* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.
           QUIET 
          [00:00:01]
DOWN A LITTLE BIT. 
          I'LL CALL 
          [1. CALL TO ORDER/PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE/MOMENT OF SILENCE]
THE MEETING TO ORDER. 
          PLEASE JOIN ME FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. 
          I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVIDUAL WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. 
          AND NOW FOR A MOMENT OF SILENCE, IF YOU WOULD, I'D LIKE TO RECOGNIZE, UH, A RESIDENT, LOU HOYT RECENTLY PASSED AWAY, AND I WAS VERY SAD TO HEAR THAT THIS MORNING. 
          AND HE WAS A FRIEND OF MINE, A FRIEND OF THIS COMMUNITY, A VERY BIG FRIEND, AND SUPPORT, UH, OF OUR CHILDREN AT THE HIGH SCHOOL. 
          AND HE, HE WILL BE SOLELY MISSED. 
          SO PLEASE RECOGNIZE LOU HOYT FOR A MOMENT OF SILENCE. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          [2. ROLL CALL]
MADAM DEPUTY CLERK, WOULD YOU PLEASE READ THE ROLL CALL? MAYOR JALO. 
          HERE. 
          VICE MAYOR PLU. 
          PRESENT. 
          COUNCILOR DUNN. 
          HERE. 
          COUNCILLOR FOLTZ. 
          PRESENT. 
          COUNCILLOR FURMAN? HERE. 
          COUNCILLOR KINSELLA. 
          PRESENT. 
          COUNCILLOR FFE. 
          HERE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          [3.a. AB 3206 Discussion/possible direction regarding the Western Gateway Master Plan.]
OKAY. 
          SPECIAL BUSINESS ITEM THREE, AB 32 0 6. 
          DISCUSSION, POSSIBLE DIRECTION REGARDING THE DRAFT WESTERN GATEWAY MASTER PLAN, WHICH INCLUDES INTRODUCTIONS, PROJECT HISTORY, SUMMARY OF PUBLIC INPUT TO DATE, WHY HOUSING OR HOUSING NEEDS UPDATE, UH, SITE CHARACTERISTICS AND ANALYSIS. 
          PREFERRED PLAN ALTERNATIVE WILL BE TAKING A BREAK, PUBLIC TESTIMONY, UH, COUNCIL DISCUSSION, AND NEXT STEPS. 
          I WOULD LIKE TO ASK THAT THE COUNCIL, UH, OR, OR PUT YOU ON NOTICE THAT WE'D LIKE TO DISCUSS IN FOUR HOURS. 
          SEE WHERE WE ARE. 
          AND IF YOU WANT TO, UH, STOP AT THAT TIME AT SIX O'CLOCK, UH, SEE WHERE WE ALL ARE. 
          'CAUSE WE'VE BEEN IN, IN MEETINGS, BE FOR THE PAST COUPLE HOURS. 
          SO, UH, BUT IN ANY EVENT, CARRIE AND STEVE KICK OFF. 
          THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR. 
          OH, AND COUNCIL. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL. 
          WE ARE, UM, THIS, THIS WORK SESSION HAS BEEN A LONG TIME COMING. 
          UM, WE ARE HERE TO TALK ABOUT THE WESTERN GATEWAY MASTER PLAN AND HOPEFULLY GET SOME DIRECTION FROM COUNCIL ON, UH, WHAT THE NEXT STEPS THAT SHOULD BE. 
          UM, WE, STEVE AND I ARE OBVIOUSLY HERE. 
          WE ARE ALSO JOINED BY OUR CONSULTANTS FROM DIG STUDIOS AND, UM, A CO AND FROM ELLIOT P*****K. 
          AND THEY WILL HAVE SOME OTHER PRESENTATIONS. 
          WE KNOW THAT WE GAVE YOU A LOT OF INFORMATION IN THE PACKET. 
          UM, HOPEFULLY YOU, WE WE'RE NOT GONNA GO OBVIOUSLY THROUGH IT PAGE BY PAGE. 
          WE'RE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU HAVE ABOUT ANY OF THAT. 
          BUT OUR GOAL IN THE PRESENTATION IS TO GIVE AN OVERVIEW, UM, AND THAT OF KIND OF THE PROCESS, HOW WE GOT TO WHERE WE ARE. 
          UM, AND THEN, UM, OPEN IT UP FOR QUESTIONS. 
          SO AGAIN, THIS IS GOING TO BE A FAIRLY HIGH LEVEL OVERVIEW, UM, BUT WE'RE HERE TO TALK WITH YOU, NOT LISTEN TO ME TALK THE WHOLE TIME. 
          SO, AND IF WE COULD REQUEST, UM, WE'RE GONNA HAVE SEVERAL DIFFERENT SEGMENTS HERE. 
          UM, IF WE, IF COUNCIL COULD HOLD QUESTIONS UNTIL THE END OF EACH SEGMENT, IT MIGHT BE A QUICKER, UH, PROCESS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          EVERYBODY HEAR THAT? ? UM, WAIT, I HAVE A QUESTION. 
          . 
          OKAY. 
          SO BEFORE WE GET STARTED TALKING ABOUT WHERE WE ARE WITH THE WESTERN GATEWAY MASTER PLAN, WE WANT TO GIVE AN OVERVIEW OF THE PLANNING PROCESS AND KIND OF WHERE IN THAT, IN THAT PROCESS THAT WE ARE. 
          SO THE COMMUNITY PLAN THAT THE CITY HAS IS SUPPOSED TO BE A PLAN FOR THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY WHERE CFA PLANS AND MASTER PLANS DIAL DOWN AND GET MORE SPECIFIC FOR PROPERTIES. 
          SO, UM, THIS AREA DOES HAVE THE WESTERN GATEWAY CFA PLAN, WHICH WAS ADOPTED BACK IN 2016. 
          WE ARE CURRENTLY WORKING ON THE WESTERN GATEWAY MASTER PLAN, WHICH WILL HOPEFULLY SET THE, THE VISION FOR THIS PROPERTY IN PARTICULAR. 
          UM, AND THEN FUTURE PHASING IMPLEMENTATION PLANS WOULD INCLUDE THINGS LIKE AFFORDABLE VERSUS MARKET RATE OWNERSHIP VERSUS RENTAL BUILDING PLANS, BUILDING DESIGN, HOW THE INFRASTRUCTURE GETS BUILT. 
          THAT WOULD BE A FUTURE PHASE THAT WE WOULD BE LOOKING AT ONCE WE GET A, WHAT IS THE, YOU KNOW, MAXIMUM NUMBERS OF THINGS THAT, UM, COUNSEL WOULD LIKE TO SEE ON THIS PROPERTY. 
          SO 
          [00:05:01]
WE ARE IN THE PURPLE STAGE RIGHT NOW. 
          UM, A LITTLE BACKGROUND ON THE SITE, THE AREA SHOWN IN BLACK, OUTLINED IN BLACK HERE IS THE WESTERN GATEWAY CFA PLAN. 
          AND THAT WAS THE PLAN THAT WAS ADOPTED IN 2016. 
          AND THAT WAS A FAIRLY SUBSTANTIAL PUBLIC OUTREACH PROCESS AS WELL. 
          THE PROJECT SITE IS SHOWN ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE OF THIS IMAGE OUTLINED IN RED. 
          AND THE WESTERN GATEWAY, CFA PLAN STATED THAT THIS, THE PROJECT SITE WAS ENVISIONED AS AN ACTIVE, WALKABLE, AND VIBRANT PLACE THAT CAN SUPPORT A DIVERSITY OF HOUSING OPTIONS AND SERVICES. 
          UM, IT WOULD BE IMPORTANT TO NOTE THAT AT THE TIME THAT THE WESTERN GATEWAY CFA PLAN WAS DONE, THE CITY DID NOT OWN THE PROPERTY. 
          SO, UM, AS MOST OF YOU LIKELY KNOW, IN THE EARLY TWO THOUSANDS, THIS PROPERTY OPERATED AS AN AMPHITHEATER. 
          UM, AND ABOUT 2003, THAT AMPHITHEATER STOPPED OPERATING. 
          AND THEN UNTIL THE CITY PURCHASED THIS PROPERTY IN 2022, IT WAS PRIVATELY OWNED AND THE CITY WAS IN THE, UH, POSITION OF RESPONDING TO DEVELOPMENT PROPOSALS. 
          MOST OF THE PROPOSAL THAT WE SAW HAD A VERY HEAVY LODGING FOCUS. 
          UM, PEOPLE WANTED TO BUILD A HOTEL ON THIS PROPERTY, AND THEY WOULD OFTEN, YOU KNOW, MAYBE OFFER SOME COMMUNITY BENEFITS AS A CARROT TO TRY TO GET THEIR LODGING PROJECT APPROVED. 
          ULTIMATELY, NONE OF THOSE LODGING PROJECTS WERE APPROVED, THUS, THE PROPERTY SITS AS IT IS. 
          UM, BUT THE CITY DECIDED IN 2022 THAT THEY NO LONGER WANTED TO BE JUST RESPONDING TO PROPOSALS. 
          THEY WANTED TO BE THE DRIVING FORCE FOR PROPOSALS. 
          AND THE WAY YOU DO THAT IS BUY THE PROPERTY. 
          SO THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED IN DECEMBER OF 2022. 
          AT THE TIME, THE CITY WAS IN THE MIDDLE OF UPDATING OUR COMMUNITY PLAN. 
          AND SO THE IDEA WAS THAT CITY WOULD BUY THE PROPERTY, FINISH THE COMMUNITY PLAN UPDATE, AND THEN MOVE INTO MASTER PLANNING OF THIS SPECIFIC PROPERTY AND NOT TRY TO OVERLAP THOSE TWO PROCESSES. 
          SO THAT'S THE PROCESS WE ARE IN RIGHT NOW. 
          ANY CON ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT VERY BRIEF HISTORY OF THE PROPERTY? YES, IF I COULD NOT, WELL, THIS IS THE END OF THIS SECTION SO YOU CAN ASK NOW. 
          SO CARRIE, BACK A SLIDE WHERE THE MAP, I'M JUST CURIOUS WHETHER IT, HOW WE SET THIS UP AND THE SHUTTLE PARK AND RIDE ISN'T, ALTHOUGH THE CITY OWNED PROPERTY ACROSS THE STREET, HAS IT PLAYED A ROLE IN THE PLAN? DID WE THINK ABOUT ACTUALLY PUTTING IT IN THE PLAN AND THINKING ABOUT HOW THAT PLAYS OR NOT? AND THEN CONNECTED TO THAT, IN MY MIND, THERE'S A FAIRLY SUBSTANTIAL CONNECTIVITY BENEFIT TO GETTING OVER TOWARDS THE HIGH SCHOOL FROM THIS AREA, RATHER THAN JUST STREET CROSSING, STRETCH. 
          I KNOW, CONTROVERSIAL TOPIC. 
          HAVE WE THOUGHT ABOUT FOOTBRIDGES OR ANY OTHER TYPE OF ENHANCED CONNECTION OUTSIDE OF THE PROP, THE ZONES AS WE CREATED? SO ANDY MIGHT BE ABLE TO REFRESH MY MEMORY ABOUT WHEN THE CITY BOUGHT THE PARK AND RIDE PROPERTY. 
          UM, BUT IT HAS NOT BEEN INCLUDED IN THE MASTER PLANNING OF THIS PARTICULAR PROPERTY. 
          I GONNA PUT HIM ON THE SPOT, SEE IF HE REMEMBERS. 
          AND HE JUST SHOUTS IT OUT. 
          AND I MUST GIVE CREDIT TO JOHN THOMPSON WHO PUT THAT IN OUR MM-HMM . 
          PACKET THROUGH THE INTERVIEW PROCESS. 
          AND IT, IT STOOD OUT TO ME. 
          IT'S LIKE, OH YEAH, WHY HAVEN'T WE THOUGHT ABOUT THOSE THINGS AS FAR AS WHEN WE BOUGHT THE PROPERTY? YEAH, I'M LOOKING AT THAT RIGHT NOW. 
          IT WOULD'VE BEEN, LET'S SEE, MAYOR AND COUNSEL, IF I RECALL WHEN THE COUNCIL WAS DISCUSSING PERSONS PROPERTY, UH, A COUNSEL, I DON'T REMEMBER WHO DID DISCUSS THAT. 
          WE MIGHT NEED BETTER WAYS TO CONNECT THE TWO PROPERTIES IN THE FUTURE, FUTURE IF IT IS DEVELOPED. 
          BUT THERE HAS NOT BEEN THAT I'M AWARE OF ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION. 
          YEAH, THE, THE ONLY THING I WOULD ADD IS THAT WE HAVE LOOKED AT A SHARED USE PATH BEING, UH, ESTABLISHED BETWEEN THE TWO PROPERTIES, NOT A SEPARATED GRADE TYPE CROSSING. 
          NO. 
          AND I WAS JUST ASKING ABOUT PURCHASE DATE. 
          'CAUSE I WASN'T SURE, LIKE IF IT JUST, WE STARTED WITH THE MASTER PLAN PROCESS AND THEN BOUGHT THE PROPERTY AFTER WE'D ALREADY KINDA DEFINED THE BOUNDARIES OF THIS ONE. 
          BUT THAT IS, THAT IS DIRECTION FROM COUNSEL. 
          WE CAN LOOK AT HOW TO POTENTIALLY INCORPORATE THAT. 
          ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS? OKAY, GREAT. 
          SO, UM, THIS PROCESS THAT WE'VE BEEN GOING THROUGH FOR ABOUT A YEAR NOW, I JUST WANTED TO GIVE YOU, UM, A SUMMARY OF PUBLIC INPUT THAT WE'VE RECEIVED. 
          WE TRIED TO INCLUDE AS MUCH AS WE COULD IN THE PACKET. 
          [00:10:01]
I'M SURE WE MISSED SOMETHING. 
          SO IF SOMEONE IN THE AUDIENCE IS LOOKING THROUGH THE PACKET AND DOES NOT SEE THEIR SPECIFIC COMMENT, I APOLOGIZE. 
          WE REALLY TRIED TO PROVIDE A GOOD SUMMARY, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF IT, SO WE COULD HAVE POTENTIALLY MISSED SOMETHING. 
          UM, WE HAVE HAD, PLAN SEDONA.COM HAS ACTUALLY BEEN OUR LANDING SPOT FOR LONG RANGE PLANNING FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS NOW. 
          UM, AFTER THE CITY BOUGHT THE PROPERTY, WE EVEN OPENED UP A COMMENT CARD, KIND, KIND OF A COMMENT FORM ON THAT FOR PEOPLE TO START SUBMITTING IDEAS FOR THE PROPERTIES BEFORE WE STARTED THE MASTER PLAN PROCESS. 
          BUT THAT HAS BEEN JUST AN OPEN COMMENT. 
          UM, WE'VE ALSO USED IT FOR COMMENTS ON PARTICULAR DRAFTS OF THE PLAN AND SURVEYS AND ALL OF THAT. 
          UM, WE HAVE ALSO, OUR CONSULTANT DID, UM, A NUMBER OF STAKEHOLDER INPUT. 
          AND THAT WOULD BE TALKING WITH UTILITY COMPANIES SURROUNDING PROPERTY OWNERS, OTHER CITY DEPARTMENTS ABOUT, UM, WHAT MAYBE THEIR PLANS FOR THEIR PROPERTY, HOW WHAT THE CITY DOES ON THIS PROPERTY MIGHT TIE IN. 
          UM, WE'VE HAD A COUPLE COMMUNITY WORKSHOPS, ONE IN OCTOBER AND ONE IN FEBRUARY. 
          WE'VE HAD A COUPLE OF ONLINE SURVEYS. 
          UM, AND THEN MOST RECENTLY, UH, MYSELF, STEVE, ANNETTE, LAUREN AND KEEGAN DID A SERIES OF FOCUS GROUP MEETINGS WITH VARIOUS COMMUNITY MEMBERS REPRESENTING A LOT OF DIFFERENT ORGANIZATIONS AND BUSINESSES IN THE COMMUNITY. 
          UM, THE EXTREMELY HIGH LEVEL INPUT THAT WE GOT FROM ALL OF THESE IS THAT IN EACH ROUND OF OUTREACH HOUSING HAS FLOATED TO THE TOP OF THE DESIRED USES ON THE PROPERTY AGAIN, BUT THAT IS AT VARYING SIZES, TOWNHOUSES TO HIGH DENSITY APARTMENTS HOUSING, BUT HOUSING AS A GROUP HAS BEEN THE TOP DESIRED USE. 
          UM, NEXT WOULD BE COMMUNITY AMENITIES AND PARK SPACES. 
          SO TRAILS, PARKS, UM, A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE TALKED ABOUT THE DESIRE FOR A RECREATION CENTER, BUT THINGS THAT WOULD SERVE THE COMMUNITY. 
          AND THERE HAS BEEN AN INTEREST IN AMPHITHEATER PERFORMANCE SPACES. 
          BUT AGAIN, THAT WOULD BE VARYING IN SIZES. 
          UM, BETWEEN A THOUSAND TO 5,000 SEATS, 5,000 SEATS IS WHAT THE OLD AMPHITHEATER WAS. 
          AND THEN FOR CONTEXT, THE CURRENT BARBARA ANSON PARK AT POSSE GROUND SEAT 600 PEOPLE, MAXIMUM 400 PEOPLE COMFORTABLY IS WHAT I WAS TOLD BY OUR PARKS AND REC DEPARTMENT. 
          AND SO A THOUSAND SEAT WOULD BE ABOUT DOUBLE THAT. 
          UM, AS FAR AS PERSON CAPACITY GOES, UM, THE JULY AND AUGUST FOCUS GROUP MEETINGS THAT WE HAD, UM, AGAIN, THERE IS SUMMARIES OF ALL OF THIS IN YOUR PACKET, WHICH WE CAN TALK TO MORE IF YOU WOULD LIKE. 
          UM, BUT OVERALL, THE TOP LIKES THAT PEOPLE HAD WERE HOUSING IN THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT AREAS. 
          UM, THE CONCERNS WERE REGARDING COMMUNITY SUPPORT, RECREATION CENTER, AND THEN WE GOT ABOUT EVEN COMMENTS OF THERE'S TOO MUCH HOUSING. 
          THERE'S TOO LITTLE HOUSING. 
          WE GOT THINGS ON BOTH SIDES. 
          SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT WE GOT. 
          UM, WE WERE ALSO TOLD, YOU KNOW, WE ASKED SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, MORE OF A, YOU KNOW, TAKE A STEP BACK AND AS A CITY, SHOULD WE BE CONCERNED ABOUT WORKER WORKFORCE HOUSING, WHETHER WORKERS CAN BE ABLE TO LIVE HERE, SHOULD WE BE DECON CONCERNED ABOUT THE DECLINING POPULATION AND DECLINING SCHOOL ENROLLMENT? AND, UM, I THINK WE'RE AT 75 TO 80% OF PEOPLE SAID YES, THE CITY AS A WHOLE SHOULD BE CONCERNED ABOUT THAT. 
          AND THAT THE WESTERN GATEWAY SHOULD BE A PLACE THAT WE BEGIN TO ADDRESS SOME OF THOSE ISSUES AND THAT HOUSING SHOULD BE A PRIMARY LAND USE. 
          UM, WHEN WE ASKED ABOUT THE DRAFT, THE LAND ALLOCATION IN THE CURRENT DRAFT PLAN THAT WE HAVE, THE MOST COMMON RESPONSE WAS, IT LOOKS GOOD, BUT THEN WE HAD SOME OTHER, AGAIN, WE GOT, THERE'S TOO MUCH HOUSING, THERE'S TOO LITTLE HOUSING THERE. 
          WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE MORE MIXED USE. 
          UM, BUT ALL OF THOSE STATS ARE IN YOUR PACKET. 
          AND THAT'S ALL I HAVE ON, DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT SECTION? PUBLIC INPUT, ANYTHING YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO ELABORATE MORE ON? OKAY, GREAT. 
          I'M JUST MOVING RIGHT THROUGH THIS. 
          UM, AND THEN ONE OF THE QUESTIONS THAT WE HAVE GOTTEN IS WHY HOUSING? WHY ARE WE PROPOSING HOUSING ON THIS PROPERTY? UM, THE SEDONAS COMMUNITY PLAN HAS A HOUSING GOAL THAT STATES THAT SEDONA, UM, THAT THE GOAL WOULD BE THAT SEDONA HAVE A DIVERT, HAVE DIVERSE HOUSING OPTIONS THAT ARE SAFE, SECURE, AND AFFORDABLE. 
          THIS HAS BEEN A COUNCIL PRIORITY FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS. 
          UM, AND WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TWO STAFF MEMBERS WHO ARE DEDICATED TO HOUSING. 
          UM, BUT DUE THE LACK OF VACANT LAND AND HIGH CONSTRUCTION COSTS, WE HAVEN'T POTENTIALLY SEEN AS MUCH PROGRESS AS WE WOULD'VE LIKED TO SEE. 
          UM, AS WE'VE TALKED TO BUSINESSES, UM, HOUSING FOR EMPLOYEES 
          [00:15:01]
HAS, IS ONE OF THEIR KEY ISSUES. 
          AND SO IT'S BLEEDS OVER INTO AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT ISSUE AS WELL AS A HOUSING ISSUE IN 2020. 
          UM, THE STUDY THAT SEDONA HAD DONE BY ELLIOT P*****K STATED THAT THERE WAS ABOUT A 1,250 UNIT SHORTFALL IN SEDONA IN PARTICULAR, AND ABOUT 3,600 UNITS IN THE VERDE VALLEY. 
          IN 2023. 
          THERE WAS A SEPARATE STUDY DONE BY THE ECONOMIC COLLABORATIVE OF NORTHERN ARIZONA E KONA, WHICH SAID SEDONA WAS SHORT OVER 2000 UNITS. 
          UM, AND THEN THERE'S SOME UPDATES TO THAT THAT THEY WILL COME AND TALK ABOUT. 
          UM, AND SINCE 2020, AND SO THIS NUMBER IS ACTUALLY A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THAN THE NUMBER THAT IS IN YOUR PACKET BECAUSE WE HAVE GOTTEN A NEW APPLICATION IN THAT WE HAVE ADDED INTO THE POTENTIAL HOUSING. 
          SO SINCE 2020 SEDONA, WE HAVE APPROVED, UH, SO 219 UNITS HAVE BEEN APPROVED OR UNDER CONSTRUCTION OF THOSE, ONLY 45 ARE ACTUALLY BEING RENTED RIGHT NOW. 
          AND THOSE WOULD BE THE 45 UNITS AT PINON LOFTS. 
          OTHER PROJECTS, NAVAJO LOFTS VILLAS ON SHELBY JORDAN LOFTS VILLAGE AT SADDLE ROCK ALCHEMIST, OGRE HERITAGE LODGE HAVE VARYING NUMBERS OF UNITS, VARYING NUMBER, LIKE VARYING STAGES OF DEVELOPMENT. 
          UM, WE ALSO HAVE DEVELOPMENT APPLICATIONS IN FOR POTENTIALLY UP TO 250, BUT A NUMBER OF THESE NEED ZONING CHANGES, DEVELOPMENT REVIEWS, POTENTIALLY DIFFERENT FINANCING THINGS. 
          AND SO THE POTENTIAL OF THOSE, YOU CAN DECIDE IF YOU WANT TO INCLUDE THOSE IN THE TOTAL NUMBER THAT WE'RE COUNTING OR NOT, BUT NOT APPROVED GOING THROUGH THE REVIEW PROCESS. 
          AND THE, THE BIG DIFFERENCE IS THAT WE DID, YOU KNOW, SINCE WE GAVE THIS PRESENTATION, UM, IN JULY AND AUGUST, THE ST. 
          JOHN ANI APPLICATION HAS BEEN SUBMITTED. 
          SO WE ADDED THOSE POTENTIAL UNITS TO THE CAT. 
          WHAT IS ALCHEMIST? UM,  ALCHEMIST IS A PROPOSAL TO DO A METERY NEXT TO THE SEDONA WILD RESORT. 
          UM, AND SO THEY'RE PROPOSING A METERY COFFEE SHOP WITH 15 HOUSING UNITS. 
          OKAY, RIGHT ON THAT PROPERTY ON THE HIGHWAY. 
          IS THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ABOUT MY HOUSING SIDE, OTHER, OTHERWISE I'M GONNA TURN IT OVER TO ELLIOT P*****K, THE REPRESENTATIVES FROM ELLIOT P*****K TO GO OVER SOME OF THE MORE SPECIFIC HOUSING NUMBERS. 
          CARRIE, YOU SAID THE TWO 19 APPROVED 45 ACTUALLY IN OPERATION UHHUH . 
          AND THEN THE LIST OF THESE PROJECTS THAT ARE IN SOME FORM, ARE THERE, ARE THEY ALL ACTIVELY MOVING? ARE THERE SOME THAT HAVE BEEN COM APPROVED AND KIND OF STUCK SOMEWHERE? UM, INACTIVE VERY QUICKLY. 
          NAVAJO LOSS IS UNDER CONSTRUCTION. 
          THEY ARE COMPLETING, I BELIEVE, CONSTRUCTION ON THE FIRST 10 OF THE UNITS, BUT THEY ARE MOVING THROUGH THOSE VILLAS ON SHELBY IS A 30 UNITS ON THE CITY OWNED PROPERTY THAT ARE UNDER CONSTRUCTION, I BELIEVE STEVE JUST TOLD US THIS AFTERNOON THAT FOR THE 30 UNITS UNDER CONSTRUCTION FOR A MONTH, THEY HAVE A WAIT LIST OF 40 PEOPLE. 
          UM, JORDAN LOFTS IS 19 UNITS THAT'S UNDER CONSTRUCTION IN UPTOWN ON JORDAN ROAD. 
          YEAH. 
          UH, VILLAGE AT SADDLE ROCK, THAT'S THE, UM, UNITS IN ASSOCIATION WITH THE HOTEL. 
          THEY HAVE NOT SUBMITTED BUILDING PERMITS YET. 
          ALCHEMIST BELIEVE THEY HAVE A BUILDING PERMIT FOR THEIR FIRST BUILDING, BUT NOT, WHICH I THINK ONLY HAD TWO. 
          IT'S THE METERY BUILDING, SO NOT REALLY THE HOUSING UNIT BUILDINGS. 
          AND THEN OAK CREEK HERITAGE LODGE, THEY HAD FOUR KINDA STUDIO UNITS AND WE HAVE NOT SEEN BUILDING PERMITS FOR THOSE. 
          AND THEN PERHAPS EVEN QUICKER THE POTENTIALS ARE THEY, UM, SO ANY TIMEFRAME TO GET TO PNZ OR ANYWHERE ELSE? SO GOODROW, WE GOT A RESUBMITTAL ON THAT ONE YESTERDAY, OR NO? WELL, WE GOT AN ALMOST RESUBMITTAL ON THAT ONE YESTERDAY. 
          UM, THEY HAD A COUPLE THINGS THEY NEEDED TO ADJUST. 
          THEY'RE GONNA GET THAT BACK TO US PROBABLY TOMORROW. 
          UM, AND THAT WOULD REQUIRE A ZONE CHANGE AND A HEIGHT APPROVAL FROM CITY COUNCIL. 
          SUNSET LOSS IS CITY OWNED PROJECT THAT, UM, I DON'T BELIEVE THE RFP FOR THAT WAS SUCCESSFUL. 
          AND SO I'M SURE STEVE COULD TALK MORE TO THAT. 
          24 11 IS THE CITY, THE PROPERTY THE CITY BOUGHT, BUT THE LITE PROJECT WAS NOT SUCCESSFUL. 
          AND THEN ST. 
          JOHN BANI IS A NEW APPLICATION THAT WE HAVE, UM, THAT WE'RE JUST STARTING THE REVIEW FOR. 
          GREAT. 
          THANK YOU, BRIAN. 
          FIRST. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          UH, IS ALCHEMIST UNDER A, A DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT OF ANY KIND THAT PUTS THEM ON A TIMEFRAME WHERE THEY GOTTA GET THE HOUSING DONE OR NO? THEY ARE ON, UM, . 
          THERE ARE SOME STANDARD DEVELOPMENT TIMEFRAMES BASED ON WHEN THEY GOT APPROVED, AND THEN THEY GOT AN EXTENSION EARLIER THIS YEAR. 
          THEY GAVE THEM SOME DIFFERENT TIMEFRAMES TO PHASE THE PROJECT. 
          OKAY. 
          BUT YOUR UNDERSTANDING AT THIS TIME IS, IS THEY ARE IN FACT INTENDING TO DO THE WHOLE THING, NOT JUST THE METERY AND I 
          [00:20:01]
MEAN, THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING, BUT OKAY. 
          YEAH. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          UM, SO YOU HAVE ALL THESE POTENTIAL, UH, UNITS COMING ONLINE. 
          MM-HMM . 
          HOW MANY OF THEM ARE MARKET RATE VERSUS HOW MANY OF THEM ARE AFFORDABLE TO SOME LEVEL OF A MI MM-HMM . 
          UM, SO JORDAN LOFTS IS THE ONLY ONE WITH NO RESTRICTIONS. 
          PENON LOFTS, NAVAJO LOFTS, OUR ALCHEMIST, I GUESS OAK CREEK HERITAGE LODGE ARE ALL MARKET RATE, BUT NO SHORT TERM RENTALS. 
          UM, VILLAS ON SHELBY IS DEED RESTRICTED FOR I THINK 60% OF A AMI 60% VILLAGE AT SADDLE ROCK IS 80 TO 120% A MI. 
          THANK YOU. 
          AND THEN THE POTENTIAL ONES ARE, THEY HAVEN'T BEEN APPROVED, SO UNKNOWN AT THIS TIME, BUT PROPOSALS INCLUDE AFFORDABILITY RESTRICTIONS FOR SOME OF THEM. 
          I THINK. 
          WELL, ALL OF THESE WOULD ACTUALLY HAVE SOME KIND OF AFFORDABILITY RESTRICTIONS AS WELL AS CURRENTLY PROPOSED. 
          OKAY. 
          CONTINUE COUNTING. 
          OKAY. 
          SO NOW I'M GONNA TURN IT OVER TO, UH, OUR REPRESENTATIVES FROM ELLIOT P*****K TO GO THROUGH THE HOUSING UPDATE NUMBERS THAT THEY HAVE. 
          AND I'LL INTRODUCE TO YOU, UH, DANNY FROM ELLIOT P*****K. 
          UH, HE'S BEEN WORKING ALONG WITH, UH, RICK, THE PRESIDENT FIRM, ELLIOT P*****K HAS BEEN WORKING WITH US, UH, FAIRLY CLOSELY, AND, UH, APPRECIATE THEM, UH, BEING HERE TO HELP US OUT. 
          GOOD AFTERNOON, MAYOR AND COUNCIL. 
          UM, LIKE WAS MENTIONED BEFORE, OUR ORIGINAL STUDY WAS A HOUSING NEEDS ASSESSMENT AND STRATEGY THAT WAS COMPLETED IN 2019 AND 2020. 
          SO THE REQUEST WAS TO GET A MARKET UPDATE OF, OF WHERE SEDONA STANDS IN TERMS OF, UH, HOUSING PRICES, RENTS, SUPPLY, AND, UH, SOURCES OF DEMAND. 
          AND, UH, WITH A, WITH A FOCUS ON AFFORDABILITY. 
          AND WE'LL KIND OF TIE THAT INTO WHAT'S PROPOSED AT THE WESTERN GATEWAY PLAN AT THE, AT THE END OF THIS. 
          BUT BASICALLY, UM, AGAIN, THIS IS AN UPDATE FROM 2020, UM, FOCUSING ON, ON HOUSING TRENDS, LOOKING AT AFFORDABILITY GAP, WHICH CURRENTLY, UM, AS OF THE 2023 US CENSUS IS 1,871 UNITS. 
          SO THAT'S ABOUT 37% OF SEDONAS HOUSEHOLDS THAT ARE COST OVERBURDENED. 
          UM, WHICH THE DEFINITION OF IS THEIR SPENDING AT LEAST 30% OR MORE OF THEIR INCOME ON HOUSING COST. 
          UM, SO WE'VE IDENTIFIED, UM, DEMAND FROM, UM, THE RECENT ABSORPTION OF THE TWO APARTMENT PROJECTS THAT HAVE BEEN COMPLETED SINCE 2020. 
          AND THEN LOOKING AT DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES THAT WOULD ADDRESS THE CER, THE, THE DIFFERENT INCOME LEVELS OF, OF THE RESIDENTS AS, AS WELL AS THE EMPLOYEES OF THE CITY. 
          UM, THIS IS A CHART OF, UH, HOME PRICES, UH, FOR SALE HOME PRICES. 
          SO SINGLE FAMILY CONDOS AND MANUFACTURED HOMES. 
          UH, HOME PRICES ARE UP 39% SINCE 2020. 
          UM, SO WE'RE BASICALLY RIGHT AT $1.1 MILLION FOR A SINGLE FAMILY HOME. 
          YOU'LL SEE A DOWNTICK THERE IN 2025. 
          WE ONLY HAVE ABOUT, UM, THE, THE, THE WRITING OF THE REPORT WAS IN JULY. 
          UM, SO THIS IS PROBABLY ABOUT A THIRD OF 2025 SALES. 
          SO, UM, THAT NUMBER COULD CHANGE. 
          BUT IT'S ALSO A TREND THAT WE'RE SEEING ACROSS THE COUNTRY IS THAT WE ARE SEEING SOME, SOME SMALL DOWNTICK IN HOME PRICES BECAUSE OF THE HIGH INTEREST RATES. 
          UM, AND, AND LACK OF VOLUME IN SALES. 
          UM, CONDOMINIUM AVERAGING AT $580,000 IN MANUFACTURED HOMES HAVE, HAVE NOW TICKED ABOVE $500,000. 
          UM, SO WHEN WE COMPARE THAT TO THE MEDIAN INCOME IN SEDONA AT 67,000, YOU KNOW, A A AN AFFORDABLE HOME TO, TO, TO PURCHASE FOR SOMEONE MAKING THE I INCOME IS UNDER 200,000. 
          SO WE'VE GOT A DISCONNECT HERE BETWEEN, UM, THE VALUES OF THE HOMES HERE AND, AND WHAT'S AVAILABLE FOR, YOU KNOW, ESSENTIAL WORKERS, WHICH ARE BASICALLY PRICED OUT OF THE OWNERSHIP MARKET. 
          WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE RENTAL MARKET, UH, THIS, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, SUDO IS NOT IMMUNE TO WHAT HAPPENED, YOU KNOW, IN THE STATE AND ACROSS THE COUNTRY. 
          WE SAW A BIG BOOM IN RENTAL WENT RENTAL PRICES, UM, FOR, FOR APARTMENTS. 
          SO THAT STARTED OCCURRING IN 2021 AND 2022. 
          SO YOU SEE THAT IN THE CHART THERE, BIG UPTICK. 
          SO WE'RE BASICALLY, UM, RANGE OF, RANGE OF PRICES BY BEDROOM TYPE IS BASICALLY $1,700 TO $2,300, MEANING, UH, FOR IT TO BE AFFORDABLE, THOSE ARE HOUSEHOLDS MAKING BETWEEN 68 AND $93,000 PER YEAR. 
          UM, AND WE'VE GOT A, WE'VE GOT A CURRENT APARTMENT VACANCY RATE OF 6%. 
          SO THAT'S BASICALLY, WE'RE AT FULL OCCUPANCY. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S CONSIDERED STABILIZED OCCUPANCY. 
          [00:25:01]
UH, NO, NO EXCESS VACANCY IN THE APARTMENT MARKET HERE. 
          UH, THIS WAS SORT OF ALREADY COVERED, BUT, UM, SINCE 2020 WE'VE, WE NOTED 69 UNITS OF, OF APARTMENTS BUILT. 
          SO THAT'S THE PINION LOFTS AND THE WYNDHAM APARTMENT, UH, WYNDHAM HOTEL APARTMENTS, UM, TO NOTE THERE TOO, UH, THE ABSORPTION ON THOSE WERE INCREDIBLY QUICK. 
          SO EACH OF THOSE PROJECTS ABSORBED TO FULL OCCUPANCY WITHIN A MATTER OF MONTHS. 
          UH, WHICH SHOWS YOU, UH, IT GIVES YOU SOME INSIGHT AS TO THE DEMAND FOR, UH, MORE RENTAL PRODUCTS, EVEN IN THE MARKET RATE SIDE OF THINGS. 
          UM, THERE'S 30 AFFORDABLE APARTMENTS, UH, THAT'S THE VILLAS ON SHELBY. 
          SO THOSE WILL BE RESTRICTED TO THOSE MAKING 60% A MI, UH, WE EXPECT THOSE TO BE ABSORBED IMMEDIATELY UPON OPENING, UH, THE TOWN HOME RENTALS, THE MARKET RATE TOWN HOME RENTALS THAT ARE UNDER CONSTRUCTION, UH, MARKET RATE CONDO. 
          SO THOSE ARE, THAT'S A FOR SALE PRODUCT, UM, THAT WE UNDERSTAND IS IN THE, WILL BE IN THE $600,000 RANGE. 
          AND THEN WE'VE GOT WORKFORCE APARTMENTS THAT ARE APPROVED, BUT WITH NO CONSTRUCTION DATE. 
          SO 111. 
          UM, AND AGAIN, CURRENT CURRENT MARKET IS 6% VACANCY, WHICH IS ABOUT 14 APARTMENTS THAT ARE, THAT ARE AVAILABLE. 
          UM, THE AFFORDABILITY GAP, AGAIN, LOOKING AT ALL CURRENT RESIDENTS OF SEDONA THAT ARE OVERBURDENED BY EITHER THEIR RENT OR THEIR, OR THEIR COST OF OWNERSHIP IS 1,871 HOUSEHOLDS. 
          THAT'S, THAT BREAKS DOWN TO 1200 OWNER HOUSEHOLDS AND 639 RENTER HOUSEHOLDS. 
          WE ALSO HAVE A, A LARGE SECTION OF, OF EMPLOYEES, 80% OF OF SEDONA WORKERS COMMUTE INTO THE TOWN. 
          UM, I BELIEVE IT WAS OVER 1600 THAT COMMUTE AT LEAST 50 MILES EACH WAY. 
          SO WE'VE GOT SERVICE WORKERS THAT, YOU KNOW, MAKING $50,000 OR LESS THAT ARE PRICED OUT OF BOTH THE RENTAL MARKET AND THE OWNER MARKET. 
          AND THE UPCOMING 30 SUBSIDIZED UNITS COVERS ABOUT 8.4% OF, OF WHAT YOU NEED. 
          WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE INCOME RANGES BROKEN DOWN BY, BY INCOME CATEGORY, THIS KIND OF LETS YOU, UH, GIVES AN INSIGHT AS TO WHAT YOU NEED TO ADDRESS, UM, TO ADDRESS THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING ISSUE BY INCOME LEVEL. 
          SO WE HAVE JUST UNDER 600 HOUSEHOLDS THAT ARE, THAT ARE EXTREMELY LOW INCOME. 
          AND THIS, THESE COULD ONLY BE ADDRESSED BY, UH, BUILDING PUBLIC HOUSING, YOU KNOW, SEDONA GETTING INTO THE HOUSING MARKET, UH, MANAGING PUBLIC HOUSING WHERE THEY PAY 30% OF WHATEVER INCOME THEY HAVE, WHICH IS, UM, WHICH ARE, THESE ARE HOUSEHOLDS MAKING $20,000 OR LESS. 
          UM, THEN WE GET INTO THE HOUSEHOLDS THAT ARE MAKING BETWEEN 20 AND 50. 
          THOSE WOULD BE, UH, MORE CANDIDATES FOR, UM, THE HOUSING THAT WE'RE SEEING UNDER CONSTRUCTION. 
          THE, THE VIL IS ON SHELBY, SO A 40 TO 60% A MI TARGET INCOME LEVEL, UM, WOULD NEED TO BE A GOVERNMENT SUBSIDIZED HOUSING PROJECT. 
          AND THERE'S 635 HOUSEHOLDS THAT ARE IN NEED OF THOSE TYPES OF UNITS. 
          AND THEN WE GET INTO MORE OF THE, UM, YOU CAN CALL IT A MIX OF WORKFORCE OR, OR, OR, OR UNDER MARKET OR EVEN MARKET RATE HOUSING, 648 HOUSEHOLDS MAKING AT LEAST $50,000. 
          SO, SO THESE HOUSEHOLDS COULD AFFORD A SMALLER MARKET RATE RENTAL UNIT, OR IF THERE WAS SOME PROGRAM THAT WAS, UH, LOWERING THE RENTS A LITTLE BIT BELOW MARKET WOULD THEN MAKE IT AFFORDABLE TO THEM. 
          SO THOSE ARE, THOSE ARE, THOSE ARE HOW THAT, UM, THAT BREAKS DOWN IN TERMS OF THE HOUSING GAP BY INCOME LEVEL. 
          UH, YAVAPAI COLLEGE ALSO PUT TOGETHER A PROFILE OF EMPLOYEES COMMUTING INTO SEDONA. 
          UH, I THINK IT WAS COMMUTING AT LEAST 15 MILES IN, AND DID A, UH, A PROFILE OF THE, UH, THE OCCUPATIONS AND THE INCOMES THAT THEY WERE EARNING AND, AND BASICALLY A, A CASE STUDY ON WHAT YOU WOULD NEED TO BUILD IN TERMS OF UNIT MIX OR, OR TARGET RENTS, UM, TO BRING THOSE EMPLOYEES INTO THE TOWN AND, AND HAVE AN AFFORDABLE PLACE FOR THEM. 
          SO THERE'S THIS SKEWS TOWARDS AFFORDABLE HOUSING, UM, TOWARDS RENT SUBSIDIZED HOUSING. 
          I WILL NOTE THAT I, IT, I BELIEVE THE METHODOLOGY IS THAT ALL OF THESE WOULD BE SINGLE INCOME EARNERS. 
          SO, UM, THERE PROBABLY IS A LITTLE BIT OF WIGGLE ROOM IF THESE, IF THERE WERE TWO INCOME EARNERS IN THE HOUSEHOLD. 
          UM, BUT BASICALLY YOU SEE, YOU KNOW, A, A PREFERENCE FOR SMALLER UNITS LIKE STUDIOS AND ONE BEDROOMS, UH, AND THEN UP THE SCALE TO, TO TWO BEDROOM APARTMENTS. 
          BUT, UM, YOU SEE THE DIS THE, THE, THE CONNECTION THERE BETWEEN THEIR TARGET RENTS TO MAKE IT AFFORDABLE AND, AND WHAT'S CURRENTLY, UH, CURRENTLY IN THE MARKET. 
          SO ONE BEDROOM APARTMENTS IN S CURRENTLY ARE ABOUT A THOUSAND TO 1900. 
          UM, AND THEY'RE RECOMMENDING FINDING APARTMENTS BETWEEN 950 AND 1100. 
          SO THAT WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, DIFFICULT TO DO FROM A MARKET RATE SOLUTION STANDPOINT. 
          UM, 
          [00:30:01]
AGAIN, IF WE CAN, IF THERE ARE MORE THAN ONE INCOME EARNER IN THAT HOUSEHOLD, UH, THEY COULD AFFORD A, A MORE AFFORDABLE RENT. 
          BUT GIVES YOU SOME INDICATION OF KIND OF THE, THE COMMUTING EMPLOYEE PROFILE, UH, FOR SEDONA. 
          AND, UH, IN TERMS OF OUR RECOMMENDATIONS FOR, FOR THE HOUSING UPDATE, UM, YOU KNOW, IT, IT IS REALLY FOCUSED ON THE AFFORDABLE SIDE. 
          SO ON THE OWNERSHIP SIDE, FINDING, UM, ENCOURAGING MORE SMALL LOT, UH, ATTACHED HOUSING THAT THAT COULD BE BUILT FOR UNDER 400,000, PROMOTING MORE HIGHER, HIGHER DENSITY, HIGHER DENSITY RENTAL PRODUCTS LIKE TOWN HOMES, DUPLEXES AND APARTMENTS, CONTINUING TO SUPPORT THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, UH, UH, PRODUCTION OF THOSE AND, AND HAVING THOSE BE SMALL CASITA RENTALS, AS WELL AS SUPPORTING MANUFACTURED HOUSING AS A, AS A LOWER COST OWNERSHIP OPTION. 
          UM, HOPING TO EXPAND MORE SUBSIDIZED HOUSING AND VOUCHER PROGRAMS FOR WORKFORCE HOUSEHOLDS. 
          AND THEN, UM, WE HAVE A SMALL SECTION ABOUT SENIOR LIVING OPTIONS FOR, FOR AGING RESIDENTS. 
          UM, AND SO HOW THAT TIES INTO THE WESTERN GATEWAY PLAN IS, UM, WE UNDERSTAND THAT, THAT THE PROPOSAL AS FAR AS A TOTAL UNIT YIELD ACROSS THE PLAN IS ABOUT FOUR 30 UNITS. 
          UM, GIVE OR TAKE, UM, YOU CAN, YOU CAN SEE THERE THAT, UH, THE HOUSING GAP FOR JUST YOUR CURRENT RESIDENTS THAT ARE OVERBURDENED AT, AT NEARLY 1900 UNITS IS, IS OF ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE OF, OF THAT PROPOSAL. 
          UM, IN ADDITION TO THOSE EMPLOYEES, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT OVER 5,000 EMPLOYEES COMMUTING IN, SO THE DEMAND POOL IS WELL IN EXCESS OF WHAT'S BEING, WHAT, WHAT COULD BE OFFERED. 
          UM, SO YOU'RE SAFE THERE IN TERMS OF, OF MARKET DEMAND, UM, WE WOULD EXPECT, UM, THAT THIS PLAN WOULD TAKE, YOU KNOW, NUMEROUS YEARS TO BUILD OUT. 
          SO OUR EXPECTATION IN TERMS OF MARKET, YOU SEE WHAT'S BEING BUILT TODAY IS, IS A SMALLER UNITS. 
          SO 40 TO 60 UNITS, THAT'S WHAT WE WOULD EXPECT IS, IS THE MOST LIKELY CASE, UH, FOR THIS, FOR THIS AREA, AS YOU WOULD SEE, UH, CONTINUE TO SEE SMALLER TYPE APARTMENT COMMUNITIES BUILT TO PROVE OUT THE MARKET. 
          UM, WE'VE SEEN REALLY STRONG ABSORPTION IN, IN THE LAST TWO APARTMENTS THAT WERE BUILT IN SEDONA, AT, AT MARKET RATES. 
          SO YOU SEE THAT THERE'S DEMAND THERE FOR EVEN A MARKET RATE. 
          THESE, THAT'S THE MOST AFFORDABLE HOUSING OPTION IN THE CITY. 
          UM, AND THE FOCUS, UH, IN TERMS OF MARKET ACCEPTANCE AND IN TERMS OF ADDRESSING AFFORDABILITY, REALLY WILL BE, UH, LARGELY ON THE RENTAL SIDE. 
          UM, IT'S REALLY DIFFICULT TO FIND PROGRAMS THAT CAN, THAT CAN BUILD AND DEVELOP OWNERSHIP HOUSING THAT'S AFFORDABLE TO HOUSEHOLDS MAKING UNDER A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS. 
          SO RENTAL PRODUCTS, UM, IS REALLY, YOU KNOW, WHAT THE MARKET IS POINTING TO, YOU CAN STILL HAVE A GREAT DIVERSITY OF HOUSING TYPES WITHIN THAT. 
          UM, TOWN HOMES, DUPLEXES, SINGLE FAMILY BUILD TO RENT, UH, COTTAGES, UH, BUNGALOWS AND, AND TRADITIONAL APARTMENT DEVELOPMENT AS WELL. 
          BUT, UM, DENSITY IN SMALLER UNITS IS REALLY GONNA HELP THE PRIVATE MARKET ADDRESS THE SOLUTION AND TARGETING HOUSEHOLDS EARNING BETWEEN 50 AND 75, WHICH AS WE SHOWED IN PREVIOUS SLIDE, IS CURRENT RESIDENTS AT 648 PLUS YOUR, YOUR ADDITIONAL WORKERS THAT ARE COMMUTING OUT FROM OUTSIDE. 
          UM, AGAIN, WE HAVE MORE OF THEM THAN, THAN IS OFFERED IN THIS PLAN. 
          SO THE PLAN WILL HELP SUBSTANTIALLY ADDRESS AFFORDABLE HOUSING ISSUES. 
          UM, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT, IT WON'T BE ALL OF THE HOUSING THAT YOU NEED, BUT IT WOULD CERTAINLY BE A SUBSTANTIAL STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION. 
          OKAY. 
          ANY QUESTIONS? OKAY, GO AHEAD. 
          SO THE WAY I READ THIS IS THAT THERE, THIS 1,871 UNIT GAP HAS TO DO, OR LET ME ASK YOU YEAH. 
          DOES IT HAVE TO DO MORE WITH BEING OVERBURDENED? I'M INTERESTED IN WHAT IS THE AMOUNT OF HOUSING THAT IS NEEDED FOR ACCESSIBILITY, NOT AFFORDABILITY. 
          SO IN OTHER WORDS, SOME OF THESE PEOPLE WHO ARE IN THE, THE OVERBURDENED UNITS LIVE THERE. 
          YES. 
          OKAY. 
          SO IT WOULD, THEY MAY NOT HAVE ANY MORE MONEY THAN TO PAY THE RENT OR VERY LITTLE MONEY LEFT OVER, BUT TO HAVE A PLACE TO LIVE, HOW DO WE GET TO WHAT THE GAP IS IN ACTUALLY HAVING HOUSING AT ALL? SO WE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO DEAL WITH A HUNDRED PERCENT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE COST OVERBURDENED, WHO HAVE A PLACE TO LIVE, OR PEOPLE WHO ARE COMMUTERS WHO DON'T WANNA LIVE IN SEDONA. 
          AND I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOUR METHODOLOGY IS. 
          HOW DO WE GET MORE REFINEMENT IN THESE NUMBERS SO THAT WE KNOW 
          [00:35:01]
WHERE TO TARGET AND WE KNOW WHAT OUR ACTUAL GAP IS? 'CAUSE I, BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE MISUSING THESE NUMBERS, THEY'RE SAYING, OH, WELL WE NEED 1,871 UNITS, NOBODY CAN LIVE THERE. 
          BUT IT, THAT'S NOT WHAT THIS WAS REALLY SAYING, SAYING PEOPLE WHO LIVE THERE ARE OVERBURDENED BECAUSE THEY'RE PAYING MORE THAN 30%, BUT WHAT ABOUT THE PEOPLE WHO CAN'T FIND ANY PLACE TO LIVE? YOU KNOW, SO, YEAH. 
          WHICH, AND THAT WOULD BE, THAT WOULD BE AN EXTREMELY DIFFICULT THING TO TRY TO DETERMINE. 
          YOU DON'T KNOW THE PEOPLE THAT AREN'T MOVING HERE BECAUSE THEY CAN'T FIND A HOME. 
          UM, I POSSIBLY IN THE EMPLOYMENT STATISTICS, BY SEEING ALL THESE COMMUTERS, YOU HAVE OVER 5,300 WORKERS THAT ARE COMMUTING INTO THE TOWN TO WORK. 
          UM, THERE'S, I'M SURE THERE'S A SUBSECTION OF THOSE PEOPLE THAT PREFER TO LIVE OUTSIDE THE TOWN AND, AND COMMUTE IN, BUT THERE'S ALSO PROBABLY A, A PERCENTAGE OF THOSE THAT WOULD LOVE TO LIVE HERE IF THEY FOUND AN AFFORDABLE PLACE TO LIVE. 
          BUT I WOULD ALSO COMMENT THAT IT, IT IS NOT A MISUSE TO SAY THAT, UH, THAT YOUR GAP IS, IS INDICATIVE OF THOSE THAT ARE OVERBURDENED. 
          SO YES, THEY HAVE A PLACE TO STAY, UM, BUT THEY ARE AT HIGHER RISK OF, OF LOSING THEIR PLACE TO STAY OF, OF LOSING HOUSING ALTOGETHER. 
          UM, SO IF, IF THE GOAL IS TO ADDRESS AFFORDABILITY, THAT THAT CERTAINLY IS A SOLID NUMBER TO USE IN TERMS OF YOUR GAP. 
          UM, THE OTHER PART KIND OF JUST COMES DOWN TO IF, IF YOU WANT TO GROW AND HOW MUCH YOU WANT TO GROW BY, UM, IF YOU'RE EXPECTING ADDITIONAL COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT OR EMPLOYMENT TO COME IN, UM, AND MAYBE STARTING FROM THAT POINT IS, IS HOW MANY, HOW MUCH MORE EMPLOYMENT ARE WE GONNA GROW BY? AND, AND WHAT THIS, THIS COULD, THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE, UH, WE DID A SURVEY BACK IN 2020 THAT WHERE WE DID SURVEY EMPLOYEES THAT LIVED OUTSIDE OF THE TOWN AND TO GET THEIR PREFERENCES ON IF THEY, IF THEY COULD LIVE HERE, WHAT ARE THE BARRIERS TO THAT? SO MAYBE UPDATING A SURVEY LIKE THAT TO SEE HOW MANY OF YOUR EMPLOYEES WOULD LOVE, WOULD LIKE TO LIVE IN SEDONA AND CAN'T FIND A PLACE TO LIVE. 
          THAT, THAT COULD BE A GOOD STARTING POINT. 
          SO THE UPDATING THAT YOU JUST DID, I THOUGHT WAS GOING TO SHOW US WHERE THE HOLES WERE IN HOUSING AVAILABILITY, BUT IT ISN'T, IT'S ABOUT HOW EXPENSIVE HOUSING IS IN THIS COMMUNITY AND HOW MANY PEOPLE WHO HAVE HOUSING ARE COST BURDEN BY THE PRICE OF THE HOUSING. 
          YEAH. 
          IS THAT RIGHT? WELL, WITHIN THE FULL REPORT, THERE IS A, THERE IS AN EMPLOYMENT FORECAST THAT WAS PRODUCED BY LIGHT CAST, UM, WHICH SHOWED A, A FORECAST OF, OF POTENTIALLY AN ANOTHER 400 OR SO 400 PLUS EMPLOYEES OVER THE NEXT FIVE YEARS. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE ADDITIONAL ELEMENTS WITHIN THE REPORT. 
          IT IS NOT A FULL, UH, REDO OF, OF THE CO OF THE REPORT THAT WE DID IN 2020. 
          THIS IS MUCH MORE OF A MARKET UPDATE. 
          SO IT'S REALLY ABOUT HOW MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE HOUSING HAS BECOME IN OUR COMMUNITY IN THE LAST FEW YEARS SINCE 2020 THAT COMBINED WITH, UH, WHICH OF YOUR HOUSEHOLDS ARE FINDING IT UNAFFORDABLE TO LIVE IN THEIR CURRENT RESIDENCE? YES. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU, BRIAN. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          UM, THE VICE MAYOR JUST HIGHLIGHTED A DISCREPANCY THEN BETWEEN YOUR STUDY, AND I'M LOOKING ON PACK AT PAGE 26 WHERE IT SAYS THAT THERE IS A PROJECTION OF 1,609 NEW JOBS BY 2030 WITH 83% CONCENTRATED IN ACCOMMODATIONS AND FOOD SERVICES. 
          AND LIKE FOR THE LIFE OF ME, I CANNOT IMAGINE 1,609 NEW JOBS IN FOUR YEARS, YOUR NUMBER OF 400 ISH OR SOMETHING. 
          YEAH, I KIND OF GET THAT. 
          I MEAN, THERE'S THREE RESORT PROJECTS IN THE WORKS. 
          THERE'LL BE SOME JOBS FOR THOSE, ET CETERA. 
          YEAH. 
          SO HOW DO WE GET, WHAT DATA ARE WE SUPPOSED TO BE TRUSTING HERE OUT OF THESE DIFFERENT REPORTS WE'RE LOOKING AT? YES, THANK YOU. 
