* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [00:00:05] OKAY. CALLING THIS [1. CALL TO ORDER/PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE/MOMENT OF SILENCE ] MEETING TO ORDER AT FOUR 30, PLEASE JOIN ME FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE, THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE FIVE OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY, JUSTICE PER, AND NOW A MOMENT OF SILENCE. AND I'D LIKE TO DEDICATE THIS TO THE RELEASE OF THE HOSTAGES. OKAY. MADAM CLERK, CAN YOU DO THE ROLL CALL, PLEASE? ACTING MAYOR PLU. HERE. COUNCILOR DUNN. PRESENT. COUNCILOR FOLTZ. HERE. COUNCILOR FURMAN. PRESENT. COUNCILOR KINSELLA. HERE. COUNCILLOR FAF. PRESENT. OKAY. ITEM THREE, [ 3. CONSENT ITEMS - APPROVE ] CONSENT ITEMS. CAN I HAVE A MOTION? MAYOR, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION, UH, TO ADOPT CONSENT TO ITEMS THREE A THROUGH F TO APPROVE. SECOND. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND. COUNCILLOR FOLTZ. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? OKAY, WE'RE UNANIMOUS. MAYOR PLU. WE'VE GOT THE MOMENT OF ART. THANK YOU. UH, I WAS GONNA DO IT NEXT. NANCY, WHERE [Additional Items] ARE YOU? HERE I CAN GO OVER, GET THE GOOD AFTERNOON ACTING MAYOR AND COUNSELORS. UM, I'M EXCITED TO PRONOUNCE, UH, PRESENT A VERY SPECIAL GUEST TODAY, JAMES HAVENS, WHO'S TRAVELED HERE FROM ALASKA TO WORK ON A COLLABORATIVE MURAL, UM, IN COLLABORATION WITH KSB AND THE CITY. AND, UM, A LITTLE BIT ABOUT JAMES. HE IS AN AWARD-WINNING ARTIST AND CONSERVATIONIST. HE WAS BORN IN MAINE, BUT LIVED ALL OVER THE COUNTRY GROWING UP SINCE HIS FATHER WAS IN THE AIR FORCE. HE ATTENDED THE ART CENTER COLLEGE OF DESIGN IN PASADENA, CALIFORNIA. AND HE IS CURRENTLY BASED IN ANCHORAGE, ALASKA. THERE HE OWNS AND OPERATES HAVEN STUDIO AND GALLERY, ALASKA PALEO PROJECT, AND THE HAVENS RELIC COMPANY. HIS PROUDEST CREATIONS ARE HIS TWO AMAZING CHILDREN, RUBY SAHARA AND SAGE MASON HAVENS. HIS ORIGINAL WORKS ARE FEATURED IN MUSEUMS AND CORPORATE AND PRIVATE COLLECTIONS WORLDWIDE. HIS EXPERTISE EXTENDS TO DIVERSE CREATIVE SERVICES, PAINTING, BUILDING SIZE, MURALS, VIDEOGRAPHY, PHOTOGRAPHY, MULTIMEDIA SCULPTURE AND DESIGN SERVICES. JAMES HAD REACHED OUT TO CARLA WILLIAMS, PRESIDENT OF KSB, AND, UM, CRAIG SWANSON, VICE PRESIDENT OF KSB, AND, UM, SAID HE WANTED DO SOMETHING IN COLLABORATION IN SEDONA. HE TRAVELS AND HE, HE'S REALLY BIG ON CONSERVATION AND GETTING TO KNOW COMMUNITIES. SHE REACHED OUT TO ME AND I JUMPED ON IT. I THOUGHT IT WAS A, A PERFECT CHECK TO EVERY BOX FOR WHAT WE DO, BRINGING COMMUNITY TOGETHER, ART AND CONSERVATION. AND SO THAT'S HOW IT STARTED. THE 15 FOOT WIDE BY EIGHT FOOT HIGH COMMUNITY MURAL EVENT IS ENTITLED RED ROCK, SEDONA SKY, UNITING EARTH, SKY, AND COMMUNITY FOR CONSERVATION. THE PUBLIC HAS BEEN INVITED TO PAINT WITH JAMES SINCE FRIDAY, OCTOBER 10TH, AND TODAY WAS THE LAST DAY BECAUSE HE REALLY HAS TO BE LOCKED UP IN THAT BARN AND, AND CONTINUE PAINTING TO GET IT TO THE QUALITY THAT, UM, HE DOES. SO, UH, WE'RE GONNA PRESENT YOU, UH, RIGHT NOW AND WE'LL GET STARTED. PLEASE WELCOME JAMES HAVENS. ALL RIGHT. OKAY. HERE WE GO. HERE WE GO. . JAMES DOESN'T LIKE TALKING ABOUT HIMSELF, BUT HE HAS TO NOW . YEAH, I GUESS WE WILL. UM, FIRST I'D LIKE TO THANK, UM, SEDONA FOR THE OPPORTUNITY AND THE GENEROSITY AND HOSPITALITY. IT'S BEEN WONDERFUL. EVERYONE HERE HAS BEEN SO SWEET AND KIND, UM, FROM THE MOMENT I GOT HERE, SO THANK YOU FOR THAT. UM, I GUESS NANCY HAS A SLIDE PRESENTATION OF SOME OF MY WORK, AND, UH, WE'LL GO THROUGH THIS REAL QUICK HERE AND, UH, AND SEE WHAT WE GOT. SO, I LIKE TO WORK IN, IN LARGE SCALE. UM, CAN YOU SIT CLOSER TO THE MIC? YEAH. HOW'S THIS BETTER? OH, YES, IT IS. MUCH BETTER. OKAY. SO I, I LIKE TO WALK WORK IN A LARGE SCALE. UM, I DO A LOT OF CONSERVATION WORK. UM, I STARTED OUT DOING LIFE-SIZE DINOSAURS, SO IT WAS A GREAT STEP TO GO INTO THE NEXT, UM, CHAPTER OF MY, UM, MY LARGE SCALE WORKS, WHICH OF COURSE IS, IS FEATURED THERE ON THE, ON THE SCREEN THERE. AND THIS, WE ROLL RIGHT INTO THE, UM, TUSKER OF AL CAPLAN. AND, UH, WE'RE FEATURING CONSERVATION WORK, UM, ON AFRICA'S LAST BIG TUSKER, UM, LIFE-SIZE PORTRAITS [00:05:01] OF THEM. AND THAT'S THE MA CAT I DID TO, UM, FOR THE PAINTING. I KIND OF PHOTOGRAPH THOSE AND CREATE THOSE FOR THE COMPOSITION. AND HERE'S A COUPLE OF MY PAINTINGS HERE. THE MOST RECENT WAS ALDA, AND HE'S A ACTUAL ELEPHANT LIVING IN SAVO AFRICA. I WORKED WITH THE SAVO TRUST FOUNDATION ON THAT ONE TO PRESERVE, UM, HIS HABITAT AND SUCH. AND THEN THE OTHER ONE OF THERE IS CRAIG, WHO IS, UM, ANOTHER BIG TUSKER, AND HE WAS FROM AM BOLEY PARK, KENYA. HOW MANY ARE LEFT? WE HAVE ABOUT, I THINK THERE'S ABOUT A HUNDRED OR SO ELEPHANTS LEFT. UM, AND THEY'RE 50 YEARS OLD. YES, THEY ARE 50 YEARS OLD. YEP. AND WE ALSO DO, WE ROLLED INTO CONSERVATION WITH THE WHALES. UM, IN ALASKA WE HAVE THE COOK AT BELUGA WHALE, AND THAT IS AN ENDANGERED SPECIES, LIKE LESS THAN 150 OR 300. SO OF THOSE, UM, AND THIS IS THE COMPLETED PROJECT THERE. UM, THIS IS ANOTHER PIECE WE DID WITH THE PALEONTOLOGY OF THE TNA MOUNTAINS RANGE, UM, FEATURED THE FOSSILS THAT WERE IN THERE. IT'S ABOUT A 35 FOOT CANVAS, AND THAT'S CURRENTLY AT THE, UM, ALASKA NATURAL HISTORY MUSEUM IN ALASKA. AND WE WERE DESIGNING, UM, SOME REALLY GREAT, UM, UNIQUE SPECIES OF DINOSAURS FROM THE NORTH SLOPE OF ALASKA. AND THIS IS THE NANUK SOUS. UM, AND I CREATED A WHOLE EXHIBIT FROM THIS, YOU KNOW, THE, THE SKULL AND THE DIFFERENT TREKS AND WHATNOT. AND I GOT TO EXPLORE ALASKA'S WILDERNESS FOR THAT PROJECT. AND THIS WAS THE, UM, THE FINISH COMPLETED PAINTING OF THE TWO TYPE, UM, NANUK SOURCES THERE. AND, UH, IT FEATURES THE DIMORPHISM, THE MALE AND THE FEMALE, AND THE LITTLE ONES RUNNING AROUND THROUGH THE, THE BRUSH THERE. AND THIS IS ANOTHER LARGE SCALE DINOSAUR PIECE I DID. IT'S AT THE UNIVERSITY OF MUSEUM OF THE NORTH. AND, UM, AS YOU WALK INTO THE MAIN GALLERY, THAT'S WHERE THAT ONE'S LOCATED. I LIKE TO WORK REALLY BIG, AND THIS IS ALL THE, THE PEOPLE THAT, UH, WE'VE, WE'VE TOUCHED OVER THE YEARS WITH OUR PROJECTS. AND, UM, HOPEFULLY THIS, IT HAS BEEN SUCCESSFUL HERE IN SEDONA AS WELL. SO, AND THAT'S, AND THIS WAS THE END OF MY, UH, DINOSAUR SERIES THERE. 'CAUSE THEY'RE, THEY'RE ALL KIND OF AVIAN BIRDS NOW. SO, UM, IT HAS THE GOLDEN EAGLE PERCH TO TOP THE SKULL OF THE T-REX THERE THAT WE HAD THERE. AND WE ALSO WERE ABLE TO, UM, DO THE COVER OF THE WOOLLY MAMMOTH BIRD SCIENCE MAGAZINE. AND NOW WE'RE ON THE CONSERVATION. THIS IS A PIECE WE DID FOR THE PALISADES FIRES ON THE COASTAL, UM, BEACHES THERE OF, OF SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA. AND, UH, SO YEAH, THAT'S WHAT WE'VE DONE. SO THAT'S JAMES' STORY. HE DOES SO MUCH CONSERVATION WORK. I OBVIOUSLY VERY IMPRESSED WITH, UH, WE JUMPED ON THIS, CARLA AND I, TO BRING HIM TO SEDONA BECAUSE HIS WORK IS INCREDIBLE. HE'S VERY HUMBLE, AS YOU CAN TELL. AND, UM, HE'S CONTINUING TO BRING OUT, UM, CONSERVATION MESSAGES AND PART OF HIS PROCEEDS GO TO THESE, UH, DIFFERENT CAUSES THAT HE REPRESENTS. AND WORKING WITH COMMUNITY IS REALLY BIG FOR HIM TOO, AND HE'S BEEN SO EASY TO WORK WITH HERE AND WITH, UM, OUR, UM, ALL AGES. AND I'M GONNA GET INTO THAT NOW. SO YOU'RE OFF THE HOOK. ALL RIGHT. SO I'LL DO THE REST, . SO, UM, FIRST I WANNA THANK MANY PEOPLE BECAUSE IT TAKES A VILLAGE. THANK YOU FOR YOU INITIATING THIS. JAMES CARLA HAS BEEN WORKING ENDLESSLY AROUND THE CLOCK, YOU KNOW, HELPING GET HIM HERE. AND, UM, CRAIG, THANK YOU CRAIG. UM, I WANNA THANK ALL OF YOU, SEDONA CITY COUNCIL AND THE ARIZONA COMMUNITY FOUNDATION FOR ALL YOUR FUNDING AND SUPPORTING THIS PROJECT. CHARLOTTE, WHERE ARE YOU? HOSNI, AND I DON'T KNOW IF DAVID GILL IS HERE, BUT BOTH OF YOU, THANK YOU FOR PUTTING JAMES UP IN YOUR CASITAS. YEAH. UM, NATE MYERS FOR THE, UM, HISTORIC PHOTOS OF THE BARN AND THE PROPERTY, SKIP DOWN FOR HIS ENERGY, RUNNING AROUND AND PASSING OUT FLYERS AND GETTING THE WORD OUT PUBLIC WORKS FOR HELPING US GET THE BARN SET UP AND COMMUNICATIONS FOR GETTING THE WORD OUT WITH PRESS RELEASES AND, UM, SOCIAL MEDIA. SO, I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY ARE AWARE, BUT LILLIAN WILHELM SMITH WAS AN ARTIST HERE, AND SHE OWNED THE PROPERTY THAT THE RANGER STATION IS ON, AND SHE PURCHASED THAT IN 1937. UM, SHE WAS A PAINTER AND AN ILLUSTRATOR. SHE ILLUSTRATED GRAIN, UH, ZANE GRAY'S BOOKS. AND, UM, MAX AND ERNST AND DOROTHEA TANNING PAINTED WITH HER ON THAT PROPERTY IN 1946. AND SOME OF THEIR MOST FAMOUS WORKS WERE DONE ON OUR CITY PROPERTY BACK THEN. AND, UM, THEY ALL LIVED IN AND STAYED AT THE STONE HOUSE THAT'S NOW IN LOS ADOS. AND IT'S ALL HISTORIC LANDMARK. SO I THOUGHT THAT WAS REALLY IMPORTANT, INCLUDING HER IN THE MURAL. SO WHEN WE GOT THIS PROJECT, IT WAS JUST GENERAL, IT WAS, LET'S JUST DO SOMETHING ABOUT SEDONA. AND THEN WHEN I, I WAS LIKE, THIS IS LARGE, WHERE CAN WE PUT IT? AND WE KNEW IT WAS GONNA BE THE RANGER STATION. WE SAID, LET'S MAKE IT ORGANICALLY EVOLVED. THIS WILL BE A MURAL ABOUT IN CELEBRATING THAT PROPERTY. SO THIS IS A VERY ROUGH, UH, PHOTOSHOP JOB. SO THERE'S A FEW EXTRA BARNS IN THERE. BUT ANYWAY, IT'S A BARN. IT'S A HOUSE, IT'S A RANGER ON A STATION. IT'S LILLIAN TO HONOR THAT. SHE WAS THERE [00:10:01] MANY YEARS AGO. IT'S THE BEAUTIFUL SCENERY WE ALL GET TO LOOK AT EVERY DAY. AND THEN AS IT EVOLVES, HE WILL ADD IN FLORA, FAUNA, AND THE CONSERVATION PIECE OF THOSE THAT ARE INDIGENOUS TO OUR AREA. I HAD THIS LITTLE DREAM THAT, UM, WOULDN'T IT BE KIND OF COOL TO HAVE THE OLD PIECES LIKE THE RANGER AND LILLIAN BLACK AND WHITE AND SHADES OF GRAY, AND THEN MERGE INTO COLOR? AND HE WAS HAPPY TO DO THAT. SO WE'LL SEE HOW THIS IS GONNA TURN OUT. IT'S ALL A WORK IN PROGRESS. SO THIS IS HIS FIRST SKETCH, AND AGAIN, VERY BIG. UM, AND HE JUST SKETCHED IT OUT IN GRAZE. AND THEN OUR FIRST DAY WE HAD, UM, A GROUP OF SEDONA CHARTER SCHOOL, THIRD GRADERS COME, THEY ALL, UM, WERE CHOSEN 'CAUSE THEY HAD LEADERSHIP SKILLS. THEY WERE VERY WELL-BEHAVED AND VERY ENGAGED. SO THEY'RE MIXING COLOR. AND JAMES IS SHOWING THEM HOW TO WORK ON THE MURAL AND PAINT DIFFERENT AREAS WITH WHAT THE PLAN WAS. THEY WERE SO INTO IT. THIS LITTLE GIRL ON THE TOP LEFT WAS ACTUALLY SKETCHING THE MURAL ON HER CLIPBOARD. UM, AND THIS LITTLE 2-YEAR-OLD WHO WAS OUR YOUNGEST WAS, UH, MIXING PAINT WITH JAMES. AND THERE IS CHRISTA WICK'S THIRD GRADERS. THAT WAS THE GROUP SHOT. THOSE, THESE, THESE KIDS ARE AMAZING, BY THE WAY. THEY'RE SO WELL EDUCATED AND SO POLITE. AND IT WAS A, IT WAS A JOY TO WORK WITH EVERY ONE OF THEM. THEY, THEY'RE JUST AMAZING KIDS HERE IN SEDONA. IT WAS VERY IMPRESSED. IT WAS A VERY, VERY GOOD, UM, PRODUCTIVE DAY THAT THEY WERE THERE. LOT OF FUN. AND THEN THIS JUST SHOWS ALL THE AGES. SO THE YOUNGEST WAS, UH, LITTLE, UM, SAMMY, WHO IS, UH, TWO YEARS OLD. AND THEN NEXT IS PENN, LAUREN'S DAUGHTER, WHO'S THREE. AND MY DAUGHTER, I THREW HER IN. UM, SHE'S 18. AND THEN IT WENT UP FROM THERE. MARYANNE UNREEL ON THE RIGHT IS PART OF THE WATERCOLOR SOCIETY, AND WE HAD MANY ARTISTS COME IN AND PARTAKE AND PARTICIPATE AND, UM, REALLY ENJOY IT OF ALL AGES. ALSO, LOCALS, WE HAD, SO JUST SO YOU KNOW, METRIC WISE, WE HAD OVER A HUNDRED PEOPLE IN THE LAST FIVE DAYS IN AND OUT, AND MANY RETURN VISITORS. SO IT JUST CONFIRMED THAT IT'S, IT DOES BRING COMMUNITY TOGETHER AND PEOPLE REALLY ENJOYED IT. AND IT WAS HARD. IT GOT SO BUSY THAT WE HAD TO START A KIND OF SAFE, LIKE WE HAD A LITTLE SIGN THAT I HAD TO RUN OUT DOWN HERE AND MAKE OUT 15 MINUTES AT A TIME BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE LOVED IT. PEOPLE LOVED IT THAT MUCH. SO WE HAD LOCALS, WE HAD FAMILIES, WE HAD HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS. I HAD PASSED IT TO THE ART TEACHER THERE AND TOURISTS. THE COUPLE ON THE BOTTOM LEFT IS FROM CLEARWATER, FLORIDA. IT WAS A RAINY DAY IN THEIR HOTEL. AND THEY CAME, AND THEY'RE NOT PAINTERS, BUT THEY PICKED UP A PAINTBRUSH. AND THEN THIS JUST SHOWS JUST ALL THE DIFFERENT GROUPS THAT WERE THERE. UM, AND THAT REALLY ENJOYED IT. AND THE BOTTOM RIGHT IS JUST THE, THE, THE THIRD GRADERS THAT WERE SPREAD OUT WORKING ON THE MAT AND AT THE BOARD. JUST SOME MORE PICTURES OF EVERYBODY. OH, I JUST HAVE TO TELL THIS, THIS IS WORTH SHARING. SO THE GROUP ON THE TOP LEFT ARE PROFESSIONAL THEATER TROOP, BUT THEY ALL LIVE ALL OVER THE COUNTRY, AND THEY TRAVEL TOGETHER EVERY YEAR. AND THEY HAPPENED TO COME TO SEDONA FOR THIS TRIP. JAMES WAS ON THE FLIGHT WITH ONE OF THE WOMEN, TOLD THEM ABOUT THIS. THEY ALL COME IN, IT WAS POURING RAIN OUT, AND THEY WERE LIKE SINGING. AND IT WAS THE HIGHLIGHT OF THIS EVENT. WAS IT VERY IMPRESS. THEY WERE SINGING, THEY WERE DANCING, THEY WERE PAINTING. IF YOU LOOK AT THE BOTTOM LEFT, THAT WOMAN HAS HER ARM UP. SHE'S SINGING AND PAINTING. I VIDEOTAPED IT IF ANYONE'S INTERESTED. AND, UM, IT WAS JUST REALLY FUN. AND THEN IT TURNS OUT THE GIRL NEXT TO ME ON THE RIGHT, UH, WE GRADUATED THE SAME COLLEGE THE SAME YEAR, AND WE KNOW ALL THE SAME PEOPLE. SO, UH, IT WAS A REALLY FUN DAY. AND THERE'S DAVID, UH, YOU KNOW, CAPTURING FOR THE PAPER. NATE POPPED IN AND THIS IS WHAT IT LOOKED LIKE YESTERDAY. SO COLOR IS STARTING TO APPEAR. HE'S GOING TO RE-PUT THE HORSE IN, UM, AND FINE TUNE. YEAH, THE WHOLE BOTTOM HALF THERE IS, IS WHAT THE COMMUNITY HAS PAINTED, UM, WITH THE CACTUS AND WHATNOT. IT'S, IT'S EVOLVED. SO IT'S BEEN FUN TO WATCH IT EVOLVE. I WISH I HAD A TIME LAPSE OF IT. 'CAUSE ALL THE, FROM THE TWO YEAR OLDS TO, TO THE ELDERLY, IT WAS, THEY'VE ALL, YOU KNOW, PUT THEIR SOUL INTO THAT PIECE THERE. SO, UM, I'M EXCITED TO GET BACK IN THERE AND, AND REWORK SOME OF IT AND, AND FINISH IT OFF. BUT, UH, IT'S BEEN A GREAT COMMUNITY EVENT AND IT'S BEEN WONDERFUL. AND THEN THIS IS JAMES TONIGHT, . THANK YOU. THANK YOU. JAMES. I JUST WANT YOU TO KNOW THAT I LIVED IN ALASKA FOR ANCHORAGE AND JUAH FOR 10 YEARS IN THE EIGHTIES, AND I KNOW CARLA ALSO LIVED THERE, SO, AND MY HUSBAND ALSO SEDONA IN ALASKA, THAT'S FOR SURE. OKAY. ITEM FOUR [4. APPOINTMENTS ] APPOINTMENTS. I SEE WE HAVE A CARD FROM TIM PERRY. WE NORMALLY DON'T TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT ON APPOINTMENTS, BUT TIM, WHY DON'T YOU GO UP AND SAY WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY. GOOD EVENING, COUNSELORS. MY NAME IS TIM PERRY. I LIVE IN SEDONA WITH THIS MAYORAL APPOINTMENT ON THE TABLE TONIGHT. I THOUGHT A LITTLE HISTORY LESSON FOR THE COUNCIL MIGHT BE FUN. AND SO I THINK WE'RE GONNA START OFF WITH A SHORT JUMP TO BEGIN WITH. BACK TO THE 1950S [00:15:01] WHEN THE SCIENCE FICTION NOVELIST H BEAM PIPER BROUGHT OUT THE NOVEL LONE STAR PLANET, WHICH I'M ASSUMING THE COUNCIL HAS NOT READ. IT'S A FASCINATING BOOK THOUGH, BECAUSE IT'S SET ON A PLANET CALLED NEW TEXAS, SETTLED OF COURSE BY IMMIGRANTS FROM THE ORIGINAL TEXAS. AND THEY HAVE ENOUGH EXPERIENCE WITH GOVERNMENT OVERREACH THAT THEY BUILT A VERY INTERESTING FEATURE INTO THEIR NEW CONSTITUTION. A PROVISION THAT THE PRACTICE OF POLITICS BY ANY INDIVIDUAL IS AN AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSE AGAINST A CHARGE OF MURDER SHOULD THAT INDIVIDUAL BE KILLED. THE PRACTICE OF POLITICS IN EFFECT, BECAME A CRIME. NOW, IT'S INTERESTING THAT PIPER OF ALL PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE COME UP WITH THIS BECAUSE HE HAD A VERY TOIN BS TAKE ON HISTORY. BUT WHAT HE DID WAS STUMBLE ACROSS, UH, AND ACTUALLY A VERY IMPORTANT PART OF, UH, HUMAN'S HISTORICAL REALITY, BEGINNING WITH THE EMERGENCE OF BEHAVIORALLY MODERN HUMANS ABOUT 50,000 YEARS AGO. AND CONTINUING ON TO THE EMERGENCE OF COERCIVE STATES, ABOUT 5,000 YEARS AGO, EVERY HUMAN WHO LIVED EXISTED IN A SOCIETY. THAT WOULD'VE BEEN WHAT WE WOULD DESCRIBE AS FIERCELY EGALITARIAN IN WHICH DECISIONS WERE MADE BY UNANIMOUS CONSENT, AND IN WHICH THERE WAS ONLY ONE KIND OF CRIME. THIS CRIME WAS ATTEMPTING TO EXERCISE AUTHORITY OVER ANYONE ELSE. IF YOU LIVED IN SUCH A SOCIETY AND YOU TRIED TO TELL SOMEONE ELSE WHAT TO DO, YOU WERE KILLED BY YOUR FAMILY OR YOUR NEIGHBORS, NOT AS A DETERRENT, NOT AS A PUNISHMENT, BUT BECAUSE YOU HAD THREATENED THE COMMUNITY BY TRYING TO CONTROL OTHERS, AND YOU HAD TO BE REMOVED. YES, COUNSELORS, LET THAT SINK IN FOR A MINUTE. YOU REPRESENT HUMANITY'S ORIGINAL DEFINITION OF EVIL. YOU ARE THE ORIGINAL SIN, NOT A SERPENT IN A TREE. YOU, AND THIS ACT THAT THE COUNCIL IS ABOUT TO GO THROUGH IN A FEW MINUTES HERE TO APPOINT A NEW MAYOR IS WELL, IT'S JUST THE PUREST AND MOST REFINED FORM OF THAT FORM OF EVIL. THERE IS NOT, THERE WILL NEVER BE, AND THERE CAN NEVER BE ANY SUCH THING AS LEGITIMATE AUTHORITY. THAT WOULD BE ILLOGICAL. THANK YOU. UH, OKAY. AB 32, I'M GONNA HAVE TO WEAR MY GLASSES. 32 82 DISCUSSION, POSSIBLE ACTION FOR APPOINTMENT OF AN INTERIM MAYOR AND POSSIBLE APPOINTMENT OF A VICE MAYOR FROM AMONG CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS, MY MAJORITY VOTE. AND DISCUSSION REGARDING THE PROCESS FOR FILLING THE VACANCY ON COUNCIL. KURT, DO YOU WANNA GO THROUGH THE PROCESS, PLEASE? YES. UH, MADAM MAYOR, I'D LIKE TO START WITH THAT, IF THAT'S OKAY WITH COUNCIL. UH, SO THE PROCESS FOR FULFILLING A THE SUCCESSION OF THE MAYOR IS OUTLINED IN, UH, COUNCIL RULES OF PROCEDURE RULE FOUR C. UM, IT'S NOT REALLY CONTROVERSIAL. UM, IT'S GENERALLY, UM, THERE'S TWO WAYS THAT CITIES GO ABOUT DOING THAT. THEY EITHER AUTOMATICALLY HAVE THE MAYOR OR THE VICE MAYOR BECOME THE MAYOR, UH, TO FILL THE POSITION, OR THEY HAVE THE MAYOR, THE VICE MAYOR, UM, BECOME AN, UM, AN ACTING MAYOR UNTIL AN APPOINT AN INTERIM MAYOR CAN BE APPOINTED. OUR RULES FOLLOW THE LATTER PROCEDURES. SO IT SAYS, UPON THE RESIGNATION OF THE MAYOR, THE VICE MAYOR SHALL ASSUME THE DUTIES OF THE MAYOR. UNTIL AN INTERIM MAYOR IS APPOINTED BY CITY COUNCIL, THE COUNCIL WILL FILL ANY SUCH VACANCY BY SELECTING THE INTERIM MAYOR FROM AMONG THE MEMBERS. BY MAJORITY VOTE, THE PERSON SELECTED WILL SERVE UNTIL THE NEXT GENERAL ELECTION. UH, SO THAT'S THE PROCEDURE. THERE'S, IT DOES NOT OUTLINE A MORE DETAILED PROCEDURE FOR THIS ONE. IN THE PAST, WE'VE HAD, UM, EVERY, EVERY ELECTION WE APPOINT A VICE MAYOR. UM, AND SO COUNCIL HAS DONE MORE DETAILED, UH, DIRECTIONS ON HOW THAT IS TO, TO GO. AND SO, IN THE ABSENCE OF MORE DETAILED PROCEDURES, UM, IT'S LEFT UP TO THE CHAIR. UH, IN THIS CASE, UH, ACTING MAYOR PLU, UM, CAN, CAN STATE HOW SHE'D LIKE TO, TO, TO RUN THE MEETING. AND THEN OF COURSE, UH, AS A, AS A PROCEDURAL CHAIR, UM, ANY, ANY PROCEDURAL, UH, DECISIONS MADE BY ACTING MAYOR PLU CAN BE CALLED INTO QUESTION BY THE REST OF COUNCIL. AND A MAJORITY VOTE CAN OVERRULE THOSE PROCEDURES IF WANTED. SO THAT'S HOW THIS WILL TAKE PLACE. UM, AND THEN I THINK ONCE THIS IS DONE, WE CAN THEN DISCUSS, UM, THE APPOINTMENT OF A, THE VACANT COUNSELOR SEAT SEPARATELY. OKAY. SO WHAT I WAS THINKING IS THAT WE WOULD ASK WHO IS INTERESTED IN THE POSITION, AND THEN THAT WHOEVER RAISES THEIR HAND WOULD THEN HAVE A FEW MINUTES TO TALK ABOUT WHY THEY SHOULD BE CONSIDERED TO BE APPOINTED TO THE INTERIM MAYORS THAT WORK FOR EVERYBODY. MM-HMM . OKAY. SO [00:20:01] WHO, WHO IS INTERESTED? DON'T FACE MY . SO NOT, NOT KNOWING WHETHER THERE WAS GOING BE ANY COMPETITION. I, I HAD A FEW REMARKS I WANTED TO SAY AS TO WHY I SHOULD BE CONSIDERED. SO I'M GONNA GO AHEAD AND DO THAT, IF THAT'S ALL RIGHT WITH YOU ALL. UH, IN LIGHT OF RECENT EVENTS AND THE RESIGNATION OF THE FORMER MAYOR, I'M SEEKING YOUR SUPPORT FOR THE APPOINTMENT. AS THE INTERIM MAYOR, THIS IS NOT AN EASY TIME FOR OUR CITY OR FOR OUR COUNCIL. PUBLIC TRUST HAS BEEN BROKEN AND THE COMMUNITY DESERVES LEADERSHIP THAT IS STEADY, TRANSPARENT, AND FOCUSED ON RESTORING ACCOUNTABILITY. IN TIMES OF CRISIS, LEADERSHIP MUST BE CLEAR, CALM, AND ACCOUNTABLE. OUR RESIDENTS DESERVE STABILITY, AND OUR CITY NEEDS TO RESTORE TRUST AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE. THAT'S WHY I AM RESPECTFULLY ASKING FOR YOUR SUPPORT. YOU ALL KNOW ME. I'VE BEEN ON THIS COUNSELOR FOR FIVE YEARS. YOU ALL KNOW ME. I THINK I'VE SERVED WITH HONESTY AND INTEGRITY. I HAVE WORKED WITH YOU ACROSS OUR DIFFERENCES. EVEN THOUGH EVERYBODY SAYS WE'RE ALWAYS UNANIMOUS, WE ARE NOT. I'VE ALWAYS SOUGHT TO FIND COMMON GROUND. AND IF APPOINTED TO THIS ROLE, I INTEND TO BRING THAT SAME APPROACH, COLLABORATIVE, TRANSPARENT, AND GROUNDED IN SERVICE FOR THE RESIDENTS WHO ELECTED US TO REPRESENT THEM. IF I'M GIVEN THIS RESPONSIBILITY, I WILL WORK CLOSELY WITH MY COLLEAGUES TO IMPLEMENT SAFEGUARDS, STRENGTHEN OVERSIGHT, INCREASE PUBLIC ACCESS TO INFORMATION, IMPROVE COMMUNICATIONS, AND ENSURE WE NEVER REPEAT THE MISTAKES THAT LED US HERE TO THIS PLACE. IT WILL NOT BE BUSINESS AS USUAL. SO LET US TURN THIS MOMENT OF CRISIS INTO A TIPPING POINT, SHOWING OUR RESIDENTS THAT WHEN LEADERSHIP FAILS, ACCOUNTABILITY RISES. THAT WHEN TRUST IS BROKEN, WE EARN IT BACK. AND I WANNA SAY TO THE PUBLIC, HEALING IS NOT SOMETHING THAT HAPPENS STRICTLY ON THIS DAIS. WE NEED YOU, OUR RESIDENTS, BUSINESS AND COMMUNITY LEADERS TO TAKE PART IN SHAPING WHAT COMES NEXT WITH A RENEWED PURPOSE AND PARTNERSHIP. SO I AM READY. I KNOW YOU'RE ALL READY. I KNOW YOU'RE ALL READY, SO LET'S GET TO WORK. AND NOW I'M READY FOR A MOTION. BRIAN. THANK YOU ACTING MAYOR. IT IS MY HONOR TO MOVE TO APPOINT ACTING MAYOR HOLLY PLU TO SERVE AS INTERIM MAYOR FOR THE REMAINDER OF THE TERM VACATED BY SCOTT JALO UNTIL A NEW MAYOR IS ELECTED AND SEATED. I'D LIKE TO SECOND THAT. IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION? ABSOLUTELY. THANK MAYOR . UH, I WANTED TO JUST REFLECT ON SOME OF THE WORDS THAT KURT SAID AT THE START. GENERALLY TWO MODELS FOR DOING THIS KIND OF THING. UH, JUST THE, THE GENERAL PROMOTION OF THE VICE MAYOR TO MAYOR OR THE ELECTION AS WE'VE DONE, UH, OR AS WE'RE HEADED TO TODAY. UH, AND I DO SUPPORT THE PROCESS THAT WE'VE GOT IN OUR RULES, VICE MAYOR, I THINK, UH, RATHER THAN JUST A COORDINATION, HAVING US CONTEMPLATE IT, AND YOU'VE EARNED IT. I APPRECIATE THE WORK THAT YOU'VE DONE WITH US IN THE PAST. UM, THE WORDS THAT YOU SPOKE HERE TONIGHT, UM, WE'RE VERY GOOD, UH, VERY HONEST, VERY EARNEST, AND, UM, SO IT'S DEFINITELY WORTHY OF SUPPORT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, PETE. KATHY? YEAH. I'M GOING TO SUPPORT THIS MOTION , THAT I SECONDED, UM, WITH JUST SUCH GREAT PRIDE, UM, IN THE WORK THAT YOU HAVE DONE AS, UH, ON THIS COUNCIL AND AS OUR VICE MAYOR. AND YOU HAVE SHOULDERED A BURDEN THAT I DON'T THINK, UM, PEOPLE CAN REALLY RELATE TO OR UNDERSTAND, UH, THROUGH THIS WHOLE CRISIS OF LEADERSHIP THAT WE HAVE HAD. SO I WANNA THANK YOU. I RECOGNIZE IT. I WANNA THANK YOU. I WANNA SAY [00:25:01] THAT IT'S AN HONOR TO WORK ALONGSIDE YOU, AND AGAIN, I LOOK FORWARD VERY MUCH FORWARD TO THE VOTE ON THIS. THANK YOU. I'M IN MY HONEYMOON PERIOD WON'T LAST LONG. . AND THEN DON'T CROSS ME . THANK YOU. UM, I THINK JUST ECHOING MY COLLEAGUES, I WANT TO RECOGNIZE SPECIFICALLY HOW MUCH I'VE APPRECIATED WORKING WITH YOU, HOLLY, UM, AS WE'VE BEEN OUT IN THE COMMUNITY TRYING TO FIND COMMON GROUND ON SOME PRETTY DIFFICULT ISSUES. AND I LOOK FORWARD TO CONTINUING TO DO THAT WITH YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. I'M JUST GONNA JUMP IN AND SAY, YOU SAID THE WORDS I THINK ARE CRITICALLY IMPORTANT TO ME. WE, WE'VE ALWAYS BEEN A GROUP THAT OUGHT TO BE ACCOUNTABLE TO THE COMMUNITY BECAUSE WE REPRESENT YOU, YOU'VE ELECTED US TO REPRESENT YOU. I FEEL SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINE, I, SOMETHING WENT AWRY. AND I AM LOOKING FORWARD TO GOING BACK TO A PERIOD OF TIME WHERE WE AREN'T AFRAID TO LET THE COMMUNITY KNOW WHAT'S BEEN GOING ON THROUGH TRANSPARENCY. AND I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO THE FACT THAT WE HAVE HELD A FELLOW MEMBER ACCOUNTABLE AND THAT HAVING DONE THAT ONCE WE'RE GONNA GO FORWARD IN THE SAME WAY. SO I APPRECIATE THE WORDS THAT YOU SAID. THANK YOU. READY FOR A VOTE? OKAY. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? OKAY. WELL, THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT, WELL, THERE'S ONE MORE PIECE. GOT ONE OF THE MICS? YEAH. OKAY. YOU CAN RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND AND THEN REPEAT AFTER ME AND I'LL LET YOU READ THAT. OKAY. AND THEN, UM, I'LL STOP AND YOU CAN STATE YOUR NAME. OKAY. I, HOLLY PLU DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR OR AFFIRM THAT I WILL SUPPORT THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES AND THE CONSTITUTION AND LAWS OF THE STATE OF ARIZONA, THAT I WILL BEAR TRUE FAITH AND ALLEGIANCE TO THE SAME. YOU CAN REPEAT WHAT I SAID. DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR. YOU JUST, OH, OKAY. LET'S START OVER. LET'S START OVER. , I, HOLLY PLU DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR THAT I WILL SUPPORT THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES AND THE CONSTITUTION AND LAWS OF THE STATE OF ARIZONA. THAT I WILL BEAR TRUE FAITH AND ALLEGIANCE TO THE SAME AND DEFEND THEM AGAINST ALL ENEMIES FOREIGN AND DOMESTIC. AND I WILL FAITHFULLY AND IMPARTIALLY DISCHARGE THE DUTIES OF THE OFFICE OF MAYOR ACCORDING TO THE BEST OF MY ABILITY. SO HELP ME, GOD. GOOD JOB. ALRIGHT, THANK YOU. OKAY. ITEM FIVE. NOPE. WE NEED A VICE MAYOR. OH, YES, OF COURSE. . YEAH. I WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION FOR A VICE MAYOR. I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION. OKAY. SO EVERYONE HAS GREAT CONFIDENCE IN YOU AND YOUR LEADERSHIP, BUT EVERYBODY NEEDS A RIGHT HAND. AND WE NEED SOMEBODY, I THINK, WHO HAS REALLY STEPPED UP AND EXHIBITED TRUE LEADERSHIP ON THIS DAIS. UH, SOMEBODY WHO'S WORKED WITH SO MANY DIFFERENT FACETS OF THE COMMUNITY, I THINK IS READY TO HELP YOU AS THIS SHIP GETS RIGHTED. I WOULD LIKE TO MOVE THAT WE APPOINT BRIAN FOLTZ, COUNCILLOR, BRIAN FOLTZ AS OUR VICE MAYOR. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND? IT'S A RACE. A CHORUS. A CHORUS OF SECONDS. I THINK PETE WAS THE FIRST ONE. ALL RIGHT. BRIAN, WOULD YOU LIKE TO SAY SOMETHING? I DIDN'T THINK THAT WAS PART OF THE, UH, PROCESS. SO, UM, I'M GRATEFUL FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO SERVE AND, UH, WE'LL CERTAINLY LOOK TO DO SO. AND YOU KNOW, EVERYTHING THAT YOU TALKED ABOUT, UH, MAYOR, UH, AS FAR AS WHERE WE NEED TO GO FROM HERE, A HUNDRED PERCENT SUPPORT THAT. SO LOOK FORWARD TO, UH, HELPING YOU IN ANY WHICH WAY I CAN AND CONTINUING TO WORK WITH MY COLLEAGUES UP HERE. SO, THANK YOU. ARE [00:30:01] THERE ANY OTHER NOMINATIONS? ARE THERE ANY OTHER NOMINATIONS? ALRIGHT. NOMINATIONS ARE CLOSED. CALL FOR A VOTE. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? OKAY. IT'S UNANIMOUS. CONGRATULATIONS TO VICE MAYOR. FOLKS. ANY PHOTOS? PHOTO OP, , VICE. HE DOESN'T NEED A SWEARING, RIGHT? NO. 'CAUSE HE'S COUNCIL, CAN WE JUST GET YOU TOGETHER IN ONE PHOTO? SURE. IN FRONT AND BACK. WHERE WOULD YOU LIKE US? HOW ABOUT EACH IN THE MIDDLE? YOU'RE GONNA MOVE IN. OH, YOU WANT ALL OF THIS ON? MOVE YOUR SEAT. YOU CAN'T, YOU CAN'T HIDE OUT IN THE CORNER. JUST PUSH A CHAIR A LITTLE BIT. 1, 2, 3. 