT JUST BE WIDE OPEN TO, TO EVERYONE THAT, YOU KNOW, UM, SOME OF THE PROPERTY OWNERS HAVE TALKED ABOUT HAVING SOME KIND OF CONTROL. YOU HAVE TO CHECK IN AT ONE OF THE HOTELS OR, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE ENTRANCES TO THE CREEK WALK. SO, SO THERE'S A LOT OF DISCUSSION THAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN AROUND THAT, AND THAT'S NOT NECESSARILY THE RESPONSIBILITY OF ANY SINGLE PROJECT. IT WOULD BE THAT IF, AGAIN, IF WE'RE ABLE TO CREATE SOMETHING THAT WE FIGURE THAT OUT BEFORE WE WOULD OPEN IT TO THE PUBLIC. THANK YOU. COUNSELOR DUNN? YES, ANDY? OH, SORRY ANDY. I, UM, THANK YOU COUNSELOR. UM, I'M WONDERING IF YOUR, YOUR QUESTION MIGHT BE VERY SPECIFIC TOWARDS THE CREEK WALK BECAUSE PUBLIC WORKS HAS STARTED SOME KIND OF RELATIONSHIP BUILDING BETWEEN THE CITY AND, UM, THE ARMY CORPS AS WELL AS A DUQ. AND KURT MIGHT HAVE SOME INFORMATION ACTUALLY TO SHARE WITH, WITH YOU ON THAT, IF, IF YOU THINK THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL. IT'S NOT REALLY SPECIFIC TO THE CREEK WALK. OKAY. THAT'S WHAT I WONDER. UM, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S REALLY, IT'S REALLY PART, PART OF WHETHER OR NOT THE, UM, PROJECT OWNERS, MANAGERS, UM, HAVE HAD ANY THOUGHTS AROUND HOW THEY'RE GOING TO MANAGE HUMAN BEHAVIOR ON THEIR PROPERTY AS REGARDS TO THE CREEK. UM, BECAUSE YOU DO HAVE BALCONIES THAT OVERHANG THE CREEK AND SO FORTH AND SO ON. AND HOW, DO YOU HAVE ANY MANAGEMENT PLANS OR, UH, RULES OF ENGAGEMENT OR ANY OF THOSE SORT? HAVE YOU [04:05:01] THOUGHT THOSE THROUGH? YES, THEY WILL THAT MAKE SENSE? YES, IT DOES. THEY WILL BE INCORPORATED INTO RULES OF CONDUCT, SO TO SPEAK. AGAIN, WE ARE HERE TO BE INCREDIBLE NEIGHBORS, A VALUED CITIZEN OF SEDONA. AND THAT CREEK IS, IS MORE VALUABLE AS A RESOURCE TO US THAN, THAN ANY OTHER, IT, IT, IT, IT IS THE MOST SCENIC, UH, MORE NATURALLY, MOST NATURALLY BEAUTIFUL ELEMENT BESIDES THE RED ROCKS HERE IN SEDONA. UH, THAT, THAT WE HAVE IN OUR BACKYARD. SO WE, WE NEED, UH, TO MANAGE IT IN A VERY, VERY EFFECTIVE MANNER TO KEEP THE BEAUTY AND THE NATURAL STATE OF THE CREEK. OKAY. THANK YOU. ARE YOU ANTICIPATING THAT YOUR EVENTS WILL BE ALLOWED TO BE HELD IN THE OPEN SPACE? NO. OKAY. LET'S SEE IF I HAVE ANY MORE AROUND HERE. I'M JUST GONNA GO AHEAD AND SKIP THE REST TO YOU. THANK YOU, MAYOR. UM, MY FIRST QUESTION REFERS TO, UM, MR. BROOK QUOTED THE, UH, LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT AS SAYING THE, UH, RIPARIAN CORRIDOR IS OVERLAPS WITH OR IS CONSIDERED PART OF THE 500 YEAR FLOODPLAIN. UM, AND SOMEHOW IN THE LAST FOUR PLUS HOURS, I SEEM TO HAVE MISSED THAT. SO COULD THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT COME BACK UP AND SPEAK TO THAT FOR JUST A MOMENT, PLEASE? ABOUT HOW YOU DEFINE THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR IN TERMS OF THE MAP? UH, NO, WHAT I WAS TRYING TO SAY WAS THAT THE RIPARIAN PLANT PALETTE THAT WE'VE ESTABLISHED FOR THE PROJECT ACTUALLY EXTENDS BEYOND INTO THE, UH, HUNDRED YEAR FLOOD PLAIN. SO IT'S ACTUALLY COVERING A MUCH BIGGER AREA. UM, SO IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE DEFINITION OF WHAT THAT IS. OUR GOAL, IF I MAY, WAS, WAS TO CREATE A VERY UNIQUE LANDSCAPE SETTING THAT HAS THREE AREAS OF TYPES OF PLANTS, THOSE BEING CLOSEST TO THE CREEK. AGAIN, OUR MOST BEAUTIFUL NATURAL AMENITY WOULD BE RIPERIAN LIKE. AND THEN WE HAVE A ZONE THAT WE LABEL TRANSITIONAL THAT WOULD BE LIKE HILLSIDE, SEDONA. AND, AND, AND THEN WE HAVE A ZONE OF LANDSCAPING THAT IS ORCHARD LIKE. AND THAT WOULD BE TO PAY RESPECT AND HOMAGE TO THE HERITAGE OF THE SITE TO BRING BACK THE STORY AND THE HISTORY OF WHEN IT WAS ORCHARDS. IT'S, IT'S A DESIGN CONCEPT THAT WE'VE LAID OUT IN, IN THREE LAYERS OF LANDSCAPING TYPE IN, WHICH ALSO A LOCAL ARCHITECT MAX LECHER HELPED US OUT WITH AND HE'S, HE'S ONE OF THE CO-AUTHORS OF THE CFA AND NEIGHBOR TO THE SITE. OKAY. THANK YOU. BUT JUST TO CLARIFY, YOU'RE NOT STATING THAT THE RIP AREA AND CORRIDOR WOULD EXTEND AS FAR AS THE 500 YEAR FLOODPLAIN? UH, NO, NOT AT ALL. JUST THE PLANTING, UH, THE, THE PLANTS THAT ARE GOING TO GET PLANTED THERE. THAT WAS IT. OKAY. THANK YOU. ALL MY OTHER QUESTIONS HAVE BEEN ANSWERED ALREADY. I'M DONE. THANK YOU. WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I THINK COUNCIL WILLIAMSON HAD SOMETHING SHE WANTED TO ASK EARLIER AND I, AND I MAY HAVE MISSED IT, BUT THEN I I'M GONNA BRING IT BACK TO ME AFTERWARDS. NO, I THINK THAT IT WAS ABOUT THE PARKING AND I BELIEVE COUNCILOR DON ALLOWED ME TO ASK IT AT THE TIME. THANK YOU. OKAY, THANK YOU. SO, UM, LET ME GO BACK TO MYSELF. UH, YOU MENTIONED THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE DOING CARPOOLING WITH YOUR EMPLOYEES. SO WOULD THAT LEAD ME TO BELIEVE THAT YOUR EMPLOYEES ARE GOING TO BE HOUSED SOMEWHERE OFF PREMISES, POSSIBLY SOMEWHERE ELSE IN OUR CITY, UH, MAYBE IN COTTONWOOD OR CLARKDALE OR, AND YOU'RE GOING TO TAKE THEM ALL AT ONE TIME OR YOU'RE GONNA HAVE EMPLOYEES? BECAUSE EMPLOYEES RIGHT NOW FOR ALL THE HOTELS IS A BIG COMMODITY, VERY HARD TO COME BY. SO UNLESS YOU LIKE ONE MAJOR HOTEL IN OR OUTSIDE THE CITY LIMITS WHERE THEY ACTUALLY BRING THEM IN FROM OUTSIDE THE COUNTRY AND HOUSE THEM IN COTTONWOOD, HAVE YOU PREPARED SOME KIND OF A PLAN THAT YOU'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT? 