          AND SO YOU'LL, YOU'LL, AND YOU'LL SEE IN THE REPORT THAT, UH, WE DID NOT RELY UPON THE GROSS NUMBER THAT LIGHT CAST IS FORECASTING. 
          UM, SO WE, WE REPORT, UH, RAW DATA FROM A VENDOR THAT, YOU KNOW, WE, WE DON'T WANT TO, WE DON'T WANT TO ADJUST WHAT IS WHAT IS PRODUCED BY THEM. 
          SO, UH, LIGHT CAST IS A, IS A WORKFORCE AND EMPLOYMENT, UH, SOFTWARE, SOFTWARE AND, AND, UH, INFORMATION SERVICE. 
          UM, THEY'RE WELL RENOWNED. 
          AND SO WE, WE INCLUDE THAT DATA. 
          WHAT WE'RE MORE INTERESTED IN IS, LIKE YOU JUST SAID, THAT THE CONCENTRATION OR THE DISTRIBUTION OF THE TYPES OF JOBS IS WHERE WE LOOKED AT. 
          SO WE LOOKED AT THE CONCENTRATION OF JOBS, WHAT, WHAT 
          [00:40:01]
THOSE MEDIAN EARNINGS WOULD BE AND WHETHER THOSE, THOSE EMPLOYEES WOULD BE A LIKELY RENTER OR OWNER. 
          SO THAT'S, THAT'S HOW WE UTILIZE THE DATA. 
          SO, UM, AND WE'VE USED THIS IN OTHER COMMUNITIES WHERE, YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU CAN FORMULATE WHAT YOU BELIEVE YOUR EMPLOYMENT FORECAST WILL BE. 
          THE LIGHT CAST DATA, I BELIEVE IS INFORMATIVE IN TERMS OF THE DISTRIBUTION OF THE TYPES OF OCCUPATIONS AND INDUSTRIES THAT THEY'LL BE IN AND THE KIND OF, UH, THE KIND OF INCOME THAT THEY'LL HAVE. 
          OKAY. 
          AND THAT'S, THAT'S HOW WE UTILIZE THAT. 
          OKAY. 
          SO THANK YOU FOR THAT. 
          IN, WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT LOW INCOME RESIDENTS, DO YOU STRATIFY THAT BETWEEN ACTUALLY WORKING LOW INCOME VERSUS POSSIBLY RETIREES THAT ARE HERE, THEY'RE ON FIXED INCOME, THAT DOES LOOK RELATIVELY LOW THEN DOES THAT PLAY A PART IN ANY OF THIS? BECAUSE SOME OF THOSE FOLKS MIGHT WELL BE HOUSE RICH CASH POOR AND THEY'RE OKAY ACTUALLY. 
          WELL, HOW THE, THE CENSUS DOES NOT DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN A WORKER AND A NON WORKER MM-HMM . 
          BUT WHAT THEY ARE CALCULATING IS WHAT THEIR INCOME IS COMPARED TO THEIR HOUSING COSTS. 
          SO, OKAY. 
          EVEN IF THEY DIDN'T HAVE A MORTGAGE, YOU KNOW, THEY STILL HAVE PROPERTY TAXES AND UTILITIES AND, AND THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          SO IT IS A COMPARISON OF WHAT THEIR HOUSING COST IS TO WHAT THEIR INCOME IS. 
          SO THEY, THEY WOULD STILL BE CONSIDERED OVERBURDENED, UM, EVEN IF, YOU KNOW, EVEN IF THEY AREN'T WORKING ANYMORE. 
          OKAY. 
          NEXT QUESTION. 
          I DON'T KNOW WHO CAN ANSWER THIS, BUT THE STATE LEGISLATURE KILLED LITECH FOR THE CURRENT FISCAL YEAR. 
          I HAVE NO IDEA IF OR WHEN THAT'LL COME BACK. 
          SO AS OF, FOR INSTANCE, THE ST. 
          JOHN ANI PROPOSAL IS TALKING ABOUT 30% A MI, LITECH D, DOES THAT EVEN EXIST? LIKE HOW DOES THAT EVEN EXIST NOW? SO THAT WOULD PROBABLY BE A GREAT QUESTION TO ASK THEM TO CLARIFY IN THEIR MM-HMM . 
          APPLICATION. 
          MM-HMM . 
          OKAY. 
          UM, AND LIKE I SAID EARLIER, WE'VE JUST GOTTEN THAT APPLICATION OR BEGINNING THE REVIEW PROCESS. 
          OKAY. 
          AND LIKELY ASK, BECAUSE WHERE I'M GOING IS LIKE, YOU KNOW, THE VICE MAYOR STARTED POKING AT THE FACT THAT OVERALL WE NEED A HOUSING STRATEGY. 
          HOW MANY HOUSING UNITS DO WE NEED? WHAT TYPE, ET CETERA, ET CETERA. 
          THE ELLIOT P*****K REPORT TELLS ME THAT 50 K AND LESS INCOME, WE UN, UNLESS THERE'S SOME MIRACULOUS LITECH PROGRAM THAT JUST POPS UP OUTTA NOWHERE, WE HAVE NO BUSINESS TRYING TO FACILITATE HOUSING FOR 50 K AND UNDER FOLKS RIGHT NOW. 
          YEAH. 
          EVEN, EVEN WITH FUNDING, YOU, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE IN A COMPETITIVE PROCESS EVEN IF YOU WANTED IT. 
          MM-HMM . 
          YOU'RE IN A COMPETITIVE PROCESS ACROSS THE STATE. 
          10 PROJECTS, 15 PROJECTS ARE APPROVED EACH YEAR. 
          RIGHT. 
          UM, SO YES, THAT'S, THAT'S OUR FOCUS IS, AND, AND WE'RE DOING THESE STUDIES THROUGHOUT THE STATE AND, AND WE KEEP COMING BACK TO THAT. 
          THERE, THERE NEEDS TO, TO SUBSTANTIALLY ADDRESS THIS ISSUE. 
          THERE NEEDS TO BE A PRIVATE MARKET SOLUTION THAT DOES NOT NEED, DOES NOT NECESSARILY NEED ANY AMOUNT OF SUBSIDY OR, OR, OR FINANCIAL INCENTIVE TO GET THERE. 
          AND SO THAT'S OUR FOCUS IS WHAT, WHAT CAN THE MARKET PROVIDE AND, AND WHAT ARE WE DOING? DO YOU CONSIDER HOUSING ALTERNATIVES IN THE FORM OF OKAY, IF 50 K AND UNDER WE JUST CAN'T SUPPORT IN SEDONA, BUT CAMP VERDE CAN, SHOULD WE BE SPENDING DOLLARS ON FACILITATING THE EXPANSION OF THE VERDE SHUTTLE SO THAT IT'S NOT JUST A BUS THAT GOES BETWEEN HERE AND COTTONWOOD, BUT ALSO DOWN THROUGH THE VOC AND ON TO CAMP VERDE AND FACILITATES THE WORKFORCE NEEDS BY HAVING, UH, SOME MASS TRANSPORTATION THAT WAY, SOME TRANSIT. 
          IS THAT A BETTER, DOES THAT PLAY A PART IN YOUR THINKING AT ALL TO TALK ABOUT? YEAH. 
          YOU KNOW, OTHER THAN JUST IN SEDONA? WELL, IN, IN SEEING THE MAGNITUDE OF THE NEED, I WOULD SAY ALL SOLUTIONS SHOULD BE CONSIDERED. 
          SO, UM, LIKE I MENTIONED THAT EVEN IF YOU BUILT OUT THE SEDONA GATEWAY AREA, UM, WITH, WITH, UH, RENTAL UNITS OR, OR UNITS THAT WERE AFFORDABLE TO THE WORKFORCE, IT STILL IS NOT, IT'S NOT A, IT'S NOT COMPLETELY ADDRESSING YOUR NEEDS. 
          SO EVERYTHING IS, IS A SUBSET OF TRYING TO AGGREGATE THOSE TO A, TO A TO A A LARGER SOLUTION. 
          WHICH ONE OF THOSE COULD THAT, THAT CERTAINLY SHOULD BE AN OPPORTUNITY. 
          OKAY. 
          SO ANOTHER CONCLUSION, AT LEAST FOR ME, I THINK FROM YOUR, UH, REPORT, WHICH AGAIN WAS VERY HELPFUL, SO THANK YOU. 
          UM, AT CURRENT INTEREST RATE ENVIRONMENT, ONLY 1% OF THOSE WHO WOULD NEED HOUSING COULD AFFORD TO BUY SOMETHING AS OPPOSED TO RENT. 
          AND EVEN IN A MORE ATTRACTIVE INTEREST RATE ENVIRONMENT, THAT DOESN'T GET ANY BETTER THAN 5%. 
          SO GIVEN THAT, WOULDN'T YOUR ADVICE BE TO THE CITY COUNCIL? DON'T BE TRYING TO WORRY ABOUT OWNERSHIP HOUSING, LIKE IT'S SUCH A SMALL PIECE OF WHO ACTUALLY WOULD EVER BE ABLE TO AFFORD IT. 
          WHY, WHY WOULD WE, 
          [00:45:01]
WOULDN'T THAT JUST BE A STRATEGIC DISTRACTION FOR US? YES. 
          I, I MEAN, IF, IF AN OPPORTUNITY WERE TO COME, SO THERE, I MEAN THERE ARE SOME OWNERSHIP PROGRAMS LIKE A HABITAT FOR HUMANITY OR A CHICANOS LA CASA, BUT THE SCALE IS, IS SO SMALL MM-HMM . 
          YOU KNOW, WE'RE TALKING FOUR TO 10 UNITS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          SO I WOULDN'T, I WOULDN'T OUTRIGHT UH, IGNORE IT, BUT I WOULD NOT FOCUS ON IT 'CAUSE I, IT JUST DOES NOT, IT APPEARS THAT THE RENTAL SIDE IS, IS REALLY WHERE YOU'RE GONNA FIND THE SOLUTION. 
          OKAY. 
          I THINK THAT'S IT FOR ME FROM THE MOMENT. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          OKAY. 
          PETE, YOU HAD SOMETHING TO ASK? YEAH, YEAH, YEAH. 
          COUPLE, COUPLE. 
          THANKS MAYOR. 
          A COUPLE OF THINGS HERE. 
          MY, UH, CURRENT INTEREST IS ABOUT SORT OF LANGUAGE AND HOW WE'RE PRESENTING AND TALKING ABOUT THIS. 
          'CAUSE I THINK IT'S A REALLY KEY TO HOW IT'S BEING PERCEIVED BY MEMBERS OF OUR COMMUNITY AS WELL. 
          SO I JUST WAS DOING SOME CURRENT QUICK SEARCHING AND IF I TYPE INTO OUR DOCUMENT HERE, THE WORD AFFORDABLE, IT APPEARS 203 TIMES MARKET RATE IS 16 TIMES, SUBSIDIZED IS 16 TIMES AND ATTAINABLE, THIS NEW PHRASE IT'S IN THERE IS 12. 
          SO THAT'S INTERESTING AND IT KIND OF FEEDS INTO WHAT COUNCILOR FOLTZ WAS JUST TALKING ABOUT. 
          AND THEN I WANNA LINK THAT TO ON YOUR PAGE 3 92, WHERE YOU COMMENT IN HERE, AND I'LL READ THAT IT IS OUR OPINION THAT THE HOUSEHOLDS EARNING AT LEAST $50,000 CREATE THE HIGHEST OPPORTUNITY TO ADDRESS AFFORDABLE HOUSING SUPPLY IN A MEANINGFUL WAY DUE TO THE FACT THAT PRIVATE MARKET RATE DEVELOPMENT CAN SUPPLY AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR THESE RESIDENTS. 
          DO, DO YOU, I WANNA ASK YOU TO SORT OF COMMENT MORE IF YOU CAN ON THAT, BUT HOW I'M LINKING THESE IN MY BRAIN TODAY IS THAT, JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT I'M READING ALSO AT THE BOTTOM OF YOUR PAGE 1, 3 94 IN OUR PACKET, AFFORDABLE HOUSING DEFINED BY HUD HOUSING, WHICH THE OCCUPANT IS PAYING NO MORE THAN 30% OF GROSS INCOME ATTAINABLE HOUSING. 
          IS THAT STILL 30% MEASURE, BUT WITHIN A BOUNDED INCOME RANGE OF 80 TO 1:20 AM I. 
          SO AM I CORRECT IN THINKING THAT AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS PROBABLY MOSTLY, UH, I'M ASSUMING THAT THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THEORETICALLY, THAT ARE IN THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING SITUATION PROBLEM INCLUDES A BUNCH OF PEOPLE BELOW 80% A MI. 
          RIGHT? EVERYONE, EVERYONE THAT'S ATTAINABLE HOUSING IS ALSO AFFORDABLE HOUSING. 
          BUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS A BIGGER POOL. 
          RIGHT. 
          MOSTLY BECAUSE OF THE LOWER INCOME FOLKS. 
          BUT IT COULD BE THAT THERE'S SOMEONE MAKING A BIG INCOME WITH A STUPIDLY BIG MORTGAGE . 
          CORRECT. 
          COULD ALSO BE IN THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING NUMBERS IF WE WANNA TALK ABOUT THAT. 
          YES. 
          AND THEN THANK YOU FOR THAT, UH, CLARIFICATION. 
          'CAUSE THESE TERMS GET PUSHED AROUND A LOT AND I THINK WHEN SOMEONE SAYS AFFORDABLE HOUSING, THEY THINK GOVERNMENT SUBSIDIZED HOUSING, BUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING TO US IS, IS JUST THE BIG UMBRELLA OF PAYING NO MORE THAN 30% OF YOUR INCOME TOWARD HOUSING. 
          SO YEAH. 
          CAN, CAN I ASK THE AUDIENCE IF YOU HEARD THE WORD AFFORDABLE HOUSING? ARE YOU THINKING SUBSIDIZED HOUSING? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          SO IT WASN'T, I WOULD'VE EXPECTED MORE HANDS UP THAN THAT. 
          THAT WAS INTERESTING TO ME. 
          UM, YEAH. 
          AND ATTAINABLE HOUSING WAS INVENTED SO THAT PEOPLE WOULD STOP SAYING AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND, AND IT SOUNDED, IT JUST SOUNDED, IT JUST SOUNDS DIFFERENT AND BETTER. 
          UM, BUT ATTAINABLE HOUSING IS AT THIS RESTRICTED 80 TO ONE 20, AND IF YOU'RE AT THE ONE 50 ATTAINABLE RANGE YES. 
          ATTAINABLE AND WORKFORCE HOUSING WORKFORCE IS ALSO, WORKFORCE HOUSING IS ANOTHER 80 TO 120%. 
          SO YEAH, A LOT OF SEMANTICS THERE. 
          BUT WHAT WE'RE ALL WE'RE TRYING TO SAY IS WE'RE JUST LOOKING AT THE DEMOGRAPHICS OF THE POPULATION AND, AND THE EMPLOYEES, UM, PROFILING THEM AND, AND ASKING THE QUESTION, ARE THEY OVERBURDENED? MEANING DO THEY PAY MORE THAN 30%? AND THEN WHAT, WHAT CAN, WHAT CAN BE PRODUCED THAT CREATES AN AFFORDABLE SITUATION FOR THEM, WHICH INCLUDES MARKET RATE HOUSING. 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          SO THEN ANY MORE WORDS WOULD YOU LIKE TO GIVE ME ABOUT YOUR $50,000 INCOME AND THAT MARKET PRIVATE MARKET RATE DEVELOPMENT CAN SUPPLY HOUSING? RIGHT. 
          SO, AND THAT'S, IT'S KIND OF A COMMENT BACK TO WHAT, UH, COUNCILLOR FOLTZ SAID IS, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LIMITED AMOUNT OF DOLLARS FOR GOVERNMENT SUBSIDIZED TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT. 
          UM, WE'RE LOOKING AT WHERE THE PRIVATE MARKET IS. 
          AND SO WHEN YOU'RE AT 50 AND 60, YOU, YOU SAW IN, IN AN EARLIER SLIDE, YOU KNOW, THE AVERAGE ONE BEDROOM RENT IN, IN SEDONA IS ABOUT $1,700, WHICH IS A 60, A $68,000 SALARY WOULD BE NEEDED. 
          SO, UM, BUT THERE ARE ALSO ONE BEDROOM RENTS AROUND A THOUSAND DOLLARS AND 1100. 
          IT, IT RUNS, IT RUNS A RANGE. 
          SO AT $50,000 SALARY, UH, WE WOULD EXPECT A SMALLER 
          [00:50:01]
UNIT, MAYBE A STUDIO OR A ONE BEDROOM COULD POTENTIALLY COME IN AND PROVIDE A RENT THAT'S AFFORDABLE TO SOMEONE MAKING AT LEAST $50,000. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND THAT'S ALSO WHERE THE MOST DEVELOPMENT OPPORTUNITY IS, IS JUST FINDING A MARKET RATE DEVELOPER THAT CAN COME IN, PROVIDE THE RIGHT UNIT MIX. 
          AND WE'VE SEEN IN WHAT'S BEEN BUILT, PINION LOFTS WAS ABSORBED WITHIN SIX TO NINE MONTHS. 
          SO 45 UNITS JUST RIGHT THERE WITH NO INCREASE TO YOUR POPULATION. 
          SO YOU CAN SEE THAT THERE'S, THERE'S THIS, THERE IS THIS UNDERCURRENT OF TRYING TO FIND A, A PLACE THAT'S MORE AFFORDABLE, UM, AND, AND THE RENTAL SIDE, EVEN EVEN A MARKET RATE PROJECT COULD, COULD, COULD PROVIDE. 
          AND ONE OF THE, SO THANK YOU. 
          YOU ACTUALLY TOUCHED ON ONE OTHER THING I WANTED TO SAY IS THAT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT AVERAGES AND WHAT'S IN OUR MARKET, WHATNOT, IT'S KIND OF WHAT'S ALREADY HERE BUILT TO STANDARDS THAT WE'VE HAD FOR A LONG TIME. 
          AND ONE WAY TO MAKE HOUSING LESS EXPENSIVE IS DO LOWER SQUARE FOOT. 
          YES. 
          I'M ASSUMING OPINION LOSS IS GENERALLY SMALLER SQUARE FOOT THAN, I THINK THEY'RE ABOUT 800 TO 1200 SQUARE FEET SMALL. 
          YEAH, THEY'RE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE SMALLER. 
          AND THEN THAT MARKET PROJECT BY THE FIRE STATION, I THINK ARE 2000 SQUARE FEET AND ABOVE. 
          YEAH. 
          I THINK THEY'RE ABOUT 23 TO 25. 
          BUT DON'T QUOTE ME ON THAT. 
          AND, AND IS THAT A, IS THERE A, A TREND, I DON'T KNOW WHAT PEOPLE WHO ARE REALLY LOOKING FOR HOMES ARE IN THE MARKET TODAY, BUT I'M ASSUMING THIS IS A PROBLEM EVERYWHERE AND AND I DO THINK I'VE HEARD THAT SMALLER SQUARE FOOT IS SORT OF BECOMING TRENDY AGAIN,  OR, OR REQUIRED OR NECESSARY AND YEAH. 
          UH, WE'RE, I MEAN WE'RE SEEING IT ON THE HOME BUILDING SIDE AS, YOU KNOW, SMALLER SQUARE FOOTAGE, SMALLER HOMES FOR TO, TO TRY TO CREATE AFFORDABILITY WHILE ALSO YEAH. 
          PROVIDING THE DEVELOPER WITH THAT, WITH THAT MARGIN THAT THEY, THAT THEY REQUIRE. 
          BUT 800 TO 1200 SQUARE FEET IS ACTUALLY PROBABLY ON THE LARGER SIDE FOR 800 SQUARE FOOT FOR A ONE BEDROOM IS, I WOULD SAY PROBABLY ON THE LARGER SIDE. 
          AND WE ARE SEEING ALSO, UM, MARKET RATE APARTMENT DEVELOPERS TRYING TO COME IN BELOW WHAT THE CURRENT MARKET IS, AND THEY'RE DOING THAT WITH SMALLER SQUARE FOOT FOOT, SO MAYBE A 600 SQUARE FOOT ONE BEDROOM. 
          UM, AND THEN IF YOU, IF YOU CONSIDER STUDIOS, YOU KNOW, THOSE ARE IN THE, THE 400 TO 500 SQUARE FOOT RANGE. 
          OKAY. 
          SO THANK YOU FOR ALL THAT. 
          AND THAT'S VERY INTERESTING AND I THINK THAT THAT SHOULD BE ALSO AT THE TOP OF OUR MIND WITH THE A HUNDRED OTHER THINGS  IN THIS WHOLE PROCESS. 
          BUT I'LL GO BACK AND THEN ALSO MAKE THE COMMENT ABOUT LANGUAGE IS IMPORTANT. 
          ALTHOUGH THE POLL TODAY DIDN'T CONFIRM MY PREVIOUS BELIEFS ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING AS SUBSIDIZED HOUSING, YOU SAID THAT GENERALLY THAT'S WHAT PEOPLE SAID. 
          AND I THINK SO TOO, AND I THINK WE SHOULD BE VERY CAREFUL ABOUT THE LANGUAGE THAT WE'RE USING IN OUR REPORT SO THAT WE'RE NOT BIASING SORT OF THE OUTCOME HERE BY USING TERMS. THANK YOU. 
          IF I CAN, BEFORE YOU GO, UH, JUST TO TAG ONTO WHAT YOU SAID, PETE, CAN YOU CLARIFY FOR ME, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT SMALLER HOMES AND WE TALK ABOUT TINY HOMES, AND THERE'S, I WAS ALWAYS TOLD BACK A LONG TIME ALREADY, UH, TINY HOMES AREN'T REALLY COST, UH, UH, COST, UH, PROPERLY FOR PEOPLE BECAUSE THEY DON'T SHARE COMMON WALLS. 
          THEY DON'T SHARE COMMON, UH, UH, SEPTICS WHERE A FOURPLEX ACTUALLY MIGHT BE CHEAPER FOR PEOPLE TO LIVE IN AS OPPOSED TO FOUR TINY HOMES. 
          UH, IS THAT STILL THE, THE MINDSET? I WOULD, I WOULD HAVE TO GET YOU AN ANSWER ON THAT. 
          UM, I MEAN, UH, WHEN I THINK OF A TINY HOME, A LOT OF TINY HOMES ARE, ARE BUILT ON WHEELS, UH, ON A, ON A TRAILER, UM, YOU KNOW, A HUNDRED SQUARE FEET, 120 SQUARE FOOT, UM, TYPE OF TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT. 
          OR IT'S A SMALL MODULAR DEVELOPMENT THAT COULD BECOME A AN A DU OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          BUT, UM, YOUR, YOUR LOGIC SOUNDS, SOUNDS CORRECT. 
          IF YOU KNOW, SHARED, SHARED UTILITIES, UH, FI FINDING DENSITY IN A, IN A NON SUBDIVIDED PROPERTY IS, IS MOST LIKELY MORE COST EFFECTIVE FROM AN INFRASTRUCTURE STANDPOINT. 
          AND STEVE, JUST BEFORE YOU GO, THE COUNCIL SAW, I DON'T KNOW IF WE WERE, WE WEREN'T ALL THERE, BUT THERE WAS A HOUSING, UH, PROGRAM UP AT THE A PS CENTER, UH, A COUPLE OF WEEKS AGO. 
          AND THERE'S A DEVELOPER THERE WHO HAS A LITTLE BIT LARGER THAN TINY HOMES, QUITE KIND OF NICE LOOKING, BUT I LEARNED A LOT ABOUT THEM. 
          UH, BUT I'M STILL HAVE THE SAME MINDSET. 
          SO EVEN IF IT'S TINY, UH, OR LARGER THAN TINY, IT'S MAY NOT BE COST EFFECTIVE. 
          STEVE, YOU HAD SOMETHING TO CONTRIBUTE? UH, YES, MR. MAYOR. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UM, AS PART OF THIS PROCESS, WE HAVE BEEN, UH, TALKING WITH DEVELOPERS 
          [00:55:01]
IN ONE OF THE, UH, THINGS THAT CAME UP ARE THE EFFICIENCIES OF BUILDING A LARGER BUILDING WITH MORE UNITS IN THEM AS OPPOSED TO BUILDING THE SAME NUMBER OF UNITS SEPARATELY. 
          UH, MUCH MORE EFFICIENCIES. 
          YOU HAVE MUCH MORE SIDES OF THE BUILDING TO DEAL WITH THE, THE UTILITIES. 
          UH, THERE ARE A LOT OF EFFICIENCIES IN BUILDING, SAY, AN APARTMENT BUILDING RATHER THAN MANY SMALL, TINY HOMES. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          UH, BRIAN, THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          STAYING ON TINY HOMES FOR A SECOND. 
          ARE YOU ABLE TO COMMENT ON LIKE, WHAT, WHAT IS THE PRACTICAL REALITY OF PEOPLE SUCCESSFULLY LIVING IN TINY HOMES? BECAUSE OFTENTIMES IT'S BANTERED ABOUT OF, OH, LET'S JUST PUT A BUNCH OF TINY HOMES IN THERE. 
          BUT MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT IS NOT FOR EVERYBODY. 
          ARE YOU ABLE TO COMMENT ON THAT? UH, NO, I'M, I'M NOT ABLE, I, I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S ANY LITERATURE OR, OR ANYTHING OUT THERE ON THE, THE SUSTAINABILITY OF IT. 
          MM-HMM . 
          UM, IT, IT DOES SEEM TO BE A TREND BORN OUT OF THE AFFORDABILITY CRISIS, CERTAINLY. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, BEING ABLE TO PURCHASE SOMETHING FOR 30 TO $50,000 AND, AND HAVE THAT BE YOUR, YOUR YOUR HOME OR, OR VAN LIVING OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          IF YOU CAN FIND FOR 30 TO 50, LET US KNOW. 
          'CAUSE UH, THAT'S NOT WHAT I HEAR THEY'RE GOING FOR. 
          MY OTHER QUESTION FOR THE MOMENT, UH, ACTUALLY RELATES TO COUNCILOR FURMAN. 
          AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THAT COST BURDEN THRESHOLD OF 30% IN A MARKET AS EXPENSIVE AS SEDONA. 
          SHOULD WE, WHEN WE'RE PREPARING OUR OVERALL HOUSING STRATEGY THAT WE'RE GONNA BE WORKING ON NEXT MONTH, AS I UNDERSTAND, UM, SHOULD WE BE THINKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, MAYBE IT NEEDS TO BE 35% AS A REASONABLE THRESHOLD TO TARGET IN SEDONA OR 40% MAYBE, OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          IS THERE ANY LOGIC TO THAT? IS THAT HOLD ANY WATER? WELL, I, AGAIN, BECAUSE OF THE, UM, LACK OF, BECAUSE OF THE LACK OF OPTIONS IN THE SUBSIDIZED SPACE AND, AND IF YOU ARE LOOKING AT THE REALITIES OF LAND PRICES OF DEVELOPMENT COSTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, YOU KNOW, IT, IT IS SOMETHING, I MEAN, UM, YOU, YOU, YOU MIGHT WANT TO CHECK WITH, UM,  PROPERTY MANAGERS, WHAT, WHAT THEY ACTUALLY ACCEPT BECAUSE IT, YOU KNOW, IT'S AN INCOME BASED APPLICATION. 
          UM, THEY MAY, THEY MAY KIND OF, MAYBE THEY TICK UP INTO THE 35% RANGE, BUT I HAVEN'T HEARD OF ANYONE APPROVING SOMEONE TO LIVE IN AN APARTMENT FOR MUCH MORE THAN THAT. 
          SO, AND AGAIN, ALSO, YOU KNOW, APPLYING FOR A MORTGAGE, YOU KNOW, THERE'S, THERE'S THAT, PLUS YOU'VE GOT OTHER DEBTS, YOU KNOW, THE STUDENT LOAN DEBT AND CONSUMER DEBT AND THINGS LIKE ALL OF THAT KIND OF STACKS UP. 
          SO THERE, I THINK YOU 30% IS PROBABLY YOUR BEST BET. 
          35, I WOULD SAY WOULD BE MY RECOMMENDED MAXIMUM. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          PETE, DID YOU HAVE ANYTHING ELSE TO ADD? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          AND OH, YES, I'M SORRY IF I, GO AHEAD. 
          UH, SO STICKING WITH THAT FOR A MINUTE, IF THESE PEOPLE ARE ALREADY LIVING IN HOME OR APARTMENTS AND THEY WERE COST OVERBURDENED, THEN SOMEBODY DID ACCEPT THEM AT SOMETHING GREATER THAN 30%. 
          RIGHT? I MEAN, THEY'RE THERE. 
          SO I WOULD THINK THAT THAT MEANS IT'S HAPPENING SOMEHOW. 
          YEAH. 
          THAT THINGS ARE FLUID, BUT, BUT I, BUT I WANTED TO ASK A QUESTION OR I WANTED JUST PUT SOMETHING IN YOUR, IN YOUR HEAD. 
          I KNOW SEVERAL PEOPLE WHO OWN HOMES AND WHO ARE AGING AND THEY NO LONGER CAN REALLY MANAGE THE HOMES THAT THEY'RE IN, BUT THEY HAVE NOWHERE TO GO. 
          AND I DON'T WANT US TO FORGET, CONSIDERING THE DEMOGRAPHICS OF OUR COMMUNITY TO PUSH PEOPLE OUT OF OUR COMMUNITY BECAUSE WE CAN'T PROVIDE HOUSING FOR SENIORS WHO WANNA DOWNSIZE. 
          AND THERE'S A PROJECT IN FLAGSTAFF AND PROBABLY HAVE THE WAITING LIST IS FROM SEDONA. 
          WE DON'T WANT PEOPLE TO LEAVE SEDONA TO BE ABLE, YOU KNOW, TO, TO LIVE IN, IN A COMMUNITY. 
          WE WANT THEM TO BE ABLE TO STAY HERE AND LIVE IN OUR COMMUNITY, ESPECIALLY PEOPLE WHO'VE BEEN HERE FOR A LONG TIME. 
          SO YOU HAD, UH, ONE OF YOUR RECOMMENDATIONS WAS TO DEVELOP SENIOR LIVING OPTIONS? YES. 
          AND I, I DON'T SEE THAT, I DON'T THINK TWO STORY. 
          I MEAN, PEOPLE WANT ONE STORY WHEN THEY'RE, WHEN THEY'RE AGING AND THEY DON'T WANT A TOWNHOUSE WHERE THEY HAVE TO WALK UPSTAIRS. 
          SO I DIDN'T SEE ANY OF THAT REALLY IN THE PROPOSAL. 
          SO WHAT, UH, WHAT WAS, WE PROVIDED THE DRAFT OF THE REPORT AND IT, IT'S OUR UNDERSTANDING OR THE FEEDBACK THAT WE GOT WAS THAT THIS PARTICULAR WESTERN GATEWAY IS NOT, WOULD NOT BE TARGETED FOR ANY SORT 
          [01:00:01]
OF SENIOR LIVING, BUT BECAUSE THE, THERE'S A LARGER MASTER PLAN SURROUNDING THE, THE MEDICAL CENTER, AND CORRECT ME IF I'M, IF I'M WRONG, BUT THAT THERE WAS ADDITIONAL HOUSING BEING CONSIDERED THAT WOULD PROBABLY BE GEARED TOWARDS THE HOUSING. 
          I WAS AT THE MEETING WITH THE, WITH THE MEDICAL CENTER, AND THEY WERE NOT, THEY DID NOT COMMIT TO BUILDING SENIOR HOUSING. 
          SO THEY SAID THEY WERE LOOKING AT IT, IF ANYTHING THEY DID IT, IT WOULD BE 10 YEARS PLUS OUT. 
          BUT WE HAVE A PROGRAM RIGHT NOW THAT WE WANNA SERVE THE RESIDENTS OF OUR COMMUNITY, BOTH PEOPLE WHO WORK IN THIS COMMUNITY AND PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THIS COMMUNITY WHO WANNA REMAIN IN THIS COMMUNITY. 
          SO I THINK IT'S SHORTSIGHTED OF US NOT TO CONSIDER SENIOR LIVING OPTIONS. 
          OKAY. 
          CAN I JUST MAKE A COMMENT? UM, I THINK I'M REALLY ACTUALLY ENJOYING THIS CONVERSATION. 
          UM, BUT TO BRING IT BACK TO THE WESTERN GATEWAY, YOU KNOW, KEEPING IN MIND ONE OF THE FIRST SLIDES I SHOWED AS FAR AS WHERE WE ARE IN THE PROCESS, UM, THE DECISION OF WHETHER, YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW THE DECISION BE LIKE, DO WE PROPOSE HOUSING AT THE WESTERN GATEWAY? AND AS WE MOVE INTO THE IMPLEMENTATION PLAN, ASSUMING THE CITY DOES NOT, YOU KNOW, SELL THE PROPERTY UNTIL YOU FIND A DEVELOPMENT YOU LIKE, THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT IS, YOU PUT OUT, YOU KNOW, POTENTIALLY AN RFP FOR SOMETHING, IF THAT IS THE PREFERENCE OF THE COUNCIL. 
          IF THE MASTER PLAN PROVIDES ENOUGH FLEXIBILITY TO ALLOW FOR THAT, YOU MIGHT WAIT, UH, A SENIOR HOUSING PROJECT DIFFERENTLY THAN A DIFFERENT KIND OF PROJECT. 
          BUT, UM, IF AS LONG AS WE'RE, YOU KNOW, TALKING ABOUT TYING THIS BACK INTO THE MASTER PLAN, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD NEED TO HAVE SOME OF THAT FLEXIBILITY IN THE MASTER PLAN. 
          BUT I DON'T THINK THE MASTER PLAN IS GOING, PROBABLY NOT GOING TO SPECIFICALLY SAY, THIS IS SENIOR HOUSING, THIS IS THIS TYPE OF HOUSING, WE'RE LOOKING AT HOUSING, AND THEN HOW DO WE, YOU KNOW, DEVELOP THAT GOING FORWARD? YOU KNOW, WHAT, DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? I DON'T KNOW. 
          YEAH, IT MAKES TOTAL SENSE, BUT I HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. 
          BUT WE HAVE VISUALS, VISUALS THAT ARE BEING DISTRIBUTED OUT INTO THE COMMUNITY VISUALS THAT PEOPLE SAY, OH, THIS IS WHAT IT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE. 
          AND THERE, TO MY OPINION, THERE'S GAPS IN THOSE VISUALS. 
          SO I DON'T WANT PEOPLE TO THINK THAT THESE THOUGHTS ARE EX BEING EXCLUDED BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT SHOWING UP. 
          OKAY, I UNDERSTAND. 
          GOTCHA. 
          MELISSA. 
          THANK YOU, MR. MAYOR. 
          UM, WHEN YOU TALK, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT BEING COST OVERBURDENED, UM, AND 30%, ARE YOU ACTUALLY ONLY LOOKING AT THE RENTAL PRICE ITSELF TO BEING OVERBURDENED? UH, YEAH. 
          SO THE CENSUS DEFINES IF YOU'RE A RENTER, IT'S THE, IT'S YOUR RENT PLUS UTILITIES. 
          IF YOU'RE AN OWNER, IT IS JUST STOP RIGHT THERE, OKAY? MM-HMM . 
          IT'S THE PLUS UTILITIES. 
          CORRECT. 
          SO WE NEED TO REMEMBER WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THE COST OF UTILITIES CURRENTLY IN OUR COMMUNITY, ELECTRICITY AND WATER. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, MY GAS BILL IS THE ONLY ONE THAT DOESN'T SEEM TO HAVE CHANGED, AND I'M SURE I JUST JINXED IT BY HAVING MENTIONED THAT . 
          BUT, UM, WHEN, WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THAT, ONE OF THE THINGS WE HAVE TO REMEMBER IS EVEN IF THE RENTS DON'T GO UP, ALL THE UTILITIES ARE GOING UP. 
          AND SO WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT WHEN WE'RE THINKING ABOUT BEING COST OVERBURDENED. 
          IS THAT, THAT'S EX THAT COULD END UP BEING MORE THAN THE RENTAL COST OF THE UNIT IS THE UTILITY. 
          SO I KNEW YOU WERE GONNA SAY PLUS UTILITIES. 
          SO I WANTED YOU TO SAY THAT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE ALL AWARE OF THE FACT THAT, UM, WE ARE NOT REALLY JUST INCLUDING THE COST OF THE RENTAL, THE RENT ITSELF, BUT THOSE OTHER PIECES THAT WE'RE ALL SORT OF EXPERIENCING A LITTLE BIT OF COST OVERBURDEN RIGHT NOW. 
          UM, AND, UH, FEELING I THINK A LITTLE HELPLESS ABOUT HOW TO FIX THAT. 
          UM, BUT MAYBE THAT'S JUST ME. 
          UM, SO THE OTHER THING THAT I JUST WANTED TO MENTION WHAT YOU JUST SAID, KIRI, I'M, NOW I'M A LITTLE CONFUSED, QUITE HONESTLY, WHY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT 430 UNITS WHEN ALL WE WANT IS A YES OR NO ANSWER ON WHETHER OR NOT THERE SHOULD BE HOUSING? WHY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT THE TYPE OF HOUSING? WHY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT THE DENSITY OF THE HOUSING? IF ALL YOU WANNA KNOW IS WHETHER OR NOT WE THINK THERE SHOULD BE HOUSING, I'M SORRY IF THAT CAME ACROSS THE, THE, AGAIN, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE TOTAL NUMBER OF UNITS, BUT WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE AND HOW, YOU KNOW, WHAT DENSITIES, AND WE'LL GET INTO SOME OF THAT AND THE FOLLOWING SLIDES. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT THAT, THAT, THAT THESE PLAY TOGETHER, RIGHT? SO, YOU KNOW, IF, IF AS THE VICE MAYOR SAID, UM, WE'RE GONNA DO SOMETHING FOR SENIORS, UM, THAT HAS TO BE ONE FLOOR, WELL, THEN YOU'RE GONNA REDUCE DENSITY BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT MAKING 
          [01:05:01]
A TWO OR THREE STORY APARTMENT COMPLEX, RIGHT? SO THAT, THAT ALL COMES INTO PLAY HERE. 
          AND IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT BIGGER SQUARE FOOTAGE THAT WE WOULD LIKE, MAYBE THAT'S TOWN HOMES, THAT'S GONNA CHANGE THE DENSITY THAT WE HAVE. 
          SO IT JUST FEELS LIKE TALKING ABOUT WHO WE WANT TO HOUSE, THERE IS PART OF THIS CONVERSATION, I THINK, AT THIS EARLY LEVEL BECAUSE THAT'S GONNA IMPACT THE KIND OF DENSITY THAT WE'RE, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT OR ANTICIPATING. 
          MAYOR, CAN I ASK A CLARIFYING QUESTION ABOUT WHAT YOU JUST SAID? YES, I, AND I WAS GONNA ALSO SAY COUNSELOR. 
          SO MY MOM-IN-LAW LIVES DOWN IN PHOENIX IN A GRADUATED CARE COMMUNITY, IN A MULTI-STORY BUILDING, BUT IN A ONE LEVEL UNIT APARTMENT, YES. 
          BUT, BUT SOMEBODY HAS TO LIVE ABOVE AND WHO LIVES ABOVE? IF IT'S ALSO AN AGED PERSON, DO THEY HAVE TO CLIMB STAIRS TO GET THERE? ELEVATORS? SO, SO NOW WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WHAT ARE THE COSTS THAT ARE GONNA BE ASSOCIATED WITH THIS? AND DO WE WANNA REDUCE THE DENSITY BECAUSE THE COSTS MAY GO UP AND I REALIZE THAT GETS INTO YOUR IMPLEMENTATION PHASE, AND THAT'S WHERE YOU WERE GOING AND I WAS TRYING NOT TO GET THERE. 
          SO I'M SORRY, . 
          SO, SO YES, I, I DID HAVE THAT IN MIND, BUT IT'S A DIFFERENT PROBLEM I THINK. 
          SURE. 
          SO I, I AM LOOKING AT ALSO, UH, ELDER CARE ASSISTED I, TO ME, I THINK THAT THIS AREA, IF WE WERE TO DIVE A LITTLE BIT DOWN, AND I, I AGREE WITH YOU, WE SHOULDN'T BE LOOKING AT ANY TYPE SPECIFIC TYPE OF HOUSING. 
          IT'S HOUSING, BUT WE WANT, DON'T WANNA FORGET ABOUT CHILDREN, FAMILIES, BECAUSE NOT JUST, AND I'M NOT TRYING TO EXCLUDE WORKERS, BUT HOPEFULLY WE CAN BRING WORKERS AND THEIR FAMILIES SO THAT THEY CAN GO INTO OUR SCHOOLS. 
          AND I KNOW THAT THIS COUNCIL IS VERY UNDERSTANDING OF THAT TOO, BUT I JUST WANT, UH, YOU KNOW, THE CONSULTANT TO UNDERSTAND, DANNY, TO UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S REALLY MIXED USE AND WHATEVER, UH, THAT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE WE CAN DECIDE IN THE FUTURE. 
          YEAH. 
          AGAIN, I THINK THIS IS ABOUT THE WHO, RIGHT? RIGHT. 
          THE WHO IS FAMILIES WHO, WHO ARE WE LOOKING AT OR THAT'S GONNA D DETERMINE INCOME LEVELS, THAT'S GONNA DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT YOU HAVE FAMILIES THAT ARE COMING IN. 
          I MEAN, TO ME, THAT'S PART OF IT. 
          AND THAT'S GONNA ALSO DICTATE DENSITY, RIGHT? I MEAN, IF YOU BRING A FAMILY AND YOU'RE NOT PUTTING A FAMILY IN A ONE BEDROOM APARTMENT, AT LEAST I HOPE SO. 
          OR TINY HOME. 
          SO YEAH, A TINY HOME IS DEFINED AS 400 SQUARE FEET FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO DON'T KNOW. 
          SO THAT'S LIKE REALLY TINY. 
          UM, SO YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S, I I WOULD LOVE TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION IF THAT'S THE CONVERSATION THAT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TODAY INSTEAD OF JUST, YES, WE WANT HOUSING. 
          SO I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY. 
          THANK YOU, CARRIE. 
          OKAY. 
          CAN WE MOVE ON? GO AHEAD, DANNY, UNLESS YOU'RE DONE. 
          NO, I DIDN'T. 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          NO OTHER COMMENT. 
          ALRIGHT, STEVE, CARRIE, SO NO OTHER QUESTIONS ABOUT HOUSING. 
          WE'RE GONNA MOVE ON QUICKLY. 
          OKAY. 
          BEFORE YOU CHANGE YOUR MIND. 
          UM, OKAY. 
          SO I JUST HAVE A COUPLE MORE BACKGROUND SLIDES BEFORE WE GET INTO THE CURRENT DRAFT OF THE PLAN. 
          UM, AND SO AS PART OF THE INITIAL PHASES OF THIS PROCESS, WE DID SOME FAIRLY HIGH LEVEL SITE ANALYSIS. 
          UM, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS LOOKED AT WAS SLOPE. 
          UM, JUST FOR YOUR INFORMATION ON THIS MAP, GREEN IS STEEP AND YELLOW IS FLATTER. 
          SO GREEN IS BAD FOR DEVELOPMENT AND YELLOW IS GOOD. 
          SO IN CASE REVERSE OF WHAT WE WOULD DO. 
          YEAH. 
          SO JUST, YEAH, PUTTING THAT OUT THERE. 
          UM, OBVIOUSLY BUILDING ON FLATTER AREAS IS MORE COST EFFECTIVE. 
          AND SO WE MAPPED OUT, YOU KNOW, WHERE ARE THE FLAT AREAS OF THE SITE, WHERE ARE THE STEEP AREAS OF THE SITE. 
          WE ALSO LOOKED AT ELEVATIONS, UM, THROUGHOUT THE SITE. 
          THERE IS ABOUT A HUNDRED FOOT ELEVATION DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE HIGH POINT AND THE LOW POINT. 
          UM, WITH 89 A BEING ABOUT IN THE MIDDLE. 
          SO THE NORTHWEST CORNER OF THE PROPERTY, UM, IS, IS THE LOW POINT. 
          AND THEN YOU ACTUALLY HAVE A KIND OF A HIGH POINT BETWEEN THE, THAT PIECE OF THE PROPERTY AND THE ROAD. 
          BUT THERE'S, THERE'S A FAIRLY GOOD, UM, YEAH, HEIGHT, ELEVATION DIFFERENCE WITH THE IDEA BEING THAT IF WE ARE GOING TO, YOU KNOW, BUILDINGS THAT ARE TALLER BUT PLACED AT A LOWER ELEVATION MAY BE LESS VISIBLE. 
          AND SO WHERE SHOULD, IF WE'RE GOING TO PROPOSE HEIGHT, WHERE WOULD IT BE POTENTIALLY APPROPRIATE TO GO AND THEN, UM, CIRCULATION, BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO GET AROUND THE SITE. 
          UM, WE HAVE KIND OF SOME SET PARAMETERS WHERE WE HAVE A LIGHT AT CULTURAL PARK PLACE. 
          WE HAVE A SECONDARY ACCESS, UM, FURTHER WEST, UH, WEST OF THE COLLEGE. 
          AND THEN WE HAVE A 
          [01:10:01]
REQUIRED EASEMENT THAT WE HAVE TO MAINTAIN OUT TO THE FOREST SERVICE TRAILS FROM THE LIGHT OUT. 
          AND SO WITH THAT, UM, WITH THE AMPHITHEATER THAT WAS THERE, THERE WERE ALREADY SOME ROADS THAT WERE CUT IN. 
          WE NEED TO, UH, PARTIAL PORTION OF OUR ROAD IS ACTUALLY ON THE FOREST SERVICE PROPERTY THAT WE DO NEED TO MOVE ONTO OUR PROPERTY. 
          AND WHAT DOES CIRCULATION LOOK LIKE? SO THIS IS A VERY SIMPLISTIC CIRCULATION, UM, KIND OF PLAN. 
          AND SO WITH, ONCE WE KIND OF LAYERED ALL OF THOSE ON TOP OF EACH OTHER, WE GOT THE FRAMEWORK PLAN. 
          AND THIS DOES NOT PROPOSE ANY USES, BUT IT PROPOSES, IT SHOWS WHERE BUILDINGS COULD POTENTIALLY BE LOCATED AND THE POTENTIAL HEIGHTS OF EACH OF THOSE BUILDINGS IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT TRYING TO MINIMIZE THE VISUAL IMPACT. 
          AND STEVE WAS GOING TO TOUCH A LITTLE BIT ON SOME OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT HE'S BEEN WORKING ON WITH THIS. 
          THANK YOU CARRIE. 
          UH, MAYOR, VICE MAYOR AND COUNCIL. 
          UM, WE, UH, THROUGHOUT OUR, OUR, UM, PUBLIC OUTREACH, UH, WE DID HEAR FROM CERTAIN PEOPLE, CERTAIN GROUPS THAT, UH, THEY HAD CONCERNS ABOUT THE BUILD BUILDABILITY OF, UM, THIS LAND. 
          AND, UH, SO, UH, WE DID HIRE AN ENGINEERING FIRM, UH, TO DO SOME BORINGS OUT THERE. 
          UH, THE BORINGS ARE SPREAD OUT THROUGHOUT THE SITE. 
          AND, UM, OF THE EIGHT BORINGS THAT WE DID, WE FOUND AN AVERAGE BETWEEN FOUR AND A HALF TO FIVE FOOT DEPTH BEFORE THE AUGER STOPPED AT ROCK. 
          SO, UM, WHETHER IT'S, UH, YOU'RE LOOKING AT MEANS OR, UH, WHAT KIND OF AVERAGE YOU'RE LOOKING AT, IT CAME OUT BETWEEN FOUR AND A HALF TO FIVE. 
          WE HAVE ONE SIDE AT ONE FOOT, AND, UH, THE ANOTHER SIDE AT 13. 
          SO 13 FEET BEFORE WE HAD, UM, UH, THE AUGER REFUSAL. 
          SO BOTTOM LINE. 
          OH, CAN, CAN YOU TELL ME THE IMPLICA IMPLICATIONS OF THAT TO ME? YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHAT I WAS GOING NON BUILDER. 
          OKAY. 
          . 
          SO BOTTOM LINE IS, UM, THE SITE IS NO DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WE TYPICALLY HAVE THROUGHOUT SEDONA. 
          UM, THERE IS AN AREA THAT AT ONE FOOT OF, OF AUGER REFUSAL DEPTH, YES, IT WOULD BE TOUGHER TO BUILD THERE. 
          UM, WE CAN, OUR FROST DEPTH REQUIREMENT IS ONE FOOT, SO WE CAN PUT FOOTINGS AT ONE FOOT. 
          UM, AS, UH, SOME, SOME OF OUR LARGER CONCERNS BEYOND THE FOOTINGS MAY BE OUR UTILITIES, BUT THE UTILITIES ARE TYPICALLY GONNA RUN, UH, THROUGH THE ROADS. 
          UH, BASED UPON OUR BORINGS. 
          UH, WE'RE LOOKING AT, UH, AN AAV AN AVERAGE OF, LIKE I SAID, FOUR AND A HALF TO FIVE FEET OF DEPTH. 
          SO IT IS NOT AS VITAL A CONCERN, AT LEAST BASED UPON THE INFORMATION THAT WE HAVE AT THIS MOMENT. 
          WE HAVE NOT RECEIVED THE FULL REPORT YET. 
          UM, I JUST GOT THE AUGER DEPTH, UH, UH, UM, RATINGS, UH, THIS WEEK. 
          UM, THE FULL REPORT IS EXPECT EXPECTED IN ABOUT TWO WEEKS. 
          SO KATHY, CAN YOU JUST INDICATE WHERE ON THE PROPERTY ROUGHLY THOSE THE 13 WOULD BE AND THE ONE WOULD BE JUST SO YEAH, POINTER TO THE, THE MOUSE. 
          OH, DOES IT SHOW UP? YEAH. 
          YEAH. 
          THERE WE GO. 
          MAGIC. 
          I, I'M NOT GOOD AT THIS STUFF. 
          SO, UM, THE VERY WORST WAS RIGHT IN THIS LOCATION HERE. 
          SO IN THE AREA OF OUR PUBLIC AMENITIES, UM, WE HAD THAT ONE FOOT. 
          WHERE WERE WE LOOKING TO PUT, OR I SHOULDN'T SAY THAT. 
          UM, WHERE THE PLAN SHOWS A, UH, AN OPTION OF UP TO FOUR STORIES THAT RIGHT ABOUT THIS LOCATION IS WHERE THAT 13 FOOT DEPTH WAS. 
          THE REST OF THE PROPERTY, UH, PRETTY MUCH AVERAGED THREE TO SIX FEET. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OF AUGER DEPTH. 
          THAT'S HELPFUL. 
          DO YOU KNOW OFFHAND THE FOOT OR DEPTHS OF SOME OF THESE, LIKE THE PRO THE HOUSING PROJECT THAT'S GONNA BE ABOVE CYCLE, PLANT, THE HOUSE, THE FOOT OR DEPTH OF, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE ONE OF THE NEWER HOTELS THAT ARE BUILT OR PIN LOFTS? YES. 
          SO TYPICALLY THANK YOU COUNSELOR. 
          UH, TYPICALLY ONE AND A HALF FOOT TO TWO FEET BELOW GRADE. 
          DEREK, YOU SAID THERE WERE EIGHT BORINGS. 
          EIGHT BORINGS, YES SIR. 
          IS THAT TYPICAL FOR A SITE OF THIS SIZE? IT'S TYPICAL FOR THIS PART OF THE PROCESS. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, IF, IF, UH, WE 
          [01:15:01]
WERE TO GET A DEVELOPER TO BUILD, UH, THEY MIGHT WANT TO HAVE ANOTHER ONE OR TWO BORINGS, UH, ON THEIR SITE JUST TO DOUBLE CHECK, UH, TO MAKE SURE. 
          'CAUSE YOU COULD GET A VEIN OF ROCK COMING IN, YOU COULD GET A VEIN OF REALLY GOOD SOIL THAT YOU DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT AS WELL. 
          SO, UM, AT THIS POINT OF THE PROCESS, YEAH, I THINK THIS IS A PRETTY GOOD SELECTION, UH, FOR THIS PROPERTY. 
          OKAY. 
          I'M JUST THINKING ABOUT LAST YEAR TRYING TO PLANT A TREE AND HAD TO DIG ABOUT 14 TEST HOLES BEFORE I FOUND ANYTHING THAT WASN'T FULL OF ROCKS. 
          SO YES, I, YOU KNOW, I ADMIT, AND THAT'S WHY I SAY, UH, AT THIS POINT IN THE PROCESS, UH, I DO ADMIT, UM, UH, LAND YOU, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT, UH, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S TRANSPIRED OVER THE LAST MILLION YEARS AND HOW IT CAME TO BE SO YOU DON'T, UM, BUT, UH, I WAS VERY ENCOURAGED, UM, BY WHAT WE FOUND IN, IN THESE INITIAL BORING TESTS, STEVE, AND THESE ARE JUST CONCEPTS HERE I UNDERSTAND. 
          BUT, UH, WHAT IS THE HEIGHT OF THE CURRENT, UH, VENUE THAT'S THERE NOW? UH, THE AMPHITHEATER IS, UH, IT'S CLOSE TO 60 FOOT IN HEIGHT, WHICH, WHICH WOULD GIVE HOW MANY STORIES IF IT WAS TO BE A RIGHT THERE. 
          IT, SO, UH, YOU'RE, YOU'RE LOOKING AT ABOUT, UH, UH, 11 FEET PER STORY, GIVE OR TAKE. 
          UM, SO YOU'RE LOOKING AT ABOUT A FIVE, A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN FIVE STORY BUILDING. 
          AND AM I RIGHT IN THINKING THAT THE TOP OF THAT STATE, THE OVERHANG, IT DOES NOT REALLY, IT'S NOT REALLY SHOWN OR SEEN FROM 89 A, IT'S BELOW THE ROAD OF 89 A YES. 
          UM, OUR CONSULTANTS HAVE DONE SOME, UH, ELEVATION SCANS, UM, AND UH, I THINK, UH, UH, THAT IT'S IN YOUR PACKET AS WELL, THAT WHEN YOU, UH, BEYOND THE AMPHITHEATER ITSELF, YES. 
          IT'S, IT, I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW THAT WAS THERE FOR THE FIRST COUPLE YEARS I WAS HERE 'CAUSE I DRIVE PAST IT AND YOU DON'T SEE IT. 
          BUT, UM, OUR ELEVATION DRAWINGS ALSO SHOW, UH, HOW, UH, YOU'LL HAVE VERY LITTLE CHANCE TO SEE IF ANY TO SEE A FOUR STORY BUILDING IN THAT NORTHWEST CORNER. 
          AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS ASKING FROM 80 98, ASSUMING THAT WE GO WITH THE FOUR STORY BUILDING THERE, IT WOULD NOT, YOU WOULDN'T SEE IT AT ALL. 
          UH, FROM 89 A RIGHT. 
          FROM 89 A RIGHT. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          COULD YOU USE YOUR MAGIC MOUSE TO SHOW US WHERE THE APPROXIMATE LOCATION OF THE ART, THE AMPHITHEATER ARCH? THE BIG, THE BIG TALL THING IS? YES. 
          SO IT'S APPROXIMATELY IN THIS AREA RIGHT HERE. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          AND, OKAY, GO AHEAD. 
          CHASSIE. 
          UH, I'M GOING BACK. 
          WHAT IS THE, THE TWO SLIDES BACK WHEN IT SAYS 50 FEET BELOW HIGHWAY, THAT'S UP AT, ON THE OTHER SLIDE, I'M CROSS REFERENCING THESE SLIDES WOULD BE THE FOUR STORY AREA, BUT THAT WHERE THE AMPHITHEATER IS NOW, THAT'S 50 FEET BELOW HIGHWAY, THAT'S THE VIEW. 