1, 2, 3. I'LL MOVE. OH, BRIAN, WHAT? MOVE BRIAN. JUST WHO GETS HIS, CAN WE TALK ABOUT NEXT? OH, NEXT. WE'RE GOING TO BUSINESS. WE'RE GONNA HAVE MAYOR APPOINTMENT. NO. PROCESS. ONE, ONE MORE. ITEM UNDER FOUR. UNDER FOUR. FILL THE VACANCY ON COUNCIL. OH, YOU WANTED TO TALK ABOUT THE PROCESS FOR FILLING THE COUNCIL VACANCY? THANK YOU. YES. YEAH, SO THAT'S, UH, THAT PROCESS WAS RE OR I GUESS, WELL, THREE YEARS AGO, UPDATED BY CITY COUNCIL. UH, AND IN THAT ANYTIME THERE IS A RESIGNATION OR OR DEATH OF A CITY COUNSELOR, THE CITY CLERK AUTOMATICALLY ADVERTISES THE VACANCY FOR AT LEAST THREE WEEKS. UM, THE CITY CLERK DID. SO, UM, THE THREE WEEKS WILL ACTUALLY BE UP, UM, NEXT WEEK, I BELIEVE, BUT WE'RE, IT'S GONNA BE ALMOST FOUR WEEKS. SHE'S LEFT IT OPEN UNTIL OCTOBER 27TH. SO, STAFF'S IDEA WOULD TO BRING IT BACK TO COUNCIL ON THE 28TH TO FINISH THE REST OF THE RULES. THE RULES STATE THAT AFTER THE APPLICATION PERIODS CLOSED, CITY COUNCIL SHALL MEET TO DETERMINE WHICH APPLICANTS WILL BE INTERVIEWED FIRST. SO, UH, WE WOULD PROPOSE PUTTING THAT ON THE 28TH. AND THAT WHICH ONES TO INTERVIEW IS SIMPLY A MAJORITY VOTE. SO YOU'LL HAVE YOUR LIST OF APPLICANTS, YOU KNOW, FOUR OR FIVE, HOPEFULLY YOU KNOW MORE. UM, AND IF ANY APPLICANT GETS A MAJORITY VOTE, THEN THEY ADVANCE TO AN, AN INTERVIEW STAGE, UM, TO BE SELECTED. I THINK FROM ON THE 28TH, EVERYONE SHOULD, SHOULD HAVE A BETTER IDEA OF THEIR SCHEDULE AND WHAT'S GOING ON. SO WE CAN PICK A DATE SOMETIME IN NOVEMBER TO INTERVIEW THE APPLICANTS. UM, AND THEN, AND SO THAT'S DONE IN OPEN SESSION. THE PICKING THE APPLICANTS, UH, OR THE PICKING THE APPLICANTS TO BE INTERVIEWS. THE INTERVIEWS ARE ALSO DONE, DONE IN OPEN SESSION, UH, PER THE RULES. AND A, UM, ALTHOUGH YOU CAN GO INTO EXECUTIVE SESSION TO THEN DISCUSS AND DELIBERATE AFTER THE OPEN SESSION INTERVIEWS. UM, AND SO ANY COUNCIL, ANY, IF THERE'S A TIE VOTE, UH, THEN THEY DON'T ADVANCE. THEY HAVE TO HAVE A MAJORITY VOTE. SO FOUR, FOUR COUNSELORS WILL NEED TO APPROVE ANYONE TO BE INTERVIEWED, AND IT'LL TAKE FOUR COUNSELORS TO THEN AT THE SUBSEQUENT MEETING APPOINT ANYONE TO CITY COUNCIL TO FILL THE REMAINDER OF THE VACANCY CAUSED BY SCOTT CHAPEL'S RESIGNATION. SO I, I RECALL BEING ON COUNCIL WHEN, UH, COUNCILOR CHISHOLM RESIGNED AND WE VOTED A REPLACEMENT. AND I'M TRYING TO RECALL WHETHER WE HAD CRITERIA THAT WE RANKED PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, SO THAT WHEN WE CAME TO THE MEETING, WE HAD, WE WERE ALL USING THE SAME STANDARD FOR HOW WE VIEWED THE APPLICATIONS. I DON'T RECALL US HAVING ANY CRITERIA LIKE THAT. I BELIEVE IT WAS JUST A, FOR THE FIRST ROUND, IT WAS JUST A MAJORITY VOTE GOT MOVED TO THE INTERVIEW. UH, WE DO HAVE THE QUESTIONS THAT WERE ASKED OF THE CANDIDATES THEN TO HELP, UH, COUNCIL MAKE A DETERMINATION OF THOSE WHO ARE INTERVIEWED. BUT I DON'T RECALL ANY CRITERIA IN THAT FIRST ROUND. OKAY. I PARTICIPATED IN THAT PROCESS AS WELL. AND I DON'T RECALL CRITERIA. I DO RECALL THAT WE MET BOLTY AND THAT WE WERE USING A MAJORITY, UH, TO ADVANCE. SO MY MEMORY CONCURS. AND, AND SO I, AND WHAT WE'LL DO ON THE 28TH IS ALSO BRING, UH, FORWARD THE QUESTIONS, UM, FOR THE, IN, FOR THE INTERVIEW SO THAT WE CAN MAKE SURE YOU'RE STILL GOOD WITH THOSE. OR IF YOU WANNA ADD OR SUBTRACT ANY QUESTIONS AS WELL THAT CAN BE DISCUSSED. UM, QUESTION FOR YEAH. UH, AS, GIMME A SECOND. MM-HMM . WE, WE MADE THE DECISION, WE CAN REVIEW AND REVISE ANY OF THIS, BUT WE MADE THE DECISION AT THAT TIME NOT TO RELEASE THE QUESTIONS IN ADVANCE. [00:35:02] SO WE ASKED THEM OF THE, AS WE INTERVIEWED EACH OF THE, OF THE, UH, CANDIDATES, BUT WE DIDN'T, I DON'T BELIEVE THAT WE GAVE OUT THE QUESTIONS TO EVERYBODY. DID WE? WE DID NOT. BUT THEY'RE ALL PUBLICLY RECORDED, SO UNLESS YOU'RE GONNA CHANGE UP ALL YOUR QUESTIONS, UM, THEY CAN GO BACK AND LOOK AT THOSE . I DON'T HAVE AN ISSUE ABOUT DOING IT. I JUST, YEAH. WANNA GET A SENSE FROM COUNCIL HOW THEY WANT, HOW YOU WANNA DO IT. I'M NOT SURE THAT IT, IT MATTERS ONLY, IT ONLY MATTERS IF YOU'RE THE VERY FIRST PERSON INTERVIEWED SINCE THESE ARE PUBLIC INTERVIEWS. THE FIRST PERSON IS AT THE DISADVANTAGE OF NEVER HAVING SEEN OR HEARD THE QUESTIONS BEFORE. EVERYONE SUBSEQUENT HAS SEEN AND HEARD WHAT EVERY OTHER PERSON HAS SAID. AN ANSWER WATCHED OUR FACES AS THEY ANSWER THEM. SO IT FEELS TO ME LIKE THE FIRST PERSON IS AT A DISADVANTAGE. AND SO PUBLISHING THE QUESTIONS ALMOST MAKES NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER. UM, THE PERSON AT MOST ADVANTAGE IS THE LAST PERSON TO, TO INTERVIEW. SO, UM, WHEN YOU HAVE A PUBLIC INTERVIEW, SO I DON'T THINK IT MATTERS. AND, AND LETTING PEOPLE HAVE THE TIME AND OPPORTUNITY TO THINK ABOUT HOW THEY WANNA RESPOND, HOW IS IT ANY DIFFERENT THAN US LOOKING AT THE PACKETS AND MAKING DECISIONS AROUND HOW WE'RE GOING TO RESPOND ABOUT AN IDEA THAT'S BEING PRESENTED INSIDE OF A PACKET? I THINK WE SHOULD DRAW NAMES OUT OF A HAT SO THAT WE DON'T GIVE ANYBODY AN ADVANTAGE OR DISADVANTAGE. A A PROCESS QUESTION RELATED TO YOUR THOUGHTS THERE. IF WE HAD, SO WE'RE GONNA SELECT THE FINALIST BEFORE AND THEN HAVE A DAY OF INTERVIEWS. WE COULD HAVE ALL THE CANDIDATES BE OUT OF THE ROOM AND JUST ONE AT A TIME COME IN. NOTHING THAT WOULD STOP THEM FROM GOING ON THE INTERNET AND WATCHING THEM. BUT, YOU KNOW, IT'S A, IT, IT'S A, UH, WHAT'S THE WORD I'M SEARCHING FOR? FAIRNESS. WELL, THERE'S A FAIRNESS. THERE'S A, UM, A, IT'S A TRUST ELEMENT, RIGHT? WE DO THINGS, WE HAVE TO BELIEVE WHAT WE SAY THAT WE'RE GONNA DO. SO THERE'S A HONESTY, THERE'S AN HONESTY ELEMENT THAT IF WE ASK PEOPLE NOT TO WATCH THE QUESTIONS, WE COULD DO THAT. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S WOULD BE PART OF OUR PROCESS OR NOT PART OF OUR PROCESS. YOU HAVE AN OPINION? I DO. MAYOR, THANK YOU. UH, I MEAN, IF WE WERE DOING THOSE INTERVIEWS IN HERE, THEY COULD SIT IN THE ROADRUNNER OR CONFERENCE ROOM AS A, FOR INSTANCE, RIGHT? OR WE CAN CERTAINLY MAKE THAT WORK IF WE'RE USING A DIFFERENT ROOM. BUT I, I THINK THAT'S A GREAT WAY TO CREATE A LEVEL PLAYING FIELD FOR ALL CANDIDATES. YEAH. ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANY COMMENTS? NOT ON THAT, BUT ON, ON, UH, LOOKING FOR CLARIFICATION. WHEN ALL OF THE APPLICANTS HAVE FILED AND THE PERIOD HAS CLOSED, AND WE ARE SELECTING WHO AND BY MAJORITY WHO'S GONNA MOVE FORWARD, THAT PROCESS IS A PUBLIC PROCESS AND NOT AN EXECUTIVE PROCESS. SO THAT, IN OTHER WORDS, I HAVE NAMES A, B, C, AND D, AND WE ONLY WANNA ADVANCE A AND C TO INTERVIEWS. IT'S PUBLIC THAT B AND D WE'RE NOT SELECTED. CORRECT. SO THE APPLICANTS, UH, WILL ALL BE, IF YOU FILE AN APPLICATION, IT'LL BE PUBLIC. UH, AND THE RULES STATE THAT IT'S TO BE AN OPEN SESSION, UH, WHERE COUNCIL VOTES AND A MAJORITY VOTE ADVANCES TO AN INTERVIEW. AND YOU DON'T GET A MAJORITY VOTE. YOU DON'T ADVANCE TO AN INTERVIEW. OKAY. AND THAT'S RULES OF PROCEDURE. WHAT RULE OF PROCEDURE? RULE TWO M. THANK YOU. AND IT'S THE ONE COUNCIL CAME UP WITH AFTER COUNSELOR, UH, CHISHOLM, UH, RESIGNED THREE OR FOUR YEARS AGO. OKAY. SO ARE WE ALL COMFORTABLE WITH THAT? YEAH. ALL RIGHT. SO, SO THAT'LL BE AGENDAS FOR OCTOBER 28TH. OCTOBER 28TH. WOULD YOU LIKE THE QUESTIONS? I DIDN'T HEAR CONSENSUS ON THE QUESTIONS. WOULD YOU LIKE TO DISCUSS THOSE IN EXECUTIVE SESSION? THAT'S AVAILABLE TOO? UM, OR WE CAN HAVE THE QUESTIONS DISCUSSED PUBLICLY. YOU KNOW, IF WE'RE, IF WE'RE CHANGING THE CULTURE TRANSPARENCY, LET'S BE TRANSPARENT. SO UNLESS THERE'S ANY OBJECTIONS, LET'S DO IT ALL IN PUBLIC. OKAY. I WILL, WE WILL INCLUDE THE OLD QUESTIONS IN THE PACKET THEN. OKAY. THANK YOU. ALRIGHT, SO NOW, UH, KURT, [ 5. SUMMARY OF CURRENT EVENTS BY MAYOR/COUNCILORS/CITY MANAGER & COUNCIL ASSIGNMENTS ] BRING THE MIC BACK. YOU WANTED TO GIVE US A SUMMARY OF THE, UH, EXECUTIVE SESSION? OH, UH, YES. SO AT THE CONCLUSION OF THE EXECUTIVE SESSION, CITY COUNCIL VOTED, UH, TO MAKE THE INDEPENDENT, UH, HARASS THE INVESTIGATION FROM THE HARASSMENT COMPLAINTS FROM THE MAYOR AND THE CHIEF PUBLIC, UH, TOMORROW MORNING. UM, [00:40:01] AND ALSO AUTHORIZE, UM, A STATEMENT MADE TO BE MADE ABOUT THE, UH, FINDINGS IN A INVESTIGATION THAT WAS DONE BASED ON A SOCIAL MEDIA POST ON SEPTEMBER 19TH. UM, AND THEN ADDITIONALLY, UM, CITY COUNCIL, I FORGET THE SECOND ITEM. THERE WAS A SECOND MOTION COUNCILOR KINSELLA? UH, YES, IT WAS, UH, TO PROCEED WITH, UM, OH, DISCUSSIONS WITH RICHARD SPEAR AS THE JUDGE MAGISTRATE APPLICANT. THAT'S CORRECT. SO, UM, MOVING FORWARD WITH, UH, A POTENTIAL, UM, CONTRACT WITH, UH, JUDGE SPEAR. OKAY. THANK YOU, KURT. JOANNE, ARE THERE ANY CARDS FOR THE PUBLIC FORUM? EXCUSE ME, MADAM MAYOR. UM, I HAVE A COMMUNITY, UM, ANNOUNCEMENT AS PART OF CURRENT EVENTS. IF I MAY GO. OH, YOU SURE MAY. THANK YOU. UM, SO AS ALL OF, YOU'RE PROBABLY AWARE, AND IF YOU'RE NOT, SHAME ON YOU. THE LIBRARY HAS ITS LARGEST FUNDRAISER COMING UP ON SATURDAY, NOVEMBER 15TH. UM, OBVIOUSLY THIS YEAR, 2025 OVER AT THE LIBRARY. THIS IS THE GET LOUD EVENT, WHICH WAS A HUGE SUCCESS LAST YEAR. UM, AND FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO MISS BEING A CHILD, THEY WILL REPEAT THE COTTON CANDY, UM, THAT THEY DID LAST YEAR. SO IT'S FROM TWO TO 4:00 PM THERE'S FREE FOOD, THERE'S FAMILY FRIENDLY ACTIVITIES FROM FOUR TO FIVE. THERE IS A LIVE AUCTION. THERE IS ALSO GOING TO BE AN ONLINE AUCTION. THERE'S SOME PRETTY, UM, AWESOME EXPERIENCES THAT ARE, UH, PART OF THAT AUCTION, INCLUDING, UM, TICKETS ON A PINK JEEP TOUR AND, UM, WHERE'S THERE'S MASSAGES IN YOUR HOME. THERE'S LIKE ALL KINDS OF REALLY COOL STUFF. SO HOPEFULLY YOU ALL TAKE A CHANCE AND GO OUT AND LOOK AT WHAT'S GOING ON ONLINE. AND PLEASE COME ON OUT TO THE LIBRARY, UM, ON THE 15TH AT TWO O'CLOCK. IT WAS A GREAT EVENT LAST YEAR. I HOPE EVERYBODY COMES. BRIAN. THANK YOU, MAYOR. UH, I ATTENDED THE NACO ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT COUNCIL MEETING A COUPLE WEEKS BACK, AND, UH, ONE OF THE SPEAKERS WAS KEON MONTGOMERY FROM THE ARIZONA DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING, WHO WAS HERE FOR THE RIBBON CUTTING FOR THE SHELBY PROJECT. AND HE PROVIDED QUITE AN EDUCATION FOR THE, UH, ATTENDEES THAT DAY, ABOUT EIGHT OH, UH, HOUSING INCENTIVES AND PROGRAMS AND SO FORTH. AND I'VE SHARED WITH THE CITY MANAGER THAT I THINK THAT IT WOULD BE VERY BENEFICIAL FOR THIS BODY TO INVITE MR. MONTGOMERY TO COME AND PRESENT TO US AND EDUCATE US, UH, NOT ONLY ON WHAT THE STATE HAS TO OFFER, BUT ALSO, UH, WHAT COMES DOWN THROUGH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AS WELL. SO HOPEFULLY MORE TO COME ON THAT. AND WE ALSO HAD A SPEAKER WHO, UM, TOLD ME THAT HE CAME UP AFTERWARDS AND, AND TOLD ME THAT, UH, UH, THAT THEY HAD DONE A BROWNFIELD ASSESSMENT IN SEDONA SOME YEARS BACK. IT PREDATES, UH, MY TIME ON COUNCIL, AND I DON'T KNOW, I'M, I'M LOOKING FOR SOME OF THE VETERANS BACK THERE, LIKE, ANDY, IF YOU KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT A BROWNFIELD ASSESSMENT THAT WAS DONE IN SOME OF THE MORE MIXED USE AREAS. UM, BUT, UH, THAT'S SOMETHING I WANNA FOLLOW UP ON BECAUSE, UH, IT WAS POINTED OUT THAT IF YOU'VE HAD A BROWNFIELD ASSESSMENT, UH, YOU CAN POTENTIALLY QUALIFY FOR SOME SIGNIFICANT FEDERAL FUNDING FOR REDEVELOPMENT PROJECTS. AND WHILE SEDONA WOULD NOT NECESSARILY BE A HOTBED FOR BROWNFIELD SITES, HE DID SAY THERE WERE SOME SITES IDENTIFIED. AND, UH, HE WENT ON TO EXPLAIN THAT IN FLAGSTAFF, A BROWNFIELD SITE, AND, AND HE PUT THIS UP AS LIKE, THIS IS LIKE THE PINNACLE OF HOW MUCH YOU COULD POTENTIALLY GET, BUT THEY GOT LIKE $150 MILLION TO BUILD OUT THEIR BIG BUS TERMINAL THAT THEY HAVE UP THERE. AND I THINK EVERYBODY DID A DOUBLE TAKE ON THAT ONE. SO, UH, I'D LIKE TO, YOU KNOW, DELVE INTO THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE AND SEE WHAT INFORMATION WE CAN FIND AND WHETHER THAT THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY HERE WITH ANY OF THE, THE WORK THAT WE MIGHT BE PLANNING. THANK YOU. ANYBODY ELSE? DEREK? UH, THIS SUNDAY, OCTOBER 19TH, THE SEDONA HUMANE SOCIETY IS HAVING THEIR FIFTH ANNUAL HALLOWEEN COSTUME PARADE. UH, PEOPLE DRESS UP THEIR DOGS AND ALL THAT. UM, ANYWAY, APPARENTLY I'M A JUDGE. UH, THAT IS SUNDAY, OCTOBER 19TH, 10:00 AM TO 12:00 PM AT AK. SO COME SEE THE DOGS. OKAY. THE, I WAS AT THE, UH, VERDE VALLEY OR THE YAVAPAI COUNTY TRANSPORTATION MASTER PLANNING. UH, AND SEDONA WAS, SEDONA WAS HIGHLIGHTED, AND, UH, AMBER [00:45:01] AND JOHN WERE THERE REPRESENTING US AND ANDY. AND IT WAS, UH, IT WAS VERY INTERESTING. THEY ALSO PRESENTED ALL THE PROJECTS THAT ARE HAPPENING ACROSS THE VERDE VALLEY IN OTHER COMMUNITIES. AND WE GOT A, I WOULD SAY, REALLY A, A, A WARM APPRECIATION FOR WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE WITH THE SIM PROJECTS IN OUR TRANSPORTATION AT TRANSIT IN PARTICULAR. UH, THE NAAG REPRESENTATIVE WAS THERE AND WE'RE, WE HAD PROPOSED ONE OF OUR PROJECTS, THE BREWER ROUNDABOUT FOR STATE FUNDING, AND IT WAS ON THE NAAG LIST, MADE THE LIST, BUT HE, HE SAW, HE SAID, WE REALLY HAVE TO LOBBY FOR IT OURSELVES, THAT JUST BECAUSE IT'S ON THEIR LIST DOESN'T MEAN THAT, THAT THEY WILL DO ANYTHING MORE THAN SUBMIT THEIR LIST BECAUSE THEY'RE, THEY'RE A 5 0 1 C3 AND THEY CAN'T LOBBY. THEY CAN ONLY EDUCATE. SO I'D LIKE TO ADD THAT TO THE LIST AND WE'LL HAVE OUR LOBBYISTS COME UP HERE BEFORE SESSION, BUT I'D LIKE TO ADD THAT TO THE LIST OF ITEMS THAT WE GIVE OUR LOBBYISTS, UH, TO, BECAUSE IT'S AN EXPENSIVE PROJECT AND WE NEED SUPPORT FROM THE STATE AND THE FEDS FOR ALL THESE PROJECTS THAT WE'RE PURSUING. SO IF YOU'RE AGREEABLE WITH THAT. OKAY. NOW ON [6. PUBLIC FORUM ] TO THE PUBLIC FORUM. OKAY. I HAVE A CARD. FIRST ONE IS SPRING GRAPH. INTERIM MAYOR, VICE MAYOR. I'M THRILLED TO BE ABLE TO ADDRESS YOU AS WELL AS ALL OF THE CITY MANAGERS AND STAFF IN THE AUDIENCE. MY NAME IS SPRING GRAFF AND I AM THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF VOLUNTEER SEDONA IN THE VERDE VALLEY. AND YOUR, AND YOUR CITY OF RESIDENCE. I AM IN THE VILLAGE OF OAK CREEK, TECHNICALLY SEDONA, NOT SEDONA PROPER. UM, AND I'M HERE TO TALK ABOUT, I'VE, I'VE SPOKEN WITH YOU BEFORE. WHEN WE LAUNCHED, WE LAUNCHED JANUARY OF THIS YEAR, 2025, AS A STANDALONE NONPROFIT. WE ARE A VOLUNTEER HUB FOR SEDONA. WE STARTED WITH 26 NONPROFITS IN JANUARY. I'M SO PROUD TO TELL YOU, WE'RE NOW AT 68 NONPROFITS THAT WE SUPPORT THEIR VOLUNTEER NEEDS. WE'VE GROWN RAPIDLY. I'M HERE SPECIFICALLY TO TALK ABOUT A COUPLE OF EVENTS WE HAVE COMING UP. ONE IS THE VERDE VALLEY VOLUNTEER FAIR. WE HELD A VOLUNTEER FAIR IN SEDONA THIS PAST MAY. WE'RE GOING TO DO SO IN COTTONWOOD AS WE EXPAND. WE HAVE 40 NON-PROFITS TABLING THIS SATURDAY, OCTOBER 18TH AT THE COTTONWOOD REC CENTER. IF ANYONE WOULD LIKE TO COME OUT, IT'S 1130 TO TWO. MORE IMPORTANT, PERHAPS TO THE CITY OF SEDONA IS A LARGE OAK CREEK COLLABORATIVE CLEANUP THAT'S HAVING ON SATURDAY, NOVEMBER THE EIGHTH. THOSE HOME BASE IS SLIDE ROCK, STATE PARK, KEEP SEDONA BEAUTIFUL, IS INVOLVED OAK CREEK WATERSHED COUNCIL AND 18 OTHER ORGANIZATIONS INCLUDING PINK JEEP TOURS, ENCHANTMENT RESORT OF THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY. UM, WE'VE GOT THE STATE PARKS AND NATIONAL FORESTS INVOLVED, AND ALSO A LOT OF VOLUNTEER ORGANIZATIONS. I HAVE A LOT OF FLYERS FOR THIS. I'LL LEAVE AT 'EM AT THE TABLE IF PEOPLE ARE INTERESTED. IT'S, UH, IT'S A BIG DEAL. THIS IS THE SECOND ANNUAL. UM, IT'S A FUN DAY TO COLLABORATE. AND IF YOU COME IN A TEAM, THEY HAVE PRIZES FOR THE MOST TRASH PICKED UP FOR PEOPLE THAT ARE LESS MOBILE. WE HAVE PLENTY OF OPPORTUNITIES TO PICK TRASH ON A PAVED, UH, SPACE. UM, WE ALSO HAVE OPPORTUNITIES FOR REGISTRATION. SO THESE, THESE TWO EVENTS ARE HAPPENING. AND THE THIRD THING I'D LIKE TO ADDRESS IS THE UPCOMING VOLUNTEER FESTIVAL, THE INAUGURAL SEDONA VOLUNTEER FESTIVAL TO BE HELD IN JANUARY OF 2026 SURROUNDING MARTIN LUTHER KING. THIS PAST YEAR WE HAD THE WEEKEND OF SERVICE. VERY HAPPY TO HAVE 149 VOLUNTEERS, AND WE HOPE TO MAKE IT BIG SINCE THE BETA TEST OF THE WEEKEND OF SERVICE WAS SO SUCCESSFUL. SO I'LL BE BRINGING MORE INFORMATION TO YOU ABOUT THAT. AND THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME. THANK YOU. THANK YOU SPRING. YOU'VE DONE A REMARKABLE JOB. APPRECIATE IT. UH, TIM PERRY. GOOD EVENING, COUNSELORS. MY NAME IS TIM PERRY, AND I LIVE IN SEDONA, I THINK IN TONIGHT'S INSTALLMENT OF THE LIES TOLD BY THE CITY OF SEDONA. WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT ONE THAT IS, UH, PARTICULARLY POPULAR WITH OUR NEW VICE MAYOR, UH, AND ALSO WITH REICHS VIEWER BROWN OF THE TOURISM DEPARTMENT. AND THAT'S THE LIE THAT COUNCIL [00:50:01] AND STAFF SOMEHOW HAVE THE JOB OF EDUCATING SEDONA. I WOULD LIKE EVERY, TO INVITE EVERYONE ON COUNCIL AND STAFF AND WATCHING THIS MEETING TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE CITY'S ORGANIZATIONAL CHART. CITY'S ORGANIZATIONAL CHART SHOWS VERY CLEARLY THAT THE DIRECTION OF PUBLIC DIRECTION FLOWS FROM THE PUBLIC THROUGH COUNCIL TO STAFF. THERE IS NO ARROW OR LOOP ON THAT ORGANIZATIONAL CHART INDICATING THAT FEEDBACK FLOWS BACK TO THE PUBLIC FROM COUNSELOR STAFF. IT'S NOWHERE IN THE WAY THIS IS SET UP TO WORK. AND INDEED, THAT WOULD POSE A PHILOSOPHICAL PROBLEM WITH THE NATURE OF A DEMOCRATIC ORGANIZATION, BECAUSE IN A DEMOCRATIC ORGANIZATION, IT'S THE PEOPLE WHO DECIDE, IF THE PEOPLE WEREN'T DECIDING, IF COUNCIL AND STAFF WERE SITTING UP HERE IN THEIR WISDOM INSTRUCTING THE PUBLIC, WELL, THAT WOULD BE WHAT IS CALLED MISLEADINGLY, SOVIET STYLE DEMOCRACY, IN WHICH THE VANGUARD PARTY LEADS THE POOR IGNORANT LUMP AND PROLETARIAT INTO THE BRIGHTER TOMORROW. BUT THAT TAKES US INTO THE QUESTION OF JUST WHY WOULD COUNCIL OR STAFF CONSIDER THEMSELVES QUALIFIED AS EDUCATORS TO EDUCATE SEDONA? LET, LET'S LOOK AT COUNCIL FOR A MINUTE. WE HAVE SOMEONE WHO USED TO WORK FOR ONE OF THE MOST EVIL COMPANIES IN THE WORLD. A GUY WHO, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, IS QUITE INTO WAGE SLAVERY. A NEW YORK LAWYER, ANOTHER NEW YORK LAWYER, A CALIFORNIA BUREAUCRAT, AND ANOTHER CITY LAWYER. WHAT EXACTLY DO YOU THINK YOU HAVE TO TEACH RURAL WESTERNERS? HOW TO PUT UP HUNDRED STORY BUILDINGS AND BLOCK THE SUN? HOW TO ASPHALT OVER FARMLAND. HOW TO HAVE GANGS OF HEAVILY ARMED THUGS IN UNIFORM, ROAMING THE STREETS, SHOOTING KIDS HOW TO SIT IN AN OFFICE UNDER A FLUORESCENT LIGHT ALL DAY, HUNCHED OVER A COMPUTER, DESTROYING YOUR BODY AND MIND. HOW TO BE LAZY, HOW TO BE IGNORANT, HOW TO DO NOTHING AND CALL IT A JOB. IS, IS, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE HERE TO TEACH US? ARE YOU HERE TO EDUCATE US ON OUR FAILURES? THERE IS NOT ONE MEMBER OF THIS COUNCIL WHO IS QUALIFIED TO SPRAY FOR GREENFLY IN A GREENHOUSE, LET ALONE RUN THE CITY OF SEDONA. LET'S END THIS NONSENSE ABOUT YOU EDUCATING US MAYOR OF PERSONAL PRIVILEGE. YES. GOOD. I JUST WANNA CLARIFY THAT I AM FROM NEW YORK. I AM NOT A LAWYER. I HAVE NEVER BEEN A LAWYER, AND I JUST WANTED TO MAKE THAT CLEAR. THANK YOU MAYOR. MR. PERRY, THANK YOU FOR, UH, BRINGING BACK MY FAMOUS QUOTE ABOUT EDUCATING THE PUBLIC ON A PROGRAM. IF THAT WORD OFFENDS, THEN I'M SO SORRY, BUT TO INFORM THE COMMUNITY ABOUT THE DETAILS OF A PROGRAM THAT WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE PEOPLE AWARE OF. I DON'T THINK THAT THERE IS ANYTHING OF SOVIET, WHATEVER YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT, THAT THAT'S APPLICABLE TO THE, THE REAL CHALLENGE IS, IS THAT IF WE WANT TO PROVIDE FREE ICE CREAM ON FRIDAYS AND FREE PUPPIES ON SATURDAYS, I WILL SAY AGAIN, THAT WILL BE AN EPIC CHALLENGE TO EDUCATE PEOPLE ON WHAT THAT PROGRAM IS. SO YOU SEEM TO BE SPLITTING HAIRS ABOUT WHAT IT MEANS TO TRY TO INFORM PEOPLE OF SOMETHING, NOT TO COERCE THEM, NOT TO MISINFORM THEM NOT TO DO ANYTHING ELSE. UNTOWARDS. UM, I SUGGEST YOU LET SOMEBODY ELSE LIVE, RENT FREE IN YOUR HEAD BESIDES THE SEDONA CITY COUNCIL AND THE STAFF. THANK YOU, MAYOR. THANK YOU. UH, JOE KLER. GOOD EVENING. UH, MY NAME IS JOE KLU. I'M, UH, I LIVE IN PEORIA, ARIZONA. I'M THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE ARIZONA POLICE ASSOCIATION. WE REPRESENT APPROXIMATELY 12,000 ACTIVE PUBLIC SAFETY PROFESSIONALS FROM 50, UH, APPROXIMATELY 50 FEDERAL, STATE, COUNTY AND MUNICIPAL AGENCIES, MOSTLY POLICE OFFICERS, BUT WE ALSO REPRESENT CORRECTIONS, DETENTION, PROBATION, PAROLE OFFICERS, AS WELL AS THE ARIZONA CONSTABLES. SO WHY AM I HERE? OVER THE PAST SEVERAL WEEKS, I'VE BEEN CONTACTED BY SEVERAL CURRENT AND, AND FORMER SEDONA POLICE OFFICERS REGARDING CONCERNS. I DID NOT REACH OUT TO THEM. THEY CONTACTED ME, THEY ASKED ME TO BE HERE. MY PURPOSE IS TO GIVE THEM A VOICE AND MAKE YOU AWARE OF THEIR CONCERNS. [00:55:01] IT IS NO SECRET THAT THERE IS SERIOUS ISSUES WITHIN THE SEDONA POLICE DEPARTMENT AND ITS LEADERSHIP. ALL ONE HAS TO DO IS GOOGLE SEARCH IT AND THE PROBLEM WILL BE EVIDENT. WHAT THESE OFFICERS CONVEYED TO ME IS THAT THERE IS AN ENVIRONMENT IN THE SEDONA POLICE DEPARTMENT OF SUBJUGATION, RETALIATION AND FEAR. AS WITH ANY ORGANIZATION, CULTURE AND PHILOSOPHIES ARE LARGELY SET BY ITS LEADERSHIP. IN THIS CASE, THE CHIEF OF POLICE, THE OFFICERS I SPOKE WITH, ARE AFRAID, VERY AFRAID OF BEING EXPOSED AND SUFFERING, THE WRATH AND RETALIATION OF THE CHIEF, UH, FOR HAVING IF, FOR, FOR SPEAKING WITH ME. THEREFORE, I'M UNABLE TO PROVIDE SPECIFICS AS TO, UH, THEIR ISSUES AND CONCERNS AS IT WOULD BE RATHER SIMPLE, UH, GIVEN THE SMALL NATURE OF YOUR POLICE DEPARTMENT TO DISCERN THEIR IDENTITY. HOWEVER, I WILL PROVIDE YOU WITH SOME OF THE ABJECT, UH, ADJECTIVES THEY USE TO DESCRIBE THE POLICE CHIEF'S LEADERSHIP STYLE. IN THEIR OPINION, VENGEFUL, TYRANNICAL, OVERBEARING, DISMISSIVE, PUNITIVE, HYPER CONTROLLING, CLOSE-MINDED MICROMANAGER AND RETALIATORY. THESE OFFICERS ALSO EXPRESSED CONCERN, UH, WITH THE CITY MANAGER AND THE CITY COUNCIL'S COMMITMENT, UH, TO INVESTIGATE, TO TRULY INVESTIGATE, UH, ACCUSATIONS OR ISSUES INVOLVING THE CHIEF. I UNDERSTAND THE FORMER MAYOR RECENTLY RESIGNED, BUT I DO NOT BELIEVE THIS WILL SOLVE THE ISSUES WITHIN THE POLICE DEPARTMENT. IT WILL REQUIRE A COMMITMENT ON YOU AND REQUIRE VERY HARD, HONEST, AND PARTICULARLY UNBIASED WORK TO ADDRESS THE ISSUES. I UNDERSTAND THE POLICE CHIEF IS HIGHLY REGARDED IN THE, BY THE CITY. UM, I, I GET THAT, BUT I HOPE THAT SOME, AT SOME POINT IN TIME, THE SEDONA POLICE OFFICERS CAN FIND SOME RELIEF. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. UH, I DON'T KNOW WHETHER YOU WERE HERE FOR OUR REPORT ON THE EXECUTIVE SESSION, BUT WE ARE RE WE HAVE UNDERGONE A THOROUGH INVESTIGATION WITH AN INDEPENDENT THIRD PARTY ON THE ALLEGATIONS THAT THE CHIEF MADE AGAINST THE FORMER MAYOR AND THAT THE MAYOR MADE AGAINST THE CHIEF. THAT REPORT WILL BE AVAILABLE TOMORROW AND, UH, THE BY, UH, CLOSE OF BUSINESS. AND IF YOU WOULD LIKE A COPY, I SUGGEST YOU TALK TO THE CITY MANAGER, OR, UH, LAUREN, WHO IS OUR DEPUTY CITY MANAGER IN CHARGE OF COMMUNICATIONS, AND WE WILL GET YOU A COPY OF IT. THANK YOU. WE DID TAKE THIS VERY SERIOUSLY. WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, MAYOR, I BELIEVE THAT A LOT OF YOUR OFFICERS, UH, DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THE CITY COUNCIL, UM, HAS EFFECTIVELY LOOKED AT THE ALLEGATIONS OF LEADERSHIP, UH, CHALLENGES WITHIN THE POLICE DEPARTMENT, AND PARTICULARLY THE POLICE CHIEF. I'M CONVEYING WHAT I'M BEING TOLD, BUT THEY DO UNDERSTAND THAT THERE HAVE BEEN INVESTIGATIONS, BUT FRANKLY, THEY DON'T HAVE ANY CONFIDENCE IN THEM. THANK YOU. I WILL JUST SAY TO MY COLLEAGUES THAT A ANONYMOUS, UH, COMPLAINTS CAN'T REALLY BE ADDRESSED WHEN THEY ARE ANONYMOUS, BUT WE ADDRESSED EVERY COMPLAINT IN WHICH WE HAD THE ABILITY TO UNDERSTAND WHAT IT WAS AND TO FOLLOW UP WITH THE, WITH THE COMPLAINANTS WAS VERY THOROUGH. WENT ON FOR MONTHS. JOHN MARTINEZ. GOOD EVENING COUNSELORS. AND I LOVE SAYING THIS. AND MAYOR FLU, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. SEVERAL WEEKS AGO, OH, WELL FIRST THE TWO PEOPLE THAT SPOKE BEFORE ME, THOSE WERE SOME HEAVY SUBJECTS. I, I HAVE NO IDEA. WHEN I COME HOME TONIGHT, I AM [01:00:01] GONNA BE THINKING WHAT THEY TALKED ABOUT. IT WAS PRETTY DEEP. IT IS OBVIOUS THAT IF, UH, SOMEBODY WANTS TO GO ON THE INTERNET TO FIND OUT WHAT PEOPLE ARE THINKING ABOUT THE POLICE CHIEF AND THE COMPLAINTS THAT THEY'VE GOT, WELL, OBVIOUSLY THE INTERNET OF IT, IT, THEY TELL THE TRUTH. SO LET'S REALLY THINK ABOUT THAT STATEMENT. 'CAUSE I'VE KNOWN THE POLICE CHIEF FOR OVER 12 YEARS. SHE'S HIGHLY RESPECTED BY THE COMMUNITY. EVERYBODY, STAFF, ALL THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE INTERACTED. EVEN ONE TIME I GOT STOPPED BY THE CHIEF AND, UH, AND, UH, I WAS, AND SHE TOLD ME WHAT I WAS DOING WRONG, AND I SAID, I PROMISE I'LL NEVER DO THAT AGAIN. , IF I GOT A TICK OR NOT. THAT'S FROM ME, . BUT WHAT I CAME HERE TO TALK ABOUT IS THAT MANY, MANY WEEKS AGO I CAME BEFORE YOU TO SAY THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THE GRANT THAT YOU GAVE THIS SEDONA SYMPHONY. WHAT I WANNA SAY NOW IS THAT NEXT SUNDAY AFTER YOU DO THE THE DOGGY THING, HALLOWEEN, THEY PLEASE COME TO SPAC SEDONA PERFORMING ARTS CENTER AT THE HIGH SCHOOL TO ATTEND OUR FIRST CONCERT OF THE SEASON. IT FEATURES JOHN NAKA MATSU, WHO IS A WORLD RENOWNED PIANIST. IN FACT, IT IS HISTORY. HE WON THE VAN CLYBURN AWARD SEVERAL YEARS AGO. IT'S, WE'VE GOT A NEW DIRECTOR THAT IS HIGHLY MOTIVATED. HE'S REALLY BRINGING SOME OUTSTANDING IDEAS, SOMETHING DIFFERENT. AND I'LL GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE. THE VERY SECOND CONCERT THAT YOU SEE IN THE PROGRAM, AND ALSO I'VE LEFT SEVERAL PROGRAMS OVER THERE. IT'S MARIMBAS. SO YOU GET TO SEE THE, THE CHORDS ON THAT IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT THAN WE'VE NEVER DONE BEFORE. HE'S HIGHLY, UH, GOT SOME GREAT IDEAS AND I THINK ANYONE THAT COMES TO THE CONCERT WILL BE PLEASED OF WHAT THEY'VE SEEN. AND I, I JUST WANT SAY, ONCE AGAIN, THANK YOU AND PEOPLE IN TV LAND, PLEASE PLAN TO ATTEND THIS SUNDAY, THREE O'CLOCK AT THE HIGH SCHOOL. OH, ALSO FOR THOSE THAT WOULD BE INTERESTED THAT AFTER THAT CONCERT, WE'RE GONNA HAVE A GATHERING AT THE MODERN MOUNTAIN, I BELIEVE THAT NEW HOTEL IN THE CORNER TO CONTINUE THE DISCUSSION WITH THE, THE ART DIRECTOR OR ARTISTIC DIRECTOR AND ADULT BEVERAGES. SO HOPE YOU'LL SEE YOU THERE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. JOHN TOBY FRIEDMAN. MY NAME IS TOBY FRIEDMAN AND I'M A CITIZEN. I'M A RESIDENT OF SEDONA AND MINE IS GOING TO BE VERY SHORT, BUT I WANTED TO TAKE A LITTLE BIT OF YOUR TIME TO THANK MAYOR PLU FOR EVERYTHING THAT SHE'S DONE IN THE CITY, AND TELL HER HOW PROUD MANY PEOPLE IN THE CITY ARE TO HAVE HER AS OUR MAYOR AND OUR VICE MAYOR, BRIAN FOLTZ. WE'RE VERY PROUD TO HAVE YOU TWO AND AS A, UH, UH, VOTER, I WILL, UH, BE LOOKING AT YOU AND VOTING AGAIN FOR YOU. THANK YOU, COUNSEL. THANK YOU TOBY. AND THAT'S THE END OF OUR PUBLIC COMMENTS. NICE WAY TO END THEM. THANK YOU. OKAY. WE HAVE NO PROCLAMATIONS, RECOGNITIONS OR AWARDS, SO WE'LL [8.a. AB 3258 Discussion/possible action regarding approval of an Ordinance amending Chapter 5.25 Short-Term Rental Regulation (STR) Regulation Sections 5.25.030 and 5.25.110.] GET TO REGULAR BUSINESS EIGHT. A AB 32 56 DISCUSSION, POSSIBLE ACTION REGARDING APPROVAL OF AN ORDINANCE AMENDING CHAPTER 5.25, SHORT-TERM RENTAL REGULATION SECTIONS 5 2 5 0.030 AND 5 2 5 0.110. AND THERESA AND BRIAN, PLEASE JOIN US. YOU NO, SURE, UH, BEFORE WE START, UH, THERE WAS A CARD, BUT I DIDN'T HAVE IT FROM DAVID KEY. AND DAVID, IF YOU WANNA COME UP AND THEN WE'LL GET TO YOU GUYS. YEAH. DID I WRITE IT WRONG? PUBLIC COMMENT AFTER YOU DO PUBLIC COMMENT, THAT'S AFTER THE, YEAH, YEAH, I GUESS SO. YOU CAN SPEAK. OKAY. OKAY, GREAT. OH, SPEAK THEN. OKAY. I HAD OTHER REMARKS, BUT I, IS THAT OKAY ON THE SUBJECT MATTER OF, [01:05:01] IS IT ON AN AGENDIZED ITEM OR A GENERAL OH, JUST RELATIVE TO YOU, YOU ALL, UH, GETTING ELECTED AND ALL THAT, SO, YEAH, NO, IT'S FINE. WE'LL JUST, I'LL JUST, I'LL TALK TO YOU ON THE SIDE ABOUT THAT. WELL, YOU, DAVID, YOU, YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES. GO AHEAD IF YOU WANNA SAY SOMETHING. I, I DO WANNA SAY, UH, DAVID KEY RESIDENT OF SEDONA, BUT ALWAYS HERE ON BEHALF OF THE SEDONA CHAMBER OF COMMERCE. UM, SO I JUST WANNA SAY CONGRATULATIONS TO OUR INTERIM MAYOR HOLLY. UM, YOU WERE, YOU KNOW, AMONG THE FIRST TO REALLY JUMP IN AND KIND OF MAKE YOUR ISSUES KNOWN. BRIAN, SAME THING. I THINK YOU WERE THE FIRST ONE I HAD LUNCH WITH. SO THANKS FOR THAT. UM, AND CONGRATULATIONS ON VICE MAYOR. UM, SO, UH, YOU KNOW, BRIAN, WE'RE GONNA HAVE YOU OUT TO OUR, OUR BOARD OF DIRECTORS MEETING. AND, AND THAT'S JUST ONE OF MANY SIGNS THAT WE WANNA CONTINUE TO EXTEND FROM THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY, THAT