'CAUSE OTHERWISE I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU'RE GOING TO DO CARPOOLING. SO IF YOU CAN EXPLAIN THAT TO ME, I'D APPRECIATE IT. CARPOOLING COMES, THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THEY ALL HAVE TO STAY IN THE SAME PLACE. WE ENCOURAGE CARPOOLING IN OUR HOTELS [04:10:01] AND WE GIVE INCENTIVES FOR THAT. AND SO ONE PERSON MAY, MAY DRIVE AND PICKS UP FOUR, THREE PEOPLE IN THEIR CAR, THEY COME TO THE HOTEL TOGETHER, THEY DON'T NECESSARILY LIVE TOGETHER. WE DON'T INTEND TO IMPORT PEOPLE FROM OUT OF THE COUNTRY AS WELL. RIGHT. WE, WE TRY TO PLAN OUT THE LOGISTICS OF THE COMMUTE FOR OUR EMPLOYEES AND THOSE THAT WANT TO FINANCIALLY BENEFIT AND GET A FINANCIAL INCENTIVE WOULD TAKE THE LEAD ON PICKING UP OTHERS ALONG THE ROUTES. SO IT'S THERE, IT'S A, IT'S AN INCREDIBLE PROGRAM BECAUSE OKAY. WELL DO YOU HAVE, YOU HAVE OTHER PROPERTIES OUTSIDE THE CITY OF SEDONA, IS THAT RIGHT? THAT'S RIGHT. OKAY. SO OF THOSE CI OTHER CITIES, ARE ANY OF THOSE PROJECTS OR FACILITIES EMPLOYEE CHALLENGED, LIKE SEDONA WHERE YOU HAVE A PROBLEM GETTING EMPLOYEES? WELL, HOSPITALITY INDUSTRY IS CHALLENGED IN GENERAL. OH, I UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT MORE SO IT'S LIKE STEROIDS IN SEDONA WHERE EVERYBODY'S STEALING FROM EACH OTHER UNLESS THEY INCORPORATE THEM FROM OUTSIDE THE, THE COUNTRY. SO I'M JUST WONDERING WHERE YOU'RE GOING TO GET YOUR EMPLOYEES AND THAT'S YOUR BUSINESS, BUT HOW ARE YOU GOING TO CARPOOL WHERE IF YOU HAVE INDIVIDUAL EMPLOYEE? WHAT'S THAT? I DIDN'T SAY ANYTHING. OH, I'M SORRY. SO I, I'M SORRY IT WAS ME. I SAID SOMETHING TO PETE. I'M SORRY. OKAY, THANK YOU. SO, UH, BECAUSE IT'S INTERESTING THAT YOU WANT A CARPOOL AND WE WOULD LOVE TO CARPOOL OUR CITY EMPLOYEES, BUT THEY'RE PARKED, THEY LIVE IN FLAGSTAFF, THEY LIVE IN CLARKDALE, THEY LIVE, I MEAN, THERE'S NO WAY THAT WE COULD REALLY DO IT EASILY. SO I'M JUST WONDERING HOW YOU WOULD BE DOING IT MORE SUCCESSFULLY THAN WE WOULD FINANCIALLY INCENTIVE. I I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE CARPOOLING PROGRAM IS FOR THE CITY OF ARIZONA OR FOR THE CITY OF SEDONA HERE. UM, WHETHER IT'S COMING, PEOPLE ARE COMING FROM FLAGSTAFF OR COTTONWOOD. UM, BUT A DRIVER IS FINANCIALLY INCENTIVE TO DRIVE EMPLOYEES IN THEIR CAR TO THE HOTEL. IT, IT IS A PROGRAM THAT WE HAVE ACTIVE. OKAY. ALRIGHT. I THINK I, I HAVE THAT ANSWERED MY LAST QUESTION IF THAT. I HAVE ONE PHONE. OKAY. VICE MAYOR AND THEN KATHY. SO I NOTICED IN YOUR PLAN THAT YOU WERE GONNA HAVE ROOMS FOR UP TO 10 EMPLOYEES OR ACCOMMODATIONS FOR UP TO 10 EMPLOYEES. 365 SQUARE FEET. YOU ARE GONNA FIT 10 PEOPLE IN THE SIZE OF A ROOM. THERE'S, THERE ARE FOUR APARTMENTS THAT ARE DESIGNED AT THE MOMENT AND WE'RE STAYING FLEXIBLE. UH, THE OCCUPANCY WILL BE BASED ON THE EMPLOYEE. IF IT'S AN A MARRIED EMPLOYEE, THEN HE AND HIS SPOUSE OR SHE AND HER, HER SPOUSE WILL OCCUPY ONE OF THE APARTMENTS, THUS ONLY TWO IN ONE. BUT WE COULD ACCOMMODATE BUNK BEDS TO SLEEP MORE IN OTHERS IF, IF EMPLOYEES DESIRE THAT TYPE OF ARRANGEMENT. IT IT'LL BE, UH, CUSTOMIZED TO THE EMPLOYEE NEED AND DESIRES. IT'S, IT'S SLEEPING UP TO, IN BETWEEN FOUR AND 10 IT'LL BE ARRANGED. OKAY. I JUST 10 PEOPLE IN A 365 SQUARE FOOT ROOM. I'M SORRY, ABOUT 10 ON AVERAGE EACH ARE THERE'S 10 OF 360, THERE'S FOUR OF THEM. THERE'S FOUR ROOMS. OKAY. CORRECT. SO THAT WOULD BE, SO 10 ACROSS THE FOUR 14 TOTAL. FOUR. YES. NOT IN ONE. YES. CORRECT. THANK YOU. THAT EXPLAINS IT FOR ME TOO. KATHY, THIS IS FOR OUR ATTORNEY, KURT. UM, I JUST WANTED TO DOUBLE CHECK ON SOMETHING THAT YOU SAID BEFORE. UM, DO WE NOT KNOW THE, DOES THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT HAVE THE RIGHT TO SHUT DOWN PRIVATE PROPERTY? IF THERE'S AN FOR THIS IS, GO BACK TO THE ENDANGERED SPECIES QUESTION. I JUST WANT CLARIFICATION ON WHAT YOU SAID BEFORE, PLEASE. SO THE CRITICAL, UM, HABITAT AREA, MY UNDERSTANDING, UM, ADVISED THE DEVELOPER TO, UH, THIS IS JUST FOR COUNCIL, NOT FOR THEM. UH, LOOK INTO IT FOR THEMSELVES, BUT THE CRITICAL HABITAT AREA DOESN'T PREVENT DEVELOPMENT IN THE AREA, BUT THEY STILL CAN'T HARM OR, OR TAKE, UM, WHICH IS A EUPHEMISM FOR KILL ANY ENDANGERED SPECIES OR THOSE ARE PROTECTED STILL ON PRIVATE PROPERTIES. OKAY. BUT IT JUST 'CAUSE IT'S IN A CRITICAL HABITAT AREA DOESN'T AUTOMATICALLY MEAN THERE'S NO, UM, CONSTRUCTION IN THAT AREA. THANK YOU FOR THE CLARIFICATION, MELISSA. SURE. I'M SORRY, KURT, I'M STILL A LITTLE CONFUSED. UM, IF CONSTRUCTION DESTROYS THE CRITICAL HABITAT [04:15:02] AND THEREFORE THE ANIMAL IS NOW EXTINCT, UM, HOW DOES THAT, HOW DOES THAT BALANCE, HOW DOES THAT, THAT IDE? SO, SO IT'S SPECIFIC TO, MY UNDERSTANDING IS IT'S SPECIFIC TO THE TAKING OR HARMING OF THE ANIMALS. SO YES, IF YOU'RE DESTROYING THE HABITAT, THEN IT COULD HARM THE ANIMAL. AND SO IT COULD BE, BUT THAT'D BE A QUESTION OF THE EXTENT OF THE DESTRUCTION OF THE HABITAT, THEN THE NUMBER OF ANIMALS IN THE AREA. UM, HOW, HOW MUCH THE DEVELOPMENT IS WITHIN THE CRITICAL HABITAT AREA. UH, ALL QUESTIONS. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO. UM, I HAVE A QUESTION. CAN JUST A MINUTE IF IT'S HELPFUL. I HAVE A PRINTOUT FROM THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT THAT STATES WHAT THEY CAN AND CAN'T DO UNDER SEVEN A. IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO READ IT, I CAN GET THAT TO YOU. IT'S TOO MUCH. NO, NO. WE'RE NOT GONNA BE READING THAT NOW. OKAY. WE WANNA GET OUT HERE BEFORE MIDNIGHT AS IT IS. BUT THANK YOU FOR OFFERING THAT. I APPRECIATE IT. OKAY. UH, YES, JESSICA. SO IF A DEVELOPER, IF, IF, IF THERE WAS FOUND TO BE AN ENDANGERED SPECIES, DOES THAT MEAN THAT THE PROPERTY OWNER COULD NEVER DEVELOP THE PROPERTY ? BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE AND I I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S, I FIND, I FIND THAT VERY DIFFICULT TO BELIEVE. SO I, YOU KNOW, I, WHERE THIS IS GOING IS WELL, SO MAYOR COUNSEL, I GUESS THE, THE GIST, THE, THE FINAL PART OF IS THIS IS NOT A REASON TO APPROVE OR DENY. THANK YOU. UH, THIS PROJECT DEVELOPMENT REVIEW, IT'S NOT A LISTED, WE COULD POTENTIALLY INCORPORATE THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT IN THE LOCAL LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, BUT WE HAVE NOT DONE SO. AND SO THAT'S NOT A REASON TO APPROVE OR DENY THIS PROJECT. THANK YOU. OKAY. ARE WE GOOD WITH QUESTIONS? OH, I'M MORE THAN GOOD WITH QUESTIONS. I FIGURED. OKAY. UH, COMMENTS. UM, WHICH WAY DO YOU WANNA START THIS WAY? PETE, YOU DON'T WANT TO START? I'LL START. OKAY. THANK YOU. OH, JESSICA WAS ABOUT TO START. OH, JESSICA WILL START. HOW YOU I WILL START YIELD MY TIME TO MY ESTEEMED COLLEAGUE. OKAY. YOU KNOW, ON AN APPEAL OF THIS NATURE, UH, I THINK IT'S A REALLY HIGH BAR MM-HMM. THAT IS NEEDED TO OVERTURN A, A BIG, BIG BURDEN OF, OF FACT ON AN APPEAL TO OVERTURN STAFF AND P AND Z. AND I THINK THAT AS MUCH AS IT IS PAINFUL, BECAUSE SO MANY OF THE ISSUES THAT WERE DISCUSSED TONIGHT ARE IMPORTANT AND ARE MEANINGFUL ISSUES, THEY DON'T FALL WITHIN THE PURVIEW OF AN APPEAL. UM, AND I, IN MY VIEW, THE BURDEN HAS NOT BEEN MET BY THE APPELLATES TO, TO OVERTURN THE DECISIONS OF THE TWO OF THE OF, OF P AND Z AND THE RECOMMENDATION OF STAFF I FOUND IN RESPONSE TO THE QUESTIONS THAT WERE ASKED, VERY PROBING AND VERY, VERY CHALLENGING QUESTIONS, I FOUND THE RESPONSES OF STAFF AND OF THE DEVELOPER TO BE TOTALLY ACCEPTABLE. UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S A PROCESS. IT ISN'T STARTING FROM SCRATCH. IT'S NOT, OH GEE, I WISH WE'D HAVE THOUGHT OF THIS, THAT, AND THE OTHER THING, AND THEREFORE I, I CAN'T APPROVE IT. UM, IT'S VERY CLEARLY LAID OUT WHAT WE CAN LOOK AT. AND WHILE WE MIGHT WANNA LOOK AT ENDANGERED SPECIES, I DON'T WANNA KILL BIRDS. UM, IT'S REALLY NOT SOMETHING THAT'S PART OF OUR REMIT AT THIS POINT. UM, I UNDERSTAND THAT THE PROPOSAL THAT WE HAVE IN FRONT OF US WAS SUPPORTED BY A NUMBER OF, UH, RESIDENTS IN THE AREA. I UNDERSTAND A NUMBER OF RESIDENTS DON'T SUPPORT IT, BUT IT HAS SOME SUPPORT. AND I KNOW THAT RESIDENTS WERE VERY INVOLVED IN DEVELOPING THE CFA TO BEGIN WITH AND WORK VERY CLOSELY WITH STAFF. I UNDERSTAND. UM, I WAS VERY, I WAS VERY STRUCK BY THE SIDE BY SIDE COMPARISON UP THERE THAT SHOWED FROM THE CFA, THE BUILDINGS WERE OF THE SIZE THAT ARE BEING PROPOSED HERE, AND THEY IN FACT TOOK OVER MORE OF THE SITE. I UNDERSTAND THAT THE DEVELOPERS IN RESPONSE TO CONCERNS FROM THE RESIDENTS MOVED STUFF DOWN SO THAT THERE'S EVEN MORE OPEN SPACE UP THERE. YOU KNOW, I, THE CFA WAS DEVELOPED ONE OF THE, ONE OF THE CENTRAL IDEAS OF SUSTAINABLE [04:20:01] CON CONSTRUCTION AND DEVELOPMENT IS THAT YOU YEAH. IS THAT YOU MOVE THE HOUSES TOGETHER AND YOU LEAVE MORE OPEN SPACE. THAT'S KIND OF, AND SORT OF, AND WHEN PEOPLE OPPOSE THE DEVELOPMENT, THEY SAY, WELL, BUT IT'S SO DENSE. WELL, DENSITY IS A WAY OF PRESERVING MORE OPEN SPACE. AND I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE MOVING FACTORS BEHIND THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE CFA. AND I THINK IT WORKS, UM, YOU KNOW, FOR BETTER OR FOR WORSE, THE CFA ALLOWS A HOTEL SAYING THAT WE SHOULDN'T ALLOW A HOTEL. IT, SO IT DOES, IT'S TOO LATE FOR THAT, THAT TRAIN HAS LEFT THE STATION. UM, AND I DON'T THINK THIS IS A BIG HOTEL. I THINK IT'S CERTAINLY NO BIGGER THAN WHAT THE CFA, UM, SEEMED TO ANTICIPATE WHEN IT HAD ITS, ITS LAYOUT ON, ON THE, IN THE, IN THE DOCUMENT ITSELF. UM, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THE DEVELOPER MET EVERY SINGLE CONDITION, EVERY LEGAL REQUIREMENT THAT WE PUT IN FRONT OF THEM. UM, IT'S IN TOTAL COMPLIANCE, WE LAY OUT A SERIES OF REQUIREMENTS THAT DEVELOPERS MEET. AND THEN WHEN WE MEET THEM, THEY SAY, OH, WELL, WE DON'T REALLY THINK YOU MET THEM. UM, IT'S A, IT'S A HARD POSITION. I BELIEVE DEVELOPERS HAVE A RIGHT TO EXPECT THAT WHEN THEY MEET REQUIREMENTS, THEY HAVE TO KNOW BEFOREHAND WHAT THEY'RE EXPECTED TO MEET AND TO CHANGE THOSE EXPECTATIONS AT THE END, BECAUSE WE'RE, THE COUNCIL JUST DOESN'T SEEM TO ME TO BE THE RIGHT WAY TO PROCEED. IF WE WANNA MAKE THE REQUIREMENTS DIFFERENT, WE SHOULD MAKE 'EM DIFFERENT. WE SHOULD MAKE THAT OUR HIGHEST PRIORITY FOR NEXT YEAR AND INCLUDE EVERYTHING THAT WE WANNA INCLUDE THAT WE THINK WASN'T INCLUDED HERE. BUT I DON'T THINK THIS IS THE TIME OR THE PLACE TO DO THAT. MY, MY TAKEAWAY FROM THE PRESENTATION TONIGHT FROM ALL THREE PARTIES IS THAT THE PROJECT PRESERVES THE LOCAL HERITAGE. IT KEEPS IN PLACE, UH, WELLS AND PUMP HOUSES AND STUFF LIKE THAT. IT, UH, IT USES LOCAL MATERIALS THAT REFLECT THE MATERIALS USED AROUND THERE. I LOOKED AT THE HOUSES THAT ARE SURROUNDING THERE, AND THEY'RE TWO STORIES. THEY'RE BRICK, I MEAN, AND THEIR LANDSCAPE. THEY'VE, THEY'VE TAKEN AWAY THE RIPARIAN, UM, HABITAT THAT, THAT WAS THERE BEFORE THEY MOVED THERE. UM, SO I THINK THAT THE PROJECT HAS REALLY DOES REFLECT THE AREA, I THINK, THAT THEY USE THE TOPOGRAPHY TO, TO REDUCE THE IMPACT OF THE TWO STORIES, WHICH I BELIEVE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DOING ON SOME OF OUR PROJECTS. UM, THE SCALE AS I SAW UP THERE, WAS THE SAME AS ENVISIONED BY THE CFA. I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY, ANY, UM, CONFLICT AT ALL BETWEEN WHAT THE CFA ENVISIONED. I MEAN, LOOKING AT THE FIVE PICTURES OF THE CABINS AND SAYING THAT'S ALL THAT COULD BE THERE. I DON'T BELIEVE WHEN I LOOKED AT THAT MAP UP THERE OF THE, OF THE LAYOUT IN THE CFA, THAT THAT'S WHAT THE CFA ENVISIONED. UM, AND