          WHAT WOULD THAT ELEVATION BE ROUGHLY? UM, I THINK THAT'S ABOUT 10 FEET HIGHER THAN 10 TO 20 FEET HIGHER THAN THE, SO YOU'RE 30 TO 40 FEET STILL LOWER THAN THE ROAD AT THAT POINT. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU TO THE STAGE LEVEL. 
          OKAY, PETE, A COUPLE QUESTIONS. 
          CAN YOU, UH, SHIFT BACK TO YOUR CHALLENGING THE CHALLENGES SLIDE? THAT'S ALL SLOPE? YES. 
          SO THE, AND WE TALKED ABOUT ROCK DEPTH, WHICH IS A CHALLENGE, IS WHAT'S THE BIGGER CHALLENGE SLOPE OR ROCK DEPTH, I SUPPOSE THAT'S A DIFFICULT QUESTION TO ANSWER, BUT, AND THEN ARE THERE OTHER CHALLENGES THAT WE'VE THOUGHT ABOUT? UH, THANK YOU COUNSELORS. 
          SO, UM, MUCH OF THE CHALLENGE IS BASED UPON THE DESIGN OF THE BUILDING. 
          UM, WE CAN EASILY BUILD BUILDINGS THAT FIT WITHIN THE SLOPES AND, UM, THAT DESIGN MAY TAKE AWAY SOME OF THE UNITS, BUT IT ALLOWS YOU TO HAVE, UH, A BUILDING IN AN AREA THAT MAYBE YOU, YOU KNOW, IT, IT COST WISE, IT MIGHT MIGHT'VE BEEN HARDER TO, TO GO DOWN. 
          SO, UM, ROCK TYPICALLY AROUND HERE. 
          UM, YES, THERE IS A, A, AN EXTRA COST, UM, BUT IT'S, IT'S NOT STOPPED ANYONE FROM BUILDING. 
          LET ME ASK A ANOTHER QUESTION. 
          WHERE'S THE OLD DUMP ? IS THAT IN OUR PROPERTY? IS IT HERE OR IN THIS PROPERTY? NO, IT'S, IT'S WITHIN THE FOREST SERVICE. 
          IT'S WITHIN THE FOREST SERVICE. 
          MM-HMM . 
          SO IT'S, SO IF WE GO BACK HERE, SO I MEAN, I THINK, SO THIS IS THE PARKING AREA, RIGHT? UM, AND JUST I THINK SOME COMMENTS HAVE SAID THAT WE SHOULD BE SHOWING WHAT 
          [01:20:01]
THE FOREST SERVICE HAS PLANNED. 
          I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY. 
          THE FOREST SERVICE HAS TOLD US TO NOT SHOW WHAT THEY HAVE PLANNED , SO WE WILL NOT BE SHOWING, BUT, UM, THAT IS THE LARGE, YOU KNOW, FLAT AREA OUT THERE. 
          UM, THE CURRENT RAMADA IS RIGHT AT THIS POINT RIGHT HERE. 
          SO A, A DUMP COULD BE A CHALLENGING BUILD SITE AS WELL. 
          IT'S NOT HERE. 
          OTHER POLLUTION THINGS COULD BE CHALLENGING, BUT WE'RE NOT AWARE OF ANY. 
          YES. 
          UM, AS FAR AS WE UNDERSTAND, UM, THE ONLY, UH, DISTURBANCE, UH, HAS BEEN FOR THE, THE AUDIT, UH, THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          THANK YOU VICE MAYOR. 
          WE'RE ON THE SUBJECT OF DISTURBANCE. 
          UH, THERE'S BEEN SOME, UH, ALLEGATIONS THAT THE, THAT THE LAND, THAT THERE'S A, THAT DURING THE, THE TIME THAT THE FOREST SERVICE PROVIDED THIS LAND IN A TRADE, THERE WERE SOME RESTRICTIONS ON THE LAND THAT HAD TO DO WITH NATIVE ARTIFACTS. 
          THANK YOU. 
           NATIVE ARTIFACTS. 
          UM, AND WELL, KURT IS NOT HERE. 
          UM, HE, HE, UM, WE'VE TALKED WITH HIM ABOUT IT. 
          UM, THERE WAS A LOT OF DISCUSSIONS ABOUT SOME OF THE ORIGINAL TRADE LANGUAGE WHEN WE PURCHASED THE PROPERTY THAT THERE ARE NO RESTRICTIONS FOR DEVELOPMENT. 
          UM, I THINK KEEGAN HAS AND OR LAURA INHABIT ATTEMPTED TO SET UP MEETINGS ONSITE WITH THE YAVAPAI APACHE TRIBE. 
          AND, UM, WE'VE HAD TO RESCHEDULE THAT A COUPLE TIMES, SO WE HAVEN'T HAD THAT MEETING YET, BUT I THINK THEY'RE STILL WORKING ON THAT. 
          IF, IF I COULD ADD TO THAT AS WELL. 
          UM, ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT WE HEARD WAS THAT WHEN, UH, THE CITY ACQUIRED THAT LAND FROM THE FOREST SERVICE, THAT WE WERE SUPPOSED TO KEEP IT AS OPEN SPACE OR FOR, UH, PUBLIC, UH, AMENITIES, UH, AND THE ARTS. 
          AND, UH, THAT ALSO WAS FOUND, UH, THROUGH LEGAL, UH, NOT TO BE, UH, EITHER TRUE OR EXISTING AT THIS POINT. 
          OKAY, THANK YOU FOR THAT CLARIFICATION. 
          YES, DEREK, HAVE WE DONE AN ARCHEOLOGICAL SURVEY OR WILL WE, OR DO WE NEED TO DO WE NEED TO, IT'S NOT LEGALLY REQUIRED FOR DEVELOPMENT, BUT UM, LIKE I SAID, HE WE'RE ATTEMPTING TO SET UP A MEETING WITH THE YAVAPAI APACHE TRIBE AND WE WOULD BE WORKING WITH THEM IF THEY HAVE SOME DESIRES. 
          AND ANNETTE IS GOING TO SPEAK. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UM, MAYOR, COUNSEL, I'M LOOKING FOR THE EMAIL AND AS SOON AS I FIND IT, I CAN FORWARD IT TO YOU. 
          BUT, UM, WHAT I WAS TOLD BY THE FOREST SERVICE IS THAT, UM, AT THE TIME OF THE TRANSFER TO THE NONPROFIT FOR THE AMPHITHEATER BACK IN THE DAY, UM, THE SITE WAS CLEARED, YOU KNOW, REGARDING CULTURAL ARTIFACTS, ARCHEOLOGICAL ARTIFACTS, ALL OF THAT WORK WAS DONE BACK THEN. 
          UM, AND I WAS LATER, OR, AND I WAS ALSO INFORMED THAT WHEN THE BANK TOOK OWNERSHIP OF THE PROPERTY, THEY WENT THROUGH A PROCESS TO CLEAR THE TITLE OF ALL THE RESTRICTIONS. 
          UM, AND SO THE FOREST SERVICE RECORD SHOWS THAT THERE ARE NO RESTRICTIONS NOW. 
          UM, AND THERE ARE NO CULTURAL ARTIFACTS TO BE ADDRESSED THAT THAT HAD ALREADY BEEN ADDRESSED BACK WHEN THE, UM, TRANSFER HAPPENED. 
          SO FROM THEIR PERSPECTIVE, WE DON'T NEED TO DO A FURTHER PROCESS. 
          HOWEVER, FROM A COMMUNITY PERSPECTIVE AND OUT OF RESPECT FOR THE NATION, THAT IS WHY WE HAVE REACHED OUT TO THE YAVAPAI APACHE NATION AND THE HOPI, UM, TO HAVE A CONSULTATION WITH THEM ABOUT THE, UM, SIGNIFICANCE OF THIS SITE TO THEIR HISTORY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY, BACK TO YOU. 
          OKAY, SO I JUST HAVE A COUPLE MORE SLIDES. 
          AND SO WITH ALL OF THAT BACKGROUND, THE CURRENT DRAFT OF THE PLAN SHOWS ABOUT 11 AND A HALF ACRES OF THE SITE, UM, BEING FOR A MIX OF HOUSING OPTIONS WITH A MAXIMUM, UM, OF 430 UNITS. 
          UM, THERE'S ABOUT FOUR ACRES OF A MIXED USE COMMERCIAL AREA. 
          WE HAVE ABOUT NINE AND A HALF ACRES SET ASIDE AS A COMMUNITY BENEFIT AREA, AND THAT COULD INCLUDE PARKS, SOME FESTIVAL SPACE, PERFORMANCE VENUE, A RECREATION CENTER, THERE'S SPACE FOR ALL OF THAT. 
          AGAIN, THIS PLAN DOESN'T COMMIT TO ANY SPECIFIC ITEM, BUT WE HAVE ABOUT NINE AND A HALF 
          [01:25:01]
ACRES SET ASIDE FOR COMMUNITY BENEFIT SPACE, ABOUT 10 AND A HALF ACRES IS NATURAL OPEN SPACE, AND THAT IS PRIMARILY THE STEEPER SLOPED AREAS OF THE SITE. 
          AND THEN WE HAVE JUST ABOUT SIX ACRES THAT WE WOULD NEED FOR RIGHT OF WAY AND INFRASTRUCTURE. 
          AND WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE ON THE PLAN IS THIS, UM, THE DARK GREEN IN THE UPPER RIGHT IS THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT BLOCK. 
          YOU HAVE THE PINK ALONG THE HIGHWAY BEING THE MIXED USE COMMERCIAL AREA, AND THEN YOU HAVE NATURAL OPEN SPACE HOUSING AND A NEIGHBORHOOD PARK, UM, AND THE INFRASTRUCTURE UTILITY SITES, UM, FILLING OUT THE REMAINDER OF THE SPACE. 
          AND WITH THAT, UM, IF THERE'S ANY QUESTION ABOUT THAT I CAN ANSWER, OTHERWISE WE'LL TURN IT OVER TO OUR CONSULTANTS FROM DIG TO GO A LITTLE BIT MORE INTO THE DETAILS OF THIS PLAN. 
          OKAY. 
          DON'T GO AWAY. 
          WE GOT PETE . 
          THANKS BARRY. 
          CARRIE, CAN YOU FLIP BACK ONE, SO THESE MEASURES, CAN YOU TELL ME HOW THIS COMPARES TO THE REST OF SEDONA DENSITY PER ACRE, PARKLAND PER WHATEVER COMMERCIAL SPOT, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT MEASURES, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE AND WE USE, BUT IS IT 10 TIMES WORSE THAN THE REST, MORE DENSE THAN THE REST OF SEDONA? IS IT THE SAME? IS IT, YOU KNOW, I'M SURE LIKE, CAN YOU TALK IN THOSE KIND OF TERMS TO SORT OF TELL US HOW THIS COMPARES TO THE REST OF OUR TOWN? THAT'S REALLY HARD. 
          . 
          UM, I DIDN'T SAY I WAS GONNA ASK AN EASY QUESTION. 
          UM, I'D PROBABLY HAVE TO DO. 
          UM, SO THE MOST COMMON RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS ARE ABOUT FOUR UNITS PER ACRE. 
          AND THAT'S WHEN YOU'RE GETTING ABOUT FOUR, YOU KNOW, FOUR HOUSING UNITS PER ACRE IS CHAPEL AREA, SOME OF THE HARMONY AREAS, THE AREA SPARE CAT, THOSE ARE ALL RSS 10, WHICH ALLOW A DENSITY OF ABOUT FOUR UNITS PER ACRE. 
          THE ACTUAL DENSITY IS PROBABLY A LITTLE LESS THAN THAT. 
          UM, PINON LOFTS, BECAUSE THAT'S OUR MOST RECENT CONSTRUCTED, IS BUILT AT 20 UNITS PER ACRE. 
          UM, AND WHAT DO, WHAT DOES THIS, WHAT DO THESE NUMBERS IMPLY? I MIGHT BE GETTING THAT OURSELVES A LITTLE BIT, BUT IF YOU'RE LOOKING, AGAIN, IT'S, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE OVERALL VERSUS IF YOU TAKE OUT THE OPEN SPACE, YOU CAN GET DIFFERENT NUMBERS, BUT THE HIGHEST DENSITY WOULD PROBABLY BE ABOUT 40 UNITS PER ACRE. 
          AND THAT WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, A FOUR STORY BUILDING. 
          UM, AND SO IF YOU CONSIDER THAT PINON LOSSES 20 UNITS PER ACRE, IF YOU DOUBLE THAT, AND SO IF YOU PUT THAT BUILDING ON TOP OF EACH OTHER, YOU COULD GET, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY THERE'D BE SOME PARKING ISSUES AND ALL OF THAT. 
          UM, BUT FOUR STORIES, YOU KNOW, OPINION LOSS IS TWO STORIES AT 20 UNITS PER ACRE. 
          FOUR STORIES COULD POTENTIALLY BE 40 UNITS PER ACRE. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, AND THEN THE DENSITY IN THE OTHER AREAS KIND OF RANGES BETWEEN, YOU KNOW, PROBABLY 20 ISH. 
          BUT THEN IT'S ALSO LIKE, ARE YOU, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE BY CONCENTRATING AND PULLING SOME OF THE DEVELOPMENT, YOU'RE ALLOWING LARGER SWATHS OF OPEN SPACE WHERE IF YOU SPREAD IT OUT OVER THE OPEN SPACE, YOU MIGHT HAVE AN OVERALL LOWER DENSITY BUT LESS OPEN SPACE. 
          AND SO, UM, DEPENDING ON HOW YOU LOOK AT IT THAT WAY, UM, YOU KNOW, HOW YOU WANT TO LAY OUT A, A PROPERTY AND WHAT WE'RE ACTUALLY COUNTING, BUT MM-HMM . 
          UM, A, A NUMBER OF THE, UM, THE KIND OF THE HIGHEST DENSITY, UM, APARTMENT UNITS THAT WE HAVE IN THE CITY ARE IN THE UPTOWN AREA, AND MOST OF THOSE WERE BUILT BEFORE CITY AND CORPORATION. 
          SO THERE ARE PROPERTIES UP THERE THAT, UM, IF YOU ACTUALLY CALCULATE THE UNITS PER DENSITY, YOU'RE AT 35 ISH UNITS BECAUSE IT'S, YOU KNOW, FOUR OR FIVE UNITS ON A VERY SMALL PIECE OF PROPERTY. 
          UM, AND SO THAT'S A LOT OF THE LITTLE, UM, PROPERTIES IN UPTOWN ARE AT THAT DENSITY. 
          YEAH. 
          UM, IT, IT MIGHT BE WORTHWHILE TO HAVE THOUGHT THROUGH THIS AND IN A THOUGHTFUL WAY, YOU CERTAINLY DON'T WANT TO COMPARE THIS TO A SINGLE FAMILY AREA OF OUR TOWN. 
          YEAH. 
          BECAUSE IT'S NOT SINGLE FAMILY. 
          MM-HMM. 
          BUT OPINION LTS UPTOWN, AND THEN FROM A PARK PERSPECTIVE, YOU MIGHT PROBABLY TAKE A LARGER, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THE SAME SIZE PARCELS COMPARED TO PART PER ACRE. 
          I DON'T KNOW. 
          BUT YEAH, I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF CONVERSATION ABOUT HOW DENSE THIS IS OR ISN'T AND, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE SHOULD BE TALKING WITH FACTS ABOUT HOW IT REALLY COMPARES TO THE REST OF OUR COMPANY. 
          YEAH. 
          AND SO, I MEAN, OBVIOUS, SO OUR CURRENT, UM, COMMUNITY PLAN ALLOWS DENSITIES HIGHER THAN 12 UNITS PER ACRE IF WE'RE DOING THINGS TO ADDRESS LOCAL HOUSING NEEDS. 
          GENERALLY, UM, OUR HIGHEST DENSITY RESIDENTIAL MULTI-FAMILY DISTRICT ALLOWS 20 UNITS PER ACRE, WHICH IS THE PINON LOFTS PROJECT. 
          AND SO WITH THAT, UM, THE HIGHER DENSITY 
          [01:30:01]
PROJECTS ARE THE ONES THAT ARE, WERE BUILT IN THE SIXTIES, SEVENTIES, BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T ALLOWED HIGHER DENSITIES SINCE THEN. 
          UM, BUT YOU KNOW, AGAIN, A NUMBER OF THE PROPERTIES AND UPTOWN ON A UNITS PER ACRE BASIS ARE FAIR, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, THE SIZE OF THEM IS SIGNIFICANTLY DIFFERENT, BUT THE, THE DENSITIES ARE SIMILAR. 
          MAY I WEIGH IN AS WELL? OH, YES. 
          OVER HERE PLEASE. 
          LAUREN BROWN, DEPUTY CITY MANAGER. 
          YEAH. 
          WHERE DID THAT COME FROM? UH, WE DID PUT THIS IN THE FAQ, UM, SO THERE IS, CARRIE AND I DID GO THROUGH AND KIND OF THINK, UM, YOU KNOW, DO A, A THOUGHTFUL, UH, LOOK AT ALL OF OUR, UH, PROPERTIES IN SEDONA AND LOOK AT THE UNITS PER ACRE SO THAT WE COULD MAYBE DO A COMPARISON, UM, BETWEEN THOSE. 
          SO JUST, UM, THERE'S A LISTING OF, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE 10, UM, 10 DIFFERENT PROPERTIES IN THEIR UNITS PER ACRES THAT WE COULD ALL THINK ABOUT THAT. 
          THANKS. 
          THANKS FOR CALLING OUT THAT I MISSED THAT PART, . 
          OKAY. 
          BUT IT'S IMPORTANT. 
          I'M GLAD YOU DID IT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          AND ANNETTE, CAN YOU ADDRESS THAT, UH, HISTORIC QUESTION THAT YOU SENT AN EMAIL TO US ABOUT? YES, MAYOR, UM, I JUST FORWARDED YOU THE EMAIL THAT I RECEIVED FROM THOMAS KROLL, WHO'S THE ASSISTANT DISTRICT ARCHEOLOGIST FOR THE COCONINO NATIONAL FOREST, UM, AND THE RED ROCK RANGER DISTRICT. 
          UM, WE RECEIVED THIS AT THE END OF JULY IN RESPONSE TO OUR INQUIRIES AFTER HEARING SOME CONCERN EXPRESSED AT ONE OF THE FOCUS GROUP MEETINGS ABOUT THE STATUS OF THE CULTURAL ARTIFACTS. 
          UM, AND HE SAYS, I WAS ABLE TO CHECK ON THE LAND EXCHANGE. 
          WE SURVEYED THE AREA IN 1992. 
          THE SHORT ANSWER IS THAT THERE ARE NO NATIONAL REGISTER ELIGIBLE SITES IDENTIFIED ON THIS PARCEL. 
          OUR SURVEY IDENTIFIED TWO SITES. 
          ONE OF THESE WAS A TRASH DUMP DATING FROM THE 1950S TO THE 1980S. 
          THE SITE WAS DETERMINED, NOT ELIGIBLE FOR THE NATIONAL REGISTER. 
          OKAY. 
          THE OTHER WAS A SOUTHERN UA RESOURCE PROCESSING SITE PRIOR TO THE LAND EXCHANGE, THE FOREST THROUGH, UM, A FIRM CALLED SEC EXCAVATED A PORTION OF THE SITE AND COLLECTED ALL OF THE ARTIFACTS BASED ON THE DATES PROVIDED BY THE CERAMICS. 
          THE SITE WAS ESTIMATED TO DATE TO AD 700 TO NINE 50. 
          THE SITE WAS INTERPRETED AS A LOCATION, PRIMARILY USED FOR SEASONALLY GRINDING FOOD PRODUCTS BASED ON THE NUMBER OF GRINDING TOOLS PRESENT. 
          UM, PARTICULARLY THE TROUGH ATE. 
          IS THAT HOW YOU ATE? THANK YOU . 
          UM, ULTIMATELY THE EXCAVATION OF THE SITE IDENTIFIED NOTHING ADDITIONAL BELOW THE MODERN SOIL SURFACE. 
          IT WAS THEN DETERMINED THAT THE SITE TYPE WAS WELL REPRESENTED THROUGHOUT THE AREA AND THE SITE WAS DETERMINED NOT ELIGIBLE FOR THE NATIONAL REGISTER. 
          YOU, YOU HAD MENTIONED TRASH DUMP, YOU HAD MENTIONED TRASH DUMP OFFSITE. 
          THIS THING SAYS IN THE PROJECT ZONE. 
          CAN I, WELL, I BELIEVE THAT WHAT THE FOREST SERVICES REFERRING TO HERE WAS A LARGER PARCEL THAN JUST OUR SITE. 
          THEY EVALUATED LIKE THE WHOLE BIG AREA FOR YEAH. 
          THANK YOU FOR DOING THAT. 
          DEREK, DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING? OKAY, VICE MAYOR AND THEN MELISSA, UH, ARE YOU ABLE TO GIVE US APPROXIMATELY, GO BACK TO THE, UH, PAGE BEFORE THIS PLEASE. 
          THE PERCENTAGE OF OPEN SPACE VERSUS BUILDINGS? UM, I KNOW SOME OF THIS IS, WELL, SO THE BUILDINGS WOULD BE CONCENTRATED IN THE HOUSING AND THE MIXED USE COMMERCIAL AREA. 
          SO YOU'RE LOOKING ABOUT 15.3. 
          UM, NATURAL OPEN SPACE IS 10 AND A HALF. 
          AND THEN, SO THAT'D BE A LITTLE LOWER THAN THE TOTAL. 
          UM, BUT THEN ASSUMING THAT WE WOULD NOT BE PUTTING BUILDINGS ON THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY BENEFIT AREA, THERE WOULD BE SOME OPEN SPACE IN THERE AS WELL. 
          SO WHAT WOULD IT BE APPROXIMATELY  AREA? ARE YOU LOOKING FOR FOOTPRINTS OF BUILDINGS OR THE AREA IN WHICH THE, NOT THE AREA, JUST THE PERCENTAGE. 
          OKAY. 
          SO I MEAN, I GUESS TO THAT POINT AS WELL, UM, THE HOUSING ACREAGE INCLUDES UM, YOU KNOW, PARKING AREAS AND ALL THAT. 
          SO WE'RE NOT GONNA HAVE A BUILDING THAT'S 11 ACRES LARGE. 
          WE'RE GONNA HAVE OR WE WOULDN'T, IF THIS PROJECT MOVES FORWARD, IS IT LIKE 50% GOT STUFF ON IT?  AND 50% DOES NOT, YOU KNOW, IS OPEN SPACE OR WHAT IS THE, DO YOU HAVE THAT THAT'S, CAN WE GO TO, 
          [01:35:01]
OH, SO IT SOUNDS LIKE OUR, THAT MIGHT BE PART OF OUR CONSULTANTS PRESENTATION. 
          IS THAT SURE, YES. 
          YEAH, SO SEE WHEN YOU GET TO THAT QUESTION, THE VICE MAYOR'S QUESTION AS WELL, LIKE SOME OF THE RIGHT OF WAY AREA IS WHAT QUESTION I'LL HAVE. 
          IS THAT GONNA FACTOR INTO YOUR, THE AN OPEN SPACE CALCULATION OVERALL? JUST TO GIVE YOU A FULLER QUESTION. 
          OKAY. 
          AND SO WE'VE JUST BEEN JOINED BY JAY HICKS FROM DIG STUDIOS AND SO IF THERE'S NO OTHER HIGH LEVEL QUESTIONS, HE'S GONNA GET INTO MORE OF THE DETAILS OF THIS. 
          UM, WELL COULD YOU JUST HOLD FOR FOR ONE SECOND BECAUSE I KNOW MELISSA HAD A QUESTION. 
          IT, IT'S A REAL QUICK QUESTION AND I WANT TO MAKE SURE SHE'S NOT CUT OFF. 
          SO, UM, ON THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT AREA, SO PARKS, REC, WHATEVER, UM, NINE AND A HALF ACRES, HOW DOES THAT COMPARE TO POSSE? JOSH IS HERE, IS JOSH HERE? JOSH IS HERE. 
          HE'S HIDING BEHIND ANDY BECAUSE I THINK OF POSSE AS BEING OUR BIGGEST OPEN SPACE PARK. 
          YES, I CAN LOOK EXACT. 
          I BELIEVE POSSE GROUNDS IS ABOUT 80 ACRES AS IT'S TOTAL LAND AREA THERE AND THAT INCLUDES SOME, WHAT'S BASICALLY THE UNDEVELOPED LAND WHERE THE DISC GOLF COURSE IS AND BEHIND THAT PART AS WELL. 
          THAT IS PART OF THE PARKLAND THERE. 
          YEAH. 
          DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA APPROXIMATELY HOW MUCH OF IT IS ACTUALLY RECREATIONAL SPACE, NOT THE OPEN LAND THAT YOU'RE NOT BUILDING ON OR USING ANY IDEA? I DON'T. 
          OKAY, FINE. 
          NO, I APOLOGIZE. 
          I'LL FIND THAT INFORMATION. 
          I'LL JUST WALK IT OFF. 
          THAT'S FINE. 
          YEAH, MEASURE IT OUT. 
          I'LL FIND THAT INFORMATION FOR YOU THOUGH. 
          ANNETTE, DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING TO ADD? LAUREN'S, LAUREN LAUREN'S LOOKING IT UP. 
          I MIGHT HAVE THE ANSWER TO THAT IN THE FAQ NO, THE SEVEN PAGE FAQ. 
          SO, UM, BUT I'LL UM, COME BACK TO ME ON THAT. 
          I'M GONNA SEE IF I CAN LOOK IT UP. 
          CAN I ASK JOSH TO CLARIFY? SURE. 
          WHILE WE'RE WAITING FOR IT. 
          JOSH, DID THAT INCLUDE THE NINE ACRES ON THE OTHER SIDE OF SOLDIERS PASS ROAD, WHAT YOU JUST SAID ABOUT POSSE GROUNDS? YES. 
          YES, IT WOULD INCLUDE THAT AS WELL. 
          OKAY, THANK YOU. 
          AND HOW BIG IS SUNSET PARK AND UH, RANGER STATION? PARK? I THINK RANGER STATION PARK'S A COUPLE ACRES, LIKE TWO, TWO AND A HALF. 
          YEAH. 
          RANGER STATION PARK'S JUST ABOUT TWO AND A HALF. 
          SUN. 
          DO YOU HAVE A SIZE FOR SUNSET? THOSE TWO DIFFERENT SITES? I DON'T KNOW SUNSET OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD, BUT WE'RE LOOKING AT IT ON THE GIS VIEWER RIGHT HERE. 
          OKAY. 
          LAUREN, YOU WANNA WEIGH IN WHEN YOU FIND IT SO WE CAN MOVE? KEEP MOVING. 
          OKAY, GO AHEAD JAY. 
          ALRIGHT, THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          UH, MEMBERS OF COUNCIL. 
          SO JUST TO ADDRESS A COUPLE QUESTIONS THAT YOU JUST HAD. 
          SO ROUGHLY JUST SHY OF 50% IS CONTAINED IN NATURAL AREA, OPEN SPACE AND THEN ALSO THE, UH, PUBLIC AMENITY. 
          SO THAT'S ABOUT THE ROUGH NUMBERS. 
          UH, ABOUT 38% OR SO IS IN DEVELOPMENT AND THE REMAINDER IS, UH, THE BASICALLY THE WATER TANK SITE AND THE ROADWAYS. 
          OKAY, SO CAN YOU SAY THAT LOUDER SO THE AUDIENCE CAN HEAR YOU? SORRY, GET IT A LITTLE BIT CLOSER TO THIS. 
          SO ABOUT, ABOUT 50% OF THE SITE IS CONTAINED IN OPEN SPACE, WHICH IS THE STEEP SLOPES ALONG WITH THE, UH, COMMUNITY BENEFIT INCLUDING THE REC CENTER. 
          SO PART OF THAT WOULD BE BUILT ON, BUT ABOUT 50% AND THEN ABOUT 38% IS ACTUALLY DEVELOPED, WHICH IS, UH, IS BASICALLY SLATED FOR SOME TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT ITSELF. 
          AND THEN THE REMAINDER ROUGHLY 12 OR SO PERCENT, IS BASICALLY ROADWAYS. 
          AND THERE'S ALSO A 0.9 ACRE SITE THAT'S BEEN IDENTIFIED FOR A WATER TANK. 
          SO 50% IS OPEN SPACE, CORRECT. 
          38% IS BUILDINGS AND 12% IS UTILITIES. 
          UTILITIES, ROADWAYS THAT CORRECT. 
          AND THERE'S 0.9 FOR A WATER TANK. 
          POINT NINE. 
          RIGHT AT JUST SHY OF AN ACRE FOR THE TANK. 
          THE WATER TANK. 
          YES. 
          THANK YOU JAY. 
          YOU'RE WELCOME. 
          ALSO, JUST, UH, REAL QUICK QUESTION. 
          I CAN GO, CAN I GO BACKWARDS AT ALL? NO. 
          DO YOU WANT ME TO GO BACK TO MY PRESENTATION? UH, YEAH, THE LAST SLIDE THAT, THAT THEY, OH, THIS ONE. 
          OKAY. 
          SO I THINK THERE'S CONFUSION ON WHEN YOU START LOOKING AT THESE MAPS. 
          SO WE, AS AS PLANNERS, WE TYPICALLY DEAL IN GROSS ACRES, WHICH IS THE ENTIRE PROPERTIES. 
          WE DEAL IN WHAT THEY CALL NET, WHICH TYPICALLY IS A PARCEL THAT GOES TO A CENTER LINE OF A ROAD. 
          AND WE CALL IT NET. 
          NET IS WHEN WE TAKE ALL THOSE OUT. 
          AND WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING HERE IS AT A NET, NET . 
          AND SO IT'S ALL, THAT'S WHAT HE SAID. 
          IT JUST DEPENDS ON HOW YOU WANT TO DESCRIBE IT. 
          BUT WE ALWAYS LIKE TO GO TO A NET NET SO WE KNOW EXACTLY THE SIZE OF PARCEL. 
          SO WHEN WE START PUTTING, UH, BUILDINGS AND DENSITY, WE HAVE REAL NUMBERS. 
          SO THIS IS NEW PLANNING TERMS, THIS IS NET NET. 
          SO ANYWAY, THANK YOU. 
          ALRIGHT, WITH THAT WE'LL GO AHEAD AND START. 
          SO, UM, MAYOR, UH, AND COUNCIL MEMBERS, YOU'VE SEEN PART OF THIS, UH, PRESENTATION PREVIOUSLY AND YOU'VE ALSO, 
          [01:40:01]
UH, PROBABLY COVERING A LITTLE BIT OF WHAT CARRIE'S COVERED. 
          SO I'LL GO OVER SOME OF THESE AND THEN GLOSS OVER OTHERS. 
          SO STARTING OUT WITH THE MAIN PLAN, I'M JUMPING AROUND. 
          SO THIS IS AGAIN, UH, THE PLAN THAT YOU SAW BEFORE WITH THE BUBBLE DIAGRAMS IS REALLY, REALLY THE GUIDING DOCUMENT. 
          THIS IS JUST AN ILLUSTRATION OF POSSIBLY HOW THIS COULD LOOK WITH A BUILDING TYPE. 
          WE DO THIS MAINLY TO LOOK AT DIFFERENT BUILDINGS, UH, ALSO THE TYPE OF BUILDING TO HECK, MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE, UH, A REALISTIC LOOK OF WHAT TYPE OF OF STRUCTURES AND THEN WHAT CAN ACTUALLY, UH, REQUIRE FROM PARKING. 
          SO WE ACTUALLY KNOW THE LAY OF THE LAND. 
          THIS IS ALSO OVERLAID ON THE, UH, THE SLOPE ANALYSIS. 
          SO WE'RE TRYING TO BE VERY REALISTIC ABOUT WHAT WE DO. 
          BUT AGAIN, THIS IS JUST A PICTURE AND KNOWING THAT ESPECIALLY OF THE, THE, UH, THE DISCUSSION ON THE DIFFERENT PRODUCT TYPES, THIS MAY BE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT AT THE END OF THE DAY. 
          SO, LIKE I SAID, THIS IS JUST A SNAPSHOT TO SHOW THE DIFFERENT PRODUCT TYPES AND HOW THEY MAY BE ARRANGED ON THE SITE ACCORDING TO KIND OF THE BUBBLE DIAGRAM THAT YOU SAW BEFORE. 
          SO JUST AS A REMINDER OF WHAT WE LOOKED AT AND WE'LL SHOOT, YOU'LL SEE A COUPLE DIFFERENT MIXED USE AREAS. 
          SO THIS IS ACTUALLY ILLUSTRATED WITH A TOWNHOME TYPE PRODUCT WITH A RETAIL THAT POSSIBLY COULD HAVE AN APARTMENT ON TOP. 
          THESE ARE TWO STORY APARTMENTS, THE AREAS THAT GO UP OR AROUND WHICH IS THE EXISTING, UH, AMPHITHEATER. 
          UH, BASICALLY A TERRACING. 
          THIS IS ACTUALLY A TOWN HOME PRODUCT, USUALLY A TWO STORY, UH, WITH A TUCK UNDER PARKING. 
          THIS IS ILLUSTRATED RIGHT NOW AS A THREE STORY APARTMENT AND FOUR STORY APARTMENTS. 
          AND AS YOU GO THROUGH, YOU CAN SEE WE'VE ALSO BROKEN THESE INTO PIECES SO THEY CAN BE PHASED. 
          SO, AND AGAIN, I JUST SAW THE REPORT SIMILAR TO WHAT YOU'VE SEEN FROM THE P*****K GROUP, WHICH ACTUALLY IS REALLY GIVES ME A LITTLE BIT MORE INFORMATION. 
          SO AS YOU START LOOKING AT BLOCKS, 50 TO 60 UNITS MAY BE THE SWEET SPOT OF DEVELOPMENT. 
          AND SO WHEN YOU START LOOKING AT THESE, YOU CAN DEFINITELY START BREAKING DOWN, YOU KNOW, NUMBERS OF UNITS AS WE GO THROUGH. 
          AND I'LL GO THROUGH A LITTLE BIT MORE EXPLANATION AS WE GO THROUGH. 
          WE ALSO HAVE SOME ILLUSTRATIONS, BUT JUST AS A I THING, IT'S TOUCHY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          DO YOU WANT ME, I I CAN, I CAN CONTROL IT IF IT'S TOUCH. 
          THAT'S RIGHT. 
          NO, THAT'S ALL RIGHT. 
          I THINK I DO. 
          UM, SO THE MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT, THIS CAN ACTUALLY, AGAIN, THIS IS REALLY A BLOCK THAT CAN ACCOMMODATE ANYTHING FROM A HOUSING USE, A RETAIL USE, IT CAN BE A ONE SINGLE USER, IT COULD BE AN INCUBATOR, TECH CENTER OFFICE. 
          IT'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT CAN ACTUALLY HAPPEN. 
          IT HAS THE BEST VISIBILITY OFF OF 89 A AND PROBABLY SOME OF THE MOST LEVEL LAND, AND ALSO THE VISIBILITY. 
          SO THIS ONE HAS THE GREATEST, UH, ABILITY TO BASICALLY SATISFY A LOT OF DIFFERENT USES. 
          OKAY. 
          DID I GO THROUGH TOO ON THAT? DID I GO TOO FAR? NO, THAT'S ALL RIGHT. 
          YOU'RE GOOD. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          SO A TOWNHOME PRODUCT. 
          UH, I THINK MOST PEOPLE ARE FAMILIAR WITH THOSE. 
          THEY TYPICALLY HAVE TWO STORIES. 
          SOME HAVEN'T TUCKED UNDER PARKING, EVEN UP TO THREE STORIES, BUT THESE WERE SHOWING US TWO STORIES. 
          THEY'RE, UH, WHAT WE LIKE ABOUT THIS PRODUCT IS BECAUSE THEY HAVE A SHARED WALL, UH, THEY CAN ACTUALLY STEP DOWN A SLOPE. 
          SO IT'S A VERY EFFECTIVE PRODUCT AND WE HAVE BASICALLY STEEP SLOPES BEING ABLE TO STACK UP THROUGH IT. 
          THEY'RE RELATIVELY NARROW FOOTPRINT, SO THEY CAN BE ANYWHERE FROM, YOU KNOW, PROBABLY 40 FOOT TO NARROWEST, UH, UP TO, YOU KNOW, 50 OR SO. 
          BUT AGAIN, JUST BECAUSE THEY HAVE A COMMON WALL, THEY CAN ACTUALLY STEP UP AND DOWN, UH, BASICALLY SLOPES. 
          AND WE FIND THESE VERY HELPFUL, ESPECIALLY WHEN WE HAVE, UH, AREAS LIKE WE'RE DEALING IN, EXCUSE ME, IN AND AROUND THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          HOUSING DIVERSITY, YOU PROBABLY HAVE SEEN THESE MORE THAN ANYTHING. 
          THIS IS THE GARDEN STYLE. 
          TYPICAL TWO STORY. 
          YOU CAN GO UP TO THREE STORY, UH, WITHOUT ANY KIND OF AN ELEVATOR. 
          ONCE YOU GO TO FOUR. 
          TYPICALLY WOULD START FROM A MARKETING STANDPOINT, WOULD REQUIRE, UM, BASICALLY A ELEVATOR AT THAT POINT. 
          WE ALSO ARE STILL SHOWING, UH, BASICALLY THIS TYPE OF UNIT AND EVEN GO INTO A FOUR AND WE'LL SHOW YOU WHAT THE FOUR, LET'S SEE IF I CAN GET THIS THING UP HERE. 
          FOUR. 
          SO EVEN THOUGH WE'RE SHOWING THE THREE AND FOUR STORY, THE APARTMENTS, THESE ARE VERY SIMILAR THAT EVERYBODY'S USED TO. 
          BUT THE ONE THING THAT THIS CAN HAPPEN IS EVEN IF YOU LET, UH, EVEN IF YOU SAY, WELL, WE WANT PRIMARILY THREE, FOUR, UH, THREE STORY, YOU CAN ACTUALLY GO TO A FOUR STORY AND BASICALLY ENTER A, YOU KNOW, MID-LEVEL, BUT IT ALSO MAY BE ABLE TO HELP YOU STEP, YOU KNOW, STEP DOWN THE SLOPE. 
          BECAUSE AGAIN, EVEN THOUGH WE'RE SHOWING THE YELLOW AS AS, UH, LESS SLOPE, WE STILL HAVE SLOPE. 
          SO WE STILL NEED TO STEP THESE BUILDINGS DOWN. 
          AND FOR EXAMPLE, ACROSS THE STREET, UH, WHAT'S THE NAME OF THE, THE MARRIOTT HOTEL? THE MARRIOTT HOTEL, THERE IS ONE PIECE THAT'S A THREE STORY AND IT BASICALLY IS, IT'S STEPPING DOWN AND IT JUST HELPS YOU DO THAT. 
          SO AGAIN, AS YOU GO THROUGH THESE, YOU KNOW, EVEN A FOUR STORY, UH, WE'VE SHOWN, YOU KNOW, THAT COULD STEP. 
          AND ALSO, UH, ON THE MODEL YOU'LL SEE A LITTLE BIT LATER, WE'VE ACTUALLY DONE A THREE STORY OF A FULL, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY THE FULL FOOTPRINT AND THEN WE'VE INSET THE FOURTH FLOOR IN. 
          SO IT ACTUALLY MINIMIZES THE IMPACT, ESPECIALLY FROM THE STREET. 
          SO IT'S A LITTLE BIT HIDDEN. 
          [01:45:01]
HARRY WENT OVER THIS, UH, BEFORE, BUT IT'S BASICALLY THE CIRCULATION SYSTEM, MAJOR PARKING AREAS. 
          IN THIS MODEL, WE'RE ACTUALLY SHOWING A LARGER USER. 
          IT COULD BE A SINGLE USE, IT COULD BE OFFICE, IT COULD BE A CULTURAL USE, IT COULD BE A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS, MIXED USE. 
          AGAIN, WE'RE SURFACE PARKING THE ENTIRE AREA EXCEPT FOR THIS AREA RIGHT NOW, THIS IS ACTUALLY SHOWN AS A PARKING GARAGE ONE AND BASICALLY A HALF STORY DOWN, TWO STORIES UP. 
          SO THIS IS A THREE STORY UNIT, THE TYPICAL ROADWAY. 
          AND THIS WOULD BE GOING ALONG CULTURAL WAY UP TO, UH, THE, BASICALLY THE WESTERN, UH, GATEWAY TRAIL. 
          AND WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS, RATHER THAN PUTTING BIKE LANES ON THE STREET ITSELF, WE'VE ACTUALLY PUT A 10 FOOT MULTI-USE PATH. 
          THIS WILL ACTUALLY LINK BACK TO THE HIGH SCHOOL AND THEN ALSO BACK UP TO, UH, BASICALLY THE, THE, UH, TRAIL ITSELF. 
          THERE YOU GO, . 
          AND THEN A TYPICAL STREET. 
          WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS AGAIN, UH, WE'RE LOOKING TO MAKE A MULTI-USE PATH AND UH, BASICALLY RUN IT THROUGH THE ENTIRE AREA. 
          WE ALSO HAVE SIDEWALKS ON ONE SIDE, BUT THIS PRIMARILY ON THE 10 FOOT PATH YOU SEE NOW WILL BE UP AGAINST THE OPEN SPACE, THAT CENTRAL SPACE. 
          AND LET'S SEE, I THOUGHT, OKAY, WE ALSO INCLUDED A TRANSIT LOOP. 
          AND DEPENDING ON THE LEVEL OF TRANSIT, UH, IN THE FUTURE WE'RE LOOKING AT, IT STILL WOULD GO UP, DROP OFF AT, UH, THE RECREATION CENTER, COME OFF AT THE GARNER TRAILHEAD OR THE WEST WESTERN GATEWAY TRAILHEAD, AND THEN BE ABLE TO CIRCULATE BACK DOWN AND HAVE, YOU KNOW, A NUMBER OF STOPS AS IT COMES BACK OUT. 
          AND THEN COMES BACK OUT TO THE SIGNAL POINT. 
          AND AGAIN, THIS IS ALL CONCEPTUAL PEDESTRIAN BICYCLE CIRCULATION. 
          YOU CAN SEE THE MULTI-USE PATH, WHICH IS THE, BASICALLY THE DARKER, UH, BASICALLY THE SOLID ORANGE. 
          AND THEN WE ALSO EXPECT SOME OTHER TYPE OF SOFT SURFACE PATHS, BEING ABLE TO CONNECT THE REST OF THE COMMUNITY, EVEN THOUGH WE HAVE NATURAL SPACE, WE ALSO SEE THAT IT'S NECESSARY TO, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY FOR AN AMENITY, BUT ALSO JUST CROSS BEING GO BETWEEN THE, BASICALLY THE DIFFERENT AMENITIES TO BE ABLE TO HAVE DIFFERENT TRAIL SYSTEMS AS WE ACTUALLY COME THROUGH. 
          WE STILL ARE ONLY CONNECTING AT THIS POINT, AND THAT'S ON THE REQUEST RIGHT NOW. 
          THE US FOREST SERVICE, THERE MAY BE SOMETHING IN THE FUTURE. 
          THERE'S OTHER TRAILHEAD CONNECTIONS AND THEN PARKS AND OPEN SPACE. 
          THIS REPRESENTS, AGAIN, ABOUT 50% OF THE SITE. 
          THIS IS A NEIGHBORHOOD PARK THAT ACTUALLY CAME OUT OF, UM, UH, BASICALLY A SUGGESTION ON, I THINK OUR FIRST MEETING WITH THE COMMUNITY OR ACTUALLY SECOND MEETING WITH THE COMMUNITY ABOUT BEING ABLE TO USE THE EXISTING TERRACE AREA AS A POSSIBLE NEIGHBORHOOD PARK, WHICH ACTUALLY FITS VERY WELL WITHIN THE COMMUNITY. 
          AGAIN, THAT'S FOCUSED ON MAINLY THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE HERE. 
          WE HAVE THE OPEN SPACE AREAS, WHICH AGAIN, ARE, ARE THE STEEPER AREAS. 
          AND THEN THE BENEFIT OF THE, THE COMMUNITY AREAS, WHICH WE'RE SHOWING, UH, YOU KNOW, THE REC CENTER, RECREATION CENTER IN IT NOW. 
          AND THEN AN OPEN SPACE, WHICH IS MUCH MORE MULTIFUNCTIONAL IN THAT ZONE. 
          WE'VE ALSO ILLUSTRATED A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THE PARKS AND OPEN SPACE. 
          SO THE VIEWS ARE PHENOMENAL FROM UP HERE. 
          I THINK EVERYBODY THAT'S WENT TO THE TRAIL HEAD AND HAS A GREAT, YOU KNOW, PROBABLY IT'S A HUNDRED AND PROBABLY MORE THAN 180 DEGREE KIND OF PANORAMA OF THE, UH, THE MOUNTAINS. 
          BUT WE'RE SHOWING MAINLY OPEN AREAS AND WHETHER THEY'RE LAWN OR DECOMPOSED GRANITE, I MEAN THAT'S SOMETHING TO BE, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY THINK OF. 
          BUT THE IDEA IS TO CREATE AN OPEN AREAS THAT YOU CAN ACTUALLY HAVE MULTIPLE EVENTS, NOT SO MUCH FIXED. 
          YOU COULD HAVE A BUILT-IN STAGE, YOU COULD HAVE A POP-UP STAGE, HOWEVER YOU WANNA DO IT. 
          WE ALSO SEE THAT MAYBE THROUGH A PARTNERSHIP WITH THE US FOREST SERVICE DURING FESTIVAL TIMES, THERE MAY BE A CHANCE TO POSSIBLY EITHER ONE, YOU KNOW, HAVE PEOPLE PARK AT THIS LOCATION TO USE THE TRAILHEAD AND THEN BE ABLE TO EVEN CLOSE DOWN THE ROAD AND PUT, UH, BASICALLY TRUCKS OR WHATEVER ELSE ON THOSE AS FAR AS FOOD TRUCKS. 
          BUT AGAIN, THE IDEA WAS TO TRY TO KEEP THIS AS OPEN AS POSSIBLE. 
          SO REC CENTER'S BEEN TALKED ABOUT QUITE A BIT. 
          WE DIDN'T SHOW ANY BUILDINGS SO MUCH, BUT AGAIN, IT WAS ONE OF THOSE THAT CAME UP ON MANY TIMES. 
          UH, AND BASICALLY THE, BASICALLY THAT WOULD SERVE THE COMMUNITY. 
          AND AGAIN, I THINK WE'VE ALREADY WENT THROUGH THIS, UH, PRETTY MUCH OVER ALL OF THIS PLAN. 
          UH, JUST A COUPLE THINGS TO HIGHLIGHT. 
          SO THIS IS HOW EVERYTHING IS BROKEN DOWN. 
          SO YOU START SEEING EVERY ONE OF THE ACRES ARE NOW ACCOUNTED FOR. 
          AND THIS IS QUOTE THE NET NET . 
          SO THIS IS WHAT WE GET ALL OF OUR NUMBERS, RIGHT? SO WHY WE DO THAT IS WHEN WE START LOOKING AT, FOR EXAMPLE, TOWN HOMES. 
          I KNOW I HAVE 2.2 ACRES AND I GO THROUGH, BUT IF ALL OF A SUDDEN I'M INCLUDING NOW HALF THE STREET, THEN IT STARTS SKEWING THOSE NUMBERS. 
          AND SO WE ALWAYS TRY TO PULL THOSE THINGS BACK. 
          ALSO IN THE RANGE TOO IS IF A, UH, MASTER DEVELOPER, EVEN THE CITY ACTUALLY PUT THIS OUT, THEN THEY KNOW THAT THEY WOULD HAVE A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF ROAD INFRASTRUCTURE THEY WOULD NEED TO PUT IN. 
          SO THIS IS ALL HOW THESE ROLL UP, BUT SO WE'VE BEEN VERY, VERY SPECIFIC ON HOW WE DO IT ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE PARKING, THE PARKING COUNTS BASED ON THE TYPE OF UNIT. 
          RIGHT NOW WE'RE SHOWING MAINLY APARTMENTS AND TOWN HOMES. 
          AND THOSE RANG ANYWHERE FROM 0.75 PER UNIT ALL THE WAY UP TO ABOUT, UH, ONE AND A HALF, 
          [01:50:01]
UH, FACES PER UNIT. 
          SO WE'VE TRIED TO BE VERY REALISTIC ABOUT HOW WE DO THIS. 
          NOW, AGAIN, THROUGH ALL THE HOUSING DISCUSSION THAT WE JUST HAD, UH, IT STARTS TO REALLY START LOOKING AT WHAT IS THE PROGRAM. 
          AND SO THIS REPRESENTS IN TERMS OF PLANNING AS A PROGRAM. 
          SO ONCE YOU LOOK AT THE DIFFERENT TYPE OF HOUSING, THEN THE IDEA WOULD BE IS HOW DOES IT REFLECT BACK IN THIS CHART? AND THEN DOES IT ACTUALLY AFF AFFECT, YOU KNOW, AFFECT ANY OF THE BLOCK SIZES OR ANYTHING ELSE? BUT THAT'S WHERE THIS, WHERE YOUR INFORMATION, WHEN YOU START MAKING DECISIONS ABOUT THE DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPE AND THE QUANTITY AND EVERYTHING ELSE, THIS IS WHERE IT ROLLS BACK INTO ON HOW THE DENSITY COMES BACK OUT AGAIN. 
          SO THIS IS A REALLY IMPORTANT CHART. 
          EVEN IT HAS A LOT OF NUMBERS. 
          IT'S KINDA LIKE GOT A LOT OF INFORMATION. 
          THERE WAS ONE ERROR, AND YOU ALWAYS LOOK AT THESE THINGS. 
          I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY TIMES THIS SHOULD BE ON BLOCK FIVE. 
          UH, IT SHOULD BE A 35 FOOT HEIGHT. 
          SO THAT'S A THREE STORY. 
          SO THAT'S THE ONE ERROR IN THE, IN THE BUILDING HEIGHT. 
          OKAY, SO WE HAVE SOME VISUALS AND AGAIN, THIS IS ALL BASED ON THE PLAN AND REPRESENTATIVE AS AS A WHAT IF ON, YOU KNOW, DEMONSTRATING ON HOW 430 UNITS ALONG WITH THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT AND ALL THE OTHER ASPECTS, THE ROADWAY AND THEN EVEN TRAIL SYSTEM ACTUALLY LOOKS. 
          SO WE ARE LOOKING, UH, BASICALLY WITH THIS IS THE TRAILHEAD EX EXISTING, UH, BASICALLY IT CURRENTLY EXISTS HIGH SCHOOL BACK OVER, SO WE'RE LOOKING A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. 
          SO THESE ARE BEING SHOWN AS, UH, A PARKING GARAGE, A USE, UH, IN THIS AREA, ANYWHERE FROM 60 TO 80,000 SQUARE FEET COULD HAVE RETAIL. 
          THESE ARE THE TOWN HOMES THAT ACTUALLY WRAP UP ON TOP OF THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          THIS IS THE EXISTING STEPPED AREA FOR THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          THESE BLOCKS CURRENTLY, UM, IN FACT I WAS JUST GOING THROUGH THIS, IT'S ABOUT 120 UNITS AND BASED ON SORT OF WHAT WE HEARD TODAY, YOU COULD ACTUALLY BREAK THOSE INTO TWO DIFFERENT PHASES OF 60 EACH OR 30 EACH. 
          SO THERE'S A WAY OF KIND OF TO START BREAKING THESE DOWN ON DIFFERENT PHASES. 
          THIS IS A THREE STORY. 
          UH, AND THEN WE GO INTO THE FOUR STORIES AS WE COME DOWN THE HILL THROUGH THIS AREA. 
          THIS IS, BY THE WAY, IS THE, UH, PROPOSED TANK SITE RIGHT NOW. 
          AND I'M GONNA FLIP YOU BACK AROUND. 
          THIS IS WHERE THE MODEL ACTUALLY STARTS. 
          WE'RE BACK BACK ON 89. 
          A HIGH SCHOOL IS BACK TO THE LOWER RIGHT, UH, THE TRAIL HEAD IS BACK BASICALLY AT THE VERY TOP. 
          SO I'VE NUMBERED EACH ONE OF THE LOCATIONS AS WE GO THROUGH. 
          THERE'LL ALSO BE A SMALL VIGNETTE IN THE LOWER RIGHT ON WHERE WE'RE ACTUALLY TAKING THE PHOTOGRAPHS. 
          SO WE'RE GONNA START PRETTY MUCH RIGHT ON THE MAIN ROAD COMING THROUGH, UH, THE MIXED USE PROPERTY. 
          SO BASED ON CURRENT CITY STANDARDS, UH, WE'RE NOT ABLE TO HAVE HEADING PARKING, BUT WE CAN ACTUALLY HAVE PARALLEL PARKING. 
          UH, ANYTIME YOU HAVE A RETAIL USE, UH, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT AT LEAST WE GET SOME TYPE OF PARKING IN FRONT. 
          WE DO HAVE THE PARKING LOADS, MAINLY ALONG THE BACKSIDE AND ALSO WITHIN THE GARAGE AROUND THIS BACKSIDE. 
          AGAIN, THIS IS ANTICIPATED AS POSSIBLY AS A SINGLE USER, BUT IT STILL COULD HAVE A RETAIL WRAP. 
          WE COULD HAVE OFFICE AND OTHER, OTHER THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          SO ANYWAY, WE'RE TRYING TO BRING THE STREET, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY NARROW THE STREET DOWN, OBVIOUSLY TO SLOW TRAFFIC DOWN. 
          AND THEN REALLY THE, THE, THE, UH, EXPERIENCE WE WANT TO CREATE IS SOMETHING MUCH MORE, UM, BASICALLY WITHIN A PEDESTRIAN ENVIRONMENT. 
          SO WE WANNA SLOW PEOPLE DOWN, WE WANNA MAKE SURE, AND ANY TIME THAT WE PUT CARS ALONG THE SIDE, IT AUTOMATICALLY SLOWS TRAFFIC. 
          'CAUSE THEY NEVER KNOW WHEN A DOOR IS GONNA OPEN, RIGHT? IF YOU DON'T PUT PARKING, THEN THEY COME OFF OF 89 A AT 55 MILES AN HOUR AND PROBABLY DON'T SLOW DOWN UNTIL THEY HIT THE INTERSECTION WAY UP NORTH HERE. 
          SO THERE'S WAYS THAT WE CAN ACTUALLY JUST THROUGH SORT OF THE DESIGN, UH, ACTUALLY START MITIGATING SOME OF THE SPEED. 
          AND ALSO REALLY NOTE TO, YOU KNOW, UH, THE PEOPLE ENTERING THE, THE DEVELOPMENT THAT'S ACTUALLY A PEDESTRIAN ZONE. 
          SO WE'RE RIGHT AT THE, BASICALLY THE CROSSROADS WHERE THIS GOES BACK UP TO THE TOWN HOMES AND THREE STORY. 
          AND THEN YOU'LL SEE A THREE STORY, UH, IN THE BACKGROUND. 
          THIS IS PROBABLY THE MOST DENSE AREA YOU'LL PROBABLY SEE ON THE SITE WITH BUILDINGS, PRETTY MUCH ON ALL FOUR CORNERS. 
          ONCE WE LEAVE THIS AREA, WE'RE GONNA GO ON DOWN THE HILL AND WE'LL SEE LOOKING BACK KIND OF OVER YOUR SHOULDER, THIS IS THE EXISTING, UH, AMPHITHEATER, RETAINING WALLS. 