AS YOU ALL PAINT THIS NEW PATH FORWARD AND CHOOSE A DIRECTION THAT WE WANNA BE IN LINE, YOU KNOW, EVEN WHEN WE DISAGREE, WE'RE ON THE SAME TEAM. WE'RE ALL WORKING ON BEHALF OF THE SAME PEOPLE. SO JUST WANNA SAY CONGRATULATIONS ON THAT AND, UH, APPRECIATE YOUR PARTNERSHIP. THANK YOU. WE DO TOO. OKAY, THERESA, GOOD EVENING, MADAME MAYOR, VICE MAYOR COUNCIL, UM, I'M HERE TO TALK TO YOU VERY BRIEFLY ABOUT SOME AMENDMENTS WE'D LIKE TO MAKE TO 5.25 SHORT-TERM RENTAL CODE. BUT BEFORE I DO THAT, I'D LIKE TO OFFICIALLY INTRODUCE ALL OF YOU TO THE CITY'S NEW SHORT-TERM RENTAL CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICER, BRIAN ARMSTRONG. BRIAN COMES BACK TO US, HE WAS OUR CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICER FOR SEVERAL YEARS BEFORE LEAVING IN 2023. AND WHEN THIS POSITION WAS POSTED, UM, I ENTERTAINED SOME CONVERSATIONS WITH HIM AND IT WAS A FIT FOR HIM TO COME BACK. AND I WILL SAY THAT IN MY LONG CAREER OF HIRING PEOPLE AND MANAGING PEOPLE, THIS IS PROBABLY THE BEST HIRING DECISION I'VE MADE. SO WE ARE VERY LUCKY TO HAVE HIM AND HE'S DOING GREAT THINGS. AND SO I WANNA DO OFFICIALLY RECOGNIZE HIM IN HIS ROLE. IT'S ALWAYS FUN TO MAKE SOMEONE TURN RED TOO, BUT, YOU KNOW, UM, SO WHAT WE'D LIKE TO DO TONIGHT IS JUST INTRODUCE A COUPLE OF CHANGES TO SHORT-TERM RENTAL CODE. AND YOU HAVE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO LOOK AT THE CONSOLIDATED FEE SCHEDULE AND SEE THE PROPOSED FEE THAT WE'D LIKE TO INCLUDE. AND YOU'VE ALSO BEEN ABLE TO READ THE AGENDA PACKET, SO I'M GONNA JUST BRIEFLY READ THROUGH THE SPECIFIC CHANGES THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO MAKE. SO WHAT WE'RE LOOKING TO DO IS, UM, UH, THE WAY THAT THE DOCUMENT IS WRITTEN, WE HAVE KIND OF A MISHMASH OF WHEN THIS LANGUAGE IS INTRODUCED. SO I'D LIKE TO TALK ABOUT THE, UM, THE PERMIT REQUIRED RENEWAL LANGUAGE. AND, AND A LOT OF THIS IS, IS JUST LANGUAGE THAT WE ARE TIGHTENING UP TO ASSIST WITH PERMIT COMPLIANCE. SO UNDER 5 0 3 0 PERMIT REQUIRED, WE WOULD LIKE TO IN, UH, THEREA, CAN I INTERRUPT YOU FOR A SECOND? SURE. CAN WE PUT THE LANGUAGE UP ON THE SCREEN? YEAH. JUST GIVE US A MINUTE. LET TALK WHEN WE PULL IT UP. THANK YOU. WASN'T IT, IT WAS IN THE PACKET, RIGHT? MM-HMM . IT WAS IN THE PACKET, BUT FOR THE PUBLIC THAT IS HERE, THE LANGUAGE ON THE SCREEN I THINK WOULD BE HELPFUL. SO UNDER SECTION 5.25030 PERMIT REQUIRED UNDER SECTION SIX, THE LANGUAGE IS ACKNOWLEDGEMENT BY THE OWNER, THE PERSON WHO IS COMPLETING A PERMIT APPLICATION THAT THE OWNER'S PROPERTY AND SHORT TERM RENTAL IS IN COMPLIANCE AND AGREES TO REMAIN IN COMPLIANCE WITH ALL DEVELOPMENT CODE. SEDONA BUILDING CODES, NEIGHBOR NOTIFICATION, EVIDENCE OF LIABILITY INSURANCE, AND THE REQUIREMENT THAT THE OWNER AND EACH DESIGNEE SHALL NOT BE A REGISTERED SEX OFFENDER. SO ON, JUST BY WAY OF EXPLANATION, FOR THE PUBLIC AS WELL AS THE COUNCIL, WHEN AN OWNER COMPLETES A SHORT-TERM RENTAL PERMIT APPLICATION OR A PERMIT RENEWAL, THERE IS JUST ONE PARAGRAPH. RATHER THAN HAVING THEM ATTEST OR SIGN A A SEPARATE DOCUMENT, THERE'S A PARAGRAPH IN A BOX THAT THEY CHECK THAT THEY'RE AGREEING TO COMPLY WITH STATE AND LOCAL LAWS AS, AS PART OF BEING ELIGIBLE FOR PERMIT. AND THAT'S BEEN IN THE PERMIT APPLICATION OR THE PERMIT RENEWAL FORM SINCE PROGRAM LAUNCHED IN FEBRUARY OF 2023. AND, UM, WE'VE RUN ACROSS SOME INSTANCES WHERE PERMIT APPLICATIONS ARE MADE WITH FALSIFIED INFORMATION. [01:10:01] UM, AND SO WE'RE CLARIFYING TO SOME EXTENT AND HONING THE LANGUAGE AROUND THIS AGREEMENT TO ENSURE THAT, UM, IF WE FOLLOW UP ON WHETHER OR NOT FALSE INFORMATION WAS PROVIDED ON A PERMIT APPLICATION, THAT ANY ACTION THAT WE TAKE IS, IS WITHIN THE, UM, IN THE CODE. SO THE LANG, THIS IS THE BASIS FOR THIS LANGUAGE TO BE ADJUSTED. AND UNDER 5.2, 5.10, THERE'S SOME LANGUAGE AROUND PERMIT SUSPENSIONS. AND WE ARE LOOKING TO ADD BRIEFLY, BRIEFLY, THE ABILITY TO SUSPEND A PERMIT. THE, THE PROCESS RIGHT NOW IS WHEN A SHORT TERM RENTAL OWNER OR THEIR DESIGNEE APPLY FOR A PERMIT, BECAUSE IT'S NOT, IT'S A CODE VIOLATION TO ADVERTISE BEFORE YOU OBTAIN A PERMIT. THERE ARE NO LISTINGS UP THAT WE CAN REVIEW BEFORE SOMEONE GETS THEIR PERMIT. AND WHAT WE'VE COME TO NOTE IS, AS BRIAN HAS JOINED THE TEAM, WE HAVE RECOGNIZED THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO'VE APPLIED FOR PERMITS WHO HAVE HAD A VARIETY OF VIOLATIONS OF LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE AND OR BUILDING CODE. AND WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR IS THE ABILITY TO HAVE ANY DISCOVERED VIOLATION ALLOW FOR THE SUSPENSION OF A PERMIT, WHICH IS DIFFERENT THAN THE REVOCATION OF A PERMIT, BUT AN IDENTIFIED VIOLATION TO ALLOW FOR THE SUSPENSION OF A PERMIT THAT THE OWNER BE NOTIFIED THAT THEIR PERMIT IS SUSPENDED UNTIL THEY MAKE THE CORRECTIONS AND COME BACK INTO COMPLIANCE WITH THE CODE THAT WAS VIOLATED. AND WHAT WE'RE DOING IS RETROACTIVELY LOOKING FOR AN OPPORTUNITY TO SUSPEND THAT PERMIT JUST FOR THE PERIOD OF TIME REQUIRED TO MAKE THAT CORRECTION. AND WHAT WE'RE FINDING BASED ON BRIAN'S INVESTIGATIONS IS FAIRLY SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF THE TIME WHEN PEOPLE APPLIED FOR PERMITS. THEY WERE ALREADY IN VIOLATION OF LAND DEVELOPMENT OR BUILDING CODE. SO THIS IS A WAY TO GO BACK AND CAPTURE THOSE VIOLATIONS. AND THE GOAL OF A SUSPENSION IS ONLY TO MOTIVATE PROPERTY OWNERS TO MAKE THOSE CORRECTIONS AND COME BACK INTO COMPLIANCE. SO THAT IS PART OF THE, UH, PERMIT REQUIRED AND PERMIT SUSPENSION. THE OTHER THING THAT WE ARE ASKING FOR TONIGHT IS TO INCLUDE A MONTHLY LATE FEE AS SET FORTH IN THE CITY OF SEDONA, CONSOLIDATED FEE SCHEDULE FOR 2025. UM, ALMOST A THIRD OF ALL PERMIT RENEWALS. WERE LATE BY AT LEAST A WEEK, OFTENTIMES BY A MONTH, AND STARTLINGLY MANY BY SEVERAL MONTHS. AND I HAVE BEEN WORKING ALL THIS YEAR WITH CITATIONS. AND WHEN BRIAN CAME ON BOARD, HE'S BEEN BUSY WITH THAT. BUT ONE THIRD OF OVER 1200 PERMITS IS A LOT OF CITATIONS TO WRITE. AND A LATE FEE WOULD ALLOW US TO CAPTURE EACH OF THOSE LATE RENEWALS AND TO BOOKMARK THEM AND RECOGNIZE THEM AND, AND ALSO TO PROVIDE SOME MOTIVATION FOR OWNERS TO MOVE TOWARDS COMPLIANCE AND RENEWING ON TIME NEXT YEAR. AND I KNOW THE COUNCIL HAS EXPRESSED INTEREST IN GREATER COMPLIANCE AROUND SHORT TERM RENTALS AND SHORT-TERM RENTAL PERMITS. AND A LATE FEE WOULD ALLOW US TO ENFORCE COMPLIANCE MORE ECONOMICALLY AND TO CAPTURE ALL THOSE LATE PERMITS. UM, WHAT WE WOULD BE LOOKING FOR IS ANY PERMIT RENEWED BETWEEN ONE DAY AND 90 DAYS LATE WOULD RECEIVE A SINGLE $50 LATE FEE. AND ANY PERMIT RENEWED AFTER 90 DAYS WOULD RECEIVE A HUNDRED DOLLARS LATE FEE, SINGLE LATE FEE, NOT CUMULATIVE, JUST A ONE-TIME FEE. WE'RE NOT LOOKING TO BE PUNITIVE, IT'S JUST A FORM OF MOTIVATION. AND AS BRIAN HAS FONDLY SAID, WE ARE HOPING TO BE ABLE TO RE GREATLY REDUCE THE NUMBER OF LATE PERMIT RENEWALS. UM, THE LATE FEE DOES NOT REPLACE THE POSSIBILITY OF CITATION FOR PERMIT VIOLATIONS, BUT IT ALLOWS US MORE ECONOMICALLY AND THOROUGHLY TO CAPTURE EVERYBODY WHO'S RENEWING LATE. AND, UM, YOU WANNA ADD ANYTHING TO THAT? NOPE, THAT WAS OKAY. I, THAT'S REALLY THE EXTENT OF WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR THIS TIME AROUND, UM, ARE THOSE TWO CHANGES TO CITY CODE. AND SO WE BRING THEM BEFORE YOU FOR YOUR REVIEW AND APPROVAL AND DISCUSSION [01:15:01] IF THERE IS ANY. OKAY. THANK YOU THERESA. QUESTIONS? I DO, BUT I WANT TO BE AT THE END 'CAUSE IT'S NOT THIS. OKAY. YOU'RE SPEAKING INTO THE MIC. YEAH, KATHY, THANK YOU. THERESA, YOU SAID THAT IT WOULD BE, LATE FEE WOULD BE A ONE TIME FEE OF $100. AND I AM CURIOUS AS TO WHY YOU'RE RECOMMENDING THAT AS OPPOSED TO SOMETHING THAT'S ON, UH, THAT WOULD ESCALATE IN TERMS OF THE AMOUNT OF TIME THAT IT'S LATE. I MEAN, IF SOMETHING IS TWO WEEKS LATE VERSUS TWO MONTHS LATE VERSUS WHY, WHY WOULDN'T YOU HAVE INCREMENTS? OR, I'M JUST CURIOUS IF YOU EXPLORED THAT AND WHY THIS IS THE PROPOSAL. WE DID A COUPLE OF THINGS, COUNSELOR. UM, WE HAD A DISCUSSION WITH, UM, STERLING IN FINANCE AND HE DID A STUDY OF PRACTICES, UH, AT A STATE LEVEL, KIND OF BEST PRACTICES OR, OR COMMON OTHER PRACTICES AND COMMUNITIES AND MUNICIPALITIES. AND THIS FORMAT WAS IN KEEPING WITH SYSTEMS THAT WERE ALREADY IN PLACE. UM, AND SO THAT WAS ONE PART OF IT. AND BRIAN AND I HAD SEVERAL DISCUSSIONS WITH KURT, THE CITY ATTORNEY, AND THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION ABOUT DOING SOMETHING THAT WAS, UM, NOT SO OVERTLY PUNITIVE IN TERMS OF BEING IN ALIGNMENT WITH KIND OF THE STATE INTENTION OF, UH, COMPLIANCE AS OPPOSED TO PUNISHMENT. SO WE ARE NOT LOOKING TO, WE'RE NOT LOOKING TO HAVE A SECOND CITATION SYSTEM. THE CITATION SYSTEM WILL STILL BE IN EFFECT. SO THERE WILL BE, UM, THOSE WHO DO GET CITED AND, AND ACTUALLY A LATE FEE WILL MAKE IT EASIER 'CAUSE A LATE FEE IS GOING TO BE PROGRAMMED INTO THE SOFTWARE. AND SO IT'S AUTOMATIC. UM, SO IF SOMEONE RENEWS AFTER ONE DAY LATE, THAT $50 FEE WILL KICK IN AND THAT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT WILL BE BE REMOVED. AND SO IT, IT IS UNLIKE A SITE TO HAITIAN, IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT WILL BE NEGOTIABLE. AND SO IT'S AN ENTRYWAY INTO ALLOWING THOSE OWNERS WHO MAYBE HAVEN'T TAKEN THIS VERY SERIOUSLY, JUST DIDN'T THINK OF IT BE, COULD BE CORRECTED. BUT I THINK THE ESCALATION OF CITATIONS, I KNOW SO FAR THIS YEAR THERE'VE BEEN A COUPLE PEOPLE THAT BRIAN HAS CITED AND THEY SAILED RIGHT THROUGH THE FIRST CITATION, AND NOW THEY'RE INTO THE SECOND CITATION, AND THE FIRST CITATION WAS $500 AND THEY DIDN'T RESPOND. AND NOW THEIR SECOND CITATION IS A THOUSAND DOLLARS, AND IF THEY DON'T RESPOND TO THAT, THEY'LL GET A THIRD CITATION, WHICH IS $3,500. SO THERE IS THAT PENALTY ASPECT IN THE CITATION PROGRAM. AND I, I WOULD LIKE TO BELIEVE, AND I I THINK TO SOME EXTENT I HAVE, LET ME CHANGE MY COMMENT HERE. I'VE NOT HAD ANY PROBLEM WITH CITING PEOPLE THIS YEAR THAT WAS COUNCIL'S DIRECTION. IT WAS A CITY MANAGER'S DIRECTION, I THINK IN THE THIRD YEAR, THE PROGRAM, IT'S APPROPRIATE. UM, HOWEVER, I DO THINK THAT HAVING ANOTHER SYSTEM THAT ALLOWS PEOPLE TO COME INTO COMPLIANCE, AND I, I THINK THE LATE FEE IS GONNA MORE THOROUGHLY CAPTURE MORE PEOPLE BECAUSE OUR, OUR CITATION PROCESS IS STILL A MANUAL PROCESS. IT REQUIRES A LOT OF REVIEW, A LOT OF PERMITS WRITTEN, A LOT OF WORKING WITH THE US MAIL, AND, UM, THE, THE LATE FEE IS, IS GOING TO REALLY JUST BE RIGHT THERE AND CAPTURE THINGS. SO I THINK IT, WE'RE GONNA SEE A DROP IN IN LATE RENEWALS. I THINK IT WILL MOTIVATE PEOPLE AND WE'LL STILL HAVE THAT CITATION PROCESS TO ENACT GREATER PENALTIES AS REQUIRED. UM, AND I, I THINK HAVING SOME APPEARANCE OF REASONABLENESS, UM, AND I KNOW I'VE BEEN A PROPONENT IN THE PAST OF NO CITATIONS AND MOSTLY EDUCATION, BUT I AM ON BOARD WITH THE CITATION PROCESS AT THIS TIME. BUT I STILL THINK A BIG PART OF THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL PROGRAM SUCCESS IS THAT WORKING RELATIONSHIP WITH OWNERS. AND, AND SO THIS IS A BRIDGE BETWEEN THE CITATION PROCESS AND THE MORE OF A, A FIRST STEP IN COMPLIANCE, IF YOU WILL. AND ONE OTHER QUESTION ON THE LATE FEE. UM, YOU SAID THAT STERLING HAD LOOKED INTO SYSTEMS. WERE THOSE SYSTEMS SPECIFIC TO SHORT TERM RENTAL? UH, OR, OR JUST GENERAL COLLECTION SYSTEMS FOR VARIOUS THINGS IN A CITY? DO YOU KNOW ANY? I THINK IT WAS A, IT WAS A MIX OF, OF [01:20:01] MUNICIPAL PRACTICES WITH SHORT-TERM RENTALS AND WITH OTHER TYPES OF, OF LATE FEE PENALTIES. OKAY. BECAUSE THE SECOND PART OF, OF MY QUESTION TO THAT IS, IS THE A HUNDRED DOLLARS, IS THAT IN LINE WITH OTHER MUNICIPALITIES THAT ARE CHARGING A LATE FEE? I BELIEVE THAT SEDONA, PERHAPS WITH THE EXCEPTION OF SCOTTSDALE, I THINK SEDONA IS STILL KIND OF LEADING THE PACK IN TERMS OF CITATIONS AND, AND LATE FEES AND ENACTING THESE THINGS. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? OKAY, PETE, THANK YOU MAYOR KLUG, . THANKS TERESA FOR BEING HERE. UM, AND I DO WANNA RECOGNIZE AND APPRECIATE YOUR INCREMENTAL BUT STEADY APPROACH HERE AS WE'RE ALL LEARNING THIS STUFF AND GOING THROUGH, UM, I, YOU KNOW, I, I'VE, I YEAH, I APPRECIATE THAT YOU CONTINUE TO LOOK AT THIS AND BRING FORTH CHANGES BECAUSE SHORT TERM RENTAL REGULATIONS ARE ON THE AGENDA HERE. I WANTED TO ASK ABOUT WEDDINGS AND WEDDING RECEPTIONS, AND THERE'S A, I THINK A CONFUSION. I KNOW THERE'S A CONFUSION WITHIN ME ABOUT WHAT'S REALLY ALLOWED AND WHAT'S NOT ALLOWED, BUT WE HAD A REALLY NICE TO-DO IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THIS LAST WEEKEND ABOUT A WEDDING RECEPTION THAT WAS GOING ON, UH, AT A NEARBY SHORT-TERM RENTAL HOUSE. AND TWO OTHER SHORT-TERM RENTAL OWNERS CAME KNOCKING ON MY DOOR AND SAYING, WHY CAN THEY DO THAT? AND I'M NOT ALLOWED TO DO THAT. AND SO DIGGING INTO THE, UH, CODE 3, 5 25 0 50 TALKS ABOUT WEDDINGS OR WEDDING RECEPTIONS, BUT IT REALLY TALKS ABOUT ADVERTISING A SHORT-TERM RENTAL PROPERTY. UH, I ALWAYS THOUGHT THE EVENT ITSELF WAS NOT ALLOWED, BUT YOU LOOK AT THE CODE, IT SAYS ONE THING. IF YOU GO TO OUR WEBSITE, OUR WEBSITE, UH, ALTHOUGH WE'VE GOT A A NICE SHORT-TERM RENTAL THING, IT REALLY DOESN'T ADDRESS THAT ISSUE AT ALL ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. SO I, I FELT UNCOMFORTABLE TAKING ANY ACTION BECAUSE I DON'T WANNA DISTURB ANYONE'S EVENT. I'M NOT SURE IF IT'S REALLY AGAINST OUR RULES OR NOT. I THINK SOME CLARIFICATION WHETHER WE NEED TO DO MORE OR LESS WITHIN THE, THE, UH, REGULATIONS. I DON'T KNOW, IT'S A QUESTION I'M ASKING. CERTAINLY ADDRESSING IT MORE IN THE FACTS, YOU KNOW, WHAT, UH, THINGS ARE ALLOWED AND NOT ALLOWED. BUT I'D LOVE TO HEAR YOU TELL ME WHAT'S THE REAL RULES AROUND EVENTS. I'M GONNA SPEAK FIRST AND THEN KURT CAN JUMP IN AND AUGMENT WHATEVER POINTS I'VE MISSED. IT'S BEEN MY UNDERSTANDING SINCE THE PROGRAM STARTED THAT EVENTS AT A SHORT-TERM RENTAL ARE PROHIBITED. AND I'VE HAD DISCUSSIONS WITH KURT AND BRIAN AND I HAVE TALKED WITH CARRIE MEYER. AND THERE THE LANGUAGE IS DEFINITELY VERY CLEAR. ANY EVENT THAT WOULD REQUIRE A TEMPORARY USE PERMIT FOR RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY IS PROHIBITED AT A SHORT TERM RENTAL BECAUSE SHORT TERM RENTALS CANNOT BE ISSUED TEMPORARY USE PERMITS. SO THAT WOULD INCLUDE WEDDINGS, IT WOULD INCLUDE RECEPTIONS, IT WOULD INCLUDE RETREATS OR EVENTS. UM, AND SO THE REASON THAT WE ADDED THE LANGUAGE BACK IN APRIL FOR ADVERTISING IS BECAUSE IT'S SO VERY DIFFICULT TO CAPTURE WEDDINGS IN PROGRESS. UM, THE WEDDING WE DID, WE DID, UM, SHUT DOWN ONE WEDDING VENUE THIS YEAR THROUGH CITATION. AND BRIAN IS WORKING WITH ANOTHER PROPERTY THAT HAS, FOR THE MOST PART, UM, STOPPED THEIR WEDDING. AND ONE OF THEM WAS A BIG VENUE AND THE OTHER WAS A SMALL VENUE. AND OUR SUCCESS AROUND THAT CAME IN A TWO-PRONGED APPROACH. AND ONE PRONG WAS THAT THE NEIGHBORS CALLED IN THE EVENTS TO THE HOTLINE AS THEY WERE OCCURRING. AND, AND WE GET A LOT OF ANECDOTAL CALLS TO THE HOTLINE ABOUT WEDDINGS AFTER THEY HAPPEN, BUT THERE'S NOTHING THAT CAN BE DONE. BUT THE POLICE DEPARTMENT WAS GREAT. I WORKED WITH GOBOS TO DEVELOP LANGUAGE THAT IF AN EVENT IS CALLED IN AND THE WORD WEDDING IS USED, WHETHER THAT'S WEDDING OR RECEPTION, THE HOTLINE WILL IMMEDIATELY TURN AROUND DAY OR NIGHT AND CALL SEDONA POLICE SO THAT THE POLICE CAN GO OUT AND INVESTIGATE AND COLLECT EVIDENCE AND VERIFY THAT THERE IS AN INDEED AN EVENT IN PLACE. AND THAT THAT HAS BEEN IN PLACE SINCE SHORT-TERM RENTAL ORDINANCE HAS BEEN HAPPENING. BUT IT'S VERY HARD. UM, I'VE INCLUDED COMMENTS ABOUT WEDDINGS IN MY, UH, SEDONA BIZ ARTICLES, OUR CITY ARTICLES. I'VE, I'VE TRIED TO EDUCATE THE PUBLIC, AND IT SEEMS TO BE VERY DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE TO [01:25:01] CALL AN EVENT IN WHILE IT'S HAPPENING. PEOPLE TEND TO WANNA BE NICE. THEY DON'T WANNA MAKE TROUBLE, THEY DON'T WANNA GO THAT EXTRA STEP IN REPORTING, SO WITHOUT ACTUAL EVIDENCE COLLECTED. UM, AND, AND EVIDENCE COULD BE A NEIGHBOR TAKING PICTURES OF AN EVENT THAT'S HAPPENING. UM, SO WE ADDED THE LANGUAGE OF IT BEING A CODE VIOLATION TO ADVERTISE, JUST TO GIVE US A MORE ROBUST APPROACH TO CAPTURING WEDDINGS. AND WE WERE ABLE TO GET BOTH THE CALLS IN AT THE TIME AN EVENT WAS HAPPENING THIS YEAR, AND, AND THE POLICE WERE OUT TO COLLECT THAT EVIDENCE AND TO HAVE THE LANGUAGE OF THE PROHIBITION ON ADVERTISING. AND THAT'S WHAT ALLOWED THIS TO BE SUCCESSFUL. AND SO I DON'T THINK, I DON'T THINK WE'RE RELYING JUST ON ADVERTISING, BUT IT'S JUST INCREDIBLY DIFFICULT, UM, TO HAVE THE PUBLIC, OUR RESIDENTS BE COMFORTABLE IN REPORTING SOMETHING AS IT'S OCCURRING. I WOULD SAY IN GENERAL, WITH EVENTS OF ANY KIND, WHETHER IT'S NOISE, NON-WETTING NOISE, OR PARTIES OR ANYTHING, I WOULD SAY EASILY 30% TO 40% OF ALL THE CALLS WE GET ARE AFTER THE FACT. AND WHAT WE HEAR FROM THE HOTLINE IS SOMEBODY SPENT THE EVENING BEING ANGRY AND STEWING AND THEN FINALLY DECIDING THE NEXT DAY TO CALL. SO THE EFFECTIVENESS OF THE HOTLINE AND SOME OF THE ENFORCEMENT OF THIS IS THAT THINGS BE CALLED IN WHEN THEY HAPPEN. AND I TALKED TO A NICE LADY FROM THE MIDWEST AND SHE SAID, OH, I WOULD NEVER DO THAT. MIDWESTERN PEOPLE DON'T DO THAT. IT'S NOT NICE. AND SO THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO WANT THE CITY TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. UM, AND, AND I WOULD ASK RESIDENTS TO FORGIVE ME, BUT I WILL SAY WITHOUT THEM HAVING TO FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE FOR DOING SOMETHING THAT FEELS LIKE IT'S NOT A GOOD NEIGHBOR. SO THE APPROACH HAS NOT CHANGED. AND CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, I AM MORE THAN OPEN TO SUGGESTIONS FROM COUNCIL OR CONTINUING REFINEMENTS IN WORKING WITH KURT OR KERRY TO, UM, TIGHTEN THIS UP OR CLARIFY THE LANGUAGE TO MAKE IT EASIER. UM, BUT THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF WHERE THINGS ARE AT RIGHT NOW. I APPRECIATE IT. OH, ONE, ONE MORE COMMENT FOR YOU. THE OTHER THING THAT WE HAVE A CHALLENGE WITH IS I'VE, I'VE HAD, I'VE BEEN MEETING WITH PROPERTY MANAGERS AND SEVERAL OF THEM HAVE APPROACHED ME AND SAID, YOU KNOW, WE HAD A WEDDING, AND I WENT AND SHUT IT DOWN RIGHT AWAY. AND, AND THE HOTLINE RECORDED IT. AND, AND ONE OF THE CHALLENGES IS THE WAY THE STATE, UM, LAW IS WRITTEN IS AN OWNER HAS TO BE COMPLICIT IN HOSTING A SHORT-TERM RENTAL. THEY HAVE TO KNOWINGLY COUNTENANCE THAT A WEDDING IS AT THEIR PROPERTY. AND SO THERE ARE WEDDINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING, AND IF, IF NEIGHBORS CALLED IT IN THE HOTLINE, YOU KNOW, THE POLICE WOULD BE THERE, THE OWNER WOULD BE NOTIFIED. AND I DO THINK THAT HAS GOTTEN SOME PEOPLE'S ATTENTION. BUT AGAIN, THERE'S AN EDUCATION PIECE HERE ABOUT HELPING OWNERS, UM, MANAGE THEIR SHORT TERM RENTALS TO PROHIBIT THOSE WEDDINGS. AND I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE SNEAKY EVENTS HAPPENING, UM, FROM TIME TO TIME. SO AGAIN, I WOULD MAKE A PLEA FOR YOUR NEIGHBORS OR ANYONE JUST CALL WHILE IT'S HAPPENING. AND, AND THAT'S A FIRST STEP. AND YOU KNOW, CERTAINLY IF WE HAVE A PROPERTY WHERE, OOPS, THE OWNER HASN'T KNOWN AND WE'VE CALLED, HAD FIVE WEDDING COMPLAINTS OVER THE SUMMER MONTHS, WE WILL BE HAVING A CHAT WITH THAT OWNER ABOUT WHAT THEY CAN DO TO REGULATE THEIR PROPERTY BETTER. I APPRECIATE THOSE WORDS, THERESA. AND, AND, AND I'LL CONVEY THAT, UH, TO THE PEOPLE THAT APPROACHED ME OVER THIS LAST WEEKEND. AND I DO AGREE WITH YOU THAT 5 25 50 SAYS THAT YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO DO EVENTS THAT REQUIRE A PERMIT, BUT THERE'S REALLY NO LINK TO THEN WHAT EVENTS REQUIRE A PERMIT IN THAT SECTION OF THE CODE. SO WHEN I'M STANDING THERE ON THIS OUTSIDE OF MY FRONT DOOR DEBATING WITH MY NEIGHBORS ABOUT WHAT'S ALLOWED OR NOT ALLOWED, THAT'S TOO HARD. OKAY? AND THEN WE WENT TO THE WEBSITE WHERE YOU DO HAVE BEAUTIFUL SECTIONS ON SHORT TERM RENTALS, THE PROPERTY OWNED RESPONSIBILITIES IN THE FACT PAGE, AND NOTHING ON AND ANYWHERE DOES IT SAY ANYTHING ABOUT EVENTS. AND SO THERE REALLY WASN'T ANYTHING I COULD POINT TO AND TRUST MYSELF THAT I WAS MAKING THE RIGHT DECISION. SO, SO MAYOR AND COUNSEL, I'LL JUST ADD TO ONE THING THERESA SAID IN THE, IN THE CODE, IT STATES THAT YOU CANNOT HAVE A SPECIAL EVENT AT THE PROPERTY PERIOD, AND A ONE TIME VIOLATION. IS IT SUFFICIENT TO REVOKE A PERMIT FOR [01:30:01] A YEAR? UM, AND, UH, COMING TO COUNCIL NEXT MONTH, I BELIEVE, AS ARE THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE UPDATES THAT WILL, UM, BE CLARIFYING THE DEFINITION OF SPECIAL EVENT. THANK YOU. APPRECIATE IT. AND BRIAN, WELCOME BACK. WELCOME ABOARD. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? OKAY, COMMENTS. I NOTICED, KURT, UH, ACTUALLY THIS IS A QUESTION AND A COMMENT IN, UH, G WHERE WE REFER TO THE CONSOLIDATED FEE SCHEDULE SAYS INCLUDING A MONTHLY LATE FEE AS SET FORTH, BUT I'M HEARING IT'S NOT A MONTHLY LATE FEE. IT'S A ONE TIME LATE FEE. SO SHOULD THAT LANGUAGE BE ADJUSTED UP UP TO THE DEPARTMENT? I THOUGHT IT WAS A MONTHLY, EVERY MONTH YOU'D GET THE, UM, BUT IT DEPENDS ON HOW WE PUT IT IN THE LATE FEE SCHEDULE AS WELL. I THINK THAT IS, UH, JUST A GAP IN BETWEEN OUR DISCUSSION AND THE LANGUAGE. UM, WE COULD CERTAINLY DO A MONTHLY LATE FEE. I, I WILL TALK TO GOBOS. I KNOW THEY WERE SET TO, UM, ADD JUST A ONETIME LATE FEE, AND I'LL CIRCLE BACK WITH THEM AND SEE IF IT CAN ACCUMULATE MONTHLY. UM, AGAIN, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT, SO I, I THINK WHAT WOULD BE BEST IS TO TAKE OUT MONTHLY FOR NOW AND JUST LEAVE IT AS IT'LL BE A SET FORTH AND A LEAVE. YEAH, WE CAN DO THAT. SO THEN YOU HAVE MORE FLEXIBILITY. YES, IT'LL BE, AND COUNCIL UPDATES, THE CONSOLIDATED FEE SCHEDULE YEARLY, UH, GENERALLY. AND SO THAT CAN CHANGE IF WE NEED TO. OKAY. READY FOR A MOTION? GO AHEAD. MOTION LADY. OKAY. SO, UM, I'M GONNA SAY AS AMENDED. AS AMENDED, PLEASE. SO I MOVE TO APPROVE ORDINANCE NUMBER 2025 DASH 10 10, UH, AN ORDINANCE OF THE MAYOR AND COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF SEDONA, ARIZONA, ADOPTING AMENDMENTS TO SEDONA CITY CODE CHAPTER 5.25, SHORT-TERM RENTAL REGULATION AS AMENDED. SECOND. OKAY. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, COUNSELORS. IF WE DID HAVE, UH, ONE COMMENT ON THIS, IF, IF, IF YOU HOLD OFF YOUR VOTING JUST TO HEAR FROM THE PUBLIC. THANK YOU, TIM PERRY. GOOD EVENING, COUNSELORS. MY NAME IS TIM PERRY AND I LIVE IN SEDONA. TONIGHT'S INSTALLMENT OF AN STR DISCRIMINATION ORDINANCE, OF COURSE, OFFERS US AN ILLUSTRATION OF A NUMBER OF THE PROBLEMS WITH OUR CITY GOVERNMENT. FOR ONE THING THAT THIS KEEPS COMING BACK OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN IS BLATANTLY UNDEMOCRATIC. WHEN THE CITY'S OWN DATA SHOWS THAT 92% OF SEDONAS DON'T EVEN CARE ENOUGH ABOUT SHORT-TERM RENTALS TO COMPLAIN ABOUT THEM. WE DO NOT NEED AN INFINITY OF SHORT-TERM RENTAL ORDINANCES. ANOTHER ISSUE IS THAT IT'S, WELL, THIS COULD ACTUALLY BE CONSIDERED MORE HELPFUL. IT SHOWS US HOW BUREAUCRATS LIKE TO ACCOMPLISH THINGS THAT THEY CAN'T GET IN OTHER WAYS BY THE DEATH OF A THOUSAND CUTS. AND IN THAT CONTEXT, IT ALSO ILLUSTRATES JUST WHY THE LEGISLATURE KEEPS TAKING AWAY LOCAL CONTROL FROM CITIES. THEY DON'T TRUST CITIES TO USE IT ANYMORE THAN THE PUBLIC DOES. BUT THE REAL ISSUE AT THE CORE OF THIS ORDINANCE IS THAT IT IS NECESSARY AS PART OF THE CITY'S FALSE NARRATIVE, THAT SEDONA IS BEING OVERWHELMED BY A WAVE OF SHORT-TERM RENTALS THAT ARE TAKING AWAY HOUSING ACCORDING TO THE CITY'S OWN DATA, AGAIN, THERE WERE 1,189 SHORT-TERM RENTALS IN SEDONA IN DECEMBER OF 2019. AND THERE ARE, IF I'M RECALLING THE NUMBER FROM THE PACKET CORRECTLY, 1,231 TODAY, THAT CHANGE DOESN'T EVEN RISE TO THE LEVEL OF STATISTICAL SIGNIFICANCE YET APPARENTLY HERE WE ARE WITH THIS BEING SUCH AN ISSUE YET AGAIN. ACTUALLY, WHAT THIS ORDINANCE IS, IS THE COUNCIL'S ATTEMPT YET AGAIN TO AVOID RECOGNIZING REALITY. ALL THE STUDIES WE'VE HAD DONE ON SHORT-TERM RENTALS IN THE RECENT PAST HAVE SHOWN THAT THERE IS A PATTERN TO SHORT-TERM RENTAL OWNERSHIP. WELL-HEELED URBANITES COME TO SEDONA ON A VACATION. THEY LIKE IT. THEY BUY A HOUSE HERE, THEY SHORT-TERM RENT THAT HOUSE FOR FIVE TO 10 YEARS TO COVER THEIR MORTGAGE, THEN THEY MOVE TO SEDONA, SEMI-RETIRED OR RETIRED FOR, OH, CALL IT BETWEEN 10 AND 20 YEARS. AND THEN THEY MOVE AWAY TO BE CLOSER TO FAMILY AND CLOSER TO A HOSPITAL, AND THEY SELL THEIR HOUSE TO THE, THE NEXT PERSON IN LINE WHO TURNS IT INTO A SHORT-TERM RENTAL. AGAIN, [01:35:01] NOTHING IN THIS ORDINANCE OR ANY OF THE OR OTHER ORDINANCES THE CITY HAS PASSED DEALING WITH THIS ISSUE WILL ADDRESS THIS PROBLEM. AND QUITE FRANKLY, IT'S NOT TO BE EXPECTED THAT THEY WILL, BECAUSE THE COUNCIL IS COMPLICIT IN THIS PROBLEM THEMSELVES. I WILL BE VERY SURPRISED IF ANY OF YOU STAY IN SEDONA UNTIL THE DAY YOU DIE. OTHERWISE, I'LL BE LOOKING FOR YOUR PLACES TO COME ON THE MARKET IN A FEW YEARS TOO. AND I WILL BE LOOKING TO SEE WHICH ONE IS THE FIRST TO BECOME A SHORT-TERM RENTAL. OKAY, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. WE'RE UNANIMOUS. JOE. THANK YOU. COULD YOU PLEASE RE REPEAT WHO, UM, YOU WANT THE REPEATED THE MOTION, THE SECOND? WELL, WHO DID, WHO WAS FIRST AND WHO WAS SECOND IS ALL SECOND. I WAS, I WAS THE MO MOVED IN. AND PETE. PETE, SECONDED. DEREK. DEREK. OKAY. THANK YOU, DEREK. SECONDED. OKAY. UH, THANK YOU. WHY DON'T WE TAKE A FIVE MINUTE STRETCH BREAK BEFORE WE MOVE ON TO THE NEXT TOPIC. SO NEED US IN STRETCHES, . YEAH. BINDER, WHAT I NEED TO DO IS GO THROUGH, WE'RE GOOD. OKAY, WE'RE READY. [8.b. AB 3257 Discussion/possible direction regarding a tourism update including results of the summer marketing campaign, the winter marketing campaign plan, the City Manager’s authority to approve amendments to the DVA contract, and approval of a contract amendment for DVA in an amount not to exceed $558,720 for marketing services.] A, B, E 32 57 DISCUSSION, POSSIBLE DIRECTION REGARDING A TOURISM UPDATE, INCLUDING RESULTS OF THE SUMMER MARKETING CAMPAIGN, THE WINTER MARKETING CAMPAIGN PLAN, THE CITY MANAGER'S AUTHORITY TO APPROVE AMENDMENTS TO THE DVA CONTRACT AND APPROVAL OF A CONTRACT AMENDMENT FOR DVA IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED $550,720 FOR MARKETING SERVICES. WHO'S GONNA START? IT'S ME. I ON DECK, YO. OKAY. JUST GET MYSELF SITUATED. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. LET'S DO IT THIS WAY. ALL RIGHT. SO GOOD EVENING, INTERIM MAYOR AND CITY COUNCILORS, VICE MAYOR, NEW VICE MAYOR. I AM HERE TONIGHT WITH TOURISM MANAGER ANDREW GROSSMAN, AND CHRISTIAN FOLK PARTNER AND DIGITAL DIRECTOR AT DVA, OUR MARKETING AGENCY. SO HERE'S WAVE CHRISTIAN, YOU'RE THERE. HE IS SMALL, SMALL BUT MIGHTY . UM, TODAY WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT FOUR MAJOR TOPICS. UM, WE'VE GOT A LOT OF GROUND TO COVER, SO I'LL TRY AND BE AS CLEAR AS I CAN. UM, BUT FEEL FREE TO ASK ME QUESTIONS. UM, I HAVE A FEW STOPPING, STOPPING POINTS ALONG THE WAY WHERE I'LL ASK FOR SOME DIRECTION AND DISCUSSION FROM YOU. UM, BUT THE FOUR TOPICS ARE THE RESULTS OF THE SUMMER MARKETING CAMPAIGN, THE WINTER MARKETING CAMPAIGN STRATEGY, THE ASK FOR A ONE-OFF PROCUREMENT AUTHORITY FOR THE CITY MANAGER, AND APPROVAL OF DVAS NEWEST AMENDMENT TO THEIR CONTRACT. SO TO JUMP IN, YEAH. OKAY. TO JUMP INTO THE SUMMER MARKETING CAMPAIGN RESULTS, HERE IS SOME OF THE CREATIVE FROM THE SUMMER CAMPAIGN, WHICH WAS BASED ON THE THEME REDEFINED DESERT. A CAMPAIGN WILL BE RUNNING FOR UP TO TWO YEARS. THE FIRST PART OF THE CAMPAIGN, WHAT WAS, IS WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY PITCHED TO YOU ALL. SO THAT WAS $163,000. IT RAN FROM MAY 15TH TO AUGUST 31ST. AND WE SPENT THAT MONEY WITH $12,000 IN PAID SEARCH, $14,500 IN META ADS FOR IN MARKET AND A 25 MILE RADIUS AROUND SEDONA AND THE PHOENIX AREA. THOSE ARE ALL SUSTAINABILITY THEMED IMAGERY AND MESSAGING. UM, META ADS FOR OUT OF MARKET, THAT WAS $21,000. AND THEN ATTRIBUTION WAY, ATTRIBUTION BASED WEB ADS FOR OUT OF MARKET, THAT'S $70,500. UM, THOSE ARE THE TYPES OF ADS THAT TRACK, UM, IF YOU, UH, SAW THE AD, UH, FROM WHEREVER YOU LIVE AND THEN ENDED UP IN MARKET. AND IF SO, UM, STAYED WHERE AND FOR HOW LONG? AND THEN THERE WAS ATTRIBUTION CTV ADS FOR OUT OF MARKET. THAT WAS FOR $45,582. UM, AS YOU REMEMBER, THIS WAS A NEW STRATEGY FOR US. AND THESE DO THE SAME THING AS THOSE ATTRIBUTION BASED, UM, THE WEB-BASED ADS WHERE THEY TRACK [01:40:01] IF YOU WATCHED, UM, THE AD, UH, AND THEN IF YOU ENDED UP IN MARKET, THAT AD ON THE RIGHT THERE IS OUR MOST POPULAR AD. UM, THAT WAS THE HIGHEST PERFORMING, AND IT WAS REDEFINE FAMILY TIME. THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S A CONSISTENT THEME, UM, THAT WE'RE SEEING IN OUR CAMPAIGNS, IS THAT REDEFINE FAMILY TIME DOES WELL. SO THE OUT OF MARKET CITIES INCLUDED PHOENIX, LA, TUCSON, SAN FRANCISCO, VEGAS, SAN DIEGO, DALLAS, CHICAGO, SEATTLE, AND DENVER. OKAY, SO NOW THIS IS THE, UM, SECONDARY CAMPAIGN OVERVIEW. SO THIS WAS, AS YOU REMEMBER, WE GOT TOGETHER IN LATE JULY. WE ASKED FOR AN EMERGENCY SPEND OF $50,000 TO ADD TO THE CAMPAIGN TO DRIVE IMMEDIATE VISITATION, UM, EVEN MORE THAN WE WERE ALREADY. UH, THAT WAS FROM JULY 25TH TO AUGUST 35TH, 31ST. IN DOING THAT, WE TURNED OFF THE SPEND IN THE LOWEST PERFORMING MARKETS OF SEATTLE, SEATTLE, CHICAGO, AND DENVER AND RE AND WE REALLOCATED THAT SPEND TO THE DRIVE MARKETS. UM, WE KEPT AD SPEND FOR SAN FRANCISCO AND DALLAS THE SAME, JUST LIKE WE HAD PITCHED FROM THE BEGINNING BECAUSE THEY WERE PERFORMING WELL. UM, WE SPENT AN EXTRA $50,000 IN PAID SEARCH THAT WAS $3,000 OF THAT. UM, META ADS, $20,000. THOSE ATTRIBUTION ADS THAT I TALKED ABOUT, BOTH THE WEB AND THE CTV, THAT WAS $20,000. AND THEN, UM, A NEW STRATEGY AS WELL WAS THE BANNER AT, AT THE PHOENIX AIRPORT, UM, FOR $15,000. OKAY, SO LET'S GET INTO SOME OF THE KPIS. SO I'VE GOT SOME GOOD NEWS AND SOME INTERESTING NEWS ON THESE. SO FIRST I'LL GO OVER THE GOOD NEWS. UM, OUR NON ATTRIBUTION KPIS, SO THAT WOULD BE THE META, THE PAID SEARCH. UM, THEY WERE EXCEPTIONAL. WE ATTRACTED 119,000 PEOPLE TO THE WEBSITE. THAT'S A 92% INCREASE IN WEB TRAFFIC. YEAR OVER YEAR. WE HAD 25,000 USER USERS THAT CAME TO OUR WEBSITE FOR THE SUSTAINABILITY PAGE. WE HAD 2.7 MILLION VIDEO VIEWS, THAT'S COMPLETE VIEWS ON OUR VIDEOS, AND WE EXCEEDED OUR PAID SEARCH AND META BENCHMARKS FROM THE WINTER CAMPAIGN IN ALL CATEGORIES. NOW LET'S GET TO THE INTRO. UH, THE INTERESTING NEWS THAT'S ON THE, UM, ATTRIBUTION KPIS. SO ON OUR RETURN ON AD SPEND OR ROAS, COMPARED TO THE OTHER CAMPAIGNS THAT WE'VE RUN, IT'S BEEN LOWER, IT WAS LOWER THIS TIME, UM, IN THE SUMMER, AND THAT'S AT A 12 TO ONE RATIO. SO THAT'S FOR EVERY DOLLAR SPENT ON THE CAMPAIGN, THE SEDONA ECONOMY SAW $12 IN RETURN. AND JUST AS A REMINDER, ROAS IS HOTEL AND SHORT-TERM RENTAL IMPACT, PLUS DESTINATION IMPACT DIVIDED BY AD SPEND. WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT, WHEN I TALK ABOUT IMPACT, THAT IS CALCULATED FROM OUR ATTRIBUTION WEB AND CTV ADS BY TRACKING IF PEOPLE WHO WERE SERVED ADS ENDED UP IN MARKET AND IF THEY STAYED IN A HOTEL OR SHORT-TERM RENTAL. UM, AND THAT'S NEW THIS TIME IS THE SHORT-TERM RENTAL COMPONENT OF IT. SO ANDREW ACTUALLY USED THERESA'S DATA, UM, TO UPDATE OUR POLYGONS WITH OUR ADVERTISING VENDOR SO THAT NOT ONLY IS EVERY HOTEL IN OUR ATTRIBUTION RESULT, BUT EVERY SHORT-TERM RENTAL IS AS WELL. SO WITH THE HOTEL A DR OF 294, AND NOTE THAT THIS IS LOWER THAN THE WINTER CAMPAIGN, THE WINTER CAMPAIGN WAS SOMETHING LIKE, OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD, IT WAS SOMETHING LIKE THREE 20. SO THAT'S JUST SOMETHING TO KEEP IN MIND. UM, THAT'S ALSO GONNA GIVE US A LOWER ROAS. UM, AND A SHORT-TERM RENTAL, A DR OF $401 AND A 190 A DAY VISITOR SPEND, WE SAW ABOUT A $2.5 MILLION ECONOMIC IMPACT, OR 12 TO ONE ROAS, WHICH I'LL GET INTO MORE OF THE SPECIFICS ON THOSE IN THE FOLLOWING SLIDES. THIS IS ALL, THIS ALSO MEANT THAT THE SALES AND BED TAX THAT WAS RETURNED TO THE CITY FROM THE CAMPAIGN WAS ABOUT 123,000. SO THAT 12, 12 TO ONE IS ACTUALLY A REALLY GREAT ROAS NUMBER IN GENERAL WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT MARKETING. BUT JUST IN COMPARISON TO OTHER CAMPAIGNS, IT IS LOWER. SO WE REACHED OUT TO OUR ADVERTISING VENDOR AND THEY INDICATED THAT THIS WAS DUE TO LESS DEVICES BEING ABLE TO BE PICKED UP IN A DESTINATION BECAUSE OF DATA PRIVACY GETTING STRICTER AND STRICTER. I HAD DVA LOOK INTO THE COMPANIES THAT OFFER [01:45:01] THIS TYPE OF ATTRIBUTION ADVERTISING THAT SERVES AN AD TO A PERSON AND THEN TRACKS IF THEY COME IN TO THE MARKET TO SEE IF THERE'S A BETTER COMPANY TO WORK WITH GOING FORWARD. I'LL GET INTO THE RESULTS OF THAT EFFORT A LITTLE BIT LATER IN THE PRESENTATION WHEN I GO OVER THE WIN WINTER CAMPAIGN. SO STAY TUNED FOR A DEEPER DIVE INTO THAT SUBJECT. OKAY, NOW I'M GONNA HAVE CHRISTIAN TALK ABOUT THE PERFORMANCE OF THE EXTRA $50,000, UM, THAT WE PUT INTO THE CAMPAIGN. YEAH, SO, UM, WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE APPLIED THE EXTRA FUNDS KIND OF ACROSS THE SPECTRUM. UM, OUR GOAL OBVIOUSLY IS TO MAKE SURE WE RETURN A POSITIVE ROI, BUT WE'RE ALSO SEEKING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE PROVIDING A STRATEGY THAT'S A FULL FUNNEL STRATEGY THAT KEEPS SEDONA HEALTHY KIND OF FOR A LONG TERM, UM, AND A VIABLE TOURISM PRODUCT INTO THE FUTURE. SO THAT'S A BIT OF, UH, WHY NOT ALL OF THE FUNDS WERE POUR INTO, UM, THE PROGRAMMATIC ADVERTISING, BUT THE ATTRIBUTION, UH, WHY SOME OF THAT, UH, SPEND WAS PLACED, UH, FOR SEARCH AND FOR, UH, FOR META ADVERTISING. UM, SO WHILE, WHILE WE CAN, YOU KNOW, WE CAN DO THE MATH ANY NUMBER OF DIFFERENT WAYS, UM, BUT ESSENTIALLY WHAT WE DO KNOW IS WHAT IT COSTS US TO GET A PERSON TO SEDONA. AND THAT COST OVER THE CAMPAIGN WAS $17 AND 95 CENTS. SO IF WE'RE JUST LOOKING AT THE DOLLARS THAT WERE SPENT ON THE PROGRAMMATIC, UM, SIDE OF THINGS, THAT PROGRAMMATIC SPEND YIELDED AN ADDITIONAL, UH, ROUGHLY 1100, UM, VISITOR DAYS WITH THAT EXTRA SPEND. UM, AND, UH, SO WHAT WE'VE ALSO BEEN ABLE TO DO, UM, SINCE THE LAST TIME WE MET IS WE WERE ABLE TO APPLY SOME, UH, DEGREE OF ATTRIBUTION TOWARDS META IN SEARCH, WHICH, UM, WE, WE CAN, UM, DISCUSS IN MORE DETAIL, I THINK DURING THE, UM, SOME PART OF THE WINTER, UH, CAMPAIGN, UM, TALKING ABOUT JUST WHY WE'RE PLACING CERTAIN DOLLARS IN CERTAIN PLACES. BUT ESSENTIALLY THAT'S THE, THAT'S THE NET THERE, UM, THAT, UH, THAT VISITOR DAYS JUST APPLIED FOR THE $20,000 FOR THE PROGRAMMATIC ADVERTISING. THANKS. OKAY, SO HERE'S OUR META CAMPAIGN RESULTS. YOU CAN SEE THAT WE EXCEEDED THE PREVIOUS CAMPAIGN IN ALL CATEGORIES, WHICH MAKES SENSE CONSIDERING THE EXTRA SPEND THAT WE HAD. WE ALSO HAD GREAT CLICK THROUGH RATE AND COST PER CLICK. OKAY, SO HERE'S THE ATTRIBUTION RESULTS THAT I WAS MENTIONING BEFORE ON HOW I GOT THAT ROAS. UM, THIS IS FOR THE DESTINATION. SO YOU CAN SEE THAT, UM, THERE'S TWO DIFFERENT CATEGORIES HERE. THIS IS THE RESULTS FOR THE WEB ADS THAT ARE ATTRIBUTION BASED. AND THEN THE CTV ADS. UM, YOU CAN SEE THERE'S ABOUT 4,300 VISITOR DAYS OBSERVED FROM THE WEB ADS. SO THAT'S, THAT PERSON SAW THAT AD, UM, WHEREVER THEIR HOME LOCATION IS, AND THEN THEY WERE OBSERVED IN THE MARKET. UM, AND THEN YOU MULTIPLY THAT BY THAT VISITOR DAY SPEND OF $190 A DAY, AND YOU GET THAT ESTIMATED CAMPAIGN IMPACT THERE, UM, AT THE BOTTOM LEFT. SAME FOR THE CTV CAMPAIGN. AND WHAT'S REALLY INTERESTING HERE IS THAT, UM, CTV PERFORMED REALLY WELL, UM, AND WE'RE GONNA SEE THAT, UH, IN THE FOLLOWING SLIDES AS WELL. UM, AS FAR AS HOW WE THOUGHT IT WAS GOING TO PERFORM, UH, WE, WE KNEW IT WAS GOING TO BE AN AWARENESS BASED MARKETING, SO TO, TO MAKE PEOPLE AWARE OF THE DESTINATION. UM, WE DID NOT EXPECT THAT IT WOULD ACTUALLY RESULT IN AS MANY PEOPLE AS IT DID ACTUALLY COMING INTO THE DESTINATION BASED ON, UM, SEEING THE VIDEO WHEN I ASKED DVA ABOUT THAT, THEY, UM, ATTRIBUTED THAT TO, UM, THE, UH, THE TYPE OF CONTENT THAT WE CREATED, UM, THAT IT WAS A REALLY GREAT, UM, AND COMPELLING VIDEO WITH REALLY GREAT IMAGERY, WHICH WE ALL KNOW EXISTS HERE. OKAY, SO HERE'S THE ATTRIBUTION RESULTS, UM, TO THE DESTINATION. THIS IS THE, THE BREAKDOWN. UM, AND NONE OF THOSE ARE GOING TO BE A SURPRISE TO ANYONE. UM, WHAT I DO WANNA CALL OUT IS THAT THE AVERAGE LENGTH OF STATE INCREASE FROM 1.7 TO TWO DAYS OVER THE WINTER CAMPAIGN, WHICH WAS REALLY NICE TO SEE. UM, YOU KNOW, FOR A WHILE THERE WE HAD KIND OF SEEN IT DIPPING INTO THE, YOU KNOW, ONE POINT, UH, SEVEN, 1.8 RANGE. SO IT'S NICE TO SEE IT BACK UP. I HOPE THAT'S A TREND THAT WE'LL CONTINUE TO SEE. HERE'S THE ATTRIBUTION RESULTS FOR THE HOTELS. YOU CAN SEE AGAIN THAT THE CTV, THOSE BOTTOM RIGHT AND BOTTOM LEFT NUMBERS [01:50:01] ARE PRETTY CLOSE, WHICH IS REALLY GREAT TO SEE THAT CTV IS PERFORMING AS WELL AS IT IS. UM, AND NOW YOU CAN SEE, UH, THAT, UM, THE OVERNIGHT STAYS INCREASED FROM ABOUT 2.1 DAYS TO 2.3 COMPARED TO THE WINTER CAMPAIGN. THAT'S GREAT. UM, PHOENIX, THAT'S REALLY NICE TO SEE THAT PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY STAYING HERE FROM PHOENIX. UM, UM, BUT ALSO OBVIOUSLY LA TUCSON, VEGAS, ET CETERA. OKAY, SO THIS IS THE SHORT TERM RENTAL. UM, THIS IS A LOWER NUMBER, BUT IT'S STILL INTERESTING. AND THIS IS SOMETHING WE'RE GONNA KEEP, UM, UH, WORKING WITH, UH, BECAUSE I THINK THE, IN THE, THE DATA IS INTERESTING ON SHORT TERM RENTALS. UM, ESPECIALLY LOOK AT THAT AVERAGE LENGTH OF STAY. UM, IT'S 20%, 26% GREATER THAN TRADITIONAL LODGING. UH, IF THIS IS A TREND THAT WE'RE GOING TO CONTINUE TO SEE, UM, MORE UPTICK OF OUR SHORT TERM RENTALS, UM, COMPARED TO TRADITIONAL LODGING, THAT'S, THAT COULD BE A DIFFERENT TYPE OF VISITOR AS WELL. SO JUST SOMETHING TO KEEP AN EYE ON. UM, AND AN INTERESTING STAT THAT WE'RE FOLLOWING. OKAY, SO THIS IS ROI, SO REMEMBER THAT ROI IS HOTEL SLASH SHORT-TERM RENTAL IMPACT PLUS THE DESTINATION IMPACT MINUS THE AD SPEND DIVIDED BY AD SPEND. SO HOW THAT'S DIFFERENT THAN ROW ADS IS THAT YOU DON'T SUBTRACT THE AD SPEND OUT OF THAT, UM, NUMERATOR, UH, WITH ROAS, BUT WITH ROI YOU DO, YOU CAN SEE THAT TUCSON, PHOENIX, LA, VEGAS, SAN DIEGO, DENVER AND CHICAGO ARE OUR HIGHEST RETURNING MARKETS WITH DENVER BEING OUR BEST FLIGHT MARKET, DESPITE THE SPEND BEING TURNED OFF THERE. UM, SOMETHING INTERESTING ABOUT THE PHOENIX SPEND IS THAT COMPARED TO TUCSON, UM, HOW WELL THE ROI WAS FOR TUCSON, UH, IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'RE GONNA KEEP AN EYE ON IN FUTURE MARKETING NOT TO OVERSPEND IN PHOENIX AND TO POTENTIALLY SPEND MORE IN TUCSON BECAUSE IT DID SO WELL. OKAY, SO HERE'S PAID SEARCH RESULTS. UM, I KIND OF MENTIONED THIS ON THE, UM, FIRST SLIDE WHEN I TALKED ABOUT THE RESULTS, BUT WE HAD A GREAT CLICK THROUGH RATE OF 5.75%. THIS WAS UP FROM THE WINTER AND IS NOW ABOVE THE BENCHMARK. AND THAT WAS A GOAL, UM, BECAUSE WE DIDN'T HIT THAT IN THE WINTER. SO WE REALLY TRIED TO REFINE THE STRATEGY THERE, UM, TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DID GET ABOVE THE BENCHMARK. SO HERE'S THE AIRPORT BANNER. UM, THIS WAS PURELY BRAND AWARENESS, UM, AND IT WAS TO INSPIRE TRIPS TO SEDONA RIGHT THEN OR IN THE NEAR FUTURE. UM, IT WAS PLAYED OVER A HUNDRED THOUSAND TIMES IN THE FIVE WEEKS AND IT HAD 4.2 MILLION IMPRESSIONS. OKAY, SO HERE'S OUR KEY TAKEAWAYS. LIKE I SAID, REDEFINED FAMILY TIME AS A CONSISTENT TOP PERFORMER. UM, DENVER WAS THE BEST FLIGHT MARKET. BIG DATA CHANGES WILL CONTINUE TO AFFECT OUR FUTURE CAMPAIGNS. META AND PAID SEARCH ADS PERFORMED REALLY WELL. UM, LIKE I SAID, WE REP, WE IMPROVED ON OUR PAID SEARCH STRATEGY THIS TIME AROUND. UM, GOING FORWARD, UM, CHRISTIAN ALLUDED TO THIS, BUT WE'LL HAVE AN ATTRIBUTION THROUGH, UM, THE PAID SEARCH AND META CHANNELS THROUGH A PIXEL WEBSITE OR THROUGH A WEBSITE PIXEL. SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS IF YOU GET SERVED AN ADD-ON META AND YOU ACTUALLY CLICK THROUGH TO THE WEBSITE, THERE WILL BE A PIXEL ON THERE THAT WILL SAY THIS PERSON IN THEIR HOME LOOKED AT IT, AND THEN IT WILL TELL ME IF THEY ENDED UP IN MARKET THE SAME WAY THAT OUR WEB-BASED ADS DO ATTRIBUTION. UM, NOW THE THING ABOUT THIS IS IT'S A DEEPER, A DEEPER TYPE OF ATTRIBUTION AND THAT IT'S NOT JUST, IT WON'T TELL ME IF THEY SAW THE ADD-ON META AND THEY ENDED UP IN MARKET. IT'S NOT THAT IT'S, IF THEY SAW THE ADD-ON META, THEY CLICKED ALL THE WAY THROUGH THE WEBSITE, NOT ALL THE WAY, BUT ONE CLICK INTO THE WEBSITE, UM, AND THEN THEY ACTUALLY ENDED UP IN MARKET. SO THAT IS SOMETHING THAT I'LL BE BRINGING FORWARD IN FUTURE CAMPAIGNS. UM, AND THEN THE LAST THING WAS, AS I'VE SAID MANY TIMES THAT CTV WAS VERY EFFECTIVE. SO WITH THAT, ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT PORTION OF THE PRESENTATION? KATHY, YOU SAID THE, UH, REDEFINE FAMILY TIME WAS THE HIGHEST PERFORMER AD WHY, WHAT, HOW DO YOU AT ATTRIBUTE THAT THAT ONE'S THE HIGHEST? OH, UH, HOW IS THAT MEASURED? HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT ONE IS THE HIGHEST? RIGHT. CHRISTIAN, I'M GONNA LET YOU TAKE THAT ONE. YEAH, WE LOOKED AT, UH, JUST SORT OF THE TRADITIONAL A PERFORMANCE METRICS OF CLICK-THROUGH RATE AND COST PER CLICK. ALSO, UM, WE [01:55:01] KIND OF HAD A BARE MINIMUM OF IMPRESSIONS. YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE LOOKING AT IT THROUGH, YOU KNOW, WHICH ADS ARE BEING SERVED THE MOST, AND THEN LOOKING AT THOSE CLICK-THROUGH RATES AND THOSE COSTS TO DETERMINE WHAT, WHAT WAS PERFORMING. AND THAT MAY NOT HAVE BEEN SERVED THE MOST, BUT IT, IT WAS SORT OF IN THE TOP TIER OF, UH, NUMBER OF TIMES THAT APP WAS SERVED OR SEEN AND, UH, CONTINUED TO YEAH, HAVE GREAT, UH, CLICK-THROUGH RATES TO THE SITE AND, AND AT A REALLY, UM, UH, EFFICIENT COST. SO LET ME ASK THIS. SO IF YOU, SO REDEFINE YOUR SUMMER VERSUS REDEFINE FAMILY, YOU KNOW THAT SOMEBODY OPENED THAT AD AND THEN THEY SHOWED UP IN SEDONA. YES, THAT'S CORRECT. WE WERE ABLE TO SEE THAT SPECIFIC ONE, YOU KNOW, THAT REDEFINED FAMILY SHOWED UP HERE IN SEDONA MORE THAN REDEFINE SANCTUARY. YEAH, SO THE, THE, AND THIS IS A NEW, UM, PIECE TO THE ATTRIBUTION, UH, DASHBOARD. WE'RE NOW ABLE TO TRACK ATTRIBUTION TO THE AD, UH, TO THE SPECIFIC AD, UM, WHETHER, YOU KNOW, WHETHER THAT BE THE SIZE, THE MESSAGING OR WHATEVER. SO WE'RE, WE'RE ABLE TO APPLY SORT OF TWO DIFFERENT VIEWS OF PERFORMANCE, BOTH ATTRIBUTION PERFORMANCE, BUT ALSO, UM, TRADITIONAL ADVERTISING PERFORMANCE. IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, WE WERE LOOKING AT ADVERTISING PERFORMANCE, NOT THE PERFORMANCE OF BRINGING PEOPLE INTO THE MARKET. IT WAS A NEW FEATURE THAT WAS JUST ROLLED OUT ABOUT A MONTH AND A HALF AGO. SO WE'VE BEEN SORT OF MAKING SURE IT'S, UM, JUST MAKING SURE IT'S GIVING US ACCURATE DATA BEFORE WE DIVE INTO HOW DID THIS APP DRIVE ACTION WITH, YOU KNOW, WITHIN SEDONA. BUT THAT'LL BE ANOTHER PIECE THAT WE CAN REPORT ON, UM, BEYOND SORT OF, AGAIN, THE TRADITIONAL MARKETING, UM, KPIS. THANK YOU. I APPRECIATE THAT LEVEL OF, OF, YOU KNOW, DETAIL. I THINK THAT'S HELPFUL. UM, DIFFERENT QUESTION NOW ON THE SLIDE SLIDE. WHAT SLIDE? SORRY? IT WAS A SLIDE THAT TALKED ABOUT THE 50,000, HERE IT IS. SLIDE FIVE, I THINK THAT IS. YEAH, YEAH, IT IS. UM, THE SPEND WAS AN EXTRA $50,000, BUT THE NUMBERS ACTUALLY ADD UP TO MORE THAN THAT. SO I WAS JUST WONDERING, OH, NO, THAT'S MY GREATEST FEAR. , I MEAN, UNLESS MY MATH IS WAY OFF. IT LOOKS LIKE THIS IS COMING UP TO 58,000, 40, 55, 58. THE BANNERS UNDER THERE. 58. YEAH, 58. SO LEMME JUST CROSS CHECK IT. GIMME A, SORRY, SORRY. I, I BELIEVE, UH, THE META ADS WERE NOT, UH, FUNDED AT THAT LEVEL. I BELIEVE THAT IS, UH, WHERE THE DIFFERENCES, UM, I THINK THAT WAS CLOSER TO 12 I WANT TO SAY. OKAY, THANK YOU. THAT ANSWERS THE QUESTION THEN. THAT'S GREAT. UM, AND THE LAST QUESTION THAT I HAVE ON THIS PORTION IS THE $17 AND 95 CENTS THAT IT STATED IT COSTS SOMEONE TO GET INTO SEDONA OR SOMEONE TO GET INTO SEDONA PER DAY. SO IF SOMEBODY COMES FOR THREE DAYS, IT'S COSTING COST TO ATTRACT SOMEONE TO THE DESTINATION. OKAY. SO WE TOOK THE TOTAL AD SPEND AND DIVIDED THAT BY THE TOTAL NUMBER OF VISITOR DAYS THAT THE CAMPAIGN YIELDED AND THAT COST, THAT THAT ACQUISITION COST MM-HMM . TO GET SOMEONE INTO THE DESTINATION THAT'S, THAT'S THAT SEVEN, THAT $18 ESSENTIALLY MM-HMM . SO IN, IF THIS WAS, IF THE PROGRAM, NOT THAT IT IS, BUT IF IT WAS SELF-FUNDING, WE WOULD NEED TO HAVE SOMEBODY COME IN AND SPEND ENOUGH TO RESULT IN MORE THAN 1795 IN TAX REVENUE TO US TO, FOR THAT TO BE, TO PUT THE PROGRAM IN THE BLACK. IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S A WEIRD WAY OF LOOKING AT IT, BUT MY MIND WENT THERE, SO I FIGURED, I DON'T THINK I CAN LOOK AT IT LIKE THAT. RIGHT. I'M GONNA HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT. OKAY. THAT FAIR ENOUGH. LET ME, I MIGHT HAVE TO GET BACK TO YOU ON THAT AFTER, I'M JUST LOOKING, I'M LOOKING TO GET LIKE A SPEND RATE AND YOU KNOW, ON THE RETURN RATES WE KEEP TALKING ABOUT THE RETURN ON INVESTMENT AND DIFFERENT WAYS THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT, AND I WAS TRYING TO GET THE RETURN ON INVESTMENT. I WAS TRYING TO SIMPLIFY IT DOWN TO OUR SPEND PER PERSON TO GET THEM HERE. SO MM-HMM . UM, LET ME, THAT, THAT'S REALLY WHAT I WANNA THINK ABOUT. [02:00:01] I'D LIKE TO FOLLOW UP WITH YOU ON THAT. OKAY, GREAT. SO THAT I CAN THANK YOU. UNDER UNPACK THAT A LITTLE BIT, DEREK, IS THERE ANY SORT OF MARGIN FOR ERROR THAT'S ACCEPTED IN THE INDUSTRY? I MEAN, IF JUST BECAUSE SOMEBODY CLICKS ON A WEBSITE AND CLICKS ON A LINK AND LOOKS AT AN AD AND THEN ENDS UP IN MARKET, I MEAN, THAT COULD BE CAUSATION OR IT COULD BE CORRELATION. SO I MEAN, IS THERE ANY SORT OF ASSUMED, OKAY, YOU KNOW, THIS PERCENTAGE OF THESE PEOPLE ENDED UP IN MARKET BECAUSE OF THIS AD VERSUS SOMEBODY WHO WAS THINKING ABOUT COMING TO SEDONA, LOOKED UP SEDONA, AND LOOKED AT A COUPLE ADS AND WAS LIKE, WELL, GREAT, I'M GOING THERE ANYWAY. I MEAN, YEAH, ANDREW AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS PHILOSOPHY A LOT OF, UM, WHILE WE DON'T THINK THAT WE ARE IMPACTFUL ENOUGH TO SAY THAT OUR AD EXCLUSIVELY MADE IT SO THAT THEY BOUGHT A TICKET AND CAME TO SEDONA, UM, AT THE VERY LEAST WE'RE CONFIDENT THAT WE CAN SAY THAT WE, UM, IMPACTED THEIR DECISION AND THAT, ESPECIALLY WITH OUR SUSTAINABILITY MESSAGING THAT WE AT, AT THE VERY LEAST SHOWED THEM HOW WE WANT THEM TO ACT WHEN THEY'RE HERE. OKAY, THANK YOU. AND THAT'S FOR THE TERM. MAY I ALSO ADD THIS IS, THIS IS ALSO NEW FROM, FROM, FOR THIS CAMPAIGN. SO DATA FI, UM, DOES WHAT'S CALLED INCREMENTAL LIFT. AND WHAT INCREMENTAL LIFT PROVIDES IS EXACTLY THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION. HOW, HOW EFFECTIVE IS MARKETING AT GENERATING VISITATION? SO THE WAY THAT WORKS IS THERE ARE AUDIENCES BASICALLY, UM, SET UP THAT, UM, IF SORT OF A A A TEST AUDIENCE THAT IS NOT BEING SERVED, THE ADS, AND THEN THE PROPENSITY OF THAT AUDIENCE TO SHOW UP VERSUS AUDIENCES THAT ARE SEEING THE ADS AND THAT PROPENSITY TO SHOW UP. UM, I DON'T KNOW THE DETAILS OF EXACTLY HOW YOU SEGMENT EACH OF THOSE AUDIENCES, BUT WHAT IT ESSENTIALLY TELLS YOU IS WHAT WAS THE IMPACT OF THE MARKETING, IF EVERYTHING, YOU KNOW, IF, IF IT WAS JUST BASED ON THE MARKETING AND THEN THIS, IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE FOR THIS PARTICULAR CAMPAIGN, WHAT WE SAW WAS AN INCREMENTAL, UM, LIFT OF, UH, 13 TO ONE. WHAT THAT MEANS IS SOMEONE WHO SAW AN AD WAS 13 TIMES MORE LIKELY TO SHOW UP IN THE DESTINATION THAN SOMEONE WHO WAS NOT. SO, UH, WHEN WE LOOK AT THE INCREMENTAL LIFT OF THESE ARE AD EXPOSED PEOPLE WHO, UM, WERE DEEMED TO, TO NOT BE LOOKING AT COMING TO SEDONA, WHO SAW AN AD, WHO THEN SHOWED UP OF THAT TOTAL VISITATION NUMBER, IT'S ALMOST 2,800 PEOPLE. UM, WITH, AND WHEN YOU APPLY, YOU KNOW, ALL OF THE, THE EFFORT OR, OR THE DOLLARS THAT THOSE PEOPLE GENERATED IN THE COMMUNITY, IT'S, AGAIN, IT'S PRETTY SUBSTANTIAL. AND JUST ON THAT INCREMENTAL LIFT, WE'RE SEEING A ROW AS OF ABOUT EIGHT TO ONE. SO THAT'S, UM, THAT WAS NOT AVAILABLE, UM, DATA IN THE PREVIOUS WINTER CAMPAIGN. SO I THINK THAT'S A REALLY GOOD MARKER FOR SUCCESS, AS I WOULD SAY, IS LOOKING AT WHAT DOES THAT INCREMENTAL LIFT LOOK LIKE, UM, BECAUSE TRULY THAT'S AFFECTING PEOPLE TO MAKE A DECISION TO COME TO SEDONA. SO, I MEAN, IT SOUNDS LIKE WE SHOULD BE BASING THESE DECISIONS ON THE INCREMENTAL LIFT AS OPPOSED TO THE BA THE CONTROL GROUP OR YOU KNOW, WHATEVER THE, I DON'T KNOW RIGHT TERM FOR THAT, BUT, UH, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE'RE BASING THIS ON REALISTIC NUMBERS ABOUT THE RETURN WE'RE GETTING. I SUPPOSE TO BE CLEAR, THE THE, ALL THE ATTRIBUTION IS ONE TO ONE, IT'S NOT EXTRAPOLATED. SO THERE, THERE MAY BE SOME DIFFERENT, UH, IMPACTS THAT GET PEOPLE TO THE DESTINATION, BUT ONCE THEY SHOW UP IN THE DESTINATION, IT'S NOT, UH, THERE'S NO MAGIC FORMULA BEING APPLIED TO, UM, HOW LONG THEY STAYED AND WHERE THEY STAYED AND WHETHER THEY SHOWED UP OR NOT. IT'S, IT'S, IT'S A ONE TO ONE ATTRIBUTION. YES, SIR. PETE, THANK YOU. I THANK YOU, MAYOR. BOY, THIS IS GONNA BE DIFFICULT TO SHIFT MY BRAIN. UH, THANKS FOR THAT QUESTION, COUNSELOR. I THINK IT'S VERY SIMILAR LINES OF QUESTIONS I'VE ASKED IN THE PAST. SO NOW I, I JUST WANNA BE CLEAR ABOUT MY UNDERSTANDING PERHAPS OF WHAT YOU WERE MENTIONING ABOUT THE INCREMENTAL LIFT. SO BACK IN THE DAY WHEN I USED TO VISIT SEDONA, I WOULD BOOK A TRIP TO SEDONA MONTHS IN ADVANCE. AND NOW IN TODAY'S WORLD, HAD I DONE THAT AND I, SORRY, SORRY, SORRY SIR. AND I SEE AN AD FOR SEDONA, [02:05:01] I WOULD LIKELY CLICK ON IT TO SAY, HEY, WHAT'S GOING ON? I'M GOING THERE IN FOUR MONTHS OR ONE MONTH BASED ON THE TIMING OF OUR CAMPAIGNS. AND THEN IF I SHOWED UP IN THE, IN SEDONA AND STARTED TO SPEND, YOU WOULD CALL THAT A SUCCESS IN THE ROAS CALCULATION. IS THAT RIGHT? SO I CAME TO SI DECIDED TO COME TO SDA LONG BEFORE I SAW THE AD, BUT I CALLED THE AD, CLICKED ON IT PERHAPS, AND THEN CAME TO SEDONA IF YOU WERE IN OUR TARGET MARKET AND THEN THE THIS INCREMENTAL LIFT IS ONE EFFORT AT TRYING TO CORRECT FOR THAT A LITTLE BIT SOMEWHAT. IS THAT WHAT I'M HEARING, THAT WE WON'T ATTRIBUTE A HUNDRED PERCENT OF THAT CLICK THROUGH OR THAT'S CORRECT. YEAH. IT'S, IT'S ESSENTIALLY, YEAH, HOW DO WE, HOW DO WE ACCOUNT FOR THE FACT THAT YES, SOME DEGREE OF THE PEOPLE THAT DO SEE THE ADS MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE BEEN PLANNING A TRIP. THE INCREMENTAL LIFT IS A MEANS TO DIVIDE AND SEGMENT AUDIENCES IN SUCH A WAY, UM, GIVEN SEARCH HISTORIES AND ALL SORTS OF OTHER ELEMENTS TO TRY TO PROVIDE, YOU KNOW, HERE'S, YOU KNOW, HERE IS, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THE EFFORTS, UH, IF IT'S NOT BASED ON IMPRESSIONS, WHICH IS WHAT, YOU KNOW, IMPRESSIONS AND CLICKS, WHICH IS CURRENT, YOU KNOW, THE STANDARD ATTRIBUTION MODELS BASED OFF OF. OKAY. AND THEN DID I UNDERSTAND, DID I HEAR YOU CORRECTLY SAYING THAT YOU'VE GOT THIS INCREMENTAL LIFT? IT'S NOT, WE'RE NOT DECREMENTING OUR NUMBERS BY THIS INCREMENTAL LIFT YET, BUT WE WILL GOING FORWARD SOMEHOW I THINK IT'S A GOOD THING TO JUST INCLUDE IN THE CONVERSATION. I THINK, UM, YOU KNOW, I MEAN THERE IT'S UP TO COUNCIL AND, AND THE TEAM, UM, TO DECIDE EXACTLY WHAT THE, THE MEASURING STICK SHOULD BE. I THINK THAT THERE ARE, UH, TO LAUREN'S POINT, A MULTITUDE OF TOUCH POINTS THAT GETS SOMEONE, UM, INTO THE DESTINATION. UM, INCREMENTAL LIFT JUST SHOWS PROBABLY THE MOST CONSERVATIVE APPROACH TO WHAT'S, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S BEING DRIVEN BY BY MARKETING. BUT IT'S, UM, YEAH, I MEAN I, I THINK IT'S AN INTERESTING, UH, DATA POINT FOR THE CONVERSATION IN TERMS OF EXACTLY WHAT WAS ASKED, YOU KNOW, HOW DO WE REALLY KNOW WHAT'S, WHAT IMPACT, UH, MARKETING IS HAVING? AND GIVEN THAT WE TEND TO SIT HERE AND HAVE THESE CONVERSATIONS LIKE RIGHT BEFORE THE CAMPAIGN, I WOULD SAY THAT THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT WE'RE GONNA REACH IT MIGHT BE EVEN BE HIGHER THAN THE INCREMENTAL LIFT NUMBER BECAUSE PEOPLE PLAN TO TRAVEL, THEY COME TO SEDONA, IT'S A NOT AN INEXPENSIVE DESTINATION TO COME TO. SO THERE MIGHT BE SOME, UH, YOU KNOW, I JUST DON'T WANNA OVERSTATE THE VALUE OF OUR ACTIVITY WHEN WE KNOW THAT IT'S NOT NECESSARILY THE RIGHT THING. SO THANK YOU BRIAN. THANK YOU, MAYOR. BUT AT THE SAME TIME, IMPRESSIONS DON'T GET PULLED INTO THE ROW AS NO. OKAY. SO IN A WORLD OF MULTI LEAD ATTRIBUTION, WHICH IS LIKE THE HOLY GRAIL, IF YOU CAN EVER SOLVE THAT FOR AS MUCH AS THIS, UM, UPLIFT IS, UM, GOING CONSERVATIVE, ONE COULD ALSO ARGUE, ARGUE THAT THERE IS STILL CONSIDERABLE OTHER VALUE CREATED BY THE PROGRAM THAT YOU'RE NOT MEASURING BECAUSE PEOPLE CAN, AN AN IMPRESSION COULD LEAD TO ACTION JUST NOT THROUGH THAT CHANNEL AT THAT TIME. SO YEAH, SOMETHING THAT WE ALWAYS TRY TO DO IS TO BE AS CONSERVATIVE AS WE CAN BE AND NOT TRY TO OVERSELL. I WOULD ALSO STATE THE FACT THAT THE ATTRIBUTION PERIOD IS ONLY FOR THE CAMPAIGN PERIOD. UM, TYPICALLY WE WOULD TRACK THE ATTRIBUTION AFTER THE CAMPAIGN BECAUSE I THINK, UM, TO, TO THE POINT THAT WAS RAISED EARLIER, UM, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE MAY COME LATER, THEY MAY COME BEFORE, THEY MAY HAVE PLANNED BEFORE, BUT THAT ADVERTISING THAT WE'RE DOING CURRENTLY MAY SPARK INTEREST FOR SUMMER NEXT YEAR OR, AND, AND THAT ISN'T CAPTURED IN HOW WE LOOK AT ATTRIBUTION BECAUSE IT'S SUCH A COM UH, A VERY SPECIFIC WINDOW JUST ASSOCIATED WITH, UH, THE CAMPAIGN, UH, FLIGHT DATES. CORRECT, MELISSA? SO THIS IS NOT SPECIFICALLY ON THE AD CAMPAIGNS, BUT IT'S ON THE FACT THAT WE ALSO GET NON AD SPEND ADVERTISING VIA ARTICLES THAT ARE [02:10:01] BEING WRITTEN ABOUT US, UM, IN VARIOUS PLACES. ARE WE DOING ANYTHING THAT MEASURES WHETHER OR NOT SOMEBODY READS AN ARTICLE IN MEN'S JOURNAL AND DECIDES THAT THAT WOULD BE A WAY THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO COME HERE? SO THERE'S REALLY NO WAY, TO MY KNOWLEDGE, TO LOOK AT, AT ATTRIBUTION BASED RESULTS FROM PUBLICATIONS THAT WE HAVE NO AFFILIATION OTHER THAN WE PARTNER WITH THEM. UM, WE ARE NOW TRACKING EVERY PIECE OF COVERAGE THAT COMES VIA PRESS TRIPS THAT WE ORGANIZE OR BACKGROUND THAT WE PROVIDE. UM, SO ESSENTIALLY ARTICLES THAT WE'VE HAD AN INFLUENCE IN, UM, AND THOSE USE THAT KIND OF INDUSTRY STANDARD OF, UM, ADVERTISING VALUE EQUIVALENT A VE. UM, I'M VERY SKEPTICAL OF A VE. UM, IT COMES UP VERY, VERY HIGH, BUT THAT IS THE INDUSTRY STANDARD ON HOW YOU WOULD REPORT THAT. UM, BUT I DO THINK TO COUNCIL FURMAN'S POINT, YOU KNOW, IT'S THOSE TYPES OF ARTICLES THAT ARE ALSO VERY TOP OF THE FUNNEL AND THE SAME WAY THAT IMPRESSIONS ARE. UM, WE'RE NOT TAKING OWNERSHIP OF THAT AS AN ATTRIBUTABLE TRIP, AT LEAST IN OUR CURRENT REPORTING. AND WE REALLY ARE LIMITING OUR, YOU KNOW, ATTRIBUTION TO THE THINGS THAT WE CAN MANAGE ONE-TO-ONE TO CHRISTIAN'S POINT. ARE THERE ANY, UM, IS THERE ANY CONSIDERATION ABOUT INCLUDING THEM AT SOME POINT IN TIME JUST SO WE HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF HOW MUCH IS SEDONA BEING MENTIONED IN THE PRESS VIA ARTICLES VIA, UM, SOCIAL MEDIA WITH INFLUENCERS, UM, SORT OF ALL OF THOSE THINGS BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE TOUCH A CERTAIN NUMBER OF PEOPLE AND THOSE PEOPLE MAY NOW BE THINKING, MAYBE I'LL COME TO SEDONA. SO WHEN WE LOOK AT VISITOR RATES, JUST HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING, I REALIZE WE CAN'T DO A ONE-TO-ONE ATTRIBUTION. UM, AND WHO KNOWS IN THE FUTURE IF WE'RE GONNA BE ABLE TO DO AN ATTRIBUTION ONE-TO-ONE EVEN ON THINGS LIKE CLICK-THROUGHS BASED ON DATA PRIVACY, WHICH SEEMS KIND OF WEIRD THAT THAT'S HAPPENING. BUT, UM, HOW ARE WE, HOW ARE WE THINKING ABOUT THAT ACTUALLY, NOT WE, YOU, YEAH. HOW ARE YOU THINKING ABOUT TO, TO TAKE THIS SORT OF FREE ADVERTISING AND AT LEAST LET ALL OF US KNOW, ARE WE GETTING, ARE WE GETTING MORE OF IT? IS IT, WHEN DOES IT HAPPENING? DO WE SEE LIKE MORE VISITORS COMING AFTER WE KNOW THAT SOME OF THIS HAS COME OUT? I DON'T KNOW IF THAT MAKES ANY SENSE, BUT NO, IT MAKES PERFECT SENSE. UM, WE STARTED WORKING WITH A PR PLATFORM CALLED MUCKRACK, UM, ON JULY ONE. UH, AS PART OF KIND OF THE CONTINUE GROW OUT OF THE WORK PLAN, UM, ANY ARTICLE THAT WE'VE INFLUENCED, AS I MENTIONED, WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO FLAG THAT IN A REPORTING SYSTEM AND WE'RE SETTING UP WITH THE MUCKRACK TEAM. THEY'RE HELPING US SORT OF GO THROUGH IT. SO IT'S BEING BUILT OUT AT THE MOMENT. BUT, UM, THERE'S WAYS TO CREATE KIND OF CUSTOM SEARCHES THAT KIND OF REMOVE THINGS LIKE CITY COUNCIL, YOU KNOW, POLICE 'CAUSE THAT'LL COME UP. SO WE KIND OF GO THROUGH SOME SEARCHES TO MAKE SURE THESE ARE REALLY TOURISM RELATED ARTICLES. BUT, UM, BY THE END OF THE FISCAL YEAR, WE WILL HAVE A REPORT THAT TALKS ABOUT MENTIONS OF SEDONA FROM A TOURISM STANDPOINT. UM, AND THEN I'M WORKING ON WAYS TO FLAG, AGAIN, ARTICLES THAT WE'VE HAD AN INFLUENCE IN, IN TERMS OF PRESS TRIPS AND THEN ALSO KINDA GIVING BACKGROUND. SO THAT'S KIND OF MY GOAL FOR THE END OF THE FISCAL FISCAL YEAR IS TO HAVE A FY 26, UM, BASICALLY EARNED MEDIA REPORT. UM, AND THEN WE ARE WORKING TO GO BACK TO FY 25 AS WELL. SO IT'S VERY MUCH IN THE WORK PLAN THIS YEAR. THANK YOU. I HAVE A COUPLE QUESTIONS. UH, SINCE THE ATTRI ATTRIBUTION RESULTS SHOW THAT PHOENIX AND PRESCOTT IS 67, AT LEAST FOR HOTEL, 67.3%, IT'S, AND TALKING TO HOTELIERS, THEY'RE SAYING THAT THAT, UM, PLANNING FOR VACATIONS HAS CHANGED AND THAT PEOPLE ARE DOING MORE SPONTANEOUS, LIKE, LET'S GO AWAY FOR THE WEEKEND. AND THINKING THAT THAT MARKET OF PHOENIX AND PRESCOTT MIGHT BE A MARKET WHERE THAT HAPPENS MORE THAN IF YOU'RE IN, YOU KNOW, SAN DIEGO OR DALLAS OR DENVER. UH, SO I, I THINK WE HAVE TO, AND I'M WITH YOU. I MEAN, I, I'M, I PLANNED VACATIONS TWO YEARS OUT. I THINK WE'RE A DIFFERENT GENERATION , AND SO PEOPLE WHO ARE GOING AWAY FOR THE WEEKEND AND DECIDE ON FRIDAY THEY'RE LEAVING. UH, BUT , UH, SO THAT WAS JUST ONE COMMENT I HAD. BUT IN TERMS OF THE AIRPORT, YOU KNOW, I WAS NEVER A BIG FAN OF THE AIRPORT BANNER, BUT I'VE, I DON'T KNOW, I THINK I'M CHANGING MY MIND. HOW DOES THAT WORK? 