AS I SAID, THE DEVELOPER OPERATES HOTELS. I DON'T, I THINK I, I HONESTLY BELIEVE THEY WANT A SUCCESSFUL HOTEL. I DON'T BELIEVE THAT THEY HAVE COMING HERE JUST TO, TO DESTROY THE LIVES OF EVERYBODY IN BEAR WALLOW. I KNOW THAT PEOPLE, WE DON'T WANT ANYTHING BUILT NEXT TO US, BUT THIS WAS A BLUEPRINT FOR WHAT COULD BE BUILT NEXT TO YOU. AND I THINK THAT THE DEVELOPER HAS MET THAT CHALLENGE. OUR STAFF AGREES. AND I THINK THAT I WOULD, I, I AM PERSUADED THAT TO SUPPORT P THE PNZ AND THE STAFF ON THIS POINT, I DON'T THINK THAT THE, THAT THE HIGH BAR THAT I HAVE SET FOR OVERTURNING THOSE DECISIONS HAS BEEN MET. THANK YOU. I WENT FIRST . THANK YOU, MAYOR. SO, UH, FIRST I'D LIKE TO THANK EVERYONE HERE TONIGHT, THE APPLICANT, THE APPELLANTS, THE MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC. I, I THOUGHT WE ACTUALLY HAD A VERY DETAILED AND INFORMATIVE CONVERSATION. UM, AND I'M IMPRESSED BY EVERYONE. I, I GET REALLY IMPRESSED WHEN MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC, THE APPELLANTS DO THEIR WORK [04:25:01] AND, AND PRESENT RATIONAL ARGUMENTS. AND, AND, YOU KNOW, IT, IT WAS VERY INFORMATIVE. SO THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE TONIGHT. AND EVERYONE THAT EMAILED IN AND RIGHT, AND, AND STAFF FOR DOING ALL THE WORK AND THE APPLICANT FOR GOING THROUGH A VERY DETAILED PROCESS, THERE'S NO DOUBT ABOUT THAT. SO I THINK SORT OF THE DIS DISSATISFACTION, YOU KNOW, IN OUR COMMUNITY THAT IT WAS EXPRESSED HERE TONIGHT AND THROUGH ALL THE EMAILS, WAS REALLY PUT INTO MOTION KIND OF BACK IN 2016 WHEN THE CFA AND THE WENT TO, UH, PNZ AND THE COUNCIL, AND THEN 2018 WHEN THE LDC WAS UPDATED. AND, UH, LOTS OF WORDS IN THE CFA AND AND, AND THE LDC. AND OF COURSE, EVERYONE HAS THEIR OWN INTERPRETATION OF WORDS. WE ALL DO. WE READ AND WE INTERPRET THINGS. AND BEAUTY IS IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER. AND IT DOES SEEM FOR ME THAT THE REAL STICKING POINT AMONGST MOST EVERYBODY IS THE BUILDING SCALE. AND IT HAD BEEN FOR ME TOO, I BELIEVE I WAS ON PNZ WHEN YOU FIRST CAME TO IN YOUR DEVELOPMENT REVIEWS. AND I THINK THAT I ALSO CALLED OUT THE PICTURES IN THE, IN THE CFA AND WAS ASKING YOU HOW YOU SCALED THOSE TWO THINGS TOGETHER. AND, AND I, AND I THINK MANY PEOPLE HAVE THAT EXACT QUESTION. UM, AND THEN NOT ONLY WAS I ON THE PZ P AND Z FOR YOUR PROJECT, I THINK I WAS THERE WHEN WE ADOPTED THE LDC CHANGES WHEN WE DID THAT AS WELL. AND SO I'M STRUCK REALLY BY THAT DIAGRAM THAT WE SHOWED. SO THERE'S PICTURES IN THE LD IN THE CFA THAT WE ALL POINT TO, BUT THAT DIAGRAM IN THE LDC AND THE CFA ALSO SHOWS THAT BUILDING SIZES OF THAT WERE CONTEMPLATED. AND THEN FURTHER, LDC TWO 20 B, THE OAK CREEK LOT AND BUILDING STANDARDS ACTUALLY CALLS OUT SOME SPECIFICATIONS THAT ARE UNIQUE TO THE ZONING CODES. AND THAT TO ME IS STAFF AND THE COUNCILS WHO APPROVE THAT. AND THOSE ON THE P AND Z THAT REVIEWED IT AS WELL. YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE EXPRESSION OF THOSE WORDS. THAT'S THE FINAL EXPRESSION. THOSE WERE DETAILED THINGS THAT WE'VE PUT IN THE LDC THAT DEVELOPERS NEED TO ADHERE TO. AND IN THIS CASE, THEY ARE. SO, I, I REALLY BELIEVE THAT MUCH OF THE CONVERSATION WE HAD HERE TONIGHT, I THINK COUNCILOR WILLIAMS JUST EXPRESSED THAT TOO, ARE CHALLENGES TO US. GREAT SUGGESTIONS FOR REVIEW, YOU KNOW, UPDATING THE CFA AND THE L-D-A-L-D-C SECTIONS IN THE FUTURE. THINGS THAT WE, WE DIDN'T REALLY TALK ABOUT THIS TONIGHT, BUT IT'S BEEN TALKED ABOUT IN THE CONCEPT OF THIS PROJECT, IS HOW WE TREAT THE DEVELOPABLE AREA OF A PROJECT. AND GIVEN THAT WE KNOW NOTHING'S GONNA BE BUILT IN THE FLOODWAY, WHY DO WE ALLOW DEVELOPERS TO TAKE CREDIT FOR DENSITY CALCULATIONS? IT INCLUDE THAT AREA. PERHAPS THAT'S A CHANGE IN THE LDC THAT WE MAKE IN THE FUTURE. AND THE BUILDING SQUARE FOOT EXPRESSED IN TWO 20 B, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THAT'S NOT RIGHT. MAYBE WE DIDN'T GET IT RIGHT. AND IT'S UP TO US TO CHANGE THAT AS WELL. DEVELOPMENT REVIEW CRITERIA, THE REAL DIFFERENCES BETWEEN ZONE CHANGES IN THE PROCESS THAT WE HAVE TO GO THROUGH AND THINK ABOUT VERSUS DEVELOPMENT REVIEWS. WE USE THE SAME SET OF CRITERIA FOR THOSE BOTH. AND MAYBE THAT'S NOT THE WISEST THING FOR US TO DO. AND ANOTHER THING WE COULD CHANGE IN THE FUTURE, THINGS LIKE PROTECTING WILDLIFE QUARTERS. I DON'T KNOW THAT THE LDC SAYS ANYTHING IN THERE YET. OR MAYBE WE NEED TO PUT SOMETHING MORE SPECIFIC ABOUT WILDLIFE QUARTERS AND MANAGING NOISE IN THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT. RIGHT? THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT WE GET TO THINK ABOUT AND COME JANUARY WHEN WE DO OUR PRIORITY SESSION, YOU KNOW, WE GET TO TALK ABOUT THAT AND CHALLENGE OUR STAFF OR DECIDE WHAT WE WANT TO USE AS A PRIORITY MOVING FORWARD. SO IT WAS A, I I, I TOO THINK I HAVE A, A HIGH STANDARD OF SORT OF OVERTURNING A, A STAFF DECISION, UH, AND THE P AND Z RECOMMENDATION. UH, AND I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT BURDEN WAS MET TONIGHT TO OVERTURN THAT. SO THAT'S MY COMMENTS. MARY. THANK YOU. EACH OF MY COLLEAGUES MADE SEVERAL POINTS THAT I AGREE WITH, SO I THANK THEM. YOU SHOULD THANK THEM FOR SHORTENING WHAT I HAVE TO SAY. UM, BUT I DO, I DO THINK IT'S WORTH SAYING AGAIN, THAT I REALLY DO APPRECIATE THE APPLICANT FOR HAVING, WE HEARD THIS IN THE PUBLIC TESTIMONY THAT WAS GIVEN FOR HAVING WORKED WITH THE COMMUNITY AND TAKEN, UH, SUGGESTIONS IN. AND I REALLY WANNA THANK THE APPELLANTS [04:30:01] BECAUSE THIS IS VOLUNTEER TIME THAT YOU PUT TOGETHER TO TRY TO HELP YOUR COMMUNITY, YOUR GREATER COMMUNITY. SO