          IT COMES DOWN THROUGH, THESE ARE THE PROPOSED SOMETHING LIKE A TOWN HOME. 
          AND THEN TO YOUR LEFT IS ACTUALLY THE OPEN SPACE. 
          SO YOU'LL START SEEING THAT JUST IN A FEW MINUTES. 
          THIS IS THE, UH, MULTI-USE PATH THAT GOES ALONG THIS AREA. 
          LOOKING BACK THE OTHER DIRECTION, AGAIN, THIS IS THE MULTI-USE PATH. 
          THIS IS, UH, THE THREE STORY APARTMENTS, AND THEN YOU'LL START SEEING THE FOURS POP UP IN THE BACKGROUND. 
          YOU CAN TELL SLIGHTLY THAT WE'VE IN, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY PUSHED IN THE, THE FOURTH FLOOR SLIGHTLY IN JUST AGAIN TO, TO BASICALLY, UH, UH, MINIMIZE SORT OF THE IMPACT, ESPECIALLY THE STREET VIEW. 
          WE HAVE NO OTHER ONE COMING UP. 
          SO THIS, IF YOU GO UP THIS TRAIL, YOU'LL END UP AT THE, UH, THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT OF THE COMMUNITY PARK. 
          OH GOSH, THANKS. 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          SO WE'RE BASICALLY AT THE VERY BOTTOM OF THE HILL LOOKING BACK UP. 
          AND AGAIN, YOU 
          [01:55:01]
CAN START SEEING HOW THE STEP OF THE FOURTH FLOOR BACK ACTUALLY GIVES US ONLY A THREE FOOT FACADE. 
          AND AGAIN, THIS COULD BE BROKEN UP. 
          WE HAVE SHOWN, UM, A POSSIBILITY, YOU KNOW, OF A, OF A CAFE OR SOMETHING THROUGH HERE. 
          WE ALWAYS CAUTION A LITTLE BIT ABOUT GETTING TOO AGGRESSIVE FROM A MIXED USE, MEANING RETAIL BURIED INTO A SITE. 
          IT'S VERY DIFFICULT FOR THOSE TO SURVIVE OVER TIME. 
          WHAT WE HAVE SEEN, UH, IN THIS PARTICULAR TYPE, UH, DEVELOPMENT IS PART OF, UH, THE COMMUNITY, MEANING THE APARTMENT COMMUNITY. 
          THERE MAY BE A SUBSIDIZED COFFEE SHOP, IT MAY BE PART OF A FITNESS AREA, IT MAY BE SOMETHING LIKE THAT, OR IT MAY BE A RETAIL SPACE THAT THEY HOLD OUT AND LITERALLY IT'S A ZERO RENT TYPE ISSUE. 
          AND SO THEY ACTUALLY WOULD BRING SOMEBODY, HOPEFULLY GET SOMEBODY LIKE A, A CAFE UH, VENDOR OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT TO COME IN. 
          BUT ANYTIME WE START BRINGING TOO MUCH RETAIL INTO THE SITE, IT REALLY IS A TOUGH THING TO DO. 
          YOU HAVE TO HAVE A PRETTY HIGH, UM, AND AGAIN, WE'LL HAVE APARTMENTS OBVIOUSLY HERE, AND HOPEFULLY WE'LL GENERATE THOSE. 
          BUT PART OF THE DEVELOPMENT, YOU KNOW, REQUEST MAY BE TO HAVE X NUMBER OF SQUARE FEET FOR SOME TYPE OF USE LIKE THIS. 
          SO THIS IS AN OVERVIEW OF WHAT THE OPEN SPACE MAY LOOK LIKE. 
          COULD HAVE A PLAYGROUND RAMADA, UH, SEPARATED FROM A LARGER, UH, WE, WE CALL IT JUST BASICALLY THE MULTI-USE LAWN AREA. 
          IT'S LARGE ENOUGH FOR, YOU KNOW, LARGER EVENTS. 
          AND THEN AS YOU GO THROUGH, AND WE'VE KIND OF HIGHLIGHTED THIS AS MAYBE A DIFFERENT TYPE OF PAVING, THIS IS THE ROADWAY THAT WOULD GO BACK TO THE TRAILHEAD, TO THE US FOREST SERVICE LAND. 
          THE NATURAL BREAK OF THE GRADE, UH, ACTUALLY STARTS GOING DOWNHILL AT THIS POINT. 
          ONE OF THE THINGS WE'RE LOOKING AT IS, YOU KNOW, COULD IT BE A RAMADA? THAT COULD BE A STAGE, UH, COULD IT BE A BUILT IN OR COULD BE EVEN A PORTABLE, BUT AGAIN, IT COULD EASILY BE OVER HERE. 
          AT THE SAME TIME, YOU COULD EVEN HAVE OPPOSING IF YOU HAD A, A LARGER FESTIVAL. 
          IN FACT, I WAS JUST AT PRESCOTT'S, UM, PURE IMAGINATION LAST YEAR. 
          THEY HAD DUAL STAGES THAT WERE GOING ON. 
          AND SO IT WAS REALLY INTERESTING ON HOW QUICK, I DIDN'T KNOW IF WE NEEDED TO HAVE THAT QUICK OF CHANGE OVER BANDS, BUT IT WAS, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING THEY REALLY THOUGHT THROUGH. 
          BUT AGAIN, IT HELPS, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY HOSTED A PRETTY GOOD SIZE EVENT. 
          AND WE HAVE A, UH, SHOT DOWN LOW. 
          AND THE IDEA, AGAIN, IF YOU HAD A FESTIVAL OR YOU HAD A FARMER'S MARKET, I MEAN, THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS YOU CAN DO. 
          AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE'RE LOOKING AT NOW IS, YOU KNOW, AND WHAT OUR RECOMMENDATION WAS, TRY TO KEEP THIS AS OPEN, AS FLEXIBLE AS POSSIBLE. 
          THIS LAWN AREA RIGHT NOW IS SIZED ANYWHERE FROM ABOUT 750 TO A THOUSAND. 
          IT COULD SPELL BACK OVER TO THE OTHER SIDE. 
          THIS IS SHOWING OR ILLUSTRATING JUST A, UH, TEMPORARY STAGE AND AGAIN, JUST A LITTLE BIT LOWER CLOSE UP AND WE HAVEN'T POPULATED VERY MANY PEOPLE IN HERE. 
          BUT ANYWAY, THAT'S, THAT'S A TRUE PHOTOGRAPH IN THE BACKGROUND. 
          UH, THE ONE THING THAT'S PRETTY INTERESTING THOUGH IS, UM, WE HAD TO ELEVATE THE VIEW BECAUSE BY THE TIME YOU GET DOWN, EVEN THE EXISTING TREE LINES KIND OF BLOCK THINGS A LITTLE BIT. 
          SO I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS WE LOOK AT IS, YOU KNOW, DO YOU WANT TO, YOU KNOW, BRING, YOU KNOW, THE BACK END OF THIS THING UP JUST A LITTLE BIT TO HAVE A BETTER VIEW. 
          THERE'S THAT PIECE. 
          UH, THERE WAS SOME QUESTIONS LAST, UH, BASICALLY THROUGH PINE AND ZONING ABOUT THE, UM, KIND OF THE DIFFERENT TYPES OF PROJECTS. 
          AND SO WE HAVE, AND AGAIN, THESE HAVE BEEN TALKED ABOUT A LITTLE BIT ALREADY. 
          SO WINDHAM APARTMENTS ABOUT 16 UNITS TO THE ACRE. 
          AGAIN, TWO STORY OPINION LOFTS BY FAR IS ONE OF THE HIGHER ONES, A 20 UNITS TO THE ACRE. 
          AND I WOULD CALL THIS A NET. 
          THIS IS A NET NET. 
          THERE IS NO OTHER KIND OF, UH, ASPECT AS FAR AS ROADWAY OR SHARED ROADWAYS IN HERE. 
          SO THIS IS A TRUE 20 UNITS TO THE ACRE AT TWO STORIES. 
          NAVAJO LOTS, 13.3. 
          AND AGAIN, WE START SEEING A LITTLE BIT AND IT'S PRETTY EFFICIENT UNIT. 
          BUT AGAIN, YOU KNOW, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PRO, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY PROJECT TYPE TUCK UNDER GARAGES AND THEN SHADOW BROOK APARTMENTS. 
          UH, FAIRLY LARGE OPEN SPACE PIECE, BUT AGAIN, 12.3 UNITS TO THE ACRE. 
          AND, UM, UH, IT'S BEEN, I THINK IT WAS, YEAH, 1987. 
          SO THIS IS A RELATIVELY OLDER PRODUCT. 
          OKAY. 
          AND THEN ALSO, UH, I'M ALMOST FINISHED THE PHASING PLAN. 
          THERE WAS SOME UM, SOME QUESTIONS THAT WE, WE RECEIVED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, HOW CAN YOU REALLY FACE THE AREA. 
          SO WHAT'S REALLY KEY IS THERE'S BASICALLY, WE IDENTIFIED ABOUT THREE MAJOR BLOCKS. 
          ONE BEING THIS A BLOCK, WHICH IS REALLY THE PUBLIC BENEFIT. 
          IT'S ALREADY SERVICED BY A ROADWAY UP AT LEAST TO THIS POINT. 
          AND OBVIOUSLY A DIRT ROAD. 
          IT COMES UP THROUGH, WE HAVE WHAT WE CALL AREA B, WHICH IN SOME CASES IS AN AREA THAT CAN BE EASILY SERVICED FROM, UM, BASICALLY SEWER AND WATER. 
          CURRENTLY YOU HAVE WATER, SEWER, GAS, AND ELECTRIC SETTING TO THAT POINT, IT ALSO GOES ON DOWN THE HILL BY THE STAGE AND THEN ENDS 
          [02:00:01]
UP IN A LIFT STATION ON DOWN THE HILL. 
          SO, UH, WE WERE A LITTLE BIT SURPRISED TO SEE YOU HAVE GAS OUT HERE, BUT YOU HAVE ALL THE UTILITIES SETTING RIGHT THERE. 
          AT THAT POINT, WE BELIEVE THAT BLOCK FIVE, UH, CAN STILL BE SEWERED BY GRAVITY, SEWER OUT OF, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY ONTO ACTUALLY OUT THROUGH THIS AREA. 
          SO AS WE LOOK THROUGH THESE, IT'S REALLY ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THE THREE MAJOR PHASES. 
          SO A IS REALLY THE OVERALL, AND THIS COULD HAPPEN AT ANY GIVEN TIME. 
          IT COULD BE THE THIRD PHASE, IT COULD BE THE FIRST PHASE, IT COULD BE TOMORROW. 
          AND AGAIN, IT ALL HAS THESE PIECES THAT ARE ALL IN THE A. 
          B IS THIS AREA, WHICH AGAIN, COULD ACTUALLY ACCOMMODATE ALL THE TOWN HOMES. 
          IT COULD ACCOMMODATE, UH, THE APARTMENTS. 
          ALL OF THIS COULD BE IN PHASE, YOU KNOW, TWO OR B. 
          AND THEN THE REASON WHY WE'VE, WE'VE SHOWN ON THREE, SO YOU WILL HAVE TO HAVE A LIFT STATION AT THIS POINT. 
          THERE'S ALREADY ONE THERE. 
          NOW WE ASSUME IT'S NOT FUNCTIONING AND IT'S PROBABLY NOT SIZED CORRECTLY FOR AT LEAST THIS TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT. 
          BUT, YOU KNOW, YOU WOULD HAVE TO HAVE A LIFT LIFT STATION SOMEWHERE AT THE LOWER END. 
          AND SO WHEN YOU DO THAT, OBVIOUSLY IT'S A LARGER COST. 
          AND THEN AT THAT POINT TOO, I WOULD ASSUME THAT, UH, YOUR FIRE CHIEF WOULD LIKE TO SEE A COMPLETE LOOP. 
          SO TYPICALLY WE WANT TWO, UH, POINTS OF ENTRY TO FIGHT ANY KIND OF A FIRE. 
          SO THAT WAY RIGHT NOW WE STILL HAVE A, A, BASICALLY A COMPLETE LOOP THAT GOES THROUGH. 
          THIS IS LESS OF A CONCERN BECAUSE OF THE COMBUSTIBLES, BUT AS YOU GET INTO THIS ZONE, THIS IS AREA THAT, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD STILL HAVE A, A COMPLETE LOOP. 
          AND THEN AGAIN, THE REASON WHY C'S THE VERY LAST IS YOU WOULD HAVE TO EXTEND THE ROAD ALL THE WAY AROUND, CONNECT IN TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU HAVE FIRE PROTECTION. 
          UH, STEVE TOUCHED ON THIS A LITTLE BIT ON CONSTRUCTABILITY. 
          SO WE ALREADY MENTIONED, YOU KNOW, WE ALREADY HAD THE COURTYARD HOTEL, UH, HILTON VACATION, YAVAPAI COMMUNITY COLLEGE, AND ALSO THE HIGH SCHOOL IN JUNIOR HIGH. 
          EXISTING STAGE AT THIS POINT SITE IS AT THIS LOCATION. 
          ONE THING WE WERE ABLE TO FIND THOUGH, UH, WAS REALLY, IT'S A, UM, IT'S A REPORT THAT WAS DONE IN 1987, I BELIEVE. 
          AND THIS IS BEFORE THE EXISTING STAGE STRUCTURE AND YAVAPI COMMUNITY COLLEGE WAS EVER BUILT. 
          SO THE BORING DEPTHS IN THIS AREA, UM, ONE TO TWO FEET. 
          SO THIS SHOWS WHAT YOU CAN BUILD ON ONE TO TWO FEET BECAUSE WE HAVE A CURRENT, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE A CURRENT COMMUNITY COLLEGE. 
          THE BORING DEATHS, UH, AT THESE TWO LOCATIONS WERE, UH, NINE, NINE, BASICALLY NINE AND A HALF FEET AND 13 FEET, UH, RESPECTFULLY. 
          SO, AND AGAIN, JUST RESPONDING BACK TO WHAT STEVE WAS TALKING ABOUT, THERE'S, I THINK THERE WAS A BORING OF 13 FEET IN THIS LOWER, THIS UPPER RIGHT OR UPPER LEFT, RIGHT? WHICH MAKES SOME SENSE BECAUSE YOU CAN SEE THERE'S SOMEWHAT OF AN ALLUVIAL FAN, YOU KNOW, FROM ALL THIS. 
          YOU KNOW, BASICALLY AS THIS IS ERODED OVER TIME, IT'S ACTUALLY FILLED IN THIS AREA. 
          SO WE CAN SEE THAT THE ONE PIECE WE DON'T HAVE WITHIN THIS IS ACTUALLY WHAT THE REPORT LOOKS LIKE. 
          AND THAT'S WHY I PUT THIS ONE TOGETHER BECAUSE YOU CAN BARELY SEE THE OTHER ONE. 
          UM, THE ONE PIECE THAT'S NOT INCLUDED IN THIS REPORT, WHICH WOULD PROBABLY NEED TO BE DONE, AND I KNOW A, UM, DEVELOPER WOULD DO IT, WOULD BE CALLED A SEISMIC REPORT. 
          SO THAT'S JUST BASICALLY THE DENSITY OF THE ROCK. 
          SO, UH, THEY DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT'S LESS THAN THREE, MEANING THAT YOU CAN USE HEAVY EQUIPMENT OR IT'S OVER FIVE, WHICH, YOU KNOW, MAY TAKE A LITTLE MORE AGGRESSIVE MODE. 
          SO THAT WOULD BE ONE OF THE STEPS THAT WOULD ACTUALLY BE IN THE CONSTRUCTABILITY, ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY START LOOKING FOR SEWER LOCATIONS. 
          'CAUSE THAT'S USUALLY YOUR DEEPEST UTILITY. 
          ALRIGHT, AND THAT'S THE END OF MY PRESENTATION. 
          PETE . 
          THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          MAKE AN ASSUMPTION. 
          . 
          THANKS, UH, JAY FOR THAT. 
          I, I'VE REALLY FOUND THAT VERY INFORMATIVE AND USEFUL. 
          A BUNCH OF QUESTIONS. 
          NOT A BUNCH. 
          I'LL TRY NOT TO DO TOO MANY. 
          I LEAVE SOME, I'LL TRY. 
          UH, BUT REAL QUICKLY, CARRIE, YOU MENTIONED THE EASEMENT. 
          I'M ASSUMING THAT'S A VEHICLE EASEMENT, THAT'S WHY IT'S ALONG THAT ROADWAY THAT EXISTS IS, IS THAT RIGHT? GOING OUT TO THE TRAIL SYSTEM? YEAH, GOING OUT TO TRIAL. 
          YEAH. 
          YEAH. 
          YES. 
          YEAH, YEAH. 
          ASSUME THAT. 
          UM, AND THEN JAY FOR YOU, OH, UH, JAY ALSO MENTIONED NO HEAD IN PARKING. 
          IS THAT EVEN SLANTED PARKING? IT'S GOTTA BE SIDE BY SIDE. 
          WHAT'S IN OUR CODE AND WHAT WOULD BE THE IMPACT OF THAT IF, IF WE CHANGE THAT? SO THE CODE SAYS THAT YOU SHOULDN'T BE BACKING OUT INTO A, A TRAVEL ROAD. 
          UM, SO I MEAN, HOW BIG A LIMITATION IS THAT? SO WE ALWAYS LOOK AT A COMPANY. 
          SO WE DID CAROLYN COMMONS YEARS AGO, AND WE FOUND THAT YOU GET PEOPLE DOWN TO 15 MILES AN HOUR WHEN YOU HAVE BACK OUT TRAFFIC, UH, PARALLEL TRAFFIC, THEY GO ABOUT OR PARALLEL PARKING, THEY GO ABOUT 30 TO 35 MILES AN HOUR. 
          THERE'S LESS OF A RISK. 
          SO IT JUST DEPENDS. 
          BUT THE ONLY CONCERN I WOULD HAVE IN THIS LOCATION COMING OFF OF 89 A, UH, BECAUSE IT'S A RIGHT IN, PEOPLE ARE COMING IN AT A FAIRLY DECENT SPEED. 
          AND SO TO GO 
          [02:05:01]
FROM THAT SPEED DOWN TO LIKE A 15 HEAD IN COULD BE AN ISSUE. 
          SO IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, I'D HAVE TO, YOU KNOW, PROBABLY GO WITH WHAT THE CODE WOULD BE AS PARALLEL PARKING, HAVE SOME FRICTION THERE, BUT DON'T MAKE IT TO WHERE IT'S SUCH A DANGEROUS SITUATION FOR THE DRIVER. 
          BUT THERE COULD BE SOME BENEFIT TO CHANGING THAT FURTHER INTO THE PROJECT. 
          IT COULD BE, YEAH, DEFINITELY. 
          SO ANYTIME WE GET INTO IT FURTHER INTO THE PROJECT, UH, WE PROBABLY HAVE BETTER OPPORTUNITY TO DO THAT. 
          AND IT ALL HAS TO DO ALSO WITH THE WIDTH OF THE ROADS, WHEN YOU START BRINGING THE WIDTH OF THE ROAD IN, WE ALSO START SLOWING TRAFFIC DOWN TOO. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, NET, NET , I KNOW I, I ALWAYS WANTED TO START A PHRASE. 
          I HAVEN'T USED THAT PHRASE SINCE I WAS IN THE CORPORATE WORLD, SO I, IT DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH IT. 
          I JUST LOVE THAT WORD. 
          . 
          UM, MIXED USE. 
          YOU HAD SOME DIAGRAMS, YOU TALKED SOME ABOUT IT. 
          WHAT HAVE WE, THE GLOBAL WE, MAYBE MORE THE US WE OR THE ARIZONA, WE AS APPLIED TO SEDONA. 
          WHAT HAVE WE LEARNED ABOUT MIXED USE AND WHAT KEEPS 'EM FROM BEING EMPTY? WE'VE ALL SEEN UNDERUSED MIXED USE STUFF THAT HASN'T BEEN SUCCESSFUL. 
          WHAT ARE THE TIPS THAT WE SHOULD BE THINKING ABOUT TO PREVENT THAT? SO IF WE'RE TALKING RETAIL, UH, DON'T BUILD TOO MUCH. 
          THAT'S USUALLY THE KEY. 
          UH, IT HAS TO HAVE GOOD ACCESS. 
          AND THAT'S THE OTHER, THOSE ARE THE TWO KEY THINGS. 
          SO DON'T BURY IT IN A DEVELOPMENT BECAUSE IT'S, UH, WE'VE DONE TOO MANY OF THOSE OVER THE YEARS AND THEY'VE NEVER PERFORMED WELL. 
          AND THE OTHER IS DON'T OVERSIZE YOUR RETAIL. 
          AND THAT'S USUALLY THE BIGGEST MISTAKE ON ONE OF THESE TYPE DEVELOPMENTS, UH, TO DO THAT. 
          SO, AND THE SIZING OF THE RETAIL COMMERCIAL THAT WE PUT IN HERE, IS THAT SIZE TO SERVICE THAT AREA OR ARE YOU EXPECTING THAT TO BE A, AN ATTRACT ATTRACTION FOR THE REST OF SEDONA? SO IT'S A BIGGER MARKET, BUT MAYBE BIGGER SPACE THAN OTHERWISE NEEDED? YES. 
          I WOULD SAY THAT THE REASON WHY IT'S AT THE LOCATION IS SO WE CAN ACTUALLY GET THE GREATER, UH, COMMUNITY. 
          SO TRY TO CAPTURE SOME OF THE GOING HOME TRAFFIC, SO TO SPEAK. 
          AND THEN RELATED TO THAT PHASING, I WAS THINKING ABOUT WHEN, WHEN THE HOUSING COMES IN, AND I THINK I DIDN'T QUITE UNDERSTAND THAT PHASE TWO MIGHT INCLUDE SOME OF THE HOUSING, BUT THERE'S A BIG IMPACT OF THE NUMBER OF UNITS IN PHASE THREE AND YOU REALLY DON'T WANT COMMERCIAL RETAIL GOING IN BEFORE THERE'S A DEMAND . 
          YEAH. 
          CORRECT. 
          AND SO THAT'S A WEIRD BALANCE. 
          ANY THOUGHTS OF HOW YOU'VE DESIGNED THAT SO FAR? THINKING ABOUT THAT? SO MIXED USE, YOUR COMMERCIAL IS, YOU KNOW, YOU ALWAYS, AND THE OLD SAYING IS YOU ALWAYS WANT, YOU KNOW, DOORS BEFORE YOU START DOING THE REST, RIGHT? SO THIS WOULD BE POSSIBLY ONE OF THE LAST BLOCKS THAT EVER EVEN GETS DEVELOPED UNTIL YOU GET TO WRITE WHAT YOU ACTUALLY WANT IN THERE. 
          THE RETAIL THE RETAIL PORTION. 
          YEAH. 
          AND IT LITERALLY, THIS CAN PLAY FOR A WHILE. 
          AND LIKE I SAID, THIS IS BY FAR YOUR MOST VALUABLE REAL ESTATE ON ALL YOUR DEVELOPMENT. 
          AND SO AGAIN, THAT'S ONE THAT YOU MAY WANT TO GET MORE DOORS, MORE PEOPLE LIVING THERE TO MAKE SURE YOU GET THE RETAIL SIZE CORRECTLY AT THAT POINT. 
          YEAH, THE, YOU KNOW, THE CRITICAL NEED OF, OF HOUSING, I GET WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT THERE'S A LIFT STATION AND OTHER STUFF IN PHASE THREE THAT'S EXPENSIVE. 
          I, I DO THINK THERE'S SOME THOUGHT THAT I'D LIKE TO HEAR MORE ABOUT, UH, AS TO WHETHER THAT INVESTMENT IS WORTH IT TO GET HOUSING EARLIER IN THE, YOU KNOW, TO HELP SOLVE THE PROBLEM BEFORE WE GET THE AMENITIES. 
          BUT I, I DON'T NEED COMMENT ABOUT THAT. 
          IT'S JUST SOMETHING I'M THINKING ABOUT AS WELL. 
          UH, JUST A QUICK NOTE. 
          TYPES OF TREES I SEE IN YOUR PICTURES, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU DID THAT ONE IN THE PARK THING, I'M NOT SURE. 
          THOSE ARE OUR TREES. 
          I KNOW , SO YOU MIGHT THINK WE LOOK FOR  TREES BECAUSE YOU MENTIONED A PROBLEM ABOUT, YOU KNOW, HAVING TO BOOST YOUR ELEVATION TO SEE OVER THERE. 
          BUT IT MIGHT BE THAT JUST, YOU KNOW, YOUR VEGETATION WELL, IT WAS INTERESTING, WE ACTUALLY GOT THE, THE PHOTOGRAPH IN AND YOU KNOW, IT'S MAINLY JUNIPER OPINIONS AND THERE, THAT'S ABOUT LITERALLY THE HEIGHT OF THE TREE RIGHT NOW IS WHAT'S IN THE, IN THERE. 
          SO YES. 
          UH, JUST A SHOUT OUT. 
          I LOVE THE WALK BIKEWAYS SEPARATED STUFF. 
          YAY. 
          AND LET'S ALWAYS REMEMBER THE TREES IN THERE TOO. 
          SHADE, WE'VE ALL TALKED ABOUT SHADE AND DECORATIVE LANDSCAPING. 
          LET'S NOT JUST BUILD BARE GROUND AND SIDEWALKS. 
          UM, COUPLE, LET ME JUST ASK A COUPLE OF THESE OTHERS THAT'S FOR LATER. 
          I, I THINK SINCE YOU'RE HERE, JAY, LET ME ASK TWO QUESTIONS ABOUT HOW YOU DO STUFF VERSUS I SEE ELSEWHERE, THERE'S BEEN SOME CONVERSATION WE'VE HAD IN THE PAST ABOUT THIS ULI WORKSHOP AND KIND OF TAKING ADVANTAGE OF SHOPPING THIS PROJECT AGAIN OUT. 
          AND I KNOW THAT YOU'VE TALKING TO DEVELOPERS THAT MIGHT BE AN ADDITIONAL OPPORTUNITY THAT MIGHT BE 
          [02:10:01]
PERHAPS GIVE MORE. 
          AND I'VE HEARD THAT YOU'VE GOT SOME THOUGHTS ABOUT HOW MANY DUCKS IN A ROW WE NEED TO HAVE BEFORE WE MIGHT TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THAT. 
          HOW MANY DUCKS, WHAT COLOR ARE THEY? HOW BIG ARE THEY? WHEN WOULD THAT FIT IN? IS THAT IN THE PLAN TO DO THAT? YEAH, SO YOU'RE TALKING, UH, COUNSELOR, YOU'RE TALKING BASICALLY THE TECHNICAL ASSISTANCE COMMITTEE, RIGHT? YOU GOT THE WORDS . 
          SO I SERVED ON MANY OF THOSE. 
          UH, AND IN WHAT IT IS, IT'S TYPICALLY A ONE DAY PROCESS WHERE YOU PRESENT, UH, ALL THE INFORMATION THAT YOU HAVE. 
          I'VE BEEN SOME THAT BASICALLY HAS VERY LITTLE INFORMATION. 
          I'VE HAD SOME THAT HAS ALL KINDS OF DEMOGRAPHICS AND EVERYTHING THROUGH. 
          IT'S TYPICALLY A PANEL THAT INCLUDES EVERYBODY FROM PLANNING CAPITAL, UH, PUBLIC GROUP ALL ACROSS THE WAY. 
          AND WHAT IT IS, IT'S A PANEL THAT'S REALLY CONCENTRATED ON SAYING A WHAT IF ONE IS YOUR PLAN? YOU KNOW, IS IT CLOSE? ARE YOU GUYS OVERSHOOTING? IS THERE SOMETHING THAT WE FORGOT? AND SO THAT'S WHAT THEY REALLY READ ON MORE SO THAN ANYTHING ELSE. 
          I THINK IT WOULD ALSO HAVE MAYBE PERSPECTIVE DEVELOPERS THAT REALLY HAVE A KEEN EYE ON, ESPECIALLY NOW WITH THE MARKETING STUDY THAT YOU HAVE, THE HOUSING STUDY, THAT'S A PRETTY EYE-OPENING. 
          UH, AND IT'S VERY, VERY SPECIFIC MEANING THAT, YOU KNOW, 50 TO 60 UNITS, THERE'S A LOT OF DEVELOPERS THAT DON'T SHOOT ANYTHING LESS THAN 200 UNITS. 
          THERE'S OTHERS THAT SHOOT, YOU KNOW, 30 TO 40 ALL THE TIME. 
          AND SO THEY UNDERSTAND IT. 
          SOME DON'T DO ANYTHING OTHER THAN ON POTATO, DIRT, FLATLANDS AND OTHERS THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT, YOU KNOW, SLOPES DON'T BOTHER THEM. 
          SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING ALONG THE PROCESS THAT COULD BE VERY, VERY HELPFUL IF YOU WANT TO GO THROUGH THE ULI, LIKE I SAID, I'M A FIRM, I'M A, I'M A FULL MEMBER OF 'EM. 
          I'M A FULL, YOU KNOW, LIKE I SAID, I'M A FIRM BELIEVER IN THAT PROCESS. 
          WOULD THAT FIT IN BEFORE WE FINALIZE, APPROVE THE MASTER PLAN OR IS THAT A TASK THAT OCCURS AFTER OUR MASTER PLAN? BEFORE IT IS. 
          BEFORE IT'S BEFORE, YEAH. 
          AND I THINK THE IDEA IS TO MAKE SURE THAT, ESPECIALLY THROUGH, YOU KNOW, YOUR COMMENTS TODAY IN REFINEMENTS BASED ON NOW THE HOUSING STUDY TO GO TO THE NEXT, I GUESS PREFERRED, YOU KNOW, NEXT PLAN PREFERRED AND TRY TO GET THAT MORE AND MORE NARROWED DOWN AND JUST SEE, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S STILL THERE AND WHAT THEY REALLY, YOU KNOW, ARE BRINGING BACK. 
          I THINK WHAT YOU'LL HEAR IS A LOT OF THE SAME ABOUT BE CAREFUL ABOUT RETAIL. 
          UM, THERE IS, THERE WILL BE COMMENTS A LOT ABOUT, UH, CREATING A PLACE, ESPECIALLY IN THE WESTERN GATEWAY BECAUSE RIGHT NOW IT DOES NOT HAVE A PLACE. 
          AND SO THIS COULD ACTUALLY HAVE A REALLY GOOD OPPORTUNITY TO CREATE THAT. 
          SO I THINK YOU'LL HEAR COMMENTS ABOUT THAT. 
          SO, OKAY, LAST QUESTION FOR NOW, . 
          UM, I'M CURIOUS ABOUT SORT OF MY KNOWLEDGE OF PAST WORK IS THAT WHEN A DEVELOPER IS THINKING ABOUT COMMITTING TO A BIG PROJECT, THAT ANY ONE OF THESE PHASES OR THE WHOLE THING IS A BIG PROJECT, THEY ALSO HAVE THEIR OWN MARKET STUDY OF WHO THEY'RE TRYING TO GET THERE AND WHAT ARE THEIR INCOMES AND ALL THE REST. 
          HOW DOES THAT WORK RELATE TO THE WORK THAT YOU GUYS DID ON THE HOUSING STUDY AND WHAT, IT WOULD BE VERY INTERESTING FOR ME TO UNDERSTAND WHERE A BUILDER MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN BUILDING AS WELL. 
          WHEN DOES THAT KIND OF FEEDBACK FIT IN? SO THAT TYPICALLY HAPPENS WHEN YOU PUT IT OUT FOR A DEVELOPMENT ITSELF. 
          SO WHEN YOU PUT A DEVELOPMENT PROPOSAL OUT, THE INFORMATION YOU HAVE SO FAR IS ACTUALLY FAIRLY DETAILED. 
          UH, BUT WHAT THEY'LL LOOK AT BASED ON WHAT PRODUCT THEY'RE ACTUALLY BRINGING, THEY'LL WANNA KNOW VERY SPECIFIC THINGS. 
          SO IF THEY DON'T REALLY OFFER A STUDIO AND THEY OFFER ONE TWOS AND THREES, HOW MUCH OF THAT DEMOGRAPHIC REALLY MAKES THAT UP? AND IF THEY DON'T EVEN WANT TO GO TO THAT DEMOGRAPHIC, THEY WON'T EVEN APPROACH IT. 
          SO WOULD THAT FEEDBACK BE A POTENTIAL TOPIC OF CONVERSATION IN THE ULI WORKSHOP THING THAT YOU MENTIONED ABOUT WHETHER OUR HOUSING NEED AND WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO BUILD HERE WOULD MATCH WELL OR NOT MATCH WELL WITH A DEVELOPER'S ABILITY AND INTEREST IN BUILDING? ABSOLUTELY. 
          YEP. 
          OKAY. 
          I, I THINK MAYBE JUST ONE MORE I'M GONNA PUT IN, I'VE SEEN MASTER PLANS BEFORE I, AND I'M ACTUALLY IMPRESSED AT WHAT I SEE HERE. 
          UH, THIS HAS BEEN INTERESTING FOR ME. 
          THERE'S A REALLY, A GOOD LEVEL OF INFORMATION COMPARED TO SOME OTHER MASTER PLANS I'VE SEEN OVER TIME. 
          AND SO I THINK IT IS ON A VERY INTERESTING TRACK, BUT I, I'M LOOKING FOR YOUR FEEDBACK. 
          'CAUSE I THINK YOU PROBABLY SEE MORE THAN MAYBE ANYBODY IN THIS ROOM, MAYBE THERE'S SOME PEOPLE OUT THERE, IT'S ALAN HERE,  OR, UM, WHAT KEEPS THEM FROM GETTING DUSTY AND STAYING ON THE SHELF AND NOT BEING IMPLEMENTED POLITICAL WILL, POLITICAL WILL . 
          AND THAT'S, UH, AND THAT'S, IT DOESN'T MATTER. 
          IT'S A PARK AND REC MASTER PLAN OR WHETHER IT'S A TRAILS MASTER PLAN. 
          IT'S BASICALLY, UM, WHO WANTS TO PUSH IT AND A CHAMPION. 
          THANK YOU. 
          [02:15:01]
APPRECIATE IT, BRIAN. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          JAY, WHAT IS, WHAT, WHAT'S A HOUSING UNIT IN THIS PROPOSED PLAN? IS THAT, IS EVERY UNIT A ONE BEDROOM? WHEN DO THEY BECOME TWO BEDROOMS? HOW IS THAT FACTORED INTO YOUR UNIT COUNT? SO WE ACTUALLY TOOK A DIFFERENT MIX. 
          I WISH YOU IN WAS HERE, WHICH IS MY RIGHT HAND PERSON, BUT IT'S BASICALLY ABOUT 10% STUDIOS. 
          I THINK IT'S ABOUT 20%, UH, ACTUALLY ABOUT 30% ONE BEDROOM. 
          SO I ACTUALLY ASK HER THIS TWO BEDROOMS ARE TYPICALLY THE ONES THAT ARE SOUGHT AFTER, AND THEN THE MINOR PART WOULD ACTUALLY BE THREE. 
          AND SO I CAN'T TELL YOU SPECIFIC NUMBERS RIGHT NOW, BUT WE TRY TO MIX THOSE THROUGH. 
          OKAY. 
          AND THEN HYPOTHETICALLY, LET'S JUST SAY EVERYBODY WAS OVER THE MOON ABOUT THIS PLAN AND SAID, OKAY, LET'S GO FORWARD. 
          WHAT'S THE CITY'S RESPONSIBILITY LIKELY TO BE IN TERMS OF FUTURE INVESTMENT IN THIS? AND I KNOW IT'S VERY HARD TO ANSWER THAT BECAUSE IT DEPENDS ON A WHOLE HOST OF DECISIONS THAT WOULD STILL NEED TO BE MADE IN TERMS OF, WELL, YOU KNOW, ALL OF THE DECISIONS, BUT JUST THE SAME. 
          WHAT REALISTIC MINIMUM WOULD THE CITY NEED TO PLAN FOR TO INVEST TO SEE SOMETHING LIKE THAT GET BUILT? SO THERE'S A COUPLE DIFFERENT APPROACHES. 
          OBVIOUSLY. 
          UM, MASTER DEVELOPER PROBABLY TAKES THE LARGEST PORTION OF YOUR, UM, YOUR INVESTMENT OFF YOUR PLATE BECAUSE THEY'RE COMING AT IT, YOU KNOW, AS A HOLISTIC PROJECT. 
          WITH THAT THOUGH, THEY'LL ALSO BE ASKING FOR POSSIBLY, AND I SAY SUBSIDIES FROM THE STANDPOINT OF POSSIBLY A, A COMMUNITY FACILITY DISTRICT TO HELP THEM WITH UTILITIES. 
          IT COULD BE, UH, YOU KNOW, A TIMEFRAME. 
          IT MAY BE, DO WE HAVE TO PAY YOU FOR THE ENTIRE PIECE OF LAND OR CAN WE PARTICIPATE TOGETHER? MEANING THE CITY AND UH, DEVELOPER CAN, THEY BASICALLY HAVE A MASTER AGREEMENT. 
          SO WHEN THEY ACTUALLY GO TO A FINAL PLAT, THAT'S WHEN THEY START BASICALLY BUYING THE LAND FROM YOU, SO TO SPEAK, SO THEY CAN ACTUALLY KEEP THE DEBT OF THE LAND OFF THEIR BOOKS. 
          SO THERE'S ALL DIFFERENT KINDS OF SCENARIOS. 
          WOULD A MASTER DEVELOPER ACTUALLY BE THE RESPONSIBLE PARTY FOR BUILDING A WRECK CENTER? THEY COULD, I WOULD PROBABLY, UH, ADVISE THAT. 
          THAT WOULD PROBABLY BE THE CITY THAT WOULD ACTUALLY DO THAT BECAUSE YOU'RE ALREADY SET UP FOR THAT. 
          YOU ALREADY HAVE, UH, A ROADWAY THAT'S BEEN DEDICATED. 
          YOU HAVE UTILITIES THAT ARE SETTING BASICALLY AT THAT CORNER. 
          SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT COULD ACTUALLY GO FORWARD LITERALLY THROUGH A TYPICAL RFP WITH AN ARCHITECTURAL LEAD AND THEN THE MUNICIPALITY WOULD END UP MOST LIKELY ISSUING BONDS TO PAY FOR. 
          IT COULD, YES. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, I'LL DEFER FOR THE MOMENT. 
          THANK YOU VICE MAYOR. 
          SO YOU'RE CALLING THIS THE PREFERRED PLAN AND I'M JUST CURIOUS AS TO HOW IT BECAME PREFERRED, PREFERRED BASED ON WHAT  SO LET ME BACK UP TO THIS REAL QUICK. 
          IT'S EASIER TO TALK FROM, UH, WHERE AM I AT HERE, ? LET'S GO TO CASH. 
          THIS THING IS SO SENSY OKAY, THERE. 
          SO WHAT CAME OUT OF, UH, THE OUTREACH WAS THAT OBVIOUSLY THAT WE STARTED GETTING COMMENTS ABOUT THE NUMBER OF UNITS. 
          SO WE STARTED LOOKING AT FROM 700  DOWN TO, YOU KNOW, FOUR 30 OR SO IN THAT AREA. 
          SOME AS YOU KNOW, SMALL AS 350. 
          ONE OF THE BIGGEST OUTCOMES ON THIS PLAN THOUGH WAS THE AMOUNT OF COMMUNITY OPEN SPACE OR COMMUNITY BENEFIT. 
          THAT WAS PROBABLY THE BIGGEST CHANGE IN THIS PLAN. 
          EVERYTHING STARTED. 
          UH, IN FACT, IF EVEN LOOKED AT THE FOUR CONCEPTS BEFORE, THREE OF THEM WERE VERY, VERY SIMILAR. 
          THEY REALLY VARIED ON BUILDING HEIGHT AND THE AMOUNT OF COMMUNITY OPEN SPACE. 
          AND SO THAT WAS THE BIGGEST CHANGE IN THIS. 
          AND THAT REALLY STARTED NOW CREATING ALL OF THIS AS A COMMUNITY BENEFIT AREA. 
          BUT IF YOU START EVEN LOOKING AT SOME OF THE ORIGINAL ONES, THESE ARE VERY, VERY CLOSE WITHIN THREE OF THE CONCEPTS BEFORE. 
          SO THERE WE HAD VERY FEW COMMENTS ON THAT. 
          OTHER THAN, LIKE I SAID, HEIGHT WAS A VERY BIG ISSUE IN THE NUMBER OF UNITS REALLY WITH THE TWO DRIVERS ON THE, ON THE RE OR BASICALLY THE RESIDENTIAL. 
          I, I REMEMBER SEEING A PARKING GARAGE IN ONE OF THEM, BUT I THINK THAT WERE, PEOPLE ACTUALLY WANT A PARKING GARAGE. 
          THIS IS A PREFERRED. 
          YEAH. 
          SO, UM, SO THE ONE THING A PARKING GARAGE CAN DO, AND AGAIN, THIS IS WITHIN, AGAIN, IT'S, IT'S MAKE SURE I'M TALKING ABOUT TWO DIFFERENT ONES. 
          SO THE MIXED USE PIECE. 
          SO IF ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU DROVE UP TO SAY 80,000 SQUARE FEET, THERE'S NO WAY TO BE ABLE TO PARK THAT AMOUNT 
          [02:20:01]
ON SURFACE. 
          SO YOU HAVE TO GO TO A GARAGE USE. 
          SO AGAIN, THAT'S NOT A CITY EXPENSE. 
          THAT WOULD BE WHOEVER THE DEVELOPER EXPENSE WOULD BE. 
          SO THAT'S THEM BASICALLY BUILDING THEIR REQUIRED PARKING JUST TO PARK THEIR FACILITY. 
          THERE'S ALSO BEEN DISCUSSION EVEN ON THE, THE RESIDENTIAL, DOES IT MAKE SENSE TO HAVE A SHARED PARKING GARAGE? AND THAT'S SOMETHING COULD ALSO BE DISCUSSED TOO. 
          AGAIN, PARKING GARAGES ARE SOMEWHERE IN THE RANGE OF EIGHT TO 10 TIMES PER SPACE, MORE THAN SURFACE PARKING. 
          SO THAT WOULD BE A VERY DIFFICULT THING, ESPECIALLY IF WE'RE TRYING TO HIT A 80 TO ONE 20 OR EVEN BELOW OF BEING ABLE TO PUT THAT KIND OF A BURDEN ONTO A, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY THE DEVELOPMENT. 
          THE FLIP SIDE IS, AND I KNOW YOU PROBABLY DON'T WANNA HEAR THIS, IS THE CITY MAY BE ABLE TO BUILD THE GARAGE AND THEN LEASE IT BACK TO THEM. 
          SO ANYWAY, NICE. 
          SAY THAT TONGUE IN CHEEK. 
          BUT ANYWAY, SO, UM, WHAT IS THE SIZE OF THIS PROPOSED PARKING GARAGE? HOW MANY CARS WOULD IT, SO DO YOU REMEMBER OFF TOP HERE? IT WAS ON THE NEXT, THAT SLIDE WAS, UH, THE DIAGRAM WE HAD THE MA THE MATRIX ABOUT 350. 
          OH, HANG ON. 
          THAT'S BIGGER THAN THAT. 
          THERE. 
          IT'S DID YOU SAY 306? YEAH, RIGHT THERE. 
          YEAH, SO IT'S RIGHT AT 400, 400 SPACES. 
          400 CARS, YEAH, 400 SPACES. 
          AND AGAIN, THAT'S FOR RELATIVELY LARGE. 
          YEAH, SEE THAT'S ACTUALLY, THIS ONE'S ACTUALLY SHOWN RIGHT NOW AT 123,000 SQUARE FEET. 
          SO IT'S A TWO STORY PIECE, BUT AGAIN, THAT'S THE MAXIMUM, RIGHT? WE'RE JUST IN THE PROCESS OF BUILDING A GARAGE FOR 200 AND SOMETHING CARS THAT IS HUMONGOUS AND IS REALLY CONTROVERSIAL IN THIS COMMUNITY. 
          I CAN'T IMAGINE ANYBODY ASKING FOR A GARAGE A FOR 400 CARS IN THIS SPACE. 
          YOU HAVE TO ASK. 
          IT'S A NON-STARTER FROM MY PERSPECTIVE. 
          WELL, AGAIN, IF, IF IT'S THE USE, UH, IF THE USE IS, IF YOU WOULD WANT A PARTICULAR USE, EXCUSE ME FOR ONE MINUTE. 
          YEP. 
          CAN, CAN I JUST ASK THE AUDIENCE TO KEEP THEIR CO CONVERSATIONS, TAKE THEM OUTSIDE? I'M SURE YOU WANT TO HAVE THEM, YOU HAVE A A WANNA HAVE A DISCUSSION, BUT IT IS DISTURBING UP HERE. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU FOR YOUR INDULGENCE, JAKE. 
          CONTINUE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          SO IF YOU DID HAVE A LARGER FOOTPRINT AND YOU WANTED TO PARK IT, THEN YOU KNOW, YOU COULD DO A PARKING GARAGE. 
          WE'RE ACTUALLY SHOWING A WRAP, YOU KNOW, TO KIND OF HELP CONCEAL IT. 
          MOST LIKELY YOU'D PROBABLY HAVE TO GO DOWN AT LEAST A STORY TO EVEN GET THAT, THAT AMOUNT OF PARKING. 
          BUT AGAIN, THAT'S A SINGLE USER MAX. 
          SO JUST SO YOU KNOW, THE GARAGE WE'RE BUILDING IN UPTOWN GOES DOWN A STORY. 
          YEAH. 
          AND IT'S FOR TWO HUNDRED AND FORTY TWO SEVENTY OR 2 72. 
          TWO 70. 
          OKAY. 
          IT IS REALLY BIG. 
          IT'S BIG. 
          THIS IS BIGGER. 
          BIGGER, YES. 
          AND WHAT IS SUPPOSED TO BE A LIGHT TOUCH? SO THE LIGHT TOUCH IS THAT, YOU KNOW, NOT SUPPOSED TO BE SEEING THESE, AT LEAST FROM MY PERSPECTIVE, HUGE BUILDINGS DENSE. 
          THAT'S NOT WHAT OUR COMMUNITY LOOKS LIKE. 
          IT'S NOT WHAT PEOPLE WANT TO SEE IN THIS SPACE. 
          OKAY. 
          SO I I I DON'T KNOW WHERE PREFERRED COMES INTO PLAY HERE, BUT, SO LET ME CORRECT ONE THING. 
          UM, THE PREFERRED, AGAIN, WHEN YOU REALLY LOOK AT THIS PLAN, THESE ARE JUST THE WHAT IFS CAN ACTUALLY FIT INTO EACH ONE OF THESE BLOCKS. 
          THE PREFERRED PLAN IS REALLY ALL ABOUT, UH, LET ME SEE IF I CAN GET BACK TO THIS ONE AGAIN. 
          THIS, THAT'S THE PREFERRED PLAN WHEN YOU GET DOWN TO IT. 
          IT'S REALLY THE ALLOCATION OF LAND USE TO SPACE. 
          BUT THAT COULD STILL HAVE A 400 UNIT PARKING GARAGE ON IT. 
          DEREK, WELL I'M ON COUNCIL AUDIENCE ONLY IF YOU APPROVE IT. 
          WHAT DO WE NEED TO DO TO UNDERSTAND THE IMPACT THAT THESE DIFFERENT DENSITIES WOULD HAVE ON TRAFFIC ON THAT END OF TOWN? I MEAN, I THINK, YOU KNOW, BOTH DAY TO DAY AND IN AN EMERGENCY SITUATION, I THINK SOME PEOPLE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY US CREATING ANOTHER WIDE BOTTLENECK AT THE WEST END OF TOWN. 
          UM, SO I'D JUST LIKE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO FIGURE THAT OUT. 
          MAYOR COUNCILLOR. 
          UM, IT REALLY REQUIRES A TRAFFIC STUDY, BUT WHICH WOULD BE THE NEXT STEP TO START LOOKING AT THESE DENSITIES? UH, WHEN YOU START LOOKING AT RESIDENTIAL USE VERSUS RETAIL, YOU KNOW, COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MODELS. 
          UH, THE ONE GOOD THING WE DO HAVE HERE THOUGH, WE DO HAVE 
          [02:25:01]
A, UM, A, YOU KNOW, A SIGNAL LIGHT, A CONTROLLED SIGNAL LIGHT THAT'S ALREADY IN PLACE. 
          SO, BUT AGAIN, IT WOULD TAKE A TRAFFIC STUDY NOW TO TAKE A LOOK AT THAT AND SEE WHAT YOUR OVERALL IMPACT IS. 
          AND PART OF THAT IS LOOKING AT THE MIX OF USES. 
          UM, SO IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT, YOU KNOW, AN EMPLOYMENT RETAIL ATTRACTION VERSUS IT'S GOING TO BE PRIMARILY HOUSING FOR PEOPLE WHO MIGHT BE WORKING IN TOWN, THAT SORT OF THING. 
          IT'S, IT WOULD HAVE DIFFERENT TRAFFIC NUMBERS. 
          SO WE REALLY CAN'T DO A FULL TRAFFIC ANALYSIS UNTIL WE GET A BETTER HANDLE ON WHAT THE MIX OF USES IS. 
          I FEEL LIKE THAT SHOULD BE A FACTOR IN HOW WE DO THE MIX OF USES. 
          I MEAN, WE DON'T WANT TO OVERWHELM THAT END OF TOWN WITH TRAFFIC. 
          I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY WE KNOW SOME USES ARE GONNA BE MORE TRAFFIC INTENSIVE THAN OTHERS, BUT I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE A BASELINE UNDERSTANDING OF THAT BEFORE WE SAY, OKAY, THIS IS WHAT WE'RE GONNA PUT HERE AND THAT'S WHAT'S GONNA GO THERE. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, PETE, I THOUGHT YOU, ARE YOU DONE OR YEAH, I'M WORKING ON CLO CLOSING COMMENTS, SO YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          ALTHOUGH I, I DID WANNA JUST CHIME IN RIGHT THERE THAT I, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING AND I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING AND THERE'S SOME MIDDLE GROUND OF MAKING SOME ASSUMPTIONS AND PUTTING SOME NUMBERS OUT AND JUST GIVING IT A SHOT. 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY, KATHY, AND THEN WE'LL MOVE ON. 
          YEAH, MY, UM, QUESTIONS, I THINK I'M GONNA DEFER THEM TO COMMENTS WHEN WE GET IN THERE, BUT THEY'RE GONNA BE IN THE AREAS OF, THE PARTS OF THIS I'M STILL WRANGLING WITH ARE, ARE, ARE THE OVERALL DENSITIES, THE RETAIL VERSUS COMMERCIAL, THE BALANCE IS THERE 'CAUSE I'M NOT SURE THAT IT'S RIGHT FOR THE COMMUNITY AND ALSO A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF COMMERCIAL. 
          'CAUSE WE WERE TALKED AND TOUCHED ON RETAIL AND USING RETAIL OUTLETS SUCH AS LIKE SELLING CLOTHING OR SOMETHING. 
          BUT I WANT, I WANT THERE TO BE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT ALLOWABLE USES ARE IN THERE BECAUSE I THINK THEY MAKE A REAL DIFFERENCE IN HOW THE, UM, HOW THE RATIOS WORK. 
          UM, THE BUILDING HEIGHTS GENERALLY ARE GONNA BE A QUESTION FOR ME BECAUSE OF THE, UM, UM, PRECEDENTS THAT ARE SET AS WELL. 
          I THINK WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT. 
          AND ALSO JUST THE, UM, GONNA HAVE QUESTIONS AND TALKING ABOUT AGAIN, WHAT WE JUST TOUCHED ON WITH THE MASTER DEVELOPER VERSUS PARCEL BY PARCEL. 
          WE HAVE TO START TACKLING THAT AT SOME POINT. 
          NOT, NOT IMMEDIATELY BECAUSE WE HAVE BIGGER OVERALL ARCHING QUESTIONS, BUT THAT HAS TO BE IN THE BACK OF OUR MINDS AS WE GO THROUGH. 
          SO MY QUESTIONS ARE GONNA ACTUALLY MANIFEST IN THAT AREA, BUT IN COMMENTS, I THINK, BECAUSE I THINK IT HAS TO BE IN CONTEXT OF SOME OF THE PUBLIC COMMENT AS WELL. 
          OKAY. 
          ANYTHING ELSE? UM, JAY, ARE YOU DONE OR, I'M FINE, THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT WOULD BE THE, UM, PREFERRED PLAN ALTERNATIVE IS COVERED. 
          RIGHT? OKAY. 
          SO THEN WE CAN EITHER TAKE A BREAK OR WE COULD, YOU KNOW, I DON'T WANNA LOSE THE PUBLIC WHEN WE TAKE A BREAK, SO IF WE, WOULD YOU BE O HOW MANY CARDS I'M GONNA FIND OUT FROM MARCY BECAUSE I DON'T WANT PE SOMETIMES PEOPLE LEAVE DURING THE MIDDLE OF OUR BREAK. 
          BREAK. 
          THERE'S A LOT AND I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE CAPTURE PERFECT. 
          OKAY. 
          DID YOU HAVE IT WRITTEN DOWN OUT? NO, I'LL GET IT LATE. 
          OKAY. 
          JESSICA WILLIAMSON, WE'RE GONNA OPEN, CAN, CAN WE DO A SHORT BREAK BEFORE THE PUBLIC COMMENT? JUST FOR PERSONAL BREAK? PERSONAL BREAK? ALRIGHT. 
          WE'RE GONNA DO A SHORT BREAK. 
          SHORT BREAK. 
          SHORT BREAK. 
          GIVE YOU 10 MINUTES TOPS. 
          WE'RE NOT GONNA EAT. 
          UM, AND THEN WE'LL COME BACK, BUT DON'T, PLEASE DON'T LEAVE. 
          OKAY. 
          CAN YOU ALL PLEASE TAKE YOUR SEATS? WE'VE MADE OUR BREAK REAL QUICK JUST TO ACCOMMODATE EVERYONE HERE. 
          WE DON'T WANNA LOSE ANYBODY. 
          OKAY. 
          SO JESSICA WILLIAMSON WILL BE FOLLOWED BY GUY GRAND. 
          HI, MY NAME'S JESSICA WILLIAMSON. 
          I LIVE IN SEDONA POLITICAL WILL , I WILL REPEAT THAT. 
          POLITICAL WILL. 
          OKAY. 
          I TOTALLY SUPPORT HOUSING ON THE SITE. 
          UM, WHEN WE BOUGHT THE SITE, THAT WAS IT. 
          WE WAS VERY CLEAR THAT THIS, IT WAS BOUGHT IN ORDER TO ADDRESS IN PART SOME OF THE HOUSING ISSUES THAT WE HAVE. 
          UM, UM, I, I KNOW THAT THERE'S A LOT OF CONCERN ABOUT THE DENSITY OF THIS AND THE HEIGHT. 
          UM, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO RECOGNIZE THE UNIQUE NATURE OF THE, OF THE 
          [02:30:01]
SITE AND THE FACT THAT HEIGHT COULD VERY WELL BE HERE, WHERE IT COULDN'T BE SOMEWHERE ELSE BECAUSE OF THE TOPOGRAPHY. 
          I ALSO THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO, FOR ME, IF THE, IF THE DENSITY ISN'T THE SAME AND I KNOW IT WON'T BE, I JUST KNOW IT WON'T BE, THAT IT NOT BE DOWN TO JUST A HUNDRED UNITS OF MARKET RATE THAT SOMEBODY HOPES SOMEBODY CAN AFFORD. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S WAS NOT THE INTENT OF THE BUYING OF THE SITE. 
          SO, UM, I JUST, THOSE TWO THINGS ARE VERY IMPORTANT TO ME. 
          UM, OH, THIS IS YESTERDAY'S NOTES. 