'CAUSE I DON'T SEE A QR CODE ON THERE. SO HOW DO WE KNOW ABOUT IMPRESSIONS? UM, THAT WAS JUST, UH, CALCULATING THE, UM, INBOUND FLIGHTS THAT COME IN AND GO DOWN THAT [02:15:01] ESCALATOR INTO BAGGAGE CLAIM THAT IT'S ESTIMATED THAT THAT MANY PEOPLE WENT DOWN INTO BAGGAGE CLAIM. SO HOW LONG DOES THE AD STAY THERE? 10 SECONDS, 15 SECONDS? IT ROTATES, RIGHT? IT IS, IT WAS QUITE SHORT. I BELIEVE IT WAS FIVE SECONDS UNTIL OH FIVE. YEAH. IS THAT STANDARD OR IS THERE A WAY IT COULD LAST LONGER IF YOU PAID MORE MONEY? OR HOW DOES THAT WORK? YES. YES. WHAT CAN YOU, WHAT, WHAT'S THE MAXIMUM? I DON'T KNOW. I DIDN'T ASK BECAUSE I ASSUMED IT WOULD BE THE CHEAPEST OPTION. MM-HMM . SINCE, UM, WE HAD NEVER DONE IT BEFORE. UM, BUT I CAN, I CAN ASK, WELL, HOW DO WE MEASURE WHETHER IT'S WORTH IT? UM, YOU ALSO ASKED ABOUT THIS IN YOUR QUESTIONS IN ADVANCE OF HOW TO MEASURE ROI AND COULD WE DO A QR CODE? WE CAN, I IMAGINE IT WILL KIND OF BE LIKE THE ATTRIBUTION THAT I MENTIONED WITH META AND, UM, PAID SEARCH OF IF THEY ACTUALLY GOT THEIR PHONE OUT, WENT THROUGH ALL, YOU'RE GOING DOWN THE ESCALATOR, YOU GOT ALL THIS STUFF WITH YOU, RIGHT? AND YOU'RE LIKE, WHERE'S MY PHONE? AND YOU'RE, AND YOU GET IT OUT. YOU ACTUALLY GET IT OUT IN TIME FOR THE AD TO STILL BE PLAYING AND TAKE THE PICTURE LAND ON THE WEBSITE, AND I GET, I GET THAT PIXEL FROM YOU, AND THEN I CAN TRACK IF YOU ENDED UP, UM, IN SEDONA. I, WE, WE COULD DO THAT. TOUGH. BUT IT IS TOUGH. AND I, I THINK THE RESULTS WILL BE, UM, INTERESTING, BUT PERHAPS NOT IMPRESSIVE. IT IS, IT'S WHY I ORIGINALLY PITCHED IT AS AWARENESS BASED MARKETING, BECAUSE I COULDN'T SELL IT AS ANYTHING, BUT THAT IT REALLY IS JUST PUTTING THE IDEA IN SOMEONE'S HEAD. OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON THIS SECTION? LET'S MOVE ON. OKAY. OH, SORRY, ANDREW. OKAY, SO NOW WE'RE GONNA DO THE WINTER CAMPAIGN STRATEGY, AND I'M GONNA HAVE ANDREW CHALK, UM, ON THE STATE OF THE INDUSTRY AND KIND OF SET THE, SET THE SCENE. SO WANTED TO SPEND A FEW MINUTES JUST TALKING ABOUT, UM, SOME NATIONAL TRENDS, SOME YEAR TO DATE SEDONA LODGING PERFORMANCE. UM, WANNA BRIEFLY TOUCH BASE ON CITY SALES AND BED TAX, AND THEN ALSO LOOK AT FUTURE BOOKING PACE. UM, SO JUST TO START WITH NATIONAL TRENDS, I WON'T SPEND A LOT OF TIME WITH THAT. I'M SURE WE'RE PRETTY INUNDATED WITH, UM, A LOT OF THIS. AND WE'VE HEARD ABOUT, UM, YOU KNOW, CHALLENGES WITH, WITH UNEMPLOYMENT. WE'VE HEARD ABOUT CHALLENGES WITH CONSUMER SENTIMENT. UM, THERE IS ONE SLIDE THAT I'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT, UH, WITH OUR, ONE OF OUR RESEARCH VENDORS, UH, TOURISM ECONOMICS, WHICH IS A SUBDIVISION OF OXFORD ECONOMICS. UM, AND THIS IS A SLIDE THAT REALLY KIND OF CAUGHT MY EYE, WHICH LOOKS AT, UM, IT'S, THIS IS A GRAPH PRODUCED BY OXFORD ECONOMICS, AND IT'S FOR CHANGES IN CONSUMER SPENDING FROM JANUARY TO JUNE SINCE OH SIX TO 25. UM, SO THIS IS NOT CALENDAR, FULL CALENDAR YEAR SPENDING. THIS IS JUST THE MONTHS OF JANUARY TO JUNE. SO WE CAN LOOK AT HOW IS 2025 COMPARING. UM, THERE HAVE ONLY BEEN THREE TIMES TIME SEQUENCES SINCE 2006 THAT THERE'S BEEN A DECLINE IN CONSUMER SPENDING FROM JANUARY TO JUNE COMPARED TO THE PREVIOUS YEAR. UM, THAT WAS THE OH EIGHT, ESSENTIALLY THE GREAT RECESSION. IT WAS COVID, WHICH AGAIN, IS INTERESTING. I FEEL LIKE IF WE SAW THE FULL CALENDAR YEAR FOR THAT, YOU WOULDN'T SEE C HAVE GONE DOWN AS FAR AS IT DID. I ALSO CAN, YOU KNOW, ACKNOWLEDGE THAT COVID IMPACTED SEDONA AS IT DID MANY WESTERN STATE DESTINATIONS WITH NAME RECOGNITION ADJACENT TO PUBLIC LANDS, UM, IN DIFFERENT WAYS THAN I THINK THE NATIONAL AVERAGE. AND NOW WE'RE LOOKING AT, UM, 2025. SO REALLY WHAT I'M TRYING TO SHOW YOU IS THAT, UM, WHERE WE ARE SITTING AT THE END OF JANUARY TO JUNE AND 25 LOOKS VERY SIMILAR TO THE CONSUMER SPENDING PATTERNS OF THE GREAT RECESSION, WHICH I KNOW WAS A TIME THAT IMPACTED THIS COMMUNITY QUITE A BIT, UM, IN TERMS OF, UM, ITS TOURISM ECONOMY. SO, UM, TO ME THIS HAS BEEN, YOU KNOW, THE BEST WAY THAT I'VE BEEN LOOKING AT A LOT OF THE NATIONAL DATA TO SAY, WHAT IS, WHAT DOES THIS MEAN FOR SEDONA? WHAT IS KIND OF THE SEDONA CONTEXT? UM, THEN I'M LOOKING AT, UM, HOTEL. UH, SO MOVING INTO LODGING PERFORMANCE. SO THIS FIRST CHART IS THE SEDONA PLUS STUDY AREA FROM SMITH TRAVEL RESEARCH, WHICH INCLUDES A COLLECTION OF HOTELS WITHIN CITY LIMITS, OAK CREEK CANYON AND ENCHANTMENT MIMO. UM, BUT, UH, REALLY WHAT I WANT TO DRAW YOUR ATTENTION TO, AND THIS IS YEAR TO DATE PERFORMANCE THROUGH AUGUST. THIS IS JANUARY THROUGH AUGUST OF 25. UM, DEMAND AT THE HOTELS WITHIN THE STUDY AREA WAS DOWN 5%, 5.3%. UM, SO THAT KIND OF SHOWS YOU THE IMPACTS TO THE NUMBERS OF PEOPLE. SO NUMBERS OF [02:20:01] VISITORS THAT ARE STAYING AT HOTELS. UM, OBVIOUSLY A DR, UM, HAS BEEN RAISED BY THE HOTELS TO MAKE SURE THAT REVENUE COMES IN ESSENTIALLY JUST 0.4% DOWN WITHIN THAT STUDY AREA. SO THAT KIND OF SHOWS YOU HOW THAT'S BEEN COUNTERBALANCED BY THE INDUSTRY. BUT JUST TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT WE HAVE SEEN LESS PEOPLE STAYING AT THE HOTELS WITHIN THE STUDY AREA FROM JANUARY TO AUGUST. IS POCO IN THAT DATASET? UM, POCO DIABLO WAS IN THE DATASET, UM, AS TERMS OF OCCUPANCY. UM, SO THE SUPPLY IN THE DATASET, UM, THEY CAME OUT IN JUNE, UH, WHICH WAS ONLY TWO MONTHS OF THE REPORTING IN THIS TIME SEQUENCE. BUT, UM, THAT'S ARTIFICIALLY LIFTED SUPPLY IN JUNE, JULY, AND AUGUST. AND WE WILL BE RELEASING THE AUGUST REPORT LATER THIS WEEK. UM, BUT THAT'S ESSENTIALLY ARTIFICIALLY RAISED THE OCCUPANCY IN THE SEDONA PLUS AREA. I DUNNO IF IT'S HAD A MAJOR IMPACT ON THE YEAR TO DATE PERFORMANCE, BUT IF YOU DO LOOK AT ANYTHING AFTER JUNE OR LATER, UM, OCCUPANCY WILL, IF YOU DO THE MATH ON WHAT WAS OCCUPANCY, WHAT WAS A DR, WHAT WAS REVENUE A YEAR OVER YEAR, THEY WON'T QUITE ADD UP BECAUSE ABOUT 5% IS BEING LIFTED UP. DO YOU HAVE A FOLLOW UP QUESTION, BRIAN OR MAYOR QUESTION? YEAH. SO ANDREW, THE REVPAR THOUGH IS UP 3.3%. SO IS THAT THE POCO DIABLO EFFECT? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? IS REVPAR BEING UP, BUT REVENUE BEING DOWN DOESN'T, DOESN'T JIVE? YEP. UM, I DON'T BELIEVE THAT'S A POCO DIABLO EFFECT. UM, I THINK I'M MOSTLY ACKNOWLEDGING THE DROP IN DEMAND, BUT I'M HAPPY TO GET BACK TO YOU ON WHY REVPAR WOULD BE UP. I MEAN, BECAUSE REVPAR REVENUE PER AVAILABLE ROOM, IF THAT'S UP. YEP. THAT'S A GOOD THING. YEP, TOTALLY. IT'S DEFINITELY A GOOD THING. I WILL SAY SUPPLY FLUCTUATES THROUGHOUT THE YEAR TO SOME EXTENT. UM, IT'S JUST SOMETHING THAT I SEE KIND OF MONTH TO MONTH, UM, THAT'S PROBABLY A FACTOR IN IT. UM, BUT I DON'T HAVE A SPECIFIC ANSWER FOR YOU, BUT I'M HAPPY TO LOOK INTO IT. THANK YOU. GREAT. AND FOR THIS ONE, UM, I DID COMBINE AIR AND V-V-R-B-O INTO ONE CHART. I DON'T TYPICALLY DO THAT, UM, BUT I JUST DID IT FOR THE SAKE OF TIME. AND JUST TO KIND OF SHARE THINGS THAT WE'RE SEEING, UM, WE DO HAVE DUPLICATION IN LISTINGS BETWEEN AIRBNB AND VRBO. UM, I JUST WANNA ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IT'S GIVEN, I THINK IT'S 10% OF LISTINGS THAT WE SEE ARE DUPLICATED ACROSS. WE DID AN AN, AN ANALYSIS OF THAT, BUT JUST TO SHARE WHAT I'M SAYING WHEN I TALK ABOUT THIS SLIDE, WE PURCHASED SHORT-TERM RENTAL PERFORMANCE LISTING DATA FROM AN ENTITY CALLED KEY DATA, UM, WHICH ESSENTIALLY SCRAPES INFORMATION ON AIRBNB AND VRBO ABOUT AVAILABLE LISTINGS AND WHAT THE ROOM RATE IS, UM, AND WHETHER OR NOT IT'S AVAILABLE TO BOOK, IF IT'S NOT AVAILABLE TO BOOK, IT'S CONSIDERED BOOKED. AND THEREFORE, REVENUE GENERATING, WHICH WE ALL KNOW IS A CHALLENGE THAT'S CALLED SCRAPE DATA, IS HAS SOME ISSUES WITH IT. IF IT'S OWNER OCCUPIED, IT'S CONSIDERED BOOKED. SO THERE IS AN INFLATION IN PERFORMANCE WHEN YOU LOOK AT SCRAPE DATA, BUT IT IS THE BEST WE HAVE. UM, WE ALSO REMOVED THE COMMERCIAL ZONES, OR ESSENTIALLY ISOLATED OUT THE RESIDENTIAL ZONES WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS. SO, UM, A LOT OF OTHER SHORT-TERM RENTAL PROVIDERS WOULD JUST TAKE CITY OF SEDONA OR SHORT-TERM RENTAL LISTING PLATFORM PROVIDERS WOULD TAKE THE, UM, BOUNDARY FOR THE CITY OF SEDONA AND LOOK AT ALL THE LISTINGS IN THERE. THERE ARE HOTELS AND TIMESHARES WITH'S WITHIN THEIR RIGHT TO LIST ON THESE PLATFORMS, BUT WE'VE REMOVED THEM TO TRY TO MAKE IT AS MUCH ONE-TO-ONE AS POSSIBLE TO THERESA'S, UM, SHORT-TERM RENTAL, UH, INVENTORY. UM, WHAT WE'VE SEEN HERE IS WE HAVE SEEN KIND OF THIS CONTINUED GROWTH IN, IN THE SHORT TERM RENTAL LISTINGS. UM, NOW AGAIN, SOME OF THOSE NUMBERS ARE INFLATED, I CAN'T TELL YOU TO THE EXTENT, BUT IT'S CERTAINLY NOT WORTHY OF DISCUSSION. UM, BUT THE DEMAND WE SEE DROPPED AT THE HOTELS DOES NOT, IS NOT COUNTERBALANCED BY THE DEMAND INCREASES THAT WE'VE SEEN AT THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS. SO, UM, I CAN'T TELL YOU EXACTLY WHAT THE DIFFERENCE WOULD BE WITHOUT KNOWING THE CHALLENGES WITH SCRAPED. BUT HOTELS HAVE BEEN DOWN, SHORT-TERM RENTALS HAVE BEEN UP. UM, BUT OVERALL WE'VE SEEN LESS PEOPLE STAY OVERNIGHT, AT LEAST IN THE RESEARCH THAT WE HAVE ACCESS TO YEAR, YEAR TO DATE THROUGH AUGUST. NOW, UM, BEFORE I GET TO BOOKING PACE, I JUST WANNA ACKNOWLEDGE, UM, THE JUNE, UH, 25 SALES AND BED TAX REPORT THAT SHOWED THAT THE BED TAX WAS DOWN 31% IN JUNE. UM, IF YOU LOOK THROUGH KIND OF THE RELEASE OF THAT REPORT, UM, THERE WAS AN ACKNOWLEDGEMENT THAT, UM, WITH THE SALES TAX AUDITORS THAT WE WORK WITH, THAT THERE WERE, UM, TWO PROPERTIES, TWO TO THREE PROPERTIES THAT WE WERE IDENTIFIED POTENTIAL, UM, DELINQUENT TAX REMITTANCE FROM. UM, AND THAT THAT COULD HAVE BEEN A LEADING FACTOR FOR WHY THE JUNE BED TAX WAS DOWN THE EXTENT THAT IT WAS. UM, I KNOW THAT WE'RE PLANNING ON RELEASING THE JULY REPORT THIS WEEK. [02:25:01] UM, I CAN TELL YOU THAT IT'S, IT'S SEEMS WE FOUND DELINQUENT TAX PAYMENTS IN THAT REPORT, WHICH HAS DRAMATICALLY INCREASED THE JULY RESULT. UM, AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO RELEASING THAT LATER THIS WEEK. BUT, UM, WHAT WE'RE SEEING IS THAT, UH, YEAR TO DATE TAX REMITTANCE 2024, JANUARY TO JULY, 2025, JANUARY, JULY IS RELATIVELY FLAT. BUT LET'S WAIT FOR THE FINAL REPORT TO COME OUT. I JUST WANNA ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THAT 31% WAS DUE TO DELINQUENT TAX PAYMENTS. UM, JUMPING INTO BOOK AND PASTE, WE KNOW THAT, UM, WE SENT YOU , UH, IN, UH, I BELIEVE THE, I THINK THERE'S MAYBE THREE DIFFERENT GRAPHS YOU'VE SEEN. THERE WAS A STAFF REPORT, THEN THERE WAS THE SLIDE DECK WE SUBMITTED LAST WEEK, AND THEN THERE WAS THE REPORT THAT WE GOT THIS MORNING, OR SORRY, TWO DAYS AGO OR YESTERDAY. UM, AND YOU KNOW, THIS IS A VOLATILE DATA SET. UM, IT REALLY LOOKS AT EVERYTHING ON THE BOTTOM RIGHT IS ROOMS BOOKED ON THOSE WEEKS AS OF THIS EXACT TIME OF YEAR OR THE YEAR BEFORE. UM, AND THE FURTHER YOU GET OUT, I THINK IF YOU REMEMBER WHEN I FIRST STARTED HERE, WE WOULD GO SIX MONTHS OUT AND IT WOULD JUST BE REALLY QUESTIONABLE DATA BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, 30 ROOMS CAN GET BOOKED AND IT COMPLETELY CHANGES THE COLORS OF THE CHART. UM, SO, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE WERE SITTING AS OF OCTOBER ONE, WE WERE LOOKING DOWN IN BOOKING PACE WITHIN THIS DATA SET. AND AGAIN, THIS IS A DIFFERENT STUDY AREA THAN WE HAVE FOR SMITH TRAVEL RESEARCH THAT, UM, NOVEMBER, DECEMBER, JANUARY, WE'RE DOWN BETWEEN TWO AND 4.3% OF BOOKINGS ON THE BOOKS ON OCTOBER ONE THE PREVIOUS YEAR COMPARED TO OCTOBER 1 25. UM, WITH FEBRUARY BEING UP, UM, AS WE LOOK AT WHAT DOES THIS DATA SET TELL US AS OF OCTOBER 8TH, GO TO THE NEXT ONE, UM, WE'RE NOW, YOU KNOW, UP 4.7, 4.0, 3.4, AND 31.8. UM, BUT I ALSO WANNA ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IF YOU LOOK AT THE FUTURE OCCUPANCY OUTLOOK, WHICH IS REALLY WHAT THIS TRANSLATES TO, YOU KNOW, JANUARY AND FEBRUARY ARE 5% OF OCCUPANCIES ON THE BOOKS. AND WE'VE BEEN SITTING AT, YOU KNOW, 67% OCCUPANCY FOR THE HOTELS YEAR TO DATE. UM, SO THAT SHOWS YOU THE AMOUNT OF ROOM WE HAVE TO GROW BEFORE WE GET TO THE DAY OF OR THE DAY AFTER, I GUESS, UM, A BOOKING OCCURS OR ACTUALLY LIKE THE GUESTS, THE GUESTS ARRIVE. UM, I WAS CHATTING WITH TOURISM ECONOMICS ABOUT THIS THIS WEEK, AND, UM, I THINK WHAT WHAT SOME OF THEIR THOUGHTS WERE WAS THAT PEOPLE ARE STARTING TO PLAN THEIR TRIPS RIGHT NOW WITH KIND OF A SHORTER, SHORTER BOOKING WINDOW, WHICH, UM, COULD SPEAK TO THE NEED TO BE, YOU KNOW, IN THE MARKETPLACE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE KIND OF TOP OF THE FUNNEL WITH THEM. UM, I'M ALSO INTERESTED TO SEE WHAT THIS SHOWS US NEXT WEEK, UM, AS WE SEE WHAT POTENTIALLY COULD CHANGE AND JUST THE FACTOR OF TIME AND WHEN PEOPLE ARE MAKING DECISIONS. BUT I DO WANNA MAKE SURE WE'RE GIVING YOU THE MOST UP TO DATE, UP TO DATE INFORMATION THAT WE HAVE. OKAY, MY TURN. SO HERE IS THE CAMPAIGN OVERVIEW BASED ON THE RECOMMENDATION FROM THE TAB, WHICH, LET'S SEE, DID WE? YEP. HI, BOB. UM, BOB PKE IS IN THE AUDIENCE. HE'S IN OUR TAB, AND I AND RICHARD KEBLE WAS HERE. UM, SO THANK YOU FOR COMING TONIGHT, BUT BASED ON THE RECOMMENDATION FROM THE TAB IN THEIR SEPTEMBER MEETING, WE ARE ASKING CITY COUNCIL TO CONSIDER A $250,000 CAMPAIGN, RATHER THAN THE $157,000 THAT WAS PLANNED AND WOULD'VE BEEN IN LINE WITH OUR YEARLY BUDGET. THIS IS DUE TO THE CONCERNING ECONOMIC OUTLOOK AND WANTING TO COMPETE FOR POTENTIALLY EVEN LESS PEOPLE TRAVELING. SO THIS MEANT ALLOCATING AN EXTRA $93,000 OF FUNDS IF APPROVED. THIS MONEY WOULD COME OUT OF THE SAME CONTINGENT CONTINGENCY FUND AS FOR THE EXTRA 50 K FOR THE SUMMER CAMPAIGN, OR IF YOU'D LIKE, UM, STAFF CAN LOOK INTO ANOTHER PROJECT, PUBLIC WORKS AND THE LIKE, THAT MAY HAVE UNSPENT FUNDS OR SURPLUS THERE AS WELL. SO, LAUREN, LET ME JUST STOP YOU FOR A SECOND. THIS IS THE CITY MANAGERS CONTINGENCY OR THE TOURISM CONTINGENCY? IT WAS ONE CONTINGENCY FUND, I BELIEVE. BARBARA, DO YOU? SORRY, I WAS LETTING HIM KNOW I WAS STILL IN COUNCIL AND NOT TO CALL RIGHT NOW. , I APOLOGIZE. UM, SO YOU WERE ASKING ABOUT THE CONTINGENCY AND IT'S A, YEAH, THE QUESTION IS WHERE WOULD THE EXTRA FUNDS BE COMING FROM? THEY WOULD COME FROM THE GENERAL FUND CONTINGENCY, YOU DO HAVE CONTINGENCIES ELSEWHERE, UM, AND THE ONE THAT'S IN [02:30:01] THE HOUSING FUND SPECIFICALLY YOU CAN USE FOR ANYTHING. BUT IN THIS CASE, I WOULD RECOMMEND USING THE ONE IN GENERAL FUND. SO WHERE DOES THAT STAND IN TERMS OF WHAT WAS ALLOCATED AND HOW MUCH IS LEFT AND WHAT IMPACT WOULD THIS HAVE? IT WON'T HAVE A MAJOR IMPACT. I BELIEVE WE HAVE ABOUT 1.4 MILLION REMAINING AFTER THE LAST ALLOCATION FROM THERE. SO THERE'S STILL A GOOD AMOUNT IN THE CONTINGENCY. SO THAT'S, THAT'S THE UNALLOCATED AMOUNT THAT WE, THAT WE STILL IN DECEMBER, COULD CHOOSE TO SOME BILLS. THAT'S ACTUALLY PART OF THE BUDGET. IT'S NOT LIKE ONE OF THE RESERVES THAT WE'LL BE LOOKING AT, UM, IN DECEMBER AND JANUARY. OKAY, THANKS. OF COURSE. OKAY. SO YOU CAN SEE IN THE BLUE THE NEW ADVERTISING STRATEGY. SO WHAT I DID IS I WENT TO DVA AND I ASKED THEM WHAT THE BEST WAY TO USE THE EXTRA MONEY WOULD BE. UM, THEY CAME UP WITH AN ROI FOR EACH ADVERTISING CHANNEL, AND THEN MATCHED THAT MONEY UP TO EACH CHANNEL FOR THE HIGHEST ROI OVERALL, THAT THAT MONEY COULD BE USED IN A DI IN A DIVERSIFIED APPROACH. THEREFORE, WHAT'S PROPOSED IS, AND I DID ADD THESE UP, IT IT MUST EQUAL 250,000 , UM, 18,000 ON PAID SEARCH, $40,000 ON META OUT OF MARKET ADS OUT OF MARKET, UM, ARE THE, UH, MARKET THAT ARE LISTED DOWN THERE BELOW 17,000 FOR META ADS IN MARKET. AGAIN, THAT INCLUDES THE 25 25 MILE RADIUS AROUND SEDONA. THAT WAS BASED ON THE VISITATION STUDY THAT SAYS THAT ACTUALLY YAVAPAI COUNTY, WE HAVE THE LARGEST VISITATION FROM YAVAPAI COUNTY, SO TO MAKE SURE WE'RE SERVING THEM A SUSTAINABLE MESSAGE. UM, AND ALSO PHOENIX, UM, $85,000 FOR OUT OF MARKET ATTRIBUTION, WEB-BASED ADS, AND THEN 90,000 FOR OUT OF MARKET ATTRIBUTION CTV ADS. YOU CAN SEE THAT, UM, IN THIS INSTANCE, UM, WE'RE ACTUALLY PROPOSING TO SPEND MORE ON THOSE CTV ADS, UM, THAN THE WEB-BASED ADS BASED ON HOW WELL IT PERFORMED IN THE SUMMER. SO THE TARGET MARKETS STAY THE SAME AS IN PREVIOUS WINTER CAMPAIGNS, AND THIS IS BASED ON PAST VISITATION AND SPENDING TRENDS IN THE WINTER MONTHS. OKAY. SO EARLIER WHEN I MENTIONED THAT LESS DEVICES ARE BEING PICKED UP IN OUR ATTRIBUTION ADVERTISING PLATFORM, I'D LIKE TO NOW GO OVER THE RESULTS OF THE ATTRIBUTION ANALYSIS THAT WE HAD DBA DO. THEY LOOKED INTO FIVE COMPANIES WHO ARE IN THIS SPACE AND DETERMINED THAT OUR CURRENT VENDOR DATA FI IS STILL THE BEST TO WORK WITH BECAUSE THEY WERE THE ONLY VENDOR THAT SAID THEY COULD GIVE US POINTS OF INTEREST DETAILS THAT WE ASKED FOR. SO WE HAVE A LOT OF POINTS OF INTEREST NOW, EVERY SINGLE SHORT-TERM RENTAL, UM, AND THEY DO OFFER THAT AND THE OTHER VENDORS DID NOT. UM, THIS INCLUDES TRACKING ATTRIBUTION FOR EVERY HOTEL AND SHORT-TERM RENTAL. UM, THEY WERE THE ONLY VENDOR TO ADDRESS THAT THEY WOULD ALLOW ADVERTISING TO BE FRONT LOADED TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE BOOKING WINDOW AND PACING. AND THEY WERE THE ONLY VENDOR TO PROVIDE REAL TIME. UM, ACTUALLY I DON'T THINK THEY WERE THE ONLY VENDOR, BUT THEY, UM, PROVIDE REAL TIME REPORTING WHILE THREE OF THE OTHER VENDORS SAID THAT THEY RELY HEAVILY ON DELAYED OR POST-CAMPAIGN DATA THAT LIMITS OUR ABILITY FOR IN, IN-FLIGHT OPTIMIZATION THAT WE DO. HOWEVER, THE SECOND BEST VENDOR WAS ONE THAT WE'D LIKE TO KEEP ON RESERVE. SHOULD DATA PRIVACY RESTRICTIONS CONTINUE TO LIMIT THE DESTINATION ATTRIBUTION CAPTURE, ITS DOWN ITS DOWNSIDE IS THAT IT SERVES ADS TO A ZIP CODE AND THEN TRACKS IF PEOPLE COME IN MARKET USING A CREDIT CARD SPEND REPORT. HOWEVER, IT CAN'T GUARANTEE THAT THE PERSON NECESSARILY SAW THE AD, JUST THAT THE AD WAS SERVED TO THEIR ZIP CODE AND THAT THEY ENDED UP IN MARKET BASED ON THEIR CREDIT CARD SPEND. SO IT'S REALLY GREAT BECAUSE IT'S ROCK SOLID ON THAT THIS PERSON USED THEIR CREDIT CARD FROM THIS ZIP CODE, THEY SPENT MONEY HERE, UM, BUT IT IS LESS HARD TO CONNECT. IT'S NOT ABSOLUTE THAT THEY SAW THAT AD AND THIS CARD WAS USED IN SEDONA. SO WE'LL CONTINUE TO MONITOR THE ATTRIBUTION PORTION OF THE CAMPAIGN SPEND AND MAKE NECESSARY SHIFTS TO THIS IF THE OTHER, SORRY, UM, AND MAKE NE MAKE NECESSARY SHIFTS TO THIS OTHER VENDOR IF DEEMED NECESSARY, BUT FOR THE TIME BEING WILL REMAIN WITH THE SAME VENDOR. ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT? YEAH, YOU LOOK LIKE YOU HAD ONE . YEAH, I I I HAVE, I HAVE TWO FIRST BACK ON THE PREVIOUS SLIDE. UM, WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, IN INCREASING THESE [02:35:01] SPENDS THOUGH, ARE YOU CHANGING THE TARGET MARKET IN TERMS OF INCOME LEVEL? UH, WE KNOW ABOUT THE LOCATIONS, BUT I JUST WANNA KNOW WHO MM-HMM . WHO THESE ARE GEARED TO. DOES THIS INCREASE SPEND MEAN THAT YOU'RE CHANGING IT AROUND, UM, TO HIT A DIFFERENT MARKET? UM, CAN YOU HOLD ON THAT FOR THREE MORE SLIDES? OKAY. AND I'LL ANSWER THAT. THANK YOU. MM-HMM . AND ON THE OTHER, MY OTHER QUESTION WAS ON THE CREDIT CARD SPEND REPORT, DID, WOULD THAT REPORT ALL CREDIT CARDS INCLUDING MASTERCARD, VISA, AMERICAN EXPRESS, AND DISCOVER, OR JUST SOME CREDIT CARDS? CHRISTIAN, CAN YOU SPEAK? DO YOU KNOW IF THAT, UM, SECOND PLACE VENDOR, UM, IF THEY, WHAT, UM, WHAT CREDIT CARD VENDORS THEY'RE USING? YEAH, I BELIEVE IT WOULD BE THROUGH, UM, THE COMPANY'S A PRETTY LARGE ENTITY, SO I THINK THEY HAVE A PIPELINE FOR ALL CREDIT CARDS, NOT JUST A VISA OR MASTERCARD. UM, I DON'T BELIEVE THEY PURCHASED THEIR DATA FROM LIKE A COMPANY, LIKE A FIRM OF CREDIT CARD COMPANY LIKE THAT. UM, SO WE CAN CERTAINLY LOOK INTO IT, UH, WHERE THEY, WHERE THAT COMES FROM. BUT I DO KNOW THAT IT IS MORE THAN JUST A SINGLE, UH, SINGLE CARD. AND WHEN WE SAY CREDIT CARDS, IS IT CAPTURING ANYTHING THAT'S PURCHASED ON A DEBIT CARD? I WOULD'VE TO CHECK THAT AS WELL. OKAY. CARRY ON HERE. SO THE CAMPAIGN CONCEPT, UM, IT IS STILL THE REDEFINED DESERT THEME, WHICH WILL NOW BE ITS THIRD ITERATION. THIS TIME WE'RE LEANING INTO COMPETING FOR THAT WORLD TRAVELER WHO MAY NOT BE DOING THAT INTERNATIONAL TRIP THIS YEAR BECAUSE OF ECONOMY CONCERNS. AND WE'RE PLAYING WITH WORDS LIKE REDEFINE WINTER SANCTUARY MASTERPIECE, PASSPORT BUCKET LIST, AWE, ESCAPE THE JOURNEY, SILENCE AND WHAT MATTERS. THESE ARE SOME OF THE CONCEPTS. UM, AND THEN YOU'VE BEEN SEEING THEM AS WELL ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE SCREEN THERE. UM, YOU'VE SEEN THIS ONE BEFORE, BUT JUST AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT THAT WEB AD LOOKS LIKE. TARGET AUDIENCES, HERE YOU ARE. UM, THEY'RE THE SAME AS OUR PAST, PAST CAMPAIGNS, EXCEPT THIS YEAR BASED ON THE TABS RECOMMENDATION, WE WOULD LIKE TO TEST TARGETING TO PEOPLE WITH A HOUSEHOLD INCOME OF $250,000 AND UP. SO CHRISTIAN, I'D LIKE TO, UM, HAVE YOU EXPLAIN HOW WE'LL BE TESTING THIS. YEAH, SO FIRST THING I'LL, I'LL, UM, CLARIFY TOO IS OUR FLOOR FOR OUR HOUSEHOLD INCOME IS NOT, UM, RELATED TO THE RANGE SHOWN IN THESE PERSONAS. UM, WHAT WE TYPICALLY LOOK AT IS A HOUSEHOLD INCOME OF A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS AND ABOVE. UH, THAT ALLOWS US TO CAPTURE, UM, RETIREES THAT WOULD HAVE THE MEANS TO TRAVEL. UM, AND WITH THE ONE EXCEPTION BEING WHEN WE TARGET FOLKS IN MARKET, UM, WE ARE NOT LOOKING AT A SPEND OR A, A HOUSEHOLD INCOME NECESSARILY. IN THAT CASE, REALLY WHAT WE'RE JUST TRYING TO DO IS COMMUNICATE THE VALUES OF SEDONA, REGARDLESS OF YOUR INCOME, UH, TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU'RE, UM, YOU KNOW, RECREATING RESPONSIBLY. BUT IN TERMS OF, UM, THE HIGHER THRESHOLD THERE, THE $250,000 UP WE'LL USE, UM, WHAT, UH, WHAT WE'VE GOTTEN FROM THE ADVERTISING VENDOR, WHICH IS A LIST OF AMEX'S, UH, TOP HOTELS WITHIN THE COUNTRY. UM, THESE ARE PLACES THAT ARE IDENTIFIED, UH, AS HOTELS WHERE YOU SEE THESE KIND OF 200 TO $300,000, UM, HOUSEHOLD INCOME SHOWING UP ON A REGULAR BASIS. AND, UM, THOSE FOLKS THEN, UH, WILL BECOME PART OF GEO CONQUESTING, UM, IF YOU WILL. SO THOSE PROPERTIES HAVE BEEN POLYGON. WE HAVE A LOOK BACK WINDOW OF, UH, I THINK WE'RE LOOKING AS FAR BACK AS THREE YEARS TO BUILD A LARGE ENOUGH AUDIENCE POOL. AND THEN WE'LL BE, UH, LAYERING THAT ON TOP OF, UM, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF OUR, OUR OTHER, UM, INTERESTS IN BEHAVIORAL BASED TARGETING AND OUR GEOTARGETING. SO WE'RE NOT NECESSARILY TARGETING PEOPLE IN GEORGIA THAT MAY HAVE GONE TO, YOU KNOW, A PROPERTY IN THE FLORIDA KEYS. WE'RE STILL LOOKING AT, UH, WHILE THE, WHILE THERE MIGHT BE A PROPERTY IN GEORGIA THAT'S IN OUR LIST, WE'RE [02:40:01] ONLY LOOKING AT PEOPLE WHO HAVE COME FROM OUR TARGET MARKETS, PEOPLE THAT HAVE A PROPENSITY TO TRAVEL, UM, AND ARE SPENDING AT A CERTAIN LEVEL, UM, THAT WE KNOW, YOU KNOW, EQUATES TO THAT 250 TO $300,000 HOUSEHOLD INCOME LEVEL. SO THAT'S, UH, THAT'S HOW WE'RE ADDRESSING THAT HIGHER INCOME MARKET. UM, IT'S SOMETHING THAT, UM, OTHER DESTINATIONS LIKE TELLURIDE HAVE USED TO ATTRACT HIGH, UH, NET WORTH, UM, FAMILIES AND INDIVIDUALS TO THEIR, UH, THEIR DESTINATION. UM, SO WE'VE SEEN THIS, UH, DEPLOYED IN OTHER AREAS. SO THESE MIGHT SOUND LIKE KNITS, SO I APOLOGIZE IN ADVANCE, BUT THERE'S, THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN US SAYING, DO THEY EARN ENOUGH MONEY TO TRAVEL VERSUS DO THEY EARN ENOUGH MONEY SO THAT WHEN THEY GET TO THE DESTINATION TO WHICH THEY ARE TRAVELING, THEY'RE GOING TO SPEND INCOME, RIGHT? SO THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN GOING TO ONE OF OUR RESTAURANTS AND GOING TO THE GROCERY STORE AND BUYING PEANUT BUTTER JELLY AND LOAVES OF BREAD. THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN COMING HERE AND GOING HIKING AND GOING AND RENTING A MOUNTAIN BIKE. SO WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU HAVE THESE, WHEN YOU'RE, TO ME, WHEN YOU HAVE YOUR BASE THINKING BEING, DO THEY HAVE THE INCOME TO TRAVEL? I'M NOT SURE HOW MUCH THAT HELPS US. UM, WHEN WE THINK ABOUT OUR BUSINESSES AND WE THINK ABOUT BED AND SALES TAX, 'CAUSE IT'S THE ONLY WAY WE, WE HAVE REVENUE HERE, RIGHT? SO, UM, I, I GET A LITTLE CONCERNED THAT WE'RE BASING THAT ON, DO THEY HAVE ENOUGH MONEY TO TRAVEL? 