TO EACH OF THOSE APPELLANT PARTIES, I THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME, YOUR EFFORT, YOUR ATTENTION TO DETAIL, AND HOW WELL PRESENTED YOUR INFORMATION WAS. SO THANK YOU FOR THAT. IT IS DIFFICULT, UM, UP HERE BECAUSE THE INCLINATION HUMAN NATURE IS TO WANNA REVISIT THE WHOLE APPLICATION, RIGHT? SOME OF OUR QUESTIONS, I MEAN, EVEN MY OWN WENT DOWN THAT PATH IN THAT RABBIT HOLE, BUT IT IS AN APPEAL. UM, AND AGAIN, I AGREE WITH WHAT WAS SAID THAT THERE'S A HIGH BAR BECAUSE FOR AN APPEAL, THE APPROVAL ALREADY EXISTS. THE BURDEN IS TO SHOW WHERE THE PROCESS WAS FLAWED. WAS IT FLAWED AT THE, UH, STAFF REVIEW LEVEL? WAS IT FLAWED AT INFORMATION THAT WAS INTERPRETED INCORRECTLY BY LEGAL COUNSEL? WAS IT FLAWED IN THE APPLICATION OF PRINCIPLES BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION? IT'S A HIGH BAR BECAUSE IN THIS ONE, WE HAVE, FIRST OF ALL, WE HAVE A CFA CHECKLIST IN ADDITION TO THE LDC CHECKLIST THAT DID SHOW AGREE OR NOT THAT THE PROCESS WORKED. THE REVIEWS WERE DONE, THE PROCESS WORKED. LODGING MEDIUM DENSITY, THAT'S A QUOTE IS ALLOWED IN THE OC ZONE. THE ACCESSORY USES SPECIFICALLY INCLUDE RESTAURANT SPA MEETING SPACE. UM, THE APPLICATION COMPLIED WITH THE LDC, AGAIN, WITH THE CHECKLIST REVIEWS THAT WERE IN THERE AND THE INFORMATION THAT WAS PROVIDED, AND THE DOUBLE CHECKING, IF YOU WANNA LOOK AT IT THAT WAY, SORT OF THE, THE REVIEW THAT WAS DONE TONIGHT TO GO OVER THOSE THINGS TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY WERE DONE. AGAIN, I DON'T THINK THAT IT, THE APPEAL, THE TWO APPEALS MEET THE THRESHOLD FOR OVERTURNING. AGAIN, I, THERE ARE THINGS ABOUT THE APPLICATION THAT I, LIKE, THERE ARE THINGS ABOUT THE APPLICATION THAT I DON'T LIKE. THERE ARE THINGS THAT THE COMMUNITY DOESN'T LIKE, LIKE, OR NOT LIKE. AGAIN, AN APPEAL PROCESS IS, IS WAS IT MET? I THINK IT, I THINK IT'S NOT. UM, THAT'S PRETTY MUCH MY POINT. THANK YOU. OKAY. THANK YOU, BRIAN. THANK YOU, MAYOR. OKAY. SO THANKS TO EVERYBODY THAT'S, UH, HANGING AROUND STILL AT NINE 30 THIS EVENING. THANK YOU FOR THE PRESENTATIONS FROM APPLICANT'S APPELLANTS, THE STAFF TIME THAT'S GONE INTO IT. SO AGAIN, ECHOING MY COLLEAGUES APPRECIATION FOR THAT. UM, YOU KNOW, REGARDING ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES SAID, OH, WE CAN'T BE CHANGING EXPECTATIONS. NOW, I DON'T SEE THAT MY INTERPRETING WHAT I READ IN THE CFA BEING DIFFERENT THAN HOW YOU READ IT, BEING A CASE OF CHANGING EXPECTATIONS. NOR DO I SEE THAT BEING A FLAW IN A PROCESS TO ALSO REFER TO ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES. SO WHEN I LOOK AT WHAT THE CFA TALKS ABOUT OF, UM, PRESERVING LARGE LAND AREAS AND GENERATING LESS TRAFFIC THAN MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL, I FIND THAT THE, ONE OF THE APPELLANTS, UH, VERY STRONGLY, UH, DEMONSTRATED THAT THE PROJECT, UH, SIGNIFICANTLY EXCEEDS WHAT THE TRAFFIC SHOULD BE. UH, FROM THAT PROJECT, THEIR ESTIMATE WAS FOUR AND A HALF TIMES, EVEN IF YOU GO WITH THE APPLICANT'S, UH, ESTIMATE OF THEIR PEAK, UH, IT'S STILL TWO X WHAT MEDIUM DOES IT MEDIUM DENSITY RESIDENTIAL, UH, TRAFFIC WOULD BE. AND AS, AS SOME OF US HAVE TALKED ABOUT, TRAFFIC IS ONE OF THE TOP, UH, ISSUES THAT WE FACE. NOT JUST TRAFFIC, TRAFFIC, TRAFFIC, RIGHT? , UM, ANYHOW. UM, SO THAT, THAT'S ONE ITEM THAT I THINK UNEQUIVOCALLY ABSOLUTELY CONCERNS ME, UH, ABOUT THE APPLICATION. UM, THE, THE LANGUAGE IS SO INTERESTING IN THIS CFA, IF NOT MADDENING AT TIMES, UM, TALKING ABOUT SMALL DESIGNER HOTELS BEING, UH, APPROVED PER SE. AND, UH, I SPENT SOME TIME GOOGLING SMALL DESIGNER HOTELS, AND TO NO SURPRISE, THERE IS NO DEFINITION OF A SMALL DESIGNER HOTEL. SO, YOU KNOW, WHAT DO YOU DO WITH THAT? AND WHEN I LOOK AT SEDONA, WHEN I LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, THE INTENTION TO, UM, DIVERSIFY WHAT LODGING MIGHT LOOK LIKE, WELL, SMALL DESIGNER HOTELS OR BOUTIQUE HOTELS, I THINK WE'VE [04:35:01] GOT TWO EXAMPLES THAT COME TO MIND QUICKLY. WE'VE GOT EL PORTAL, THAT'S 12 UNITS. WE HAVE AMBIENTE A A MORE RECENT ADDITION TO THE HOTEL PORTFOLIO IN TOWN WITH 40 UNITS. SO I DON'T SEE WHERE A 70 UNIT HOTEL FEELS VERY SMALL OR DESIGNER AT THAT POINT. UM, ANOTHER AREA THAT I FIND VERY CONCERNING IS THE PROTECTION OF THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. AND WE CAN CERTAINLY ARGUE ABOUT HOW FAR THAT EXTENDS FROM THE CREEK, BUT CERTAINLY I THINK WITHIN THE A HUNDRED YEAR FLOODPLAIN IS REASONABLE, UH, TO ASSUME. AND THAT MEANS THAT THERE IS, IF, UH, APPLICANT WOULDN'T MIND PUTTING UP PAGE 20 OF THEIR PRESENTATION, UM, BECAUSE I'M GONNA GET TO THAT IN A MINUTE. UM, A NUMBER OF THE, UH, STRUCTURES ARE IN THE A HUNDRED YEAR FLOODPLAIN. AND IT'S NOT ABOUT WHETHER YOU CAN GET INSURANCE FOR THAT. IT'S THAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO ONLY, ONLY MINOR IMPROVEMENTS WITHIN THE RIPARIAN CORRIDOR. MINOR IMPROVEMENTS DON'T STRIKE ME AS 600 SQUARE FEET AND LARGER STRUCTURES, SO I DON'T FEEL LIKE THAT'S BEEN MET. UM, PRESERVE OPEN SPACE, HILLSIDES AND FLOODPLAINS ELSEWHERE, IT'S REFERRED TO AS, UH, NATURAL HILLSIDES AND OPEN FIELDS. THERE ARE OPEN FIELDS THERE. NOW, I DON'T SEE OPEN FIELDS IN THE PROPOSED SITE PLAN. UH, AGAIN, PAGE 20 IN YOUR PRESENTATION, I BELIEVE IS WHAT I, NO, SORRY. 