          THAT'S NOT GONNA DO ME MUCH. 
          GOOD. 
          I'M GONNA HELP YOU AND THAT'S TAKING UP A LOT OF TIME. 
          OKAY. 
          . 
          UM, AND I THINK IF YOU DON'T MANAGE TO USE POLITICAL WILL TO CREATE  TO CREATE SOME FAIR AMOUNT, NOT MAYBE 500 UNITS, BUT NOT 100 UNITS OF HOUSING, SOME OF WHICH ARE AVAILABLE TO PEOPLE WHO MIGHT EARN LESS THAN 50%. 
          UM, AND THEN YOU MIGHT AS WELL TAKE HOUSING OFF OF YOUR PRIORITY LIST BECAUSE YOU AREN'T REALLY, YOU AREN'T REALLY COMMITTED TO PRODUCING IT. 
          BEING PRODUCING IT IS OBVIOUSLY HARD. 
          I, I KNOW THAT THERE'S A LOT OF DISLIKE OF TAX CREDITS, BUT THAT'S WHAT IT COSTS. 
          AND WHEN THEY'RE AVAILABLE THEY WORK. 
          SO, UH, A KIND OF PURITY ABOUT, ABOUT COST, ABOUT USING CERTAIN PRODUCTS, UM, IS PROBABLY NOT AN APPROACH. 
          THE LAST THING I'LL SAY IN MY 30 SECONDS IS THE ONE SURE WAY THAT HOUSING GETS BUILT FOR PEOPLE SEEMS TO BE HOTELS. 
          WE LEARNED THE ONES THAT ARE GOING AHEAD ON THE LIST I SAW WERE ASSOCIATED WITH HOTELS WITH THAT STEADY STREAM OF A LOT OF REVENUE OVER 50, 30 TO 50 YEARS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          JESSICA. 
          GUY GRAND IS UP NEXT TO BE FOLLOWED BY UH, UH, JOHN AND DONNA J SNICK. 
          OKAY, MAYOR CITY COUNCIL. 
          DID YOU ALL GET MY LITTLE MM-HMM . 
          HAND OUT? OKAY. 
          YOU GOT, JUST HOLD ON ONE SECOND. 
          UH, YOU MIC ON THE MIC. 
          YOU NAME CITY RESIDENCE GUY GRAND. 
          I'M A 37 YEAR RESIDENT OF SEDONA AND MY WIFE AND I ARE THE ONLY TWO PEOPLE IN THIS TOWN CURRENTLY THAT PRODUCED EVERY SINGLE MUSICAL EVENT FROM 1991 JAZZ, THE ROCKS, JACKSON BROWN AND EVERY EVENT AT THE CULTURAL PARK UNTIL THE END OF 2002, I SHOULD SAY NOT PRODUCE, BUT WE'RE THE PRODUCTION MANAGEMENT COMPANY. 
          WE DID ALL THE, EVERYTHING THAT WENT ON. 
          I CAN GIVE YOU A LIST A MILE LONG. 
          I COULD TALK FOR HOURS WHY THE CULTURAL PARK ISN'T VIABLE, BUT WHAT I'M GONNA SPEND MY TWO MINUTES ON RIGHT NOW IS TELLING YOU WHY THIS ISN'T VIABLE. 
          SHE'S RIGHT. 
          POLITICAL WILL'S IMPORTANT AND IF THE CITY COUNCIL HAS POLITICAL WILL TO SHUT THIS THING DOWN NOW IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE. 
          THAT SITE IS BUILT ON ROCK. 
          I WAS THERE WATCHING GIANT MACHINES GOING JUST TO BUILD A PATHWAY FROM A PARKING LOT TO THE VENUE. 
          I WAS THERE EVERY SINGLE DAY THAT THAT SITE WAS BEING BUILT. 
          IT'S HILLY, IT'S ROCKY. 
          IF YOU WANT TO PUT 400 UNITS, HOW MANY CARS IS THAT? TWO CARS PER HOUSE? THAT'S 800 CARS. 
          YOU GUYS MENTIONED ALL OF THAT. 
          I PARKED EVERY SINGLE CAR ON THAT SPACE. 
          THE MOST WE COULD GET WAS 768 PARKING ON THE STREETS AS WELL AS THE PARKING LOTS THAT WERE THERE. 
          SO I STARTED THIS AND I WAS ASKED TO COME HERE BECAUSE I'M SO ADAMANTLY OPPOSED TO THE CONSTRUCTION, THE PLANNING AND EVERYTHING THAT THE CULTURAL PARK WAS. 
          I READ GOD LOVE THE, THE STAFF. 
          I READ THAT 700 PAGES AND WENT, OH MY GOD, IT IS THE SAME THING. 
          I'M GONNA BLOW UP ROCK. 
          WAS ANYBODY HERE WHEN WE BLEW UP SAFEWAY MOUNTAIN TO BUILD AFFORDABLE HOUSING CALLED NAP PENTE? THAT WAS A FIVE YEAR PROJECT AND WE DYNAMITED THAT WHOLE AREA WHERE SAFEWAY IS TO MOVE ALL THAT ROCK TO BUILD NAP PENTE. 
          THOSE HOUSES WERE AFFORDABLE HOUSING AT THE BEGINNING AND THEY WERE TWICE THE COST AT THE END. 
          SO THAT'S . 
          IF YOU HAVE POLITICAL WILL, 
          [02:35:01]
IT WOULD BE THINK ABOUT SOMEWHERE ELSE TO PUT HOUSING. 
          IF YOU NEED TO BUILD 800 OR 1800 HOUSES, DO IT AT THE DELLS. 
          IT'S THE ONLY FLAT LAND THAT THE CITY OWNS. 
          SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          THANK YOU GUYS. 
          JOHN AND DONNA JK WILL BE FOLLOWED BY SANDRA B BALO. 
          I DON'T HAVE ANY STATEMENT, IT'S JUST I FOUND OUT ABOUT THIS. 
          START WITH YOUR NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE PLEASE. 
          YEAH, I LIVE IN UPTOWN NAME JOHN AZIZA. 
          AZIZA. 
          OKAY, THANK YOU. 
          YES. 
          UH, WITH MY WIFE. 
          UH, WE'RE FORTUNATE WE LIVE IN UPTOWN, BUT WE SEE ON WEEKENDS, HOLIDAYS, TRAFFIC BACKING UP FROM CVS GOING INTO DOWNTOWN. 
          WE MOVED HERE. 
          WE ARE LOOKING AT THE UNDERPASS WENT BY THE LOCK. 
          APPARENTLY IT COST MILLIONS, BUT THE GUARDRAILS ARE OPEN. 
          NO ONE WANTS TO GO ALL THE WAY AROUND. 
          WE'RE QUESTIONING WHO APPROVED THAT. 
          YOU MADE A COMMENT ABOUT THE PARKING GARAGE. 
          NOBODY WANTS IT, BUT IT'S BEING BUILT. 
          I'M JUST QUESTIONING. 
          I'VE LIVED IN ENOUGH PLACES AROUND THE WORLD THAT THERE IS A TRANSIENT WORKFORCE. 
          I CAN'T GET THE SAME VENDORS TO COME HERE WITH THE SAME PERSON BECAUSE THEY'RE COMING HERE WITH A NEW PERSON. 
          I'M LOOKING AT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE WORKING IN, UH, HEALTHCARE. 
          THEY HAVE A PERMANENT JOB, SECURITY, THEY HAVE A PERMANENT JOB. 
          TEACHERS, THEY HAVE A PERMANENT JOB. 
          YOU'RE NOT GONNA COME HERE TO WORK $50,000 A YEAR AND COME HERE WITH A WIFE AND FOUR KIDS TO LIVE IN A TWO BEDROOM HOUSE. 
          YOU'RE JUST NOT, THIS IS GONNA BE A PART-TIME. 
          SO I WOULD ASK FOR THESE PEOPLE WHO MIGHT BE BUYING OR LIVING INTO THESE PLACES, ARE THEY GOING TO BE LONG-TERM RESIDENTS WORKING HERE OR ARE THEY GOING TO BE BREAKING THE LEASE COMING IN HERE, COMING AND GOING AND EVERYTHING ELSE LIKE YOU SEE IN ASPEN AND ALL THESE OTHER PLACES? THIS IS THE BEAUTIFUL COMMUNITY I WOULD BE, I PROBABLY WOULDN'T HAVE BOUGHT. 
          IF I WOULD'VE COME IN HERE AND SEEN THIS DEVELOPMENT COMING IN FROM COTTONWOOD, I WOULD'VE SAID, THIS IS NOT THE PLACE I WANT. 
          IF I WANT THAT, I'D HAVE STAYED IN SAN FRANCISCO. 
          IT IS A DISASTER. 
          I SEE EXPENDITURES THAT ARE JUST OUT THE DOOR AND THEN YOU COME UP AND GO, WHO IS APPROVING THIS STUFF? AND THEN EVERYBODY LOOKS AROUND AND GOES, I DON'T KNOW, BUT IT'S BEEN APPROVED AND I JUST, I'M JUST SHOCKED. 
          I AM JUST REALLY SHOCKED. 
          I DEFINITELY WANT GOOD THINGS FOR THE PEOPLE WHO WORK HERE. 
          WE MET SOMEBODY, WE HAD LUNCH AT THE ENCHANTER RESORT. 
          SHE MOVED HERE FROM LAS VEGAS WITH HER HUSBAND. 
          THEY HAVE SEVEN CHILDREN. 
          SHE'S NOT GONNA RETIRE HERE. 
          SHE'S GONNA LIVE HERE FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS, HIKE, HAVE A GOOD TIME, AND THEN SHE'S GONNA MOVE ON. 
          SHE'S NOT GONNA HAVE A COMMITMENT HERE. 
          WE'VE MADE A COMMITMENT HERE. 
          WE PAY TAXES, WE EXPECT A RETURN FOR OUR INVESTMENT. 
          THIS IS NOT A RETURN ON OUR INVESTMENT. 
          OKAY. 
          SANDRA WILL BE FOLLOWED BY, UH, TRACY RANDALL. 
          SANDRA, I GUESS SHE'S LEFT. 
          OKAY. 
          TRACY, YOU'LL BE FOLLOWED BY GUY LAUNION. 
          SO MY NAME IS TRACY RANDALL. 
          I'M A SEDONA RESIDENT AND THE PRESIDENT OF THE VERDE VALLEY CYCLIST COALITION. 
          UM, FIRST I WANT TO THANK AND ACKNOWLEDGE THE CITY FOR ALL THE WORK THEY'VE DONE. 
          UM, MYSELF AND A GENTLEMAN HERE SITTING WITH ME AND SOME OTHER PEOPLE IN THE BIKE CLUB HAVE BEEN VERY ACTIVE AND I THINK IT HAS GONE ON FOR A YEAR. 
          CARRIE, UM, YOU KNOW, THE CITY HAS INVITED US INTO MEETINGS. 
          UM, I KNOW THEY'VE COORDINATED WITH THE FOREST SERVICE COLLECTED FEEDBACK. 
          SO THANK YOU FOR ALL THE INPUT, UM, THAT YOU'VE TAKEN. 
          I KNOW THIS HAS BEEN A HEAVY LIFT AND AS SOMEONE WHO'S WATCHED IT EVOLVE, I THINK IT'S CONTINUED TO GET BETTER. 
          SO COMMEND YOU FOR THAT. 
          UM, HOWEVER, I'M HERE TO EXPRESS A FEW THINGS THAT I'D LIKE TO IT TO CONTINUE TO EVOLVE AND GET BETTER. 
          UM, ONE, WHICH CARRIE YOU ALLUDED TO. 
          I JUST THINK IT'S A HUGE MISS THAT WE DON'T SEE THE GERDNER TRAILHEAD. 
          UM, I DON'T KNOW THE DETAILS AT THIS POINT. 
          I MEAN, I TALK TO THE FOREST SERVICE A LOT. 
          THEY SAID THEY HAVE IT NOW. 
          IT'S NOT HERE. 
          YOU SAID THEY DON'T WANNA SHOW IT. 
          UM, IT'S JUST DISAPPOINTING TO ME BECAUSE RIGHT NOW THIS PROPERTY IS EXCLUSIVELY A TRAILHEAD AND WE DON'T SEE WHAT THE TRAILHEAD LOOKS LIKE WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE EVOLUTION OF THE PROPERTY. 
          I REALIZE THAT THAT'S FOREST AND THIS IS CITY, BUT THAT'S A HUGE MISS FOR A BIG PORTION OF THE COMMUNITY. 
          WHAT DOES THE TRAILHEAD LOOK LIKE? HOW ARE WE GONNA GET INTO 
          [02:40:01]
IT? ANYWAY, SO THAT'S ONE. 
          UM, HOW I JUST DON'T THINK YOU CAN GIVE MEANINGFUL FEEDBACK WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT THE PRIMARY USAGE OF THIS PROPERTY IS GONNA IN INTERACT WITH US. 
          THE SECOND IS WE'VE CONTINUED TO ASK FOR THE EXISTING TRAIL SYSTEM TO BE REFLECTED ON THE MAPS. 
          I'VE HEARD THAT'S FOREST SERVICE PROPERTY. 
          THAT'S NOT CITY PROPERTY. 
          I'VE HEARD THE TECHNOLOGY DOESN'T ALLOW US TO DO IT AGAIN. 
          I THINK THAT'S A HUGE MISS. 
          I KNOW EXACTLY WHERE THEY ARE. 
          I APPRECIATE, I THINK YOU GUYS HAVE CREATED A BIGGER BUFFER SO IT'S NOT SO TIGHT, BUT IT'S A HUGE MISS THAT WE DON'T REFLECT THE EXISTING TRAILS THAT ARE THE CENTERPIECE OF THE CURRENT PROPERTY. 
          UM, AND I THINK IT'S A HUGE MISS THAT WE DON'T CREATE ACCESS INTO THOSE TRAILS. 
          WE SEE WHAT HAPPENS IF WE DON'T. 
          THAT IS A HUGE PIECE OF PROPERTY WITH A LOT OF PEOPLE ON IT. 
          IF WE DON'T CREATE MORE ACCESS, WE'RE GONNA HAVE SOCIAL TRAILS EVERYWHERE. 
          SO LET'S WORK WITH THE FOREST SERVICE. 
          WE'RE HAPPY TO DO IT. 
          OKAY, WHAT IS MY LAST POINT? UM, SORRY. 
          UM, THIS GOES BACK. 
          WE NEED A TRAILS COORDINATOR. 
          YOU GUYS HAVE HEARD ME OVER AND OVER RIGHT NOW, LARS AND I ARE DOING IT FOR YOU. 
          BUT WE NEED SOMEONE IN THE CITY STAFF. 
          THE CITY'S DOING A GREAT JOB, BUT IT'S A HUGE HOLE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          GUY LAUNION WILL BE FOLLOWED BY SYLVIA SPINELLI. 
          GOOD AFTERNOON, MAYOR COUNCIL, GUESS MY NAME'S GUY LAUNION. 
          UH, I LIVE IN CITY OF SEDONA. 
          UH, I CAME IN RESPONSE TO A LOT OF WHAT I'VE SEEN, UM, NAY SAYING MONDAY MORNING QUARTERBACKING, UH, AND A LOT OF NEGATIVITY ABOUT THIS PROJECT. 
          I FEEL THAT THE CONSULTANTS AND THE SURVEYS HAVE DONE DUE DILIGENCE AND I'M IN SUPPORT OF THIS PROJECT. 
          UH, I'M ALSO IN SUPPORT OF THE, THE MAYOR AND, UH, I SEE THAT THERE'S ANOTHER PROJECT COMING YET ST. 
          JOHN ANI, UH, WHICH I SUPPORT. 
          SO THANK YOU ALL FOR THE WORK THAT YOU'RE DOING. 
          UM, UH, I KNOW, UH, CITY COUNCIL MAYOR IS PRACTICALLY A VOLUNTARY POSITION AND I APPRECIATE ALL YOUR WORK. 
          THANKS. 
          THANK YOU GUY SYLVIA SPINELLI WILL BE FOLLOWED BY JENNIFER MAY. 
          SYLVIA CEPI, A RESIDENT SINCE 1994. 
          SORRY. 
          IF THIS WERE A PRIVATE PROJECT LOOKING FOR INVESTORS, UNDERLYING FEASIBILITY STUDIES, FISCAL AND DEVELOPMENTAL REQUIREMENTS WOULD BE MANDATORY. 
          NOW THE CITY IS THE OWNER DEVELOPER WITH DEBT ON THE PROPERTY. 
          IT CONTROLS ZONING BUILDING CODES, DESIGN REVIEW APPROVALS, OVERSEAS FISCAL BUDGETS AND CITY FUNDS DETERMINES THE MASTER DEVELOPER AND HOW PARCELS TO INDIVIDUAL DEVELOPERS WILL BE SOLD. 
          THIS CLOSED CIRCUIT CONTROL AFFECTS ALL RESIDENTS. 
          FOR BETTER OR WORSE, FLEXIBLE CONDITIONS WERE INITIATED TO PREVENT CHANGING THE GUARANTEE OF THE FOREST SERVICE, THAT 50% OF THE LAND WOULD BE OPEN TO THE PUBLIC. 
          IT APPEARS THAT FLEXIBILITY ENABLES THE CITY TO MAKE THAT OR OTHER CHANGES WITHOUT ANY LIMITATIONS OR SUCH LIMITATIONS. 
          CURRENT PLAN CLEARLY SHOWS A HOUSING DEVELOPMENT, 430 UNITS IN COMMUNITY SPACES, CONSUMING 29.4 OF THE 41 ACRES, LEAVING ONLY 11.6 ACRES OF NATURAL OPEN SPACE. 
          I SUGGEST THIS RATIO BE INVERTED THOUGH WORTH CONSIDERING. 
          AFFORDABLE HOUSING ON THIS COMPLEX SITE IS A FALLACY. 
          IS THE ALL IN DEVELOPMENT COST OF THE 11.4 HOUSING ACRES KNOWN? HOW DOES THAT COST COMPARE TO FLAT PARCELS? LIKE THE DELLS, THE MASTER DEVELOPER OVERSEES LARGE SCALE GRADING OF DEVELOPMENT SITES TO ENSURE BUILD READY PARCELS. 
          THE INFRASTRUCTURE, THAT SECTION ALONE SHOULD GIVE PAUSE TO ANYONE SUPPORTING THE PLAN. 
          AFTER PHASE ONE IS COMPLETE, THE LAND MAY LINGER AS A CONSTRUCTION SITE FOR YEARS, THE CITY SHOULD PROVIDE BEST AND WORST CASE TIMELINES. 
          CAN THE CITY EXECUTE THIS IN A FISCALLY RESPONSIBLE AND TIMELY MANNER? THE CITY'S KNOWN FOR ITS NOTORIOUSLY SLOW APPROACH TO DESIGN, REVIEW, AND APPROVAL PROCESS. 
          IT CAN TAKE YEARS FOR AN EXISTING COMMERCIAL BUILDING RENOVATION, LET ALONE AN ENTIRE COMMUNITY WITH DIFFERENT DEVELOPERS. 
          WHAT WILL THIS PROJECT TRULY COST? IS THERE A FINANCIAL ANALYSIS FOR FUNDING COST, REVENUE AND OPERATIONAL PROJECTIONS? 
          [02:45:01]
OTHER CITY REAL ESTATE VENTURES ARE RUNNING OVER BUDGET AND SCHEDULE. 
          I RECOMMEND THE CITY PROVIDE LIVE ONGOING ACCESS TO ALL BUDGETS AND EXPENSES OF THE CULTURAL PARK. 
          THE CULTURAL PARK IS CHAINED OFF WITH NO TRESPASSING SIGNS. 
          RESIDENTS SHOULD WALK THE SITE TO MAKE INFORMED DECISIONS. 
          CAN COUNCIL AND CITY EMPLOYEES PROVIDE GUIDED TOURS? UM, PLEASE READ, UH, THE, MY FULL TEXT ON SEDONA BIZ. 
          BUT I'D LIKE YOU TO, UM, TAKE A LOOK AT THE, WHAT MY THOUGHTS ARE ON YAVAPAI COLLEGE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          AND SYLVIA, I APOLOGIZE FOR SCREWING UP YOUR NAME A LITTLE BIT. 
          . 
          IT'S OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          IT'S, YEAH, RIGHT. 
          UH, JENNIFER MAY WILL BE FOLLOWED BY TIM PERRY. 
          JENNIFER MAY, UH, I RESIDE IN HORTONVILLE, BUT OWN A BUSINESS HERE IN SEDONA. 
          UM, GOOD AFTERNOON MAYOR AND COUNCIL. 
          AS A LIFELONG SEDONA RESIDENT, BORN HERE IN 1970 AND A MEMBER OF THE SEDONA CULTURAL PARK 2.0 BOARD. 
          I'M ALSO A BUSINESS OWNER, A DAILY COMMUTER. 
          MYSELF. 
          I AM DEEPLY INVESTED IN OUR COMMUNITY'S FUTURE. 
          I URGE YOU TO RECONSIDER DEMOLISHING THE SEDONA CULTURAL PARK AMPHITHEATER FOR HIGH DENSITY HOUSING. 
          WHILE THE HOUSING CRISIS IS REAL, THIS PLAN IS NEITHER FEASIBLE NOR OPTIMAL BUILDING 430 UNITS ON THIS ROCKY 41 ACRE SITE PURCHASED FOR $23 MILLION, WOULD INFLATE COSTS AND REQUIRE TAXPAYER SUBSIDIES, WHICH ARE NEITHER SUSTAINABLE NOR FAIR. 
          INSTEAD, REVIVING THE AMPHITHEATER CAN GENERATE REVENUE FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING ELSEWHERE WITHOUT BURDENING LOCALS SEDONAS TOURISM ECONOMY SUFFERS SEASONAL SWINGS, CUTTING JOBS IN SUMMER AND WINTER. 
          AT OUR HOTEL, WE HAVE REDUCED 11 THOU, 1,150 LABOR HOURS EVERY TWO WEEKS IN JULY AND IN AUGUST, WHICH STRAINS THE WORKERS' LIVELIHOODS A VIBRANT AMPHITHEATER COULD HOST YEAR-ROUND EVENTS, STABILIZING JOBS AND REVENUE FOR THE WORKFORCE THAT WE AIM TO SUPPORT. 
          NATIONWIDE CITIES ARE INVESTING IN AMPHITHEATERS ALL OVER THERE HAVE BEEN 50 TO 70 BUILT SINCE 2015 WITH ANOTHER 50 ESTIMATED THAT ARE PLANNED CAPITALIZING ON THE MUSIC INDUSTRY. 
          TOURING BOOM, EARMARKING AMPHITHEATER. 
          REVENUE FOR HOUSING ON SUITABLE LAND LIKE OUR PROPOSED 700 ACRE DELLS PROJECT WE SUBMITTED TO YOU FOR THE 500 TO 700 UNITS OFFERS A SMARTER, A SMARTER SOLUTION. 
          ALTERNATIVELY, DISPERSING HOUSING ACROSS SMALLER SITES AVOIDS OVERCROWDING. 
          CRITICS CLAIM THE AMPHITHEATER FAILED BEFORE, BUT TODAY'S WORLD IS DIFFERENT WITH APPS, PEOPLE PLAN CONCERTS MONTHS AHEAD, BOOKING HOTELS AND BO BOOSTING EXISTING INFRASTRUCTURE. 
          UNLIKE 430 APARTMENTS THAT ADD AN ESTIMATED 860 DAILY VEHICLE TRIPS AND CONSTANT CONGESTION AMPHITHEATER EVENTS CREATE PREDICTABLE, MANAGEABLE TRAFFIC. 
          THIS IS YOUR MOMENT, MAYOR AND COUNCIL TO CEMENT A VISION LEGACY BY PERVERSING PER PRESERVING THE SEDONA CULTURAL PARK, YOU CAN HARNESS ITS ECONOMIC POWER TO FUND WORKFORCE HOUSING WISELY, PROTECTING OUR COMMUNITY'S SOUL AND SAFEGUARD OUR GOLDEN GOOSE IN THE SEDONA CULTURAL PARK AMPHITHEATER AND LEADING THAT LEGACY FOR FUTURE GENERATIONS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU JENNIFER. 
          TIM PERRY WILL BE FOLLOWED BY, UH, ROBERT COSTA. 
          GOOD AFTERNOON, COUNSELORS. 
          MY NAME IS TIM PERRY AND I LIVE IN SEDONA FOR THIS AFTERNOON'S DISCUSSION I'D LIKE TO PUT ASIDE FOR A COUPLE MINUTES. 
          UH, SOME OF THE MINOR LIES WE'VE BEEN, UH, TOLD ABOUT THIS PROJECT AND THIS LOCATION. 
          THINGS LIKE, UH, THE, UH, PUBLIC SURVEYS BEING FAIR AND TRANSPARENT. 
          THANK YOU, LAUREN. 
          AND, UH, THINGS LIKE THIS FANTASY THAT DEMOLISHING THE CULTURAL PARK WILL SOMEHOW BE A MAGIC BULLET THAT WILL SOLVE SEDONAS WORKFORCE HOUSING PROBLEM. 
          LET'S TAKE A MOMENT INSTEAD TO CONSIDER ONE UNSPOKEN FACTOR THAT IS DRIVING THE DISCUSSION BEHIND THE SCENES FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE, WHICH IS THE ASSUMPTION THAT HOUSING IS SOMEHOW MORE NECESSARY THAN THE ARTS. 
          THIS PROPOSAL IS ABSOLUTELY FALSE. 
          ARTS ARE NOT NICE. 
          THEY'RE NOT OPTIONAL, THEY'RE NOT A LUXURY, THEY'RE NOT AN EXTRA. 
          THEY ARE ONE OF THE FACTORS THAT MAKE HUMAN BEINGS HUMANS IN THE FIRST PLACE AND ALLOW US TO BUILD CIVILIZED, ORGANIZED SOCIETIES. 
          THIS IS NOT A METAPHYSICAL RELATIONSHIP. 
          THIS IS A PHYSICAL ONE. 
          THE SAME BIOCHEMICALS THAT ENTER OUR BODIES FROM THE ACT OF PARTICIPATING IN THE ARTS, AND ESPECIALLY FROM PARTICIPATING IN THE PERFORMING ARTS, CONTRIBUTE TO UNDERPINNING HUMAN COGNITION, MORALITY, AND SOCIALITY FUNCTIONING SOCIETIES AND NORMAL HUMAN BEINGS CANNOT EXIST WITHOUT REGULAR PARTICIPATION IN THE ARTS. 
          IT FOLLOWS FROM THE INEXORABLE LOGIC THAT ANY VOTE TO DEMOLISH THE SEDONA CULTURAL PARK AND 
          [02:50:02]
TRANSFORM IT INTO HOUSING RATHER THAN ARTS VENUE IS A VOTE AGAINST THE ENTIRE FUTURE OF THE HUMAN SPECIES. 
          IT IS TIME THAT THE PEOPLE OF SEDONA STARTED TO REJECT MATERIALISM AND UTILITARIANISM AND PRAGMATISM AND THE TYRANNY THAT GOES ALONG WITH THEM. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, IN SPITE OF THE, THIS COUNCIL'S COMPLETE IGNORANCE AND DISDAIN FOR THE ARTS AND ITS LACK OF EMPATHY AND JOY, I HAVE EVERY CONFIDENT THAT THE PEOPLE OF SEDONA WILL MAKE THIS CHOICE. 
          AND THAT THEY WILL VOTE NEXT NOVEMBER TO PRESERVE THE PARK AS A PARK AND TO EVENTUALLY REOPEN THE VENUE. 
          IT IS TIME FOR SEDONA TO RECOMMIT TO ITS LEGACY AS A CITY ANIMATED BY THE ARTS. 
          A CITY WHICH IS ANIMATED BY THE MOST ESSENTIAL IDEALS OF HUMANITY IS TIME FOR US TO BECOME FOR THE FUTURE, A CITY IN WHICH ARTS ARE PART OF THE DAILY LIFE OF MOST OF THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THIS CITY. 
          AND THE CULTURAL PARK IS AN INTEGRAL AND IMPORTANT PART OF THAT EXPERIENCE. 
          NOW, GOD BE THANKED WHO HAS MATCHED US WITH THIS HOUR. 
          THANK YOU. 
          ROBERT KOSTER WILL BE FOLLOWED BY STEVE THOMPSON. 
          ROBERT, DO YOU, ARE YOU? YEAH, I'M COMING UP. 
          OKAY. 
          I WASN'T SURE THAT WAS OUT LATE. 
          DON'T, DON'T START THE CLOCK YET, PLEASE. 
          NO, NO. 
          , . 
          START START TALKING. 
          OKAY, WELL I WON'T START TALKING. 
          OKAY. 
          START WITH YOUR NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE PLEASE. 
          UH, MY NAME IS ROBERT COSTER AND I LIVE HERE IN SEDONA. 
          I HAVE SOMETHING TO READ HERE, BUT I WANT TO TAKE, MAKE TWO POINTS. 
          FIRST. 
          FIRST, I DID PARTICIPATE IN THE, UH, EASEL BOARD WITH THE, UH, DOTS EXERCISE THREE TIMES. 
          UM, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT WAS A FAIR CROSS SEGMENT OF EVERYTHING THAT THE PEOPLE OF SEDONA HAVE WANT IN TERMS OF WHAT WE HAVE HERE TODAY. 
          THE SECOND WAS A COMMENT THAT WAS MADE ABOUT WHEN THIS IS BUILT. 
          WELL, I, I HAVE TO REMIND YOU THAT WE HAVE AN INITIATIVE, WE'RE TRYING TO GET ENOUGH SIGNATURES TO GET ON THE BALLOT FOR NEXT YEAR SO THAT WHEN SHOULD BE CHANGED TO, IF THAT'S THE FIRST THING I WANT, THAT'S THE TWO COMMENTS I WANNA MAKE. 
          MENTION. 
          I'M JUST GONNA GO AHEAD AND READ SOMETHING HERE. 
          HOPEFULLY I'LL COVER IT ALL WITHIN MY TWO MINUTES. 
          UH, AND YOU KNOW, FIRST I HAD TO ASK THE QUESTION IS, WHAT IS THE PURPOSE AND CHARTER OF CITY GOVERNMENTS? I'M GONNA READ SOMETHING I JUST PULLED OFF THE INTERNET. 
          CITY GOVERNMENTS ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR SERVING THE NEEDS OF THEIR CITIZENS. 
          STATES GRANTS POWER TO LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, CITY OFFICIALS WORK COLLA COLLABORATIVELY WITH STATE AND FEDERAL AGENCIES ON LOCAL ISSUES. 
          CITY OFFICIALS COMMONLY INCLUDE CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS, MAYORS, CITY ATTORNEYS, AND CITY CONTROLLERS, ALL, ALL THE PEOPLE THAT IN THIS ROOM. 
          SO YOUR JOB IS TO LISTEN TO US, RIGHT? I MEAN, WE PUT YOU THERE. 
          I ALREADY KNOW THE ANSWER. 
          I'M GONNA SAY OF COURSE, THAT THAT IS YOUR JOB. 
          YOU WORK FOR US AND AS A RESIDENT OF THE CITY WHO PUT YOU HERE, AND GUESS WHAT, WE CAN JUST AS EASILY REMOVE YOU FROM HERE. 
          NEWSFLASH, OVER THE PAST FEW MONTHS HAVE COLLECTED HUNDREDS OF REGISTERED SEDONA VOTER SIGNATURES FOR THE CULTURAL PARK PRESERVATION ACT INITIATIVE OVER THESE SLOW SUMMER MONTHS. 
          JUST FROM ONE LOCATION, ONE LOCATION. 
          AND WE'RE, WE'RE, WE'RE LOOKING AT A NUMBER OF PLACES WE'RE COLLECTING IT, INCLUDING DOOR TO DOOR AND PROBABLY HAVE OVER TALKED TO OVER 500 PEOPLE AT THIS ONE LOCATION. 
          A PRETTY GOOD CROSS REFERENCE OF THIS CITY. 
          AGAIN, THAT'S JUST ONE LOCATION. 
          AND WHAT DO YOU THINK, YOU KNOW, THE PEOPLE ARE SAYING? WELL, 95% OF 'EM, AND AGAIN, THIS ISN'T SCIENTIFIC, THIS IS KIND OF GUESSING ON ONE HAND HOW MANY DIDN'T LIKE IT VERSUS HOW MANY DID LIKE IT. 
          AND OVERWHELMINGLY THE PEOPLES THAT DONOR AND VISITORS WE TALK TO AGAIN FROM JUST THIS ONE LOCATION ARE NOT IN FAVOR OF WHICH YOU, THE CITY REPRESENTATIVES ARE PUSHING. 
          THAT'S OVERWHELMING. 
          500 PEOPLE. 
          I MEAN, GRANTED SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE FROM VILLE, UM, SOME OF 'EM WERE VILLAGE OF OAK CREEK, SOME OF 'EM WERE OUT OF TOWN, BUT SEVERAL HUNDRED OF 'EM WERE REGISTERED VOTERS AND THEY COLLECTIVELY SAID THAT HOPEFULLY THAT'S NOT A FIRE I NEED TO RUN. 
          UM, I DO HAVE TO CUT YOU OFF THOUGH. 
          I DIDN'T EVEN GET THE REST OF IT. 
          OKAY, I WILL GO AHEAD AND LEAVE THAT WITH YOU. 
          LEAVE IT WITH THE CITY CLERK PLEASE. 
          YEAH. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          AND MY CLOSING COMMENT IS BASICALLY, ROBERT, I'M SORRY YOU'RE OFF THE MIC. 
          ALRIGHT, 
          [02:55:01]
THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          I'D LIKE THAT TO BE ON RECORD. 
          THANK YOU. 
          IT WILL BE ON RECORD. 
          STEVEN WILL BE FOLLOWED BY TIM JESSOP. 
          MR. MAYOR COUNSEL, I'M STEVEN THOMPSON. 
          I'M AN ARCHITECT PLANNER AT SEDONA FOR 40 YEARS. 
          UM, WELCOME TO SEDONA GENTLEMEN. 
          UM, HI, I, I'M HERE. 
          UH, I, I'VE HEARD A LOT OF THINGS I WANTED TO SAY, SO I'M GONNA CUT RIGHT TO SOME OF THE ESSENCE OF WHAT I THINK MIGHT BE CONSIDERED CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM, WHICH I ALWAYS TAKE BACK AND SPEND LATE HOURS ON. 
          UM, YOU MENTIONED, UM, KIERLAND, CONGRATULATIONS. 
          IT'S A GREAT PROJECT. 
          I HANG OUT THERE. 
          UM, TO PUT IT IN YOUR TERMS, I WOULD SAY SEDONA IS PROBABLY A LITTLE MORE LIKE DC RANCH VERSUS KIRLAND. 
          IT'S, THERE'S MORE EVIDENCE OF THE NATURAL LAND WOVEN INTO THE PROJECT. 
          THE BUILDINGS FEEL LIKE THEY BELONG THERE. 
          AND THAT'S SEDONA. 
          THIS IS WHAT WE'VE STRIVED FOR IN OUR COMMUNITY PLAN, OUR DEVELOPMENT, UH, UH, GUIDELINES. 
          AND I'D LIKE TO SEE SOME OF THAT THE NEXT TIME YOU COME TO TOWN, IF POSSIBLE. 
          UM, IT'S NEVER AN EASY TASK, UH, IN GENERAL. 
          UM, I'D LIKE TO SEE A LITTLE MORE OF THE SPIRIT AND ESSENCE OF OUR COMMUNITY PLAN OF OUR CFA OF WHAT A GATEWAY. 
          WHAT'S A GATEWAY? THAT IS WHERE WE MAKE OUR STATEMENT AS TO WHO WE ARE. 
          AND I THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE SOME NATURAL LAND ALONG THE HIGHWAY. 
          I THINK THERE SHOULD BE A BRIDGE WITH A PEDESTRIAN CONNECTION TO THE HIGH SCHOOL AND PERHAPS CULTURAL FACILITIES. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, UM, BACK WHEN WE, I WAS INVOLVED IN THAT PROJECT BACK WHEN WE WERE DOING IT, BILL CLINTON MADE A COMMENT THAT REALLY HIT ME AND THAT WAS, UH, WITH THE DETERIORATION OF COMMUNITY. 
          SO DOES CULTURE GO. 
          AND WE HAVE A SPECIAL CULTURE HERE, AND I'D LIKE THAT TO BECOME A STATEMENT FOR IT, FOR THE WORLD TO SEE WHEN THEY ARRIVE. 
          AND IF YOU CAN IMAGINE THE RED ROCKS UNVEILING THEMSELVES UNDERNEATH THAT AND LOOKING TO THE LEFT AND SEEING, OH, THIS IS WHAT SEDDON IS. 
          THIS PLACE IS DIFFERENT. 
          THESE PEOPLE HAVE IT GOING. 
          AND YOU KNOW, WHO'S IMPRESSIONABLE? WHO'S MOST IMPRESSIONABLE IS OUR YOUNG PEOPLE, OUR CHILDREN, AND OUR, OUR WORKFORCE HAS CHILDREN. 
          WE NEED TO EMBRACE THE VERDE VALLEY. 
          THERE ARE 4,000 WORKFORCE HOUSING UNITS PLANNED IN THE VARIOUS COMMUNITIES IN OUR VALLEY. 
          WE NEED TO BECOME A PIECE OF IT. 
          AND I THINK WE'VE BEEN ISOLATED FROM IT A LITTLE BIT TOO LONG. 
          THERE'S A LOT GOING ON OUT THERE. 
          IT COULD HAVE A VERY REAL EFFECT ON WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE AND HOW WE'RE PLANNING IT. 
          CHURCHILL SAID, AFTER THE RECONSTRUCTION, MAN SHAPES HIS HOME AND HIS HOME IN TURN SHAPES, MAN. 
          AND HE REBUILT ENGLAND THAT WAY. 
          AFTER THE WAR, CHICAGO BURNED DOWN. 
          THEY HIRED THE BEST PLANNERS AND ARCHITECT. 
          THEY WANTED TO MAKE A UNIQUE STATEMENT, AND THEY DID. 
          AND IT'S LASTED 130 YEARS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU STEVEN. 
          TIM JESSUP WILL BE FOLLOWED BY MARK JACOBSON. 
          GOOD AFTERNOON. 
          AND, UH, AND THANK YOU MAYOR. 
          THANK YOU COUNSEL FOR CONSIDERING YOUR NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE. 
          TIM JESSUP. 
          I'M A 25 YEAR RESIDENT OF SEDONA, REGISTERED VOTER YAVAPAI COUNTY. 
          UH, SO I'M A 50 YEAR, UH, VETERAN OF THE MUSIC INDUSTRY, UH, THE LAST ALMOST 16 YEARS NOW WITH THE BAND CHICAGO. 
          AND WE HAVE A STUDIO HERE IN TOWN, WHICH IS LOCATED LITERALLY A HALF A MILE FROM THE SITE OF THE CULTURAL PARK, UM, THIS WEEK. 
          AND CHICAGO ACTUALLY IS PLAYING THREE SOLD OUT BACK TO BACK SHOWS AT THE HOLLYWOOD BOWL. 
          AND THEY WOULD LOVE TO COME BACK HERE. 
          UM, EARLIER IN THE, IN THE CONVERSATION TODAY, UM, THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION ABOUT, UH, OVERBURDENED INCOME RATES AND HOW IT'S AFFECTING THE ABILITY OF LOWER WAGE EARNERS HERE IN TOWN TO HAVE A PLACE TO LIVE IN SEDONA. 
          AND IT SEEMS TO BE A, YOU KNOW, A, A MYTH, UH, TO, TO TRY TO SOLVE THAT. 
          AND I THINK THAT PART OF THAT ANSWER WE COULD BE SITTING ON HERE AT THE CULTURAL PARK IF IT WERE PROPERLY MANAGED, IF IT WERE OPEN AND PROPERLY MANAGED. 
          YOU KNOW, A TYPICALLY A A MAJOR ACT IS GONNA CHARGE YOU ABOUT A HALF A MILLION DOLLARS A NIGHT PER SHOW. 
          OKAY, THAT'S REALISTIC. 
          A THOUSAND DOLLARS, I MEAN, A THOUSAND SEAT TO 
          [03:00:01]
AMPHITHEATER IS NOT GONNA COME CLOSE TO CARRYING THAT KIND OF AN EXPENSE. 
          WHAT WE HAVE THERE NOW AT 5,000 SEATS IS A BARE MINIMUM TO EARN, UH, THE KIND OF REVENUE THAT WOULD MAKE IT WORTHWHILE DOING. 
          UH, SO OVER MY COFFEE THIS MORNING, I WAS JUST CHEWING ON SOME NUMBERS THAT YOU MAY NOT HAVE CONSIDERED. 
          AND SO I JUST WANNA RUN, RUN THESE BY YOU AND HAVE YOU PUT THESE NUMBERS INTO YOUR CALCULATIONS AS YOU'RE TRYING TO COME UP WITH A, A SOLUTION TO THIS, THIS, UH, PROBLEM WE HAVE OF, OF OVERBURDENED, UM, INCOME EARNERS HERE. 
          SO 5,000 SEATS, UH, AT AN AVERAGE TICKET PRICE OF $250, WHICH IS PRETTY AVERAGE THESE DAYS ACROSS THE COUNTRY. 
          UH, IT COMES TO, UH, A GROSS INCOME OF $1,000,250 PER SHOW, MINUS THAT 500,000 I SPOKE OF EARLIER. 
          UH, LEAVES A NET OF $750,000 PER SHOW IF WE'RE DOING 30 SHOWS A YEAR. 
          THAT'S ONE SHOW A WEEK FOR SEVEN MONTHS. 
          WE'RE LOOKING AT $22,000,500 AS AN INCOME. 
          UH, A NET INCOME FROM THAT. 
          UH, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE COULD DOUBLE IT TOO. 
          OH, AM I OUT OF TIME? YOU ARE. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU TIM. 
          UM, ALRIGHT. 
          $900 MILLION IS WHAT WE LEFT ON THE DIRT OUT THERE WHEN THE, WHEN THE CULTURAL PARK CLOSED 20 YEARS AGO UP. 
          THANK YOU, TIM. 
          OKAY. 
          MARK JACOBSON WILL BE FOLLOWED BY DAVID KEY, MARK JACOBSON, UH, LIVE IN SEDONA, LONG-TERM RESIDENT AND BUSINESS OWNER. 
          MARK. 
          MARK ON THE MIC. 
          THERE YOU GO. 
          I'M MARK JACOBSON, LONG-TERM RESIDENT AND BUSINESS OWNER. 
          UM, IN MY BUSINESS, I REPRESENT LOCAL BUSINESSES OR THE MAJORITY OF MY CLIENTS ARE LOCAL BUSINESSES. 
          AND I HEAR THE SAME COMPLAINT EVERY DAY FROM MY CLIENTS AND I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM. 
          AND I BELIEVE THE CITY OF SEDONA AS AN EMPLOYER HAS THE SAME PROBLEM IN RECRUITING, MAINTAINING AND KEEPING EMPLOYEES. 
          UM, IT'S JUST IMPOSSIBLE FOR ONE, COST OF LIVING, AVAILABILITY OF HOUSING, AND, UM, YOU KNOW, THE SALARIES ARE A LITTLE LOWER THAN, THAN TO KEEP UP WITH THAT. 
          AND, UM, SO, YOU KNOW, I IN A SENSE REPRESENT THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY. 
          NOT ALL OF THEM, BUT THE VAST MAJORITY OF THEM. 
          AND, UM, I, I SUPPORT HOUSING ON THIS SITE. 
          IT SHOULD BE A SLAM DUNK. 
          LOOKING AT ALL THE NUMBERS OR THE LACK OF HOUSING NUMBERS, THIS PROJECT SHOULD BE A SLAM DUNK AND WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT WHAT'S NEXT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY, MARK DAVID KEY WILL BE FOLLOWED BY, UH, LARO, MEG, MAYOR AND COUNSEL. 
          YOU ALL HAVE HEARD FROM ME ON OCCASION. 
          I'LL SAY SOME THINGS YOU'VE HEARD BEFORE, BUT I WILL SAY THEM BECAUSE THEY'RE IMPORTANT. 
          I APOLOGIZE, MAYOR. 
          I KNOW THAT. 
          I KNOW THAT. 
          LOOK, DAVID, KEY RESIDENT OF, UH, SEDONA. 
          THANK YOU, UM, HERE ON BEHALF OF THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY AND THE SEDONA CHAMBER OF COMMERCE, UM, YOU KNOW, I I I WAS GLAD THAT POLITICAL WILL CAME UP. 
          I KNOW THAT YOU ALL DECLARED A HOUSING EMERGENCY, SO I THINK THAT YOU ALL DO HAVE THE POLITICAL WILL TO BACK THAT UP. 
          UM, WORKFORCE HOUSING IS THE NUMBER ONE NEED CITED BY OUR EMPLOYERS. 
          I SURVEYED EVERYONE IN REAL TIME AT OUR EVENT IN MARCH. 
          UH, EARLY IN MY TENURE HERE, I WANTED TO KNOW WHAT WAS IMPORTANT. 
          WE DID NOT PREMEDITATE ANY OF THAT. 
          IT WAS ALL IN REAL TIME. 
          THAT WAS THE NUMBER ONE NEED BY FAR, THAT OUR MEMBERSHIP ASKED US TO ADVOCATE FOR. 
          AND FOR ANYONE WHO DOESN'T KNOW, WE HAVE 730 MEMBERS ROUGHLY, DEPENDING ON THE DAY. 
          AND, UM, YOU KNOW, THAT'S A LOUD VOICE. 
          AND WE NEED HOUSING SUPPLY OF ALL STOCK AND SUPPLY. 
          SO THERE ARE SOME FOLKS WHO GRIMACE AT MULTIFAMILY HOUSING. 
          MULTIFAMILY HOUSING IS SUSTAINABLE, WHICH REFLECTS THE VALUES OF THIS COMMUNITY. 
          AND I'VE HEARD THAT ARTS MAY NOT HAVE BEEN PRIORITIZED, BUT I HAVE NEVER BEEN IN A COMMUNITY THAT PRIORITIZES THE ARTS MORE. 
          I HAVE NOT HAD ART AMONG A CITY COUNCIL MEETING. 
          I HAVE NOT HEARD A GUITAR PLAYER START A CITY COUNCIL MEETING BEFORE. 
          WE NEED TO, IN, WE NEED TO INCORPORATE CULTURE THOUGH AT THIS SITE. 
          I THINK THAT HONORS THE SPIRIT OF COMPROMISE, WHICH IS FOUNDATIONAL TO OUR DEMOCRACY. 
          UH, WE NEED TO SUPPORT SMALL VENUES IN THIS TOWN AND ENSURE THEIR SUCCESS BEFORE WE RISK IT ALL IN A LARGE VENTURE. 
          AND THIS PROPERTY SITE IS SAT VACANT FOR SO LONG THAT IT'S STRANGE THAT PEOPLE COME OUT OF THE WOODWORKS NOW. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, WE NEED TO DEED RESTRICT THIS LOCATION. 
          WE DON'T NEED MORE SHORT-TERM RENTALS. 
          WE REALLY DON'T. 
          UM, SO AS THE STUDY SUGGESTED 
          [03:05:01]
THAT RENTAL, UM, OPPORTUNITIES ARE NEEDED COMING IN, I DIDN'T HAVE VERY MANY OPPORTUNITIES AT ALL. 
          WE WERE WORRIED I WOULDN'T GET IN IN TIME, BUT I'M HERE. 
          UM, WE REMAIN COMMITTED TO WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO CALL CONSCIOUS DEVELOPMENT, INTENTIONAL DEVELOPMENT, COMMUNITY-MINDED DEVELOPMENT, RIGHT? SO WE ARE COMMITTED TO EVALUATING THIS PROJECT AND SUPPORTING FUTURE HOUSING PROJECTS ACROSS THE BOARD. 
          AND OF COURSE, EACH OF THESE WILL GO THROUGH PLANNING AND ZONING, WHICH IS, OF COURSE A COMMISSION OF ALL OF YOUR PEERS. 
          SO EACH PROJECT WILL BE EVALUATED ON ITS MERITS. 
          AND I THINK THAT'S IMPORTANT TO RECOGNIZE. 
          YOU KNOW, UH, THE SHRINKING POPULATION CONCERNS ME. 
          THE SCHOOLS ARE AT RISK. 
          THAT REALLY CONCERNS ME. 
          UM, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT WISE, WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT WISE, PEOPLE WON'T MOVE HERE IF THEIR KIDS DON'T HAVE A PLACE TO GO TO SCHOOL. 
          UM, SO THE, THE DISREGARD FOR THAT MAJOR POINT, IT REALLY CONCERNS ME. 
          UM, AND, YOU KNOW, WE NEED TO SECURE OUR WORKFORCE. 
          WE NEED TO BUILD A COMMUNITY WITH THE INDIVIDUALS THAT MAKE ALL THE WHEELS TURN HERE. 
          UM, NAMELY STAFF. 
          YOU GUYS HAVE DONE A GREAT JOB. 
          YOU'RE PURSUING A LOT OF GREAT PROJECTS. 
          UH, I SUPPORT YOU. 
          THE CHAMBER SUPPORTS YOU. 
          UM, THANK YOU FOR YOUR HARD WORK. 
          UM, LAST NOTE I WOULD LEAVE YOU WITH IS I HEAR FEAR IN THE ROOM. 
          FEAR IS EASY, HOPE IS HARDER. 
          WE NEED TO GROW SO OUR COMPET COMMUNITY CAN THRIVE. 
          THANK YOU, DAVID. 
          UH, LAWS ROMIG WILL BE FOLLOWED BY MARY BIRD. 
          MY NAME IS LARS ROEG AND I LIVE IN THE CHAPEL AREA OF SEDONA, LIFELONG VERDE VALLEY RESIDENT. 
          I JUST WANTED TO COME UP HERE AND SAY THAT I, I DEFINITELY SUPPORT THIS PROJECT MOVING FORWARD. 
          UM, IT'S A REALLY BIG LIFT FOR EVERYBODY IN THE CITY, PEOPLE INVOLVED OF TRYING TO BRING TOGETHER ALL THESE DIFFERENT PIECES OF THIS PLAN TO WHERE WE ADDRESS THE HOUSING PROBLEM THAT WE HAVE. 
          I'VE WATCHED THIS AS A, LIKE FROM BEING A SMALL KID HERE TO GROWING UP AND WORKING HERE. 
          LIKE I USED TO BE THE ONE THAT COMMUTED FROM COTTONWOOD, FROM JEROME, FROM COVILLE TO COME OVER HERE AND WORK AND MAKE A LIVING. 
          AND I LIVE HERE NOW AND I'M THANKFUL FOR THAT. 
          BUT I SEE A LOT OF PEOPLE LEAVING OVER THE YEARS. 
          AND SO IT'S SUPER IMPORTANT, I THINK, TO SEE THIS THING WORK. 
          THAT SAID, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE IN THE PROCESS OF WORKING WITH THE CITY, THAT WE DO LISTEN TO EVERYBODY'S INPUT. 
          AND THAT'S ONE THING I'D LIKE TO SAY IN THIS PLAN. 
          WE DO NEED TO SHOW THAT, LIKE I WENT THROUGH THE BUBBLE EXERCISE THAT WE DID IN ONE OF THE FIRST PLANNING SESSIONS AND PULLED THAT AGGREGATE UP. 
          AND WE HAVEN'T REFERENCED THAT FULL AGGREGATE, WHICH WAS 185. 
          AND I DON'T THINK 185 IS THE DEFINITE SOLUTION TO WHAT EVERYBODY SUBMITTED IN THAT PIECE. 
          BUT I DO THINK THAT SHOWING THAT WE LISTEN TO THE COMMUNITY IN THAT MANNER IS IMPORTANT. 
          SO WE SHOULD HAVE THAT, THAT REFERENCE IN THERE. 
          I ALSO AGGREGATED SOME OF WHAT THE, THE, THE VENUE WAS FOR THE AMPHITHEATER, WHICH WAS RIGHT AROUND A THOU ABOUT 1200 SEATS IS WHAT EVERYBODY FROM THE 5,000 TO SOME SAYING, NONE TO SOME SAYING IN THE MIDDLE OF THAT. 
          SO THAT WOULD BE GOOD TO PUT THAT IN THERE, IN MY OPINION. 
          UH, AND THEN I, AGAIN, I WANT TO APPLAUD EVERYBODY FOR TRYING TO TAKE THE TIME TO GET THIS SUPER COMPLEX, UM, GROWTH PIECE OF MAKING SURE THAT WE CAN MOVE FORWARD AS CITY AND MAINTAIN OUR CULTURE OF THE ARTS, MAINTAIN OUR EXPERIENCE THAT WE ALL LOVE HERE OF GETTING OUT INTO THE OUTDOORS. 
          UM, THIS HAS TO REFLECT THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE EVERYTHING TO WHERE WE CAN STILL GO OUT AND ENJOY OUR EVENING SUNSETS, WHICH THIS SITE IS HUGE FOR THAT, RIGHT? LIKE PEOPLE GO OUT OF ALL THE DIFFERENT PLACES. 
          LIKE THIS IS THE ONE YOU CAN ACTUALLY GO OUT AND ENJOY IN YOUR CAR. 
          SO I THINK WE NEED TO MAKE SURE WE TAKE THAT AND SHOW THAT TO THE PEOPLE, HOW THIS WILL WORK ONCE IT'S IN PLACE. 
          UM, AND THEN THE LAST LITTLE BIT, I'LL HIT ON MY PIECE WITH MY HAT FOR THE RABBI DOUGLAS COALITION. 
          SEEING ALL THE PATHWAYS AND EVERYTHING IN HERE WAS SUPER GOOD FOR ME TO SEE THAT. 
          AND I'LL ECHO A LITTLE BIT OF WHAT TRACY SAID IN THAT IT WOULD BE NICE TO SEE HOW THIS INTEGRATES INTO IT SO THAT THE REMAINDER OF THE TRAIL USERS IN THE COMMUNITY CAN ACTUALLY SEE AND FEEL HOW THIS WILL BE. 
          I KNOW WE'RE IN THE BEGINNING OF THIS, BUT I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO SEE JUST ADJACENT TO THIS, WHERE THOSE TRAILS ARE AT AND THE, AT LEAST THE FOOTPRINT OF WHERE THE GURNER TRAILHEAD WILL BE. 
          AND THAT I THINK WOULD BRING THIS THING TOGETHER A LITTLE BIT MORE TO WHERE EVERYBODY CAN SEE. 
          WE DON'T HAVE ANY ASSUMPTIONS OF WHAT THINGS ARE. 
          SO THANK YOU AGAIN FOR THE TIME AND THANK YOU AGAIN FOR ALL THE WORK ON THIS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          LARS MARY BIRD WILL BE FOLLOWED BY HENRY SER. 
          MARY LEFT. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME KNOW. 
          AND THEN, UH, HENRY, ARE YOU HERE? WE'LL BE FOLLOWED BY. 
          AND SCOTT ROSS. 
          HE LEFT ALSO, I BELIEVE. 
          YES, I THINK HE DID. 
          WE WILL BE FOLLOWED BY ANN EMERSON. 
          HENRY, START WITH YOUR NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE. 
          MY NAME IS HENRY SILBIGER AND I LIVE IN SEDONA. 
          I'M HERE TO DISCUSS THE CULTURAL PARKLAND PURCHASE AND PROPOSED USE OF THE LAND BY THE CITY MAYOR AND COUNCIL. 
          WHAT YOU PROPOSED AND THE REDUNDANT RENDERINGS LEAVE A GREAT DEAL TO THE IMAGINATION. 
          IT IS CLEAR THAT YOU HAVE NOT THOUGHT YOUR PLAN THROUGH BASED ON THE INFORMATION YOU PROVIDED. 