'CAUSE YOU DON'T NEED A LOT OF MONEY TO TRAVEL, YOU KNOW? SO, UM, I'M A LITTLE CONCERNED ABOUT THAT. THE OTHER THING THAT CONCERNS ME IS HOW YOU'VE CREATED PERSONAS, ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORER, WELLNESS SEEKER, SO AND SO ON, WHICH ARE PERSONAS AND YOU'VE TIED THEM TO AN INCOME. UM, I WOULD CONSIDER MYSELF TO BE AN ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORER, BUT YOU KNOW, I'M GOING ON TRIPS AROUND THE WORLD BEING ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORER, MY HOUSEHOLD INCOME MAY NOT BE 75 TO 120. IT COULD BE EXCEEDINGLY HIGHER THAN THAT. SO I, I JUST, HOW ARE WE, HOW ARE WE THINKING ABOUT THE MONEY THAT WE'RE SAYING THE HOUSEHOLD INCOME IS TO THE KIND OF PERSON THAT YOU ARE? IF, IF THAT MAKES SENSE. YEAH, IT MAKES, MAKES PERFECT SENSE. I THINK, AGAIN, THE, UM, I THINK THE, THE MIX UP HERE IS IN THE MESSAGING THAT'S ON SCREEN, UM, THE PERSONAS WERE DEVELOPED TO GIVE PEOPLE A SENSE OF THE TYPE OF PERSON ACTIVITIES AND MESSAGING THAT WE WOULD CREATE TO ATTRACT PEOPLE TO SEDONA. THE, THE RANGES, YOU KNOW, WERE, I MEAN, WE, WE TRIED TO BASE THEM IN SOME REALITY BASED ON WHERE WE MIGHT FIND THESE PEOPLE. UM, YOU KNOW, ARE THEY SEATTLEITES TYPICALLY? YOU KNOW WHAT, SO, BUT WHAT WE'RE DOING FUNCTIONALLY LOOKS DIFFERENT THAN WHAT YOU'RE SEEING HERE IN TERMS OF THE RANGES. FUNCTIONALLY, WE'RE NOT TARGETING ANYONE AGAIN, UNDER A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS. AND I APPRECIATE THE, I THE THE NOTION THAT, YOU KNOW, TRAVEL CAN BE ACCESSIBLE REGARDLESS OF, UH, YOU KNOW, INCOME AND HOUSEHOLD INCOME. UM, BUT WE ALSO KNOW THAT THERE ARE CERTAIN, UH, YOU KNOW, COSTS TO IT. AND SO, UM, A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS SEEMS TO BE A GOOD PLACE TO BE, AGAIN, TO CAPTURE, UM, BOTH YOUNGER FAMILIES THAT MAY NOT HAVE THE RES, YOU KNOW, LIKE THE RESOURCES OF AN OLDER, UM, DEMOGRAPHIC, BUT ALSO OF A, A RETIRED COUPLE WHO ARE LIVING OFF A PENSION OR SOCIAL SECURITY, UM, WHAT HAVE YOU, YOU KNOW, A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS AGAIN, IS, IS WHERE WE START THERE IS IN, IN OUR TARGETING. THERE IS NO CEILING. SO, UH, AS LONG AS YOU MEET, YOU KNOW, AS LONG AS FROM A AUDIENCE PERSPECTIVE, YOU MEET THAT QUALIFIER, YOU KNOW, THERE IS NO UPPER END TO, UM, THAT AUDIENCE, UH, PARAMETER. I THINK THE, THE, THE IDEA IS, UM, FINANCES ARE THE ONLY ONE MARKER. UM, AT THE OUTSET OF, UH, D DA'S RELATIONSHIP WITH, UH, THE CITY WAS WE NEEDED TO MAKE SURE [02:45:01] THAT THE VALUES OF THE DESTINATION CAME ACROSS AND THAT WE REALLY FOCUSED ON THAT AT EVERY STEP. AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, THAT VALUE-BASED MARKETING AND THE VALUE-BASED MESSAGING, I THINK THOSE ARE THINGS THAT GO INTO ALL OF THIS AS WELL. YOU KNOW, AND, AND SO WE'RE NOT JUST LOOKING FOR PEOPLE TO COME HERE AND JUST BE CONSUMERS. WE'RE LOOKING FOR PEOPLE TO BE, UM, MINDFUL OF WHAT THEY'RE DOING WHILE, YOU KNOW, BEING PART OF THE COMMUNITY, WHETHER THAT MEANS HIKING OR SUPPORTING LOCAL BUSINESS. I THINK THAT'S ALSO PART OF THE MESSAGING IS SUPPORTING LOCAL BUSINESS. UM, THAT'S THE, THAT'S WHAT DIFFERENTIATES THE COMMUNITY, UM, IS WHAT MAKES, YOU KNOW, SEDONA DIFFERENT FROM PRESCOTT OR ANY OTHER, YOU KNOW, ANY OTHER DESTINATION IS THE LOCAL FLAVOR. AND SO THAT IS, AGAIN, THROUGH THE MESSAGING, THAT'S PART OF HOW WE COMMUNICATE SOMETHING FAIRLY NUANCED AND INTRICATE. AND I THINK, YEAH, YOU KNOW, WE'VE, WE'VE CERTAINLY, UM, GOTTEN GREAT FEEDBACK ON THESE PERSONAS AND I THINK THEY DO A DISSERVICE TO GENERALLY THE, THE NUANCE THAT WE TAKE IN ENSURING THAT WE GET THE RIGHT PEOPLE VISITING. SEDONA. PETE, I'D LIKE TO FOLLOW UP ON THAT A LITTLE BIT, AND THANKS FOR SOME OF THAT CLARITY. 'CAUSE THIS PARTICULAR CHART, WHEN WE HAVE THOSE INCOME RANGES IN THERE, IT HAS CAUSED SOME CONVERSATION WITH US AND THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY, THAT'S FOR SURE. AND SO I, I APPRECIATE THE SUBTLENESS OF THE ANSWER THAT YOU JUST GAVE, AND IT MAY BE CONFUSING, BUT THEN THAT ANSWER THEN CAUSES ME TO ASK, WELL THEN WHAT ARE WE DOING WITH THIS NEW TEST OF INCOMES OF 250,000 UP? IF, IF THE VARIOUS CATEGORIES DIDN'T HAVE A CAP? WHAT, TELL ME AGAIN, WHAT IT IS THAT WE'RE GONNA DO IN THIS TEST THAT'S DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WE'RE ALREADY DOING? CHRISTIAN, CAN YOU EX CAN WE, THERE THERE'S NATIONAL RESEARCH, UM, THAT, UH, IS SUGGESTING THAT REALLY TRAVEL IS DEFINITELY BEING, UM, MORE, UH, CONSIDERED WITH, YOU KNOW, THE MIDDLE CLASS. AND SO THOSE DECISIONS ARE BEING WEIGHED MORE HEAVILY NOW THAN THEY WERE EVEN SIX TO SEVEN MONTHS AGO. SO WHAT, WHAT THE RESEARCH IS SUGGESTING IS THAT, UM, YOU KNOW, FOLKS THAT ARE BASICALLY IN THE TOP 10% OF INCOME IN THE US AREN'T AS, UH, CONCERNED, UH, WITH THE CURRENT CLIMATE. UM, WHETHER THAT'S THE POLITICAL CLIMATE OR FINANCIAL AND ARE STILL, UH, BOOKING TRIPS, THEY'RE STILL LOOKING AT TRAVEL AND THEY HAVEN'T BEEN IMPACTED AS MUCH IN THEIR DECISION MAKING. SO THIS TEST ALLOWS US TO VALIDATE THAT, UM, WE, YOU KNOW, WHILE WE CAN'T, WE'RE NOT GONNA PLACE A CAP ON, ON THE INCOME SPEND OUTSIDE OF THAT, WE WILL BE ABLE TO SEE WHEN WE'VE CREATED THIS AUDIENCE THAT CLEARLY HAS, YOU KNOW, DIFFERENTIATED, YOU KNOW, ITSELF FROM THAT A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS PLUS AUDIENCE. THIS IS 250,000 PLUS IS WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IT AS. ARE WE GETTING THE HIGHER DEGREE OF ATTRIBUTION FROM THAT AUDIENCE THAN WHAT WE'RE GETTING FROM OUR OTHER AUDIENCES WITH THAT LOWER SPENDING THRESHOLD? UM, WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT MAKING, UM, YOU KNOW, HUGE INVESTMENTS IN THAT. 'CAUSE I, I THINK, UM, YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT, YOU KNOW, I, I I THINK THERE'S, THERE'S A NEED TO SERVE ALL OF SEDONA AS A DESTINATION, NOT JUST, UM, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE BUSINESSES AND THINGS THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, REALLY ONLY ACCESSIBLE TO, TO TOP 10%. SO WE'RE TRYING TO TAKE A MEASURED APPROACH. WE'RE TRYING TO, TO AT LEAST TEST IT AND SEE, UM, AND, YOU KNOW, THE, I THINK THE RESULTS WILL, WILL HELP GUIDE FUTURE DECISIONS ON, YOU KNOW, HOW WE WANT TO, TO MARKET, UM, MARKET, UM, YOU KNOW, USING INCOME AS A MARKER, UH, FOR, FOR OUR EFFORTS. WELL, AND WE'RE GETTING INTO THE, THE NITTY GRITTY DETAILS OF HOW THESE AUDIENCES ARE CREATED, BUT I I, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO STATE THAT THE WAY THAT WE ARE CREATING WHO TO SERVE THESE ADS TO IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT. SO EVERYBODY ON THE LIST ABOVE THAT TWO 50 AND UPLINE IS CREATED WELL, UM, EXCEPT THE UNINFORMED ADVENTURE. IF THEY END UP IN MARKET, THEY, [02:50:01] THEY GET SERVED AN AD, UM, REGARDLESS. BUT CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, CHRISTIAN, BUT WHEN I TRY AND EXPLAIN FROM A LAYMAN'S TERM OF HOW THIS, HOW WE DO THIS, IT'S THAT WE LOOK AT A PAST VISITOR AND THEN WE CREATE A LOOKALIKE AUDIENCE FROM THOSE PAST VISITORS. AND WHAT CHRISTIAN IS SAYING IS THAT THE PAST VISITOR THAT WE'LL BE LOOKING FOR WITH A TWO 50 AND UP IS NOT THE PAST VISITOR FROM SEDONA. IT'S A VISITOR TO THE TOP. WHAT DID, WHAT'D YOU SAY? 1%, 1% OF, UM, LUXURY HOTELS IN THE UNITED STATES. AND THEY'LL TAKE THAT AS THEIR KERNEL, AND THEN THEY'LL CREATE A LOOKALIKE AUDIENCE FROM THAT. SO IT'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT WAY OF CREATING THE AUDIENCE, NOT JUST, UM, AS SIMPLE AS BREAKING IT DOWN AS THE NUMBERS THAT ARE LISTED HERE, BUT THE, IT'S, IT'S ACTUALLY, IT'S A DIFFERENT TYPE OF PERSON. AND, AND JUST TO BE CLEAR, THAT'S THE STARTING POINT, RIGHT? IT'S NOT THE END POINT. THAT'S NOT THE AUDIENCE. WE, AGAIN, WE LAYER ON THE INTERESTS, WE LAYER ON THE BEHAVIORS, WE LAYER ON THE GEO GEOS THAT WE'RE LOOKING TO TO BE IN. SO IT'S, IT'S REALLY JUST A STARTING POINT FOR THE AUDIENCE BUILDING. THERE'S A LOT THAT WILL GO INTO REFINING THAT EVEN FURTHER TO, I THINK, I, I DON'T REMEMBER WHICH COUNCIL MEMBER, UM, VOICED THE CONCERN ABOUT JUST GETTING PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, WITH HIGH MONEY TO, TO SHOW UP IN SEDONA. THAT'S, THAT'S NOT WHAT WE WANT. UM, THAT'S NOT WHAT WE WERE TASKED WITH. WE WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE GETTING THE RIGHT PEOPLE THROUGH MESSAGING, THROUGH INTEREST, THROUGH BEHAVIOR, AND ALSO THROUGH INCOME AS A TEST. PETER, ARE YOU DONE? YES. I'M GONNA TAG ONTO THAT. OKAY. I'M, I MAKE $250,000 AND UP. THIS IS AN EXAMPLE. UH, WHAT DOES THE AD LOOK LIKE? WHERE DO, WHERE ARE YOU? IS IT DIFFERENT? IS IT REDEFINE SUMMER REDEFINE? NO, IT, IT, IT, THE WAY THAT WE'RE DOING IT RIGHT NOW IN OUR, IN OUR TEST IS TO, UM, SERVE THE SAME IMAGERY, THE SAME AD AS EVERYBODY GETS. IT'S JUST SERVING IT TO YOU. IF WE DIDN'T SERVE IT TO YOU BEFORE, BECAUSE YOU WEREN'T IN OUR AUDIENCE, SO, SO, AND I JUST WANNA REITERATE THAT THE WAY THAT THE AUDIENCE IS CREATED IS BASED ON YOUR TRAVEL PATTERN THAT YOU HAVE TRAVELED TO A LUXURY DESTINATION. HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT? BECAUSE THEIR CELL PHONE WILL HAVE INDICATED IF THEY WERE IN THE, UH, AMMAN GEAR, IF THEY WERE IN AMMAN, GEARY, IF THEY'RE IN THE, IF THAT'S THE TOP 1% OF HOTELS, IT WILL HAVE PINGED YOU THERE AND YOUR DATA IS, IS SOLD. IT'S, IT'S THE SAME WAY THAT WE KNOW IF THEY SPEND A NIGHT IN A HOTEL YEAH. WITHIN SEDONA, WE'VE JUST, WE'VE JUST POLYGON A DIFFERENT SET OF HOTELS AND LOOKED AT A NATIONAL STUDY AREA. SO YOU'RE TRACKING PEOPLE WHO GO TO UTAH AT THE HOTEL. WE AREN'T, THEIR DATA WAS SOLD TO A COMPANY. SOLD TO A COMPANY. YEAH. WE DON'T, WE DON'T EVER CORRELATE IT TO AN INDIVIDUAL PERSON WITH A NAME AND A FACE, IF THAT MAKES ANY SENSE. YEAH. THEY'RE JUST A DATA POINT OF THIS PERSON HAS TRAVELED TO FOUR SEASONS WHEREVER. UM, AND, AND THEY'D BE A GOOD PERSON TO SERVE AN AD TO, AND THEY'RE IN OUR TARGET LIKE WHAT CHRISTIAN IS SAYING. THEN WE START THE LAYERS, RIGHT? YOU'RE IN OUR TARGET MARKETS, OUR TARGET CITIES, AND YOU AND YOUR WEB HISTORY HAS INDICATED THAT YOU ARE AN ADVENTURE ENTHUSIAST, A WELLNESS SEEKER, A CULTURE EXPLORER, AN ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORER. IT'S SORT OF LIKE THE OPPOSITE OF HOW WE DO OUR IN-MARKET ADS, WHICH IS WE KNOW YOU'RE IN CITY LIMITS, YOU GET A SUSTAINABILITY MESSAGE. WE'RE DOING AN INVERSE. WE KNOW THAT YOU'VE STAYED AT A LUXURY PROPERTY IN THE US AS DEFINED BY AMERICAN EXPRESS, AND NOW YOU'RE GONNA GET AN AD THAT SAYS, COME PLAN YOUR NEXT VACATION IN SEDONA. AND DO YOU KNOW IF I'VE STAYED MY PRETEND PERSON STAYED IN, YEAH, RIGHT. A HOTEL IN, UH, HONG KONG, UH, C CHRISTIAN, WE DID NOT LOOK OUTSIDE OF THE COUNTRY, RIGHT? NO, NO. THE DATA IS LIMITED TO THE UNITED STATES. OKAY. BRIAN, DID YOU HAVE A QUESTION? THANK YOU. UM, I GET WHERE YOU'RE GOING ON THE TARGETING FOR THE TWO 50 AND UP. IT'S THE REST OF 'EM THAT I HEARD TWO THINGS THAT I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I REALLY HEARD RIGHT? I THOUGHT I HEARD WELL, YEAH, THOSE OTHER PERSONAS, IT'S REALLY A HUNDRED K AND UP AND THERE'S NO UPPER LIMIT ON WHO WE'RE TARGETING. IS THAT REALLY? RIGHT? 'CAUSE THAT DOESN'T MAKE [02:55:01] SENSE. I MEAN, YOU'VE GOT A LIMIT. I MEAN, WE DON'T HAVE UNLIMITED MARKETING DOLLARS. SO FOR THE ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORER, ARE WE REALLY SERVING ADS JUST TO THE 75 TO ONE 20, OR DID I HEAR RIGHT? AND THAT IT'S REALLY A HUNDRED K ON UP WITH NO UPPER LIMIT? YEAH, THAT'S CORRECT. IT, SO IT SETS THE, WHAT IS, SO DO YOU MEET THE CRITERIA IN THIS WAY, YES OR NO? THEN WHAT'S THE NEXT SET OF CRITERIA? UH, BUT YEAH, IT'S, IT'S SET AT FACEBOOK IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. I BELIEVE. UH, WE, WE SET THAT, UM, AT, UH, TOP 25, WHICH I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT THAT CORRELATES TO. IT'S PRETTY CLOSE TO THAT A HUNDRED THOUSAND. IT MIGHT BE A LITTLE BIT LESS FOR META. UM, THEY DON'T PROVIDE THE SAME HOUSEHOLD INCOME, UH, SPENT PARAMETERS. IT'S MORE, UH, UPPER PERCENT OF, OF HOUSEHOLD INCOME. SO YOU'RE SAYING FOR GOOGLE PAID SEARCH, ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORER, 75 TO ONE 20 IS REAL? NO, NOT FOR SEARCH. SEARCH IS OBVIOUSLY A TOTALLY DIFFERENT BALLGAME, RIGHT? WE'RE FOR SEARCH, UH, WE HAVE OUR GEOS, UM, WE HAVE OUR, OUR BASICALLY OUR, UH, VARIOUS SEARCH CAMPAIGNS, WHETHER THAT'S A SUSTAINABILITY SEARCH CAMPAIGN OR DESTINATION DISCOVERY CAMPAIGN. UM, SO THAT'S, THAT'S DIFFERENT. THAT'S REALLY, THERE'S NOT A, THERE'S GEO PLACEMENTS, UM, ON THERE, BUT NOT LIKE THERE'S NO HOUSEHOLD INCOME PLACED ON THAT. SO THIS IS ATTRIBUTION AND FACEBOOK. AND FACEBOOK, INSTAGRAM, YEAH. AND I LOOKED UP A HUNDRED K HOUSEHOLD AS CONSIDERED TOP 23%. SO THAT KIND OF ALIGNS WHAT CHRISTIAN WAS JUST SAYING WITH, UH, FACEBOOK'S TARGETING. OKAY. THANK YOU, MAYOR. I'M SORRY, I'M, I'M STRUGGLING JUST A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE, UM, IN MY LIFETIME WORKING FOR THE MOST EVIL COMPANY IN THE WORLD, UM, I DEVELOPED PERSONAS AND WORKED WITH PERSONAS. SO I'M STRUGGLING A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE YOU SAID EARLIER THAT, UM, RED REDEFINE, UM, FAMILY TIME WAS LIKE THE NUMBER ONE PERFORMING AD. SO DID IT PLAY THE SAME OVER ALL YOUR PERSONAS? BECAUSE YOU DON'T HAVE LIKE A FAMILY PERSONA. YOU, YOU'VE GOT BEHAVIORAL PERSONAS, RIGHT? AND THAT PLAYED WELL. SO IT DIDN'T MATTER WHETHER YOU'RE AN ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORER, IT STILL PLAYED WELL. WELLNESS SEEKERS STILL PLAYED WELL. ADVENTURE ENTHUSIASTS STILL PLAYED WELL. SO DID THAT PLAY WELL ACROSS ALL OF YOUR PERSONAS? AND SO PERSONA ITSELF BECAME KIND OF NOT AS RELEVANT AS THE FACT THAT YOU HAD A FAMILY? YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S GENERALLY, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, WE'VE SEEN, SO WITH THE PERSONAS THAT HAVE BEEN MOST INFLUENTIAL IS THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE CONTENT, DEVELOPMENT OF THE MESSAGING. UM, AND YOU KNOW, REALLY, LIKE, IT'S NOT REALLY DEFINING OUR OUTLETS PER SE ANYMORE, RIGHT? WHERE, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD BE IN CERTAIN MAGAZINES OR CERTAIN OTHER, YOU KNOW, TV CHANNELS, WHATEVER THAT SPOKE TO THESE INDIVIDUALS. IT'S SO MUCH MORE DYNAMIC NOW, YOU KNOW, THAT REALLY THE FUNCTION OF THE PERSONAS WAS REALLY TO ELICIT A VISUALIZATION OF THE TYPE OF PEOPLE THAT WE WERE SEEKING TO COME TO SEDONA THAT WERE GONNA BE VALUES ALIGNED. UM, ENSURING THAT LIKE THE MESSAGING AND HOW WE MIGHT ATTRACT PEOPLE THROUGH VARIOUS, UH, BRAND, UH, PILLARS OF SEDONA, THE, THE MAIN VALUE PROPOSITIONS WOULD, UH, ALIGN WITH THE INTERESTS, UM, OF THESE PERSONAS. THAT'S REALLY WHERE THE RUBBER MET THE ROAD ON, ON THESE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE OBVIOUSLY LOOKING, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT DOING A POSTMORTEM AT THE END OF THREE MONTHS TO SAY, OH GEEZ, WE SHOULD HAVE DONE MORE OF THIS, AND LESS OF THAT. IT'S, YOU KNOW, AS YOU KNOW, IT'S OBVIOUSLY SO MUCH MORE DYNAMIC WHERE WE'RE ABLE TO SHIFT MONEY AND DOLLARS AROUND TO THINGS THAT ARE PERFORMING AND, AND TONE DOWN THE THINGS THAT AREN'T. SO, YOU KNOW, REALLY WHERE THIS REALLY COMES, YOU KNOW, TO, TO LIKE WHERE WE'VE USED THIS MOST IS JUST IN ALIGNING THE MESSAGING, UM, WITH THE MAIN VALUE PROPOSITION, UM, UH, FOR SEDONA. AND AGAIN, JUST TRYING TO [03:00:01] GIVE FOLKS AN IDEA OF THE TYPE OF INDIVIDUALS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO ATTRACT. UM, 'CAUSE THAT WAS, AGAIN, IT WAS LIKE ONE OF THE VERY FIRST THINGS THAT WE HEARD, UM, WAS WE DON'T WANT EVERYONE TO COME, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T WANT, YOU KNOW, JUST THE, THE TOUR ON THAT'S JUST VERY TRANSACTIONAL. WE WANTED TO TURN TOURISM LESS EXTRACTIVE AND, AND MAKE IT, UM, YOU KNOW, A MORE POSITIVE EXPERIENCE ON, ON BOTH SIDES. SO THESE WERE DEVELOPED TO TRY TO REALLY KEEP US IN CHECK FROM A MESSAGING STANDPOINT, UM, TO KEEP THAT TOP OF MIND. BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE DON'T REALLY KNOW HOW THE PEOPLE WHO ARE VISITING AND REMEMBERING THAT WE ARE A TOURISM BASED ECONOMY CURRENTLY, RIGHT? AND, UM, IF THEY DON'T SPEND MONEY IN MARKET, WHETHER IT'S VIA BET TAX OR IT'S VIA SALES TAX, AND THEY'RE JUST COMING HERE AND SLEEPING IN THEIR CAR AND GOING HIKING AND WHATEVER, THEY'RE NOT CONTRIBUTING TO OUR ECONOMY HERE, RIGHT? WE, WE SAY WE DON'T WANT EVERYONE, BUT HOW, HOW DO WE EVEN KNOW HOW MANY OF THESE PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY SHOWING UP? SO EVERYONE TO, TO BE KIND OF BLUNT, EVERYONE FALLS INTO UNINFORMED ADVENTURER IF THEY DON'T FALL INTO EVERY OTHER CATEGORY, RIGHT? AND SO, UM, HOW DO, HOW DO WE KNOW IF THESE PERSONAS ARE EVEN USEFUL FOR US ANYMORE? YOU KNOW, HAVE WE, HAVE WE GONE BEYOND PERSONAS AND YOU'RE, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE USING THEM, YOU KNOW, WHAT MARKETS ARE PLAYING WELL, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE ADVERTISING WHERE PLAYS WELL, YOU KNOW, WHAT YOUR ADVERTISING ABOUT IS PLAYING WELL, HOW ARE, HOW IS ANY OF THIS ON THIS PAGE USEFUL FOR US ANYMORE? JUST ASKING. YEAH, I MEAN, THAT'S A FAIR QUESTION AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'VE, WE'VE OBVIOUSLY GOTTEN A LOT OF FEEDBACK ON IN THE LAST, UM, TWO SESSIONS, UM, THAT WE'VE BEEN IN FRONT OF COUNCIL, AND I KNOW LAUREN AND, UH, ANDREW HAVE HEARD THAT AS WELL FROM THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY. UM, SO I THINK IT'S A FAIR POINT. UM, WE, WE CAN CERTAINLY, IT WAS WRITTEN INTO THE STRATEGY, WHICH I THINK IS WHY WE'VE INCLUDED IT HERE, BECAUSE AGAIN, IT DOESN'T FORM THE MESSAGING. IT INFORMS, UM, YOU KNOW, HOW WE WOULD APPROACH, UM, THE, THE PRODUCTS AND SERVICES AND THINGS THAT WE'RE PROMOTING. BUT, YOU KNOW, TO YOUR POINT, UM, YOU KNOW, WE, WE DO LOOK AT THE CORRELATION OF VISITORS TO THE VARIOUS CLUSTERS IN SEDONA. SO WE KNOW, YOU KNOW, FOR INSTANCE, OF THE VISITORS, YOU KNOW, HOW MANY SHOW UP AT SHOPPING, HOW MANY SHOW UP IN HOTELS. UM, SO WE DO LOOK, LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE'RE GETTING NOT JUST THE ATTRIBUTION SIDE OF THINGS, UM, BUT IN TERMS OF BEING ON THE FRONT END OF THIS CONVERSATION WITH THIS, UH, AUDIENCE, UH, YOU KNOW, I I THINK IT'S, UM, PRETTY CLEAR THAT, UH, WE SHOULD HAVE A DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT THE VALUE OF THAT, UH, ARE AT LEAST, UM, IN THE, IN THIS STATE, UH, STAGE OF THE, OF THE CAMPAIGN DEVELOPMENT AND REVIEW. AND CHRISTIAN, CAN YOU QUICKLY, DON'T YOU WANT TO BE AS TARGETED AS YOU CAN IN ORDER TO GET THE QUOTE UNQUOTE RIGHT PERSON? I MEAN, IF IT'S JUST OPEN ENDED, UM, OR JUST BASED ON PAST VISITATION, UH, I MEAN, AS, AS OUR CONSULTANT, WOULD YOU RECOMMEND COMING UP WITH, IF NOT THESE PERSONAS THAN OTHER PERSONAS? OR CAN YOU JUST KEEP IT OPEN-ENDED? UM, WELL, I THINK WE WOULD ALWAYS RECOMMEND SOME LAYERING, RIGHT? WHETHER THAT BE INTEREST OR BEHAVIORS, BECAUSE WE DO, YES, WE, WE, WE DON'T WANT, OR I, I BELIEVE THE QUOTE WAS, WE DON'T WANT JUST TOUR BUS AFTER TOUR BUS AFTER TOUR BUS. WE, WE WANT MORE THOUGHTFUL VISITORS. UM, AND, AND SO I THINK AS LONG AS WE UNDERSTAND THAT THEY'RE MORE FUNCTIONING IN A WAY TO HELP KEEP THE MESSAGING ON BRAND AND TO KEEP, UM, OUR FOCUS ON THINGS THAT THOSE PERSONAS WOULD VALUE, UM, AND THAT WE CAN PROMOTE AS PART OF, UH, THE SEDONA VISITOR EXPERIENCE, I THINK, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, YOU KNOW, WE, WE COULD LEAVE IT AT THAT, BUT WE FOR SURE WANT TO INCORPORATE THESE INTERESTS AND BEHAVIORS TO, TO [03:05:01] GET A MORE REFINED AUDIENCE THAT ISN'T COME ONE COME ALL, UM, YOU KNOW, COME, COME, COME ALL IF YOU'RE GONNA BE RESPECTFUL. SO, SO I JUST WANNA JUST HAVE ONE FINAL OKAY. COMMENT HERE. WHAT I'M HEARING IS THE FOLLOWING, AND PLEASE TELL ME IF I'M MISHEARING THESE PERSONAS THAT YOU'VE CREATED, YOU'RE USING THEM TO GUIDE WHAT YOUR IMAGERY IS. YOU'RE USING 'EM TO GUIDE WHAT WORDS YOU USE, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, THEY'RE NOT NECESSARILY RELATED TO ANY PARTICULAR INCOME RANGE BECAUSE ECO TOURS, ECO CONSCIOUS EXPLORERS COULD BE, THEY COULD MAKE 20 MILLION A YEAR FOR ALL, YOU KNOW, UM, BECAUSE THAT TO THEY ARE, UH, AND SO THE, THE RANGES HERE IS, IS CONFLATION. AND, UM, AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE DON'T NECESSARILY KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE CAME HERE WHO WERE ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORERS, WE'RE JUST USING THIS TO KEEP OURSELVES ON MESSAGE. WELL, I CAN'T TRACK IF THAT ECO-CONSCIOUS EXPLORER CAME IN MARKET. I CAN'T GET THAT. I, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT THESE TYPE IN, FROM WHAT I'VE SEEN, THEY CAN'T DO EVERYTHING, UM, THE TYPE OF ATTRIBUTION THAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR. BUT WE DO SERVE THAT AD BASED ON A PERSON'S WEB HISTORY THAT PUTS THEM INTO ONE OF THESE CATEGORIES. NOW, CAN I TRACK IF THAT PERSON IN THAT CATEGORY COMES IN? NO, I CAN JUST TRACK IF THAT THAT PERSON IN THAT ZIP CODE CAME IN. UM, 'CAUSE I DON'T HAVE THAT LEVEL OF REPORTING. BUT ANDREW, DO YOU HAVE ANY INSIGHT INTO, UM, THE INCOME QUESTION THAT SHE JUST ASKED? BECAUSE, UH, INCOME IS A BIG PART OF IT. CAN YOU EXPLAIN HOW INCOME PLAYS INTO HOW THIS AD IS SERVED ME HERE? CHRISTIAN, YOU, ME? YEAH. SO THERE'S KIND OF THREE DIFFERENT COLORS IN THE VENN DIAGRAM AS HOW I THINK ABOUT A COUNSELOR DUNN, AND THERE'S MORE TO IT THAN THAT. BUT THERE IS INCOME LEVEL IS ONE OF THE COLORS IN THE VENN DIAGRAM. GEOGRAPHY IS ONE OF THE COLORS IN THE VENN DIAGRAM, AND ESSENTIALLY ON ONLINE BEHAVIOR AND INTEREST IS ANOTHER COLOR IN THE VENN DIAGRAM. INCOME LEVEL'S PRETTY SELF-EXPLANATORY, GEOGRAPHY'S PRETTY SELF-EXPLANATORY. HOW DO WE COMMUNICATE HOW WE DEFINE BEHAVIOR AND INTERESTS? THE WAY THAT WE'VE INITIALLY SET OUT TO DO THAT AS FOLKS THAT ARE SUSTAINABILITY MINDED AND WANT TO EXPLORE TYPICALLY PUBLIC LANDS, WELLNESS SEEKERS, AND WANT TO CONNECT INTO THE SEDONA SPIRIT SPIRITUAL METAPHYSICAL ASSOCIATION CONCEPT THAT SORT OF, THEY ACCESS THE DIFFERENT MODALITIES THAT WE HAVE. THE ADVENTURE ENTHUSIAST IS MORE OF JUST A TYPICAL OUTDOOR RECREATIONIST AND A CULTURAL EXPLORER IS SOMEONE THAT WANTS TO EXPERIENCE ARTS AND CULTURE. NOW, WE COULD CERTAINLY JUST SAY WE'RE LOOKING FOR PEOPLE WITH ONLINE BEHAVIOR THAT ALIGN WITH THE DUMBED DOWN VERSION OF WHAT I SAID. BUT WHEN WE INITIALLY CREATED THIS, WE'RE LOOKING AT HOW DO WE COMMUNICATE THAT THIRD PART OF THE VENN DIAGRAM THAT'S LESS SELF-EXPLANATORY THAN MONEY AND, AND THEN WHERE YOU'RE FROM. ALL RIGHT, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS RIGHT NOW? OKAY, THE MAYOR WOULD LIKE TO MOVE TO, UH, THE PUBLIC COMMENT RIGHT NOW. SO FIRST UP, WE HAVE TIM PERRY AND YOU KNOW THE DRILL. GOOD EVENING COUNSELORS. MY NAME IS TIM PERRY, AND I LIVE IN SEDONA, WELL OVERLOOKING FOR THE MOMENT. UH, LAUREN'S ENORMOUS LOGICAL FALLACY, THE SIZE OF THUNDER MOUNTAIN. UH, THIS WHOLE PROPOSAL IS JUST SIMPLY INAPPROPRIATE. IT'S THE JOB OF BUSINESSES TO PROMOTE SEDONA AND TO PROMOTE THEIR BUSINESSES. IT'S NOT THE JOB OF THE CITY TO DO IT USING PUBLIC FUNDS. BUT THE OTHER ISSUE THAT ARISES WITH TONIGHT'S PROPOSAL IS HOW IT RELATES TO THE QUESTION THAT'S OFTEN ASKED, UH, IS, ARE, ARE DECISIONS IN GOVERNMENT MADE ON THE BASIS OF IGNORANCE, OR ARE THEY MADE ON THE BASIS OF MALICE? AND IN THIS CASE, A CASE CAN BE MADE FOR BOTH. DO COUNCIL AND STAFF ACTUALLY BELIEVE THAT THIS STEWARDSHIP MESSAGING IS ACTUALLY GONNA CHANGE ANYONE'S BEHAVIOR? DO YOU REALLY THINK PEOPLE ARE GONNA TAKE WHAT TRAIL YOU WANT OR VOLUNTEER ON THE VACATION? BECAUSE YOU SAID, SO UNFORTUNATELY, THERE'S THIS LITTLE THING CALLED PSYCHOLOGICAL REACTANCE, WHICH IS THE HUMAN TENDENCY TO DO THE OPPOSITE OF WHAT WE'RE TOLD. AND THAT'S WHY THE WHOLE STEWARDSHIP MESSAGING THING IS DOOMED TO FAILURE. PERSONALLY, I ALWAYS GO OFF TRAIL AND BUILD KARENS BECAUSE, OH, WELL, I KNOW IT GIVES THE COUNCIL ASSET INDIGESTION. BUT BEYOND [03:10:01] THAT, THE PROPOSAL FOR STEWARDSHIP MESSAGING ALSO SUGGESTS THAT CITY COUNCIL AND STAFF FIND IT NOT ONLY A GOOD IDEA, BUT SOMEHOW APPROPRIATE TO REACH INTO THE MINDS OF VISITORS AND ATTEMPT TO MANIPULATE THEIR THOUGHTS TO GET THE OUTCOME THEY WANT. THERE'S A TERM FOR THAT MENTAL RAPE. THIS ISN'T A TOURISM POLICY, THIS IS A RAPE POLICY. AND WHAT IT DOES IN THIS REGARD IS IT SHOWS OFF EVEN MORE OF ONE OF THE CRITICAL ELEMENTS TO THE DEFINITION OF PSYCHOPATHY AS PRESIDENT IN COUNSEL AND STAFF. THE ELEMENT OF A LACK OF EMPATHY. NORMAL PEOPLE WOULD NEVER THINK THAT HAVING SOMEONE GO IN THEIR HEADS AND MESS WITH THEIR DECISION MAKING IS A GOOD THING. BUT COUNSEL AND STAFF WHO DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THAT'S LIKE, THAT APPARENTLY WENT RIGHT OVER THEIR HEADS. THIS TOURISM PROPOSAL IS BOTH IGNORANT AND MALICIOUS AS WELL AS COMPLETELY UNNECESSARY AND SHOULD BE DEEP SIX. DAVID, THANKS FOR STICKING WITH US. UH, DAVID KEY RESIDENT OF SEDONA, OF COURSE, ALWAYS HERE ON BEHALF OF THE GREATER SEDONA CHAMBER OF COMMERCE AS THEIR LEADING EXECUTIVE. UM, I'VE HAD THE PLEASURE TO MEET WITH THE TOURISM TEAM AND, UH, EVEN PUT IN A RECOMMENDATION FOR AN ADDITION TO THE TOURISM TEAM, BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, I'VE, I'VE LEARNED A LOT OVER THESE PAST, WHAT DO WE GOT NINE MONTHS, UH, ALMOST 10, UM, THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU GUYS ARE, ARE KNOWLEDGEABLE AND BUILDING A NEW PROGRAM. I THINK I WANNA JUST CONTINUE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT YOU GUYS KNOW THAT BETTER THAN ANYBODY. UM, SO, YOU KNOW, AND, AND I KNOW THAT TOO, I'M VERY OVERTLY AWARE OF THAT PART OF OUR, YOU KNOW, HISTORY. UM, BUT, YOU KNOW, I'D, I'D ASK PEOPLE THAT THIS IS A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION. I DO SUPPORT THIS. UH, THE CHAMBER SUPPORTS PURSUING, SPECIFICALLY TESTING HIGHER INCOME MARKETS. AND I THINK, ANDREW, YOU KIND OF ALLUDED TO THIS, IT'S NOT JUST ABOUT THE INCOME, SO KIND OF ABOUT THE BEHAVIOR AND THINGS LIKE THAT. UM, SO, YOU KNOW, THE, THE AVERAGE FAMILY INCOME ISN'T WHAT IT USED TO BE. WHEN YOU LOOK AT THAT 60, 70, 80,000, YOU KNOW, DUAL INCOME, IDEALLY, IF YOU'RE FORTUNATE, I DON'T HAVE THAT LUXURY MYSELF. UM, BUT YOU KNOW, THAT WE, I, I SPEAK ON IT EVERY TIME I'M HERE, BUT INFLATION'S BEEN DESTROYING BUYING POWER. SO I THINK IT'S NOT A POLICY OF PURSUING LUXURY AT LARGE FOREVER, BUT IN THE NEAR TERM, WE DO HAVE TO RECOGNIZE THAT I THINK THE, THE EXPLORATION OF THAT TOPPER TOP END OF WHAT PEOPLE WOULD CONSIDER HIGH INCOME IS WORTH EXPLORING, UH, BEHAVIORS, UM, RELEVANT TO THAT TYPE OF TRAVELER. YOU KNOW, MAYBE THEY'RE FLYING INTO THE AIRPORT RATHER THAN DRIVING UP. UM, BUT I REALLY JUST WANNA SAY I, I REALLY ADMIRE THE EXPERTISE OF ANDREW COMING INTO THIS PROGRAM, BUILDING IT FROM THE GROUND UP. UM, LAUREN, WE'VE BEEN BUILDING THE PARTNERSHIP SINCE I GOT HERE. GRATEFUL FOR THE CONVERSATIONS WE'VE HAD. WE'VE BEEN EXCHANGING A LOT OF GREAT IDEAS TOO, WHICH I THINK IS SO IMPORTANT. UM, ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM, THE BUSINESS IMPROVEMENT DISTRICT, YOU KNOW, WE DO A LOT OF MARKETING TOO. UM, AND I THINK WE, OUR PROGRAMS HAVE A LOT TO LEARN FROM ONE ANOTHER IN THAT CONTINUED COLLABORATION. SO I'M JUST GONNA CONTINUE TO SHOW UP, SHOW MY SUPPORT, SPEAK WITH YOU ALL WHENEVER I GET THE OPPORTUNITY AND JUST LET YOU KNOW THAT WE'RE ALWAYS HAPPY TO, TO CONTINUE THESE CONVERSATIONS AND, UH, CONTINUE TO SUPPORT AN INCREASING BUDGET. YOU KNOW, THAT'S, THAT'S A BIG BOTTOM LINE FROM OUR BUSINESSES. UM, THEY WANT INCREASED EFFECTIVENESS AND HIGHER BUDGETS, AND OF COURSE, YOU CAN ONLY ACCOMPLISH THE EFFECTIVENESS BY REITERATING AND REFINING THE PROCESS. SO THANK YOU ALL FOR SUPPORTING THEIR EFFORTS. THANK YOU FOR COLLABORATING, UH, WITH THE TAB AND, AND LISTENING TO THEIR ADVICE ALONG THE WAY. AND OF COURSE, AS ALWAYS, UH, BEING GRACIOUS ENOUGH TO LISTEN TO THE CHAMBER OF COMMERCE AND, UH, THE PERSPECTIVE OF OUR EMPLOYERS. THANKS. THANK YOU, BOB PIKE. UH, GOOD EVENING COUNCIL. LATE EVENING COUNCIL, UH, BOB PIKE, UH, RESIDENT OF SEDONA. AND I'M ON THE TOURISM ADVISORY BOARD. UM, MANY OF YOU KNOW THAT FIVE OR SIX YEARS AGO I WAS ON A BUDGET SUBCOMMITTEE THAT REALLY ATTACKED THE, UH, THE BUDGET THAT WAS BEING SPENT ON TOURISM. AND, UH, AT THE TIME IT WAS ABOUT $3 MILLION. UM, AND ONE OF THE BIGGEST COMPLAINTS THAT I HAD WITH MANY OTHERS WAS THAT, UH, THE KPIS, WE WERE NOT LOOKING AT MEASURING THE RESULTS OF OUR EFFORTS. AND IN THIS DISCUSSION TODAY, I ALMOST, UH, FEEL SOME REGRET TO THAT BECAUSE [03:15:01] THERE'S A MYOPIA OF FOCUSING ONLY ON NUMBERS. AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOTTEN SO INTO THE WEEDS HERE THAT, UM, WE'RE BEING BLINDED TO WHAT WE'RE ACTUALLY ACCOMPLISHING. I MEAN, LET'S SAY ONLY 25% OF CELL PHONES ARE BEING CAPTURED, UM, BY THE DATA SYSTEM THAT WE'RE USING. SO THAT 12 TO ONE RETURN ON A, UH, ON SPEND IS ACTUALLY 48 TO ONE. YOU KNOW, WE DON'T KNOW WHAT PERCENTAGE OF ATTRIBUTION WE'RE REALLY GETTING, BUT WE KNOW DIRECTIONALLY, AND WE CAN USE THAT TO SAY THIS APPROACH WORKS BETTER THAN THAT APPROACH, BUT WE DON'T KNOW CONCRETELY. UH, THE OTHER