28. APOLOGIES. THANK YOU. SO WHEN I LOOK AT THAT SITE PLAN, I SEE EVERY INCH OF THAT PROPERTY BEING SCRAPED CLEAN IN ORDER TO PUT 28 OR SO STRUCTURES ON THAT PROPERTY. AND I DON'T SEE HOW THAT'S CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVING, UH, OPEN SPACE AND PROTECTING THE SOILS THAT ARE THERE, ET CETERA. LIKE, I, I JUST FUNDAMENTALLY, I JUST DON'T SEE IT. I THINK I'VE PROBABLY COVERED EVERYTHING THAT, UH, I NEED TO AT THIS POINT, BUT I DO FIND THAT APPLICANT OR APPELLANT, SORRY, HAS, UH, EXCEEDED MY BAR FOR OVERTURNING THE P AND C DECISION. THANK YOU, MAYOR. THANK YOU. COUNSELOR DUNN. I THINK FOR ME, THERE ARE GOOD POINTS THAT HAVE BEEN STATED ON BOTH SIDES OF THE CASE. UM, I WOULD ADD ON, ON MY SIDE, ONE OF THE 12 LDC SECTIONS IS MINIMIZES ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS. AND IT SAYS, EXAMPLES, NATURAL ENVIRONMENT INCLUDING WATER, AIR, NOISE, STORM WATER MANAGEMENT, WILDLIFE, HABITAT, SOILS, AND NATIVE VEGETATION. UM, AND IT'S, YOUR DEVELOPMENT IS DESIGNED TO MINIMIZE THE NEGATIVE IMPACTS ON THESE ELEMENTS IN THE ENVIRONMENT. UM, IT'S HARD TO KNOW THEORETICALLY WHAT WILL AND WILL NOT BE, BUT I DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE THAT THE WILDLIFE HABITAT IS BEING PROTECTED. I DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE THAT NATIVE VEGETATION IS NECESSARILY BEING WELL PROTECTED AND NOT PROTECTING THAT NATIVE VEGETATION CAN IMPACT THE HEALTH OF OAK CREEK, NOT ONLY WHERE YOU ARE, BUT DOWNSTREAM AS WELL. IF WE CHANGE THE BIOME BY, FOR INSTANCE, THE WATER GETTING WARMER OR VEGETATION IS GONE, AND NOW THE WATER CAN, CAN FLOW FASTER, UM, THAT JUST INCREASES THE RISK OF FLOODING. UM, SO THOSE, THOSE THINGS FEEL TO ME AS IF THEY HAVE NOT BEEN MET. UM, WE'VE TALKED A LOT ABOUT TRAFFIC. WE'VE TALKED A LOT ABOUT PARKING. UM, FOR ME, A CONCERN AROUND THE VALET SYSTEM IS THAT SHOULD WE HAVE A NATURAL DISASTER? SHOULD THERE BE A FIRE? SHOULD THERE BE A FLOOD? UM, PEOPLE TEND TO PANIC AND NOT ACT IN AN ORDERLY FASHION. THEY DO NOT ACT LIKE THEY ACTED WHEN THEY DID FIRE DRILLS IN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL. UM, AND NOW WE HAVE A VALET SYSTEM WHERE PEOPLE WANT TO GET TO THEIR CARS, THEY'RE NOT ABLE TO GET TO THEIR CARS, THEY DON'T HAVE [04:40:01] THEIR KEYS. UM, AND, AND JUST PANIC ENSUES AND ARE ROUNDABOUT, WHICH IS ALREADY OVERBURDENED BECOMES MORE OVERBURDENED, OVERBURDENED. SO I'M, I'M NOT SURE WHETHER OR NOT THIS HAS AN ADEQUATE ACCESS FOR AN EMERGENCY, UM, GOD FORBID, WHEN ACTUALLY WERE TO HAPPEN. UH, BUT YOU ARE RIGHT THERE NEXT TO THE FOREST AND, UM, FIRE IS, IS A HAZARD. SO I, I WORRY ABOUT ABOUT THAT AS WELL. UM, SO I'M JUST GONNA LEAVE IT THERE. THANK YOU, VICE MAYOR. SO I TOO AM CONCERNED ABOUT THE SAFETY OF OUR RESIDENTS AND ONE OF THE CRITERIA IS ABOUT JAY IS PROVIDE ADEQUATE ROAD SYSTEMS AND TRAFFIC MITIGATION, AND I JUST DON'T FEEL LIKE THAT'S BEEN MET. IT SAYS ADEQUATE ROAD CAPACITY MUST EXIST TO SERVE THE USES PERMITTED UNDER THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT. AND THE PROPOSED USES SHALL BE DESIGNED TO ENSURE SAFE INGRESS AND EGRESS ONTO THE SITE AND SAFE ROAD CONDITIONS AROUND THE SITE, INCLUDING ADEQUATE ACCESS ONTO THE SITE FOR FIRE PUBLIC SAFETY AND EMS SERVICES. AND I JUST DON'T THINK THERE THAT YOU'VE MET THAT CRITERIA. UH, I DON'T THINK THERE'S ADEQUATE ACCESS FOR AN EMERGENCY. UH, AND I AGREE WITH MY COLLEAGUE TO MY RIGHT THAT PEOPLE DON'T BEHAVE IN A WAY THAT MAKES IT EASY. BUT THEN THERE, ALL THIS TRAFFIC IS GONNA BE GOING ON TO THE SECOND MOST CONGESTED AREA IN OUR CITY, WHICH IS ALREADY ON ANY DAY WITHOUT AN EMERGENCY, A HORROR SHOW. I MEAN, IT'S TRULY A HORROR SHOW THERE. BACKUPS COULD BE, YOU KNOW, FOR 10 OR 15 MILES, IT TAKES AN HOUR SOMETIMES TO JUST GO FIVE TO 10 MILES OR LESS FIVE MILES AN HOUR. THAT'S ON A GOOD DAY WITH NOTHING HAPPENING. SO, UH, I JUST, I I WAS NOT ON COUNSEL WHEN THIS WAS VOTED ON. I WON'T SAY SO. IT'S NOT WHERE YOUR ATTORNEY NICK SAID WE SHOULD HAVE DONE THAT THEN. WELL, I WASN'T HERE THEN. AND I SEE CRITERIA HERE THAT WE ARE PERMITTED TO LOOK AT IN THIS, UH, APPEAL AND THE SECOND AREA ON MINIMIZING ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS. I I ALSO AGREE WITH MY COLLEAGUES THAT I JUST DON'T FEEL LIKE THIS WILDLIFE, THIS IS OUR COMMUNITY. THIS IS OUR RIPARIAN AREA THAT IS UNTOUCHED, IS BEAUTIFUL, AND WE'RE TRYING TO DO THINGS THERE BUILDING RIGHT NEXT TO THE FLOODPLAIN. I I'M JUST NOT COMFORTABLE THAT, THAT, THAT THESE SPECIES WILL SURVIVE OR THAT OUR WILDLIFE WILL BE PROTECTED. SO I JUST CAN'T SUPPORT THIS. OKAY. SO, UM, I AGREE WITH MY COLLEAGUES ON THIS SIDE. I, I AGREE AND I APPRECIATE COUNCILOR FOLTZ FOR SAYING THAT THE LAND DOES LOOK LIKE IT WOULD BE SCRAPED DOWN AND REBUILDING. I'M SURE YOU'RE SAVING SOME TREES IN THE MIDDLE, BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT ME, WHAT HAS ME NOT BEING, UH, THRILLED WITH THIS PROJECT. I'M GONNA GO BACK TO WHAT I SAID TO YOU IN THE VERY BEGINNING WITH MY QUESTIONS. THE CFA CORE COMMENT, THIS IS LOCATED IN THE HEART OF SEDONA, A PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY AREA FOCUSED ON OAK CREEK AND SEDONA HERITAGE FUTURE DEVELOPMENT AND REDEVELOPMENT OF A IS A MIXED USES OF PRESERVE THE OAK CREEK RIPARIAN CORRIDOR WITH NATURAL HILLSIDES, OPEN FIELDS, AND A VARIETY OF MODESTLY SCALED BUILDINGS THAT HAD ME FROM THE BEGINNING, THUS SUSTAIN THE DISTINCT, DISTINCT HISTORIC CONTENT OF THE CHARACTER. AND AFTER LOOKING AT THOSE LARGE UNITS, AND I LOOK AT, I PASS THE ANTE HOTEL ALMOST THREE TIMES A DAY, AND I LOOK, THEY HAVE MORE UNITS THERE AND THEY HAVE, THEY ARE HIGH END. I'VE BEEN IN THEM. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN REALLY GET MORE HIGH END THAN THAT COMPLEX. AND YET THEY, IT'S FABULOUS. [04:45:01] AND THEY ARE MODEST AND SCALED, NOT TAKING, OH, WE CAN'T, WE CAN, THE MAXIMUM FOOTPRINT IS 5,000. WELL, YEAH, YOU'RE EXCEEDING IT 'CAUSE YOU'RE GOING UP. THAT'S NOT A CABIN AND THAT'S NOT MODEST IN MY POINT OF VIEW. AND GO, GIMME A DEF DEFINITION OF WHAT IS MODEST, RIGHT? IT'S SUBJECTIVE. I DON'T THINK THAT IT, IT MEETS THE BASIC FORM OF THE COMMUNITY PLAN IN ADDITION TO ALL THE OTHER THINGS. AND I DIDN'T THINK ABOUT THE EVACUATION PLAN AND THE TRAFFIC. WE ALL TALK ABOUT TRAFFIC. THIS IS ANOTHER VERSION OF TRAFFIC WE HAVE JUST GOTTEN DONE. NOT COMPLETING OUR EMERGENCY EVACUATION, BUT ESTABLISHING AN EMERGENCY EVACUATION PLAN UNLIKE ANYTHING ELSE IN THE STATE. AND YET YOU WANNA BUILD RIGHT NEXT TO THE WORST TRAFFIC CIRCLE. NOW YOU CAN DO THAT, I GUESS BECAUSE WE, SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINE IT WOULD SAID WE CAN'T DEAL WITH OR TOUCH TRAFFIC. BUT I THINK WHEN IT COMES TO AN EMERGENCY EVACUATION AND EVERYTHING ELSE THAT'S GOING ON, BUT THAT'S NOT MY CORE REASON OF NOT SUPPORTING IT. THE MODESTY MODESTLY SCALED BUILDINGS. AND YOU LOST ME THERE. SO I WILL NOT BE SUPPORTING THIS PROJECT EITHER. I, AND I DON'T THINK I'VE EVER TURNED AROUND AND GONE AGAINST P AND Z EVER. AND I'M HERE LONGER THAN, WELL, JESSICA'S HERE LONGER THAN I AM, BUT I'VE NEVER GONE AGAINST P AND Z EVER. I DON'T THINK SO ANYWAY. BUT ANYWAY, DID I, NO, I DON'T THINK YOU CROSSED. I DON'T THINK I HAVE. SO THIS IS NOT EASY FOR ME TO DO. IT DOES, YOU KNOW, IT BOTHERS ME TO HAVE TO DO IT, BUT I THINK THAT MAYBE THAT WAS MISSED. I DON'T THINK SO, BUT OBVIOUSLY IT WASN'T PICKED UP ON, SO THAT'S MY VOTE. UM, OR THAT'S MY OPINION. WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A VOTE. SO, UM, DON'T YOU HAVE TO YOU, DO YOU WANNA GO INTO EXECUTIVE SESSION? NO, WE'RE GONNA DO THAT HERE, BUT I, 'CAUSE I THINK WE ALSO HAVE, UH, UH, MOTIONS, UNLESS KURT WANTS, THINKS THAT WE SHOULD, BUT I THINK, UH, I THOUGHT WE TALKED ABOUT IT. WE DID TALK ABOUT IT, BUT I THINK IT SHOULD BE DONE. THE DELIBERATION SHOULD BE DONE AT DELIBERATION. SO KURT MA, MAYOR AND COUNCIL, IT'S, UH, UP TO COUNCIL, IT IS IZED, UH, TO GO INTO EXECUTIVE SESSION FOR LEGAL ADVICE ON ANY AGENDA ITEM, INCLUDING THE OAK CREEK HERITAGE LAW. SO IF THERE'S A, A MOTION AND A SECOND FROM COUNSELORS AND IT'S A MAJORITY VOTE, THEN WE CAN GO INTO EXECUTIVE SESSION. I FOR, I CAN ANSWER ANY LEGAL QUESTIONS. COUNSEL HAS, I HAVE NO QUESTION TO ASK. I, IT'S UP TO COUNSEL. DOES ANYBODY HERE NEED TO GO INTO EXECUTIVE SESSION? I JUST WANNA POINT OUT, MAYOR, THAT IT SAYS BASED ON THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS, SPECIFY FINDINGS. YEAH. SO YOU CAN DO THAT HERE. YOU'RE GONNA AD HOC, JUST SORT OF DO THAT. OKAY, GO ON. GO FOR IT. RIGHT. UH, BRIAN DID, WHAT DO YOU WANNA DO? UH, WHAT JESSICA JUST SAID. OKAY. UH, THAT WE NEED TO SPECIFY THOSE FINDINGS HERE BEFORE ANY EXEC SESSION, IF WE ARE TO TAKE IT FOR THE PURPOSES OF JUST GETTING THE OKAY. MOTION. CORRECT. SO AM I CORRECT IN THIS, IN ASSUMING WE'RE GOING TO GO WITH, UH, MOTION NUMBER TWO ON HERE, A REVERSAL OF THE D UH, UH, DEV APPROVAL. IT, IT WOULD BE A VARIANT OF THAT, CORRECT? SO, WELL, MR. MAYOR, YOU CAN CALL IN WHOEVER YOU WANT AND THEN YOU GET, MAKE A MOTION. SO IT'S UP TO THEM. OKAY. ALRIGHT. OKAY. UH, BRIAN, YOU WANTED MAKE THE MOTION. OKAY. UM, MR. MAYOR, I MOVE TO APPROVE CASE NUMBERS. A PPE 24 DASH ZERO ONE AND A PPE 24 DASH 0 0 0 2, THEREBY REVERSING PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION'S, APPROVAL OF CASE NUMBER PZ 23 DASH 0 0 4 DEV OAK CREEK HERITAGE LODGE AT 65 DASH 1 95 SIBLEY HILL ROAD IN 20 BEAR WALLA LANE. BASED ON THE FOLLOWING FINDINGS, AND I WOULD OFFER UP, UM, I NEED TO GO AHEAD AND AND OFFER UP THE FINDINGS RIGHT NOW, CORRECT? CORRECT. AND THEN THEY CAN BE ADDED ON TO AS DESIRED, ET CETERA. SO, UM, MAYOR AND COUNCIL, YES, A A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT COULD ADD ADDITIONAL FINDINGS. SO I WOULD START WITH, UH, LDC, SECTION 8.3 POINT E, UH, PARAGRAPH FIVE. UH, LETTER C, THAT, UH, IT IS THE APPLICANT IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE SEDONA COMMUNITY PLAN AND OTHER APPLICABLE PLANS. AND THAT INCLUDES THE ASPECT OF, UH, TRAFFIC BEING LESS THAN MEDIUM DENSITY, UH, RESIDENTIAL, UH, IN PARTICULAR, AS WELL AS THE, UH, SMALL DESIGNER HOTEL, UH, ASPECT. UM, THEN [04:50:03] ALSO L-D-L-D-C, SECTION 8.3, POINT E, PARAGRAPH FIVE, LETTER G MINIMIZED ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS. UH, AS MY COLLEAGUES HAVE MENTIONED HERE, UM, THERE IS SIGNIFICANT ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT, UH, IN BASICALLY SCRAPING THE GROUND, NOT PRESERVING THE RIPARIAN AREA. UH, SOILS AND NATIVE VEGETATION. UM, WILDLIFE HABITAT. WHAT'S THAT? THE WILDLIFE HABITAT. AND WILDLIFE HABITAT. THANK YOU. UH, ALSO LDC SECTION 8.3 POINT E, PARAGRAPH FIVE, LETTER J PROVIDING ADEQUATE ROAD SYSTEMS AND TRAFFIC MITIGATION AS PER THE VICE MAYOR. UH, SPEAKING TO THAT A FEW MOMENTS AGO, THAT THERE IS, UH, IN, THERE IS EXCESS TRAFFIC BEING GENERATED BY THE PROPERTY AND INADEQUATE, UH, FACILITY TO SUPPORT IT. THAT'S WHAT I HAVE. WOULD ANY LIKE, WOULD HE LIKE TO AMEND THAT FURTHER? VICE MAYOR? I WOULD LIKE TO ADD AS A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT, NOT ADEQUATE ON THE SITE FOR FIRE PUBLIC SAFETY AND EMS SERVICES. GOT THAT. KURT? OH YEAH, HE'S NOT TYPING, BUT THAT'S OKAY. IT'S OVER RECORDED. ? IT'S RECORDED. IT'S RECORDED. AND THEN, AND THEN COUNCILLOR FOLTZ. DO YOU ACCEPT THAT AMENDMENT? I DO. OKAY. AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE WOULD BE FOR THE, UH, SCALING OF THE BUILDING. THE OVERSIZED SCALE OF THE BUILDING COMPARED TO BUT THAT'S IN THE C. THE