          OR DO YOU WANT SCOTTSDALE OR CHANDLER HERE THERE ARE THE DIRECTIONS WE WENT THROUGH REGARDING 
          [03:10:01]
THE CULTURAL PARK. 
          FIRST WORKFORCE HOUSING, THEN LOW INCOME HOUSING AFTER AFFORDABLE HOUSING. 
          FINALLY, MARKET VALUE HOUSING. 
          YOU HAVE CHANGED DIRECTION FOUR TIMES, WHICH IS NOT UNCOMMON FOR A GROUP THAT HAS NOT THOUGHT THROUGH WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO ACHIEVE. 
          YOUR ENDINGS ARE NOT SHOW REALITY, BUT SHOW THOUGHTS OF WHAT MIGHT BE. 
          YOU HAVE NOT SHARED THE COST ASSOCIATED WITH THE PLAN. 
          THERE'S NO BUSINESS OR GOVERNMENT AGENCY THAT WOULD NOT ASK THE QUESTION, DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE COSTS ARE BEFORE THE LAND BUY? HOW MUCH WILL OUR PROJECT COST? SINCE YOU DO NOT HAVE A WORKING PLAN, HOW CAN YOU BUY THE LAND WITHOUT KNOWING WHAT THE FINAL PROJECT WOULD BE? DO YOU KNOW OR HAVE ANY IDEA HOW YOUR PLAN WILL IMPACT THE COMMUNITY TODAY, TOMORROW, AND IN THE FUTURE? YOU SPENT $23 MILLION FOR LAND THAT ON ITS BEST DAY WAS WORTH 14 $19 MILLION. 
          AGAIN, I DO NOT BELIEVE YOU DID YOUR HOMEWORK. 
          OTHER CONSIDERATIONS NOT PRESENTED BY THE CITY COUNCIL AND MAYOR? INCREASE IN TRAFFIC. 
          A HUNDRED THOU A THOUSAND PLUS TRIPS DAILY. 
          THEY'LL USE THE SAME ROAD TRAFFIC IS A COMMUNITY COLLEGE. 
          THE HIGH SCHOOL MARRIOTT RESIDENCE INN. 
          WOW. 
          WHAT CONGESTION? WATER WASTE CAPACITY UPGRADE WATER TANK NEEDED OR UPGRADED ELECTRICAL SERVICES AND WILDFIRE INTERFACE. 
          THEN THERE ARE THE COSTS THAT'LL JUST CONTINUE TO GROW ANNUALLY. 
          INCREASE THE NUMBER OF POLICE, FIRE PERSONNEL. 
          INCREASED THE CITY STAFF TO HANDLE THESE DIGITAL NEEDS. 
          HOW MUCH WILL THIS COST? AND I SAVE THIS FOR LAST. 
          WHAT IS THE COST TO DEVELOP THE LAND BY THE CITY BEFORE DEVELOP TAKES OVER? BEST ESTIMATE. 
          A HUNDRED THOU A HUNDRED MILLION BASED ON THE PREVIOUS PROJECTS. 
          HOW WILL YOU PAY FOR IT? TAXES, BOND ANY WAY YOU DO IT. 
          WE COMMUNITY PAY FOR SOMETHING THAT IS NOT NECESSARY. 
          WE HAVE A SIX YEAR HOUSING PLAN. 
          SAINT FION AND CATHOLIC CHURCH WANTS TO PUT ADDITIONAL HOUSING, THE HOUSING PROJECT ON 89 8. 
          HOW MUCH MORE HOUSING IS NEEDED AND WHY? I WANT TO SAVE OUR BEAUTIFUL COMMUNITY OF THE SEDONA PEOPLE COME HERE TO ENJOY OUR SERENITY TRAILS AND TRANQUILITY. 
          WE LIVE HERE FOR THE SAME REASONS YET. 
          YOU WANT TO BRING A BIG, BRING A BIG YELLOW TAXI AS JOHNNY MITCHELL SAYS, DON'T IT ALWAYS SEEM TO GO THAT YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU GOT TILL IT'S GONE. 
          THEY PAVED PARADISE AND PUT UP A PARKING LOT. 
          WAIT, YOU'VE ALREADY STARTED THAT. 
          AND THE COSTS JUST KEEP GROWING. 
          IN CLOSING, DO WHAT'S RIGHT FOR BEAUTIFUL RURAL RESORT RETIREMENT COMMUNITY. 
          SEDONA. 
          START BEING HONEST AND TRANSPARENT. 
          AFTER ALL, IT'S OUR MONEY YOU ARE SPENDING. 
          AND NOT ALWAYS WISELY MIGHT ADD. 
          ABRAHAM LINCOLN FAMOUSLY SAID, YOU CAN FOOL ALL THE PEOPLE SOME OF THE TIME, SOME OF THE PEOPLE ALL OF THE TIME. 
          BUT YOU CAN'T FOOL ALL THE PEOPLE ALL THE TIME. 
          ANN EMERSON, YOU STILL YEAH. 
          THERE. 
          YOU'RE OKAY. 
          BE FOLLOWED BY PATRICK SCHWEISS. 
          HI, I'M ANN EMERSON, A 40 YEAR RESIDENT OF SEDONA, ARIZONA. 
          AND I HAVE, I'VE GOT SOME BULLET POINTS. 
          FIRST THING THAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT IS LOSING DIVERSITY IN SEDONA. 
          WHEN I MOVED HERE 40 YEARS AGO, IT WAS A FUNKY WORKING CLASS, MIDDLE CLASS ARTIST, COMMUNITY ARTISTS CAN'T AFFORD TO LIVE HERE. 
          THIS IS NOT AN ARTIST COMMUNITY ANYMORE. 
          MY CONCERN IS THE POPULATION IS AGING OUT AND WE ARE NOT REPLACING ALL OF THE OLD PEOPLE WITH YOUNG VITAL LIVES. 
          I'M CONCERNED BECAUSE IF WE DON'T HAVE A DIVERSE POPULATION, WE LOSE VITALITY. 
          AND I THINK LOSING VITALITY. 
          AND IT IS BASICALLY TURNING THIS INTO A OLD FOLKS HOME. 
          AND I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO KEEP BRINGING IN NEW IDEAS, NEW POPULATION, NEW ENERGY, AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS NECESSARY HERE. 
          THE THING THAT I, TWO THINGS, I THINK JUST LISTENING TO OTHER PEOPLE IS WE ALREADY HAVE A FEW ENTERTAINMENT VENUES AND HOW MANY TIMES DO THEY ACTUALLY FILL THE CAPACITY? WE HAVE A BEAUTIFUL OUTDOOR VENUE. 
          WE HAVE THE, UH, A SPACE AT THE PUBLIC LIBRARY. 
          WE HAVE SPAC. 
          HOW OFTEN DO THOSE SPACES GET FILLED? SO INSTEAD OF LOOKING AT BUILDING ANOTHER CULTURAL PARK, WHICH WAS A BUST, WHY DO WE FO WHY FOCUS ON THAT? LET'S GET PEOPLE OUT WITH WHAT WE HAVE. 
          AND THE LAST THING I'M REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT, OR MY QUESTION IS I DIDN'T HEAR ANY TALK ABOUT SUSTAINABILITY IN BUILDING THIS PROJECT. 
          WHAT ABOUT, WHAT ABOUT SOLAR POWERING ELECTRICITY? WHAT ABOUT REP REPURPOSED WATER? WHAT ABOUT USING, HOW DO WE CREATE A SITUATION HERE WHERE WE'RE ACTUALLY REPLICATING A SUSTAINABLE 
          [03:15:01]
LIVABLE COMMUNITY BASED ON OUR CONCERNS ABOUT KEEPING OUR, OUR BEING ABLE TO, UM, EXCUSE ME, I GOT REALLY EXCITED . 
          I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR MORE CONVERSATION ABOUT SUSTAINABILITY AND AFFORDABILITY BECAUSE THAT'S HOW WE SUPPORT OUR WORKFORCE. 
          ANYWAY, THAT'S ALL I GOT FOLKS. 
          THANKS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          AND PATRICK SCHWEISS WILL BE FOLLOWED BY CHRISTOPHER FORD. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR, VICE MAYOR AND CITY COUNCIL. 
          I'M PAT SCHWEISS AND I'VE LIVED IN SEDONA SINCE 1992. 
          AND I'M MARRIED A NATIVE WHO IS WATCHING US RIGHT NOW. 
          HELLO ELIZABETH. 
          UM, I'M GONNA CHANGE THE TONE ENTIRELY AND NOT TALK ABOUT HOUSING OR ANY OF THAT. 
          UM, I WANNA TALK ABOUT THE SEDONA FILM FESTIVAL. 
          WE WOULD LIKE TO GO ON RECORD AS SAYING WE WOULD LIKE TO BE THE DEVELOPERS OF BLOCK ONE AND BLOCK TWO, THE PINK ON THE, ON THE DRAWINGS THERE. 
          WE WOULD LIKE TO BUILD THE SEDONA FILM AND CULTURAL CENTER. 
          MANY OF YOU SAW OUR PLANS. 
          SO I DON'T HAVE TO TAKE UP MY THREE MINUTES OF TIME DOING THIS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          SIX OF YOU WHO CAME TO MY OFFICE AND SAW THE PLANS. 
          DEREK, I KNOW YOU'RE GONNA BE COMING AT SOME POINT AS WELL. 
          UM, WE ARE PLANNING TO BUILD A FOUR THEATER COMPLEX, INCLUDING OUR OWN MOVING, THE MARY D. FISHER THEATER AND ALICE GILL SHELDON THEATER OVER THERE. 
          ADDING A 300 SEAT MUSIC AND LIVE THEATER PERFORMANCE VENUE AND AN, UH, THEATER THAT ALSO CAN BE TRANSFORMED INTO AN EVENT CENTER AS WELL AS SOME FOOD OFFERINGS AND THINGS THAT GO IN THAT, UH, THAT MIXED USE, UH, COMMERCIAL SPACE RIGHT THERE. 
          AND WE'RE GONNA DO IT WITHOUT BUILDING A PARKING GARAGE. 
          ALL THE PARKING WILL BE BUILT INTO THE LANDSCAPING. 
          UM, SO WE'LL, WE'LL BE VERY, VERY GOOD ENVIRONMENTAL NEIGHBORS. 
          AND WE ARE NOT ASKING FOR CITY FUNDS TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN. 
          WE ARE GONNA DEVELOP IT, FUND IT OURSELVES, BUILD IT OURSELVES. 
          THE ONLY THING WE'RE HOPEFULLY ASKING FROM THE CITY WHEN IT GETS DOWN THE ROAD IS HELP WITH THE INFRASTRUCTURE AND THE SEWER LINES, ELECTRICITY VARIANCE AND ALL THOSE KIND OF THINGS. 
          AND WORKING WITH YOU, UH, TO PARTNER ON SHARED YOUTH PA YOUTH PASS PASS THAT WILL SERVICE THE WHATEVER YOU DECIDE TO HAVE HAPPEN IN THE BACK SPACE OF THAT. 
          SO WE'RE ASKING FOR YOUR SUPPORT IN LETTING US BE THE DEVELOPER AS THE PLANS GO ALONG AND GUIDING CITY STAFF TO, UH, TO LET US BE CONSIDERED FOR THAT. 
          FOR BLOCKS ONE AND TWO. 
          AND, UH, WE WOULD ALSO LIKE TO BE CONSIDERED FOR THE PHASE ONE BECAUSE WE BELIEVE WE CAN DO THIS QUICKLY. 
          AND I'M 59 AND I DON'T WANNA BE BUILDING A THEATER WHEN I'M 70. 
          SO LET'S MOVE THIS ALONG FAST. 
          WE'D LIKE TO BE THERE. 
          AND FOR US, VERY, UM, VERY EMOTIONALLY FOR US, WE WERE A PRODUCT OF THE SEDONA CULTURAL PARK IN THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          WE WERE STARTED IN 1995 AS THEY WERE BUILDING FUNDS TO MAKE THE AMPHITHEATER, TO CREATE THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          AND UM, SO WHEN IT WENT BANKRUPT IN 2003, SOME OF YOU MAY OR MAY NOT KNOW THIS, SHEILA JACKMAN AND SOME BOARD MEMBERS BROKE US AWAY AND FORMED OUR OWN 5 0 1 C3. 
          SO WE WOULD NOT GO DOWN WITH THE MOTHERSHIP. 
          SO THIS WOULD BE COMING HOME FOR US. 
          AND NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS ON THE BACKSIDE OF THE PROPERTY, WHETHER YOU DECIDE TO KEEP THE AMPHITHEATER OR MAKE IT HOUSING OR WHATEVER IT IS, WE WILL BE EXCELLENT NEIGHBORS IN A REALLY WONDERFUL CULTURAL THING LEADING RIGHT INTO SEDONA FROM THE WEST. 
          SO THANK YOU. 
          BRING US BACK HOME TO THE CULTURAL PARK. 
          THANK YOU SO MUCH. 
          THANK YOU PATRICK. 
          UH, ALRIGHT. 
          CHRISTOPHER FORD. 
          WE'LL BE FOLLOWED BY ALAN. 
          HEY, UM, GOOD AFTERNOON EVERYONE. 
          SO YES, MY NAME IS CHRIS FORD. 
          I'M A FULL-TIME RESIDENT OF WEST SEDONA. 
          I'M ACTUALLY A MEMBER OF THE CULTURAL PARK 2.0 BOARD. 
          AND I REALLY STRONGLY OPPOSE WHAT DIG HAS JUST PROPOSED. 
          I THINK WHAT WE'VE BEEN SHOWN WOULD LOOK FINE IN SCOTTSDALE, HEY, EVEN BUCKEYE, BUT ABSOLUTELY NOT IN SEDONA. 
          ARE WE REALLY TALKING ABOUT FOUR STORY PRODUCT IN A SITE OF SUCH NATURAL BEAUTY? UM, HONESTLY, THE DISRESPECT TO THE CULTURAL PARK LAND IS NOTHING LESS THAN VANDALISM. 
          THIS IS WHAT I LOOK AT HERE. 
          THIS LAND IS A PLACE OF GREAT SCENIC BEAUTY AND NOT JUST ANOTHER PIECE OF LAND TO BE COVERED IN COOKIE CUTTER PRODUCT. 
          NOW LEMME TALK ABOUT MY OWN BACKGROUND, UH, 'CAUSE I DO SUPPORT THE, UH, REVIVAL OF THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          I'M ACTUALLY A FORMER EXECUTIVE OF PIXAR AND WALT DISNEY COMPANY. 
          UM, A COMPANY THAT KNOWS JUST A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE MANAGEMENT OF LARGE SCALE PERFORMANCE VENUES AND ENTERTAINMENT SPACES, AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, THEIR CONTEMPORARY MANAGEMENT STYLES, TOOLS, AND TECHNIQUES. 
          AND I ALSO HAVE EXTENSIVE EXPERIENCE IN OTHER LARGE SCALE, UH, PERFORMANCE VENUES. 
          THIS IS A SPECTACULAR PLACE THAT DESERVES MORE AND SHOULD BE A TRUE COMMUNITY BENEFIT TO SEDONA. 
          IN FACT, JUST AS, UH, PATRICK HAS SAID, BUT IN A WAY THAT DOESN'T OBLITERATE THIS LAND WITH COOKIE CUTTER BUILDINGS. 
          UM, AND YET WHEN I HEAR OF OBJECTIONS TO THE AMPHITHEATER, MANY OF YOU HERE, ALL I HEAR IS UNINFORMED COMMENTARY ON WHAT WON'T WORK BASED ON SOMETHING THAT DIDN'T WORK 25 YEARS AGO. 
          AND HONESTLY, IN AN INDUSTRY THAT HAS BEEN TRANSFORMED BEYOND ALL RECOGNITION. 
          AND I THINK WHAT'S 
          [03:20:01]
BEEN VERY DISPIRITING, UH, IN FOLLOWING THIS WHOLE SAGA, THE FUTURE OF THE LAND HAS JUST BEEN THE COMPLETE LACK OF VISION OR WILLINGNESS TO CONSIDER THESE ALTERNATIVES. 
          I MEAN, FEW REALLY, IF ANY OF YOU HAVE THE PROFESSIONAL KNOWLEDGE AND AUTHORITY TO TALK ABOUT HOW MODERN LARGE SCALE EVENTS ARE MANAGED. 
          AND NEITHER DOES THIS COUNCIL APPEAR WILLING TO LISTEN. 
          I SUSPECT MANY OF US HERE SUPPORT ADDITIONAL HOUSING. 
          I CERTAINLY DO JUST NOT ON THIS LAND. 
          SO YES, THERE SHOULD BE A PATH TO RESURRECTING THE AMPHITHEATER AND YES, BUILDING MORE HOUSING AND CIVIC AMENITIES. 
          A SOUND SITE PLAN AND BUSINESS PLAN NEEDS TO BE ARTICULATED, BUT IT NEEDS A WILLINGNESS TO SERIOUSLY CONSIDER THE POSSIBILITY AND GENUINELY SUPPORT IT. 
          AND HONESTLY, WHAT I'VE HEARD TODAY AND CERTAINLY WHAT DIGGER HAS PROPOSED, IS ABSOLUTELY NOT IT. 
          SO I DO URGE YOU TO RETHINK THIS HONESTLY APPALLING PROPOSAL. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY, ALAN, UH, WILL BE FOLLOWED BY, UH, CHRISTINE ADAMS. ALAN FEL. 
          UM, I'M A RESIDENT OF SEDONA. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR AND COUNCIL. 
          UH, SOME OF YOU KNOW, I'VE ALSO BEEN A MAYOR AND A COUNCIL MEMBER, SO I AM GRATEFUL FOR THE TIME THAT YOU PUT INTO LISTENING TO US. 
          'CAUSE I KNOW THIS IS A DIFFICULT ISSUE. 
          I'M ALSO A DEVELOPER, AS SOME OF YOU KNOW, I'VE RESTORED SEVERAL DOZEN HISTORIC PROPERTIES THROUGHOUT THE SOUTHWEST. 
          SO WHEN I HEAR WE SHOULDN'T DO THE AMPHITHEATER BECAUSE IT FAILED, I HAVE TO LOOK AT MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE AND THINK, WELL, LA POSADA FAILED TOO. 
          AND IT WAS THE RESURRECTION OF LA POSADA THAT READ TO A RENAISSANCE IN WINSOR, ARIZONA. 
          AND THIS IS NOT A UNIQUE EXPERIENCE. 
          THIS HAPPENS OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN. 
          SO THE FACT THAT SOMETHING FAILED IN THE PAST SHOULD NOT BE THE REASON THAT YOU TEAR IT DOWN. 
          IN FACT, I'D ARGUE THAT THERE'S ZERO COMPELLING REASON TO TEAR DOWN THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          I WAS SURPRISED TO SEE IN THE PRESENTATION PICTURES OF WHAT LOOKED LIKE AMPHITHEATER SPACES THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE BUILT ANEW. 
          WHEN YOU ALREADY HAVE A SPACE WHICH COST THE CITIZENS OF SEDONA MILLIONS OF DOLLARS AND THOUSANDS OF HOURS OF WORK. 
          WHY WOULD YOU TEAR THAT DOWN THIS SPACE, FOR EXAMPLE, YOU SAY YOU NEED A SPACE FOR A THOUSAND PEOPLE. 
          THIS SPACE CAN ACCOMMODATE 20 PEOPLE OR A HUNDRED PEOPLE. 
          SO CAN THE EXISTING AMPHITHEATER. 
          IT DOESN'T NEED TO BE TORN DOWN. 
          THERE'S NO COMPELLING REASON TO DO THAT. 
          NOW, ON THE HOUSING FRONT, UH, I I'M VERY DISTRESSED BY A COUPLE OF COMMISSARY MAY BAYER CONSULTANTS. 
          ONE WAS THAT THE MARKET WILL SOLVE THE PROBLEM. 
          YOU'RE WORKING NOW ON THE SHELBY VILLAS PROJECT, AND OF COURSE THE ORIGINAL BUDGET WAS 14 MILLION. 
          IT BECAME $24 MILLION. 
          IT COULD NOT BE BUILT WITHOUT SIGNIFICANT SUBSIDY, NOT ONLY FROM THE STATE, BUT FROM THE CITY AS WELL. 
          IF THE MARKET CAN SOLVE THAT PROBLEM, IT WOULD SOLVE IT ALL OVER THE COUNTRY. 
          AND IT HAS SOLVED IT NOWHERE IN THE COUNTRY. 
          IF YOU REALLY WANNA BUILD AFFORDABLE HOUSING, WHICH I WOULD ARGUE IS THE ONLY HOUSING THAT THE COMMUNITY SUPPORTS BEING BUILT, YOU WILL HAVE TO SUBSIDIZE IT MASSIVELY. 
          THAT 30 UNIT PROJECT REQUIRED MULTIPLE MILLIONS OF SUBSIDIES. 
          IF YOU WANNA BUILD A COUPLE HUNDRED UNITS OF WORKFORCE HOUSING, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT TENS OF MILLIONS OF CITY SUBSIDIES. 
          JUST RECOGNIZE THE REALITY OF THAT A DEVELOPER IS NOT GOING TO BUILD HUNDREDS OF UNITS OF WORKFORCE HOUSING WITHOUT YOUR SUPPORT. 
          SO I AM VERY MUCH OPPOSED TO THIS PROJECT. 
          I THINK IT DOESN'T REFLECT THE COMMUNITY NEED AT ALL. 
          BUILDING MARKET HOUSING WILL NOT SOLVE ANY PROBLEM IN THE COMMUNITY, AS HAS BEEN WELL EXPRESSED HERE. 
          THE REAL CHALLENGE HERE IS THAT THE PEOPLE WHO WORK HERE CANNOT AFFORD TO LIVE HERE. 
          AND IF YOU WANNA ADDRESS THAT HOUSING PROBLEM, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO EITHER PONY UP A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF MONEY AND RETHINK THIS PROJECT ENTIRELY. 
          SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO NOT SUPPORT THIS PROPOSAL CURRENTLY, BECAUSE I THINK THE COMMUNITY IS GONNA BE SIGNIFICANTLY OPPOSED TO VIRTUALLY ALL OF IT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          CHRISTINE ADAMS WILL BE FOLLOWED BY JOEO WINTER. 
          UH, CHRISTINE ADAMS, UM, BEEN IN SEDONA SINCE 2002, AND A RESIDENT OF THE VERDE VALLEY SINCE 95. 
          UM, BOY, I'LL TELL YOU, MY MIND HAS GONE ALL OVER ABOUT THIS SUBJECT. 
          AND THE THING THAT I THINK COMES UP FOR ME THE MOST IS THE DIVISIVENESS. 
          THAT'S IT'S CREATED IN THE COMMUNITY. 
          AND WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, LIKE HIGH DENSITY HOUSING AND THEN WE HAVE A CULTURAL PARK. 
          SO THE THING THAT I, I CAN'T UNDERSTAND IS WHY THOSE TWO THINGS CAN'T GET MELDED TOGETHER IN A VERY CREATIVE WAY. 
          I MEAN, IF YOU LOOK AT OTHER COMMUNITIES, UM, THAT ARE SIMILAR TO SEDONA OR, OR USED TO BE SIMILAR TO SEDONA AND WHAT THEY'VE DONE WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU LOOK AT PARK CITY, UTAH, WHEN YOU LOOK AT ASPEN, WHEN YOU, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU GO TO, UM, A LOT OF PLACES LIKE THAT, I MEAN, THEY'VE CREATED SOME REALLY CREATIVE I IDEAS. 
          SO THE CULTURAL PARK DOESN'T HAVE TO BE ALL ABOUT 
          [03:25:01]
HOUSING. 
          I MEAN, WHY, WHY DO WE JUST HAVE TO USE THIS BEAUTIFUL PIECE OF LAND THAT IS SUPPOSED TO BE ABOUT CULTURE JUST FOR HOUSING? AND WHY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT JUST AFFORDABLE HOUSING? WE'RE TRYING TO SOLVE A PROBLEM THAT SEDONA HAS MAYBE GONE PAST ALREADY. 
          I MEAN, I, IT'S THE VERDE VALLEY IS WHERE WE LIVE. 
          SEDONA IS IS THE LITTLE DIAMOND IN THE VERDE VALLEY. 
          IT'S ACTUALLY THE LITTLE DIAMOND IN ARIZONA. 
          AND THE THING THAT MAKES IT SO IS NOT JUST THE LANDSCAPE, BUT IT'S THE DIVERSITY OF PEOPLE HERE AND THE OPEN-MINDEDNESS OF ALL OF US. 
          AND I, YOU KNOW, I, THAT'S THE THING I REALLY DON'T WANNA LOSE. 
          I I COME FROM NEW YORK, YOU KNOW, I LIVED IN NEW YORK CITY FOR 15 YEARS, AND WHEN I MOVED TO SCOTTSDALE, YOU KNOW, I DIDN'T SEE THE DIVERSITY. 
          EVERYBODY LOOKED THE SAME. 
          EVERYTHING WAS THE SAME, YOU KNOW? AND WHEN I SEE THIS PLAN, THAT'S THE THING THAT SCARES ME THE MOST IS LIKE, YOU KNOW, WHY DOES, WHY DO WE HAVE TO HAVE, UM, ANOTHER SCOTTSDALE IN, IN SEDONA? AND THAT'S WHAT I SEE HAPPENING HERE. 
          A LOT OF THE REALLY UNUSUAL BUILDINGS ARE GONE. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, AND A LOT OF THE ARTISTS HAVE MOVED. 
          SO I THINK WE NEED TO KEEP ART IN THE FRONT OF OUR MINDS NO MATTER WHAT WE DO. 
          LOOK AT THIS, AT THE, UM, THE, THE PRESERVE AND THINK ABOUT WE COULD PUT A BEAUTIFUL, UM, AMPHITHEATER OUT THERE AS WELL. 
          WE COULD HAVE HOUSING IN BOTH PLACES. 
          I MEAN, YOU GOTTA REALLY GET MUCH MORE CREATIVE. 
          THIS IS NOT CREATIVE. 
          AND I, I LOVE WHAT PATRICK SAID. 
          I MEAN, I I JUST LOVE THAT IDEA. 
          I THINK THAT'S A GREAT PLACE TO START. 
          AND I LIKE WHAT ANN SAID, YOU KNOW, I'M LIKE, LET'S GO BACK TO OUR ROOTS HERE. 
          YOU KNOW, LET'S BECOME SOMETHING WE'RE, WE'RE LOSING ALL THAT. 
          SO THAT'S ALL I HAVE TO SAY. 
           DUETTA WINTER WILL BE FOLLOWED BY SEAN SMITH. 
          DUETTA NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE, PLEASE. 
          HI, JOTA WINTER. 
          I'M A RESIDENT OF SEDONA SINCE, UH, 2020. 
          AND I ALSO, UH, OPPOSE THE PLAN HERE. 
          AND, UH, I AM ALSO A MEMBER OF THE CULTURAL PARK 2.0. 
          UM, MAYOR AND COUNCIL MEMBERS, THE SEDONA CULTURAL PARK HAS ALWAYS BEEN MORE THAN LAND. 
          IT REPRESENTS COMMUNITY. 
          PEOPLE FROM EVERY WALK OF LIFE ONCE GATHERED HERE TO EXPERIENCE MUSIC, ART, AND CONNECTION. 
          THAT WAS ITS ORIGINAL PURPOSE AND IT REMAINS THE VISION TODAY. 
          THE CULTURAL PARK WAS NOT A PRIVATE DEVELOPMENT. 
          IT WAS CREATED FOR PUBLIC USE. 
          THE LAND WAS OBTAINED THROUGH A FOREST SERVICE EXCHANGE IN 1996, THEN APPROVED BY SEDONA VOTERS IN PROPOSITION 400. 
          THE ORIGINAL CCNRS MANDATED THAT THE PROPERTY BE USED AS AN ARTS AND ENTERTAINMENT FACILITY FOR 50 YEARS. 
          THAT'S NOT JUST HISTORY, THAT'S THE FOUNDATION OF THE COMMUNITY'S COMMITMENT. 
          WHAT WE'RE ASKING TODAY IS SIMPLE HONOR, THE LEGACY AND ORIGINAL VISION OF THE CULTURAL PARK. 
          IT WAS ALWAYS MEANT TO BE SEDONAS, CULTURAL HOME. 
          RESTORING IT WILL HELP SEDONA RECLAIM ITS PLACE AS A CENTER FOR THE ARTS, NOT JUST FOR TOURISTS, BUT FOR RESIDENTS AND THE ENTIRE VERDE VALLEY COMMUNITY. 
          ALSO, SINCE I HAVE A LITTLE TIME, UM, EVERYBODY TALKS ABOUT HOW HORRIBLE IT IS FOR WORKERS TO COMMUTE. 
          MANY OF US HAVE MOVED FROM OTHER STATES AND PLACES WHERE IT IS COMMON TO COMMUTE. 
          IT'S NOT A BIG DEAL TO HAVE TO LIVE IN ONE TOWN AND WORK IN ANOTHER TOWN. 
          I MEAN, I DROVE ON FREEWAYS AND SAT THERE FOR AN HOUR IN CALIFORNIA. 
          HERE YOU HAVE THIS BEAUTIFUL ROAD. 
          IF YOU HAVE TO DRIVE TO VILLE COTTONWOOD RIM ROCK, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE ON THE 89 A, YOU DON'T HAVE TRAFFIC. 
          YOU LOOK AT THE BEAUTIFUL MOUNTAINS. 
          I MEAN, IT'S JUST, YOU, YOU GUYS ACT LIKE IT'S A TORTURE THAT SOMEBODY HAS TO COMMUTE AND PEOPLE SHARE RIDES IN A LOT OF PLACES. 
          COUPLE OF PEOPLE WILL RIDE INTO TOWN TOGETHER. 
          I MEAN, THAT'S JUST, IT'S JUST CRAZY THAT THAT'S A, A COMMON THING ALL THE TIME. 
          SO I JUST THINK THAT WE NEED TO QUIT THINKING THAT WAY. 
          WE HAVE PLENTY OF PLACES THAT YOU'RE BUILDING FOR PEOPLE TO LIVE HERE. 
          AND, UM, THIS IS A RESORT COMMUNITY. 
          WE MOVE HERE FOR THE BEAUTY, THE CULTURAL, THE EVERYTHING THAT EVERYONE TALKED ABOUT, NOT SO WE CAN LOOK AT MORE STACK AND PACK HOUSING, YOU KNOW, THREE AND FOUR STORIES HIGH. 
          SO THAT'S ALL I HAVE TO SAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY, SEAN, BEFORE YOU BEGIN, TOM, UH, BENNINGS WILL BE THE FINAL SPEAKER. 
          IF YOU, UH, IF THERE'S ANYBODY LEFT WHO HASN'T SPOKEN, I THINK ALMOST EVERYBODY HERE HAS, WHICH IS GREAT, BUT IF YOU HAVEN'T AND YOU WISH TO SPEAK, NOW IS THE TIME TO FILL OUT A CARD. 
          OTHERWISE, TOM WILL BE OUR LAST SPEAKER. 
          SO, SEAN, NAME AND CITY OF RESIDENCE. 
          ALRIGHT, SEAN SMITH, UH, RESIDENT OF SEDONA. 
          THANK YOU, COUNCIL, CITY MANAGER, STAFF AND PROJECT STAFF. 
          I KEEP HEARING FROM THOSE WHO DON'T WANT DENSITY. 
          [03:30:01]
I COMMUTED AN HOUR EACH WAY FOR 20 YEARS. 
          NOBODY HAS THE LIGHT RIGHT TO LIVE WHERE THEY WORK. 
          THAT DOESN'T REALLY SUPPORT A QUALITY COMMUNITY. 
          IT SUPPORTS THE DESIRE TO HAVE A SINGLE FAMILY HOMES. 
          WE HAVE A VERY DIVERGENT SET OF OPINIONS ABOUT THE VALUE OF A DIVERSE COMMUNITY. 
          SO LET'S HAVE A COMPROMISE. 
          LET'S SAY SOME PEOPLE CAN MAKE LESS AND WIN THE LOTTERY BY LIVING HERE BECAUSE WE SUPPORT MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING. 
          I BELIEVE THAT IF WE DON'T, THIS TOWN WILL CONTINUE TO SHRINK. 
          I APPLAUD THE EFFORTS UNDERWAY IN THE PLANNING PROCESS. 
          AND FOR THIS PROJECT, THIS TOOK THREE YEARS SINCE PURCHASE. 
          AND WE STILL DON'T HAVE A MASTER PLAN YET. 
          THE DELL'S ANOTHER THREE YEARS OUT AT LEAST. 
          LET'S NOT WAIT FOR THE DELLS. 
          WHEN WE HAVE THIS PROJECT THAT CAN MOVE FORWARD NOW AND FAMILIES ARE A PRIORITY, CONSIDER THIS. 
          AND TALKING TO THE SCHOOL DISTRICT, UM, AND SCHOOL BOARD LEADERSHIP, IT WAS CLEAR THAT THREE, THREE BEDROOMS ARE KIND OF A MINIMUM. 
          IF YOU WANT TO TRACK FAMILIES, YOU KIND OF NEED TO FOCUS ON FOUR BEDROOMS AS WELL. 
          UM, THAT ALSO HAS THE EFFECT OF LOWERING THE PARKING DEMAND BECAUSE IF MORE FAMILIES ARE HERE, SOME OF THOSE PRESUMABLY AREN'T DRIVING YET. 
          UM, YOU, I, LOOKING AT THE PICTURES OF THE, THE, THE ROAD AND THE ELEVATION AND THE FOUR STORY SECTION HERE, IT STRUCK ME THAT YOU COULD RAISE THE ROAD BED, HAVE A WALL WITH A DA RAMPS, AND YOU COULD HAVE THE SECOND STORY BE AT THE LEVEL OF THE ROAD THAT WOULD DO TWO THINGS. 
          ONE, YOU COULD HAVE A WIDER ROAD, SO YOU'D HAVE THE ANGLED IN PARKING, BUT IT WAS ALSO CUT DOWN ON COMPLAINTS ABOUT THE VIEW SHED. 
          UH, PARKING WAS NOT TALKED ENOUGH. 
          I, I APPLAUD WHAT GUY GRANT SAID. 
          UM, THE HORSE TRADING TO FIGURE OUT WHATEVER DENSITY MAKES SENSE, WE'RE GONNA NEED ADDITIONAL PARKING. 
          UM, SO RAISING THAT ROAD BED, ALLOWING YOU TO HAVE A WIDER ROAD AND, AND HAVE THAT ANGLE PARKING LIKE WE HAVE IN UPTOWN WHERE YOU CAN KIND OF STILL BACK OUT WITHOUT BEING IN THE ROAD, UH, MAKES A LOT OF SENSE. 
          AND IF YOU'RE GONNA HAVE ANY SORT OF MUSICAL VENUE, YOU'RE GONNA NEED EXTRA PARKING. 
          SO YOU KNOW YOU'RE GONNA NEED, UH, NOW YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A PARKING GARAGE, MAYBE IF WE KEEP KIND OF THINGS AS CONFIGURED HERE. 
          SO IT GETS REALLY KIND OF CRAZY. 
          UM, I'M ALSO, FOR SUSTAINABILITY, I WATCHED THE MEETING ABOUT BRINGING THE TREATED WATER BACK UP TO THE HILL. 
          UM, IT WAS GROSSLY COST PROHIBITIVE TO SERVE THE WHOLE CITY WITH THAT, BUT THAT IS THE CLOSEST PROPERTY TO THE TREATMENT PLANT. 
          SO YOU COULD BRING A PIPE UP, UH, AND SERVE THE, UH, WESTERN GATEWAY AS WELL AS THE HIGH SCHOOL. 
          UM, THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU SEAN. 
          TOM BIDDINGS WILL BE OUR LAST SPEAKER. 
          TOM, ARE YOU STILL HERE? UP THERE YOU GO. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK SO WITH YOUR NAME AND CITY OF MAYOR COUNCIL, I'M TOM BENNINGS. 
          I LIVE IN THE VILLAGE OF OAK CREEK. 
          AND, UM, I WASN'T GONNA SPEAK, BUT A COUPLE THINGS WERE SAID THAT COMPEL ME TO SPEAK TONIGHT. 
          SO, BUT I DO WANT TO THANK YOU FOR PUTTING UP WITH THE CHALLENGE THAT YOU FACE IN MAKING THIS A REALITY IN, UH, WORKING WITH THE CITIZENS. 
          SO I'VE SPENT MY CAREER AS A COMMUNITY ECONOMIST. 
          I'VE DONE LOTS OF FEASIBILITY STUDIES ON WORKFORCE HOUSING AND OTHER TYPES OF HOUSING. 
          I'VE ADVISED STATE LEGISLATURES, ALTHOUGH, AND COMMUNITY, YOU KNOW, UH, CITY COUNCILS AS WELL. 
          AND I'M HERE TO TELL YOU THAT IT IS FEASIBLE. 
          THIS CAN BE DONE AND IT'S ATTAINABLE IN A SUSTAINABLE WAY. 
          IT CAN BE DONE THAT WAY. 
          IT DOES REQUIRE VISION AND POLITICAL WILL. 
          THE TYPE OF VISION I'M TALKING ABOUT IS A VISION THAT WE HEAR FROM PAT SCHWEISS WHEN HE TALKS ABOUT POSS POSSIBILITIES. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, THE, AND I'M REALLY HERE TODAY AND WHAT COMP COMPELLED ME TO SPEAK TWO THINGS. 
          ONE IS THE GROUP THAT'S NOT HERE TODAY, THE WORKERS WHO WORK IN THIS COMMUNITY SERVING THESE PEOPLE, THE BUSINESS OWNERS WHO SERVE THESE PEOPLE, AND THE NONPROFIT ORGANIZATIONS WHO SERVE THESE PEOPLE WHO REPEATEDLY SAY THE NUMBER ONE ISSUE IS ATTAINABLE HOUSING. 
          CERTAINLY IT'S A NATIONAL PROBLEM. 
          IT'S A, UM, IT'S REALLY A WORLDWIDE PROBLEM BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE POLITICAL WILL. 
          AND WE, WE THROW ALL THE CONSTRAINTS OUT THERE AND ALL THE NAYS OF WHY IT CAN'T BE DONE, IT CAN BE DONE. 
          SO MY LAST POINT IS, THERE'S A GENTLEMAN HERE WHO TALKED EARLIER WHO SAID THAT THERE ARE 4,000 WORKFORCE HOUSING UNITS BEING PLANNED IN THE VERDE VALLEY. 
          I WORK THROUGHOUT THE VERDE VALLEY, I MONITOR THE VERDE VALLEY. 
          AND I'M HERE TO TELL YOU THAT THAT IS NOT TRUE. 
          THAT IS WAY OFF. 
          SO WE NEED HOUSING, WE NEED WORKFORCE HOUSING IN SEDONA. 
          IT HAS SUSTAINABILITY ELEMENTS. 
          IT CAN ADD TO NEW PARADIGMS FOR TRANSPORTATION. 
          YOUR SCHOOL SYSTEM NEEDS MORE HOUSING TO BRING IN MORE STUDENTS TO MAKE THEM VIABLE. 
          THE VILLAGE OF OAK CREEK, WE LOST OUR SCHOOL BECAUSE WE DIDN'T HAVE THE SCHOOL 
          [03:35:01]
SYSTEM COULDN'T SUPPORT TWO SCHOOLS. 
          YOU WERE COMPELLED TO MAKE THIS SCHOOL SYSTEM WORK FOR NOT JUST SEDONA, BUT FOR THE VILLAGE OF OAK CREEK AND MAKE IT WORK WELL BY SUPPORTING IT WITH MORE HOUSING. 
          SO THANK YOU. 
          AND AGAIN, UH, BEST WISHES FOR THE EFFORTS YOU'RE GONNA MAKE. 
          OKAY, THANK YOU TOM. 
          TOM WILL BE OUR LAST SPEAKER. 
          WE'LL BRING IT BACK TO COUNCIL. 
          UH, UM, DO YOU WANNA TAKE A, ANOTHER LONGER LITTLE BREAK? I WOULD RATHER MOVE FORWARD SO WE CAN BE DONE. 
          WE'RE ALMOST, WE'RE ALMOST THERE. 
          UM, DO YOU THINK WE CAN BE DONE BY SIX? NO, NO. 
          I'M THROWING IT OUT THERE. 
          I I TAKE THAT MUCH LONGER. 
          OKAY, THAT'S FINE. 
          I, BUT I SAID AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MEETING THAT WE WOULD LOOK AT SIX O'CLOCK TO SEE WHERE WE'RE AT. 
          SO, UH, CARRIE, YOU WANT TO CONTINUE ON WITH ANY, UH, UH, ANY OTHER INFORMATION OR WE JUST DISCUSS IT AMONGST OURSELVES? I WAS JUST GONNA SAY WE'RE HERE AS LONG AS YOU'RE HERE. 
          SO  OKAY. 
          DON'T CHALLENGE US. 
          WE CAN BE HERE, HERE TILL MIDNIGHT. 
          WE'VE DONE THAT ALL CLOSE ENOUGH. 
          BRIAN, I KNOW YOU, YOU LOOK LIKE YOU HAVE, EXCUSE ME, HAVE SOMETHING THAT YOU, UH, LIKE TO SHARE. 
          SURE. 
          I'M HAPPY TO START. 
          UM, FIRST OFF, CARRIE, THANK YOU FOR ALL THE WORK ON THIS. 
          I KNOW IT'S NOT JUST BEEN YOU, STEVE, OBVIOUSLY YOU'VE PLAYED A ROLE, UH, KEEGAN, WHEN WE ASKED FOR MORE COMMUNITY INPUT AND PUT A PAUSE ON THINGS, I KNOW YOU WERE PART OF THAT AND ANNETTE, SO, AND, AND WHOEVER ELSE I'M FORGETTING. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UH, DIG ELLIOT P*****K. 
          THANK YOU. 
          UM, AND THEN OUR COMMUNITY, THANKS FOR HANGING IN THERE, UH, THIS LONG AND TO, UH, PROVIDE US INPUT. 
          I'VE BEEN TAKING COPIOUS NOTES, UM, AND I'M LIKE TRYING TO MELD THEM TOGETHER BETWEEN FOLKS THAT ARE LIKE, I WANT THIS, I WANT THAT. 
          I DON'T WANT THAT. 
          UM, BECAUSE I'M TRYING TO FIND WHERE'S THE COMMON GROUND AND I THINK THERE IS SOME COMMON GROUND TO BE FOUND. 
          BUT WHERE I START, BECAUSE HOUSING IS A PRIMARY ISSUE, AND I THINK A PRIMARY QUESTION FOR THIS PROPERTY IS WHAT'S THE MAXIMUM NUMBER OF HOUSING UNITS THAT SHOULD GO THERE? I HAVE NO IDEA. 
          AND I DON'T KNOW HOW ANY OF US COULD SAY THAT WE KNOW WHAT THE RIGHT NUMBER IS BECAUSE WE LACK A HOUSING STRATEGY RIGHT NOW. 
          AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE WORKING ON IN THE VERY, OR ARE WORKING ON RIGHT NOW. 
          BUT I WANNA BE ABLE TO LOOK EVERYBODY IN THE AUDIENCE AND BE ABLE TO SAY, THIS IS HOW MANY HOUSING UNITS I THINK THAT WE NEED IN SEDONA, REGARDLESS OF WHERE THEY'RE LOCATED. 
          OKAY? BECAUSE YOU TAKE THAT NUMBER AND YOU SUBTRACT OFF EVERYTHING THAT'S IN THE PIPELINE, AND THEN THAT GIVES YOU A GAP. 
          AND THEN YOU CAN START THINKING ABOUT, WELL, HOW MUCH OF THAT GAP MIGHT MAKE SENSE TO, TO FILL FROM WHAT'S HERE? SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MAX NUMBER IS, BUT LIKE STEVEN THOMPSON SAID, IT'S A VERDE VALLEY QUESTION, NOT EVEN JUST A, UH, SEDONA QUESTION. 
          SO WE DO NEED TO TAKE INTO ACCOUNT WHAT'S GOING TO BE BUILT ELSEWHERE. 
          WE NEED TO LOOK AT ALTERNATIVES LIKE EXTENDING, AS I ASKED DURING Q AND A EARLIER, THE VERDE SHUTTLE SAY TO THE VILLAGE OF OAK CREEK AND TO CAMP VERDE. 
          THOSE ARE POTENTIAL SOLUTIONS THAT WILL HELP US. 
          SO WE'VE GOTTA GET THAT QUESTION ANSWERED OF HOW MUCH HOUSING DO WE NEED? PART OF THAT IS GONNA ALSO GET ANSWERED BY HOW MANY BUTTS IN SEATS DO WE NEED IN OUR SCHOOLS? BECAUSE MY NUMBER ONE CONCERN IS THE, THE, THE FAILURE OF OUR SCHOOL SYSTEM BY LACK OF ENROLLMENT. 
          AND THAT REALLY CONCERNS ME. 
          SO MY PRIORITY IS GETTING FAMILIES WITH KIDS IN HERE. 
          AND THAT NEEDS TO BE ALSO PART OF WHAT WE'RE ABLE TO SAY TO THE COMMUNITY. 
          HEY, HERE'S OUR PRIORITY. 
          AND IT ALSO INFORMS, OKAY, YOU KNOW, ONE BEDROOM UNITS AREN'T GONNA HELP US. 
          STUDIOS ARE GONNA DO NOTHING FOR US IN TERMS OF GETTING STUDENTS INTO THE SCHOOLS. 
          WE GOTTA GET TWO, THREE BEDROOM TYPE HOUSING WHEREVER IT IS THAT IT'S GOING TO GO. 
          SO THAT'S IMPORTANT. 
          AND I WOULD HOPE THAT MY COUNCIL COLLEAGUES WOULD AGREE TO PROVIDE DIRECTION TO CITY MANAGER TO WORK ON ARRANGING A MEETING WITH THE SCHOOL DISTRICT BOARD, BECAUSE THAT'S SOMETHING WE'VE NOT DONE DURING MY TIME ON COUNCIL. 
          AND I THINK IT'S WELL OVERDUE THAT WE GET, UH, IN DISCUSSION WITH THEM AND UNDERSTAND WHAT THEIR PRIORITIES ARE AND WHERE, YOU KNOW, WHAT THEIR HOPES ARE. 
          OF COURSE, THEY'RE GONNA WANT AS MANY BUTS AND SEATS AS THEY CAN GET, BUT WE NEED TO FIGURE OUT WHAT'S AN ATTAINABLE SORT OF NUMBER THAT WE THINK MAYBE WE CAN HELP WITH BY PROVIDING HOUSING IN THE CITY. 
          UM, GOSH, WHERE TO GO NEXT ON THIS? UH, I'VE BEEN THINKING ABOUT THIS SO MUCH FOR WEEKS NOW, 
          [03:40:02]
BEYOND GETTING THOSE, UM, CHILDREN IN OUR SCHOOLS. 
          YES, WE NEED, I I'M ASSUMING THAT CHILDREN IN SCHOOLS GETS US THREE CHECK MARKS, THE BUTTS IN THE SEATS, WORKFORCE, UH, EMPLOYEES AND GETTING OUR OVERALL POPULATION BACK UP BECAUSE YOU'RE EITHER GROWING OR DYING. 
          IT'S TRUE IN CHURCHES AND IT'S TRUE IN CITIES AS WELL. 
          AND I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, FIVE AND 10% GROWTH EVERY SINGLE YEAR. 
          UM, BUT JUST THAT LITTLE BIT WHAT'S IN THE ELLIOT P*****K STUDY OF, YOU KNOW, 15 ADDITIONAL HOUSING UNITS A YEAR IS, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, THAT'S KEEPING US ALIVE. 
          LIKE WE NEED THAT. 
          SO, UM, I DO THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE, UH, HAVE THAT MINDSET THAT WE WANT TO GET OUR POPULATION BACK UP. 
          THE FACT THAT YOU ALL IN THE COMMUNITY COULD NOT VOTE ON THE 10 YEAR COMMUNITY PLAN BECAUSE OUR POPULATION DROPPED BELOW 10,000, YOU KNOW, IS SAD. 
          IT REALLY IS. 
          AND YOU KNOW, THANKFULLY REPRESENTATIVE BLISS HAS TRIED TWO LEGISLATIVE SEASONS IN A ROW TO GET, UH, A BILL PASSED TO LET US LET YOU VOTE. 
          AND HAS NOT HAD SUCCESS YET WITH THAT. 
          BUT THAT'S ANOTHER TOPIC FOR ANOTHER DAY. 
          UM, I TAKE SOME EXCEPTION WHEN IT COMES TO THE CRITICISM THAT WE'RE NOT OPEN-MINDED ABOUT RESURRECTING THE CULTURAL PARK AMPHITHEATER. 
          I WANNA BE VERY SPECIFIC ABOUT THAT. 
          WE HAVE BEEN ASKING FOR EASILY A YEAR SHOW US A BUSINESS PLAN OF WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE TO RESURRECT THE CULTURAL PARK AMPHITHEATER. 
          THE ONLY THING I'VE SEEN, WE JUST RECEIVED, I WOULD CALL THAT A STATEMENT OF ASPIRATION. 
          IT SAYS, AMPHITHEATERS ARE GREAT, OTHER COMMUNITIES ARE BUILDING AMPHITHEATERS. 
          WE SHOULD REBUILD OURS. 
          IT'S GONNA HAPPEN IN THREE PHASES AND NEED $21 MILLION. 
          WE'RE NOT GONNA ASK YOU FOR ANY OF IT, AND YOU'RE GONNA GET TONS OF TAX MONEY. 
          IT'S GONNA BE GREAT. 
          YOU'RE GONNA LOVE IT. 
          THAT'S WHAT I'VE SEEN SO FAR. 
          THAT'S NOT A BUSINESS PLAN. 
          THE CLOSEST THING TO A BUSINESS PLAN I JUST HEARD WAS TIM JESSUP. 
          THANK YOU, SIR. 
          UH, STARTING TO TALK ABOUT THIS IS HOW MUCH AN ACT COSTS, THIS IS HOW MUCH AT A CERTAIN NUMBER OF SEATS. 
          THAT'S THE START OF A BUSINESS PLAN. 
          IF YOU'RE SERIOUS ABOUT WANTING US TO EVALUATE THE VIABILITY OF A RESURRECTED AMPHITHEATER, SHOW US A BUSINESS PLAN, SHOW US A STATEMENT OF INTEREST FROM A PRODUCTION COMPANY THAT WOULD ACTUALLY BE SERIOUS ABOUT WORKING WITH THE CP 2.0 ORGANIZATION. 
          WE DON'T HAVE ANY OF THAT. 
          WE LITERALLY HAVE NOTHING TO TAKE SERIOUS RIGHT NOW ABOUT A RESURRECTED AMPHITHEATER. 
          WE JUST SIMPLY DON'T. 
          SO IF YOU ARE SERIOUS ABOUT IT, SHOW US, BRING US A BUSINESS PLAN FOR REAL. 
          I'M, I'M READY TO READ IT. 
          SERIOUSLY. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, YEAH, I I I'LL PROBABLY PAUSE. 
          OH, HAVE WE TALKED TO THE FARMER'S MARKET PEOPLE? LIKE ARE THEY EXCITED ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY OF MOVING THE FARMER'S MARKET OUT HERE? 'CAUSE WE SHOW THAT AND TALK ABOUT THAT AS A POSSIBLE, YOU KNOW, NEW VENUE FOR THEM. 
          HAVE WE EVEN TALKED TO THEM ABOUT THAT? NO, BUT WE CAN. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, OH YEAH. 
          SO ANN EMERSON, YOU TALKED ABOUT LOSING VITALITY. 
          UM, CHRISTINE ADAMS, YOU TALKED ABOUT NOT WANTING SCOTTSDALE REVISITED JOETTA WINNER. 
          YOU TALKED ABOUT NOT WANTING STACK AND PACK HOUSING. 
          OKAY, I HEAR YOU. 
          WHAT CAN WE DO? WHAT WOULD BE SOME COOL HOUSING THAT CAN GO ON THIS LAND THAT MAKES A STATEMENT? I GET IT. 
          THAT SOME OF YOU'RE SAYING, HEY, LET'S MAKE THIS, LET'S MAKE IT COOL. 
          LET'S HAVE IT, LET'S HAVE THAT HOUSING HAVE AN UNMISTAKABLY ARTISTIC QUALITY TO IT. 
          GREAT. 
          BRING IT ON. 
          LET'S DO IT. 
          OKAY. 
          JUST, I DON'T, I CAN'T TELL YOU WHAT THE RIGHT NUMBER IS. 
          UM, FOR THE REASONS I'VE ALREADY STATED. 
          PATRICK, I LOVE YOUR ENERGY. 
          YOU KNOW, SEEING YOUR PLAN FOR WHAT COULD BE OUT HERE IS PRETTY DARN COOL, RIGHT? SO I KNOW YOU'RE GONNA KEEP PUSHING US. 
          ROCK ON. 
          UM, AND I THINK WITH THAT, I'LL TAKE A PAUSE. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU, BRIAN. 
          MELISSA. 
          SO I, I'D LIKE TO START FIRST BY ASKING, UM, LIKE STAFF, SOMEONE MADE THE COMMENT THAT THERE'S 700 ACRES AT THE DELL THAT COULD BE BUILT ON. 
          MY UNDERSTANDING WAS THAT WAS LIKE 200 ACRES. 
          COULD I, COULD I GET SOME? VER SOME, YEAH. 
          THANK, THANK YOU. 
          COUNCILOR DUNN, UH, MAYOR COUNCIL. 
          UM, SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS, UH, AND WE CAN VERIFY THE SPECIFIC NUMBERS FOR YOU, BUT WE HAVE APPROXIMATELY 300 ACRES AT THE DELL THAT'S OWNED AND USED. 
          UH, RIGHT NOW FOR THE WASTEWATER 
          [03:45:01]
TREATMENT PLANT. 
          200 ISH ACRES OF THAT IS CURRENTLY BEING USED FOR DISPOSAL OF THE TREATED EFFLUENT. 
          OKAY? SO, SO JUST, JUST TO BE CLEAR, WHEN IT COMES TO, WE HAVE A LOT OF LAND AND WE CAN BUILD ON IT AND GO BUILD ON THE DOS, THERE'S NOT THAT MUCH LAND IN THE DELLS AS PEOPLE APPARENTLY BELIEVE IN THE COMMUNITY. 
          UM, AND THERE'S A LOT THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE BEFORE WE CAN DO THE DELLS. 
          THERE'S, WE GOTTA GET RID OF ALL THE, YOU KNOW, EFFLUENT. 
          IF YOU'VE COME TO ANY OF THE MEETINGS WITH WASTEWATER, YOU KNOW, THIS IS NON-TRIVIAL FINANCIALLY, THIS IS NON-TRIVIAL AS FAR AS EFFORT AND WORK IS CONCERNED. 
          SO WHEN PEOPLE SAY, GO BUILD IT ON THE DELLS, WE'RE TALKING 10 YEARS FROM NOW, MAYBE I'M LOOKING OVER AT CITY MANAGER. 
          YEAH. 
          I MEAN, WE'RE NOT EVEN AT THE STAGE WHERE WE'RE GONNA KNOW WHEN THEY'RE GONNA BUILD THE WELLS THAT THEY NEED IN ORDER TO REPLACE THE PIPES THAT ARE OUT THERE. 
          SO THE DELLS IS A LONG TIME IN THE FUTURE, AND THIS IS A NEED WE'RE TRYING TO SOLVE CLOSER TO NOW. 
          MEANING IT ISN'T GONNA BE BUILT TOMORROW AND IT ISN'T GONNA BE NEXT YEAR. 
          BUT WE NEED THAT RESOLVED TO, TO MOVE FORWARD NOW. 
          UM, THE OTHER COMMENT THAT WAS MADE WAS, UM, WE'RE A RESORT RETIREMENT COMMUNITY. 