THING THAT WE'RE, WE'RE NOT SPENDING TIME ON IS, YOU KNOW, THE WEBSITE TRAFFIC. YOU KNOW, SOME OF THE MORE TRADITIONAL THINGS. HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE WE DRIVING TO, TO FIND OUT ABOUT SEDONA, UM, THAT'S REALLY DOING WELL. AND SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE NEED TO STEP BACK AND NOT TRY AND OVERTHINK EVERYTHING. IT'S GOING WELL, AND, UH, YET THE ECONOMY HERE IS NOT SO GREAT. AND WE KNOW THAT THE TOP 20% ARE, ARE, THEY ARE THE REASON THAT THE ECONOMY IS GROWING. IT IS NOT THE BOTTOM 80%. AND SO THAT'S THE REASON WHY TAB WANTED TO GO UPPER INCOME IS, YOU KNOW, LET'S FIND OUT IS THAT A, A, A TARGET THAT WE OUGHT TO BE GOING AFTER? AND THE ONLY WAY TO FIND OUT IS TO DO IT NOW WHILE THERE'S STILL SOME ATTRIBUTION, BECAUSE WE MAY END UP IN ANOTHER COUPLE YEARS WITH LIKE NO ATTRIBUTION BECAUSE EVERYBODY'S GOTTEN INVOLVED IN DATA PRIVACY AND TURNING OFF THEIR PHONES. SO, UM, I, I'M APPLAUDING THE WORK THAT'S BEING DONE. UM, I APPLAUD THE EXTRA SALES GIVE OR EXTRA ADVERTISING SPEND BECAUSE OF THE ECONOMIC SITUATION TODAY. AND, UM, JUST DON'T OVERTHINK THIS. LET'S, LET'S STAY OUTTA THE WEEDS. LET'S LOOK AT THE FOREST. OKAY, THANK YOU. THANKS, BOB. OKAY, LAUREN. OKAY, SO WE'RE NOT DONE. UM, NOW WE ARE TO THE PROCUREMENT AUTHORITY AND DVA AMENDMENT PORTION OF PRESENTATION. SO BECAUSE IT WAS A ONE YEAR CONTRACT WITH THREE ONE YEAR EXTENSIONS, THE CITY MANAGER'S PROCUREMENT AUTHORITY TO ADD ANY MONEY TO THIS CONTRACT IS CAPPED AT $20,100 WITH THE FIRST CONTRACT BEING 281,000. WHILE THE CITY MANAGER WOULDN'T EXERCISE THIS AUTHORITY IN THIS WINTER CAMPAIGN DUE TO THE PREEMPTIVE ASK FROM TAB THIS TIME IN FUTURE CAMPAIGNS, IF BUSINESS AND THEREFORE SALES TAX PERFORMANCE IS POOR, LIKE IT WAS THIS SUMMER, STAFF WOULD LIKE THE ABILITY TO BE NIMBLE AND MOVE QUICKLY TO ADD MONEY TO A DESTINATION MARKETING CAMPAIGN. SOMETHING UNIQUE ABOUT THIS CONTRACT IS THAT IT IS DIRECTLY RELATED TO SALES AND BED TAX. SO WHEN THE BUSINESSES ARE UP, WE'RE UP AS WELL. AND THEN WHEN THE BUSINESSES ARE DOWN, WE'RE DOWN AS WELL. HENCE, THE IMPORTANCE OF BEING ABLE TO SUPPORT THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY WITH DESTINATION MARKETING CAMPAIGNS AND BEING ABLE TO ADD MONEY MORE QUICKLY TO A CAMPAIGN IF NEEDED. YOU CAN SEE THAT IF THE CONTRACT WERE TO HAVE BEEN APPROVED ALL AT ONCE RATHER THAN IN AMENDMENTS, THIS IS ASSUMING IT GETS FUNDED TONIGHT. IT WOULD BE OVER 1.5 MILLION, IN WHICH CASE THE CITY MANAGER WOULD HAVE THE, WOULD BE ABLE TO ADD 10% OR ONE 50 TO THE CONTRACT, WHICHEVER'S LOWER IN THIS CASE. THOSE ARE EQUAL. THEREFORE, STAFF IS ASKING FOR A ONE OFF APPROVAL WITH THE DVA CONTRACT FOR THE CITY MANAGER TO BE ABLE TO ADD UP TO $150,000 TO THAT CONTRACT. IN THE INSTANCE OF POOR BUSINESS AND SALES TAX PERFORMANCE. IF COUNCIL THINKS THIS IS A POSSIBILITY, STAFF WOULD LIKE TO UNDERSTAND THE PARAMETERS OR TRIGGERS THAT WOULD ALLOW THE CITY MANAGER TO ADD EXTRA MONEY. FOR EXAMPLE, CONSIDERING OUR SALES AND BED TAX REPORTS HAVE A 45 DAY DELAY, WOULD IT BE ANONYMOUS BUSINESS PERFORMANCE SURVEYS THAT INDICATE FLAT OR NEGATIVE SALES AND PROFIT HOTEL OCCUPANCY DOWN MORE THAN 2%. THAT'S JUST A COUPLE IDEAS TO CONSIDER. JUST PLANTING, PLANTING IDEAS IF YOU NEED A PLACE TO START, IF YOU WANNA GO THERE. AND THEN FINALLY, DO YOU APPROVE THE DVA CONTRACT FOR THE WINTER, SUMMER, AND ALWAYS ON SUSTAINABILITY MESSAGING CAMPAIGNS IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED 558,720 FOR A NEW TOTAL CONTRACT VALUE? NOT TO EXCEED $1,565,720. [03:20:02] THE BREAKDOWN OF THAT 558 7 20 IS $443,720. THAT'S FOR THE ADVERTISING ITSELF. UM, THAT INCLUDES THE 6% AD PLACEMENT FEE, SO THAT'S NOT ON TOP. UM, THAT ALSO INCLUDES THE $93,000 EXTRA WINTER SPEND. SO TAKE THAT IN MIND. IF THAT'S, UM, NOT GOING TO BE FUNDED, THEN THAT WOULD BE 93,000 LESS THAN THAT. UM, CREATIVE ASSET PRODUCTION, THAT'S, UM, VIDEO CREATION AND PHOTOGRAPHY, THAT'S 44,000. UM, BRIAN, THE LAST TIME THIS CAME, UM, YOU HAD QUESTIONED THAT NUMBER AND IT WAS, I THINK IT WAS CLOSER TO 60. UM, AND SO I DID TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION. IT'S LOWER THIS YEAR. AND THEN ACCOUNT MANAGEMENT SERVICES AND TRAVEL, THAT'S 71,000. SO THAT'S ALL THE STRATEGY, THE REPORTING, THE BEHIND THE SCENES, THE PLANNING, THE CHECK-INS, CHRISTIAN ON THE PHONE RIGHT NOW. UM, ALL OF THAT. SO THAT'S WHAT THAT 558,000 IS THAT WOULD FUND, UM, LIKE I SAID, THE, UM, ADVERTISING AND MARKETING STRATEGY WITH DVA, UM, THROUGH, UM, THAT WOULD BE TWO CAMPAIGNS AND THEN ARE ALWAYS ON SUSTAINABILITY MESSAGING THAT WE HAVE. WHAT QUESTIONS, WHAT DISCUSSION WOULD YOU LIKE TO HAVE? DO YOU WANT ME TO GO BACK TO THIS? WHERE CAN I TAKE US? MAYOR, CAN I ASK YOU A QUE YEAH. PROCEDURAL QUESTION? MM-HMM . SINCE THE FIRST QUESTION IN FRONT OF US, DO YOU WANT JUST STILL QUESTIONS OR CAN WE COMBINE QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS? OH, YOU CAN COMBINE THEM. OKAY. ALRIGHT. YOU WANNA START? SURE, SURE. OKAY. SO ON THIS PARTICULAR ITEM, UM, MY CONCERN IS THAT IF THE, IF WE PUT, IF WE CHANGE THIS, YOUR WORDING IS TO MAKE IT MORE NIMBLE, BUT MY CONCERN IS THAT IN BEING MORE NIMBLE, WE LOSE SOME OF OUR TRANSPARENCY BY IT NOT BEING FORCED TO COME BACK INTO COUNCIL. UM, AND THE AUTHORITY GOING TO THE, THE CITY MANAGER WHO I'M SURE TO MAKE EXCELLENT DECISIONS. BUT WHAT WE LOSE IS THE ABILITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO EASILY IDENTIFY AND KNOW WHAT WE'RE SPENDING. WHEN SOMETHING IS INCREASED, WE DON'T GET THAT FEEDBACK THAT WE MIGHT NEED. SO THAT IS MY CONCERN ABOUT PUBLIC NOTICE THAT A CHANGE IS GONNA HAPPEN TO A CONTRACT AND, AND HAVING PUBLIC INPUT AND PUBLIC DISCUSSION. SO DO YOU HAVE, NOW MAKE A QUESTION AFTER THE COMMENT, HOW WOULD YOU RESPOND TO THAT? ALL OF YOUR CONCERNS ARE VALID. OKAY. IT, IT'S, IT'S WEIGHING THOSE CONCERNS WITH, IS IT WORTH THE BENEFIT OF THE FACT THAT IF SALES AND BED TAX IS NEGATIVE, THAT MEANS OUR COFFERS FOR THAT MONTH AT LEAST, ARE NEGATIVE AS WELL. SO IT'S, IT'S LIKE WE'RE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER. AND SO THE THOUGHT IS, I AT LEAST WANTED TO BRING THE QUESTION TO COUNCIL, AND THE ANSWER MIGHT BE NO, AND THAT'S OKAY. BUT I WANTED TO ASK YOU ALL IF YOU WANTED ME TO ACT MORE LIKE A PRIVATE BUSINESS WHERE I COULD MOVE QUICKLY TO ADD MONEY BASED ON REQUIREMENTS THAT YOU ALL SET FOR THE CITY MANAGER TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT. AND THE OTHER THOUGHT, UM, FROM OUR LEGAL DEPARTMENT WAS THAT IF THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN A MORE TYPICAL CONTRACT IN WHICH YOU BRING, UM, IF IT'S A FOUR YEAR CONTRACT, YOU BRING THE NOT TO EXCEED AMOUNT. THAT'S A REALLY HARD THING TO DO IN THIS SITUATION BECAUSE I, IT, IT'S HARD FOR ME TO PREDICT TWO YEARS FROM NOW WHAT COUNCIL THINKS SHOULD BE IN DESTINATION MARKETING. UM, AND SO THEREFORE IT IS IN THESE ONE YEAR EXTENSIONS THAT I BRING THINGS TO YOU. BUT IF IT WAS LIKE WE DO ALL OF OUR OTHER CONTRACTS WHERE WE HAVE A FOUR YEAR CONTRACT AND IT'S, AND NOT TO EXCEED AMOUNT, THEN ANNETTE WOULD HAVE THE PROCUREMENT AUTHORITY IF WE WERE BASING IT ON WHAT THE CONTRACT, IF IT'S FUNDED TONIGHT, WOULD BE, SHE WOULD HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO ADD UP TO ONE 50 OR 10%. SO THAT WAS THE THINKING BEHIND IT. BUT LIKE I SAID, WHAT YOU SAID ARE ALL VALID CONCERNS. RIGHT. I, THOSE WEIGH VERY HEAVY ON ME, THOSE CONCERNS. UM, BUT ALSO I'M, I'M QUESTIONING THE TIMELINESS BECAUSE WE HAVE, IN THE SECTION YOU JUST SAID PREVIOUSLY, IF THE $250 THOUSAND DOLLARS CAMPAIGN IS APPROVED, THAT CAMPAIGN LAUNCHES ON OCTOBER 15TH. MM-HMM . TODAY IS OCTOBER 14TH. MM-HMM . SO, SO WHY ARE WE NOT NIMBLE? WE, WE WERE ABLE TO MOVE PRETTY QUICKLY ANYWAY. SO WHY WOULD WE NEED TO TAKE THIS EXTRA STEP TO BE ABLE TO REACT TO THINGS TIMELY WHEN WE SEEM TO BE PRETTY TIMELY? I WOULD ARGUE THAT IS A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SCENARIO IN THAT, UM, TO HAVE SOMEONE WHO WORKS IN-HOUSE FOR [03:25:01] US CREATE ADS AND HAVE WEEKS TO PRODUCE THEM BECAUSE HE HAD EITHER PREVIOUS IMAGES OR IMAGES THAT WE'VE TAKEN WITHIN THE LAST THREE WEEKS TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT THAN REALIZING THAT BUSINESS PERFORMANCE. SO LET'S SAY IT'S THE 30TH OF THE MONTH. THAT DAY CLOSES, PROBABLY HALFWAY THROUGH THE MONTH, THE BUSINESS OWNERS STARTING TO GET JITTERY BECAUSE THINGS DIDN'T GO WELL. AND BY THAT 30TH OF THE MONTH, THEY KNOW I AM DOWN THIS MONTH. THE FASTEST THAT I COULD COME TO YOU ALL WOULD BE FOUR WEEKS IN ORDER FOR ME TO MEET THE REQUIREMENTS OF PUTTING TOGETHER AN AGENDA BILL WITH THE PUBLIC NOTICE AND, AND DOING ALL OF THAT. AND I AGREE THAT THE TRANSPARENCY IS THE BENEFIT IN THAT SITUATION. THE NEGATIVE IS THAT TO A BUSINESS OWNER, THEY'RE GONNA SAY, I DON'T HAVE FOUR WEEKS. I NEED HELP NOW. SO THAT'S WHY, UM, THAT TURNAROUND WAS VERY QUICK IN THE SUMMER. UM, BUT IT WAS STILL ABOUT THREE WEEKS OF LEAD TIME BETWEEN WHEN I COULD HAVE TURNED ON MORE MONEY TO ADVERTISING TO WHEN IT ACTUALLY HAPPENED. BUT I HAVE THE IMPRESSION THAT THERE ARE OTHER WAYS THAT WE CAN EXPEDITE THIS AS OPPOSED TO, BECAUSE THE, THE FOUR WEEKS THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ARE IN OUR REGULAR MEETING SCHEDULE, IF THERE WAS A, A, A A CRISIS, SOMETHING TO RESPOND TO, WE DO HAVE THE ABILITY TO CALL FOR A MEETING WITH, YOU KNOW, WHAT, IS IT 24 OR 48 HOURS NOTICE, UM, YOU KNOW, FOR SOMETHING TO BE POSTED IF THERE WAS SOMETHING THAT REQUIRED, YOU'RE SAYING, OR IT SOUNDS TO ME LIKE I'M, WHAT I'M HEARING IS THAT THERE'S AN IMMEDIATE ISSUE THAT WE'VE JUST DISCOVERED BECAUSE IT'S THE 30TH, THE MONTH, WE NEED TO RESPOND TO THAT QUICKLY. WELL THEN THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WOULD RISE TO THE LEVEL OF IT BEING SOMETHING WHERE WE CALL IN A SPECIAL MEETING AND WE DO THE ROUNDS AND SAY, CAN EVERYBODY GET IN THERE FOR 30 MINUTES ON THE NEXT TUESDAY OR THE NEXT THURSDAY, OR WHATEVER IT IS. SO I, I THINK IF IT'S AN EMERGENCY AND YOU'RE LOOKING FOR A RESPONSE TO BE AN AUTOMATIC AUTHORITY ON CONTRACTS, I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT'S THE RIGHT RESPONSE, YOU KNOW, TO THAT EMERGENCY. SO THAT COUPLED, I MEAN, I WANT, I'M REALLY INTERESTED TO HEAR WHAT MY COLLEAGUES HAVE TO SAY IF THEY CAN TURN ME AROUND. BUT MY INITIAL INSTINCT ON THIS IS THAT THERE'S TOO MUCH AT STAKE FOR, YOU KNOW, PUBLIC INFORMATION HERE. UNDERSTOOD. DEREK, IF YOU'RE GIVEN THIS AUTHORITY, WHETHER IT'S 150 OR SOMETHING ELSE, ARE THERE PARTICULAR TRIGGER POINTS THAT YOU HAVE IN MIND THAT YOU PREFER, THAT YOU THINK WOULD BE BEST REPRESENTATIVE OF WHAT THE TRIGGER POINTS WOULD BE? YEAH, UM, I MEAN, YOU PROBABLY, I ASSUME YOU HAVE SOMETHING IN MIND. YEAH. SO, UM, OUR PREFERENCE, SOME OF THE THINGS THAT I MENTIONED, LIKE, UM, IF, UH, IF THAT SALES AND OR AT THE PROFIT, UM, AND SALES AT A BUSINESS IS ZERO OR LESS, THAT THAT WOULD BE A TRIGGER POINT FOR ME. THESE ARE THE TYPES OF THINGS THAT WE LOOKED AT WHEN WE CALLED THAT EMERGENCY SESSION. THE THINGS THAT I, THAT WE LOOKED AT WERE OCCUPANCY. UM, AN ANONYMOUS BUSINESS SURVEY IN WHICH FOLKS TOLD US, OH, WE ASKED SEVERAL QUESTIONS. WE ASKED, HOW WAS MAY, HOW WAS JUNE AND WHAT IS YEAR TO DATE? UM, AND IF ALL, AND MANY OF THOSE CAME IN AS NEGATIVE, AND THE, THE, THE GAINS THAT THEY GOT IN THE SPRING DID NOT MAKE UP FOR THE LOSSES THAT THEY HAD IN MAY AND JUNE. UM, WE LOOKED AT VEHICLE TRAFFIC, WE LOOKED AT VEHICLE TRAFFIC VEHICLE COUNTER THAT WE HAVE. AND WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS ESSENTIALLY LIKE TOURISM FORECASTING. UM, WE'VE GOT KIND OF THIS LIKE DOMINO EFFECT OF ACCESS TO DATA AROUND TOURISM PERFORMANCE. OBVIOUSLY CITY SALES AND BED TAX IS, I LIKE TO CALL THAT SORT OF THE GOSPEL OF KIND OF PERFORMANCE, ALTHOUGH I JUST ALLUDED TO THERE BEING SOME DISCREPANCIES BETWEEN THE, YOU KNOW, JUNE AND JULY. SO NOTHING'S PERFECT, BUT THAT IS REALLY WHAT WE LOOK AT IN TERMS OF CITY REVENUE AT LEAST, RIGHT? AND THAT'S WHY IT'S THE MOST, MOST THERE. BUT IT ALSO HAS A TWO MONTH LAG TO IT. SO IF OUR CAMPAIGNS ARE RUNNING TWO TO THREE MONTHS, WE CAN'T WAIT FOR SALES AND BED TAX RETURNS TO MAKE A DECISION. 'CAUSE THAT'S JUST THE CAMPAIGN'S OVER BY THE TIME WE GET THAT INFORMATION. UM, WHEN WE LOOK AT SMITH TRAVEL RESEARCH, SO THE HOTEL DATA THAT I SHARE THAT'S GOT ABOUT A 30 ISH DAY LAGS, SO WE CAN HAVE THAT, THAT'S A VERY TRUSTED, TRUSTED RESOURCE FOR US. IT IS A LIMITED STUDY AREA. WE DO HAVE THE SHORT TERM RENTAL PERFORMANCE DATA. UM, WE'VE ALSO GOT REALLY THE ADVENT OF THE TOURISM BUSINESS PERFORMANCE AND OUTLOOK SURVEY. WE PILOTED THIS IN JULY. UM, WE INTEND TO, REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE OUTCOME OF THIS QUESTION IS, UM, OUR TEAM WILL DO THIS ON A QUARTERLY BASIS AND ARE REALLY TRYING TO WORK WITH THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY TO GET ACCESS TO THAT ANONYMIZED BUSINESS PERFORMANCE DATA. UM, [03:30:01] AND THEN IT'S ALSO VEHICLE COUNTS, UM, OR WHAT WE SORT OF OWN WITHIN THE CITY ITSELF. UM, IF WE WANTED TO GET BIGGER, WHICH I'M NOT RECOMMENDING, YOU COULD LOOK AT, UM, SKY HARBOR THROUGHPUT IN THE AIRPORT, BUT THAT'S NOT TIED TO WHAT I WOULD SAW SEDONA PERFORMANCE. SO, YOU KNOW, LOOK AT TOURISM FORECASTING. I WOULD LOOK AT DATA WITHIN THE CITY WE HAVE ACCESS TO. AND REALLY, YOU KNOW, IF WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE A DECISION WITHIN A 30 DAY PERIOD OF TIME, YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE OCCUPANCY AND KIND OF LODGING PERFORMANCE DATA THAT WE GET MIXED WITH TOURISM BUSINESS PERFORMANCE AND OUTLOOK DATA. AND THEN I REALLY WANT TO UNDERSTAND ANY CORRELATIONS BETWEEN REVENUE AND VEHICLE COUNTS. WE HAVEN'T QUITE GOTTEN THERE YET, BUT THAT IS A REALLY INTERESTING DATA SET THAT WE COULD PUT INTO THE MIX OF CRITERIA THAT WE USE TO DETERMINE, YOU KNOW, IF CERTAIN CONDITIONS ARE NOT BEING MET IN TERMS OF PERFORMANCE, DO WE TRIGGER ESSENTIALLY AN ADDITIONAL SPENDING ON THE CAMPAIGN? OKAY. I'M GOOD. SO I, I WANNA COME BACK TO WHAT, UH, LAUREN SAID BEFORE, IF THIS WAS A STANDARD CONTRACT, WHICH IT, IN MY OPINION IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN, BUT I DO UNDERSTAND WHY IT WASN'T. WE STARTED OUT, WE HAD NO IDEA IF WE WERE GONNA WORK WELL WITH THIS COMPANY OR NOT WORK WELL WITH THEM, HOW MUCH WE WERE GONNA SPEND. SO WE STARTED OUT PRETTY SMALL. ALL OF OUR OTHER CONTRACTS, THE VALUE OF THE CONTRACT, WHETHER WE ACTUALLY SPEND THE MONEY OR NOT, IS A TOTAL FOR THE NUMBER OF YEARS. IT'S NOT A TOTAL FOR ONE YEAR. IT'S A TOTAL FOR FOUR YEARS IN THIS EXAMPLE. OTHERS MIGHT BE, UH, FEWER YEARS IF WE HAD A TOTAL. AND REMEMBER, WE HAVE IN ALL OUR CONTRACTS HAVE AN OUT CLAUSE FOR, FOR FUNDING OUT OR TERMINATION FOR CONVENIENCE. SO WE'RE NOT STUCK AND WE HAVE A FOUR YEAR CONTRACT. BUT IN THIS INSTANCE, UNLIKE OTHER STANDARD CONTRACTS, WE DID IT YEAR BY YEAR. AND SO IT WAS DETERMINED THAT THE CITY MANAGER'S AUTHORITY WAS BASED ON YEAR ONE. SHE HAS THE AUTHORITY TO APPROVE AMENDMENTS UP TO 10% OF THE VALUE OF THE CONTRACT. BUT BECAUSE OF THE WAY THIS CONTRACT WAS STRUCTURED, HER AUTHORITY IS ONLY ON THE FIRST YEAR SPEND AND EACH YEAR IT HAS INCREASED. SO I THINK WE SHOULD CONSIDER LOOKING AT, SO THERE'S TWO YEARS LEFT IN THE CONTRACT LOOKING AT A TWO YEAR SPEND AND ADD THAT TO THE CONTRACT IN THIS AMENDMENT SO THAT WE LOOK AT FUNDING IT NOW FOR THE NEXT TWO YEARS INSTEAD OF COMING BACK CONSTANTLY WITH AMENDMENT AFTER AMENDMENT AFTER AMENDMENT. IT'S A LOT OF WORK FOR THEM TO PUT THIS TOGETHER. AND, AND YOU ASK KATHY, WHY DOES IT TAKE FOUR WEEKS? IT'S OUR OWN PROCESS THAT REQUIRES THIS. WE COULD CHANGE OUR PROCESS, BUT DO WE REALLY WANNA DO THAT? I'M NOT SURE THAT'S A GOOD IDEA FOR EMERGENCIES. AND IT'S ONLY AN EMERGENCY IN THIS ONE PARTICULAR AREA OF TOURISM SPENDING. AND I KNOW IT IS A SENSITIVE SUBJECT IN THE COMMUNITY, BUT I THINK WE'RE HARMING OURSELVES BECAUSE WE'RE REQUIRING OUR STAFF TO DO SO MUCH PREPARATION. THEY REALLY CAN'T BE NIMBLE. AND OUR, AND OUR APPROVAL OF $50,000, WHICH WAS SMALL, HOWEVER IT WE'RE DOING IT AT THE SAME TIME THAT WE'RE STRUGGLING , IN OTHER WORDS, WE'RE DOING IT IN THE SUMMER, NOT IN ANTICIPATION OF THE SUMMER. SO IT'S A CONUNDRUM. YOU KNOW, I I THINK WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO BITE THE BULLET AT SOME POINT AND DECIDE WHETHER MARKETING SHOULD BE YEAR ROUND AND THEREFORE EASIER JUST TO PUT A CONTRACT TOGETHER OR WE DO A ANTICIPATION. AND THEN WE TAKE THIS, FOR EXAMPLE, THESE NEXT TWO YEARS, WE ASSIGN A NUMBER TO IT. AND THEN IT'S ONLY IN AN EXTRAORDINARY INSTANCE WHERE THE CITY MANAGER WOULD HAVE THAT AUTHORITY TO APPROVE AN AMENDMENT WITHOUT HAVING TO COME BACK TO COUNCIL, WHICH DOESN'T MEAN THAT THEY DON'T COME BACK TO COUNCIL TO TALK ABOUT. IT JUST MEANS THEY CAN MOVE QUICKLY AND THEY DON'T HAVE TO PREPARE AN AGENDA BILL AND DO ALL OF THAT. SO WHAT DO YOU THINK? HOW WOULD YOU LIKE TO PROCEED? BRIAN? THANK, COME HERE. I THINK IN THE INNOVATIVE THOUGHT THERE OF LET'S JUST GO AHEAD AND CONTRACT FOR THE REMAINING PERIOD, I DON'T [03:35:01] KNOW THAT THAT'S PRACTICAL FOR LAUNCHING A CAMPAIGN TOMORROW, SHOULD WE CHOOSE TO WANT TO DO SO. SO WHILE I THINK THERE'S MERIT IN THAT IDEA, I'M NOT SURE IT'S PRACTICAL FOR GETTING GOING IN THIS MOMENT, BUT WE COULD DO IT RIGHT NOW. BUT, BUT THEY WOULD NEED, BUT DVA HASN'T PROPOSED WHAT THE FOLLOWING YEAR WOULD COST. WE COULD HEDGE A BET. YOU WHAT? WE COULD HEDGE A BET AND THEN COME BACK IF I NEED AN AMENDMENT. OKAY. SO THAT'S ONE OPTION CONCERNING CITY MANAGER AUTHORITY FOR EMERGENCY SPENDING. LIKE I'M OKAY WITH THAT. UM, BUT I THINK WE NEED, AND, AND IT'S PUBLIC FROM THE STANDPOINT THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT GRANTING IT, IT'S PUBLIC THAT I WOULD WANT A AGREED UPON SET OF TRIGGERS. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SOME, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT TONIGHT WE'RE GONNA BE ABLE TO SAY, OH YEAH, THESE ARE THE THREE, OR THESE ARE THE FOUR OR THE FIVE, WHATEVER. UM, BUT THAT'S PUBLIC ALSO. SO AS LONG AS THIS BODY AGREES TO A PUBLICLY AGREES TO, HEY, HERE'S THE METHODOLOGY BY WHICH WE'RE GRANTING THE AUTHORITY TO GO AHEAD AND MAKE THESE EMERGENCY SPENDS, THEN I DO THINK THAT THAT'S TRANSPARENT, UH, IN THAT CASE. AND I'M GOOD WITH THAT. UM, I DO HAVE A NUMBER OF OTHER COMMENTS AND I'M HAPPY TO HOLD OFF ON UNTIL WE KIND OF NAIL THIS PARTICULAR PIECE OF THE DISCUSSION THOUGH. SO I'LL YIELD PETE. YEAH, THANKS MAYOR. I, I WISH I COULD SEPARATE THE COMMENTS THAT I WANNA MAKE INTO THE BUCKETS THAT YOU, YOU KNOW, AND I DON'T THINK I CAN. SO I WANNA START BY JUST RECAPPING WHAT I'VE HEARD TONIGHT. WE STARTED OFF BY TALKING ABOUT THE ECONOMY. OH, THAT CHART WAS, IT'S OKAY. REALLY INTERESTING WAY OF LOOKING AT THOSE ECONOMY CHARGES. CERTAINLY WE'VE ALL HEARD ABOUT, RIGHT? THE INTERNATIONAL ECONOMY, THE, OUR NATIONAL ECONOMY, THE REGIONAL ECONOMY, AND, YOU KNOW, PERCEPTIONS OF THE ECONOMY. AND THEN A COUPLE ON THAT CONSUMER DECISIONS ON TRAVEL AND VACATIONS AND SPENDING. SO I, UH, SO THAT'S WHERE WE STARTED. WE, WE ALSO THEN TALKED ABOUT REVENUES BEING GENERATED FROM HOTELS AND STRS, AND WE SEE THIS KIND OF CHANGE IN THE PATTERN. MAYBE WE ALSO TALKED ABOUT TAX REVENUES MIGHT NOT BE AS BAD AS WE THOUGHT THEY WERE AT SOME EARLIER PART BECAUSE THINGS MIGHT BE CHANGING. SO ALL THESE THINGS ARE KIND OF BUILDING UP IN MY HEAD TO SAY, I, I'M NOT SURE WHAT THE EMERGENCY OR WHAT THE PROBLEM IS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO SOLVE HERE. I HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT A DECISION TO JUST SPEND MORE VERSUS CHANGE HOW YOU'RE SPENDING TARGET SOMETHING. IF, IF I WAS A BUSINESS OWNER AND MY PEOPLE WERE COMING TO ME TO SAY, JUST SPEND MORE, THAT JUST SOUNDS LIKE THE EASY DECISION RATHER THAN, YOU KNOW, A A MORE THOUGHTFUL STRATEGIC DECISION. SO I GET SOMEONE COMFORTABLE THERE. I ALSO THINK ABOUT THE OPPORTUNITY COSTS. WHAT DIDN'T WE TALK ABOUT TONIGHT? IF YOU, YOU KNOW, WE INITIALLY WERE GONNA SPEND WHATEVER IT WAS ON THE WINTER CAMPAIGN AND THE TAB INCREASED IT BY A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS. WHERE ELSE MIGHT WE SPEND THAT A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS, EITHER WITHIN YOUR DEPARTMENT OR WITHIN THE CITY TO SORT OF DO SOMETHING BETTER? WE DIDN'T HAVE ANY PRESENTATION TO US ABOUT A RATIONALE. IS A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS MORE COMING OUTTA CONTINGENCY THE RIGHT DECISION FOR US TO MAKE TODAY? I I, I'M NOT CONVINCED BY THAT YET. AND THE FACT THAT IT'S COMING OUT OF A GENERAL CONTINGENCY VERSUS A CONTINGENCY THAT WE MIGHT SET UP IN FUTURE CONTRACTS HERE ABOUT TOURISM, THAT'S THE RIGHT WAY TO THINK ABOUT. THIS IS A VERY PREDICTABLE CONVERSATION TO HAVE. AND THE FUTURE CONTRACTS SHOULD HAVE SOME TYPE OF, SOME AMOUNT OF MONEY SET ASIDE FOR ECONOMIC SPENDING WITH SOME CRITERIA THAT IS, WE'RE NOT READY TO MAKE THAT DECISION TONIGHT. BUT, YOU KNOW, THAT'S MAYBE A LESSON LEARNED. AND I THINK WE JUST DO THAT GOING FORWARD. WE DON'T KIND OF CORRECT THAT ERROR TONIGHT. I'M, I GET CONCERNED ABOUT MAKING LAST MINUTE DECISIONS TO RATE CONTINGENCIES AND CHANGE SPENDING PLANS WITHOUT A LOT OF RATIONALE THAT I'VE HEARD, YOU KNOW, LAYER ON TO THAT, THAT I KEEP HEARING KPIS ABOUT MARKETING AND SPEND AND REVENUE. AND I HAVEN'T SEEN ANY KPIS ABOUT IMPACT OF TOURISM ON OUR COMMUNITY YET. RIGHT? THAT'S IN YOUR PURVIEW TO GET GOING. AND, AND I, I HAVEN'T SEEN ANY RESULTS BASED KPIS TO TALK ABOUT THE IMPACT OF, OF WHAT WE'RE DOING THIS. AND WE SHOULDN'T ONLY TALK ABOUT TRIGGERS TO SPEND MORE, THERE'S TRIGGERS TO SPEND LESS TOO, RIGHT? THAT NEEDS TO BE PART OF THE CONVERSATION. SO I'M NOT REALLY IN A MOOD TO APPROVE ADDITIONAL SPENDING BEYOND WHAT THE ORIGINAL PLAN WAS. THAT'S KIND OF WHERE MY HEAD IS AT. [03:40:01] I DON'T KNOW HOW TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM. I TOO HAVE, I THINK I ALLUDED TO THAT I HAVE PROBLEMS WITH GIVING ONE OFF AUTHORITIES TO DO SOMETHING THAT'S NOT PART OF OUR REGULAR PROCESS. THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO ME. AND I THINK THAT WE'VE FIXED THIS WITH HOW WE CONTRACT WITH DVA OR THE TOURISM BUDGET IN GENERAL IN THE FUTURE. THAT'S IN THE FUTURE, NOT NECESSARILY, UH, TONIGHT FOR ME. SO THAT'S MY THOUGHTS. ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANY COMMENTS THEY WANNA MAKE? IS THERE A GO AHEAD. SORRY. UM, SO I DID WANNA COMMENT ON THIS AS WELL. UM, EVERYTHING THAT YOU SAID, COUNCILOR FURMAN RESONATES, RIGHT? BUT WE'RE, OUR BUDGET IS FIXED FOR THIS FISCAL YEAR. WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING EXCEPT MOVE THINGS FROM THE CONTINGENCY PLAN. SHOULD WE HAVE A, A DEEP CONVERSATION AROUND ALL OF THIS? LIKE WHEN WE GO TO PRIORITIES? PROBABLY SHOULD, BECAUSE PRIORITIES IS THE BEGINNING OF OUR BUDGET DISCUSSION FOR FISCAL YEAR 27. SO I, I GET THAT AND I THINK WE, WE SHOULD DO THAT. AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, IF WE DECIDE WE WANNA CHANGE THE BUDGET IN 27 AND GIVE THEM THEIR OWN CONTINGENCY, THAT'S GREAT. BUT DOES THAT SOLVE THE PROBLEM ABOUT WHAT WE'RE DOING IN 26 WHERE WE'RE ALREADY APPARENTLY SEEING A PROBLEM, UM, IN, IN THE COMMUNITY, MEANING THAT WE ARE IN THIS ALTOGETHER. AND IF THEY DON'T DO WELL, IF PEOPLE AREN'T COMING HERE AND, AND STAYING PLACES AND PAYING BED TAX, IF NOT BUYING THINGS, THERE'S NO SALES TAX, THEN, UM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE IMPACTED AS A CITY AND SHOULD WE POTENTIALLY HAVE TO SPEND LESS? WELL, MAYBE. AND, YOU KNOW, THAT PROBABLY WOULDN'T HURT US EITHER. 'CAUSE YOU KNOW, WE HAVE BEEN SORT OF BLESSED AS AN ECONOMY WITH, UM, A LOT OF MONEY, UM, WITHIN OUR COMMUNITY AND, AND YOU KNOW, NOT EVERY COMMUNITY HAS BEEN THIS LUCKY. BUT THAT'S ANOTHER CONVERSATION TO HAVE WHEN WE TALK ABOUT PRIORITIES. AND WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE BUDGET HERE, I THINK THIS IS VERY SPECIFIC AND, YOU KNOW, THIS IS ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT WE BELIEVE THEY SHOULD COME TO US ASKING FOR MORE MONEY IN ORDER TO IMPROVE THE SITUATION. UM, THAT THEY BELIEVE THEY CAN IMPROVE, BUT BY THE TIME THEY GET TO US, IT'S ALREADY TOO LATE FOR THEM TO DO ANY OF THE WORK THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE TO GET IT INTO THE MARKETPLACE. AND I THINK THAT THAT'S THE CRITICAL PIECE HERE. UM, BECAUSE WE CAN DO A YES, BUT RIGHT TO COUNSELOR, OH, SORRY, VICE MAYOR, UM, FOLTZ POINT. UM, I THINK THE, I THINK THE PIECES THAT ARE DIFFICULT FOR US ARE WHAT ARE THOSE TRIGGERS? AND, AND YOU'RE CORRECT. SOME OF THOSE TRIGGERS SHOULD BE NOT SPENDING THE MONEY, LIKE, HEY, WE WE'RE COMING TO YOU TODAY TO TELL YOU WE'RE NOT GONNA GO SPEND SOME MONEY. BOY, I WOULD LOVE TO HEAR THAT FROM ONE OF OUR DEPARTMENTS. THAT'S NOT USUALLY WHAT WE HEAR. BUT TO SAY THAT THESE ARE, YOU KNOW, THESE ARE WHAT'S GOING ON. THIS IS WHAT'S GOING ON IN OUR ECONOMY AND WE'RE HAPPY WITH WHERE WE'RE AT, THAT WOULD BE GREAT. AND WE'RE GONNA GIVE YOU MONEY BACK TO PUT SOMEWHERE ELSE IN THE BUDGET. AWESOME. WE KNOW THAT'S NEVER HAPPENING. SO THE QUESTION AROUND WHETHER OR NOT WE HAVE TO WAIT, I THINK OUR PROCESS, I THINK IT IS OUR PROCESS, BUT WE DON'T WANNA CHANGE EVERYTHING TO THE MAYOR'S POINT. SORRY, I'M GETTING, IT'S OKAY. I'M STILL WORKING ON THE TERMS. UM, BUT WE CAN DO A YES SPOT AND SAY, LOOK, IF THIS TRIGGERS, THESE TRIGGERS HAPPEN AND THIS GETS PULLED, AND WE'RE NOT IN SESSION, YOU DON'T HAVE TO WAIT FOR US TO BE IN SESSION, BUT WE EXPECT THERE TO BE SOME KIND OF REPORT THAT CAN BE THEN DISPERSED, NOT JUST BETWEEN US, BUT INSIDE OF THE COMMUNITY, SO THAT WHEN YOU DO THIS, THAT'S ONE OF OUR, THAT'S ONE OF OUR CONDITIONS OF ALLOWING THIS TO HAPPEN. AND THEN WE HAVE ALL THE TRANSPARENCIES THAT WE HAVE, WHY THEY NEEDED TO DO IT WHEN IT WAS DONE, HOW MUCH WAS, WAS A, YOU KNOW, ACHIEVED. 'CAUSE MAY IT MAY NOT BE 150, WE'RE MAKING AN ASSUMPTION IT'S ALWAYS GOING TO BE 150. IT, IT MIGHT NOT BE THAT MUCH, BUT WE'RE, I THINK WE CAN GET ALL OF THOSE THINGS WITHOUT US CHANGING OUR PROCESS. AND ANYTHING WE WANNA DISCUSS AT A MORE DEEP LEVEL AROUND ALL OF THIS GOING FORWARD, I THINK THAT HAPPENS IN DECEMBER AND IT HAPPENS WITH OUR BUDGET, BUT IF WE WAIT UNTIL THEN, WE COULD HAVE HURT OURSELVES. SO THAT'S WHAT I HAVE TO SAY. [03:45:01] SO I THINK THAT THERE'S TWO, TWO THINGS FOR US TO TALK ABOUT. ONE IS, ARE WE READY TO SPEND $93,000 MORE? AND THEN THE SECOND THING IS HOW DO, HOW WE DO THAT? SO LET'S TALK ABOUT THE 93,000 AND WE'LL JUST DO A LITTLE WHO IS INTERESTED IN THE EXTRA SPEND? JUST THUMBS UP A LITTLE. YEAH, I COULD DO THAT. NO, NO. OKAY. SO WHAT DID YOU SAY? YEAH. ALL RIGHT. SO LET'S DO, LET'S DO THAT FIRST. WELL, WE JUST DID THAT. AND THEN I GUESS OUR MOTIONS ARE COMBINED, BUT THE, WE COULD JUST AUTHORIZE $93,000 OF AN AMENDMENT TO THE DVA CONTRACT WITHOUT GIVING AUTHORITY RIGHT. TO ANNETTE IF WE WANTED TO DO THAT, YES. BUT AT THIS POINT, UM, I'M ASKING FOR THE, UM, FISCAL YEAR 26, UM, SPENDING A STORY. WELL, THE WINTER CAMPAIGN, RIGHT? WINTER, SUMMER, AND THE ALWAYS ON EDUCATIONAL MESSAGING THAT WE DO, THAT'S ABOUT THREE TO $5,000 A MONTH THAT WE SPEND ON EITHER PAID SEARCH OR RIGHT. BUT THIS IS FISCAL YEAR 26. YES. YEAH. YES. SO IT'S, SO IT'S THE YEAR IN WHICH WE ARE CURRENTLY IN FOR A BUDGET THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN APPROVED. CORRECT. SO IT'S, AND THE ONLY THING OUT OF THAT 5 58, 7 20, THAT WASN'T PART OF MY BUDGET, IS THE 93,000. CORRECT. BUT WE COULD APPROVE THAT TONIGHT WITHOUT TALKING ABOUT THE NIMBLENESS. RIGHT. QUESTION THAT COULD COME BACK LATER IF PEOPLE AREN'T READY TO DEAL WITH THAT. SO THAT'S PART TWO, RIGHT? YES. SO LONG AS THE 93,000 IS THOUGHT OF AS THE 5 58 720 FOR THE ENTIRE CONTRACT. YES. WE, WE HAVE A MAJORITY OF COUNSEL THAT WANTS TO TO AUTHORIZE THE 93,000. YES. OKAY. SO THEN THE NEXT QUESTION IS, CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION ON THAT THOUGH? YEAH. HOW DOES THAT FACTOR IN, HOW DOES THAT AFFECT THE 250,000? IS THAT NUMBER IN THAT FOR THE YES, YES. SO IF WE HAD A MOTION, 'CAUSE I'VE WORKED, BEEN WORKING ON AN ALTERNATIVE HERE, SURPRISE, UM, THAT WOULD APPROVE THE $250,000 ON THE WINTER DESTINATION THAT WOULD INCORPORATE THE BOY THAT WAS A NEW YORK ACCIDENT , TO INCORPORATE THE 93,000 IN THAT. AM I CORRECT OR DO I HAVE TO STATE THAT SEPARATELY? NO, THE 5 58 7 20 INCLUDES THE TWO 50 AND IT INCLUDES THE 93,000. I'M TRYING TO, OKAY. I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT NUMBER I WOULD NEED TO PUT INTO AN ALTERNATIVE MOTION HERE. WHY DO YOU WANT AN ALTERNATIVE MOTION? BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE THE ONE THAT'S IN THE PACKET BECAUSE EVERYTHING IS COMBINED IN IT WITH THE AUTHORITY TO AMEND AND WE WANNA SEPARATE THAT OUT. BUT CAN YOU, YEAH. WOULD YOU SEPARATE THE 5 58 FROM THE PROCUREMENT AUTHORITY? ASK YES. YES. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE SAYING. YEAH. SO ISN'T IT THAT SIMPLE THEN? I I STILL DON'T KNOW THE NUMBER THEN IT, I THINK SHE'S SAYING THE NUMBER IS 5 58 7 20. YEAH. THAT'S THE AMENDMENT YOU WANT. CORRECT. OKAY. OKAY. OKAY. I GOT IT. SO IT'S EVERYTHING. IT'S EVERYTHING IN THE, IN THE MOTION UP TO THE COMMA. AND, AND THEN THERE'S, AND THEN YOU'RE GONNA WANT A SEPARATE MOTION THOUGH, AUTHORIZING THE $250,000 SPEND. YOU DON'T WANT THAT TOO. WELL, THAT'S WITHIN, BECAUSE WE WANTED TO TALK ABOUT THAT. I MEAN, THAT WAS, THAT WAS AN ASK YOU HAD IN HERE ABOUT HOW TO DO THAT 250. SO THAT'S WITHIN THE 5 58, IT'S WITHIN THAT. CORRECT. BUT YOU WANT, YOU WANT OR JUST DIRECTION ON THAT OR DID YOU WANT A MOTION ON THAT TO APPROVE THAT ALSO? NOT THE TWO 50, THE, THE AUTHORITY TO AMEND THE CONTRACT? NO, I GOT THAT PART. OKAY. I GOT THAT PART. I'M JUST ASKING. SHE HAD AN ASK. SORRY, LAUREN HAD AN ASK IN HERE ABOUT THAT, BUT I THINK YOU WERE JUST LOOKING FOR DIRECTION. YES. AND IF THERE WAS ANY OTHER CHANGES IN THAT PLAN FOR THE WINTER MARKETING, THEN I WOULD, I'D BE HAPPY TO HEAR ANY CONSENSUS ON THAT TOO. SO THE CURRENT MOTION ALSO HAS AN AUTHORIZATION FOR THE CITY MANAGER TO APPROVE FUTURE AMENDMENTS, BUT WE HAVEN'T DISCUSSED THIS AS TO WHETHER WE HAVE A MAJORITY FOR THAT, THAT, UH, PIECE OF THE MOTION. SO LET'S DO THAT. 'CAUSE MAYBE THE MOTION IS TOTALLY FINE AND MAYBE IT'S NOT. OKAY. SO WHERE ARE WE AT WITH THE, UH, AUTHORITY TO APPROVE? IS ANYBODY INTERESTED IN THAT TONIGHT? ONE 50. I THOUGHT WE ALL SAID THAT THERE WERE OTHER THINGS WE WANTED TO HAVE IN PLACE BEFORE WE COULD DO THAT. [03:50:01] YEAH, THE TRIGGERS. I THINK WE GOOD. I'M JUST CHECKING. SO THAT WE SPLIT THAT WE CAN SPLIT OUT THAT PIECE FROM THE MOTION. 'CAUSE THERE'S A MAJORITY THAT WANTS TO GRANT THE 500 PLUS THOUSAND, BUT I DIDN'T THINK THERE WAS A MAJORITY THAT WANTED TO DO THE PROCUREMENT. AM I RIGHT TONIGHT? CORRECT. NOT YET. MM-HMM . RIGHT? I SUPPORT DOING THE PROCUREMENT TONIGHT. IF WE CAN FIGURE OUT THE PARAMETERS. WE GOT IT. OKAY. UH, DO YOU SUPPORT THAT? NO. OKAY. SO I THINK WE HAVE A MAJORITY THAT DOES NOT SUPPORT IT. SO LET'S JUST DO THE MOTION TO SPEND THE MONEY. AND I THINK THE THIRD PIECE WAS WHETHER OR NOT WE APPROVE THE CAMPAIGN AT THE TWO 50. CORRECT? THAT WAS I WAS GETTING BEFORE. I THINK THAT'S JUST DIRECTION. I DON'T THINK THAT'S A MOTION. CORRECT. OKAY. I JUST HEARD JUDGE COUNCIL APPROVE ON THE SIDE. THAT'S WHAT I WAS LOOKING AT. I WAS LIKE, WAIT MINUTE. THERE'S ANOTHER ASK IN HERE, BUT NOW IT'S LIKE DISAPPEARED. BUT I THINK IT'S JUST FOR DIRECTION. OKAY. YOU READY FOR MOTION? YEAH. HOLD ON. I MEAN, I, I STILL WANTED TO HAVE DISCUSSION ON OTHER ELEMENTS OF THE PRESENTATION AND HELD OFF BECAUSE WE WERE DIGGING SPECIFICALLY INTO THIS. SO IF MY COLLEAGUES WILL INDULGE, I STILL HAVE SOME COMMENTS I'D LIKE TO BE ABLE TO MAKE. AND I THOUGHT PERHAPS COUNCILOR FURMAN DID AS WELL, OR HAVE YOU GOTTEN THOSE OUT? I, I THINK I MOSTLY GOT MY HEADS UP. OKAY. OKAY. GO AHEAD. OKAY. THANK YOU. I'LL BE BRIEF AND THANK YOU BOTH. I DON'T KNOW WHICH OF YOU, UH, WERE PART OF ANSWERING ALL THE QUESTIONS EARLIER, BUT YOU CERTAINLY SAVED 20 MINUTES HERE TONIGHT, I'M SURE. UM, EARLIER TODAY I COULD SPEND ON SOMETHING ELSE. OH, YEAH, HERE WE GO. UM, EARLIER TODAY, ALONG WITH THE MAYOR, UH, I ATTENDED THE LODGING COUNCIL MEETING, AND I THOUGHT IT WAS REALLY QUITE A, A PRODUCTIVE MEETING AS THE MEETING WENT ON. AND, AND WE TALKED ABOUT, UH, A VARIETY OF NOTIONS. THE MAYOR ALREADY TALKED ABOUT, UM, ONGOING MARKETING AS SOMETHING THAT WE SHOULD BE THINKING ABOUT AS PART OF THE BUDGET PROCESS COME. WELL, PRIORITY SETTING, PROBABLY DISCUSSION COME DECEMBER ALSO ABOUT, UH, EVENTS AND HAVING MONEY, UH, CONTINGENT MONEY FOR WHEN SIGNIFICANT EVENTS COME UP THAT WE COULD TAKE ADVANTAGE OF. AND THE GREAT EXAMPLE WAS THE PHOENIX MERCURY JUST MADE THE WNBA FINALS, WHICH NOBODY CAN PREDICT THAT HAPPENING, BUT THAT BROUGHT A BUNCH OF PEOPLE TO PHOENIX AT A TIME AT WHICH WE WOULD'VE ENJOYED BEING ABLE TO GET THEM UP HERE, UH, TO HELP OUT OUR TOURISM ECONOMY. SO THAT WAS ALSO A GOOD PUT. AND THEN ALSO, UH, WHAT I THOUGHT WAS INTERESTING, I, I'VE BEEN TRYING TO THINK ABOUT, YOU KNOW, HOW DOES OUR, HOW CAN WE UTILIZE OUR MARKETING TO SUPPORT OUR HOTELS IN PARTICULAR RELATIVE TO STR AND THE IDEA TODAY ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THE REDEFINE CAMPAIGN, SOMETHING AROUND, YOU KNOW, REDEFINE HOTELS. AND WHEN WE STARTED TALKING ABOUT THAT THIS MORNING, YOU KNOW, WE STARTED LEARNING THAT A NUMBER OF THE HOTELIERS IN THE AUDIENCE ARE DOING THINGS. THEY'RE INVESTING IN THEIR PROPERTIES TO OFFER EXPERIENCES. AND THAT WAS REALLY GOOD TO HEAR. UM, AND SO I THINK IT WOULD BE REALLY COOL FOR REDEFINE, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER IT IS, HOTELS, UH, HOWEVER YOU, YOU KNOW, YOU PHRASE IT AND THEN HAVE DRILL DOWN FROM THERE. LIKE, I THOUGHT THAT WAS REALLY COOL. UM, WE TALKED ABOUT THE PERSONAS AND THE FACT THAT ARTS, YOU KNOW, IT SAYS CULTURE, BUT YOU KNOW, OKAY, IF WE'RE A CITY ANIMATED BY THE ARTS, IS THAT PERSONA STRONG ENOUGH IN OUR MIX RIGHT NOW OF WHO WE'RE TRYING TO ATTRACT? AND I KIND OF THINK THE ANSWER IS NO. SO I THINK MORE EMPHASIS ON ART LOVERS, AND I KNOW THAT MAY COME AS A SHOCK TO SOME MM-HMM . UM, I DO THINK THAT THAT IS A PLACE WHERE WE HAVE OPPORTUNITY. UM, THERE'S BEEN A QUESTION ABOUT, YOU KNOW, DO WE HAVE THE MIX RIGHT OF LIKE WHAT MARKETS THAT WE'RE PURSUING? AND I THINK I'VE ARM WRESTLED A LITTLE BIT WITH BOTH OF YOU ABOUT THAT SAYING, OKAY, YOU KNOW, WE FINALLY ANSWERED THE QUESTION ABOUT DOES PHOENIX MATTER? LIKE, THAT WAS DRIVING ME CRAZY LIKE A YEAR AND A HALF AGO BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, HALF THE, UH, HOSPITALITY COMMUNITY WOULD BE LIKE, OH NO, DON'T MARKET A PHOENIX. WE DON'T WANT THEM. AND THE OTHER HALF ARE, YES WE DO. AND NOW THE DATA PROVES IT OUT. IT'S A VERY VALUABLE MARKET TO US. AND SO LOOKING AT THE DATA THAT YOU SHOWED EARLIER, AND THIS IS JUST A COMPARISON OF LIKE PHOENIX WITH A FLY MARKET LIKE CHICAGO. SO CHICAGO VISITS WERE 30% LONGER THAN PHOENIX VISITS. OKAY, THAT'S COOL. BUT THE ROI ON PHOENIX WAS 1400% HIGHER THAN CHICAGO. SO IN MY MIND, IF, IF WE'RE STRUGGLING, IF WE'RE TRYING TO CATCH UP A LITTLE BIT, IT SURE SEEMS LIKE THE LOW HANGING FRUIT REALLY IS PHOENIX. I KNOW WE WOULD HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT DO WE GET TO A POINT OF DIMINISHING RETURN? BUT YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK WE'RE THERE. YOU DON'T THINK WE'RE THERE. DVA TOLD YOU, AND IF YOU'RE NOT SPENDING A MILLION BUCKS [03:55:01] ON THE MARKET, YOU'RE PROBABLY NOT OVERSATURATING IT. SO I DO WONDER WHETHER WE'RE, YOU KNOW, REALLY EMPHASIZING THE RIGHT MARKETS AT THIS TIME WHEN THERE'S A HEIGHTENED CONCERN ABOUT THE AMOUNT OF REVENUE COMING INTO THIS MARKET. UM, COUPLE LAST THINGS COMPETING. YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW WE'RE, WE'RE SUFFERING NOT BECAUSE WE'RE LOSING SHARE, IT'S 'CAUSE IT'S A SMALLER PIE. RIGHT? AND, AND I THINK THAT GETS LOST IN SOME OF THE DISCUSSION, RIGHT? TOURISM HAS SHRUNK GLOBALLY, CERTAINLY IN THIS COUNTRY, AND WE'RE NOT ALONE IN THAT. SO I DON'T THINK WE'RE NECESSARILY SINGLED OUT, UH, BY ANY STRETCH. SO THE FACT THAT FOLKS ARE STRUGGLING IS NOT BECAUSE OUR MARKET IS FALTERING, IT'S THE PIE HAS SHRUNK. UM, I LIKE THE IDEA OF WORKING, BOOKING PACE INTO THE TRIGGERING ALGORITHM WHEN WE GET TO THAT. UM, AND THE MAYOR BROUGHT UP THE AIRPORT BANNER. UM, I DO GET CONCERNED THAT THAT'S JUST A, A VANITY SPEND OF DON'T I FEEL PROUD GOING DOWN THE ESCALATOR AND SEEING THE SEDONA, YOU KNOW, AIRPORT BANNER. YOU KNOW, I, I ASKED THE EXACT SAME QUESTION ABOUT HOW, HOW DO WE KNOW WHETHER THAT MONETIZES OR NOT AND, UH, THAT THAT WOULD STILL BE A, A CONCERN IN THE FUTURE. BUT OVERALL, AND, AND BECAUSE I SPEND IN MY BUSINESS LIFE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS ON MARKETING EVERY YEAR, LIKE, AND FOR TARGETING CONSUMER EYEBALLS, JUST LIKE WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE. AND IN FACT IT'S A HUNDRED THOUSAND HOUSEHOLD INCOME AND ABOVE. SO VERY SIMILAR TYPES OF PERSONAS. I TARGET THAT THE CITY'S TARGETING. AND I DO WANT TO COMPLIMENT OUR STAFF AND THE DVA PROGRAM THAT I DO SEE STRONG ROAS, STRONG ROI, THE METRICS THAT WE'RE MEASURING WITH GIVE ME CONFIDENCE AS A BUSINESS OWNER IF THIS WAS REALLY MIND TO OWN A HUNDRED PERCENT. AND I TREAT IT LIKE IT IS AS A COUNCIL MEMBER. RIGHT. UM, I I THINK THAT YOU GUYS REALLY ARE ON THE RIGHT TRACK WITH THIS AND, AND KUDOS TO YOU AND BOB, THANK YOU FOR REMINDING US TO NOT GET TOO CAUGHT UP IN THE WEEDS. POINT TAKEN. THANK YOU. UM, SO I THINK THAT'S MY PIECE ON THIS. THANK YOU. WE ARE WEEDY PEOPLE. OKAY. SO ARE WE READY FOR A MOTION TO, UH, INCREASE THE CONTRACT? JUST A SECOND. OKAY. DID YOU WRITE SOMETHING OR SHOULD WE JUST NO ONE'S, BUT WE CAN JUST USE IT AND YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I'M GONNA SAY. YEAH, WE, WE USE WHAT THERE IS WITHOUT THE, THIS SEC, THE SECOND FROM THE, JUST END IT AT THE, I MOVE TO APPROVE AMENDMENT NUMBER FOUR TO THE PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT WITH DAVE LEY AND ASSOCIATES DOING BUSINESS AS DVA. SPEAK IN THE MIC PLEASE. SORRY. I MOVE TO APPROVE AMENDMENT NUMBER FOUR TO THE PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT WITH D DAY DAVE LEY AND ASSOCIATES D-B-A-D-V-A TO ADD THE FY 26 SCOPE OF WORK AND THE INCREASED COMPENSATION IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED $558,720 FOR A NEW TOTAL CONTRACT VALUE, NOT TO EXCEED $1,565,720. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? OH, SURE. GO RIGHT AHEAD. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MAYOR. YOU KNOW, I, I JUST WANT TO SAY THAT I'M GONNA SUPPORT THIS MOTION 'CAUSE I CAN COUNT, BUT ALSO 'CAUSE I THINK THAT MY OBJECTIONS WERE HEARD AND YOU KNOW, I THINK IT, YOU KNOW, YOU'LL CONSIDER 'EM IN THINKING ABOUT HOW YOU PRESENT, UH, INCREASES TO ME IN THE FUTURE. IT IS STILL MY RECOMMENDATION THAT WE SPEND THE OLD AMOUNT, THE BUDGETED AMOUNT. BUT I'M GONNA VOTE YES FOR THIS. OKAY. THANK YOU PETE. OKAY. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? AYE. AYE. AYE. WE'RE UNANIMOUS. I DO THINK IT'S IMPORTANT. 'CAUSE I WAS THINKING TODAY AFTER THE LODGING COUNCIL MEETING THAT FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IS SHUT DOWN. I DON'T KNOW HOW LONG THAT'S GONNA BE. PEOPLE ARE AFRAID TO FLY RIGHT NOW. MAYBE THAT'S AN OPPORTUNITY, NOT JUST THE, WE MISSED THE OPPORTUNITY OF THE PHOENIX MERCURY, BUT SEE, WE, WE ARE MISSING OPPORTUNITIES BECAUSE WE CAN'T ACT QUICKLY. SO I THINK THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT WE'VE GOTTA TACKLE. WE WEREN'T READY TO TACKLE IT TONIGHT, BUT I DO THINK WE NEED TO TACKLE IT. MAYBE WE CAN AGENDIZE IT IN THAT, UH, EVEN BEFORE. I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE SPACE BEFORE DECEMBER, BUT WE NEED TO DEFINITELY ADD IT TO THE AGENDA FOR OUR PRIORITY SETTING. , GO AHEAD ANDREW. YOU GOOD? CAN I JUST ADD A, A FINAL COMMENT 'CAUSE I DIDN'T DO FINAL COMMENTS. LOOK, I, I THINK YOU GUYS ARE DOING A GREAT JOB AND I THINK IT'S REALLY HELPED [04:00:01] IN OUR COMMUNITY AND I THINK IT'S ALSO HELPED BRING OUR BUSINESSES HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT WE ARE UP AGAINST AS A CITY. UM, AND NOT JUST ABOUT THE BUSINESSES THEMSELVES. AND, UM, I APPRECIATE THE WORK YOU GUYS DO DESPITE WHAT I SAID. UM, AND JUST FOR CLARITY, I HAVE NEVER WORKED FOR GOOGLE OR META WHO ARE THE MOST EVIL COMPANIES IN THE WORLD, . UM, SO I, I JUST WANNA SAY, YOU KNOW, THANK YOU FOR THE HARD WORK AND DESPITE WHAT WE'RE WRESTLING WITH RIGHT NOW, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU AND NOTHING TO DO WITH THE WORK THAT YOU'RE DOING. ABSOLUTELY. DEREK. UM, QUESTION, DO YOU HAVE A, THIS PROCUREMENT AUTHORITY THING, DO YOU HAVE A VAGUE IDEA OF WHEN YOU IT MIGHT BE REQUIRED? I MEAN, I'M CONCERNED THAT WE'RE KICKING THE CAN DOWN THE ROAD AND THEN BY THE TIME WE GET AROUND TO DEBATING IT AND DISCUSSING IT AND MAKING A DECISION, IT'LL BE TOO LATE FOR THEM TO DO ANYTHING WITH IT. SO I JUST LIKE TO HEAR FROM YEAH, SO WHAT'S INTERESTING IS THAT, UM, BY ALLOWING THE 93,000, YOU'VE BASICALLY, UM, GIVEN ME THAT AUTHORITY IN THE WINTER CAMPAIGN, RIGHT? YOU, YOU'RE, YOU'RE PRE BOOSTING IT. OKAY. UM, CAN I SAY WHAT NEXT SUMMER WILL BE LIKE? NO, BUT I IMAGINE THAT'S THE NEXT TIME WE WOULD HAVE TO FACE IT UNLESS WE GET INTO ONE OF THESE SITUATIONS WHERE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT WHERE WE HAVE AN UNPLANNED SPORTS EVENT IN PHOENIX WHERE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE ARE GOING TO COME THERE AND WE WOULD LOVE TO TAG ON, AND I DON'T HAVE ANY MONEY IN MY BUDGET NOW. WE HAVE A LITTLE BIT, UM, I FORGET WHAT WE CALLED THAT RANDOM, RANDOM MARKETING OPPORTUNITY OR SOMETHING. WHAT IS IT? 20,000? YEAH. WE HAVE A MISCELLANEOUS MARKETING LINE ITEM THAT TYPICALLY WAS INITIALLY SET UP FOR WHEN ARIZONA OFFICE OF TOURISM REACHES OUT WITH REQUESTS THAT THEY DIDN'T LET US KNOW ABOUT AT THE START OF THE YEAR. THERE'D BE OPPORTUNITIES TO GET, YOU KNOW, ADVERTISING PLACEMENTS AT TRADE SHOWS OR KIND OF THINGS LIKE THAT. SO THAT WAS THE SPIRIT OF IT. UM, BUT I THINK AS WE'VE GONE ON, WE'VE SEEN OTHER THINGS POP UP, UM, THAT WE COULD PULL FROM. BUT, UM, THE WAY THAT WE'VE SET UP THE BUDGET, 'CAUSE I THINK WE TALKED ABOUT THIS AT THE LODGING COUNCIL TODAY, WAS WE DIDN'T REALLY SET THE BUDGET UP WITH THE IDEA OF CONTINGENCY FUNDS. 'CAUSE WE WANTED TO BE REALLY TRANSPARENT ABOUT THE STRATEGIES WE WERE BE WE WERE GONNA EXECUTE. SO, UM, WE DO HAVE A LINE ITEM FOR IT, BUT WE HAVEN'T FUNDED IT TO THE LEVEL THAT I THINK WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IT BEING EFFECTIVE AS IN ITS CURRENT STATE. YEAH. WE'VE ALSO TRIED TO TAKE, UM, THE APPROACH OF NOT GIVING A LOT OF BUFFER IN PADDING. THAT'S BEEN INTENTIONAL. UM, BUT OF COURSE THE DOWNSIDE IN THAT IS THAT WE DON'T HAVE ANY PADDING OUTSIDE OF $20,000 UNLESS, YOU KNOW, IF IF SOMETHING CAME UP, WE WOULD HAVE TO GET IT ON YOUR AGENDA OF FOUR WEEKS BEFORE YOU KNOW THAT THAT WHOLE RIGMAROLE. SO, UM, THAT WAS A REALLY LONG WAY OF SAYING NO, I CAN'T PREDICT WHEN THE NEXT TIME OKAY. IT WILL BE BECAUSE I MEAN, I DON'T WANNA PREJUDICE OURSELVES BY KICKING THE CAN DOWN THE ROAD. AND THE OTHER THING I'LL THINK, AND I, KATHY, I THINK YOU MENTIONED THE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE TRANSPARENCY AND THE ACCOUNTABILITY AND EVERYTHING, THIS WAS ON THE AGENDA. THIS WAS THE PUBLIC'S OPPORTUNITY TO COME FORWARD AND SAY, NO, WE DON'T WANT YOU TO GIVE THE CITY MANAGER THIS AUTHORITY. AND I COUNT THREE MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC WHO STUCK AROUND LONG ENOUGH TO COMMENT ON THE ISSUES. SO I FEEL LIKE THE PUBLIC, YOU KNOW, WAS PUT ON NOTICE OF THIS AND THEY DIDN'T LIKE IT, THEY COULD HAVE TOLD US. SO I'LL JUST LEAVE IT AT THAT. SOUNDS LIKE I'M THE ONLY ONE WHO WANTS TO MOVE FORWARD ON THAT. SO I'M GONNA SHUT UP. OKAY. WE DONE WITH THIS TOPIC. THANK YOU. THANKS FOR, UM, THE HEALTHY DISCUSSION AND DIALOGUE ON IT. I APPRECIATE THE HONESTY AND HAVING A REAL CONVERSATION, SO THANK YOU. OKAY. UH, EIGHT [8.c. AB 3066 Discussion/possible action regarding future meeting/agenda ideas.] C AB 30 66. DISCUSSION POSSIBLE ACTION REGARDING FUTURE MEETING AGENDA ITEMS. ANYBODY HAVE ANYTHING THEY WANNA OH, TWO PEOPLE. OKAY, MELISSA. SO I'M GONNA KIND OF LOOK TO THE CITY ATTORNEY TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT THESE ARE REQUESTS TO ADD ON TO ALREADY EXISTING AGENDIZED ITEMS OR WHETHER OR NOT THEY NEED TO BE SEPARATE AGENDIZED ITEMS. UM, WE HAVE A UPCOMING TOPIC ON 10 28 AB 3 2 72, WHICH IS THE GARAGE. UM, AND THERE HAS BEEN QUITE A BIT GOING ON. WE KNOW IN THE PUBLIC, AND, AND, AND ANDY, I KNOW THAT YOU'VE ADDRESSED THOSE COMMENTS, BUT I'M WONDERING WHETHER OR NOT WE SHOULD HAVE A SORT OF OPEN DISCUSSION AROUND THE SAFETY STANDARDS THAT ARE BEING USED [04:05:01] BASED UPON THE TIMING OF PERMITS, WHAT THOSE MAY BE, AND HOW THEY MIGHT BE DIFFERENT FROM LATER UPDATED STANDARDS. AND, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS THE PROCESS WITHIN THE CITY WHEN THESE, UM, HEALTH AND SAFETY STANDARDS GET UPDATED AND HOW THAT WOULD COMPARE TO HOW OTHER MUNICIPALITIES ALSO DEAL WITH THOSE SORTS OF CHANGES ONCE PERMITS HAVE BEEN ISSUED. SO I DON'T KNOW IF THAT CAN BE PART OF TOPICS FOR THAT OR WHETHER IF THE COUNCIL'S INTERESTED OR WHETHER OR NOT THAT SHOULD BE A SEPARATE AGENDIZED ITEM. SO IF I RECALL, THAT ITEM IS JUST FOR THE, THE, THE ARCHITECT AMENDMENT, RIGHT? AND SO IT WOULDN'T FIT IN THERE RIGHT NOW. UM, IT'S AT THE PURVIEW OF COUNCIL REALLY IF THEY WANT TO COMBINE IT OR HAVE IT BE A SEPARATE ONE. SO, SO THE FIRST THING IS WHETHER OR NOT THERE ARE OTHER PEOPLE WHO ARE INTERESTED IN THIS BECOMING SORT OF AN OPEN PUBLIC CONVERSATION. KATHY, THERE'S A, A TOPIC ON 12 NINE THAT'S GOT, UM, THE AGREEMENT FOR THE ELECTRIFY AMERICA CHARGING STATIONS BEING INSTALLED IN THE UPTOWN PARKING GARAGE. AND I THINK THAT, UM, MORE CLOSELY TIES WITH SOME OF THE SAFETY CONCERNS. IT'S FURTHER OUT, IT'S DECEMBER. WELL, UH, YEAH, BUT TO, TO, THAT'S MY NEXT ON MY LIST. OKAY. OKAY. BUT I WAS THINKING THAT WHAT YOU WANTED TO COMBINE COULD COMBINE IN THERE BECAUSE THE, UH, THE ONE THAT'S COMING UP SOONER AT THE MOMENT. AND I WAS GOING TO, I WOULD SPEAK TO THIS, BUT NOW YOU'VE ANOTHER POINT, BUT YOU'VE RAISED IT, SO I MIGHT AS WELL THAT CONTRACT AMENDMENT IS ON TENTATIVELY FOR THE CONSENT AGENDA. AND I DO NOT IT OFF. BELIEVE I VOTED IT OFF. OH, YOU DID? OKAY. 'CAUSE THERE, YEAH. THANK YOU. YEAH, NO WAY WOULD I WANNA SEE THAT ON THE CONSENT? NO. RIGHT. BUT OKAY, TO YOUR POINT, I'D RATHER PUT IT ON WITH THE 12 NINE, BUT, OKAY. CAN I ASK A THANK YOU COUNSEL, MAY I ASK, IS THIS OKAY? UH, A CLARIFYING QUESTION. SO ARE YOU ASKING FOR A NEW, UM, CONVERSATION REGARDING THE ACTUAL DESIGN OF THE GARAGE THAT YOU'VE ALREADY APPROVED AND WE'VE ALREADY AWARDED THE CONSTRUCTION CONTRACT FOR, OR NO, THIS IS A DIFFERENT, THIS IS A DIFFERENT CONVERSATION. WELL, ARE YOU, BECAUSE IF YOU'RE ASKING HOW WE'RE INCORPORATING, UM, NEW, IF IT'S EVEN CORRECT THAT THERE'S NEW FIRE CODE REQUIREMENTS INTO THE DESIGN. NO, THAT'S NOT WHAT I WAS SAYING. SO WHAT I WAS SAYING IS TO, TO EXPLAIN, UM, HOW IT WORKS TODAY. AND THAT'S BASED ON WHERE WE ARE TODAY AND WHETHER OR NOT OTHER MUNICIPALITIES EVER DO ANYTHING AROUND NEWER SAFETY STANDARDS. AND IF THEY DO, WHAT ARE THOSE? AND DO THE, THOSE MAKE SENSE IN OUR CONTEXT, SO I'M NOT ASKING US TO MAKE ANY CHANGE. OKAY. SO A MORE EDUCATIONAL CONVERSATION ABOUT HOW CODE UPDATES APPLY TO PROJECT. YEAH. SO WE UNDER AND WE UNDERSTAND AND THE PUBLIC UNDERSTANDS WHEN THOSE QUESTIONS ARISE, HOW IT WORKS. WE NEED THE FIRE MARSHAL TO ATTEND THAT MEETING BECAUSE THAT IS, UH, FIRE CODE THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, WHICH, WHICH IS FINE. SO ARE OTHER PEOPLE INTERESTED THAT SEPARATELY AS A SEPARATE DISCUSSION? THAT'S FINE. FROM EITHER OF THESE ITEMS ACTUALLY THEN SO, SO I'M, I'M FINE WITH THAT. THAT'S WHAT I DIDN'T KNOW AND THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING FOR ADVICE. SO IF THIS IS A NEW AGENDAS ITEM, ARE THERE PEOPLE ON COUNCIL BESIDES MYSELF WHO ARE INTERESTED IN US HAVING THIS EDUCATIONAL INFORMATIONAL DISCUSSION? I AM. I I WOULD LOOK AT THAT AS A WORK SESSION FOR A WEDNESDAY, NOT A, NOT A TUESDAY BUSINESS MEETING. YEAH. I MEAN THERE'S NO DECISION TO MAKE HERE. IT'S JUST TO MM-HMM . FOR US, UH, FOR ALL OF US INCLUDING THE PUBLIC TO UNDERSTAND HOW THIS PROCESS WORKS. AND THEN, YOU KNOW, UM, DO OTHER MUNICIPALITIES DO ANYTHING DIFFERENT IF THINGS CHANGE? I WAS, I WAS WONDERING WHETHER JUST A MEMO FROM STAFF MIGHT GO A LONG WAY TOWARDS ADDRESSING THIS, BUT YOU KNOW, A WORK SESSION TOO IS FINE. I DON'T THINK IT, DO YOU THINK IT DEEMS AN ENTIRE WORK SESSION JUST ON THIS ONE TOPIC? NO. I'M SURE THAT THERE'D BE OTHER TOPICS AS WELL ON THAT WORK SESSION. YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. YEAH. BUT YOU, BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO GET THE FIRE MARSHAL HERE, YOU HAVE TO HAVE JUST THAT KIND OF DISCUSSION, IF THAT MAKES ANY SENSE. DO YOU WANT ME TO GO TO THE SECOND ONE? MM-HMM . ALREADY SORT OF MENTIONED BY UM, KATHY AB 32 73 ON 12 NINE, THE EV UPDATE. I'M WONDERING WHETHER OR NOT THAT CAN INCLUDE A DISCUSSION AROUND, UM, UH, HEALTH AND SAFETY STANDARDS EMPLOYED, UM, ON THE EV STATIONS THAT WE HAVE IN TOWN. WHAT THAT REALLY MEANS. UM, AND ALSO WHAT IS OUR OVERALL PLAN AROUND EV CHARGING STATION LOCATIONS? WHAT'S THE STRATEGY AROUND EV CHARGING? UM, AND WHETHER OR NOT IF CHARGING IS COMPLETE, ARE WE EXPECTING [04:10:01] PEOPLE TO MOVE THEIR VEHICLES? ARE WE EXPECTING THEM TO STAY? BECAUSE I HAVE SEEN A COMMENT THAT SAID THEY PARK, UM, THEIR EV AND THEN THEY GO AND TAKE A PINK JEEP TOUR THAT'S A FOUR HOUR TOUR OR TWO HOUR TOUR, IT TAKES 25 MINUTES TO CHARGE YOUR, YOUR VEHICLE IF YOU'RE AT A HIGH SPEED CHARGING. SO HOW IS ALL OF THAT GOING TO WORK? AND YOU KNOW, DO WE HAVE A STRATEGY BASICALLY? SO I THINK I'M HEARING TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. MM-HMM . ONE IS WHAT'S THE DETAIL ON THE CONTRACT WITH ELECTRIFY AMERICA FOR? CORRECT. HOW THEY'RE GONNA CHARGE PEOPLE THAT USE THE CHARGING STATION IN THE GARAGE. 'CAUSE THAT'S WHERE THE IDLE TIME FEES COME IN AND SORT OF THE PENALTY ASPECT THAT ENCOURAGES PEOPLE TO MOVE ON. AND THEN I HEARD YOU ASK ABOUT WHAT'S OUR OVERALL CITY STRATEGY AROUND ELECTRIC VEHICLES. MM-HMM . AND CHARGING, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT BRYCE BECK HAS TALKED TO YOU ABOUT BEFORE IN OUR SUSTAINABILITY AND CLIMATE ACTION PLAN AND ALL OF THAT. SO, UM, I DON'T KNOW IF HE'S SCHEDULED AGAIN TO COME BACK WITH A UPDATE ON THE CLIMATE ACTION PLAN, BUT WE CAN REFRESH, YOU KNOW, WHAT THAT 'CAUSE THERE IS AN ELEMENT IN THAT PLAN ALL ABOUT THE ELECTRIFICATION AND COUNCIL HAS APPROVED, UM, PROJECTS ALREADY FOR US TO INSTALL ADDITIONAL CHARGING, UM, FACILITIES, UM, HERE AT THE CITY. SO IF I UNDERSTOOD CORRECTLY, IT'S KIND OF TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. YOU'RE YOU'RE PROBABLY CORRECT. I JUST PUT IN MY BRAIN IT WAS EV SO, SO RIGHT NOW THE ONLY, UH, FAST CHARGERS WE HAVE ARE POSSE GROUNDS. THAT'S THE ONLY PLACE. YEAH. AREN'T THAT OUR CITY, THE CITY SPONSORED OTHER FOR PUBLIC CHARGING FOR PUBLIC CHARGERS. RIGHT. FOR PUBLIC CHARGE. AND I'VE USED THEM, IN FACT, I USE THEM FAIRLY REGULARLY. AND UH, PEOPLE ARE NOT TAKING PINK JEEP TOURS. I MEAN FROM NO, BUT AT THE GARAGE, MAYOR AND COUNCIL, I THINK THAT'S DIFFERENT. MAYOR AND COUNCIL I THINK WE'RE GONNA BE ON. SO SHE'S PROPOSED IT. DO WE HAVE THIS TWO SECONDS FOR WHAT COUNCILOR DUNS PROPOSE? ANYWAY, I THINK WITH THE GARAGE, THAT WHOLE, THAT'S WHERE A LOT OF THE COMMENTS ARE COMING FROM COULD BE IN THAT SAME DISCUSSION, WHICH, WHICH IS FINE WITH ME TO DO IT THAT WAY. UM, AND IF THE OTHER ONE AROUND THE STRATEGY AROUND EVS AND WHERE WE'RE GOING TO PLACE THEM AND SO FORTH AND SO ON IS A SEPARATE TOPIC AND A TOPIC THAT GOES TO A DIFFERENT DEPARTMENT THAN THE PEOPLE WHO ARE DOING PARKING. I'M HAPPY IF PEOPLE ARE INTERESTED MAKING THAT A SEPARATE AGENDIZED ITEM SO WE KIND OF HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF HOW THAT'S GOING TO WORK THROUGHOUT THE CITY. SO YOU'RE ASKING IF OTHER COUNSELORS ARE INTERESTED IN WHAT OUR STRATEGY IS AROUND EV PUBLIC EV STATIONS, WHICH IS PART OF THE UPDATE WHEN WE HAVE SUSTAINABILITY, CORRECT. YEAH. OKAY. IT'S IN OUR CLIMATE ACTION PLAN. AND WE CAN CERTAINLY, I DON'T REMEMBER OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD WHEN BRYCE COMES BACK NEXT TO YOU, BUT WE CAN GO BACK AS STAFF AND SEE IF WE CAN BREAK OUT LIKE A, A SUB CONVERSATION, I GUESS, ABOUT THAT PLAN. SO DOES IT, JUST FOR CLARITY ON MY PART, UM, UNDER THE ELECTRIFY AMERICA CONTRACT, WE'RE GONNA DISCUSS WHAT HAPPENS IF I'VE EXCEEDED MY CHARGING 25 MINUTES, BUT I'M ON A, OR I'VE GONE TO HAVE LUNCH, SO IT'S MORE THAN 25 MINUTES. HOW THAT IS GOING TO PLAY OUT, BECAUSE TO ME THAT'S A PARKING STRATEGY, SO I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THE, THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO. SO, SO THAT PART WILL YES. POTENTIALLY BE PART OF AB 20 32 73. AND THEN THE REST OF MY INTEREST IS ACTUALLY, UH, SIM UPDATED SOME, I'M SORRY, A SUSTAINABILITY UPDATE AT SOME POINT. CORRECT. OKAY. UNDERSTOOD. JUST MAKE SURE THAT IN THE DISCUSSION WITH ELECTRIFY AMERICA, WE ADD THOSE, MAKE SURE THAT'S INCLUDED IN THERE. ABSOLUTELY. SO I HAVE, I HAVE, I HAVE, UM, ONE MORE. YOU'RE ON A ROLL. GO FOR IT. OH, . SO WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS, BUT WE HAVEN'T REALLY TALKED ABOUT THIS. UM, DO WE HAVE ANYTHING IZING UH, THE NEXT DISCUSSION ON THE WESTERN GATEWAY? THAT WAS ONE THAT WAS I WAS GONNA BRING UP AND YOU WERE GONNA BRING UP. SO IT'S ON EVERYONE'S MIND. IT'S ON EVERYONE'S MIND BECAUSE I, WHEN I LOOK THROUGH ALL THE STUFF THAT'S BEEN AGENDIZED, SO BASICALLY THROUGH THE END OF THE YEAR, I DON'T SEE IT. AND THIS IS A, SO A TOPIC I THINK IS PRETTY IMPORTANT. [04:15:01] YEAH. DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING SPECIFIC IN MIND? 'CAUSE LIKE MY NOTION IS WE NEED TO AGENDIZE SOMETHING AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. DOESN'T REQUIRE A STAFF PRESENTATION PER SE, OTHER THAN TO BE ABLE TO COME BACK TO US AND SAY, THIS IS WHAT WE BELIEVE WE WALKED AWAY FROM THE LAST MEETING WITH IN TERMS OF ANY ACTION ITEMS. AND WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO JUST TALK SOME MORE ABOUT WHAT WE HEARD, WHAT WE THOUGHT ABOUT WHAT WE HEARD FROM THE COMMUNITY SINCE THEN. WHETHER WE THINK THERE'S ANY POINT IN GOING FORWARD WITH DIG, IF THERE'S ANY OTHER STRATEGIES THAT WE THINK WE WANNA PUT TO USE. IT'S JUST A, UH, CORRECT. AND WE MENTIONED LAST TIME THAT ALL WE HAVE IS A BUBBLE DIAGRAM AT THE MOMENT, AND WE NEED TO HAVE A STORY THAT WE WANT TO TELL AROUND WHAT GOES INTO THAT BUBBLE DIAGRAM. AND WE HAVEN'T HAD THAT CONVERSATION AND IT, IT JUST FEELS LIKE WE NEED TO DO THAT SOON. UM, AND NOT LET THAT GET A, A VERY COLD YEAH. LIKE BEFORE THE PRIORITY SETTING. YES. MM-HMM . OKAY. EVERYONE AGREE TO THAT? MM-HMM . OKAY. DO YOU HAVE ANY THAT WAS IT. THAT WAS ME. ANYTHING ELSE FOR THE GOOD OF THE ORDER? IF NOT, OH, MAYOR. YES. LUKE, WE DO HAVE A MEETING TOMORROW AT 3:00 PM YES. OH MAN. THANK YOU. UH, DO I HAVE A MOTION TO [10. ADJOURNMENT ] ADJOURN? SO ADJOURNED. YEAH, WE JUST GOT IT. SO, AND I CAN. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.