C, C. WHAT'S THAT? C. C WITH C, THAT'D BE LETTER C, WOULD IT NOT? OKAY THEN THAT'S FINE. YOU WANT TO ADD THAT AS A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT? YES, PLEASE. YOU HAVE TO SPELL IT OUT. OH, OKAY. THAT IT, THAT THEIR DESIGN IS NOT MODESTLY SCALED TO MEET THE, UH, CFA WITH BUILDINGS MORE THAN DOUBLE. WELL, NO, I'LL LEAVE THAT OUT. I WOULD ACCEPT THAT. IS THAT GOOD KIRK? YES. OKAY. WE NEED A SECOND. OKAY. I, I UNDERSTAND THAT WE MAY HAVE MORE FRIENDLY AMENDMENTS. MELISSA, DO YOU WANNA MAKE ANYTHING ELSE? NO, SIR. OKAY. WOULD YOU LIKE TO MAKE ANYTHING IN, IN DIFFERENCE? OKAY, THEN I'LL SECOND THAT MOTION. OKAY. ALL IN FAVOR OF, OF, OF THAT UH, MOTION. UH, SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. THOSE OPPOSED NAY. OKAY. FOUR TO THREE AND SUPPORT. THE MOTION CARRIES. OKAY. THANK YOU GENTLEMEN. AND EVERYBODY HERE FOR COMING IN AND SPENDING, IT'S EARLY. IT'S ONLY 10 O'CLOCK. WE'RE USUALLY OUTTA HERE. 11, 11 30, SO THAT'S RIGHT. WE'RE NOT EVEN DONE. WE'RE NOT DONE. ALMOST DONE. WHY DON'T WE, WE DON'T NEED FIVE MINUTES. WE DON'T NEED FIVE MINUTES, DO WE? CAN WE TAKE A MAYOR? WE HAVE MORE TO DO. MAYBE PEOPLE COULD BE QUIET AND JUST LEAVE. YES. OKAY. UH, FOLKS, IF YOU GIVE US, JUST IF YOU CAN QUIET DOWN A LITTLE BIT, WE DO HAVE A LITTLE BIT MORE BEFORE WE CAN LEAVE. SO IF YOU DON'T MIND, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. OKAY, SO ITEM [8.c. AB 3066 Discussion/possible action regarding future meeting/agenda items.] C, AB 30 66. DISCUSSION POSSIBLE ACTION REGARDING FUTURE MEETING AND AGENDA ITEMS. I HAVE ONE ITEM UNLESS SOMEBODY ELSE HAS SOMETHING. UNLESS WE HAVE THE SAME ITEM WE, MAYBE WE DO. I'M SURE YOU DO. SO, UH, REFERENCE TO THE MORGAN ROAD NEIGHBORHOOD WHO SENT US AN EMAIL THAT THEY'RE INTERESTED IN, UH, A SPEED REDUCTION ON MORGAN ROAD. CAN I POINT OUT THAT I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANYBODY'S ATTENTION. . I JUST NEED, I'M LISTENING. YOU DON'T HAVE, I'M, I'VE GOT THE AGENDA. UH, WE HAVE A NET. SHE'S OKAY. THANK YOU. OKAY. OKAY. WE, WE ARE FINE. SO, UH, I WOULD LIKE TO, UH, SEE IF WE HAVE A SECOND, UH, SECOND. OKAY. FOR, OKAY, SO THE SECOND IS FOR, UH, SPEED REDUCTION CONSIDERATION, UH, ON MORGAN ROAD TO DOWN TO 15. I BELIEVE IT WAS. YES. OKAY. AND FOR, UH, AND STAFF WOULD LOOK INTO IT WHEN AND GET TO IT WHEN THEY CAN, UH, WITHIN THEIR GUIDELINES. MAY I ADD SOMETHING TO THAT, MR. MAYOR? IS THAT A FRIENDLY IT'S A FRIENDLY GO AHEAD. UM, ALONG WITH THAT, I WOULD LIKE TO SUGGEST THAT AS PART OF THAT CONVERSATION WE DISCUSS WHETHER OR NOT, UM, WE SHOULD CONSIDER MAKING THAT ROAD RESIDENT ONLY, UM, BECAUSE OF THE, THE WIDTH OF THE ROAD. AND IF AS PART OF THAT CONVERSATION [04:55:01] TO ALSO DECIDE, UM, WHETHER OR NOT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE AN INCREASE IN, UH, PATROL ENFORCEMENT FOR SPEED. UM, IT'S AN AWFUL LOT TO PUT ON ONE, ONE ITEM. IT'S ONE SECTION ROAD. UH, WHEN YOU SAY RESIDENT ONLY COUNSELOR DUNTON, CAN YOU JUST CLARIFY FOR YOU CAN'T KEEP A PINK, PINK JEEP OUT? NO, NO, NO PARKING. RESIDENT. ONLY PARKING. OKAY. PARKING RESIDENT ONLY. PARKING. PARKING. OH, PARKING. SO NO PARKING EXCEPT WE'RE CORRECT, BUT THAT WASN'T PART OF THE SO HIKERS WOULDN'T NECESSARILY PARK THERE? UM, UH, THEY SHOULD BE PARKING IN THE TRAILHEAD. UM, WE DON'T NECESSARILY WANT OTHER PEOPLE SUPPOSED TO DISCUSS IT. NO, WE WILL. THIS IS TO DISCUSS IT, RIGHT? THIS IS HER. I WAS JUST TRYING TO CLARIFY WHAT I MEANT BY RESIDENT ONLY. OKAY. JUST ONE SECOND, KATHY. OKAY. YOU DONE? OKAY, KATHY, THANK YOU. UM, I THINK IF WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A DISCUSSION ABOUT THE SPEED LIMIT R MORGAN ROAD, WE NEED TO ALSO BE CONSIDERING OTHER OPTIONS. I, I DON'T WANNA LOOK AT IT IN A VACUUM. MM-HMM. , I BELIEVE THAT THERE'S BEEN SOME THOUGHT OUT THERE AMONG RESIDENTS THAT MAYBE THERE WOULD BE A BAN ON OHV USE ON THAT ROAD. I CAN'T SEE DISCUSSING ONE ISSUE ONLY WITHOUT THE OTHER. SO I'D LIKE TO BROADEN THE TOPIC IF WE'RE GOING, 'CAUSE I DO THINK IT SHOULD BE DISCUSSED, BUT I THINK WE SHOULD BE TALKING ABOUT ALL THE OPTIONS THAT WE MIGHT WANT FOR TREATMENT OF, OF MORGAN ROAD. WELL, RIGHT NOW, AND THIS IS GOING BEYOND SO, SO YEAH, MAYOR AND COUNCIL, WE DON'T NEED TO DISCUSS IT. SO WE HAVE A PROPOSAL FOR A 15 IN REDUCTION. NOW WE HAVE A BROADER PROPOSAL. IF SOMEONE WANTS TO SECOND COUNCILLOR KINSELLA. THAT CAN BE ON THE AGENDA. I SECOND IT. OKAY. SURE. OKAY. WELL THEN IT'LL BE THE BROADER TOPIC, RIGHT? SO THAT'S ALL WE NEED, RIGHT? CORRECT. OKAY. ARE THERE ANY OTHER ITEMS FOR FUTURE AGENDAS? ANNETTE. THANK YOU MAYOR. UM, WHILE YOU WERE HAVING YOUR APPEAL HEARING, I DID RECEIVE A CONFIRMATION FROM NORTHERN ARIZONA HEALTH THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO BE AT YOUR OCTOBER 8TH MEETING. SO I WAS JUST LETTING YOU KNOW THAT. PERFECT. WE GONNA ADD THAT TO YOUR AGENDA. PERFECT. YOU HEARD FROM THE COLLEGE TOO, THEY WANNA COME ? UM, I HAVE NOT HEARD BACK FROM THE, YOU, YOU HELPFUL, BUT I DID SEND ANOTHER, UH, REQUEST. YES. OKAY. UH, AND, UH, ANNETTE, POSSIBLY ON OUR NEXT MAYOR MANAGER'S MEETING, WE CAN BRING THAT UP DIRECTLY TO THE, UH, DEAN BECAUSE IT DIDN'T GET ACROSS TO HER SO WELL THE LAST TIME MAYBE. OKAY. I'VE ALREADY SENT TWO EMAILS TO HER AND ALSO TO THE, UM, ASSISTANT TO THE PRESIDENT. I UNDERSTAND. OKAY. BUT YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES ON VIDEO IT, SO THIS IS AN AGENDA FOR DISCUSSION. YES. THANK YOU. OKAY. UH, NOTHING [10. ADJOURNMENT ] ELSE. THIS MEETING IS ADJOURNED. YES. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.