          OH MAN. 
          OH MAN, REALLY? BECAUSE IF WE'RE A RESORT, IF WE'RE SUN CITY OF NORTHERN ARIZONA, WE'RE A DYING COMMUNITY, RIGHT? SO DO WE WANT TO BE A DYING COMMUNITY? WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO NOT GO THAT DIRECTION. 
          AND SO WE SHOULD, WE SHOULD TAKE THAT IN, IN MY OPINION. 
          UM, SO NOW BACK TO MY REGULARLY SCHEDULED COMMENTS. 
          UM, I'VE HEARD A LOT ABOUT THE RECREATION CENTER AND I THINK THAT, THAT BRIAN TOUCHED ON ONE OF THE FUNDAMENTAL ISSUES. 
          I WILL BET THAT THIS IS SUPER EXPENSIVE AND THAT, UM, WE AS A COMMUNITY, WHEN WE CHOKED ON THE COST OF THE GARAGE IN UPTOWN, WE WILL CHOKE ON THE COST OF A RECREATION CENTER IF THE CITY HAS TO BUILD IT. 
          NOW, I DON'T KNOW THAT'S TRUE BECAUSE I'VE NEVER BUILT A RECREATION CENTER, BUT I AM PRETTY SURE WE'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO BUILD ONE THAT'S GONNA BE $2 A DAY FOR US TO GO AND USE. 
          UM, SO IF WE WANT A REC CENTER, THEN I THINK WE NEED TO GO OUT AND ASK STAFF TO GIVE US SOME IDEAS OF WHAT THAT MIGHT COST, IF THAT'S TRULY WHAT WE DECIDE SOMETHING WE WANNA LOOK INTO. 
          BUT I THINK THAT IT'S GONNA BE WAY MORE EXPENSIVE THAN WE'RE THINKING. 
          UM, PERFORMING ARTS, I TOTALLY AGREE. 
          WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE ANIMATED BY THE ARTS. 
          WE HAVE AN AGING ARTIST POPULATION. 
          UM, AND WE DON'T SEEM TO BE ATTRACTING YOUNGER ARTISTS TO COME AND REPLACE THAT. 
          COULD THIS BE A COMMUNITY WHERE WE DO THAT? COULD THERE BE SOMETHING INSIDE OF THE HOUSING THAT MAYBE IT COULD BE, UM, LIVE WORKSPACE WHERE THEY HAVE THEIR WORKSPACE OR GALLERY BELOW AND PEOPLE COME AND THEY, THEY SEE AND THEY LIVE ABOVE. 
          I DON'T KNOW. 
          BUT THAT'S AN ALTERNATIVE. 
          WE DON'T HAVE TO BUILD EXACTLY WHAT WE SEE HERE. 
          SO JUST OTHER THOUGHTS TO THINK ABOUT. 
          WHEN I THINK ABOUT SEDONA, I DON'T THINK OF THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          SORRY GUYS. 
          I THINK ABOUT SIF, RIGHT? I THINK ABOUT THIS. 
          THE, THE, THE INTERNATIONAL FILM FESTIVAL. 
          UM, IT'S BEEN HERE AS LONG AS I'VE BEEN HERE, THAT'S FOR SURE. 
          AND, UM, YEAH, I'D LIKE TO PUT THEM SORT OF AWAY ON THE WEST SIDE. 
          'CAUSE YOU KNOW, YOU GUYS KNOW WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE WHEN THEY'RE IN FULL SWING. 
          SO, UM, I I, I WOULD LOVE TO CONTINUE THE CONVERSATIONS AROUND CIF. 
          I AGREE WITH BRIAN. 
          IF, IF THE, IF THE, UM, AMPHITHEATER HAS SOME IDEAS, GREAT, BRING IT ON. 
          BUT I DON'T WANT TO USE THE ENTIRE PROPERTY FOR THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          I DON'T WANT THE AMPHITHEATER AND THE REST IS ALL PARKING. 
          THAT'S NOT A GOOD USE OF THAT PROPERTY EITHER. 
          SO I REALLY, I, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY'RE THINKING, BUT, UM, I HEARD HIM SAY THEY USED ALL THE REST OF THE PROPERTY FOR PARKING AND THE STREET FOR THE 5,000. 
          I, I'M NOT SURE THAT'S WHAT WE WANNA USE THIS FOR. 
          SO, UM, I GUESS, I GUESS WE GET, WE GET TO THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM HOUSING. 
          UM, AND I, I WILL STILL GO BACK TO MY STATEMENT EARLIER IN THIS QUESTION CONVERSATION. 
          AND THAT'S THE, WHO, WHO ARE WE TRYING TO BUILD HOUSING FOR? ARE WE TRYING TO BUILD HOUSING TO BRING IN YOUNG ARTISTS? THAT'S PROBABLY A DIFFERENT KIND OF HOUSING THAN SOME OTHER KIND OF HOUSING. 
          ARE WE, WE WANT IT AS A AGING FACILITY. 
          WELL, THAT'S A VERY SPECIALIZED FORM OF HOUSING, AND IS THAT REALLY WHAT WE WANT TO DO? UM, BUT I, I JUST WANNA TALK ABOUT THE FACT THAT USUALLY WHEN WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT HOUSING, WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT WHAT YOU MIGHT THINK OF AS HOURLY, 
          [03:50:01]
HOURLY WORKERS, PEOPLE WHO ARE BEING PAID MINIMUM WAGE OR AN HOURLY WAGE. 
          UM, THESE ARE THE PEOPLE WHO, UH, DAVID WAS RES REFERRING TO WHEN HE, WHEN HE REFERS TO PEOPLE WHO ARE SUPPORTING, UM, HOTELS AND RETAIL AND RESTAURANTS. 
          BUT WE HAVE A WHOLE NOTHER CLASS OF PEOPLE IN OUR COMMUNITY. 
          YOU CANNOT LIVE HERE. 
          UM, AND, AND THESE ARE THE SALARIED WORKERS. 
          SO I WANNA JUST TALK ABOUT WHO THESE PEOPLE ARE. 
          THESE ARE OUR FIRST RESPONDERS, THESE ARE HEALTHCARE WORKERS, THESE ARE EDUCATORS, THESE ARE OUR CITY STAFF. 
          THESE ARE THE PEOPLE WHO RUN AND SUPPORT SERVICES THAT WE USE THROUGH CONTRACTS HERE IN THE COMMUNITY. 
          SO I HAVE SOME NUMBERS, WHICH THANK YOU. 
          CITY STAFF, MOSTLY LAUREN FOR, UM, HELPING ME GET THESE NUMBERS. 
          AND I DON'T HAVE ALL OF THEM, BUT THESE ARE THE ONES I HAVE. 
          SO WE HAVE 26 SWORN OFFICERS. 
          DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY LIVE IN THE CITY? 1, 1 1 OF 26 SWORN OFFICERS LIVES INSIDE THE CITY LIMITS. 
          SO WHEN WE HAVE AN EMERGENCY HERE, THE ONES WHO ARE HERE OR WHOEVER IS ON DUTY, AND THEN THE REST OF THEM HAVE TO TRAVEL 25 TO 45 MINUTES TO GET INTO TOWN DEPENDING ON WHERE THEY LIVE IN THE VERDE VALLEY. 
          UM, AND THEY MAY NOT BE ABLE TO GET IN BECAUSE WE HAVE ONLY TWO WAYS IN 89 A AND, UM, UH, 79, 1 79. 
          AND GUESS WHO'S GONNA BE ON THOSE ROADS TRYING TO GET OUT, RIGHT? SO THAT'S ONE THING. 
          SO LET'S ALSO TALK ABOUT THE, UM, 87 INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE QUALIFIED TO WORK IN FIRE OPERATIONS. 
          FIREMEN. 
          DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY LIVE INSIDE THE CITY? 2, 5, 5 OF 87 LIVE INSIDE OF OUR CITY. 
          EIGHT. 
          ONLY EIGHT. 
          SO THREE MORE LIVE INSIDE THE FIRE DISTRICT, WHICH IS BIGGER THAN THE CITY OF SEDONA, RIGHT? UM, SO HEALTHCARE PROFESSIONALS, I DON'T HAVE ANY NUMBERS HERE, BUT I KNOW THAT WE ALL COMPLAIN ABOUT EVERY THREE MONTHS WE GET A LETTER FROM NAH THAT SAYS OUR DOCTOR HAS CHANGED, RIGHT? BECAUSE THE OTHER DOCTOR HAS RETIRED OR MOVED AWAY, OR THEY WERE A LOCUM. 
          SO THEY'RE ONLY HERE ON A CONTRACT FOR SIX MONTHS OR EIGHT MONTHS OR A YEAR. 
          UM, I'VE GOTTEN SOME FEEDBACK THAT A LOT OF TIMES THESE YOUNGER DOCTORS, THEY HAVE FAMILIES THEY COULD AFFORD POTENTIALLY TO BUY A HOME HERE, BUT THEY DON'T BECAUSE THERE'S NO NO SCHOOLS, THERE'S NO YOUTH ACTIVITIES AFTER THE SCHOOLS. 
          THERE'S NO PRESCHOOL CARE, THERE'S NOTHING THAT SUPPORTS IN OUR COMMUNITY, A FAMILY. 
          SO THAT'S SOMETHING FOR US, I THINK TO THINK ABOUT. 
          AND THAT KIND OF BRINGS ME, UM, TO OUR CITY EMPLOYEES AND SERVICE CONTRACTORS. 
          SO WE HAVE 178 CITY EMPLOYEES, 27 OF THEM LIVE WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS. 
          UM, SOME OF THEM LIVE AS FAR AWAY AS FLAGSTAFF. 
          THEY HAVE LONG COMMUTES TO GET HERE. 
          UM, OF THE PEOPLE WHO WORK, THE EIGHT PEOPLE WHO SUPPORT THE COMMUNITY CENTER, WHICH IS ONE OF OUR SERVICE CONTRACT PROVIDERS, ONLY TWO LIVE INSIDE THE CITY LIMITS OF THE 30 HUMANE SOCIETY EMPLOYEES ONLY THREE LIVE INSIDE THE CITY LIMITS. 
          AND OF THE 27 COMMUNITY LIBRARY, SEDONA EMPLOYEES, ONLY TWO LIVE INSIDE THE CITY LIMITS. 
          SO THESE ARE PEOPLE WHO WE ARE, WE, WE RELY ON TO PROVIDE US WITH OTHER SERVICES. 
          UM, AND THEY'RE NOT ABLE TO AFFORD TO LIVE INSIDE OF OUR CITY. 
          SO, I DON'T KNOW. 
          AND WE, WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT EDUCATORS, UM, BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE NO CONTROL OVER SALARIES. 
          THAT'S SORT OF A STATE WHEN WE HAVE NO CONTROL OVER HIRING BECAUSE THEY'RE OWNED BY THE COUNTIES, NOT THE CITY. 
          THIS IS THE ONLY THING THAT WE CAN DO TO TRY AND SUPPORT EDUCATORS AND ATTRACTING AND RETAINING HIGH QUALITY EDUCATORS IN OUR COMMUNITY IS THROUGH HOUSING IN SUPPORT SERVICES. 
          SO IT JUST, WHEN, WHEN I JUST HEARD I HAVE, I HAVE A FRIEND WHOSE DAUGHTER IS OVER AT RED ROCK, AND, UM, THEY'RE CUTTING BACK ON THEIR SPORTS BECAUSE THEY CAN'T GET COACHES. 
          WHY CAN THEY NOT GET COACHES? BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANNA STAY. 
          THEY HAVE TO TRAVEL 25 TO 45 MINUTES TO GET HOME. 
          AND THEY WOULD RATHER SPEND THAT TIME WITH THEIR FAMILIES THAN SPEND THEM SPONSORING CLUBS OR COACHING. 
          SO WE HAVE IT IN OUR POWER, IF WE HAVE THE WILL TO DO IT, TO TRY AND BE CREATIVE AND FIND WAYS TO USE AT LEAST A FRACTION OF THIS PROPERTY FOR HOUSING THAT WILL SUPPORT FAMILIES AND WILL SUPPORT THE PEOPLE WHO SUPPORT OUR COMMUNITY. 
          UM, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THOSE TYPES OF HOUSINGS WILL BE THAT WE'RE 
          [03:55:01]
TWO. 
          I I THINK LARS SAID IT, WE'RE AT THE BEGINNING OF THIS. 
          WE'RE NOT AT THE END OF THIS, RIGHT? SO WE'RE BEGINNING. 
          YOU, YOU, YOU ASKED FOR A LOT OF DETAILS. 
          WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT THERE YET, BUT WE HAVE TO KEEP HAVING THIS CONVERSATION BECAUSE I THINK THAT THIS IS THE FUTURE OF OUR COMMUNITY THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. 
          AND I THINK IT SHOULD BE IMPORTANT TO ALL OF US, AND IT'S CERTAINLY IMPORTANT TO ME. 
          THANK YOU, MELISSA. 
          I JUST LEARNED A A LOT FROM, THAT WAS A GOOD STATS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          WE ARE DATA ORIENTED UP HERE. 
          YOU AND I APPRECIATE THAT VICE MAYOR. 
          SO I, I REALLY DO NOT SUPPORT THIS PLAN. 
          THERE'S ALMOST NOTHING IN HERE THAT I SUPPORT EXCEPT FOR OPEN SPACE. 
          UH, IT DOESN'T FEEL LIKE SEDONA. 
          IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE SEDONAS. 
          I'M SURPRISED THAT OUR CONSULTANT HASN'T, FOR ALL THE TIME THAT THEY'VE BEEN HERE, JUST HAVEN'T SEEMED TO HAVE GRASPED WHO WE ARE. 
          AND IT'S NOT REFLECTED IN THIS PLAN. 
          I, SO I THINK IT'S TOO DENSE. 
          I THINK THEY, THEY'RE TOO THE, IT'S TOO, TOO, BESIDES BEING TOO DENSE, THERE DON'T, THEY DON'T HAVE A FEEL THAT I, LIKE, I WOULD NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS WANT A GARAGE THERE BY GOD. 
          UH, IT, IT JUST ISN'T, I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS. 
          I MEAN, IT'S PHOENIX, IT'S SOME COMMUNITY SOMEWHERE, BUT IT'S NOT SEDONA. 
          I'VE GIVEN THAT INPUT OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN. 
          THE PLAN KEEPS COMING BACK THE SAME, ACTUALLY WORSE FROM MY OPINION ON SOME THINGS. 
          SO I'M READY TO JUST DUMP IT. 
          BUT I, AND HAVING SAID THAT, I, I DO THINK THAT A COMPROMISE COULD BE AN ORDER AND, AND, UH, CHRISTINE'S NOT HERE, BUT I LIKED HER COMMENTS ABOUT WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE ONLY ONE THING OR ONLY ANOTHER THING? WHY CAN'T WE WORK, FIND SOME COMMON GROUND SO THAT WE MAKE THIS PLACE SOMETHING WE'RE ALL PROUD OF? AND I WAS REALLY DISAPPOINTED, I HAVE TO SAY TO THE 2.0 BOARD MEMBERS, BECAUSE I WAS TOLD THAT YOU GUYS WERE GOING TO PRESENT US WITH SOMETHING THAT INCORPORATED SOME HOUSING. 
          AND THEN I WAS TOLD THAT THE BOARD REJECTED THAT. 
          AND I'M SORRY ABOUT THAT, BECAUSE I THINK IN ORDER TO COME TOGETHER, WE NEED FLEXIBILITY ON BOTH SIDES TO LOOK AT WHAT THE OPTIONS COULD BE AND SHOULD BE. 
          UH, I'VE BEEN READING SOCIAL MEDIA AGAINST MY BETTER JUDGMENT AND UH, I'VE SEEN HOW MANY PEOPLE WANNA A REC CENTER OR SOMETHING FOR THE COMMUNITY. 
          AND, AND, UH, I, I THINK WE COULD, WE NEED COMMUNITY BENEFITS SO THAT THIS 40 ACRES, WHICH IS THE LAST LARGE PIECE WITHIN THE CLOSE, AND YOU KNOW, WE JUST, UH, WE JUST BROUGHT, UH, SEDONA, YOU KNOW, WE JUST, UH, WHAT IS ANNEX? THANK YOU. 
          I WAS LOOKING FOR THE WORD ANNEX LAND OUT TO THE, TO THE, UH, WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT. 
          BUT IN TERMS OF THE REGULAR FOOTPRINT OF SEDONA, UH, THIS IS OUR LAST LARGE PIECE OF PROPERTY. 
          AND SO WE, AND IT'S A BEAUTIFUL PIECE OF PROPERTY AND I LIVE ACROSS THE STREET FROM YOU AND YOUR STUDIO. 
          YOU SPENT A LOT OF MONEY TO, SO THAT WE DIDN'T HEAR WHAT WAS GOING ON IN YOUR STUDIO. 
          AND I APPRECIATE THAT. 
          WELL, OUR NEIGHBORS APPRECIATE IT, TIM. 
          HOWEVER, WE MIGHT NOT APPRECIATE THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          AND IT WAS OUR COMMUNITY, WHICH IS NOW MUCH BIGGER THAN IT WAS AT THE TIME THAT, UH, NEGOTIATED THE, UH, LIMITATIONS ON THE AMPHITHEATER AND HOW OFTEN CONCERTS COULD BE HELD AND WHEN THEY COULD BE HELD BECAUSE OF THE ENJOYMENT WE WOULD LIKE TO HAVE IN, IN OUR COMMUNITY. 
          BUT TECHNOLOGY'S IMPROVED. 
          I THINK THINGS CAN WORK BETTER NOW, BUT IT, IT SHOULDN'T. 
          IT'S SO DI DEVISED. 
          IF SOMEBODY ELSE SAID ABOUT DIVISIVENESS, UH, ONE OF THE SPEAKERS DOESN'T HAVE TO BE. 
          WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE? THAT'S WHAT I KEEP ASKING MYSELF. 
          WHY CAN'T WE TRY TO SOLVE MULTIPLE COMMUNITY NEEDS? IT'S A LARGE PIECE OF PROPERTY. 
          SO THAT'S KIND OF WHERE I'M COMING FROM. 
          UH, THE, I'M LOOKING AT MY NOTES HERE. 
          UH, 
          [04:00:01]
OH. 
          I THINK WE HAVE THE CART BEFORE THE HORSE. 
          WE DON'T HAVE A HOUSING STRATEGY. 
          SO HOW CAN WE DECIDE WHAT WE NEED ON THIS PROPERTY WHEN WE HAVE NO STRATEGY? SO WE NEED THE STRATEGY FIRST, IN MY OPINION, BEFORE WE CAN GO MUCH FURTHER HERE. 
          UH, ONCE WE HAVE A HOUSING STRATEGY, THEN WE CAN KNOW WHO WE'RE TARGETING AND WHAT TYPE OF HOUSING WE WANT OR NEED. 
          AND WHAT WORKS ON THIS PROPERTY DOESN'T WORK ON THIS PROPERTY. 
          SO WHERE I AM IS LOOKING FOR A WAY TO COMPROMISE, LOOKING FOR A WAY TO BRING COMMUNITY NEEDS FORWARD IN A WAY THAT WE CAN BE JOINED AND NOT THROWING ROCKS AT EACH OTHER. 
          THAT'S A PUN BECAUSE IT'S A ROCKY PLACE. 
          OKAY. 
          NOT FUNNY. 
          OR I THOUGHT IT WAS FUNNY. 
          . 
          UH, AND I, AND I WOULD CHALLENGE ALL OF YOU TO HELP US. 
          I THINK IT WAS WONDERFUL THAT THE CITY WENT BACK OUT AND HAD THESE FOCUS GROUPS AND BROUGHT IN ALL KINDS OF DIFFERENT PEOPLE WITH DIFFERENT POINTS OF VIEW TO GIVE US ADVICE. 
          I CHALLENGE YOU ALL TO DO THAT AS WELL AND TO KEEP THIS CONVERSATION GOING. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          VICE MAYOR. 
          DEREK, YOU WANNA, WILLIAM? YES, I DO. 
          UM, I DO NOT SUPPORT RESURRECTION OF THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          UH, IT HAS SAT THERE ROTTING AWAY FOR 20 PLUS YEARS. 
          UH, THE FOLKS THAT ARE NOW COMING FORWARD WITH THESE PIE IN THE SKY PROJECTIONS ABOUT WHAT CAN BE DONE WITH THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          WHERE WERE YOU FOR THE PAST 20 YEARS? UM, WE WERE PRESENTED. 
          WHAT WE WERE TOLD WAS GONNA BE A BUSINESS PLAN. 
          I THINK COUNCILOR FOLTZ WAS BEING GENEROUS WHEN HE CALLED IT ASPIRATIONAL. 
          UM, I THINK IT WAS A PUFF PIECE. 
          IT SAID, WELL, WE'RE GONNA DO THIS AND IT'S NOT GONNA COST YOU ANYTHING, AND WE'RE GONNA RELY ON DONATIONS, YOU KNOW? OH YEAH. 
          PEOPLE ARE REALLY GENEROUS. 
          SO IT, IT'S TOO LATE FOR ME ON THAT. 
          I'VE, YOU KNOW, LEADING UP TO THE, TO ALL THIS, I'VE BEEN ASKING PEOPLE, WHAT'S THE PLAN FOR THE AMPHITHEATER? IF THERE'S A PLAN FOR THE AMPHITHEATER, IF THERE'S A BENEFACTOR WHO WANTS TO COME FORWARD AND SUPPORT IT, THAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN. 
          BUT WE'VE BEEN HAVING THIS DISCUSSION FOR, WHAT, TWO YEARS NOW? AND THERE'S NOTHING CONCRETE. 
          I'VE SEEN NOTHING TO INDICATE THERE'S ANY REAL MONEY OR WILL BEHIND THE RESURRECTION OF THE AMPHITHEATER. 
          UM, WHAT I DO SUPPORT, AND PAT, I'M SORRY, I HAD TO CANCEL OUR MEETING. 
          UH, I DO LIKE THE IDEA OF HAVING DISCUSSIONS WITH CIF ABOUT THE, UH, WHAT IS IT? WHATEVER THOSE TWO BLOCKS ARE DOWN THERE. 
          I THINK THE FILM FESTIVAL HAS A PROVEN TRACK RECORD. 
          UM, THEY'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THEY'RE NOT EXPECTING A SUBSIDY OR A, OR A, UH, BELOW MARKET RENT OR WHATEVER IT WOULD BE FOR THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY. 
          UH, THEY WOULD BE SELF-SUSTAINING, AND I THINK WE SHOULD BE TALKING TO THEM. 
          UM, AS FOR THE, WHAT WE DO AT THE REST OF THE PROPERTY, YOU KNOW, THE FUTURE OF OUR CITY DOESN'T DEPEND ON WHETHER OR NOT WE HAVE AN AMPHITHEATER. 
          IT DEPENDS ON WHETHER WE CAN KEEP WORKERS, WHETHER WE CAN HAVE SOME DIVERSITY IN OUR ECONOMY. 
          AND WE SIMPLY DON'T HAVE THAT BETWEEN SHORT-TERM RENTALS AND PRICING AND EVERYTHING. 
          IT'S JUST, IT'S, IT'S BEEN A DISASTER. 
          AND I THINK WE NEED TO BE MINDFUL OF THE IMPACT, WHATEVER WE DO, IN TERMS OF HOUSING OUT HERE, I THINK WE NEED TO BE MINDFUL OF THE IMPACT ON THE SURROUNDING AREAS. 
          UM, I DON'T KNOW IF FOUR 30 IS THE RIGHT DENSITY. 
          UM, I THINK THE CARRYING CAPACITY OF THE PROPERTY, I CAN'T REMEMBER IT WAS SEVEN SOMETHING. 
          THAT'S CRAZY. 
          NO, NO, NO WAY. 
          UM, I THINK FOUR 30 MAY BE TOO HIGH. 
          I THINK WE OUGHT TO BE THINKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, LOWER NUMBERS. 
          UM, BUT MORE THAN ANYTHING, I, I FEEL LIKE PEOPLE THINK THAT SEDONA IS THIS DELICATE LITTLE FLOWER AND IT'S GONNA FALL APART IF WE BUILD ANOTHER APARTMENT BUILDING AT THE WEST END OF TOWN. 
          COME ON. 
          WE'RE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE WORKERS THAT NEED PLACES TO LIVE. 
          THIS ISN'T GONNA DESTROY OUR CITY. 
          ALL THE, YOU KNOW, THE HYPERBOLE ONLINE ABOUT, UH, ABOUT HOW IT'S JUST GONNA DEVASTATE THE SMALL TOWN CHARACTER OF OUR TOWN. 
          I, SO I'VE BEEN HERE 10 YEARS AND I DON'T CONSIDER SEDONA A SMALL TOWN. 
          SO I, THAT SHIP SAILED A LONG TIME AGO, PETE. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          WOW. 
          THIS IS REALLY A, A VERY GREAT CONVERSATION. 
          LET'S SEE. 
          I WANNA START PROBABLY BY ADDRESSING SOME OF THE THINGS I HEARD FROM THE COMMENT. 
          I CAN'T HELP MY PUBLIC COMMENT 
          [04:05:01]
'CAUSE I CAN'T HELP MYSELF AT THIS POINT. 
          FIRST THING I WANNA SAY IS, UH, THERE WAS A COMMENT ABOUT SOMEBODY THAT SAID, UH, WHEN NOT IF I THINK THAT THAT WAS ME, AND IF THAT WAS ME, I APOLOGIZE. 
          THAT'S NOT MY APPROACH. 
          UH, I'M GONNA TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT, UH, WHY PERHAPS THAT SLIPPED OUT. 
          BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, I'LL OWN THAT. 
          IF THAT WAS ME. 
          I SHOULDN'T HAVE SAID WHEN. 
          IT'S CERTAINLY AN IF, UH, BECAUSE I ALSO THINK, UH, I HEARD, UH, A COUPLE PEOPLE COMMENT ON, WE SHOULD HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING ON THE FOREST SERVICE STANCE ABOUT THE TRAILHEAD, THE EXISTING TRAILS, AND THE POSSIBILITY OF SOCIAL TRAILS. 
          I THINK THAT'S A REAL QUESTION, AND I GET IT, THAT MAYBE THE FOREST SERVICE SAID, DON'T SHOW IT. 
          I NEED TO UNDERSTAND WHY THAT THEY WOULDN'T WANNA DO THAT. 
          I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT AS WELL. 
          SO I'D LIKE TO GIVE THAT FEEDBACK TO STAFF. 
          UM, WE WERE CRITICIZED FOR NOT HAVING ALL THE ANSWERS. 
          I'M NOT SURE THAT PEOPLE WOULD SAY THAT. 
          DON'T UNDERSTAND THE PUBLIC PROCESS. 
          I MEAN, WOULD, I HOPE YOU DON'T PREFER THAT WE JUST WORK BEHIND CLOSED DOORS AND COME OUT WITH THE MOST POLISHED PLAN EVER. 
          THAT THAT'S NOT THE PUBLIC PROCESS. 
          SO TH THIS IS IT. 
          THIS IS WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE. 
          WE MEET IN PUBLIC, UH, WE TRY TO STRUGGLE WITH THESE ISSUES AND, UH, WE DON'T HAVE ALL THE ANSWERS. 
          NOT YET. 
          AND WE'RE NOT ANYWHERE CLOSE TO BEING DONE. 
          UM, SOMEBODY MENTIONED SOMETHING ABOUT SUSTAINABILITY, AND I LOVE YOU. 
          YOU KNOW, I APPRECIATE YOUR, YOUR PRESENCE HERE. 
          I WILL GUARANTEE YOU THAT SUSTAINABILITY IS BUILT INTO THE CITY PROCESS AT TIMES. 
          I WONDER THAT THE COST OF SUSTAINABILITY DRIVES UP THE IMMEDIATE, THE DELIVERY COST OF HOUSING TOO. 
          SO WE HAVE TO BALANCE THAT. 
          UM, BUT I GUARANTEE YOU THAT THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION STAFF, THIS COUNCIL WILL CONSIDER SUSTAINABILITY ITEMS AS THIS MOVES IF IT MOVES FORWARD. 
          AND THEN, UH, YOU KNOW, WHEN I TALK TO PEOPLE THAT IF I EVER HEAR A RESPONSE ABOUT HOUSING, YES, BUT NOT AT THIS LOCATION, YOU KNOW, THEY NEED TO TELL ME WHERE ELSE. 
          UH, AND I WILL, I WILL TALK MORE ABOUT THAT 'CAUSE THAT, THAT GETS BACK TO THE WHEN VERSUS IF, WHICH MAYBE I'LL TALK ABOUT RIGHT NOW. 
          PERSONALLY, I THINK THAT THE BIGGEST CRISIS, UH, UH, IN SEDONA IS ITS DECLINING POPULATION. 
          AND THE FUTURE IS GONNA BE WHETHER WE'RE A RES, YOU KNOW, WHETHER WE'RE A COMMUNITY OR WHETHER WE'RE JUST, UH, A, A VACATION TOWN. 
          AND THE FASTER WE GET TO A DECISION ABOUT THE, WHICH FORK IN THE ROAD WE WANNA BE ON IS IS GONNA BE HELPFUL TO US. 
          WE NEED AN ANSWER SOON. 
          SO IF I SAID WHEN, NOT IF IT'S BECAUSE I'M VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THIS QUESTION, AND IF WE DON'T START BUILDING HOUSING, WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GET BACK TO THIS OTHER FORK ABOUT US BEING A COMMUNITY. 
          AND I THINK OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS HAVE SHARED, UM, SOME COMMENTS ABOUT GROWTH AND, AND COMMUNITY. 
          SO THAT'S PART OF THAT. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          NOW SHIFTING TO KIND OF WHAT I'VE PICKED UP HERE, HOUSING STRATEGY. 
          ALSO, I'M ON BOARD WITH, WE CAN'T EVEN COME CLOSE TO ANSWERING SOME OF THESE QUESTIONS WITHOUT A HOUSING STRATEGY FIRST, AND I KNOW IT'S COMING. 
          BUT I, I AGREE WITH MY COUNCIL COLLEAGUES THAT HAVE SUGGESTED THAT MY NEXT PART, AS I WOULD HATE TO BE STAFF SITTING OUT HERE LISTENING TO US TALK ABOUT THIS AND TRYING TO GET SOME DIRECTION, UH, I WOULDN'T WANNA TRY TO SYNTHESIZE OUR RESULTS. 
          AND ACTUALLY, I DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR TO THEM. 
          AND AT SOME POINT, THIS COUNCIL IS GONNA HAVE TO TAKE SOME VOTES, I THINK SOME VOTES. 
          SO WE KNOW WHAT THE CONSENSUS IS OR NOT. 
          AND THE FIRST ITEM IS WHETHER WE DO NOTHING CP TWO, OR WE PROCEED WITH THE MASTER PLAN. 
          UH, IF WE PROCEED WITH THE MASTER PLAN, THERE IS A WHOLE HOST OF THINGS THAT WE NEED TO ACTUALLY TALK ABOUT. 
          SOME OF US ARE GONNA BE ON THE LOSING END OF VOTES, AND THAT'S THE WAY IT GOES. 
          I'VE BEEN ON THE LOSING END OF AN ANNEXATION VOTE. 
          I WAS AGAINST, UH, ANNEXING THE DELL'S PROPERTY, BUT THAT SHIP HAS SAILED. 
          THIS COUNCIL HAS SPOKEN, AND I'M AS RIGHT. 
          YOU DON'T HEAR ME TALK ABOUT THAT ANYMORE. 
          AND EVENTUALLY SOME OF THESE THINGS THAT WE BROUGHT UP HERE, WE'RE ALSO GONNA HAVE TO SETTLE AND MOVE FORWARD. 
          THOSE THINGS INCLUDE THE MIX OF USES, THE HOUSING TYPES, COMMERCIAL VERSUS RETAIL, HOW MUCH OPEN SPACE, THE MAX NUMBER OF UNITS, YOU KNOW, THAT AFFECTS THAT HOUSING STRATEGY. 
          I WANNA GO BACK AND TALK ABOUT THE DECLINING POPULATION CONCERN OF MINE. 
          WE, WE DO CHUNK OUT BIG NUMBERS ABOUT HOW MANY HOUSING UNITS ARE NEEDED, BUT I DON'T THINK, AT LEAST, I'M NOT SAYING THAT WE HAVE TO SOLVE ALL OF THAT IN OUR TOWN. 
          WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING. 
          OUR PART, OUR SHARE, 
          [04:10:01]
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT IS YET. 
          EITHER WE 26 OFFICERS, ONE LIVES IN TOWN. 
          IS THAT TOO LITTLE? YES. 
          DO WE NEED ALL 26 LIVING IN TOWN? NO, NOT ALL OF 'EM WOULD WANT TO LIVE IN TOWN. 
          BUT THERE'S SOME AMOUNT THAT THE HOUSING STUDY AND THE DIFFICULT QUESTION THAT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO PICK ABOUT HOW MANY, UH, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO TALK ABOUT NEIGHBORHOOD VERSUS MORE CITY SERVING RETAIL. 
          WHAT'S THE GOAL? WHAT DO WE REALLY WANT THERE? AND THE, AND THE, AND THE SF AND THE REC CENTER AND THE PARKING GARAGE AND A BRIDGE OVER TO THE HIGH SCHOOL, UH, AND SENIOR HOUSING AND RIGHT. 
          AND WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO TALK ABOUT A REALISTIC NUMBER ABOUT THE COST OF THE INFRASTRUCTURE. 
          I HAVE NO DOUBT THAT IF A PROJECT DECIDES TO MOVE FORWARD HERE, THERE'S GONNA BE AN ASK FOR THE CITY TO PAY FOR INFRASTRUCTURE. 
          AND WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT. 
          AND THEN THERE WERE NINE QUESTIONS PUT FORTH BY STAFF THAT I THOUGHT WERE GOOD QUESTIONS. 
          AND I THINK YOU DESERVE TO HEAR INDIVIDUALLY FROM US. 
          I THINK AFTER WE ANSWER THIS QUESTION ABOUT WHETHER WE'RE GONNA MOVE FORWARD ANYTHING OR NOTHING. 
          BUT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO, AND WE CAN'T DO THAT TONIGHT. 
          ALTHOUGH THAT LIST OF STUFF I JUST REELED OFF, WE CAN'T DO TONIGHT. 
          WE HAVE TO TALK MORE. 
          I I, AND I THINK THERE'S PROBABLY SOME CONVERSATION WE COULD HAVE BEFORE THE HOUSING STUDY. 
          I'M NOT EXACTLY SURE WHEN WE'RE GONNA SEE IT AND HAVE THAT HOUSING STRATEGY. 
          CERTAINLY AFTER THAT HOUSING STRATEGY, WE HAVE TO PICK THIS BACK UP AND START MOVING. 
          'CAUSE I WILL TELL YOU THIS FORK IN OUR FUTURE ABOUT WHETHER WE'RE GONNA BE, UH, COMMUNITY WITH FULL-TIME RESIDENTS, OR WE'RE GONNA JUST BE A VACATION PLACE. 
          WE'RE ALREADY DOWN ONE OF THE PATHS OF THAT FORK. 
          I THINK WE CAN STILL GET BACK TO THE COMMUNITY VERSION, BUT I ABSOLUTELY BELIEVE WE ARE ON THE FORK THAT SAYS WE'RE GONNA BE ANOTHER ASPEN OR WHATEVER, WHATEVER COMMUNITY YOU WANNA THINK OF, THAT'S NOT SEDONA. 
          THAT'S CURRENTLY WHERE WE'RE HEADED. 
          SO THAT'S MY COMMENTS. 
          GOOD. 
          THANK YOU VERY MUCH. 
          PETE. 
          KATHY, THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          UM, I WANNA THANK MY COLLEAGUES FOR BEING AS ANALYTICAL AND AS THOROUGH AS THEY ARE REALLY, BECAUSE, UM, I THINK IT'S, IT'S HELPFUL TO FRAME THE DISCUSSIONS TO HAVE ALL THE INFORMATION THAT, THAT YOU PROVIDED, UM, COUNCILOR DUNN AND FOR PUTTING THE HARD QUESTIONS OUT THERE. 
          COUNCILLOR FURMAN, I MEAN, I REALLY, THANKS TO ALL OF YOU. 
          UM, A LOT OF WHAT WE FACE UP HERE IS, IS WHAT YOU GUYS FACE OUT THERE IN THE COMMUNITY. 
          SAME THING IS REACTION TO WHAT'S PRESENTED TO WHAT WE SEE, RIGHT? WE CAN ONLY, OUR IMAGINATIONS TAKE US SO FAR. 
          WE'RE NOT EXPERTS IN VARIOUS AREAS. 
          YOU KNOW, RENDERINGS ARE SHOWN TO US AND WE REACT TO THEM, RIGHT? JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER. 
          UM, THE RENDERINGS THAT ARE USED HERE LOOK LIKE SCOTTSDALE. 
          THEY LOOK LIKE CURLING GAR. 
          IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT SEDONA. 
          UM, I WOULDN'T SUPPORT, I UNDERSTAND THE, THE VICE MAYOR USED THE TERM DUMP IT BASED ON A REACTION TO THAT. 
          LOOK, I'M NOT QUITE READY TO DUMP IT BECAUSE I THINK WE STILL NEED TO MOVE FORWARD WITH A PLAN. 
          AND THE IDEA WAS TO SAY, WHAT USES DO WE NEED AND WHERE WOULD THEY POTENTIALLY FIT? SO THAT'S THE PLAN I WANT TO WORK WITH. 
          BUT THE PLAN, UH, RENDERINGS THAT ARE SHOWN HERE ARE NOTHING I'M INTERESTED IN MOVING FORWARD WITH. 
          UM, SO I WANNA MAKE, MAKE THAT CLEAR. 
          UM, SO WITH THAT SAID, YOU KNOW, THE ARCHITECTURAL, THIS IS EARLY STAGES. 
          IT REALLY IS. 
          IT'S, IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S NOT PERHAPS, BUT IT IS BECAUSE THESE ARE NOT WHAT ARE GOING TO COME FORWARD. 
          THOSE DETAILS ARE IN ONCE THE USES AND THE DENSITIES AND THE PARAMETERS AND THE THINGS THAT WE STILL ARE NOT DISCUSSING, ALTHOUGH WE'RE HOW MANY HOURS IN WHICH WE KNEW WAS GONNA HAPPEN. 
          THAT'S NOT UNEXPECTED. 
          BUT THOSE THINGS HAVE TO BE SET IN ORDER FOR PEOPLE TO REACT. 
          AND I SAY WITH PEOPLE, I MEAN, CONSULTANTS AND POTENTIAL, UM, THINK TANKS THAT THEY WANNA REFER TO FOR, FOR DAY LONG INPUT OR POTENTIAL DEVELOPERS THAT MAY WANT TO SAY, HEY, IF YOU ARE PUTTING AN RFP TOGETHER, YOU KNOW, THINK ABOUT THIS OR THIS. 
          THOSE KIND OF THINGS STILL HAVE TO BE FORWARD BEFORE WE KNOW WHAT THIS IS GOING TO LOOK LIKE. 
          THIS IS NOT WHAT IT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE. 
          WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IT'S GONNA LOOK LIKE. 
          THAT BEING SAID, WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT THOSE THINGS. 
          LIKE THAT WILL GUIDE WHAT IT'LL LOOK LIKE. 
          BUILDING HEIGHTS. 
          WE KEEP SHYING AWAY FROM THAT DISCUSSION AND THAT, THAT CONCERNS ME. 
          I, I HAVE VERY STRONG FEELINGS ABOUT BUILDING HEIGHTS. 
          DENSITY IS A QUESTION. 
          ABSOLUTELY. 
          AND RATIOS. 
          BUT OVERALL HEIGHT IN AND OF ITSELF IS AN IMPORTANT FACTOR TO ME BECAUSE SEDONA HAS A FEEL A LOOK. 
          OUR RED ROCKS ARE WHAT MAKE US, THOSE VIEWS NEED TO BE PROTECTED, UM, TO PRESERVE OUR CHARACTER AND OUR, OUR CULTURE. 
          GET BACK TO CULTURE. 
          SO BUILDING 
          [04:15:01]
HEIGHTS ARE SOMETHING I WANNA TALK ABOUT. 
          THERE MAY BE A PLACE OR TWO, BUT IN THE, WHAT WE'VE LOOKED AT AND WHAT'S BEEN PRESENTED, THERE'S, THERE'S, THERE'S, TO ME TOO MUCH OF IT THERE. 
          AND THAT TRANSLATES DIRECTLY INTO THE OVERPOPULATION, THE RESIDENTIAL, I THINK OVERPOPULATION. 
          NOW WE HAVE A NEED TO FIND OUT WHAT GAPS WE NEED TO FILL AND HOW THIS CAN PLAY A PERCENTAGE ROLE IN FILLING THOSE GAPS. 
          BUT WE DON'T, WE DON'T KNOW THAT YET. 
          BUT THIS EITHER WAY, I CAN TELL YOU RIGHT NOW, THIS IS TOO MUCH FOR ME. 
          THIS IS JUST, THE 430 NUMBER FOR ME IS LIKE A NON-STARTER IN A, IN A RATIO. 
          IF YOU TAKE 430 RESIDENTIAL UNITS, NO MATTER IF THEY'RE DENSE APARTMENT BUILDINGS, SINGLE FAMILY HOMES, WHATEVER THEY ARE, AND YOU STICK THAT IN ONE CORNER OF SEDONA, YOU'VE COMPLETELY ALTERED THE FEELING OF SEDONA. 
          'CAUSE THAT IS NOT HOW OUR COMMUNITY IS LAID OUT. 
          SO I AM, I'M AGAINST THAT. 
          I WANTED, I WANNA GET TO BUILDING HEIGHTS DISCUSSION. 
          I WANT TO UNDER BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF DENSITY NEEDS, UH, UNIT NEEDS SO THAT WE CAN START TALKING ABOUT WHAT REALISTIC NUMBERS, THESE ARE THE TYPES OF USES AS WELL. 
          UM, I THINK ONLY ONE OF US UP HERE, I DON'T REMEMBER WHO'S TALKED ABOUT THE FACT THAT, YOU KNOW, SENIOR HOUSING, WE HAVEN'T TALKED ABOUT. 
          IT CAME UP. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          IT CAME UP BEFORE FROM A QUESTION ABOUT, UM, NAH, YOU KNOW, MIGHT WANT TO DO SOME SENIOR HOUSING DOWN THE ROAD. 
          THERE IS NO PLAN FOR THAT. 
          THERE IS NOTHING THAT HAS BEEN SUBMITTED FOR THAT. 
          THEY ARE MOVING ON A, UM, ONCOLOGY CENTER IN COTTONWOOD THAT IS GOING TO TAKE THEIR TIME, MONEY, AND ATTENTION. 
          UM, IF WE WANT, IF, IF WE TRULY WANNA SEE SENIOR HOUSING IN SEDONA, IT'S SOMETHING WE HAVE TO BUILD INTO AN RFP THAT GOES OUT TO SAY THIS HAS TO BE A PART OF PROPOSALS COMING FORWARD. 
          'CAUSE IT'S A NEED, SEDONA HAS, AND IT'S A NEED. 
          WE WANT TO MEET AND FILL, UM, THE ALLOWABLE USES, AGAIN, I'M BACK TO THE RATIO. 
          FOR ME, THE RATIOS ARE NOT, AND THAT'S ONE OF YOUR QUESTIONS HERE. 
          I THINK IT'S QUESTION SIX, RIGHT? IS IN THE CURRENT DRAFT PLAN, THE DEVELOPMENTS ARE BROKEN DOWN TO 10.5 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE, NINE AND A HALF ACRES OF COMMUNITY AMENITIES, FOUR ACRES, COMMERCIAL, 11.3 ACRES OF RESIDENTIAL, AND 5.8 ACRES OF RIGHT OF AWAY AND INFRASTRUCTURE OUTTA 41 ACRES, ONLY 27 ACRES ARE DEVELOPABLE. 
          DOES THIS ALLOCATION SOUND RIGHT? NOT TO ME IT DOESN'T BECAUSE THIS LAND NEEDS TO BE USED TO FILL THE NEEDS THAT WE HAVE AND ALSO TO SERVE THE COMMUNITY THAT IS ALREADY HERE. 
          SO WE TALKED ABOUT A REC CENTER AND THEN THAT, I KNOW THAT THAT'S TOP ON PEOPLE'S MINDS. 
          IT'S CERTAINLY BEEN IN A LOT OF FEEDBACK THAT I'VE GOTTEN. 
          IT'S SOMETHING I'M VERY INTERESTED IN SEEING AS A PART OF THIS MOVE FORWARD. 
          UM, DO I THINK THAT THERE ARE WAYS WE NEED TO BE TALKING ABOUT, AGAIN, WE'RE CART BEFORE HORSE BECAUSE WHAT, WHAT I THINK WE SHOULD BE TALKING ABOUT IS WE HAVE ALL SORTS OF DEVELOPMENT IMPACT FEES AND DEVELOPMENT FUNDS. 
          WE HAVE, YOU HAVE TO DO A PERCENTAGE TO ART FOR COMMERCIAL. 
          YOU HAVE TO DO A, YOU KNOW, PERCENTAGE TO THIS. 
          YOU HAVE TO DO THAT. 
          WHY COULDN'T WE TALK ABOUT IF FOR HOWEVER THIS IS GOING TO BE DEVELOPED, WE SHOULD START THINKING ABOUT WAYS THAT IT CAN HELP TO FUND SOME OF THE AMENITIES THAT WILL GO IN TO SERVE THE AREA THAT'S BEING BUILT OUT, BUT THE COMMUNITY AS A WHOLE AS WELL. 
          SO I WANNA HAVE THAT DISCUSSION ABOUT, YOU KNOW, DEVELOPMENT FUNDS, DEVELOPMENT COSTS, AND WAYS THAT WE CAN CREATIVELY LOOK AT, UM, MEETING SOME OF THOSE NEEDS. 
          UM, I WANNA THANK YOU COUNCILOR FURMAN, FOR BRINGING UP AGAIN, THE TRAILHEAD. 
          I HADN'T REALLY THOUGHT OF IT THE WAY THAT YOU PHRASE IT, AND I COMPLETELY AGREE. 
          IT'S NOT THERE FOR A REASON. 
          I NEED TO KNOW WHAT THAT REASON IS. 
          BECAUSE OPEN SPACE ACCESS TO THE LANDS IS CRITICAL IN THE SUCCESS OF THIS PRO, UH, ANY PROPOSAL THAT GOES ON THERE. 
          UM, IF WE WANT CULTURE, WE KEEP HEARING THAT THIS SHOULD BE CULTURE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS THE CULTURAL PARK THERE AND THE KNOW THAT WAS WHAT IT WAS DESIGNATED FOR. 
          AND WELL THEN LET'S TALK ABOUT CULTURE. 
          AND I LIKE THE IDEA VERY MUCH OF, OF CIF, YOU KNOW, WANTING TO FUND ITS OWN WAY AND CARRY ITS OWN WAY AND BE A PART THERE AND HAVE THIS BE A CULTURAL GATEWAY. 
          BUT I'M ALSO, AND PATRICK KNOW THIS, I'VE EXPRESSED IT. 
          I'M ALSO CONCERNED THAT ONE CULTURAL ENTITY, UM, WILL TAKE ALL OF THE COMMERCIAL SPACE THAT'S AVAILABLE BECAUSE I THINK THERE NEED TO BE MORE CULTURAL USES THERE TO TRULY MAKE IT A CULTURAL GATEWAY INTO, WITH THE, IN THE MIXED USES. 
          I'D LIKE TO SEE A MUSEUM THERE, UM, PERHAPS THE FINE ARTS MUSEUM, PERHAPS, UH, YOU KNOW, DAN'S ACADEMY PERHAPS. 
          I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU KNOW, BUT I'D LIKE TO SEE, MAKE SURE. 
          AND THAT BRINGS ME BACK TO THE RATIOS. 
          I THINK WE'RE TOO HEAVY ON THE RESIDENTIAL AND THAT WE WILL NEED TO DESIGNATE MORE COMMERCIAL IN ORDER TO ALLOW THOSE CULTURAL USES, WHICH I THINK CAN FIT FILL SOME OF 
          [04:20:01]
THE QUESTIONS THAT PEOPLE HAVE HAD ABOUT WHY ISN'T THIS BEING USED, UH, FOR CULTURAL USES. 
          NOW, THAT BRINGS THOUGH ANOTHER QUESTION ALONG THE LINES OF MY, YOU KNOW, DEVELOPMENT FUNDING QUESTION, RIGHT? HOW CAN WE LIMIT THAT? BECAUSE NOBODY, AT LEAST I'M NOT HAVING HEARD FROM ANYBODY, IS INTERESTED IN HAVING ANOTHER T-SHIRT SHOP THERE. 
          NO OFFENSE TO OUR T-SHIRT SHOPS, GO FORTH, SELL, GET TAXES. 
          UM, BUT HERE, YOU KNOW, I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT IF WE JUST DO A COMMERCIAL DESIGNATION, THAT IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT ANYTHING COMES TO INFILL. 
          BECAUSE TO YOUR POINT AND TO OUR, OUR CONSULTANT WHO KNOWS THIS BEST, IF YOU OVERBUILD COMMERCIAL AND YOU CAN'T FILL IT, YOU'RE, YOU'RE REALLY SETTING THE WHOLE AREA UP AS A NEIGHBORHOOD TO FAIL. 
          SO ARE, IS THERE A WAY WHEN WE HAVE COMMERCIAL DESIGNATION THAT WE CAN LIMIT THIS FOR STAFF, THE COMMERCIAL USES TO CERTAIN USER GROUPS? WILL WE BE ABLE TO DO THAT? NOW, I KNOW THAT THERE ARE CERTAIN LIMITATIONS WE CAN DO. 
          AND TO THE LAST POINT THAT A COLLEAGUE RAISED ABOUT REBUILDING COMMUNITY, WE HAVE HAVE LOST SO MUCH TO SHORT TERM RENTALS. 
          WE OWN THIS LAND. 
          WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO RESTRICT, UM, YOU KNOW, THINGS THAT GO ON THERE THAT ARE BUILT THERE THAT THEY WOULD NOT BE SHORT TERM RENTALS. 
          THAT THEY COULD BE LONG TERM HOUSING, BRINGING BACK REAL PEOPLE THAT LIVE HERE, REAL RESIDENTS THAT WILL NEED THESE AMENITIES, BUT BE PART OF REBUILDING THAT COMMUNITY FEELING. 
          SO THOSE ARE, I THINK, ALL OF MY RANTING COMMENTS. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU, KATHY. 
          OKAY, I'M GONNA GO DOWN MY LIST BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT IN ANY PARTICULAR ORDER. 
          UH, BUT, UH, BRIAN, I APPRECIATE WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT COOL HOUSING. 
          GREAT IDEA. 
          I DIDN'T LIKE THE CONCEPT THAT WAS GIVEN TODAY, BUT I WALKED INTO THIS MEETING KNOWING THAT THAT'S NOT WHAT THEY'RE REALLY GONNA LOOK LIKE. 
          THEY'RE JUST PLACEHOLDERS. 
          BUT I THINK IF THE COMMUNITY COULD WORK WITH US TO TALK ABOUT COOL HOUSING AND WHAT THEY WOULD WANNA SEE THERE, BECAUSE ULTIMATELY WE DO NEED HOUSING. 
          AND I WAS DISAPPOINTED. 
          I MEAN, AND I, EVERYBODY KNOWS I'M NOT A BIG SUPPORTER OF 2.0. 
          HOWEVER, I WAS KIND OF OPTIMISTIC WHEN I HEARD FROM THE CITY MANAGER THAT THERE, SHE HAD THREE MEETINGS WITH THE 2.0 PEOPLE AND SHE WAS EXPECTING A, THE BUSINESS PLAN, WHICH WAS MENTIONED EARLIER, BUT IN THE, I THINK IT WAS THE SECOND, UH, MEETING THAT YOU HAD, THERE WERE 200 HOUSING UNITS PROPOSED, OR YOU JUST TALKED ABOUT IT. 
          THANK YOU MAYOR FOR THE QUESTION. 
          AT THE END OF THE THIRD MEETING, OKAY. 
          UM, THERE WAS AN INDICATION THAT THEY WOULD GO BACK AND LOOK AT ADDING UP TO 200 HOUSING UNITS IN THEIR DESIGN AND SUBMIT THAT BACK TO US TO PROVIDE TO YOU. 
          AND THAT WAS THE FOLLOW UP WHEN WE REACHED OUT THAT, UM, WE HEARD THAT THE BOARD HAD VOTED AGAINST REVISING THE CURRENT CONCEPT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          SO THIS COLLABORATION, IT DOESN'T SEEM TO BE THE COLLABORATION I ANTICIPATED. 
          I ACTUALLY HOPED FOR SOME KIND OF COLLABORATION. 
          BUT IT SEEMS TO BE WE, YOU KNOW, WE WANNA SUPPORT THE ARTS, BUT ONLY THE ARTS THERE. 
          ONLY THE ARTS ON THAT STAGE. 
          THE SCF PROGRAM WILL SERVE MULTIPLE ARTISTS TYPE SONG, DANCE, BALLET, A LOT OF DIFFERENT ARTS INSTEAD OF JUST AN OPEN STAGE THAT'S GOING TO BRING SEAT 5,000 PEOPLE AND RIGHT. 
          AND THEN WE HAVE THE CARS THAT NO LONGER HAVE A PLACE TO PARK ANYMORE. 
          SIF F WAS GONNA HAVE THEIR OWN PARKING STRATEGY. 
          THEY WERE GOING TO FUND IT THEMSELVES. 
          SOMETHING WE WOULDN'T HAVE TO DO. 
          UH, I'M DISAPPOINTED BECAUSE I WAS TRYING TO OPEN MY MIND TO THE 2.0. 
          BUT WHAT WE RECEIVED WAS NOTHING. 
          JUST ALL THESE OTHER CITIES AND TOWNS THAT ARE BUILDING SOME KIND OF A STAGE, BUT WE DON'T KNOW IF THEY WERE REALLY SUCCESSFUL. 
          I THINK IT WAS, UH, COUNCILOR FAF THAT SAID THE VENUE'S BEEN VACANT FOR 25 YEARS. 
          WHERE WERE THESE PROPOSALS FOR THAT BEFORE WE BOUGHT IT? WHEN IT WOULD'VE BEEN, AND SOMEBODY SAID, OH, WE PAID TOO MUCH FOR IT. 
          WELL, THAT'S WHAT THE SALE PRICE WAS. 
          BUT 25 YEARS AGO THEY WERE THE SAME PEOPLE ARE HERE. 
          STEVEN THOMPSON'S HERE HAD A GREAT VISION. 
          NOBODY CAME FORWARD TO WANNA BUY IT. 
          AND IT WOULD'VE BEEN A LOT LESS EXPENSIVE. 
          AND THERE WOULD'VE BEEN NO PUSHBACK BECAUSE IT, IT WAS FOR SALE FOR 25 YEARS. 
          AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NEW TYPE OF SOUND SYSTEMS 
          [04:25:01]
WOULD BE. 
          I'M TOLD BY SEVERAL PEOPLE, SCOTT ROSS IS A NEIGHBOR OF MINE. 
          HE WAS TRYING TO CONVINCE ME OF THERE'S WAYS OF CONTAINING THE SOUND. 
          BUT IF YOU LIVED BY YOUR HOUSE, WHICH I'M SUPPOSED TO GET TO ONE DAY, OKAY, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU'RE GONNA NOT HEAR THE SOUND FROM THAT STAGE BECAUSE YOU'RE GONNA GET SOME RESIDUAL SOUND. 
          OKAY? THERE'S NO GETTING AWAY FROM THAT UNLESS YOU'RE GONNA HAVE IT ALL WITH EARBUDS AND THE 5,000 PEOPLE ARE GONNA BRING THEIR OWN EARBUDS. 
          THERE'S NO OTHER WAY. 
          OKAY? SO THAT'S A PROBLEM. 
          AND THAT CAUSED A PROBLEM FOR THE, YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD. 
          AND THE VICE MAYOR WAS, HAS BEEN TELLING ME FOR A LONG TIME, BUT I THINK BEFORE SHE EVEN ARRIVED HERE, THAT WAS A BIG PROBLEM. 
          AND YET, OH, LET'S BRING IT BACK AGAIN. 
          SO IF IT WERE TO COME BACK, HOW ABOUT RELOCATING IT ON THE PROPERTY, MAKE IT SMALLER, MAKE IT A THOUSAND SEATS INSTEAD OF 5,000? I DON'T KNOW. 
          WELL, IT'S NOT GONNA BE PROFITABLE. 
          OKAY, I UNDERSTAND. 
          BUT THE TRAFFIC THAT IT WOULD BRING ALL AT THE SAME TIME AS OPPOSED TO HOUSING. 
          AND I DO THINK THAT THE NUMBER'S STILL TOO HIGH FOR ME. 
          OKAY. 
          WHICH WOULD COME AND GO ALL DAY LONG. 
          WHICH WOULD, YOU KNOW, IT HAS ITS OWN ROAD. 
          IT WOULD HAVE, IT HAS A TRAFFIC LIGHT AS OPPOSED TO 2,500 CARS COMING AT THE SAME TIME FOR THE SAME SHOW. 
          OH. 
          AND THEN THEY HAVE TO LEAVE. 
          AND I THINK IT WAS GUY GRANT WHO SAID THERE WAS, BACK IN THE DAY, IT WAS ONLY PARKING FOR 700 AND SOME ODD CARS. 
          OKAY? BUT BACK THEN THERE WASN'T THE TWO MARRIOTTS, THERE WASN'T THE HIGH SCHOOL THEY PARKED THERE. 
          BUT THOSE BUILDINGS OR THOSE AREAS HAVE BEEN BUILT UP. 
          THE BUSINESS PLAN I HAD HOPED TO, TO SEE, WELL, WHERE ARE YOU GONNA PUT THOSE CARS? WE'D NEVER GOT THAT BUSINESS PLAN. 
          I WAS REALLY HOPING EXPLAIN, BECAUSE WE'RE TOLD, WE'LL FIGURE IT OUT. 
          STEVEN THOMPSON TOLD ME TWO YEARS AGO, DON'T, DON'T WORRY, WE'RE GONNA FIGURE OUT WHERE TO PUT THE CARS. 
          I'M STILL WAITING TO SEE IT. 
          SO, QUITE HONESTLY, I MEAN, I OPENED UP MY MIND BECAUSE OF SCOTT ROSS SAYING TO ME, OPEN, YOU KNOW, AND HE'S A, HE'S A, A, A GUY THAT MAKES YOU WANNA OPEN UP YOUR MIND, RIGHT? SO I DID. 
          I DIDN'T SEE ANYTHING. 
          SO LET ME GO TO MOVE ON, OFF OF THE CULTURAL PART. 
          ALRIGHT, UH, LET'S TALK ABOUT HOUSING. 
          IT SEEMS THAT WE'RE HERE, I'M HEARING TODAY BY PATRICK, NOT IN MY BACKYARD, NOT IN MY TOWN, BUT FOR THE REASONS THAT MY FELLOW COUNSELORS SPOKE ABOUT TODAY. 
          WE NEED THIS HOUSING FOR THOSE THAT, CAN YOU CLOSE THE DOOR PLEASE? DOES ANYONE REALIZE THAT THE LITTLE TOWN OF JEROME IS LOSING THEIR IDENTITY? 'CAUSE THEY'RE LOSING ALL THEIR EMPLOYEES BECAUSE OF SHORT, SHORT-TERM RENTALS? OKAY, NOW WE HAVE A LONG WAY TO GO BEFORE WE'RE GONNA BE LOSING OUR IDENTITY THAT MUCH. 
          BUT NAH GAVE A PRESENTATION THAT, UH, UP AT THE, AT THE, UH, HOSPITAL IN COTTONWOOD ABOUT A MONTH OR SO AGO. 
          WE'RE ALL COMPLAINING. 
          WE, WE ARE LOSING OUR DOCTORS LIKE THE VICE MAYOR SAID. 
          BUT WHAT THE, THE, UM, PRESIDENT OF THE HOSPITAL HAD DID, DID SAY HE CAN GET EMPLOYEES TO LIVE IN, UH, FLAGSTAFF. 
          THERE'S NOBODY WANTS TO LIVE DOWN HERE. 
          THERE'S NO REAL OPTIONS FOR A NEW DOCTOR WHO'S GOING TO PLANT ROOTS HERE, BRING THEIR CHILDREN OR CREATE THEIR OWN CHILDREN. 
          THERE'S REALLY NO PLACE THAT THEY COULD AFFORD. 
          AND THAT'S UNFORTUNATE. 
          OKAY? SO DOCTORS, EVERYBODY'S COMPLAINING ABOUT THE LOSS OF DOCTORS AND, AND THE ANCILLARY POSITIONS THERE. 
          OKAY? IT ALL GOES TOGETHER. 
          WHETHER IT'S THE PEOPLE THAT WORK IN THE FOOD STORES, I'M NOT LOOKING AT THAT FOR HERE, THE CULTURAL PARK. 
          I'M LOOKING FOR PROFESSIONALS, CRITICAL EMPLOYEES. 
          THE POLICE OFFICERS THAT COUNCILOR DUNN TALKED ABOUT, WHETHER, AND THERE WAS SOME, YOU KNOW, LAUGHING AND SMIRKING FROM THE AUDIENCE WHEN WE SAID, OH, YOU KNOW, ONLY HOW MANY LIVE POLICE. 
          ONE PEOPLE SAY, WELL, THEY COULD DRIVE TO WORK. 
          AND YES, I GET THAT. 
          NOT EVERYBODY HAS TO LIVE IN THE TOWN THEY WORK IN, OKAY? BUT THE VERDE VALLEY IS BEING EATEN UP BY SHORT TERM RENTALS. 
          WE ALL NEED TO DO OUR FAIR SHARE. 
          NOT JUST PUSH 'EM TO COTTONWOOD, PUSH 'EM TO CAMP VERDE, PUSH 'EM TO CLARKDALE. 
          NOTHING HERE DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY. 
          [04:30:01]
WE NEED TO DO OUR FAIR SHARE. 
          ARE WE, WE'RE NOT GONNA SOLVE THE HOUSING PROBLEM WITH THIS PROJECT THE SAME WAY. 
          WE'RE NOT GOING TO SOLVE THE TRAFFIC PROBLEM WITH ALL THE GREAT STUFF THAT WE'RE DOING WITH, WITH THE, UM, TO DONATE MOTION PROJECT. 
          BUT WE'RE GOING TO HELP. 
          LET ME SEE. 
          OKAY, I THINK I'VE GOT JUST ABOUT, OH, WE TALKED ABOUT, UH, SOMEBODY HAD SAID, WELL PUT THE HOUSING AT THE DELLS. 
          THAT ALWAYS COMES UP AND COUNCIL DUNN ADDRESSED THAT REALLY WELL. 
          BUT IT'S NOT THE DELLS OR THE CULTURAL PARK. 
          ULTIMATELY, IT'S GONNA HAVE TO BE BOTH. 
          NO ONE'S SAYING NO TO THE DELLS, BUT IT'S GOING TO TAKE YEARS FOR THAT LAND TO BE ABLE TO BE USED AND IT'S GONNA HAVE TO BE BOTH. 
          SO, UH, I, AND I WANT, I ALSO WANT TO SHARE MY APPRECIATION WITH OUR GUESTS TODAY AND OUR STAFF. 
          THEY DID A GREAT JOB. 
          I I'M SEEING A LOT OF MOVEMENT FORWARD. 
          I DON'T THINK WE'RE THERE YET. 
          I THINK THE NUMBER HAS TO BE SPOKEN. 
          I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE, THE HOUSING PLAN DEFINITELY HAS TO, YOU KNOW, COME UP. 
          WE NEED SOME FACTS AND FIGURES. 
          I GET IT. 
          BUT I THINK WHAT YOU'VE DONE HAS BEEN REALLY, REALLY HELPFUL TO ME. 
          SO, UH, ANNETTE, DO YOU HAVE SOME KIND OF GUIDANCE TO MOVE FORWARD? BECAUSE I'M, WE'RE NOT GONNA HAVE A DECISION TODAY, I WOULD GUESS. 
          THANK YOU, MAYOR. 
          UM, I DO HAVE A QUICK QUESTION FOR YOU IN TERMS OF US SCHEDULING THE NEXT CONVERSATION ON THIS TOPIC. 
          AND THAT WOULD BE, IF YOUR PREFERENCE IS TO, UM, DO THE HOUSING STRATEGY WORK FIRST. 
          I HEARD SEVERAL PEOPLE BRING THAT UP, BUT I WASN'T SURE IF IT WAS A MAJORITY. 
          UM, AND THEN BRING BACK THE, UM, MASTER PLAN AFTER THAT, WHICH WOULD MEAN THAT THIS WOULD GET DELAYED TOWARDS THE END. 
          WHAT'S THE TIMEFRAME ON THE HOUSING STUDY THOUGH? THE HOUSING WORK? YEAH, SO THAT WE HAVE A PROPOSAL FROM A CONSULTANT THAT WE'VE BEEN, UM, FINE TUNING AND GETTING THAT READY TO, UM, BRING TO YOU. 
          UM, AND I THINK IT'S PROBABLY A COUPLE MONTH PROCESS WITH YOU TO WORK THROUGH THAT BECAUSE IT WOULD TAKE SEVERAL MEETINGS, AS YOU CAN TELL, IT'S A COMPLICATED TOPIC THAT YOU WOULD NEED TO HAVE A LOT OF DEBATE AND FIND, YOU KNOW, UH, TO COME TO THE FINAL CONCLUSION ON. 
          UM, SO WE'RE HAPPY TO DO THAT. 
          SO IF THAT'S THE NEXT STEP THAT YOU WANNA HAVE HAPPEN, WE CAN CERTAINLY, UM, GET THAT ROLLING AND THEN BRING THIS BACK AFTER THAT OR RUN IT IN PARALLEL. 
          I JUST WANTED TO CHECK ON YOUR, UM, KATHY EXPECTATION FOR THAT. 
          UM, SO I GUESS MY CONCERN IS THOUGH, IF THAT TAKES, YOU ARE GONNA PRESENT THAT IN A MONTH OR TWO AND THEN IT TAKES A COUPLE MONTHS? NO, NO, I HAVE THE PROPOSAL NOW. 
          OKAY. 
          BECAUSE I'M JUST WORRIED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, AS, WHO WAS IT THAT SAID, HOW DO YOU KEEP A PLAN FROM JUST GATHERING DUST ON A SHELF? RIGHT? UM, IS THERE ANY PART OF THESE THINGS THAT COULD MOVE FORWARD SORT OF ON A BIFURCATED TRACK, YOU KNOW, THAT WE COULD LOOK, LOOK, KEEP IT, KEEP IT RUNNING IN PARALLEL, IS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? YEAH, BECAUSE I JUST DON'T WANT, YOU COULD DO THAT AS WELL. 
          LOSE MOMENTUM OF, 'CAUSE EVERY TIME WE HAVE LARGE GAPS, WE HAVE TO GO BACK AND HAVE THE DISCUSSIONS REFRESH OUR MEMORIES. 
          YOU KNOW, THE PUBLIC WANTS TO WEIGH IN ON THE SAME POINTS AGAIN, WHICH ARE, THEY'RE ALWAYS WELCOME. 
          BUT IT, I WANNA MOVE FORWARD IN CONVERSATION. 
          SO I'M JUST TRYING TO SEE HOW WE CAN DO THIS EFFICIENTLY. 
          WELL, I DID HAVE ONE, UM, THOUGHT COME TO MIND THAT I HAVEN'T HAD A CHANCE TO ASK OUR CONSULTANTS OR STAFF ABOUT. 
          BUT I'M WONDERING, UM, IF WE CAN TACKLE THE CONVERSATION SORT OF BY THE DIFFERENT USES OR BLOCKS INSTEAD OF TRYING TO DO THE WHOLE ENTIRE THING ALL AT ONCE. 
          SO FOR EXAMPLE, IF WE'RE WORKING ON THE HOUSING STRATEGY, COULD WE AT THE SAME TIME BE WORKING WITH YOU ON NAILING DOWN WHAT YOU WANNA SEE IN THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT AREA OR THE DISCUSSIONS AROUND THE SIZE OF THE COMMERCIAL? UM, WHILE WE WORK ON WHAT SHOULD BE IN THE HOUSING PORTION, UM, IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH THE GENERAL WAY THAT THIS IS ALLOCATED, ALTHOUGH I DID HEAR SOME COMMENTS ABOUT THE ALLOCATION NOT BEING CORRECT, SO I DON'T THINK WE ARE HAPPY THE WAY IT'S ALLOCATED. 
          OKAY. 
          THEN I DON'T KNOW HOW WE CAN DO IT IN PARALLEL. 
          IF THE BIGGEST QUESTION MARK FOR YOU IS THE HOUSING DENSITY THAT NEEDS TO BE ANSWERED FIRST. 
          OKAY. 
          I WOULD RATHER WAIT. 
          I'M NOT LOOKING TO RUSH THIS AND YOU'RE NOT EITHER, BUT IS THERE INTEREST IN MEETING WITH THE SCHOOL BOARD TO UNDERSTAND THEIR NEEDS? YEAH. 
          YEAH, SURE. 
          WE CAN SET THAT UP. 
          WELL, CAN I JUST ASK, UH, BRIAN WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE? YOU WANT THE SCHOOL, THE ENTIRE SCHOOL BOARD 
          [04:35:01]
TO COME HERE? OR DO YOU WANT, UH, THE CITY MANAGER TO MEET WITH THE SCHOOL SUPERINTENDENT AND THE BOARD CHAIR? UH, I THINK WE NEED TO MEET WITH THE BOARD, LIKE WHAT WE DID WITH THE FIRE DISTRICT WHEN TALKING ABOUT THEIR NEED FOR A NEW LOCATION. 
          FIRE FOR FIRE STATION. 
          I JUST WANTED TO UNDERST UNDERSTAND YOUR, YOUR, YOUR THOUGHTS. 
          I, I WOULD AGREE. 
          UM, I DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND OF TIMEFRAME, UH, THAT WOULD BE. 
          I'LL SEND OUT THE INVITATION TOMORROW MORNING AND SEE WHAT THE SCHEDULING LOOKS LIKE. 
          I DON'T, UM, I'M NOT FAMILIAR WITH THEIR, THE AMOUNT OF AGENDA AND HOW, HOW EASY IT IS OR NOT TO GET ON THEIR CALENDAR. 
          OKAY. 
          WOULDN'T THIS BE A SPECIAL MEETING, JUST LIKE WHAT WE DID WITH THE FIRE DISTRICT? SO IT'S JUST A MATTER OF GETTING EVERYBODY'S SCHEDULES ALIGNED, I THINK, MELISSA. 
          SO IS THERE A WAY FOR US TO HAVE THE CONVERSATION SOONER THAN LATER REGARDING WHAT THE PROPORTIONS NEED TO BE IN ORDER FOR COUNCIL TO BE SORT OF HAPPY WITH THAT? BECAUSE THAT'S GONNA IMPACT DENSITY ON HOUSING IF YOU'RE GONNA TAKE AWAY LAND THAT CURRENTLY ON THEIR MAP SHOWS UP AS AS HOUSING. 
          SO IT SEEMS LIKE THAT SHOULD BE A CONVERSATION THAT WE HAVE SOONER RATHER THAN LATER JUST LOOKING AT 'EM AS BLOCKS, NOT LOOKING AT HOW MANY THINGS GO INTO EACH OF THOSE BLOCKS. 
          UM, AND THEN, YOU KNOW, IF WE WANTED TO HAVE THE CONVERSATION, WHAT I HEARD FOR INSTANCE FROM, FROM PATRICK IS SIF WANTS BOTH PINK SPOTS, UM, WHICH IS ALL OF THE COMMERCIAL THAT IS CURRENTLY DESIGNATED THERE. 
          AND SO PERHAPS THAT SHOULD BE A CONVERSATION THAT WE HAVE. 
          SO, I MEAN, I'VE HEARD OTHER PEOPLE SAY, WE DON'T RE WANT RETAIL IN THERE, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BUT THERE ISN'T ANY ROOM FOR RETAIL IN HERE. 
          YOU'D HAVE TO TAKE SOME OF YOUR, YOUR MIXED, YOU KNOW, MULTIFAMILY AND TURN IT INTO MIXED USE IN ORDER TO PUT COFFEE SHOPS UNDERNEATH OR WHATEVER IT IS THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. 
          SO I THINK THAT THOSE MIGHT BE DECISIONS THAT WE CAN, WE CAN HAVE THAT CONVERSATION SOONER RATHER THAN LATER AND, AND TRY AND COME UP WITH WHAT WE CAN MOSTLY AGREE ON. 
          . 
          WELL, CAN I ASK YOU, UH, MELISSA, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT COMMERCIAL, AND YOU MENTIONED A COFFEE SHOP, AND I LOVE THE IDEA OF A COFFEE SHOP, BUT IF THERE'S ONLY 2 5300 HOMES THERE, IS THAT A VIABLE BUSINESS? CAN THAT SURVIVE IN THAT CO BUT THAT'S THE CONVERSATION. 
          SO, SO THE YEAH, I I JUST WANNA SURE I UNDERSTOOD WHAT YOU WERE SAYING. 
          YEAH. 
          THE CONVERSATION IS, RIGHT NOW, THE ONLY COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES WE HAVE LINED OUT ARE BLOCKS ARE THE TWO PINK BLOCKS AS FAR AS I CAN RECALL, CORRECT? YES. 
          AND I HEARD PATRICK SAY FOR INSTANCE, IF WE WANTED TO MOVE FORWARD WITH SIF, HE WANTS BOTH OF THOSE, RIGHT? AND SO THEN THERE IS NO COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES AND, AND IF WE'RE IN AGREEMENT THAT HEY, LET'S CONSIDER THE SIF PROPOSITION, THEN WE CAN TAKE COMMERCIAL CONVERSATION OFF THE MAP, SO TO SPEAK. 
          BUT THEN WE STILL SAY, WELL, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN TO SAY YOU WANT MORE WHAT? MORE OPEN SPACE? MORE, MORE PARKLAND. 
          I MEAN, THOSE ARE THE CONVERSATIONS THAT I THINK I'M HEARING THE VICE MAYOR SAY SHE'S NOT SURE. 
          SO IT JUST SEEMS LIKE WE COULD HAVE THOSE CONVERSATIONS IN PARALLEL WITH DECIDING WHAT WE'RE DOING WITH HOUSING. 
          I'M LOOKING AT, I'M TRYING TO GET A, EVERYONE LOOKS REALLY TIRED. 
           WELL, WE'RE, WE'RE TIRED. 
          AND IF YOU WANNA SEND US AN EMAIL, SIR, WE CAN'T TAKE ANY COMMENTS FROM THE AUDIENCE RIGHT NOW. 
          SEND US AN EMAIL. 
          SEND US AN EMAIL. 
          SO, UH, COUNCILOR DUNN, UM, CAPTURED MY CONCERN AS WELL ABOUT HAVING EVERYTHING USED BY ONE AND THEN IT NOT REALLY HAVING A COMMUNITY FEEL. 
          SO YEAH, WE DON'T HAVE THAT INFO. 
          THAT DOES HAVE TO BE A PART OF IT, WHICH WE CAN ONLY KNOW AFTER. 
          AGAIN, IT'S CART BEFORE HORSE, RIGHT? SO WE HAVE TO FIGURE THAT OUT. 
          BUT YES, I KNOW THAT C HAS, UM, INDICATED THEY WOULD TAKE ALL THAT. 
          SO AGAIN, THAT WENT BACK TO THE POINT I WAS MAKING. 
          THAT'S, THERE'S NOT ENOUGH COMMERCIAL IN HERE FROM ME AND SOME OF THE DENSITY IN THE RESIDENTIAL PROBABLY NEEDS TO TRANSFER, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT BALLOT, THIS IS STUFF WE'RE ASKING FOR FROM STAFF. 
          MM-HMM . 
          SO THE QUESTION GOES BACK TO STAFF, DID YOU GET ENOUGH QUESTIONS FROM US TO BE ABLE TO PUT TOGETHER SOME OF WHAT WE'VE BEEN ASKING? BUT I'M NOT SURE THAT I WOULD AGREE BECAUSE YOU MIGHT SAY THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE COMMERCIAL AND FOUR OF US GO NOPE. 
          YEAH, I DON'T KNOW YET. 
          WE DON'T WE NEED ANY MORE COMMERCIAL. 
          AS A MATTER OF FACT, I DON'T WANNA DRIVE COMMERCIALS. 
          I MEAN, THAT'S A CONVERSATION WE NEED TO HAVE. 
          OKAY. 
          EXACTLY. 
          BUT DO WE HAVE A, A QUESTION POSED TO STEPH? OH, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, TO ANSWER COUNSELOR ELLA'S QUESTION, DO WE HAVE ENOUGH DIRECTION? I WOULD SAY NO RIGHT NOW. 
          MM-HMM . 
          UM, BUT I THINK AS I'M THINKING THROUGH IT, AS I'M LISTENING TO YOU TALK, UM, YOU KNOW, IN IN 
          [04:40:01]
THE PACKET WE HAD THE QUESTIONS THAT WE POSED TO THE PARTICIPANTS IN OUR FOCUS GROUPS, I DON'T THINK THAT THOSE QUESTIONS ARE SPECIFIC ENOUGH MM-HMM . 
          UM, TO GET FEEDBACK FROM YOU. 
          SO I THINK WHAT WE COULD DO IS TO GO BACK AND WORK WITH OUR TEAM AND COME UP WITH MAYBE SOME MORE SPECIFIC QUESTIONS. 
          SO FOR EXAMPLE, INSTEAD OF ASKING THE GENERAL QUESTION, IS THE LAND ALLOCATION APPROPRIATE TO ASK YOU MORE SPECIFIC QUESTIONS ABOUT EACH LAND ALLOCATION? I THINK WE'VE HAD ENOUGH CONVERSATION TONIGHT THAT WE'RE, I, I HOPE YOU GUYS HAVE ENOUGH BACKGROUND INFORMATION THAT YOU COULD ASK THAT. 
          AND THEN, UM, SO MAYBE THE NEXT STEP WOULD BE TO TAKE THOSE QUESTIONS, GET A LITTLE MORE DETAILED, SEND THOSE TO YOU, ALLOW YOU TO RESPOND TO THEM, AND THEN WE CAN, UM, COME UP WITH A CONSENSUS OR THE MAJOR, WHAT THE MAJORITY OF THE COUNCIL WANTS AND POTENTIALLY GO FROM THERE. 
          I DON'T KNOW IF I'M, I'M NOT NETTE OR LAUREN WANTS TO WEIGH IN OR IF YOU GUYS HAVE A DIFFERENT IDEA. 
          I, I LOVE THE I THE CONCEPT FIRST. 
          I WANNA SAY THAT I TOO, I THINK SHARE THAT THERE'S QUESTIONS THAT I THINK WE COULD TRY TO MOVE FORWARD TO INDEPENDENT OF THE HOUSING STUDY. 
          AND I WOULD LIKE TO TRY TO DO THAT SOONER RATHER THAN LATER. 
          I UNDERSTAND. 
          AND LIKE WHAT YOU'VE SAID, I WAS GONNA PUT THE NINE QUESTIONS BACK UP ON THE TABLE, BUT I HEARD WHAT YOU JUST SAID AND MM-HMM . 
          AND MAYBE THERE COULD BE BETTER QUESTIONS FOR US, BUT I WANT THAT DONE IN A PUBLIC SESSION FOR ALL OF US. 
          THE CONVERSATION. 
          I DON'T WANT THAT DONE AS RESPONSES BACK TO YOU WHERE YOU HAVE TO SEE IF YOU CAN FIGURE OUT WHAT THE MAJORITY OF COUNCIL IS, I THINK. 
          OKAY. 
          WE HAVE TO BE CLEAR ABOUT THAT. 
          OKAY. 
          AND THEN I WANTED TO ASK A SPECIFIC QUESTION JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT, DID YOU HEAR ANYTHING REGARDING THE PLAN THAT YOU THINK YOU'VE HEARD A CONSENSUS ON TONIGHT? I'M NOT SURE I'VE HEARD ANYTHING, BUT I WANNA KNOW WHAT YOU THINK  OTHER THAN VICE MAYOR PLU. 
          I HAVEN'T HEARD A START OVER DIRECTION. 
          OKAY. 
          SO DID I, I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT I THINK I, I REALLY WANNA BE PUBLIC ABOUT THIS. 
          YEAH. 
          I, I DON'T WANT JUST NODS HAPPENING. 
          I'D LIKE TO HEAR PEOPLE SAY SOMETHING SO WE CAN PUT IT TO BED OR NOT PUT IT TO BED. 
          SO YOU, YOU ASKED US A QUESTION, DO WE WANNA CONTINUE TO DO SOME WORK ON THE THIS MASTER PLAN IN THE MEANTIME OR NOT? OKAY. 
          SO THEN WHY DON'T WE START BY VOICE, DEREK? YES, YES, YES, YES. 
          I DON'T EVEN, I DON'T REALLY EVEN UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION TO BE HONEST WITH YOU. 
          DO YOU, DO YOU WANNA START FROM SCRATCH? DO YOU WANNA GO BACK? I DON'T KNOW. 
          OKAY. 
          I TRULY DON'T KNOW BECAUSE I WANNA SEE THE HOUSING STUDY. 
          RIGHT. 
          OKAY. 
          MELISSA? I'M GONNA SAY YES IF THIS IS THE POINT AT WHICH WE'RE STARTING WITH THE BLOCKS, RIGHT? OH YEAH. 
          BRIAN, I'M WILLING TO SAY YES, BUT I CAN THEN SEE US RUNNING INTO SOME ROADBLOCKS IN THE DISCUSSION. 
          SO WE'LL SEE WHAT HAPPENS. 
          DO THAT EVERY TIME ANYWAY. 
          THAT'S OKAY. 
          , THAT'S WHAT HAVING A PUBLIC DISCUSSIONS ABOUT. 
          RIGHT? UM, MAYBE IF WE TAKE EACH USE SEPARATELY REGARDING THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT BLOCKS MM-HMM . 
          MM-HMM . 
          IS THERE ANY DIRECTION THAT WE HAVE REGARDING THOSE REC CENTER? OKAY, WELL WE'RE GOOD. 
          WE COULD TALK ABOUT THAT NEXT TIME. 
          MM-HMM . 
          I, I MEAN UNDERSTANDING THAT THE SPECIFIC USES COULD CHANGE, BUT AS FAR AS THE SIZE OF THEM, THE LOCATION OF THEM, THE YES. 
          I THINK COMMUNITY AMENITIES AND A REC CENTER IS THE ONE THAT I THINK IS GOT THE MOST POPULAR AND NEED FOR, UH, NEED TO BE CONSIDERED. 
          SO, YES. 
          SO IF WE'RE STARTING WITH THE BLOCKS HERE, ARE THERE ANY, IS THERE ANY, ARE YOU OKAY WITH IT? WE STILL NEED TO DO IT . 
          SO I THINK WHAT I HEARD THE VICE MAYOR SAY IS SHE THINKS THERE HAS TO BE A REDISTRIBUTION OF THE BLOCKS ALONG EITHER OPEN SPACE 'CAUSE I DIDN'T GET CLARITY OR THE COMMUNITY BENEFITS SPACE. 
          OKAY. 
          BOTH OF WHICH ARE IN ESSENCE OPEN SPACE, RIGHT? MM-HMM . 
          SO WHAT I HEARD WAS THERE'S, SHE WOULD LIKE A CONVERSATION AROUND SHOULD ANY OF THIS BE MOVED AROUND SO THAT INSTEAD OF BEING 50%, IT'S 60% OR WHATEVER WE COME UP WITH. 
          SO, BUT IS THERE, OKAY. 
          I GUESS HERE'S, HERE'S A MORE SPECIFIC QUESTION. 
          IS THERE ANY DESIRE FROM ANY OF THE COUNCIL MEMBERS TO REDUCE THE SIZES OF THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT BLOCKS? REDUCE THE SIZE, RIGHT? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          ACTUALLY INCREASE THE SO WE'RE GOOD WITH CURRENT OR LARGER. 
          OKAY. 
          SAY THAT AGAIN. 
          I DIDN'T HEAR YOU WE'RE, IF WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT BLOCKS, WE ARE NOT GOING TO REDUCE THE SIZE, CHANGE THE USES OF THOSE AREAS. 
          THOSE WILL, YOU'RE OKAY WITH THOSE STAYING? I MIGHT WANT AND WE MIGHT WANT THEM TO BE LARGER. 
          OKAY. 
          GOT IT. 
          WE KNOW, WE 
          [04:45:01]
KNOW WHAT NONE OF US WANT IT TO BE REDUCED. 
          REDUCED, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE'S CONSENSUS ON, UH, A RECREATION CENTER. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND THAT THAT IS A USE THAT THERE, THERE'S, YOU CAN DEBATE THERE'S WAY MORE INFORMATION NEEDED. 
          WE'RE NOT COMMITTING TO DOING A RECREATION CENTER AS PART OF THIS. 
          WE ARE SAYING THAT IF YOU DECIDE TO DO A RECREATION CENTER IN THE FUTURE, THERE IS ROOM HERE FOR ONE. 
          CORRECT. 
          ONE OF THE PRO ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I HAVE THAT WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT IS WHEN WE PUT OUT DOCUMENTS, LISTING OF A RECREATION CENTER IS ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT, I MEAN I WOULD LOVE TO TRADE ONE OF MY BICYCLES FOR A PRIVATE JET, BUT I'M NEVER GONNA GET THERE. 
          SO THE, THAT RECREATION CENTER, I DON'T WANNA LIE TO PEOPLE ABOUT WHETHER THAT'S GONNA BE A FEASIBLE THING OR NOT. 
          AND SO WE NEED TO BE VERY CAREFUL IN FUTURE VERSIONS OF THIS DOCUMENT ABOUT WHAT'S LISTED AND WHAT'S NOT. 
          OKAY. 
          SO, SO I THINK THAT THAT'S ACTUALLY A QUESTION THAT WE CAN ASK TO THE CITY MANAGER IS TO WHETHER OR NOT THERE'S ANY WAY FOR US TO GET A ROUGH FEASIBILITY OF DOING A REC CENTER IF WE'RE THE ONES WHO ARE DOING, IT'S NOT A PRIVATE PUBLIC PARTNERSHIP SO THAT WE HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF IT'S A MILLION DOLLARS TO BUILD OR IT'S GONNA BE $30 MILLION TO BUILD. 
          UM, WE PROBABLY COULD GET A ROUGH ESTIMATE, BUT WE'D NEED TO KNOW ARE YOU TALKING FULL SIZE OLYMPIC POOL INDOORS? ARE YOU TALKING? DEPENDS ON WHAT IT IS. 
          SO YOU WANT ALL THE DETAILS? , I'M SURE JOSH WOULD TELL US HOW MUCH SOMETHING'S GONNA COST. 
          I THINK, UM, WHEN THIS FIRST CAME UP, WE, SOME OF OUR STAFF MEMBERS DID DO NOT NECESSARILY, THEY DID MORE OF A SURVEY OF SOME CITIES OF WHAT DO YOU HAVE, HOW MUCH DID IT COST? THAT SORT OF THING. 
          WE COULD, WE CAN PULL EXAMPLES ABOUT, WE CAN PULL EXAMPLES. 
          YEAH. 
          IT WAS IN THE SURVEY THAT WENT OUT TO RESIDENTS ABOUT THIS OF ALWAYS, EXCEPT IT WAS A MISLEADING QUESTION I FELT, BUT WE HAD IT, IT, BUT IT LISTED DIFFERENT CITIES THAT HAD BUILT VARIOUS LEVELS OF AMENITY AND THIS IS HOW MUCH IT, WE HAD A SQUARE FOOTAGE, A REC CENTER OF THIS SQUARE FOOTAGE OR THIS SQUARE. 
          THEN IT SAID, AND YOU'LL HAVE TO, WE WILL HAVE TO RAISE TAGS. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT THAT'S NOT THE POINT. 
          THE POINT IS IS THEY'VE ALREADY DONE THE WORK TO GET INFORMATION. 
          JUST BRING IT BACK. 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          JUST, JUST BRING IT BACK SO WE CAN HAVE A CONVERSATION AROUND IT. 
          THAT'S ALL. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          DOES THAT GIVE YOU ENOUGH TO, TO START WORKING WITH FOR NOW? WE DON'T HAVE TO GO DOWN THE ENTIRE, EVERY SINGLE BLOCK. 
          OKAY. 
          WE'RE NOT GONNA GO DOWN EVERY SINGLE BLOCK. 
          I'M GONNA HOPEFULLY DO ANOTHER ONE. 
          DOES ANYONE WANT TO DECREASE THE SIZE OF THE NATURAL OPEN SPACE AREA? NO. 
          UH, NO. 
          OKAY. 
          SO THERE, THERE'S, THERE YOU GO. 
          A GOOD DIRECTION. 
          GO . 
          OKAY. 
          UM, FOR THE MIXED USE AREAS, IS THERE ANY IN INTEREST IN, I I HEARD THAT POTENTIALLY THERE MIGHT BE INTEREST IN HAVING OTHER AREAS DESIGNATE AS POTENTIAL FUTURE MIXED USE. 
          IS THERE ANY DESIRE TO DECREASE THE SIZE OF THE MIXED USE? IS IT TAKEN UP NOW? NO, I'M, I'M SAYING THAT IF LIKE, IS THIS TOO MUCH MIXED USE AREA, I THINK IT'S HARD TO SEPARATE MIXED USE OUT FROM RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL BECAUSE THEY'RE ALL THE, THE THREE OF THEM THERE CAN BE SWAPS AND WHO KNOWS. 
          I HAVE NO IDEA HOW THAT CONVERSATION WILL GO. 
          BUT THAT'S PART OF, IS IN THE MIX FOR ME. 
          IT WOULD BE IN THE MIX. 
          AND FOR ME, I THINK THERE IS A CONVERSATION NEEDED ABOUT WHETHER IT'S UH, LOCAL AREA SERVING RETAIL COMMERCIAL OR WHETHER IT'S A LARGER DRAW CITYWIDE. 
          MM-HMM . 
          AND THEN WE GOT INTO TALKING ABOUT ACTUALLY BEING REALLY CREATIVE AND OKAY, IF YOU WANT TO HAVE ARTISTS IN, ARE THEY GONNA HAVE SOME SHARED ART SPACE, SOLO SPACE? WHAT'S THAT LOOK LIKE THAT THAT DOESN'T FIT THESE BLOCKS RIGHT NOW. 
          SO I WANNA MAKE SURE WE DON'T PRECLUDE THE CREATIVITY THAT WE GOT ENCOURAGED TO HAVE, UH, THIS AFTERNOON. 
          GOOD POINT. 
          BUT WOULDN'T THAT BE MIXED JUICE? I'M LOOKING AT CARRIE. 
          YEAH. 
          SO I GUESS THE, WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT YOU WANT MORE DETAIL ABOUT WHAT COULD POTENTIALLY BE THERE. 
          I THINK ONE OF THE QUESTIONS WAS, YOU KNOW, AS AGAIN AS THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY, THERE'S, YOU HAVE A LITTLE MORE CONTROL OVER THE PROPERTY. 
          UM, THE CURRENT ZONING OF THE PROPERTY IS P PLAN DEVELOPMENT. 
          IF THE ZONING OF THE PROPERTY, YOU KNOW, OBVI, THERE WILL BE SOME KIND OF ZONING CHANGE. 
          UM, A PD ZONING CAN DEFINE SPECIFIC USES. 
          AND SO THAT COULD BE A CONVERSATION OF WHAT TYPES OF USES WOULD BE ALLOWED IN THE MIXED USE AREA, COMMERCIAL, WHATEVER THAT YOU END UP CALLING IT. 
          SO, SO I'M HEARING, I I DON'T KNOW IF IS THERE THAT WE NEED TO HAVE MORE CONVERSATIONS ABOUT POTENTIAL FUTURE USES IN THAT AREA BEST. 
          OKAY. 
          UNDERSTAND THEM BETTER. 
          GREAT. 
          OKAY. 
          [04:50:01]
AND THEN, I MEAN THEN THE ONLY USES THAT ARE LEFT, UM, WOULD BE THE HOUSING, WHICH BASED ON YOUR CONVERSATION, IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU WANNA DO SOME DIFFERENT HOUSING THAT YOU WANT SOME MORE INFORMATION ON THE HOUSING STRATEGY. 
          YES. 
          AND SO I WOULD SAY FOR RIGHT NOW, UM, YOU KNOW, WE PROBABLY WILL JUST BE HANDS OFF ON THAT UNTIL WE GET FURTHER DIRECTION FROM YOU. 
          'CAUSE IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU GUYS WEREN'T PREPARED TO GIVE DIRECTION ON THE HOUSING TONIGHT. 
          BUT IF YOU POTENTIALLY WANT TO INCREASE THE COMMUNITY BENEFIT AREA AND INCREASE THE NATURAL OPEN SPACE, THE, THAT WOULD LIKELY BE COMING OUT OF THE HOUSING BLOCKS. 
          WHICH IS WHY IT'S HARD TO BE DEFINITIVE WHEN WE DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH HOUSING WE ACTUALLY WANNA PUT THERE. 
          MM-HMM . 
          RIGHT. 
          COULD WE POSSIBLY USE PLANNED SEDONA FOR GATHERING SOME MORE COMMUNITY INPUT? LIKE I'D LOVE TO JUST, YOU KNOW, SORT OF CROWDSOURCE IDEAS ABOUT WHAT WOULD COOL HOUSING LOOK LIKE. 
          ABSOLUTELY. 
          WHAT ARE SOME GOOD EXAMPLES OF, UH, COLLABORATIVE ART SPACE AND THINGS LIKE THAT? LIVE LIVE AND, AND WORK SPACE? UH, LIKE THAT. 
          UH, I'D LOVE TO HEAR MORE FROM THE COMMUNITY ABOUT THAT. 
          IS THAT SOMETHING WE CAN YEAH. 
          ACTIVATE THROUGH PLANNED SEDONA? YEAH, WE CAN DEFINITELY USE PLANNED SEDONA FOR MORE THINGS. 
          UM, HOW WE DO THAT, WE'LL HAVE TO, AND WHAT WE ASK, WE'LL, UM, TALK WITH OUR TEAM. 
          UM, BUT SO WOULD YOU BE LOOKING AT LIKE AN, AN OPEN, LIKE AN OPEN-ENDED QUESTION OF WHAT DO YOU THINK IS COOL HOUSING? OR DO YOU WANNA DO LIKE A, A OR B? LIKE YOU'RE AT THE EYE DOCTOR WHEN THEY SAY, YOU KNOW, FLIP THROUGH ALL THE THINGS I, I WOULDN'T WANNA PRECLUDE SOMEBODY COMING UP WITH SOMETHING THAT'S NOT A OR B, YOU KNOW, AND YOU BUILD. 
          SO THE ABILITY TO UPLOAD AN IMAGE FOR INSTANCE, UH, TO BE ABLE TO SHARE. 
          I THINK THAT WOULD BE USEFUL. 
          BRIAN, LET ME ASK YOU THIS. 
          WHEN YOU TALK AND I TALKED ABOUT COOL HOUSING ALSO THAT HAS TO BE WITHIN OUR CODES. 
          MM-HMM . 
          RIGHT? BECAUSE WE CAN END UP HAVING G AN EGG HOUSE LIKE THEY HAVE IN THE VOC. 
          THAT'S A, THAT WOULD BE KIND OF COOL BUT IT DOESN'T MEET OUR CODES. 
          SO IF WE TALKED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, NOT HAVING MORE THAN FOUR STORIES BECAUSE THAT'S OUTSIDE OUR DISCUSSION. 
          WE HOW DO YOU FRAME WHAT'S COOL? I KNOW I HAVE A VISION OF WHAT WOULD BE COOL BUT YOU KNOW, I MEAN CAN I RESPOND TO THAT? I WOULD RATHER NOT LIMIT THE INPUT. 
          I WOULD LIKE MAYBE STAFF COMMENT THAT OOH, THIS WOULD REQUIRE CHANGES AND YEAH WHATEVER. 
          BUT NOT, NOT TO LIMIT WHAT THE INPUT MIGHT BE. 
          OKAY. 
          YEAH. 
          ESPECIALLY IF IT WINDS UP BEING A SOURCE OF COMMUNITY PRIDE WHEN THE DAY IS DONE. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          WHY DON'T WE HAVE A FOCUS GROUP WITH AREA ARTISTS TO TALK. 
          THIS WOULD BE SEPARATE BUT JUST TO TALK ABOUT WHAT THEIR NEEDS ARE AND WHAT WE COULD DO FOR THEM. 
          'CAUSE I KNOW EXHIBITION SPACE AND BRINGING ARTISTS IN FROM OUTSIDE ARTIST RESIDENCE HAS BEEN TALKED ABOUT FOR A LONG TIME FOR YEARS AND IT'S BEEN DONE IMMANENTLY AND IT WAS VERY, VERY WELL RECEIVED BUT IT NEVER, YOU KNOW, LASTED . 
          YEP. 
          DEREK, I SWEAR I DO NOT HAVE CONSUMPTION. 
          UM, QUESTION TO THE OTHER COUNSELORS. 
          DO YOU HAVE A ROUGH IF WE HAVE HOUSING HERE? SOUNDS LIKE DIRECTION WE'RE GOING. 
          DO YOU HAVE A ROUGH IDEA OF A NOT TO EXCEED NUMBER IN YOUR MIND OR IS THIS ALL, I FEEL LIKE I HEARD SEVERAL OF YOU, SEVERAL OF YOU SAY THAT YOU THOUGHT FOUR 30 WAS TOO DENSE. 
          BUT I WOULD, DO WE ALL THINK FOUR 30 IS TOO DENSE OR DO WE NOT, I MEAN JUST SOME VAGUE IDEA OF YOU START . 
          OKAY, I'LL START. 
          I'D SAY 300 OR BELOW. 
          I HAVEN'T BEEN UP, UH, SCARED OFF BY WHAT I'VE SEEN IN THE PLAN SO FAR WITH THE CAVEAT THAT I DO NEED TO SEE SOME TRAFFIC INFORMATION BEFORE WE COMMIT TO SOME NUMBER. 
          SOME OF THE NUMBER DEPENDS ON HOW IT'S GONNA BE LAID OUT TOO BECAUSE I DEFINITELY, UM, DON'T I WANNA SEE A MIXED TYPES OF HOUSING AS WELL IN TERMS OF TOWN HOMES ATTACHED, NON-ATTACHED, YOU KNOW, I WANNA SEE A MIX THERE. 
          SO I THINK THAT HAVING A MIX IS PROBABLY GONNA BRING A NUMBER DOWN SIGNIFICANTLY. 
          SO I DON'T HAVE THE NUMBER IN MY HEAD, BUT IF YOU WANTED TO SAY 300 AS A GOAL TO START WITH AND DOWN FROM THERE IN TERMS OF TYPES, I COULD GO WITH THAT IF THAT'S SOMETHING WE'RE SETTING. 
          BUT 
          [04:55:01]
COULD BE 200 FOR ME. 
          IT COULD BE LESS. 
          I DON'T, YOU KNOW, PROBABLY NOT 'CAUSE WE'RE TRYING TO GET HOUSING THERE, BUT MY QUESTION WAS KIND OF DOES ANYBODY WANNA HIRE NUMBER OR WE ALL KIND OF NO. 
          NO. 
          OKAY. 
          SO NO ARE THE OTHER QUESTION. 
          DO PEOPLE, DOES ANYBODY WANT FOUR STORY BUILDINGS? NO. 
          NO. 
          I MEAN I DON'T WANT A FOUR STORY BUILDING. 
          COULD I DO A THREE STORY BUILDING? DEPENDS ON WHERE IT IS. 
          FOUR STORY BUILDINGS AT THE RIGHT LOCATION ARE NOT OFF THE MAP FOR ME. 
          OKAY. 
          BUT I MEAN WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, BUT I FEEL LIKE THESE ARE MAYBE SOME OF THE THINGS WE COULD DRILL DOWN ON FOR CARRIE AND, AND MM-HMM . 
          WHOEVER ELSE IS HAVING TO KEEP TRACK OF THIS MESS. 
          SO PETE HAS BROUGHT UP A TRAFFIC, SOME TRAFFIC ANALYSIS A COUPLE TIMES. 
          IS THERE INTEREST FROM OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE TRAFFIC DATA? I WOULD LIKE TO SEE TRAFFIC DATA ON THE AMOUNT OF HOUSING THAT WE HAVE, BUT ALSO WHAT A 5,000 SEAT AMPHITHEATER WOULD BRING. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT WOULD BE ON THE 2.0 PEOPLE TO PAY FOR. 
          SO AGAIN, IS THE JUST TRAFFIC DATA OVER, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT COUNCIL WOULD LIKE TO SEE? I WOULD ACTUALLY SUGGEST THAT TRAFFIC DATA MIGHT BE THE NEXT STAGE AFTER THE NEXT CONVERSATION. 
          WHAT I WAS GONNA ASK NEXT IS WHAT NUMBERS SHOULD WE USE? YEAH, I DON'T THINK WE HAVE THAT NUMBER YET. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT'S FAIR. 
          WELL CAN YOU GO, IS THERE CONSENSUS TO GO WITH THE NUMBER THAT'S BEING USED NOW? NO, I DON'T THINK SO. 
          JUST THE TRAFFIC DATA AND THEN AGAIN AT 300. 
          YEAH, I THINK, I THINK IT COMES DOWN TO WHAT'S THE MIX. 
          IF IT'S A STUDIO, WHICH WE DON'T THINK WE REALLY WANT, THAT WOULD, THAT MIGHT BE ONE CAR. 
          AND IF IT'S A THREE BEDROOM BUT IT'S A FAMILY, IT MIGHT BE ONE CAR. 
          SO I THINK WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND A LITTLE MORE ABOUT WHO WE'RE HOUSING AND WHAT KIND OF HOUSING, YOU KNOW, DO WE WANNA PUT THERE? 'CAUSE THAT'S GOING TO, YEAH, IT'S JUST OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          TO THAT POINT. 
          AND WHO WAS IT THAT BROUGHT UP ABOUT DOING A FOCUS GROUP? OKAY. 
          I WOULD LIKE TO THROW ON A TABLE, A FOCUS GROUP FOR FAMILIES TO SEE WHAT THEY'RE LOOKING FOR AND IF WE COULD FIND FAMILIES THROUGH THE SCHOOL DISTRICT BY WORKING WITH THEM. 
          GET SOME INPUT FROM, FROM FAMILIES. 
          WHAT DO THEY NEED? DO THEY NEED A SWING SET? DO THEY, I MEAN, WHATEVER. 
          HOW MANY ROOMS DO THEY NEED? YOU THINK, YOU KNOW, COMMON SENSE WOULD TELL YOU THREE BEDROOMS, BUT I JUST WANNA KNOW IF THERE'S ANY INTEREST OF HAVING A FOCUS GROUP FOR THAT. 
          IF NOT, OKAY. 
          BUT I JUST WANNA THROW IT OUT THERE. 
           DEREK, WHERE ARE WE GONNA FIND THESE FAMILIES? ARE WE GONNA FIND FAMILIES? RIGHT? YEAH, I KNOW, I, I, I GET IT. 
          IS THAT PART OF THE SCHOOL DISTRICT DISCUSSION THOUGH? WELL, AND THAT'S FINE, BUT IF YOU DON'T BROACH IT, YOU DON'T KNOW MM-HMM . 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          SO OKAY TO WRAP THAT UP FOR TRAFFIC, I'M HEARING YOU'RE INTERESTED, BUT NOT NOW BECAUSE YOU WANNA TALK MORE ABOUT THE NUM HOUSING NUMBERS. 
          MM-HMM . 
          FAIR ENOUGH. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, I DON'T, CAN I HEAR FROM THE OTHER COUNCIL? OH YEAH, I WAS GONNA SAY I HAVE THREE PEOPLE WHO WEIGHED IN ON THE HOUSING NUMBERS, THESE THREE ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE DIOCESE. 
          RIGHT? SO DO YOU WANT TO WEIGH IN ON SOME NUMBERS? I STILL THINK IT'S PREMATURE. 
          I MEAN I JUST, I THINK IT, I, MY ASSUMPTION IS THAT ONCE WE DO OUR HOUSING STRATEGY, I BELIEVE IT WILL BE A SIGNIFICANTLY LOWER NUMBER THAN THE CURRENT TOP END FIGURE. 
          BUT WHAT IT IS, WHO KNOWS? ARE YOU WILLING TO GO ON THE RECORD ABOUT STORIES THREE, FOUR OR FOUR IF IS FOUR OFF THE TABLE FOR YOU OR? YEAH, I THOUGHT WE ALL, I THOUGHT ALL OF US WERE NODDING OUR HEAD THAT WE WERE OUT ON THAT. 
          WE DON'T WANNA NOD HEDGE. 
          NO, I'M FINE WITH, WITH LIMITING IT'S LIKE THREE MAX. 
          OKAY. 
          EVERYBODY ELSE, DEPENDING ON WHERE IT'S LOCATED ON PROPERTY. 
          YEAH, I, I I THINK THREE WOULD BE THE MAX FOR ME BECAUSE THAT'S JUST SORT OF IN CHARACTER WITH WHERE WE ARE. 
          I REALIZE THAT, THAT IT'S LOWER AND THEREFORE IT MAY ONLY LOOK LIKE A TWO STORY BUILDING FROM FURTHER AWAY. 
          BUT TWO STORIES IS WHAT MOSTLY WE HAVE EVERYWHERE AND IT JUST FEELS LIKE I, IF WE WANT IT TO BE REPRESENTATIVE OF OUR COMMUNITY, THEN WE NEED TO HAVE IT BE REPRESENTATIVE OF OUR COMMUNITY. 
          I REMAIN PUZZLED THAT WE HAVE A ESSENTIALLY A FIVE STORY STRUCTURE OUT THERE CURRENTLY. 
          AND NOW WE'RE GONNA SAY LIMIT HOUSING TO THREE. 
          THAT JUST SEEMS WEIRD TO ME. 
          IT DOES, YEAH. 
          BUT TO THAT, I'D LOVE TO HEAR, I BROUGHT IT UP EARLIER, IT'S AN OPEN ARCHWAY THAT ONE CAN STILL SEE THROUGH. 
          IT'S NOT THE DENSITY, THE, THE MASS THAT A BUILDING WILL BRING YOU HAVING THERE. 
          SO I JUST, JUST YOUR THOUGHT, KEVIN, DO YOU HAVE ANY WORDS OF WISDOM THAT JUST CAME TO YOU? UM, SO I JUST ASKED JAY, UM, AND BY GOING DOWN TO THREE, I MEAN OBVIOUSLY 
          [05:00:01]
NOT DOING A FOURTH STORY, YOU'RE GONNA LOSE 25% OF THE UNITS IN THAT BLOCK. 
          SO JUST BY THAT YOU'D PROBABLY BE DOWN TO ABOUT 3 25. 
          IS THAT, THAT'S THE 0.3 25. 
          SO YOU'RE GONNA, THAT WILL REDUCE IT QUITE A BIT BY DOING A THREE STORY BUILDING INSTEAD OF A FOUR STORY BUILDING IN BLOCK EIGHT. 
          YOU KNOW, I THINK ONE OF THE LESSONS THAT WE LEARNED FROM THE OAK RIDGE HERITAGE DISTRICT IS TO BE CLEARER ABOUT WHAT IT IS THAT WE WERE ASKING PEOPLE, RIGHT? MM-HMM . 
          AND WE GIVE THEM PICTURES OF WHAT WE THINK IT SHOULD LOOK LIKE, AND THEN THEY BRING THINGS THAT HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THOSE PHOTOS, AND IT WASN'T REALLY CLEAR WE COULD HOLD THEM TO THOSE PHOTOS. 
          SO I THINK WE HAVE TO LEARN FROM THAT ABOUT WHAT PHOTOS MEAN AND HOW PEOPLE INTERPRET THEM. 
          OKAY. 
          AND THE FACT THAT WE DON'T ALWAYS GET WHAT WE WANT 'CAUSE WE'RE NOT CLEAR ENOUGH. 
          AND WHEN IT GOES THROUGH A REVIEW, IT'S LIKE, DOESN'T REVIEW, DOESN'T MATCH WHAT IT'S, WHAT PEOPLE THINK IT'S GOING TO LOOK LIKE. 
          SO THAT'S WHY I'M SO HESITANT ABOUT SHOWING. 
          YEAH, OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, IT'S, IT'S A, IT'S A HARD THING BECAUSE DOING A COMPLETE BUILDING RENDERING TO MEET SEDONA DESIGN STANDARDS IS PROBABLY LITTLE BEYOND THE SCOPE OF WHAT WE WERE TRYING TO DO. 
          BUT WE'RE TRYING TO REPRESENT SOME BLOCKS, BUT THEN IF YOU JUST PUT A BLANK BLOCK, THEN I KNOW THERE'S NO DETAILING. 
          YOU PUT THE WRONG DE AND SO THERE, THERE IS A BALANCING ACT THERE. 
          UM, BUT, BUT IF WE COULD FIND, AND WE COULD SHOW TO THE PUBLIC SOMETHING THAT HAS BEEN DONE IN ANOTHER COMMUNITY THAT DOES FEEL LIKE US, IT WOULD GO A LONG WAY. 
          I MEAN, THAT MIGHT BE SOMETHING WHERE I DON'T, I AM NOT AS FAMILIAR WITH THE PLAN. 
          SEDONA WEBSITE. 
          CYNTHIA DID A LOT OF THE DEALING ON THAT. 
          AND SO IF WE CAN FIND SOMETHING WHERE, UM, I THINK, UM, COUNCILOR FOLTZ MENTIONED IF THERE WAS LIKE AN OPEN THING WHERE PEOPLE COULD SAY, THIS IS WHAT I THINK LOOKS COOL. 
          UM, STAFF COULD PROBABLY GO THROUGH AND SAY LIKE, HERE'S HOW THIS MAY OR MAY NOT FIT WITHIN SEDONA DESIGN STANDARDS. 
          BUT THEN THAT WOULD ALSO GIVE COUNCIL SOME IDEA OF WHAT, YOU KNOW, IF, IF THAT'S WHAT YOU WANT, WE CAN LOOK AT HOW, LIKE WHAT KIND OF DESIGN STANDARDS MIGHT BE NEEDED FOR THIS AREA. 
          BUT THAT, YOU KNOW, LEAVING IT OPEN AND SAYING, WHAT DO, WHAT DO YOU WANT? GIVE US PICTURES OF WHAT YOU WANT MIGHT HELP US, RATHER THAN US PICKING PICTURES ON OUR OWN AND SAYING, YEAH, VOTE YES OR NO. 
          I DON'T KNOW IF THAT, BUT I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT WOULD WORK BECAUSE I'M NOT, I'LL HAVE TO FIGURE THAT OUT. 
          YEAH, THINK ABOUT IT. 
          OKAY. 
          NOW, UH, DO YOU HAVE ENOUGH, STEVE ? CARRIE, CLEAR AS MUD. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY, WELL WE TRY TO ACCOMMODATE. 
          OKAY. 
          ANYTHING ELSE? 
          [5. ADJOURNMENT]
I OKAY. 
          HEARING NOTHING. 
          THIS MEETING'S ADJOURNED.
* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.